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From: marsden@digicon-egr.co.uk (Richard Marsden)
Subject: Re: Metrics
Date: Tue, 13 May 97 12:04:26 BST

> advice was disregarded in favor of the English system, as England was then
> >the main trading partner.
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 13 lines)]
> in about 1911,and was so complicated no-one dared adopt it.Its perhaps
> worth noting that the committee that set out to design the horse ended
> up with the camel,so they say:-))

The Imperial System was probably named such, as it was a standard for
The Empire. Eg. BS=British Standards today.

Metric and SI are actually different.
The original Metric system was invented in France post-Civil War, in an
attempt to purge the old system and old ways. This also included metric time.
Metric time did not last long (a couple of imperial years if that), but
kilograms,metres,etc survived much longer.

SI is an international system of scientific units (many of which are practical
to the real world of you and I and our trucks). I'll take your word that it
was devised in 1911. Anyway, it was based on the metric system which does
make more sense in this case. But many metric units were dropped
(centimetres don't exist in SI, but millimetres and metres do). Also, SI
includes a lot more "basic" units - Pascals, Farads, Newtons, Kelvins, etc

In recent years them physicist folk have been trying to find a "natural"
system of units, so we don't need conversion factors (eg. the Gravitational
Constant). Probably apocyphal, but I heard somewhere that the natural
unit for the speed of light then becomes furlongs-per-fortnight....

As for what units I use?
Generally metric - I was educated with them, but with SI for science stuff
(formal science training - but hey, it makes things a lot easier for
back-of-the-envelope calculations, than worrying about converting, along
with good old pints of beer, gallons of petrol (why the heck aren't  pumps
in gallons?), and inches for drawing (at work, we still use inches for our
plots, even though the inhouse software handles both mm and inches).

Richard (ex-Gurkha SIII 2768.6mm FFR)

------------------------------

Subject: Re: Metrics
Date: Tue, 13 May 97 13:57:49 +0100
From: Simon Ward-Hastelow <simon.110.v8@dial.pipex.com>

>My first visit to the rainy island was before their money went metric.
>Pound, Shilling and Pence seemed somehow appropriate for the folks that gave
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 6 lines)]
>Isn't it odd that England has abandoned their old system and we are still
>stuck with it?

Don't you believe it - we now have two systems - they run alongside each 
other and serve as a surefire way to confuse everyone.

In shops and supermarkets everything pre-packed is weighted in metric 
Kilos or litres whilst everything sold loose, ie packed to order, is sold 
in imperial, pounds and ounces. All beers are bottled in metric 
quantities but can only be sold in pubs in imperial pints or half pints. 
The building trade seems to be working in metric at last but if you go to 
a lumber yard or builders merchants they only speak feet and inches.

Cars are all sold with metric dimmensions in their brochures and engine 
sizes are listed in metric litres but quote 'miles-per-gallon' fuel 
economy when it is impossible to buy a gallon of fuel because its only 
sold in litres now.

The politicians answers to this stupid system is that 'we don't want to 
confuse the old people with a new metric system' - well what about the 
thousands of school kids that are only given the metric system at school 
then leave to find that its totally different to what they've been told

thats my sermon finished for today

simon w-h

------------------------------

From: Franz Parzefall <franz@max.physiol.med.tu-muenchen.de>
Subject: Re: Metrics and Mike's hate
Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 14:53:56 +0200 (MET DST)

Sorry Mike,
I really enjoyed most of your postings aswell as all your stories
in the OVLR newsletter, but reading your postings about the metric
system just tells me the you must have had sort of experience that 
lead you to hate all things that could be related to the word Europe.
But the British empire has become a bit smaller, so we should
see if we can arange things...

BTW. LR has gone the metric way long before they were bought by
BMW. My 1989 military 110 has a quite astonishing mixture of 
UNF UNC and metric. The only bad thing about metric and imperial
therads is that you have problems to get the one or the other
nuts and bolts, depending where you are. I can't say that one
is better than the other.

