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Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 08:33:41 -0500
From: David Cockey <dcockey@tir.com>
Subject: Re: Bearing numbers

Alexander P. Grice wrote:

> shells....
> I don't know about "custom" but here are some 'American' part
> numbers.  All
> are for "standards", though.

The original posting and response were about SII engine bearing shells,
not SIIA. ARe the cross-references posted for SII or SIIA?

> These are "old" numbers, in that they may have been superceeded by
> now.  The
> nice thing about "modern" bearing numbers is that the part number
> defines
> the bearing size, or so I'm told by out local bearingplace (though I
> haven't
> figured out how).

This is true for ball, roller, tapered roller, etc. bearings which are
usually generic in design and interchangeable similar to fasteners.

Engine main and rod bearings are journal bearings, with the support
provided by a thin film of oil in the gap between the bearing and the
journal. Such bearings are specific to an engine design and generally
not interchangeable. SII mains are the same size as SIIA but not
interchangable due to tab position, etc.

Regards,
David Cockey

------------------------------

From: SPYDERS <SPYDERS@aol.com>
Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 08:35:31 EST
Subject: Re:  ECR stealing *my* thunder!

In a message dated 12/6/97 3:45:26 AM, you wrote:

>P.S., The brits did make computers -- Anyone remember the Sinclair ZX81?  Or
>Amstrad (I've got two Amstrads (and another coming from Oz) in my collection
>and would love a Sinclair QL!)

Not only do I remember them, but I had to use them as well. We were taught on
the Sinclair "Zed-Exes", then moved up to the *big, fast* Amstrad. I thought
I'd left it all behind when I see the ECU on my rover, it looks suspiciously
like a black Sinclair without the (cassette) tape drive...

pat
93  110

------------------------------

From: ASFCO@worldnet.att.net
Subject: Re: Series IIA gearbox case...
Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 13:40:01 +0000

At 01:18 AM 12/6/97 +0000, you wrote:
>Anybody out there have one? I kinda killed mine yesterday. Don't know what

Charlie;
   If all else fails...I would check with Harrell Motor Sales in
Waynesville, NC..
Rgds
Steve  
>Anybody out there have one? I kinda killed mine yesterday. Don't know what

------------------------------

From: Alan_Richer/CAM/Lotus@lotus.com
Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 08:41:26 -0500
Subject: Re: Belleview electric winch?

Yes, my boy, you came to the right place....

I have a Bellview on the front of my 109. It proudly wears a plate
mentioning that it is an authorized accessory from Land-Rover North
America. Great beast. Mine has hauled more than one Range Rover away from
certain doom...8*)

The history of these old boys is a bit odd. Bellview came up with this
great winch, rated 6000 pounds, and sold them as a kit to LRNA and other
manufacturers, which put them on Rover front ends. Bellview then got bought
by Warn, Inc. who tested the design and promptly sold it as an 8000 pound
winch with a few minor modifications.

The same basic design is stil for sale today as the Warn 8274.

That's the good news. The bad news is that Warn no longer sells parts for
these winches at all, so things like brake bands, control cables and power
switches are not available from the original source. However, except fr odd
custom parts, everything else is pretty-well industrial stock.

If you can get one, go for it. They're a great unit, not as heavy or
cumbersome as some, and are real Land-Rover to boot! The downside is that
the power IN only, and freewheel out. They also don't have a pendant
control, usually being rigged to operate from the driver's seat with pull
cables to the controls and a power button.

Email me if you need more information.

                    Alan R.

