Land Rover Owner Message Digest Contents

[ First Message Last | Table of Contents | <- Digest -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest

Send Submissions Land-Rover-Owner@Land-Rover.Team.Net

From: Orin Harding <orin@deltacp.com>
Subject: Re: Fuel Injection (2.25 L)
Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 07:24:50 -0500

System parts are all new and will carry a 1 year warranty.

Regards, Orin Harding

Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 10:42:09 -0500
From: "Adams, Bill" <badams@usia.gov>
Subject: Re: Fuel Injection (2.25 L)

Is this made up from new parts or stuff you scrounged off a junker 
Toyota?

Bill Adams
3D Artist/Animator
'66 Land Rover S2A 109 Diesel Station Wagon,
'81 Honda Goldwing 1100 Standard:
"Practicing the ancient oriental art of ren-ching"

------------------------------

From: Johan Jacobs <jacobsj@laser.co.za>
Subject: Tyres
Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 15:01:31 +0200

>Dries Venter Wrote
*	Another option we have are Continental Conti-Trac's which
*	are fairly new issue here, but everybody's raving about 
*	them.  LR South Africa fits them as standard equipment.

I bought a new Tdi in May 1997 fitted with the Continental Conti-Tracs
AT tyres from a dealer in Cape Town. I came back from a trip in the
Kalahari Desert and blew a tyre on a gravel road. The road was in good
condition and I was travelling at 80 kph but the tyre almost
disintegrated. There was only 19000 km on the tyre. Two weeks before
that I also had a fairly thin stick penetrate one of the other tyres
side walls.
I have subsequently found out that some of the other new Landrover
owners in Cape Town are VERY unhappy with the Conti Trac tyre and a
number of people have written to Landrover South Africa complaining
about the tyre.
My next step is to see if the dealer is willing to replace the tyre.
Johan Jacobs
Public Relations Officer
Cape Land Rover Club
jacobsj@laser.co.za
1997 Tdi HT

------------------------------

From: cascardo@ix.netcom.com
Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 07:16:51 -0500
Subject: Brake lights

Hello,

Thanks to a very nice truck driver I was informed yesterday that I was
driving without the lower brake lights. The first thing I checked was
the fuse because both the right and left were not working, it wasn't
burnt.  Second, I checked the drivers side bulb, it wasn't burnt.  Using
"The Club" I wedged the brake down to check them again and saw that the
third upper brake light was working.  By the way the parking lights also
work so how can the socket be damaged.  What's going on!!!

Lucas (yes I share the same name of the demon that plagues me)
NAS '95 D90 SW

------------------------------

From: Alan_Richer/CAM/Lotus@lotus.com
Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 08:35:35 -0500
Subject: Re: Brake lights

Lucas, (I don't envy you that name.....<grin>)

I'd suspect grounding, either that or a disconnected lead in the rear
harness.

Wedge the pedal down and check the voltage at the lights with a meter.
Also, check the grounding to the sockets to make sure that the ground side
is actually connected to something. A long wire with a pair of alligator
clips had proved useful in situations like this - clamp it to a good ground
then start touching lamp sockets...

It's a simple process of elimination - work your way upstream in the
circuit till you find out where the electrons are falling off....8*)

               ajr

------------------------------

From: Andy Phillips <AnPi@norsk-data.co.uk>
Subject: RE: Brake lights
Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 13:36:06 -0000

The first thing to do is change both bulbs for known working bulbs. If
they don't work either then you know its a power problem. (And you have
the correct number of replacement lower brake bulbs!) Next follow the
wiring back and see where the lower wiring and upper wiring join
together (assuming they do). Now you know the size of the cabling you
have to check. My brake light problems started off with only the left
light working in tail light mode and by changing the brake light unit
(the socket the bulb sits in) I brought both left and right bulbs back
to life. The problem was thus in the unit as I had already checked the
cabling and earth point and fuses. At some stage I plan to change the
rest of the units as they are all similarly corroded and all the same
age. Probably the next time the electrics go mad . . .
My point about the electrics is don't panic and *do* attack the problem
systematically! I know very little about electrics and managed to fix my
wiring fault by doing the above.

