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The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest

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From: eheite@dmv.com (Ned Heite)
Date: Sun, 9 Aug 1998 07:48:09 -0500
Subject: ash trays and lighters

The IIA had an ashtray bolted to the black dash panel next to the
instruments, but no lighter. BTW, they are no longer called lighter sockets
when you buy them at the Shack. But here is a use for the infamous Lucas
accessory light socket:

The sockets are closed-end brass tubes threaded to attach to the dash.

Remove the sockets from the dash.

Drill out the positive and negative sockets, so that they are open-end tubes.

Go to the Shack and get a cigar-lighter socket that isn't called a cigar
lighter socket anymore. Get the kind that is on a pigtail.  Strip about a
half inch of insulation off the end of each lead. Tin the end of the wire
with solder.

Tin the end of each socket that sticks out on the inside of the dash

Run the wires into the now open-end sockets and pull the tinned end out the
back. Fold it over a bit and solder it in place firmly.

Reinstall the sockets, so that the cigar lighter socket (which isn't called
that anymore) is hanging by a pigtail from the dash.  Now you can plug in
your cell phone, air compressor, or whatever, into that device, now known
as "Prince," the Outlet-Formerly-Called-A-Cigar-Lighter-Socket.

For some time I had been attaching a socket to the Lucas sockets using
Motorola jacks, but they slipped at inopportune times. The soldering solved
the problem, and it makes only minimal changes to the historical Lucas
original.

    _____
___(_____)            If you are worried about the milennium
|1969 Land\_===__     what will happen when sleazy real-estate

   ___Rover   ___|o   developers run out of golf courses
|_/ . \______/ .  ||  to name their tacky subdivisions after?
 __\_/________\_/________________________________________________
Ned Heite, Camden, DE  http://home.dmv.com/~eheite/index.html

------------------------------

From: "The Becketts" <hillman@bigpond.com>
Date: Sun, 9 Aug 1998 13:01:04 +1000
Subject: Can I get rid of my voltage regulator?

Wolfe, Charles wrote:
>It is a 59 Series II 109 that has been changed to neg earth and
>has a Delco 60 Amp Alternator.
>I understand the the alternator output is regulated and hence do not
need the function of the voltage regulator.

>So is the voltage regulator just functioning as a glorified junction
>box or does it perform other duties?

Yes to the first question and no to the second.

>If it is just a junction box, are there ways to avoid using it all
>together with the alternator?

Yes. but I'd need to see the schematic drawing that you were provided with.
If you can scan it, email it to me at work
(rbeckett@nibupad.telstra.com.au).
 Why at work?  Well, most people when they scan images don't save it in the
most efficient manner so one ends up with humungous files that take forever
to download. (Just check some of the web sites around).

If you can scan it, do so as a black and white line drawing and save it as a
.gif file and it should be quite small.

(FYI, PaperPort which comes with HP scanners is bad.  In its default
settings it makes huge JPG files when you export them.  One has to go into
preferences to change the settings to make them reasonably sized).

Ron

------------------------------

From: "The Becketts" <hillman@bigpond.com>
Date: Sun, 9 Aug 1998 12:52:49 +1000
Subject: gaitors (or should that be"Gators"

Art Bitterman wrote:
>Seriously , Pierre (whoever you are!!) I was laughing so hard I 
>had to take a break from the 'puter!

Me too.  Loved it - certainly a change from recent topics.

Regards,
Ron Beckett
Emu Plains, Australia
'86 Range Rover 4.8L auto  "The Last Aquila" 
'67 Hillman Gazelle 1725cc auto
check my web site at www.users.bigpond.com/hillman

------------------------------

From: RoverNut@aol.com
Date: Sun, 9 Aug 1998 08:54:04 EDT
Subject: Re: The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest

In a message dated 98-08-09 07:00:12 EDT, you write:

<< Sorry if this seems spammy, I'm just a Rover guy helping a Rover guy.
  >>

I don't know if this is even necessary to say, but I'm not at all offended by
a post like this. In fact, it's one of the reasons the list exists as far as
I'm concerned - cheaper and easier than want-ads for all parties.
Just don't try to sell me term life insurance and you're OK.

If I see the right price on the right LR and it's within a 10 hour drive , I'm
buyin'.