------------------------------

From: SPYDERS <SPYDERS@aol.com>
Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 08:52:14 EST
Subject: Re:  Land Rover Buyer's Kit-Spam

=0AIn a message dated 12/5/97 10:40:28 PM, you wrote:=0A=0A> OUR 350-PAGE=
 FULLY ILLUSTRATED=0APROSPECTIVE OWNER=92S  INFORMATION  KIT, PROVIDES A =
 VETERAN LAND-ROVER=0APROFESSIONAL=92S COMPREHENSIVE ANALYSIS OF THE INTE=
LLIGENT AND ACCURATE WAY TO=0A>EVALUATE AND PURCHASE A SECOND-HAND LAND-R=
OVER.  4,000+ SATISFIED CUSTOMERS=0A>TO DATE. =0A=0A4,000 Customers? What=
's he counting? Hits on his webpage, the kids and pets=0Atoo? It doesn't =
appear any on *this* list are part of that group.=0A=0AHEY, NORTHWORST, I=
N FAIRNESS TO THOSE THAT HAVE RECEIVED THIS IN THE PAST,=0AHERE IT IS FOR=
 YOU: TAKE YOUR STINKIN' ADVERTISING ELSEWHERE. IT ISN'T LIKE=0AYOU'RE A =
*REGULAR CONTIBUTOR* TO THE LIST, AND ALLOWED SOME LEEWAY... BUT YOUR=0AM=
ESSAGE IS THE MOST EXPENSIVE SPAM I'VE SEEN (INCLUDING THE STUFF SOLD ON=
=0AGUAM) GO HOME AND KEEP TAKING YOUR 4000 FOR A RIDE, IT APPEARS FROM TH=
E=0APOSTINGS ON THE LIST THAT THAT'S ALL YOU CARE TO DO.=0A=0Apat "not 1/=
4000" p.=0A93  110=0A

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 09:53:58 -0500 (EST)
From: Russ Wilson <rwilson@usaor.net>
Subject: Re: Belleview electric winch?

Belleview was bought by Warn
Warn has excellent customer service and supplies spares for everything they
have ever made...  I have a Warn 8274 which is based on an old Belleview
design..
as for Warn having parts for a belleview winch  I'd say give warn a call
and ask

 Warn ph# 1-800-543-Warn

Russ Wilson
Leslie Bittner

Fort Pitt Land Rover Group
Pittsburgh, Pa.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 10:01:06 -0500 (EST)
From: Russ Wilson <rwilson@usaor.net>
Subject: Re: Dot4

For reasons known only to those with much more knowledge than I...
Don't ever, ever, ever  use ANYTHING  other than the Castrol girling  juice
of the gods....   the other stuff will rot your rubber inards on the whole
brake system..

Russ Wilson
Leslie Bittner

Fort Pitt Land Rover Group
Pittsburgh, Pa.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 05:20:02 -0800
From: Thomas Spoto <tspoto@az.com>
Subject: Re: Belleview electric winch?

Russ Wilson wrote:
> Belleview was bought by Warn
> Warn has excellent customer service and supplies spares for everything they
> have ever made...  I have a Warn 8274 which is based on an old Belleview
> design..
> as for Warn having parts for a belleview winch  I'd say give warn a call
> and ask

	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 16 lines)]
> Fort Pitt Land Rover Group
> Pittsburgh, Pa.

I beg to differ. I called Warn, and was told that they no longer stocked
parts for my winch. It's an early Warn not a Belleview. They did provide
a parts breakdown/exploded view however. That was three or four years.
ago.

Tom

------------------------------

From: dbobeck@inetgate.ushmm.org
Date: Sat, 06 Dec 97 11:16:57 EST
Subject: Re[2]: Belleview electric winch?

Ok, here's the REAL skinny on Belleview/Warn 8000's.
 I got one of these a few years ago, and it was pretty much toast. All the 
bearings were seized and the casing was full of water. The motor did run 
however, but the cable was really in bad shape and the hook was gone. I 
called WARN and tlaked to a guy named Ron Hoffman. Ron is an old timer at 
WARN and knows everything about these winches, and is more than happy to 
talk about them, for lengthy periods of time. 
 They have not made or supplied parts for them for over twenty years. 
Bearings and oil seals are still available from any bearing supplier. I 
spent about fifty bucks replacing all of them. Gears etc, could be repaired 
if they ever broke, but the cable would be more likely to give before that 
happens. 
 After I was done rebuilding mine, the motor stopped working. I called Ron 
for advice and he suggested I call Clemson 4wd, in South Carolina I think. 
They had some NOS motors on the shelf. They guy there said he had just sold 
the last one a week before. I took the motor apart and cleaned it up, and 
it works fine now. 
 They do sell a conversion kit that allows you to operate the winch by 
remote. It includes a solenoid pack and 12 foot cable remote switch. Not 
having the pwer ouyt feature isn't a real big deal, I don't think you would 
power out all the cable anyway, it would take too long.
 They will, as stated earlier supply you with a parts diagram, a user's 
manual, and even a step by step repair guide with photographs.
 These winches are monsters, that will hold 150' of 5/16" cable. It has 
saved my a** on numerous occasions, and will pull the Rover through a 
mountain of the thickest Virignia clay you can find.
 