Hope I didn't offend anyone,
Franz
Franz Parzefall                franz@physiol.med.tu-muenchen.de
		   http://www.physiol.med.tu-muenchen.de/~franz
       _______
      [____|\_\==
      [_-__|__|_-]      Brumml, exmil. 1989 Land Rover 110 2.5D
 ___.._(0)..._.(0)__..-
                                  

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 09:08:46 -0400
From: Michel Bertrand <mbertran@interlinx.qc.ca>
Subject: Re: 900-16 Tires & Frame Transplant

At 21:05 97-05-12 -0700, you wrote:

>Blain,

->I'm posting this for a member of the TARC. Can anyone suggest a supplier in
>>the US or Can for new tires of the size 900-16
>I don't know what you are wanting these for.  If for a 101FC and if you
-want SERIOUS off-road tyres, don't mind that they are bias-ply, Interco
>Super Swamper TSLs are available in 34x9.00x16 and boy, do they look tall,
>skinny, and mean!  
-
Wasn't the 900-16 standard on the 109 1-ton model? I believe that it would
fit rather nice on a 109 with military frame and shackles, but they must be
sooooo expensive!

Salutations, 

Michel Bertrand
						______
Sherbrooke, Quebec, Canada, 		       /    __
					      /        \
1963 109 PU (Rudolph)	   		     | Lucas    |
1968 109 SW (in the works)		     |  Inside  |
1973 88 SW (21st century project)	      \        /
					       \______/

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 09:17:42 +0000
From: MALCOLMF <MALCOLMF@prodigy.net>
Subject: Whitworth temperature!!

Richard Marsden wrote:

> Fahrenheit just don't make sense. 

Actually old Farenheit had a pretty good idea when he selected his 0 -
100 range for the temperature scale.  It is a people oriented scale,
representing the range from about as cold as it ever gets in the
temperate zone to about as hot as it ever gets.  

Freezing is about a third of the way up.  Two thirds of the way up (say
about 70 degrees) is pretty comfortable.  

 Centigrade, on the other hand, only makes sense if you are a drop of
water that solidifies at one end of the scale and vaporizes at the
other.  Nice to know your limits, I guess.

Malcolm

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 09:35:10 -0400 (EDT)
From: Dixon Kenner <dkenner@nrn1.NRCan.gc.ca>
Subject: LRO

	The makings of a price war?  Who knows, but I see that LRO has
dropped the price of a subscription by ten quid for us chaps in North
America.  Under 50 quid again (just).  You probably have to deal via
LROShop to get the cheaper price since I didn't see it reflected in the
magazine itself.  

------------------------------

From: marsden@digicon-egr.co.uk (Richard Marsden)
Subject: Re: Whitworth temperature!!
Date: Tue, 13 May 97 14:35:57 BST

> Richard Marsden wrote:
> > Fahrenheit just don't make sense. 
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 7 lines)]
> representing the range from about as cold as it ever gets in the
> temperate zone to about as hot as it ever gets.  

He thought 0F was absolute 0, but he got it wrong.

> Freezing is about a third of the way up.  Two thirds of the way up (say
> about 70 degrees) is pretty comfortable.  
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 6 lines)]
> water that solidifies at one end of the scale and vaporizes at the
> other.  Nice to know your limits, I guess.

And only at atmospheric pressure. Also, British Weather Forecasts are in
Celsius.

Now, in schools, they only teach celsius (and Kelvin if you reach A Level),
so I'm in the position, as someone mentioned earlier, of only knowing 
one system. Fine I quickly pick up lb, inches,etc if I didn't know them before,
but psi and Fahrenheit, I just hate!  :-)
I just can't picture either.

For temp:

Celsius is handy for "common" use. Weather temps range from a little below
zero (-15?) to the 30s (UK Range!). 1000C is about the maximum attainable 
without special equipment - ie. a good bunsen burner.
Kelvin is based on abs. zero, so much easier for thermodynamic problems, but
means everyday things are up at or above 273 degrees. I find the conversion no
problem (simple subtraction/addition), but Kelvin doesn't make that much
sense for "common use".

As for PSI: I was brought up on bars and Pascals (and SI variants of Pa upto
GPa). I only measure tyre pressure in PSI, and have no real comprehension
of what 30 psi is in bars or Pa. That's the British Education System for
you.

Richard (ex-Gurkha Series 2.95 with a temperature-dependant wheelbase)

------------------------------

From: "Beckett, Ron" <rbeckett@nibupad.telstra.com.au>
Subject: SER: barbie on a grill???
Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 23:50:00 +1000

Ross replied:
>My grille stays where it is as LR designed it. Not many books record
>it, but the size of the grille "grid" was settled on after extensive
>testing in Northern Australia. If the size was too small our large
>mosquitos and flies would build up on the grille and look unsightly...

Absolutely.  I am sorry had I forgotten about that.  I had read about
it in one of the historical books on LR by Geoffrey (?) Robson.
Of course there was a trade off.  Too big and the mossies'
stingers would spear the radiators and suck all the water out.