Alex Maiolo
Hillsborough NC

------------------------------

From: john cranfield <john.cranfield@ns.sympatico.ca>
Date: Sun, 09 Aug 1998 11:04:45 -0300
Subject: Re: gaitors (or should that be"Gators"

The Becketts wrote:
> Art Bitterman wrote:
> >Seriously , Pierre (whoever you are!!) I was laughing so hard I
> >had to take a break from the 'puter!
> Me too.  Loved it - certainly a change from recent topics.
> Regards,
> Ron Beckett
> Emu Plains, Australia
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 13 lines)]
> '67 Hillman Gazelle 1725cc auto
> check my web site at www.users.bigpond.com/hillman
Me, I tink shes a croc.
   john and muddy

------------------------------

From: john cranfield <john.cranfield@ns.sympatico.ca>
Date: Sun, 09 Aug 1998 11:33:38 -0300
Subject: potentially lethal event

Yesterday two Landrover Owners ( Con Seitl and myself) witnessed an
accident that was very scary. A Jeep TJ driven by a responsible young
man became stuck by missing the edge of a water covered trail. Another
young man with a fair amount of Off Road experience went to extract him. 
They used an approved tow strap and attached it to a propper tow hook.
    The TJ proved to be quite well stuck so the Cherokee pulling  gave
it a little extra snap of about 6 feet. The result was that the hook
gave off the TJ and flew through the rear window of the Cherokee and
exited through the windshield at a point directly in front of the driver
It is only the fact that His head was turned that saved him.
  The moral is that these things happen even to careful well prepped 
people. We did determine that the attaching bolt pulled right out of the
nuts. Probably they were too short.
  Something to think about on a sunny Sunday. 
John and Muddy

------------------------------

From: IBEdwardp@aol.com
Date: Sun, 9 Aug 1998 12:43:51 EDT
Subject: Re: -FREE- Series Parts

In a message dated 98-08-08 23:44:18 EDT, you write:

<< 5 - original 15x6" steel rims, surface rust from sitting
 
 1 - RH door top, good threads, only surface rust
 
 1 - original bumper, has been straightened
 
 2 - complete early wings, no headlight panels, 1 RH, 1 LH, both good except
 for front of outer panels
  >>
 Joseph:
I'm in Maryville and can use all of the above. Don't need the chasis but I'll
be glad to keep it for you until you or someone else needs it. Let be know
when and where I can pick them up. I can do this this afternoon or any evening
this week. Thanks.
Ed Bailey
Maryville
984-1155
982-5921
66 S2a 88 (Rolling restoration)

------------------------------

From: CIrvin1258@aol.com
Date: Sun, 9 Aug 1998 12:59:37 EDT
Subject: Re: potentially lethal event

Reminds me of an event at LAX about 15 years ago:

Japan Airlines Cargo -- A B747 freighter was being loaded in front of the
warehouse. Inside, their roller system for moving aircraft containers at the
time, was marginal at best, and they usually had to lock the end of a cargo
strap onto the sides of pallets, and pull them with a tug.

This particular day, they had a M1 container stuck on the rollers (a M1 is a
main-deck only container, that measures 96"x125" at the base, and is about 10
feet tall, and the maximum weight, is somewhere around 14,000 pounds), that
was full of new stereos.

They latched the strap onto the pallet and the tug, and began pulling. What
they didn't know, was that the strap had been used for this a few times too
many (maximum load capacity 5000 pounds - this is NOT what they can pull, but
what they'll hold in place!). The pallet got stuck, the strap was tired, and
lo and behold, a buckle came apart. Like a bullet, it shot CLEAR THROUGH THE
FULL CONTAINER!

Granted, human error was the main cause of this one, but the result was the
same.

Watch your head.

Charles

------------------------------

From: Jeremy Bartlett <bartlett@slip.net>
Date: Sun, 09 Aug 1998 10:09:07 -0700
Subject: Re: potentially lethal event

john cranfield wrote:

> They used an approved tow strap and attached it to a propper tow hook.