Andy.

> -----Original Message-----
> From:	cascardo@ix.netcom.com [SMTP:cascardo@ix.netcom.com]
> Sent:	Tuesday, January 06, 1998 12:17 PM
> To:	lro@playground.sun.com
> Subject:	Brake lights

	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 24 lines)]
> Lucas (yes I share the same name of the demon that plagues me)
> NAS '95 D90 SW

------------------------------

From: L.Terburg@student.kun.nl
Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 15:03:36 +0100 (MET)

unsubscribe lro-list

------------------------------

From: Autoconv <Autoconv@aol.com>
Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 09:11:48 EST
Subject: Re: Traction Stuff

Hi Steve=0A=0AThe Detroit Locker or Truetrac diffs to fit the LR 90 can b=
e fitted to Series=0Avehicles using a crown wheel spacer (=A318) and a pa=
ir of bearing sleeves=0A(=A324/pair). It is a very straight forward job.=
=0A=0ARegards=0A=0ADavid Ashcroft (Automatic Conversions UK )=0A=0A

------------------------------

From: "Richard Marsden"<rmarsden@digicon-egr.co.uk>
Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 15:46:01 +0000
Subject: Reuse of tyres

I had my most spectacular flat tyre yesterday - on a slip road of the
M25/M23 junction.
Thought a plane was flying a bit low, by the noise!

Anyway, I had to drive approx. 100m on it, and I broke the beading if
that's the right term.

How safe is it to reuse such outer tyres?  My (scanty) look, didn't find
anything. I'll obviously need a new
inner, and me thinks my tracking will need another check...
The tyre is a (cheapish brand) "new" (ie. not remould) radial,  approx. 1yr
old.

Yes, I'm back from colder climes. Moral of last week: Check the adjustment
of your handbrake before attempting a Lake District pass!  No damage, but
good for the adrenalin if you stall on Honister at night in such a
situation...   :-)

Richard  (ex-Gurkha SIII 109 FFR)

------------------------------

From: Orin Harding <orin@deltacp.com>
Subject: Re: Fuel Injection (2.25 L)
Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 11:10:07 -0500

System parts are all new and will carry a 1 year warranty.

Regards, Orin Harding

Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 10:42:09 -0500
From: "Adams, Bill" <badams@usia.gov>
Subject: Re: Fuel Injection (2.25 L)

Is this made up from new parts or stuff you scrounged off a junker 
Toyota?

Bill Adams
3D Artist/Animator
'66 Land Rover S2A 109 Diesel Station Wagon,
'81 Honda Goldwing 1100 Standard:
"Practicing the ancient oriental art of ren-ching"

------------------------------

From: "Dries Venter" <ventera@ilink.nis.za>
Subject: Re: V8i Ignition Leads
Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 18:31:07 +0200

Over a period of time I have changed ALL my vehicles to BougiCord, and use
the Bosch 4-pointer plugs.  Good results.  Agood bright spark will not
necessarily give you sports performance, but it will give you better fuel
consumption, because the fuel is burned more efficiently, giving you more
power for the same qty of fuel.

Dries Venter
Pretoria
South Africa
1985 Defender PUP V8 aka "The Yellow Submarine"
----------
> From: Alan Logue <logue@a011.aone.net.au>
> Does anyone have any recomendations/warnings for a good brand of plug
leads
> and coil lead to upgrade to?
> I don't want sports car performance :<), but I want to get as much spark
to
> each plug as I can.

------------------------------

From: "Dries Venter" <ventera@ilink.nis.za>
Subject: Re: Tyres
Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 18:25:20 +0200

Just goes to show, a number of people here in the Transvaal at the LRO club
are pretty happy about their Conti-Trac's.  Me? I stuck to the tried and
tested Super All Grips!  They are actually good all-round performers. And
for really nasty rock work I can always put on some the S.A.G's in crossply
form.