Regards,
Ron Beckett
Emu Plains, Australia
'87 Rangie 4.8 L Auto
'71 HE Hillman Hunter Royal 660 Manual
'67 HA Hillman Gazelle Auto

------------------------------

From: "Beckett, Ron" <rbeckett@nibupad.telstra.com.au>
Subject: Metrics
Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 23:50:00 +1000

From: "Davies, Scott

>What makes you think we've abandoned imperial measures? (Oh and we're
>British, not English. Scots like myself get very uppity on this issue
:-)).

I'm the same when people in Asia ask me if I'm American!
Me a dinki-di Aussie!
When I worked in Saudi Arabia I wanted one of those T-shirts which said,
in Arabic, "I am not an American"  But the to Arabs I sounded like a
Pommie (English).  (See we don't class Scots as Poms).

>I'm still 5' 7" and 11 stone, I still drink pints and I still travel 10
>miles to work. My Landy will NEVER return a fuel consumption figure in
l/100
>km:-)
Ditto except I'm heavier and I drink wine not beer.  I drive a Hillman -
it has a 10 gallon tank and an Imperial speedo & odometer.  The way
man intended cars should be!

Regards,
Ron Beckett
Emu Plains, Australia
'87 Rangie 4.8 L Auto
'71 HE Hillman Hunter Royal 660 Manual
'67 HA Hillman Gazelle Auto

------------------------------

From: "Beckett, Ron" <rbeckett@nibupad.telstra.com.au>
Subject: MPG - Metric conversions
Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 23:50:00 +1000

From: Adrian Redmond
>Any of you mathematicians out there got a simple formula for converting
>between mpg (UK) mpg (US) and Km per Liter? It would help my
>spreadsheet!

US mpg = 2.3522 km/l
km/l = 0.425134 US mpg
Imperial mpg = 2.8248 km/l
km/l = 0.354 Imperial mpg

But as metric fuel economy is usually given in litres/100km

235.2 L/100km = 1 US mpg
282.48 L/100km = 1 Imperial mpg
235.2 / US mpg = L/100 km
282.48 / Imperial mpg = L/100km

and some more conversions to keep your tyres happy
to convert psi to kpa, multiply the psi reading by 6.895
(i.e. 28psi = 193.06 kpa)

1 statute mile = 1.6093 km

and for Sea Rovers
1 nautical mile = 1.847 km (sometime 1.852 km depending
where you are.  In some places even less!  The nautical mile
isn't really fixed except at the equator.)

Regards,
Ron Beckett
Emu Plains, Australia
'87 Rangie 4.8 L Auto
'71 HE Hillman Hunter Royal 660 Manual
'67 HA Hillman Gazelle Auto

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 09:59:05 -0400 (EDT)
From: Dixon Kenner <dkenner@nrn1.NRCan.gc.ca>
Subject: Re: Whitworth temperature!!

On Tue, 13 May 1997, Richard Marsden wrote:

> Now, in schools, they only teach celsius (and Kelvin if you reach A Level),
> so I'm in the position, as someone mentioned earlier, of only knowing 
> one system. 

	Problem with Celsius is that it is supposed to be exact and
scientific like.  Cool, but then they get rigorous and say that boiling
and freezing is conducted at sea level.  OK, but which sea?  All the
oceans are not at the same level.  They are off by a bit.  The SI
committee is playing silly buggers trying to make us think that they have
it all worked out perfectly... :-)  Should be defined in units of distance
from the centre of the earth.  Of course the earth bulges a bit just south
of the equator (must be that beer consumption, just like most LR owners),
so you will have a problem there too... :-)  Do we do this at the equator
or at one of the poles?  (North is pointier than the south as well as
being in Canada) 

> As for PSI: I was brought up on bars and Pascals (and SI variants of Pa upto

	Haven't figured out Pascals yet.  Inches of Mercury was so easy to
visualise, demonstrate etc.  Dumb to change from something that worked
happily.  Metre is supposed to be a fraction of the distance between the
north pole to the equator.  Real scientific there.

	Rgds,

	Dixon (really loved the debate 20 years ago on SPEOL in furlongs
per fortnight.  Check out Scientific American where much of it played out
in the letters to the editor pages)

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 15:15:08 +0000
From: M.J.Rooth@lboro.ac.uk (Mike Rooth)
Subject: Re: Metrics and Mike's hate

>Sorry Mike,
>lead you to hate all things that could be related to the word Europe.
Why apologise Franz?My dislike of Europe,though,*as an organisation*
has little to do with metrication,and more to do with an affection
for the British Commonwealth of Nations,which,in my view,Britain
badly let down when it first joined the Common Market.Which has no
place on this list.The subject,that is.