I'd question the appropriateness of those hooks.  I've seen them and I'd
never use them,but then again I'm a little paranoid sometimes.   I tend not
to trust stock recovery equipment;
half the time it seems it's just for show.  Even people who ought to know a
hell of a lot
better, like WARN for example, supply horrifically over rated equipment in
their "recovery" kits.
Ever seen the shackle in the warn kit? It's ridiculous.  As to the ratings
of the warn cable.... well I drone on.

cheers

Jeremy

------------------------------

From: "A.G.Dolsa" <dolsa@emporion.net>
Date: Sun, 9 Aug 1998 20:06:18 +0200
Subject: RE: potentially lethal event

Law of Murphy.  

If  something bad can occur, it occurs

one time in 1000000 of times, also
-------------
A day I found an arrow nailed in my vehicle (not LR).

I thought if they had sioux  in my people, in Spain.

Not, was not possible.

A vane of a house was broken.

  ===============             Alfons G. Dolsa
  ||--------||  \\            Entomologist
  ||        ||   \\   ____    Museum of Butterflies of Catalonia
|#||________||____\\__####__  http://www.emporion.net/museu
|#|-Land Rover----- \-------] 86" - 88"III - 88"III
|#|  _____   |      |  _____| http://emporion.net/landrover.htm
 _| //---\\__|______|_//---\\     
 [_/<  o  >\_________/<  o  >-]
     \___/             \___/

------------------------------

From: Vince Sabio <vince@humournet.com>
Date: Sun, 9 Aug 1998 14:10:51 -0400
Subject: Recovery Kits (was: potentially lethal event)

** Sometime around 13:09 -0400 8/9/98, Jeremy Bartlett said:

>john cranfield wrote:
>> They used an approved tow strap and attached it to a propper tow hook.

[break]

>I'd question the appropriateness of those hooks. I've seen them and I'd
>never use them,but then again I'm a little paranoid sometimes. I tend
>not to trust stock recovery equipment; half the time it seems it's just
>for show. Even people who ought to know a hell of a lot better, like
>WARN for example, supply horrifically over rated equipment in their
>"recovery" kits. Ever seen the shackle in the warn kit? It's ridiculous.
>As to the ratings of the warn cable.... well I drone on.
[break]

This thread raises some important questions for us off-road newbies.
I've been taking the whole off-road thing pretty slowly (so to speak),
so I don't get myself in over my head. At least, not right away. ;-)

Eventually, though, I'll surely get it stuck, and I know that I'll need
pretty good recovery equipment. As a skydiving instructor, I also know
the value of buying high-quality equipment. <g>

So ... what constitutes a high-quality recovery kit? What are the things
to avoid (e.g., it sounds like the WARN kit is one of them)? What are
the better kits on the market, and where can they be purchased?

It's not the same as potentially getting knocked unconscious in freefall,
but a shackle through the frontal lobe still has about the same end
effect -- a closed-casket funeral. I'd prefer to put that off for as
long as possible. ;-)

- Vince Sabio
  98 Disco (original owner!)
  Columbia MD USA

  errata: D16474; I'98; Pro; yes, I jump with Cypresses

------------------------------

From: Marc-Andre Leger <ma@wefa.com>
Date: Sun, 09 Aug 1998 14:53:09 -0400
Subject: Re: potentially lethal event

Some years ago, when I was in the Royal Air Cadets, I used to pull gliders
(aircrafts) in the air using a winch. We would put a "Weak Link" on the cable
with a known strenght on the cable to have a controlled breaking point to avoid
dammage to the glider. We would also put a small parachute to create resistance
if the "weak link" broke or when the cable was released from the craft (so it
could be re-spooled properly). Perhaps a similar technique or an adaptation
thereof, would prevent similar problems to the JEEP people mentionned at the
start of this thread.

Jeremy Bartlett wrote:

> john cranfield wrote:
> > They used an approved tow strap and attached it to a propper tow hook.
> I'd question the appropriateness of those hooks.  I've seen them and I'd
> never use them,but then again I'm a little paranoid sometimes.   I tend not
> to trust stock recovery equipment;
> half the time it seems it's just for show.  Even people who ought to know a
> hell of a lot
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 17 lines)]
> cheers
> Jeremy

------------------------------

From: Zaxcoinc@aol.com
Date: Sun, 9 Aug 1998 19:36:47 EDT
Subject: Re: Recovery Kits (was: potentially lethal event)

Perhaps the thing to worry about is the people who think that because their
gear is the best, that abusing it is appropriate.  Perhaps, one of the best
things that ever happened to me is as follows.