later
DaveB

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 11:36:50 -0500
From: Mike Johnson <johnsonm@borg.com>
Subject: Re: Dot4

>Don't ever, ever, ever  use ANYTHING  other than the Castrol girling  juice
>of the gods....   the other stuff will rot your rubber inards on the whole
>brake system..

Another chapter from the book of urban myths.  But to each their own I
suppose.  People feel a sort of religious attachment to certain products,
Champion spark plugs, oil, oil filters, octane grades, tires and so on.  

I used silicone on my clutch last week and when the time comes will use the
same with my brakes.  My personal choice.  As for "rot your rubber inards"
HOG WASH.

Michael Johnson
johnsonm@borg.com
http://www.borg.com/~johnsonm

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 08:52:10 -0800
From: "Christopher H. Dow" <dow@thelen.org>
Subject: Re: Land Rover Buyer's Kit

Thomas Spoto wrote:
> > Would you mind explaining the Corn Flakes thing?  I don't get it.
> The gentleman in question is named Kellogg. 

OK.  I get it now.  Wow, that was pretty thick-headed of me, eh?

C

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 15:57:03 -0800
From: "Con P. Seitl" <seitl@ns.sympatico.ca>
Subject: Re: Dot4

Mike Johnson wrote:
> >Don't ever, ever, ever  use ANYTHING  other than the Castrol girling  juice
> >of the gods....   the other stuff will rot your rubber inards on the whole
> >brake system..
> Another chapter from the book of urban myths.  But to each their own I
> suppose.  People feel a sort of religious attachment to certain products,
> Champion spark plugs, oil, oil filters, octane grades, tires and so on.

	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 16 lines)]
> johnsonm@borg.com
> http://www.borg.com/~johnsonm

Well hog wash or not, I've got a leaking master clutch, and I use Dot 3 
from our local Crappy Tire Store. Already replaced wheel cyl kits over 
the years, and clutch slave. I don't mind so much, but it would be nice 
to get the proper stuff. Can't seem to find it anywhere here.

Con Seitl
1973 III 88 "Pig"

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 14:02:27 -0500 (EST)
From: Russ Wilson <rwilson@usaor.net>
Subject: Re: Dot4

>I used silicone on my clutch last week and when the time comes will use the
>same with my brakes.  My personal choice.  As for "rot your rubber inards"
>HOG WASH.

I've never washed a hog but I've been smart enough to only use the correct
fluid for my brakes.....

see you on the side of the road

>Michael Johnson
>johnsonm@borg.com
>http://www.borg.com/~johnsonm

Russ Wilson
Leslie Bittner

Fort Pitt Land Rover Group
Pittsburgh, Pa.

------------------------------

From: "S. Vels" <dko5319@vip.cybercity.dk>
Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 20:00:50 +0001
Subject: Re: Rust

> From:          Steve Fullwood <ansdf@ttacs1.ttu.edu>
> Subject:       Rust

> I have a easy question I hope.  What is the easiest way to check for rust
> on the frame.  

The MOT inspectors in DK has a small hammer with a parabolic head. 
Sounds nasty, but with the wrist thay can tap gently or apply a 
formidable force to a very small area. When i check for rust (every 
second year) i use a copy of such a hammer. It's a 200gram shoemaker 
hammer. The sharp end is ground to resemble the inspectors hammer. 
Works great. A large screw driver also works but is more awkward.