BTW. LR has gone the metric way long before they were bought by
BMW. My 1989 military 110 has a quite astonishing mixture of
UNF UNC and metric.

That's NATO for you,probably.If not,its what I was saying.Whatever
the pro's and cons of either system its the method of changeover
that's at fault.And to try to be fair,the problems are huge,possibly
prohibitively so.Land Rover,for instance,to avoid the dog's breakast
Franz has inherited,could have said that up to,19-umpty-ump all
fasteners would be SAE/Imperial.On 1st Jan 19-umpty-ump+one,all
would be metric.Supplies of the old standard would then be available
only as spares.But the tooling changeover would have been a very
expensive lump sum,rather than a gradual outlay.The basis of the
problem appears to be the oversimplification on the part of
politicians(who should *never*,along with journalists,be given
any say in engineering type issues)concerning the changeover.
Its not easy,considering for instance,the number of existing
houses there were(and are) built to Imperial standards,the miles
of Imperial central heating pipe,the industrial plant...the list
is endless,and includes machine tools,manufacturers for the use of.
This is exclusive of the emotional issue,and an issue it is.At the
time,if I remember,one of the reasons for the changeover was "because
they do it this way on the Continent".Unfortunately,this was the
last of a long list of changes either actual or proposed for this reason,
which prompted the reply"Why the devil cant *they* change?",or,"If
they stick their heads in the fire,why should we?".Irrational,maybe,
but in my view perfectly understandable.When people see the standards
by which they live replaced by others,for no discernably good reason,
only the fact that someone else does it this way,or,to my mind the
silliest of all "Its Easier"(Not,be it noted,its *better*,with reasons
given)they are entitled to get upset.
However,I *did* actually get one advantage from the change.As well as
a Land Rover owner,I'm a Model Engineer(lapsed,but still interested),
and eventually got to the stage where I needed two taps and a die
of 1/4"M.E.for the current project.The Model Engineering thread
series was formalised at the turn of the century just for the hobby,
and has always been a "special".Basically,it is of Whit form,1/8"
to 1/2",all available at 40TPI,and 32TPI from 3/16" upwards as well.
I'd used B.A up till then,which were;and I suppose still are;used
for fasteners,B.A bolts and nuts being available commercially.
However,boiler fittings and the like were always sized in M.E
for ease of screwcutting where necessary.So more in hope than
expectation I toddled off to the local ironmonger,one of those
old fashioned sort,where all manner of goodies have been taking
cover in little wooden drawers for years.Once I'd got across what
I wanted,sure enough,round the back,the little wooden drawer was opened
(after exploring the ones with British Standard Cycle thread,BSP,
and the like),to reveal some M.E taps and dies,including the one
I wanted.When I enquired how much,the shop owner said,"Well,of
course they're obsolete now"."You what?" says I,nonplussed,because
I know he was wrong there."All metric now"he says.Sensing advantage,
I kept my gob shut for once,and he said"A quid for the die,and 50p
each for the two taps".Yours truly paid up,zipped off home,collected
all the spare cash I could find and bought the silly fool out of
every M.E tap and die he had.Each one was High Speed Steel,worth
five times what I paid for them.The bloke went bust not long
afterwards,after many,many years in business.The problem was he went
Metric daft.People kept going in asking for 1/4"Whit bolts and the like.
He didnt stock them.In the end,he had a large notice put up in the
shop"Do NOT Ask For Imperial Nuts,Bolts etc.We Stock Metric Only!!!"
Trouble was,the other ironmonger down the road *did* stock Imperial,
as well as Metric.Guess where everyone went....The other guy is still
there.

>Hope I didn't offend anyone,
>Franz
Not me mate:-)

Cheers
Mike Rooth

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 15:21:30 +0000
From: M.J.Rooth@lboro.ac.uk (Mike Rooth)
Subject: Re: Metrics

>The Imperial System was probably named such, as it was a standard for
>The Empire. Eg. BS=British Standards today.