Young and inexperienced I was attempting a recovery of a D-8 Caterpillar
tractor with a D-6 using 1" wire rope in all the approved ways.  As the
extraction was a no go I was letting the 6 come to speed and "popping" the
clutch.  A wise and experienced  co-worker from about thirty feet away winged
me with a rock and told me NO!  He was concerned about the effect on both
machines as well as the potential for injury.  Dynamic recovery is for the
birds. judicious digging and getting wet and muddy is what happens if you do
it right.  Lost/broken equipment and stories is what happens if you do it
wrong.

Zack Arbios

------------------------------

From: Rick Grant <rgrant@cadvision.com>
Date: Sun, 09 Aug 1998 17:08:01 -0600
Subject: Re: Gumption talk (from Pirsig)

>If you're going to repair a motorcycle (Land Rover) an adequate supply
>of gumption is the first and most important tool.  It's the psychic
>gasoline that keeps the whole process going.

>.
Thanks Robert for that very interesting list.  I kept it in mind all today
as I tackled the springs on my 59 SII.

I spent four hours getting just one spring off and I've yet to get to the
dreaded chassis bushings.  I must have been out of my mind to think I could
do all four in one day, Hah!

Anyway I found some of the things in Pirsig's list of "gumption traps" of
real value as I busted bolt heads, knuckles, and sockets.  Perhaps the most
important was remembering to become absorbed in the job and not necessarily
the goal which in retrospect was far too unrealistic.  

But I've got to tell you that when I discovered that the springs had somehow
rust welded themselves to the u-bolt fastening plate as well as the brake
line shield I seriously wondered whether there wouldn't be a market for a
book called, "Satanism, and the Art of Land Rover Maintenance."

			Rick Grant

			1959, SII   "VORIZO"  

rgrant@cadvision.com	
www.cadvision.com/rgrant
Cobra Media Communications.  Calgary, Canada
Aboriginal and International Relief Issues

------------------------------

From: Scott Wilson <scott@scratchstudio.com>
Date: Sun, 9 Aug 1998 20:00:55 +0100
Subject: Reverse Lights...

Hmm... Can't seem to find in the manual where the reverse switch is
that turns on the reverse lights... Could someone point me in the 
right direction?

-Scott
 1973 SIII 88"

------------------------------

From: "Con P. Seitl" <seitl@ns.sympatico.ca>
Date: Sun, 09 Aug 1998 21:50:24 -0700
Subject: Re: potentially lethal event

Jeremy Bartlett wrote:
   I tend not
> to trust stock recovery equipment;
> half the time it seems it's just for show.  

It wasn't really a problem with the hook so much as the fastening 
technique that was employed. We determined hat the hook was bolted in 
place using the same bolts that held his brush bar, which had a T50 head 
on it. It also screwed on down into a captive nut on the underside of the 
frame rail, and there where flat washers used under the hook to make the 
hook sit straight. The lesson here should also include the use of proper 
grade bolts and proper use of same. The amount of power to hurl a big tow 
hook through the back window and out the front AND another 50 feet 
further demonstrates the need for operators and spectators to take all 
precautions possible. As a note, the operator in the Jeep was very lucky. 
The hook exited out the front window in the area between the rear view 
mirror and the steering wheel, just as he was about to look back through 
the window to see his progress. The hook missed him by about four inches, 
but he did suffer from glass in his eyes. There where two other fellows 
in the Jeep with him, one in the front seat and the other in the back. I 
count them lucky as well!

------------------------------

From: "d.h.lowe" <dhlowe@idirect.com>
Date: Sun, 09 Aug 1998 09:27:25 -0400
Subject: Michelin tires