Regards,
Dries Venter
Pretoria
South Africa
1985 Defender PUP V8 aka "The Yellow Submarine"
----------
> From: Johan Jacobs <jacobsj@laser.co.za>
> >Dries Venter Wrote
> *	Another option we have are Continental Conti-Trac's which
> *	are fairly new issue here, but everybody's raving about 
> *	them.  LR South Africa fits them as standard equipment.
> I bought a new Tdi in May 1997 fitted with the Continental Conti-Tracs
> AT tyres from a dealer in Cape Town. I came back from a trip in the
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 21 lines)]
> Public Relations Officer
> Cape Land Rover Club

------------------------------

From: debrown@srp.gov
Date: 06 Jan 98 09:49:35 MST
Subject: Help with rough idle - sucking exhaust.

From:  David Brown - Graphics Specialist ~SRP~ E-mail: debrown@srp.gov
       PAB219 (602)236-3544 -  Pager:6486 External (602)275-2508 #6486
                                    Pers. E-mail: rovernut@hotmail.com
If you're on the "mendo" list, please respond directly to me, I'm not
subscribed to that list (no time).

Hello great Rover lovers... (Hey! That sounds rather provocative!) I have a
'71 IIa that hasn't been licensed in almost 2 years (long, slow, gearbox
rebuild) that has a problem passing local emissions. I don't have the exact
numbers with me, but the area that failed was in the idle test (tickover):
1500 HC when 500 HC is the maximum. Also, when you put your hand over the
exhaust you can feel a fairly frequent (but not steady) miss, and sucking.
2-3 times/second. As I recall, you can't notice it doing this when reving
the engine. Obviously, the idle is pretty rough, but not extremely so.

I have replaced plugs, wires, cap, rotor, carburetor, and checked the
points. Valve clearance checked and ok. All valves (rocker arms) appear to
move the same, and seem ok. Compression is good: 117-120 dry, and 125 "wet."
(oil) No apparent vacuum leaks. Distributor (dizzy) doesn't have excessive
play when I try to wiggle it at the points lobes, and vacuum advance moves
when I suck on the tube. No noticeable collapses in the exhaust pipe. The
carburetor worked great on my 109, (now sold.) Dwell is fairly steady, at
60. (Admittedly, I have a 25+ year old dwell meter).

The distributor is pointing differently than the 109 did, and the timing
marks on the pulley are nowhere near lined up to the indicator mark, (Around
90 degrees towards the bottom) but the timing seems to be ok, gets worse
when I turn the distributor left or right. (Could the distributor just be
set a tooth or two off? Or would the chain be set wrong?)

Where does your #1 plug wire "point" to on the cap? Mine is facing the #2
spark plug, as I recall.

Other symptoms: very week power, (even for a Rover!) top speed is BARELY 50
on the flat road, more of 35 on ANY kind of incline. This is with the
throttle floored. I have checked the throttle linkage and it is good
(getting gull throttle). Starts right up - easily. Gas milage (not actually
checked) is estimated at around 10 mpg. No excessive oil use or smoking.

I used to be able to at least keep up with VW vans with my 109, but with
this one, I can't keep up with ANYTHING, except maybe the bicyclist along
the roadway. Acceleration is extremely slow. 1/4+ mile to get to around
40mph. (Small, "street" type tires.)

What could this be??? Sticking valve? Weak valve springs? Anything else???
Bad fuel pump/pressure (for weak power)?

What's the easiest fix? Valve spring spacers? Risoline oil treatment? Engine
flush? How can I test to see what's wrong?

Please, Please help!!! I really NEED to get this running and licensed. My
other car is flat worn out and beat to a pulp. (Not a 4WD either!)

Thanks, Dave Brown

 Never give up your life for          #=======#         _____l___
 anything that death can take away.   |__|__|__\___    //__|__|__\___
                        -anonymous    | _|  |   |_ |}  \__ - ____ - _|}
                                      "(_)""""""(_)"      (_)    (_)

------------------------------

From: Ben Nibali <BNibali@dmtn.com>
Subject: Castrol-Girling Rubber Grease
Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 12:58:00 -0500

I am in the midst of rebuilding the clutch master cylinder on my '65 88"
IIA.  I found a few references in the LR manual about smearing
Castrol-Girling Rubber Grease all over the new seals before
reassembling.  I've never heard of such a thing and a search of the
mailing list archives turned up nothing- so I'm posing the following
questions:

What is this stuff, do I really need to use it, and if so where can I
get some (or its equivalent)?  I use Castrol LMA in all the hydraulic
lines already, would it be OK if I just smear that around?