Named as a tribute to Queen Victoria.The "Queen Empress".Fashionable
at the time.And no,I *wasnt* there.....:-)

Mike Rooth

------------------------------

From: John Putnam <jdputnam@pacifier.com>
Subject: RE: Metrics
Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 07:02:34 -0700
[digester: Removing section of:  Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BC5F6E.D2B12FC0" ]
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Paul,
As a note, any transportation project designed and/or built with federal =
funds must be done in metric.  Give it some time and we will be there.

John Putnam
Surveyor
Forest Grove, OR

----------
From: 	DONOHUEPE@aol.com[SMTP:DONOHUEPE@aol.com]
Sent: 	Monday, May 12, 1997 5:18 AM
Subject: 	Metrics

New ! Improved ! http://www.Land-Rover.Team.Net/

On 8 May, Michael Carradine responded to Ron Beckett's history of Land =
Rover
fasteners, stating: "The US is the biggest holdout to metricization."

George Washington recommended that the US adopt the metric system.  His =
good
advice was disregarded in favor of the English system, as England was =
then
the main trading partner.

My first visit to the rainy island was before their money went metric.
Pound, Shilling and Pence seemed somehow appropriate for the folks that =
gave
us inches, feet, miles, quarts, gallons, ounces and pounds.

Isn't it odd that England has abandoned their old system and we are =
still
stuck with it?

Paul Donohue
1965 2.77m Land Rover

------ =_NextPart_000_01BC5F6E.D2B12FC0
[digester: Removing section of:  Content-Type: application/ms-tnef ]

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 15:26:55 +0000
From: M.J.Rooth@lboro.ac.uk (Mike Rooth)
Subject: Re: Whitworth temperature!!

       Dixon (really loved the debate 20 years ago on SPEOL in furlongs
>per fortnight.

Sounds like what my speedo ought to be calibrated in.......

Mike Rooth

------------------------------

From: NADdMD@aol.com
Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 10:31:29 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: Waxoyl: Good News

You can get all the info on them (Location, address, tele number) from their
website:
http://www.triple-c.com  (They are located in York, PA)

Nate

------------------------------

From: marsden@digicon-egr.co.uk (Richard Marsden)
Subject: Re: Whitworth temperature!!
Date: Tue, 13 May 97 15:35:18 BST

> 	Problem with Celsius is that it is supposed to be exact and
> scientific like.  Cool, but then they get rigorous and say that boiling
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 11 lines)]
> so you will have a problem there too... :-)  Do we do this at the equator
> or at one of the poles?  (North is pointier than the south as well as
> being in Canada) 

No, NO,NO!

I could go into gravitational theory here, but you are exactly wrong! :-)
The surface of the sea is a geoid. This is a surface of equal gravitational
potential. Ie. IT DOESN'T MATTER which sealevel. Yes, it isn't a perfect
sphere or ellipsoid. Yes, it does bulge more in the southern hemisphere.
In fact, there are much fine variations, reflecting changes in the shape
of the lithosphere below (I'm a geophysicist in case you hadn't guessed!)
What really matters is the pressure. Accounting for weather conditions,
air pressure at sea level will be the same wherever you are.
Tides may have an effect, but land, sea, and the atmosphere experience tides...

If it wasn't for plate tectonics, the land would erode down, and the lower
crust would produce isostatic compansation, and eventually the Earth's
gravity at the surface would be uniform.
 
I think I'm heading off topic here! :-)

> > As for PSI: I was brought up on bars and Pascals (and SI variants of Pa upto
> 	Haven't figured out Pascals yet.  Inches of Mercury was so easy to
> visualise, demonstrate etc.  Dumb to change from something that worked
> happily.  Metre is supposed to be a fraction of the distance between the
> north pole to the equator.  Real scientific there.

SI is based on about half a dozen "basic" fundamental units. These are all,
lets face it "useable" lengths. Eg. the metre *isn't* a light year long!
These are arbitrary though, as is the yard. The other SI units are derived
from these basic units. The system fits together very well.
When you get to use these units in science,etc. its much easier to 
have 1000mm in a metre, than to worry about whether its 12 inches in a foot,
or 12 feet in a yard. You can use that extra time/effort to do what you're
trying to do - rebuild a Land Rover, or fly to the Moon! :-)

Richard

------------------------------

From: SPYDERS@aol.com
Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 10:45:39 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: 900-16 Tires  on a 109

In a message dated 5/13/97 9:10:18 AM, you wrote:

>Wasn't the 900-16 standard on the 109 1-ton model? I believe that it would
>fit rather nice on a 109 with military frame and shackles, but they must be
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 7 lines)]
>Salutations, 
>Michel Bertrand

Tom Maynard in Live Oak FL has 9.00-16's on his IIa 109. His family has had
the 109 from new. Along with his "welded" rear diff, the 9.00-16 tires get
him places... I was there to see it.

pat
93  110

------------------------------

From: SPYDERS@aol.com
Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 10:50:25 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: Whitworth temp/Kelvin's use

In a message dated 5/13/97 9:39:14 AM, Richard wrote:

>but Kelvin doesn't make that much
>sense for "common use".