A few days ago I contacted a couple of local ( Toronto) Michelin tire
dealers to enquire about the availability and cost of their XZL tire.
They had never heard of them.
I then phoned the Michelin 1-800-461-8473 sales help number, which is in
Montreal, with the same result. The woman I spoke too was pleasant but
totally useless, "sorry but I don`t have any listing for that type, are
you sure you have the right letters", " We don`t sell that type in
Canada, It must be an American market type"...! ! ! ! " Sorry but I
cannot help you".................And this from their sales help line.
Not content with this limp excuse for a sales rep. I phoned their head
office and asked for their sales dept. The individual to whom I spoke
immediately impressed me with his supercilious, I don`t know, never
heard of them, but give me your number and I will call you back
attitude. I wasn`t about to hold my breath but gave him the benefit of
the doubt.
Eight hours later, not having heard from them, I phoned them again.
"They still haven`t called me back, but I will call you when they do"
says the sales type.
Twenty four hours later I call him again.He seems suprised and tells me
the same cock and bull story , puts me on hold and then returns to
inform me that the tire is not available in Canada and thinks it must be
a military type .....very sorry but cannot help you.
I told him what I thought of his abilities as a sales rep. and of
Michelins Canadian sales office.
NOW. having got that off my chest is there anyone out there who can
direct me to a Michelin sales office or dealer who is worthy of the name
in the U.S.A.                       At Greek Peak I picked up a sales
brochure of this tire ,(I think it was at the Safari Guard booth) and
thought they would look a whole lot better on my 101 than those bar
grips.The Michelin web-site is no help either.  .

To Sandy Grice et al.....Thanks for all your efforts. No mean feat to
organise such an event. Ignore those rude and ignorant comments from
people who should know better..

------------------------------

From: Thomas Spoto <tspoto@az.com>
Date: Mon, 10 Aug 1998 06:47:53 -0700
Subject: Re: Reverse Lights...

The switch is mounted on top of the transmission. If you crawl under the
vehicle and look up between the front drive shaft output and the main
gearbox you should see it. Two wires (at least on mine) go to it.

Tom Spoto

Scott Wilson wrote:

> Hmm... Can't seem to find in the manual where the reverse switch is
> that turns on the reverse lights... Could someone point me in the
> right direction?
> -Scott
>  1973 SIII 88"

------------------------------

From: AHKai@aol.com
Date: Sun, 9 Aug 1998 22:19:20 EDT
Subject: Buying a used Series III

Greetings, 

I'm new to the Land Rover List and have some questions concerning the purchase
of a '74 Series III Land Rover in the Detroit, MI area.  I haven't seen it
yet, just spoken to the owner over the phone.  Apparently the current owner
bought it a few years ago after it having been in storage for about 15 years.
The engine is seized apparently and won't turn over (sorry for the
redundancy).  It was a going to be a bonding project for himself and son,
which apparently never materialized, so he's asking around $2000 for it, the
rest of the Rover supposedly being in fair condition.  As I am going to take a
look at it later in the week and being new(er) to older Land Rovers, I would
appreciate any insight, tips or suggestions any of you may have regarding this
vehicle.  

As I ride my motorcycle as many days out of the year as possible (rain, light
snow included), my plan would be to get the Rover fixed up as a good runner
and use it mainly for winter transport, for now.  One day to be restored to
it's former glory...  

Thank you,

Kai Higdon

------------------------------

From: David Scheidt <david@infocom.com>
Date: Sun, 9 Aug 1998 21:26:44 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: Axel/hub seals - Options??

On Fri, 7 Aug 1998, Peter M. Kaskan wrote:

> Hi all - I may need to replace some oil seals in my hub/axels, front and
> rear, rover type.
> Is there an aftermarket option that I can get w/o buying through a LR parts
> supplier. Can I get them at NAPA, or order them from Federal Mogul?
> Thanks in advance - Peter

National Federal-Mogul number for the seal that keeps oil (or grease...)
in your hub, and off the brakes is 410694.  Dimensions are 2.312 X 3.350
X .375 .  I presume this OD X ID X thickness.  You probably will also need
to replace the distance piece,  and certainly need to replace the tab
washer that retains the bearing retaining nuts, neither of these are going
to be at your corner parts house.  I called a couple of local places about
the seal once.  It was less than a buck cheaper than from BP, and not in
stock.  Much as i like to buy things locally, for that price differance I
will buy them from a LR specialist.

David/mr sinclair -- who is finally moving under his own power again.

------------------------------

From: David Scheidt <david@infocom.com>
Date: Sun, 9 Aug 1998 21:44:11 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: Buying a used Series III

On Sun, 9 Aug 1998 AHKai@aol.com wrote:
> The engine is seized apparently and won't turn over (sorry for the
 redundancy).  It was a going to be a bonding project for himself and son,
 which apparently never materialized, so he's asking around $2000 for it, the
 rest of the Rover supposedly being in fair condition.  As I am going to take a
 look at it later in the week and being new(er) to older Land Rovers, I would
 appreciate any insight, tips or suggestions any of you may have regarding this
> vehicle.  

