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From: john cranfield <john.cranfield@ns.sympatico.ca>
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 09:34:25 -0300
Subject: Re: Help W/Valve Seal Replacement - MA or NY

Peter, I hate to be the bearer of bad news but it is very rare that bad
valvestem seals cause such oil consumption. It is almost certainly one
or several broken oil control rings. You probably have bad seals too!
    John and Muddy

Peter M. Kaskan wrote:
>         My oil consumtion is driving me batty! 1Qt per 100 miles! I only
> see smoke on a warm start-up. Recently - I have noticed at night
> w/head-lights behind me - smoke coming from the exaust when at the high end
> of a gear. There are very few oil leaks -  I can only find one - along the
> oil pan bolts.
>         So, I was wondering if someone out there has replaced valve seals
> on a low compression 2.25 head (I think)? If so, might you have the
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 23 lines)]
> http://comp9.psych.cornell.edu/psychology/finlay/finlaylab.html
> -----------------------

------------------------------

From: "Alex Easton" <easton@big.net.au>
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 23:18:12 +1000
Subject: Re: The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest

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From: "Wolfe, Charles" <CWolfe@smdc.org>
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 09:59:35 -0500
Subject: RE: Chassis Maintenence

Adrian

Thank you for your opinions about chassis care.  I feel about the same
way about undercoating.  What about waxoyl products inside the frame?
Does this have the same fire risks with welding?  How do you feel about
the POR products?

I drove my rover as a daily driver for about eight years but bought my
first new vehicle four years ago (GMC Sierra).  Put 85K on the Sierra
and now I am going to sell it while the resale value stays high.  I am
excited to be going back to rovers full time.  Puts more pressure on me
to get my second 109 rebuilt as to have some backup reliability.  May
have to buy a Norton motorcycle to give the rovers a summer vacation.

I did a compression test on my tired and noisy 2.25 Petrol and concluded
that it is tired but not dead.  I could just redo the head but  I have
convinced myself that I deserve a brand new Turner.  So my July rover
projects include:

Tighten up brakes
Chassis cleanup/touchup
Pull engine and replace with Turner
Probably new wiring harness while engine out
Halogen headlights
Paint touchup

I will then start putting the firewall and brakes on my rebuilt 109
frame to start the second project.  The GMC is going down the road (
with someone else) and the difference between lien and sale price will
help finance the addiction.  

Cwolfe

------------------------------

From: "Chris Weinbeck, Office Logic, Inc." <cmw@tiac.net>
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 12:12:27 -0400
Subject: Hammerite /Compression

>etch the galvanizing right, the rest has held on nicely through a New
>England Winter with no problems...

>a new england winter in the driveway? not on the road already is it?

>daveb

Ouch!  :-)  I've got Hammerite on my roof rack.  No special preparation 
other than a quick spray down and it's stuck quite nicely through a winter 
(it's not a chassis but it's been on the road).

Since no one else seems to be tackling the question about compression, 
timing and octane rating I guess I'll write up something.  This is somewhat 
simplified so don't jump too far down my throat.

Compression is exactly what it sounds like, the reduction of the volume of 
the intake mixture by a certain mechanical ratio.  The ratio is dependent 
on the construction of the engine incorporating the bore, stroke etc. and 
final volume of the combustion chamber.  A 9:1 engine reduces 9 volumes to 
1 volume.  This compression creates heat -called the heat of compression. 
 The fuel-air mixture is intended to withstand this increase in heat 
without self igniting or detonating in a gas engine; instead undergoing 
controlled ignition by the timed introduction of a spark.  A diesel engine 
depends upon the intake mixture igniting solely due to the heat of 
compression.  The higher the compression ratio the greater the utilization 
of the energy released by combustion.

Octane rating is intended to quantify a comparison of the particular 
gasoline to pure octane -the liquid form of straight chain eight carbon 
saturated hydrocarbons.  This liquid was given the rating of 100 (100% 
octane) early on in the research of internal combustion engines and fuels 
because of it's excellent ability to resist detonation due to the heat of 
compression.  A given gasoline motor fuel is given a rating (as compared to 
a mixture octane) based on the average of two "measures" of it's ability to 
resist pre-ignition.  The research method -what all the equations say 
should be it's "octane rating"- and the motor method -an actual test of 
detonation due to mechanical compression of the mixture- are averaged to 
create the octane number posted on the pump labeled R+M/2.  Ether, used as 
starting fluid, self ignites all the way down to 3:1 compression -the 
practical lower limit in construction of an internal combustion engine.