>I am not a idiot I just want to know if you just look and say "yep 
> there is rust" or what.  

If whatever tool you use goes throug, you can say "yep there is 
rust".

A hammer is good for removing rust flakes as well. Ask any sailor. In 
ares where salt is used in the winter, rust will not be a thin layer. 
It will become a porous layer. 1/10 millimeter of rust can become a 
flake of 1mm thick. These flakes has got to be removed. Salt makes 
rust work like cancer.

Make sure there are drain holes in the frame. Also in the outriggers. 
Rust on the outside is worst ( salt, mud, etc). Use Waxoyl or invent 
your own stuff. I use gear oil and Tectyl.

rgds
sv/aurens

New address:
dko5319@vip.cybercity.dk

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 16:24:51
From: James Wolf <J.Wolf@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: front axles and swivels

First some history; I have had the front diff.(Rover type) brought back to
as built specs. The swivels etc are new, the axles are the old ones with
all new replaceable parts renewed.
My problem, the short-side front axle went in rather smoothly; however the
long-side axle requires several taps with a rubber-faced mallet. Once in it
appears to be just fine, ie. the diff. turns easily both axles turn
smoothly all seems right; however when removeing the long-side again it is
very tightmand requires some tapping with aforesaid mall.
My question, is this really abnormal? Should I just continue on or should I
stop and take everything back apart? As I have ruined the axle seal and new
ones won't be here until wed. I have some time to sort this out, with help
from the digest. This is my first time into the front axle, so I really
don't know what is the norm. 

Jim Wolf

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 16:50:35 -0500 (EST)
From: Russ Wilson <rwilson@usaor.net>
Subject: Re: Dot4

>Well hog wash or not, I've got a leaking master clutch, and I use Dot 3
>from our local Crappy Tire Store. Already replaced wheel cyl kits over
>the years, and clutch slave. I don't mind so much, but it would be nice
>to get the proper stuff. Can't seem to find it anywhere here.
>Con Seitl
>1973 III 88 "Pig"

>From one pig owner to another I'll trade you a few gallons of the good stuff
 ( Castrol GT LMA) for that left wing ;)

Russ Wilson
Leslie Bittner

Fort Pitt Land Rover Group
Pittsburgh, Pa.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 19:19:44 -0800
From: "Con P. Seitl" <seitl@ns.sympatico.ca>
Subject: Re: Dot4

Russ Wilson wrote:
> >Well hog wash or not, I've got a leaking master clutch, and I use Dot 3
> >from our local Crappy Tire Store. Already replaced wheel cyl kits over
>          [ truncated by lro-lite (was 7 lines)]
> >Con Seitl
> >1973 III 88 "Pig"
> >From one pig owner to another I'll trade you a few gallons of the good stuff

	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 16 lines)]
> Fort Pitt Land Rover Group
> Pittsburgh, Pa.

  Aha! The cat's <-- Rover content?-- outta the bag! 
   Now let's see.... 20 gallons divided by 1 wing + Royal Mail = .....
        :-)  :-)   :-)   :-)   :-)   he he!
  

            From one Pig owner to another of course!! ;->
Con Seitl
1973 III 88 "Pig"

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 18:32:34 -0500
From: Mike Johnson <johnsonm@borg.com>
Subject: Re: Dot4

>>I used silicone on my clutch last week and when the time comes will use the
>>same with my brakes.  My personal choice.  As for "rot your rubber inards"
>>HOG WASH.

>I've never washed a hog but I've been smart enough to only use the correct
>fluid for my brakes.....
>see you on the side of the road

I don't mean to talk down to anyone but silicone is inert.  If you would
like to burn down your house try this little experiment:

1 pint of "normal" break fluid and 12 ounces of powdered pool chlorine in a
coffee can and wait a minute or two...  BOOM! therefore it is not inert
i.e. it reacts with other compounds, to include but not limited to rubber
innards.