I guess photography is "uncommon" enough and Kelvin is commonly used to
measure light's color in that field.

pat
93  110

------------------------------

From: QROVER80@aol.com
Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 10:49:58 -0400 (EDT)
Subject:  Lightweight Paint color Question 

I have a 1970 IIa Lightweight for sale here that I am going to paint. This
week. Wednesday. It is a slightly scabius shade of green at the moment and
flushed with the success of the paint job I did on the ambulance last week I
was, (am ?) planning to paint it the same NATO green.  This morning we have
been doing the surface prep ( with an angle grinder and a wire brush ) And we
have discovered several interesting things. First this vehicle is reputed to
have a very low mileage, 18k. Second as we have been removing the flaking
paint we have discovered that the bottom color seems to be DARK Blue ??? RAF
?? Under what circumstances were Lightweights painted such a color? It also
has what could be flag holders on the front wings. With the demise of the
Museum of Army Transport I don't know where to turn for the service history
of the vehicle, any suggestions? What color were the RAF ceremonial flight
Lightweights painted?  I guess the idea of painting it school bus yellow with
"Follow me" on the back is right out :-(  
Rgds Quintin 

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 11:15:32 -0400 (EDT)
From: Dixon Kenner <dkenner@nrn1.NRCan.gc.ca>
Subject: Re: Whitworth temperature!!

On Tue, 13 May 1997, Richard Marsden wrote:

> No, NO,NO!

	:-)

> I could go into gravitational theory here, but you are exactly wrong! :-)

	"Gravity" is a function of mass (kinda, lets not loose all the
non-scientists here).  There will be a difference (albeit really, really
small) at the different sealevels (and whether the moon is above or below
the horizon (they take into account tides when the came up with this?)
:-)

> If it wasn't for plate tectonics, the land would erode down, and the lower
> crust would produce isostatic compansation, and eventually the Earth's
> gravity at the surface would be uniform.

	Get rid of the moon & sun and tectonics would calm down after a
while!  Gotta deal with the fact the centre turns at a different rate than
the surface.

> When you get to use these units in science,etc. its much easier to 
> have 1000mm in a metre, than to worry about whether its 12 inches in a foot,
> or 12 feet in a yard. You can use that extra time/effort to do what you're
> trying to do - rebuild a Land Rover, or fly to the Moon! :-)

	Screwy systems make you use your head with the conversions!  As
for the Space Rover, it is still classified.  The engineers are having
trouble fitting the rocket nozzle in the rear pto hole, or so I
understand.

------------------------------

From: marsden@digicon-egr.co.uk (Richard Marsden)
Subject: Re: Lightweight Paint color Question 
Date: Tue, 13 May 97 16:22:32 BST

> I have a 1970 IIa Lightweight for sale here that I am going to paint. This
> week. Wednesday. It is a slightly scabius shade of green at the moment and
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 15 lines)]
> "Follow me" on the back is right out :-(  
> Rgds Quintin 

I have a mate who, after seeing my "new" truck last year, after he stopped
laughing, decided he wanted one...
He still hasn't got one, but he has started looking. He's persuaded the
girlfriend (infact I know him via her). A few weeks ago, they popped by on
one of the places in Leeds (PRB Services?), on their return from
Northumberland. There was a yellow and blue Lightweight which Josie fancied,
although I think Vince was beginning to lean torwards a 101" (not that I
have tried to persuade him in *any* way, honest!).

Anyway, PRB have/had a Lightweight (SIII I think) in dark blue with yellow
top. It was a run-around for an airfield. I suggested it might have been
RAE (Royal Aircraft Establishment) as these were apparently in this scheme.
They seemed certain it wasn't.
Yes, the only RAF Landies I've seen have been green (var) usually with
yellow stripes, or all yellow.

I seem to remember an article in one of the mags about 12-18 months ago about
the Royal Navy Bomb Disposal people. I think they also have a yellow and blue
colour scheme.