Timing refers to the adjustment of the point during the compression stroke 
at which a spark is introduced to ignite the intake mixture.  If the 
fuel-air mixture could ignite instantaneously and fuels with precise octane 
ratings were available to run in our perfectly constructed engines timing 
would be permanently set to top dead center "TDC", where the piston is at 
the exact top of it's stroke and the charge is fully compressed for maximum 
power and efficiency.  But in our less than perfect world it takes an 
imprecisely known amount of time for the flame front to propagate 
throughout the mixture of less than perfectly rated fuel and air compressed 
at something close to a 8:1 ratio.  Therefore we are forced to set our 
timing for something in advance of TDC in most cases, and then use various 
measures (vacuum, centrifugal force) to determine engine speed and farther 
increase the "advance" and higher RPM.

Uncontrolled or improperly timed ignition reduces efficiency and can 
destroy an engine.  Detonation/preignition can occur at odd locations 
inside the combustion chamber creating stresses for which the engine wasn't 
designed.  Pre-ignition or improper timing also can cause the force of 
combustion to peak while the engine is still trying to compress the 
mixture.  Excessively late ignition lowers engine power and causes too much 
heat to be transferred to the cylinder walls.

Summing it up;

The greater the compression the greater the heat of compression and need 
for fuels resistant to detonation or pre-ignition.

The greater the speed of the engine the farther in advance of TDC the spark 
must be introduced to have ignition occur at the correct point in the 
piston's motion for maximum efficiency.

The higher the octane rating of a fuel the slower it ignites.

The lower the quality (or reliability of the quality rating) of the fuel 
the farther from peak efficiency timing should be set for controlled 
ignition.

Why didn't I just say that in the first place?

Had a great time in Ottawa!

Chris
Looking for 2.6 engine and Dormobile parts.
Ask me about East Coast Rover!

------------------------------

From: Brett Storey <brstore@ibm.net>
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 18:51:37 -0400
Subject: Swivel Ball Problems

G'day all

I am in the process of rebuilding a set of swivel hubs. I have a pair of
used swivel balls in great shape and have added all new bearings and
Railco Bushes.

Here's the problem. After assembling one unit, the amount of force
needed to move the outer swivel pin housing  is more than the 14 to 16
lb. the manual suggests. I have added and removed shims from the top pin
to no avail. It just seems like the top pin is just a tight fit in the
bush and that is what is causing the resistance.

On the second assembly, I have just the opposite problem. The swivel pin
housing turns much to easily, even with all the shims removed. What's up
with that? If I fit the wafer for the Railco bush, it does get much
tighter, but the top pin will not seat to the swivel housing and I am
left with a big gap.

Anybody have any solutions to this problem. Am I doing something wrong
here? I have done this job before and all was fine. I imagine the one
unit may loosen with use but I don't want to finish assembling and
installing only to find I have the dreaded wheel hop and that are no
shims to remove on the other.

Maybe I should use grease instead of oil.  ;-)

Thanks for any and all help.

Brett

------------------------------

From: "C. Marin Faure" <faurecm@halcyon.com>
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 17:27:39 -0700
Subject: Limestone paint substitute

I've been mostly out of the country on business and vacation during the
last three months, so I appologize if I'm asking a question that was
recently asked and answered.  I recall seeing some posts a few months ago
regarding commercial paint brands and colors that were identical to, or
almost identical to, Land Rover's Limestone.  I believe there was a
Rustoleum color mentioned as well as others.  Unfortunately I neglected to
save these posts.  I have a bit of touch-up to do on my Series III and am
looking for a locally available spray paint that will come as close as
possible to the vehicle's original Limestone.  It's a working vehicle, not
a show-car or restoration, so an exact match isn't critical, although it
would be nice to get as close as possible.  Thanks.

________________________
C. Marin Faure
  (original owner)
  1973 Land Rover Series III-88
  1991 Range Rover Vogue SE
   Seattle, WA

------------------------------

From: Faye and Peter Ogilvie <ogilvi@hgea.org>
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 14:45:36
Subject: Re: Limestone paint substitute

	Wondered why we hadn't heard from you for such a long time.  Antique 
White
is the color that has been mentioned as a limestone replacement.  I find it
to be heavier on the yellow side of the spectrum while limestone tends to
the grey.  Not an exact match but close enough for wheels.
Aloha Peter

At 05:27 PM 6/27/98 -0700, you wrote:
>I've been mostly out of the country on business and vacation during the
>last three months, so I appologize if I'm asking a question that was
>recently asked and answered.  I recall seeing some posts a few months ago
>regarding commercial paint brands and colors that were identical to, or
>almost identical to, Land Rover's Limestone.  I believe there was a
>Rustoleum color mentioned as well as others.  Unfortunately I neglected to
>save these posts.  I have a bit of touch-up to do on my Series III and am
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 24 lines)]
>  1991 Range Rover Vogue SE
>   Seattle, WA

------------------------------

From: "M. Tompkins" <mmglass@ix.netcom.com>
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 21:36:39 -0400
Subject: Party at Lanham Creek, Maryland

We sure had a great time at the 50th Anniversary Party
put on by LRNA at Lanham Creek, Maryland.