I won't stoop to return the personal intelligence attack, sorry enough
flaming going on.

Michael Johnson
johnsonm@borg.com
http://www.borg.com/~johnsonm

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 18:43:35 -0500
From: "William L. Leacock" <wleacock@pipeline.com>

>Lucas seems very German for being a British company... I understand the
>Lucas EFI is in fact made by Bosch.
 Lucas has not been a British Company for some time, like the British car
industry it too has been exported.  Lucas was purchased by an American Co.
 I hope they keep it going because one day they owe me some pension for my
years of dedicated service.
Bill Leacock  ( Limey in exile )
 88 and 109 LR's and 89 RR 

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 18:45:21 -0500
From: "William L. Leacock" <wleacock@pipeline.com>
Subject: Lucas.

As I clicked the send button I realised that I had not put in the name of
the current  owner of Lucas, it is now called Lucas Varity, a subsidiary of
the Varity Corporation
Bill Leacock  ( Limey in exile )
 88 and 109 LR's and 89 RR 

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 20:19:26 -0400
From: john cranfield <john.cranfield@ns.sympatico.ca>
Subject: LR contacts wanted

A family member is relocating to Slave Lake Alberta and would like any
LR contacts in the Edmonton Area.
       John and Muddy ( who hasn't been to Alberta......yet)

------------------------------

From: SPYDERS <SPYDERS@aol.com>
Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 19:15:09 EST
Subject: Center Diffs: locked or open? not-lr type.

I have a question for those of you who have owned or (also) own non-lr 4x4s;
the ones with a transfer box selector that reads: 2H--4H--N--4L... I guess
meaning selectable four wheel drive.

Are those xfer cases permanently locked (ie: no differential between front and
rear axles) or are they open diffs? Are they open for 2wd and locked when 4wd
is engaged?

Just curious, as I rode in a non-lr 4x4 and in 4wd mode, there was lots of
tire scrubbing, even on mild turns. The vehicle was stock with no lockers that
I was aware of. You can reply to my e-mail so as not to distract from the
serious land rover topics...

pat
93  110

------------------------------

From: SPYDERS <SPYDERS@aol.com>
Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 19:29:13 EST
Subject: Re: Flamethrowers

Uncle Roger mentioned the flamethrower and others have mentioned the heat from
flames on the list recently, so here's a personal story of my flamethrower:

I miss my old flamethrower. Granted it wasn't military issue, but it was a
neat party trick, or stoplight trick. This doesn't really apply to Land Rovers
and their mission specific design, but in my younger, bolder years...

I acquired a VW with a lumpy idle/high-overlap cam and straight through
headers and exhaust. With a spark plug tapped into the 4:1 collector, the
unburned fuel would be ignited... pretty cool. I learned that I could turn off
the main ignition and switch on the 2nd coil and exhaust sparkplug, while
coasting down the road, press the gas pedal to activate the carbs' acc.pumps
and watch the flames shoot out the back. Boy, did it wake up boy-racers in
their mustangs... Kinda funny to do on a first date, too. ;-)

Unfortunately, a motorcycle cop thought it was really, really unfunny.

I miss my flamethrowing exhaust (no Taco Bell jokes, please).

pat
93  "no noise or flames out the back" 110

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 17:33:58 -0800 (PST)
From: davery@on-ramp.ior.com (Dale W. Avery)
Subject: Speedo cures

Mike Smith wrote:

Putting 4.70's in the D90 does screw up the speedo by quite a bit though. I
haven't come up with a cure for that one yet... Has anyone else???????

From: Mike Smith,  EAST COAST ROVER CO.
*Land Rover and Vintage 4X4 Specialists*

The speedo in my 73 88" with 16 in. tires has always been a bit daft.  I use
my GPS II for mph readings.  Backlit, it's easily readable even at night,
and I believe it to be superior to the speedos in our vehicles.