Richard (ex-Gurkha SIII 109 FFR)

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 11:31:22 -0400
From: David L Glaser <dlglaser@wam.umd.edu>
Subject: Re: Lightweight Paint color Question

I remember a picture I used to have (if I look around I can probably
find it) of a few ceremonial light weights.  In the picture they were
painted in dark blue (navy?), had chorme bumpers and chrome trim, and
are fitted with a white leather interior.  From what I remember the
picture was taken in the early '80s.  Is it possible that the chrome and
leather was removed and these vehicles entered "real" service? Is your
LW possibly one of these vehicles?   

David Glaser

------------------------------

From: marsden@digicon-egr.co.uk (Richard Marsden)
Subject: Re: Whitworth temperature!!
Date: Tue, 13 May 97 16:38:26 BST

> > No, NO,NO!
> 	:-)
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 9 lines)]
> the horizon (they take into account tides when the came up with this?)
> :-)

I think we agree on tides.
But I still disagree on the rest. Not to pull stripes, but I have studied
this stuff to MSc level! :-)
Forgetting about extra thickness, the acceleration due to gravity decreases
of the order of  1 part in a million for a metre in height
(can't remember if its 3 parts/metre, or 3 metres/part! - anyway, its easily
measurable with the right kit - I've done it).

If an area is of lower density, then the local gravitational field will be
lower. Hence, there will be less water. Therefore sea level will be lower.
The maths actually works out.
We all know water flows downhill. Water flows due to gravity, until its upper
surface is at the same "strength" of field (ie. the same gravitational
potential). If it wasn't, water "above" will flow to somewhere "below",
so equalling things out.

"Down" is defined as the direction of the
gravitational vector (ie. a plumb-line), and similarly, the sealevel surface
is a equipotential in the gravitational field.
We measure altitude relative to this surface.

Now, you're going to say "What powers the ocean currents?" Well, surface
currents are a complex interaction between wind and water. complex is
a good cover-all word, isn't it?
Bulk current flows are due to "thermohaline" circulation - eg. density
differences due to salinity and temperature. I won't write another essay
on this one here! Probably forgotten most of it after 2-3 years actually.

Anyway, any more questions, I guess we should get off the list and onto 
private email.

> 	Get rid of the moon & sun and tectonics would calm down after a
> while!  Gotta deal with the fact the centre turns at a different rate than
> the surface.

Can you prove that? Current geological thinking would disagree with that
*just a bit*! Plate tectonics looks like it might be self-sustaining.
Some say it is driven be mantle convection. There is obviously a lot
of interaction in this aspect. The convection is powered by radiogenic
decay. This is much larger than any tidal heating (unlike Io and Europa
where tidal heating dominates).

> > When you get to use these units in science,etc. its much easier to 
> > have 1000mm in a metre, than to worry about whether its 12 inches in a foot,
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 8 lines)]
> trouble fitting the rocket nozzle in the rear pto hole, or so I
> understand.
 
:-)

Its called an oil leak nozzle.

Or was it that over-rich exhaust, with a spark-plug in the back? :-)

Richard (ex-Gurkha SIII 109 FFR)

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 17:08:12 +0000
From: M.J.Rooth@lboro.ac.uk (Mike Rooth)
Subject: Re: Whitworth temperature!!

>Its called an oil leak nozzle.
>Or was it that over-rich exhaust, with a spark-plug in the back? :-)
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 7 lines)]
>Or was it that over-rich exhaust, with a spark-plug in the back? :-)
>Richard (ex-Gurkha SIII 109 FFR)
No,that's an afterburner.Not a bad idea,though:-)
Miken Rooth

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 20:45:39 +0300
From: Iwan Vosloo <ivosloo@cs.up.ac.za>
Subject: SWB real speed on 750x16's

I would love to know how to *calculate* my real speed and distance from
the readings I get.  My SWB is standard all over except it has the 109
wheels.

Scanned the last year's list messages... someone suggested such SWBses
would underread about 20%.  Did some calculations of my own from info
someone posted about speedo calibration... got 7%.  Measurements from
other vehicles show a CONSTANT 10kmph difference.
...none of these seems reasonable.  

If I knew this, I would be able to calculate my fuel consumption for
Adrian's little survey.

- Iwan Vosloo
( 1975 SIII 88" Diesel )

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 20:57:06 -0700
From: Adrian Redmond <channel6@post2.tele.dk>
Subject: Re: SWB real speed on 750x16's

I didn't realise that there was any difference between 88" and 109"
wheels! I thought it was the tyres which made the difference (if any).