If the beast ran when it was parked, the main box, transfer case and diffs
are proabably alright.  Unfortunaltly, without being able to drive the
thing there is little you can tell without taking them apart.  The thing
you can really look at is rust.  Get under the car and look at the frame.
If it doesn't look like swiss cheese or have scaling rust, knock it with a
hammer.  It should sound like you are hitting a solid steel box.  It
shouldn't dent or break through.  Inspect the bulkhead (firewall).  rust
in the toeboards is fairly easy to fix if you can weld.  The door posts
and upper sections are harder to repair.  If the frame and bulkhead are
mostly solid, $2000 is probably a good deal.    

David

------------------------------

From: Jeremy Bartlett <bartlett@slip.net>
Date: Sun, 09 Aug 1998 19:56:30 -0700
Subject: Re: Gumption talk (from Pirsig)

Rick Grant wrote:

> I seriously wondered whether there wouldn't be a market for a
> book called, "Satanism, and the Art of Land Rover Maintenance."

Naturally with a foreword by the Prince of Darkness himself :)

Jeremy

------------------------------

From: Adrian Redmond <channel6@post2.tele.dk>
Date: Mon, 10 Aug 1998 05:00:02 +0200
Subject: Landy blues

For the first time in years I must admit that I am tired of land rovers
- not just annoyed with the latest broken stud or lost timing, but all
round pi§§ed off with the marque. Maybe it's the 15 yr. itch.

When I think of the hundreds of hours spent scraping, cleaning, washing,
priming, painting and reassembling painstakingly my SIII's and the
thousands of kroner spent on parts, I really begin to wonder if it's all
worth it.

After all, a rebuilt and tuned SIII 2.25 diesel is slow, hot, noisy and
prone to smoke. For all that effort and money I deserve more. The brakes
are out of the last century - even when adjusted to the peak of SIII
perfection, and the gearbox now hops out of fourth.

The doors (new doors and locks) wont shut properly without a hard lift
and bang, which, given time will send the sliding window onto my lap -
probably when it's raining.

The stainless steel exhaust is - after five months - not on stock here
in Denmark, so the reconditioned stock pipe will rust away soon.

It's as if, even given hundreds of hours of careful work, these cars
still never rise above the "old banger" stage. New doros, new rubber
seals - and they still leak.

What's more, in Denmark we can't carry passengers in the back unless we
have the "white" registration number plates (mine are the cheap and
common yellow - which cost more in tax, and which cost a fortune to
change, as the tax office takes a 90% surcharge of the cars value for
the priviledge - not a scaled look-it-up-in-a-table value, but a value
based on the careful restoration which would render my SIII 88" from
1979 to cost a fortune. Basically a state-authorised-rip-off.

For the first time in years, I am seriously thinking of selling or
scrapping all three of my rovers - which despite their almost immaculate
condition are taking up too much of my budget, workshop and life. I have
just had a month away from them whilst travelling in Greenland, and
guess what - I didn't even miss them. OK there's a first time for
everything.

I have spent the last two years on this list waxing lyrical about the
values of these rattling workhorses - but when i really think about it,
I think some of us - well at least I - have been fooled by the dream of
the "country-gentlemans-workhorse" which in fact is a badly designed,
badly built and overrated bucket of bolts, employing technology which
most repectable car manufacturers disposed of when they discovered that
people want comfort and speed, and the chance of drving for more than
two days without some part falling off or losing adjustment.

I can't spend as much time in the future as I have in the past looking
after these wagons - my work and family need me - and I know that if I
don't offer the time, the rovers will rattle into corroded oblivion in a
few short months, crying for attention and wearing yet more holes in my
wallet.

I wouldn't mind if I thought it would be worth it - but I feel that I'm
losing the magic of the rover - life's too short for spending more time
repairing and maintaining a car that most yacht owners spend keeping a
boat in the water.