BTW, I am fabricating a metal plate out of 1/8" aluminum stock that will
mount to the upper windshield and will allow me to locate the gps unit
straight ahead and slightly above "view of road" in my vehicle.  With the
canvas top, I hope this will help keep it locked on satellites in
mountainous terrain.  Mounted on the dash, with the metal brace between
front windshield sections, I sometimes lose the lock.  This location also
makes it easier to "tag" waypoints.

-----
   Dale W. Avery KC7MM
   Tigger - '73 88" canvas top
     

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 20:56:24 -0500
From: David Cockey <dcockey@tir.com>
Subject: Re: Dot4

Mike Johnson wrote:

> >Don't ever, ever, ever  use ANYTHING  other than the Castrol girling
> juice
> >of the gods....   the other stuff will rot your rubber inards on the
> whole
> >brake system..
> Another chapter from the book of urban myths.  But to each their own I
> suppose.  People feel a sort of religious attachment to certain
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 11 lines)]
> Champion spark plugs, oil, oil filters, octane grades, tires and so
> on.

Maybe folklore, as in has a basis in fact. I've heard for 20 years or
more that Girling uses/used a different type of rubber than most other
brake part makers which is incompatible with the usual North American
brake fluid. The Castrol is compatible. I also thought DOT 3 vs. DOT 4
is a matter of boiling point, etc, and don't know if the Castrol
formulation is needed to get the DOT 4 pertformance or if Castrol just
happens to be DOT 4 also. Silicon brake fluid is supposed to also be
compatible with Girling rubber. However, the usual folklore is don't mix
silicone and non-silicone brake fluid. Again, just because it is
folklore doesn't mean it is false.

One potential incompatiblity of silicone is with hydraulic brake light
switches as used in pre-67 vehicles. An item in the US British car mag a
few years ago claimed that the hydraulic pressure switches have
electrical contacts exposed to the fluid. Supposedly minor arcing can
occur each time the contacts open and this causes the problem.

Regards,
David Cockey

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 20:56:38 -0500 (EST)
From: David Scheidt <david@math.earlham.edu>
Subject: Re: Speedo cures

On Sat, 6 Dec 1997, Dale W. Avery wrote:

> Mike Smith wrote:
 
 Putting 4.70's in the D90 does screw up the speedo by quite a bit though. I
 haven't come up with a cure for that one yet... Has anyone else???????
> Mike Smith wrote:

Hot-rodders have the same problems with changing rear ends and speedo
accuracy.  I suspect that a good speed and custom shop can fix your
problem.

David
 

--------
David_Scheidt@math.earlham.edu

yip yip yip yap yap yak yap yip *BANG*  -- no terrier

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 21:17:06 -0500
From: David Cockey <dcockey@tir.com>
Subject: Re: Center Diffs: locked or open? not-lr type.

> I have a question for those of you who have owned or (also) own non-lr
> 4x4s;
> the ones with a transfer box selector that reads: 2H--4H--N--4L... I
> guess
> meaning selectable four wheel drive.

Actually, this is the essentially the setup on series LRs. LR just uses
two levers instead of one. I never have understood why they used a
complicated mechanism which requires engaging low range to disengage
4wd. They should have used the much simpler system of early Jeeps, etc.

> Are those xfer cases permanently locked (ie: no differential between
> front and
> rear axles) or are they open diffs? Are they open for 2wd and locked
> when 4wd
> is engaged?

A Stage 2/90/110/101/RR/Disco has three differentials, one in each axle
between the axle shafts on either side,  and one in the transfer case
between the front and rear prop shafts. This center differential allows
the front and rear wheels to turn at different speeds so that "full
time" 4wd is possible. Otherwise binding would occur on non-slippery
surfaces when the vehicle turns and the front wheels follow a larger
radius than the rear wheels. The differential lock position on the
transfer case lever on one of these LRs locks the center diff so that
front and rear prop shafts have to turn at the same speed. It does not
affect either axle.

A Series LR, most Jeeps, 4wd pickups etc. have a "part time" 4wd system.
In these the 4wd position on the transfer case lever locks the front and
rear prop shafts together, similar to a "full time" system with the
center differential locked. In 2wd the front axle is free to rotate on
its own.