Here's another quick question while I've got the attention of 900 LR
owners:  Can I smooth out the very slight scoring in the cylinder with
600-grit wet paper or do I need something a bit more subtle?

Thanks everyone.

 -Ben Nibali
 Maryville, TN

------------------------------

From: dbobeck@inetgate.ushmm.org
Date: Tue, 06 Jan 98 13:15:59 EST
Subject: Re: Castrol-Girling Rubber Grease

> I use Castrol LMA in all the hydraulic
>lines already, would it be OK if I just smear that around?

wouldn't hurt anything. Girling rubber grease comes in little foil packets when 
you buy a rebuild kit. smear it all over the seals and on the inside of the 
dustboot, before you put it al back together

> Can I smooth out the very slight scoring in the cylinder with
>600-grit wet paper or do I need something a bit more subtle?

try a brake cylinder hone. before you use it, knock off the edges of the stones 
with some fine sandpaper so that they don't further gouge the inside of the 
aluminum cylinder.

cheers
Dave

------------------------------

From: Ben Nibali <BNibali@dmtn.com>
Subject: Castrol-Girling Rubber Grease
Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 14:57:00 -0500

I am in the midst of rebuilding the clutch master cylinder on my '65 88"
IIA.  I found a few references in the LR manual about smearing
Castrol-Girling Rubber Grease all over the new seals before
reassembling.  I've never heard of such a thing and a search of the
mailing list archives turned up nothing- so I'm posing the following
questions:

What is this stuff, do I really need to use it, and if so where can I
get some (or its equivalent)?  I use Castrol LMA in all the hydraulic
lines already, would it be OK if I just smear that around?

Here's another quick question while I've got the attention of 900 LR
owners:  Can I smooth out the very slight scoring in the cylinder with
600-grit wet paper or do I need something a bit more subtle?

Thanks.

 -Ben Nibali
 Maryville, TN

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 10:34:50 -0800
From: Todd_Wilson@ccmail.columbia.com (Todd Wilson)
Subject: Re: Castrol-Girling Rubber Grease

     I just rebuilt the brake master cylinder on my truck and the brake 
     grease came in the rebuild kit. Per the instructions the grease is 
     used on the sealing cups *outside* of the cylinder (wheel or master). 
     I believe it also said not to let the grease come in contact with 
     surfaces that the brake fluid will touch (i.e. internal parts).
     
     As for the scoring, I picked up a small cylinder hone at the local 
     auto parts store for $3 - $4 US. Much more uniform than sandpaper I'd 
     imagine. use brake fluid to lubricate the hone while it's running. 
     (It's drill powered)
     
     hope this helps.
     tew
     
     Ps helpful hint #381, I lost the cap to the reservoir, Turns out the 
     cap from a gas can is a perfect fit. might get you home without 
     sloshing fluid on your perfectly restored bulkhead. ;)

------------------------------

From: "Chris Dillard"<cdillard@Aholdusa.com>
Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 16:19:42 -0500
Subject: Uniden 510XL CB

SORRY FOR THE DOUBLE POSTING!!!
Went and looked at the Uniden 510XL CB at the local "CB World' and was just
curious if anyone had any direct experience with this unit!  The cost was
about $60.  The whole kit: Ant, Caox cable, and CB unit would be about
$100. Is this good or bad for the money?