Maybe it'll wear off - maybe I've been away from the list for too long,
or maybe - having driven a bog-standard Toy++ta RAV4 and discovered that
brakes which work, electrics which function, and motors which
accelterate without deafening me don't need to cost a fortune and take
over my life - has shown me the folly of my ways.

But right now, I'm almost ready to sell the brit junk and buy a reliable
jap. junk with a built in 5 year obsolescence - just to hear the door
shut tight first time.

After all - it's only worth having a rover if you rove - and by the time
I have used so much time and cash on mine, I don't fancy driving it into
a gravel pit just to play rough - and here in denmark there is pretty
little chance of meeting rough terrain without having to pretend.

Who am I kiddin?

Doe's everyone get like this once every 15 years?

 
Adrian Redmond

CHANNEL 6 TELEVISION DENMARK       (Adrian Redmond)
Foerlevvej 6  Mesing  DK-8660  Skanderborg  Denmark
telephone (office)                  +45 86 57 22 66
telephone (home)                    +45 86 57 22 64
telefacsimile / data                +45 86 57 24 46
mobile GSM (EFP unit)               +45 40 74 75 64
mobile GSM (admin)                  +45 40 54 22 66
mobile NMT                          +45 30 86 75 66
e-mail                       channel6@post2.tele.dk
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------------------------------

From: Stefan Dyckerhoff <sad@juniper.net>
Date: Sun, 9 Aug 1998 20:29:07 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Looking for Defender 90

Hello,

	I am looking to buy a Landrover Defender 90 in the USA. I am interested
in the 3.9 L V8 version with hard- or softtop, a pre 1997 model in the colors
white, yellow, green or red.

I would be most thankful for any hints.

Thank you,

	Stefan Dyckerhoff

------------------------------

From: "Franklin H. Yap" <FHYap@ix.netcom.com>
Date: Sun, 09 Aug 1998 20:57:47 -0700
Subject: Re: Michelin tires

d.h.lowe wrote:

> NOW. having got that off my chest is there anyone out there who can
> direct me to a Michelin sales office or dealer who is worthy of the name
> in the U.S.A.

Good luck.  I spent considerable time calling Michelin (main office) and
Michelin dealers (SF Bay Area) and was unable to find anyone who could get
me Michelin radial tubes for a 7.50x16.

I think Safari Gard had advertised that they had Michelin tyres and tubes.
I tried calling them but got the "I'll get back to you."  In all fairness,
they were probably pretty busy at the time and my request may have been at
the bottom of the list.

I gave up because I needed to have them quickly.

Frank

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From: Rick Grant <rgrant@cadvision.com>
Date: Sun, 09 Aug 1998 22:04:00 -0600
Subject: Re: Landy blues

At 05:00 AM 10/08/98 +0200, Adrian Redmond, wrote

>For the first time in years, I am seriously thinking of selling or
>scrapping all three of my rovers
>.
Well Adrian, speaking as one who has spent the better part of today
wondering why I bother with the damned thing, and coinicidently after having
spent several weeks just across the Davis Strait from you on a job and only
recently returned to VORIZO I have a lot of sympathy.  

Now while I don't know your situation I would say the ideal situation, at
least for me, is to have to have other vehicles that can be the daily driver.

Having said that.  I am sick and tired of reading about maintenance and
repair activities in either Haynes or the Shop manual and finding out that
no one had made the slightest recgnition that in the real world; bolts can
be rusted, maybe you don't have the right tool, perhaps there isn't enough
money right then for the new part.

On top of that as I drive either our Golf or Subaru Wagon I know that there
is a world of handling and responsiveness out there that is beyond the utter
wildest of drug crazed imagining of the LR desingers.

Yet I wouldn't give up VORIZO for anything. ( well perhaps if you make a
good offer).

As I sit here and type with bloody knuckles, as a result of a badly going
spring replacement exercise, I can honestly say that as exaspertating, as
stupid, as bloody minded as the godamned machines are there is a real glow
of chalenge acheived, of weirdness overcome, of rightness done when one has
put one of these blasted mechanical non wonders into good working tick.

By all means get rid of two or your wonders.   Just make sure that you hang
onto at least one so you can stay on this list.