Regards,
David Cockey

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 22:03:39 -0500 (EST)
From: David Scheidt <david@math.earlham.edu>
Subject: Re: Dot4

On Sat, 6 Dec 1997, David Cockey wrote:

> Mike Johnson wrote:
> > >Don't ever, ever, ever  use ANYTHING  other than the Castrol girling
> > juice
> 	 [ truncated by lro-lite (was 11 lines)]
> Maybe folklore, as in has a basis in fact. I've heard for 20 years or

 more that Girling uses/used a different type of rubber than most other
 brake part makers which is incompatible with the usual North American
 brake fluid. The Castrol is compatible. I also thought DOT 3 vs. DOT 4
 is a matter of boiling point, etc, and don't know if the Castrol
 formulation is needed to get the DOT 4 pertformance or if Castrol just
 happens to be DOT 4 also. Silicon brake fluid is supposed to also be
 compatible with Girling rubber. However, the usual folklore is don't mix
 silicone and non-silicone brake fluid. Again, just because it is
> folklore doesn't mean it is false.

Girling components are said to contain a higher amount of natural rubber
than american stuff.  (The folklore about that is the British wanted to
support the colonial rubber industry.)  DOT 3, DOT 4 and DOT 5 are
standards about performance, not content.  DOT 3 and DOT 4 are both almost
exclusivly glycol or glycol-ether based, depending on brand.  DOT 5 stuff
is silicone, though there is said to be a glycol based DOT 5.  The
differences are mostly the boiling points of the stuff (from memory, don't
shoot me if I wrong:

			Dot 3	dot 4	dot 5
dry boiling pt          400     448     500
wet                     285     310	356
).  If your brake fluid boilds, the bubbles are compressable, which goes
the sort of spongyness we all know and love.  It should be noted that
these are american standards.  (Lucas-)Girling have a seperate set of
standards, which cover not only boiling point, but also things like how
quickly they eat the seals.  So there are DOT-3 fluids that won't eat
brake components, and DOT-4 that will.  If the can or spec sheet says that
it meets all Girling standards, then you are probably safe.  Castrol
GT-LMA meets these standards, so you should be able to use it with no
problems.  So does the Prestone Super-Heavy duty fluid, which I have never
used.    

Silicone brake fluids are a different kettle of fish.  Silicone is pretty
inert, so your seals are safe.  Silicone is also not hyrdoscopic (doesn't
absorb water), so you will have less corrosion of pistons, cylinder walls,
and bleed screws.  It also doesn't need to be changed as often, partially
off-setting its much higher cost. (About US$15 a litre, as opposed to
US$5/litre for GTLMA)  The problem with silicone fluids is they are very
slightly more compressable than the glycol based stuff.  The
compressablity also increases with temperature, indpendently of actual
boiling.  No one seems to use silicone fluids in high performance
situations any longer, due to these concerns.  They are also not
recommended for ABS-equippped vehicles for this reason.  (But also because
they are expensive, so no one uses them, so manufactures don't test with
silicone, so don't want to risk a lawsuit.)  There is probably not much
reason not to use silicone fluids in Series truck, other than it is quite
expensive.  Drain, flush with isopropyl alchol, and dry with dry
compresed air.  Replace all of the rubber bits, which makes the fluid look
cheap, but this is necesary to make sure that you don't have any gylcol
fluid in the system.  

Brake fluids are essentially miscible, so don't need to worry too much
about mixing types.  However, if you put any glycol-based in a silicone
system, you are adding water (or the potential for water), which is why
you are using silicone in the first place, right?  If you have to get
home, though, it is not going to cause a catastrophic failure.  

I should add the usual disclaimers:  I am not an qualified expert on brake
fluid, hydraulics, or most things automotive.  I also use nothing but
Castrol GTLMA.  It is religion folks, not science.  