Chris
91 RR County SWB (w/ a few extra's)

------------------------------

From: Solihull@aol.com
Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 16:34:42 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re:  Castrol-Girling Rubber Grease

  To Dave's and Todd's good advice, I'd add; after you're done honing, wash
the cylinder thoroughly, even run it through the dishwasher, if the distaff
will let you get away with it, to remove *all* traces of loose metal
(honage?!?). The rubber grease is red or tan, and in a paper or foil tube in
some kits. All it is, is thiiiick brake fluid. Use LMA if your hands are tres
clean. Better yet, use gloves, even if only for your hands' sake. It used to
be available in bigger tubes. I'm still using out of the tube I bought back
in the late seventies. Lifetime supply, I guess.
  There's another LRO in Maryville. Here, I'll introduce y'all. Ben; Ed. Ed;
Ben. Now go and start a  club, maybe a SoLaRoS chapter!?!
Cheers!!
John Dillingham
(known to use kitchen appliances on VW and Rover parts)
near Canton, GA
KF4NAS
LROA #1095
SoLaRoS #23
73 s3 swb 25902676b DD "Pansy"
72 s3 swb 25900502a rusted, in suspended animation
Looking for a P5 project, well, OK, or a P6 or another SD1

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 17:23:52 -0500 (EST)
From: David Scheidt <david@infocom.com>
Subject: Re: Uniden 510XL CB

On Tue, 6 Jan 1998, Chris Dillard wrote:

> Went and looked at the Uniden 510XL CB at the local "CB World' and was just
> curious if anyone had any direct experience with this unit!  The cost was

I have one these. It seems to work, though I don't really use it for
anything but short range stuff.  I paid a lot less than $60 though, maybe
30 or $40, exclusive of an antenna.  

david/mr sinclair

> about $60.  The whole kit: Ant, Caox cable, and CB unit would be about
> $100. Is this good or bad for the money?
> Chris
> 91 RR County SWB (w/ a few extra's)

------------------------------

From: "daviscar" <Daviscar@concentric.net>
Subject: Help with lights
Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 19:04:53 -0600

Hi All

I know this is a long shot but here goes.
I am in NEED of a ignition/headlight switch for a 2A.
If anyone anywhere has one they can part with Please let me know.
My switch came apart today wail I was at work. I went out to a location for
work when to shut the LR off the key turned to the off but the engine
stayed on.
Took the dash off and the switch was all apart. got it back together far
enough to get back to work and home but the Lights are all messed up  the
little ball thing is gone.
This is my daily and at the moment only driver so I really need to find
this switch.
I will take it with or without keys I will even take one that it broken as
long as the little ball thing is there.
Please Help me

Bruce Davis
67 SIIA 88 Patches
Daviscar@concentric.net

------------------------------

From: "daviscar" <Daviscar@concentric.net>
Subject: Help with light switch
Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 19:27:08 -0600

 Hi All
 
 I know this is a long shot but here goes.
 I am in NEED of a ignition/headlight switch for a 2A.
 If anyone anywhere has one they can part with Please let me know.
 My switch came apart today wail I was at work. I went out to a location
for
 work when to shut the LR off the key turned to the off but the engine
 stayed on.
 Took the dash off and the switch was all apart. got it back together far
 enough to get back to work and home but the Lights are all messed up  the
 little ball thing is gone.
 This is my daily and at the moment only driver so I really need to find
 this switch.
 I will take it with or without keys I will even take one that it broken as
 long as the little ball thing is there.
 Please Help me
 
 Bruce Davis
 67 SIIA 88 Patches
 Daviscar@concentric.net
 

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 20:43:42 -0500
From: David Cockey <dcockey@tir.com>
Subject: Re: Castrol-Girling Rubber Grease

It's available in tubes from RN as "Red Brake Grease" 514578 for $5.50 /
tube, which should last a long time.

Regards,
David Cockey

------------------------------

From: "daviscar" <Daviscar@concentric.net>
Subject: Help with light switch
Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 20:18:14 -0600

  Hi All
  
  I know this is a long shot but here goes.
  I am in NEED of a ignition/headlight switch for a 2A.
  If anyone anywhere has one they can part with Please let me know.
  My switch came apart today wail I was at work. I went out to a location
 for
  work when to shut the LR off the key turned to the off but the engine
  stayed on.
  Took the dash off and the switch was all apart. got it back together far
  enough to get back to work and home but the Lights are all messed up  the
  little ball thing is gone.
  This is my daily and at the moment only driver so I really need to find
  this switch.
  I will take it with or without keys I will even take one that it broken
as
  long as the little ball thing is there.
  Please Help me
  
  Bruce Davis
  67 SIIA 88 Patches
  Daviscar@concentric.net
  
 