See you chum

			Rick Grant

			1959, SII   "VORIZO"  

rgrant@cadvision.com	
www.cadvision.com/rgrant
Cobra Media Communications.  Calgary, Canada
Aboriginal and International Relief Issues

------------------------------

From: Russ Wilson <rwwilson@mho.net>
Date: Sun, 9 Aug 1998 21:28:49 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Re: Buying a used Series III

3 words....frame, frame, and you guessed it ..."frame".  IF the frame is
solid, with only minor rot on the outriggers....the little bits that come
off of the main rails, you should be fine.  $2,000 for a truck that is
complete with a decent frame regardless of engine condition is fair.  Any
work that will need to be done will be considered minor compared to the
task of doing a "frame over".

good luck

Russ Wilson
Leslie Bittner

"That's just my opinion; I could be wrong...."
				Dennis Miller

------------------------------

From: Russ Wilson <rwwilson@mho.net>
Date: Sun, 9 Aug 1998 21:35:53 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Re: Michelin tires

>d.h.lowe wrote:
>> NOW. having got that off my chest is there anyone out there who can
>> direct me to a Michelin sales office or dealer who is worthy of the name
>> in the U.S.A.
>Good luck.  I spent considerable time calling Michelin (main office) and
>Michelin dealers (SF Bay Area) and was unable to find anyone who could get
>me Michelin radial tubes for a 7.50x16.
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 13 lines)]
>they were probably pretty busy at the time and my request may have been at
>the bottom of the list.
I'd agree that Safari Gard would be your best bet as they are a Michelin
vendor and I know that the owner (name??)  uses and likes the Michelin
products...he should be able to either sell you the goods or give you the
phone # of someone who can.
good luck

Russ Wilson
Leslie Bittner

"That's just my opinion; I could be wrong...."
				Dennis Miller

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From: "Peter Howard" <rover@mackay.net.au>
Date: Mon, 10 Aug 1998 16:59:14 +1000
Subject: RE: Potentially lethal event.
	charset="iso-8859-1"

About recovery hook pulling off and rocketing straight through the =
Cherokee recovery vehicle.
FWIW, here in the land of Oz careful people lay an old chaff or grain =
bag across the tow line or winch cable. The idea being, I guess, that =
the weight and aerodynamic drag will help to tame the cable if the =
attachment point lets go. I've also seen this method mentioned in many =
recovery articles in Oz 4WD magazines. Every Oz 4WD has at least one =
mouldy old chaff bag lying around somewhere inside, usually with the tow =
strap or chain stored in it. If you were being really careful you could =
wire the bag to the line to ensure that it does not fly off when =
something happens. Of course, the best insurance is to use GOOD tow =
hooks with correct size, grade and quantity of bolts.
My two centavos worth,
Peter H.

------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BDC480.345E5FA0
	[ Original post was HTML ]
[digester: Removing section of:  Content-Type: text/html; ]

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From: Francois ADAMS <francois.adams@wanadoo.fr>
Date: Mon, 10 Aug 1998 09:50:22 +0200
Subject: Re: Landy blues

Hello
I do not have the required 15 years of land rover repair to be so
desesperate !

I think maybe you ve gone too far in land rover love, too exclusive !

I have a serie IIa 88, and I act the following way :

- If I feel like driving it and it works : i drive it
- """"""""""""""""""""""""""and it doesnt work : i drive another car
  (nissan patrol, sorry !!)
- if i feel like repairing something, i repair the IIa (something is
  always needing service)
- if i dont feel like repairing, i just check levels on the nissan
  patrol (oil and water, but anyway no need to check !!!)
  
In fact, it also dpends on the time and money i have to put in the rover

During two years, i had the rover as my main and only car, but I was
having more more more money to put in it than now ! It is less expensive
I think to have an every-day-driving-Jap-4x4 AND a pleasure-beauty-rover
than having a must-be-nice-and-work-every-day-and-clean-rover 

(the only thing i would add is : can we ask the same work to a 30 years
jap than to a 30 years rover ??? )

Moreover, acting like this allows you to keep a good state rover as it
is less used 

By the way i started my rover career at 6 months !!! (i was not
driving), it was my father's rover (the one i now own), and when i was
about 18 years old my dad had the landy blues and gave it to me !!!! Do
you have children :-)))))))))))))) ?

I did not undestand cvery well the tax problem for the rear seats ...

Keep at least one rover, but do not be ashamed to get a jap 4x4!!

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