Regards,

David/mr. sinclair (with all new rubber hydraulics since september)

--------
David_Scheidt@math.earlham.edu

yip yip yip yap yap yak yap yip *BANG*  -- no terrier

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 23:50:50 -0500
From: Dean Meyer <Dean.Meyer@citenet.net>
Subject: Front spring hangers

My email is not cooperating with me. I think I've got it working now,
though. Can anyone help me put the right way round the front spring
hangers on my 1974 88". Which way does the offset hangers go or does it
matter?

Dean Meyer

------------------------------

From: rovah@agate.net
Date: Sun, 7 Dec 1997 00:09:36 -0500 (EST)
Subject: DELRC Website Update..

Thought I'd let those who want to hear about the Chevy 4.3L engine I'll be
putting in my Range Rover next week know there's a page on our club website
about it.  There's also a small page about my Unimog, and lots of updated
links.

Happy Holidays!  John

John Cassidy
Bangor, Maine USA

The Downeast Land Rover Club, <http://www.agate.net/~rovah/>
X0 of the V(irtual)MFA 323rd Cougars/Flying GSC's F/A-18 Hornet game
<http://www.tstonramp.com/~kahuna/index.html>

2 Wheels: Ducati M900, Velocette Thruxton, Moto Morini 350S
4 Wheels: 1995 Discovery, 1987 Range Rover-"Smedley," 1966 Series IIA 88",
1972 Series III 88"-"SWAMBO" 1963 Unimog 404.1-S "The Caterpiller"

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 23:45:17 -0800
From: Dave Place <dplace@mb.sympatico.ca>
Subject: Lockers

Does anyone know a source of limited slip or locker diffs in Canada or
the U.S. and what kind of price I am looking at?  If someone has a used
set or even a singel I would like to hear from them.  Is there a general
feeling about the best of the ones being offered?  I want them for a
Ser. IIA 88.
Dave VE4PN

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 07 Dec 1997 00:11:35 -0800
From: Dave Place <dplace@mb.sympatico.ca>
Subject: Cottage in Great Britain with Land Rover possibilities

Is there someone on the list who has a cottage in Great Britain in Land
Rover type area for rent for a couple of weeks.  Reply to me at my
E-Mail address.  I would like to rent a Ser III as well while I am
there, perhaps this spring or fall.  Something off the beaten path with
lots of scenery.
Dave VE4PN

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 07 Dec 1997 00:54:48 -0600
From: car4doc <car4doc@concentric.net>
Subject: Looking for Paul Hansen

Hi Paul,
 I know your on the list so please email me directly.  I need to talk to
you about something.
 Sorry for this personal message everyone. 
Regards,
Rob Davis_Chicago.

------------------------------

From: "Charles Morris" <scimg@quiknet.com>
Subject: Re: The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest Re: Frames HTML
Date: Sun, 7 Dec 1997 02:03:15 -0800

Check out Microsoft Frontpage, has a frames wizard.
Also Check out Hotdog, www.sausage.com, also has tools for frames.

happy programming,
Charles
'97 D90 #1927

------------------------------

From: "Ron Beckett" <hillman@bigpond.com>
Subject: Desperately seeking source for series ll bearings
Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 22:42:47 +1100

From: JJG98580 <JJG98580@aol.com>
Date: Thu, 4 Dec 1997 22:48:16 EST
Subject: submission for lro digest
Jack Gleason wrote:

>  It seems the 1958-early 61 series ll had smaller journals and
different mounting tabs on the bearings.  I need a set of rods and mains in
.010 or if I must do it to fit bearings available I will cut to .020
undersize.  

I seem to recall that years ago crankshaft journals used to be built up
with the metal spraying techniques then they could be reground.  Is this
work still done?

Regards,

Ron Beckett
Emu Plains, NSW, Australia

'86 Range Rover 4.6L auto (The Last Aquila)
'71 Hillman Hunter Royal 660 1725cc manual
'67 Hillman Gazelle 1725cc auto
'67 Hillman Gazelle 1725cc manual

check my home page at 
http://www.users.bigpond.com/hillman for Hillman and Rover

------------------------------

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