Over 250 Land Rovers showed up. Weather was bearable
and the event was excellent. Hats off to LRNA.

I put some pictures from the event on one of my web
sites. Follow the links to web pages with pictures from
the event.
Web site:
http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Hills/8365/index.html

Cheers,
Mike Tompkins
Owner of 'No Chance' 1966 Series II 109" SW
USAF Master Sergeant
Soccer Referee
Chief Designer, M&M Stained Glass
    http://www.netcom.com/~mmglass

------------------------------

From: Kathleen Hollington <kholling@nrn1.NRCan.gc.ca>
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 21:32:35 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Drive shaft alignment?

I put the engine and gearbox back in my Rover a couple of weeks
ago (I had bought the vehicle without drivetrain installed, as 
a semi-restored specimen).  Today I removed most of the remaining
body panels so I've basically got a rolling chassis with
bulkhead attached.  I noticed with some confusion that the center of
the powershaft coming out of the back of the gearbox is 8 inches higher
than the center of the nut on the rear diff connector.  For the front,
the power shaft coming out the gearbox is 6 inches higher than the center
of the front diff.
Why is this happening?  Should these things line up?  I don't have shock
absorbers installed front nor back, would that make a difference?  Would
the weight of the body panels bring the vehicle down?
The bolts holding the shackles on the leaf springs are loose.  The PO
told me he had put 109 springs in the back, could that account for the
high lift?  Any recommendations on how to correct the sitiuation would
be greatly appreciated.
Regards,
	--Robert
-- 

Robert St-Louis -- OTTAWA/CANADA -- '68 IIA SWB LR -- 
  kholling@nrn1.nrcan.gc.ca.NOSPAM (remove NOSPAM when replying)

------------------------------

From: Jeremy Bartlett <bartlett@slip.net>
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 18:38:44 -0700
Subject: Re: Limestone paint substitute

C. Marin Faure wrote:

> I believe there was a Rustoleum color mentioned as well as others.

Antique White.  It should be a fairly close match.  I'm not too big
onRustoleum (having used it myself), but it should do.

Jeremy

------------------------------

From: IBEdwardp@aol.com
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 21:37:08 EDT
Subject: Re: Limestone paint substitute

Just about any Dupont automotive paint place can mix limestone in any of their
automotive paints. The place in Maryville, TN, when I gave them the Dupont
#38505 (limestone) mixed me a quart of  Dupont Centari acrylic enamel in the
limestone color with the words "Atlantic British" on the computer generated
label. Centari is a comparatively safe paint to use (you can use a painter's
gas mask rather than a life support system) and seems fairly easy for an
amature to use. It drys fast and you don't have to have a spray booth. The
stuff costs about $20 per quart plus reducer.

If by "spray paint" you mean in spray cans, I believe the color mentioned on
the list a few months ago for Rustoleum was almond. I've looked at in in
Walmart and the cap color looks about right. 

I painted my 88 with tractor enamel from the local Tractor Supply Company. The
color is International Harvester White. Parked next to my friend's 109 which
he painted with the Dupont product, you can't tell the difference. The stuff
comes in spray cans, quarts and gallons. So far, it has proven pretty durable.
Drys slower than Rustoleum though. Spray cans are about $5, gallons about $15.
Thins with naptha if you're spraying, paint thinner if you're brushing. A
gallon will paint a LR and some porch chairs.

Usual disclaimers, I own nothin in anything except a LR.

Good luck!

Ed Bailey
"66 S2a 88
Somewhere in East Tennessee

------------------------------

From: john cranfield <john.cranfield@ns.sympatico.ca>
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 23:48:45 -0300
Subject: Re: Drive shaft alignment?

Relax. This the normal situation when the body is off. There is always
some height difference between the gear box out put and the diff. That
is why there are universal joints in the drive shafts.
     John and Muddy

Kathleen Hollington wrote:
> I put the engine and gearbox back in my Rover a couple of weeks
> ago (I had bought the vehicle without drivetrain installed, as
> a semi-restored specimen).  Today I removed most of the remaining
> body panels so I've basically got a rolling chassis with
> bulkhead attached.  I noticed with some confusion that the center of
> the powershaft coming out of the back of the gearbox is 8 inches higher
> than the center of the nut on the rear diff connector.  For the front,
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 23 lines)]
> Robert St-Louis -- OTTAWA/CANADA -- '68 IIA SWB LR --
>   kholling@nrn1.nrcan.gc.ca.NOSPAM (remove NOSPAM when replying)

------------------------------

From: Paul Oxley <paul@adventures.co.za>
Date: Sun, 28 Jun 1998 06:55:51 +0200
Subject: Re: Drive shaft alignment?