------------------------------

From: Solihull@aol.com
Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 23:08:01 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re:  Help with light switch

Bruce, 
  Disassemble the switch. Clean everything up. The keyed part only makes toe
two contacts on the center, since your starter sw is under the dash. You
should be able to see two tangs, like dog ears, bent toward each other. after
you unbend them, and clean everything below, put the contact parts back on,
but this time bend the tangs the *other* way. This should solve the problem
and let you turn the truck off at will. 
Just get behind the panel. You'll see what I mean.
Hang in there!
Cheers!!
John Dillingham
near Canton, GA
KF4NAS
LROA #1095
SoLaRoS #23
73 s3 swb 25902676b DD "Pansy"
72 s3 swb 25900502a rusted, in suspended animation
Looking for a P5 project, well, OK, or a P6 or another SD1

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 23:42:30 -1000
From: kiotee@mcn.net (Roy Caldwell)
Subject: Rovers for sale

Well folks, after 81/2 months in Bosnia and getting back into real life my
friend and I have 3 Rovers for sale.  We have our eyes on other projects and
have run out of room and the sig others are really wondersing what we are up
to.  So here are the facts:

64 Series IIA, North American top with tail gate, Seamist Green top and
bottom,solid frame, strong engine, Fairey overdrive, old style Warn hubs,
new 15" tires, good seats, is a daily driver.  $5,000

71 Series IIA, Pick-up cab, Limestone, bit of rust on frame, straight body,
strong engine, Toro overdrive, old style Warn hubs, roll bar, new 16" tires,
daily driver, $6,500.

69 Series IIA, early year Bugeye, Station Wagon, Limestone over Seamist
Green, Deluxe but worn interior, new Mile Marker hubs, good frame and body,
some normal wear and tear on the body, rebuilt 21/4 engine, daily driver,
$6,500.

All three are here in Helena, MT.  If not too far out, delivery might be
arranged.  You have my e-mail but you can also call me at 406-442-1804 after
about 6PM MT time to talk.  Any questions give a call or drop some mail.
For somebody really interested we can do some stills and a vid of any or all
three.

Roy - Rovers in the Rockies - Where Rovers were built to live!!!!

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 03:17:00 -0500
From: Alain Hoffmann <AlainHoffmann@compuserve.com>
Subject: 101 for sale

Sorry to take up bandwith with this sales message but as the car is such =
a
rare thing ...
First: This is no commercial add.
A friend of mine sells his LR101 (for those who ignore it: that's sort of=
 a
forward control). It's one of the very last built (around 1979 I believe)=

and has the very rare radio body (closed hard top) but no more military
radio equipment. Engine is the original carburated V-8, it's
left-hand-drive, 38.000 genuine km's (about 21.000 miles), overdrive, ver=
y
short axle ratio (5.?), 12 VOLTS and STANDARD electric parts (not this
expensive military stuff) and everything in good working order with a
straight body and no dammage. Also it's fully equipped (shovels, axe, hit=
ch
etc). It's very recently gone through our technical inspection, it's road=

registered with plate LR101 and can be driven as is for any distance
(whatever this means on a Land-Rover...). The last few years it was store=
d
in a dry barn and only driven a few days every year. Some spares go also
with the car. The location for the moment is in LUXEMBOURG, EUROPE. =

Asking price is said to be around 7000 US-$ or 3500 =A3 ONO. He sells it
because his pregnant wife can't climb inside any more :-) .
Shipping can be arranged worldwide, as can be any optional equipment you
want on it (diff locks, stainless exhaust, winch,?)
Only serious inquiries please directly to me at 100770.1655@compuserve.co=
m.
For those interested I can also send pics of the car.

                        ---ALAIN---

------------------------------

  END OF * LIST DIGEST 
 Input:  messages 26 lines 1085 [forwarded 70 whitespace 227]
 Output: lines 818 [content 484  forwarded 41 (cut  29) whitespace 217]

Back	Forward
Photos & text Copyright 1990-2011 Bill Caloccia, All rights reserved. Digest Messages Copyright 1990-2011 by the original poster or/and Bill Caloccia, All rights reserved.