Kathleen Hollington wrote:
> I put the engine and gearbox back in my Rover a couple of weeks
> ago (I had bought the vehicle without drivetrain installed, as
> a semi-restored specimen).  Today I removed most of the remaining
> body panels so I've basically got a rolling chassis with
> bulkhead attached.  I noticed with some confusion that the center of
> the powershaft coming out of the back of the gearbox is 8 inches higher
> than the center of the nut on the rear diff connector.  For the front,
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 23 lines)]
> Robert St-Louis -- OTTAWA/CANADA -- '68 IIA SWB LR --
>   kholling@nrn1.nrcan.gc.ca.NOSPAM (remove NOSPAM when replying)

Hi Robert,

If I understand your predicament correctly you're concerned that without
front and rear propshafts the diff flanges are lower than the rear and
front output shaft flanges (?).

If this is the case, don't worry. That's what the universal joints on
the propshafts are for. And just think of the arc of travel that the
diffs describe when you're moving over rough terrain... The diff height
relative to the output shaft height changes all the time. For this
reason make sure that your UV joints in the propshafts are always in
good condition (Heaven forbid one should seize up and break out of its
yoke - been there, done that).

Regards

Paul Oxley
http://AfricanAdrenalin.co.za
http://Adventures.co.za
http://AfricanAdrenalin.com

------------------------------

From: "The Becketts" <hillman@bigpond.com>
Date: Sun, 28 Jun 1998 10:36:07 +1000
Subject: POR15

Someone wrote:
>Not sure if it matters, chemistry being a pseudo-science and all, but I
>think it was SPF 18.

Peter M. Kaskan responded:
>Chemistry - A Pseudo-Science?! You Can't Really Be Serious?!!
- Peter "Ex-Chemist" Kaskan

But didja notice Peter's address :
Peter M. Kaskan
Uris Hall 231
Dept. Of Psychology
Cornell University

Psychology -- Now there's a psuedo-science if anyone asks!  I'll just
unsubscribe to avoid the flaming responses 8-)

Regards,
Ron Beckett
Emu Plains, Australia
check my web site at www.users.bigpond.com/hillman

------------------------------

From: Faye and Peter Ogilvie <ogilvi@hgea.org>
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 22:24:29
Subject: Re: Drive shaft alignment?

	Aita Probleme as they say in Tahiti.  The universal joints in the drive
shaft take care of the different alignment between the trans and
differential.  I haven't measured the actual difference in height between
trans out put and diff, but yours sounds okay.  
	I'd lose the 109 rear springs.  500 pounds of fertilizer in the back of 
my
88 will barely depress very tired standard springs.  Driving over speed
bumps at more than a crawl will launch launch anything in the back with
this set up.  109 springs would probably be the equivalent of no springs at
all.
Aloha Peter

At 09:32 PM 6/27/98 -0400, you wrote:
>I put the engine and gearbox back in my Rover a couple of weeks
>ago (I had bought the vehicle without drivetrain installed, as 
>a semi-restored specimen).  Today I removed most of the remaining
>body panels so I've basically got a rolling chassis with
>bulkhead attached.  I noticed with some confusion that the center of
>the powershaft coming out of the back of the gearbox is 8 inches higher
>than the center of the nut on the rear diff connector.  For the front,
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 25 lines)]
>Robert St-Louis -- OTTAWA/CANADA -- '68 IIA SWB LR -- 
>  kholling@nrn1.nrcan.gc.ca.NOSPAM (remove NOSPAM when replying)

------------------------------

From: Frankelson@aol.com
Date: Sun, 28 Jun 1998 05:06:50 EDT
Subject: Re: Drive shaft alignment?

In a message dated 28/06/98 09:24:55 BST, you write:

<< I'd lose the 109 rear springs.  500 pounds of fertilizer in the back of my
 88 will barely depress very tired standard springs.  Driving over speed
 bumps at more than a crawl will launch launch anything in the back with
 this set up.  109 springs would probably be the equivalent of no springs at
 all. >>

I'm with Peter on that. It's a fairly common mistake in the Uk as well. Stick
109 springs on for an 'improved' ride. They tend to come off a week or so
later.
 Our triallers actually buy up tired springs to give better travel during a
trial.

Best Cheers

Frank
             +--+--+--+   	        
            I !__|  [_]|_\___   
            I ____|”_|"__|_ | /   B791 PKV - Bronze Green 110
            "(o)======(o)"

------------------------------

From: Frankelson@aol.com
Date: Sun, 28 Jun 1998 05:06:52 EDT
Subject: Re: POR15

In a message dated 28/06/98 08:37:17 BST, you write:

 But didja notice Peter's address :
 Peter M. Kaskan
 Uris Hall 231
 Dept. Of Psychology
 Cornell University
  >>

I'd always assumed he was an inmate - best place for a Land Rover owner :-)>

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