But if it is a problem, couldn't one fit a speedo from a 109 too?

or is that too obvious? are there difference in the tranny etc which
would render this solution a non-solution?

Adrian Redmond

---------------------------------------------------
CHANNEL 6 TELEVISION DENMARK       (Adrian Redmond)
Foerlevvej 6  Mesing  DK-8660  Skanderborg  Denmark
---------------------------------------------------
telephone (office)		    +45 86 57 22 66
telephone (home)		    +45 86 57 22 64
telefacsimile / data		    +45 76 57 24 46
mobile GSM (EFP unit)		    +45 40 74 75 64
mobile GSM (admin)		    +45 40 50 22 66
mobile NMT			    +45 30 86 75 66
e-mail			     channel6@post2.tele.dk
HoTMaiL (www.e-mail)	channel6denmark@hotmail.com
---------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 15:58:23 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Steven Swiger (LIS)" <swiger@luna.cas.usf.edu>
Subject: Porsche Mailing List? (non-rover content)

All--

Sorry for the non-rover posting, but I was wondering if anyone knew of a
Porsche mailing list similar to our rover one.  Any help would be
appreciated, and you may respond directly to me so as not to eat up more
bandwidth (and spawn yet another discussion on non-rover content).

Thanks for all help in advance!
Rove to live, live to Rove...
steve

	_________________________________
	|_______|_______|_______|_______|	"Moose"
	|   ____________    |	   |	\\	'73 III 88"
	|  /  	  |	\   |  	   |	 \\      ________
     	|  |	  |	|   |	   |	  \\    |        |
	|  \______|_____/   |______|_______\\___|________|__
	|___________________|_______________|---------------\
	|  []    []    []   |		    | 0		    |)
	|                   |--]	    |               |		
       _|    /	 OOOOO      |		    |      OOOOO    |__
      |_|____I OO o o OO ___|_______________|___ OO o o OO ____|
	   0  OO o 0 o OO			OO o 0 o OO
	       OO  o  OO     "Tread Lightly"     OO  o  OO
              	 OOOOO				   OOOOO
       		           Florida Rover Canvas
	Steve Swiger   
	swiger@luna.cas.usf.edu
	

------------------------------

From: lroshop@idirect.com
Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 16:28:36 +0000
Subject: Re: LRO

You are right as usual Dixon.  The special price is available on 
line at www.lroi.com or at the North American Customer Service Centre 
at 905-436-7813 providing you have an email address or are in 
receipt of one of the offer packages soon to go out.

 
> The makings of a price war?  Who knows, but I see that LRO has
> dropped the price of a subscription by ten quid for us chaps in North
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 8 lines)]
> LROShop to get the cheaper price since I didn't see it reflected in the
> magazine itself.  
LRO SHOP (NORTH AMERICA)

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 13:37:28 -0700
From: Michael Carradine <cs@crl.com>
Subject: Re: LRO

At 09:35 AM 5/13/97 -0400, Dixon Kenner wrote:
:	The makings of a price war?  Who knows, but I see that LRO has
:dropped the price of a subscription by ten quid for us chaps in North
:America.  Under 50 quid again (just).  You probably have to deal via
:LROShop to get the cheaper price since I didn't see it reflected in the
:magazine itself.  

 Publish different rates in the LRO itself?  If the rest of the world
 found out about North American preferential pricing, there will surely
 be revolt! ;)

-Michael

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 14:47:59 -0600
From: jfrancis@frii.com (Jeff Francis)
Subject: Re: Porsche Mailing List? (non-rover content)

Steven Swiger (LIS) writes:
> Sorry for the non-rover posting, but I was wondering if anyone knew
> of a Porsche mailing list similar to our rover one.  Any help would
> be appreciated, and you may respond directly to me so as not to eat
> up more bandwidth (and spawn yet another discussion on non-rover
> content).

	Might as well tell everyone at once and get it over with.
Try:

	http://www.porschefans.com

	Lots of Porsche info, including how to sign up on their
various mailing lists (911/912, Boxster, 356, etc).

-- 
+-------+-------------------------------+-------------------------+--------+
|       |         Jeff Francis          |                         |        |
|  (__) |      Network Specialist       | A preference for C++    | ____/| |
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 6 lines)]
|       |      jfrancis@frii.com        | ignorance.              |    U   |
|       | http://www.frii.com/~jfrancis |        --Thant Tessman  | PRR... |
+-------+-------------------------------+-------------------------+--------+

------------------------------

From: SPYDERS@aol.com
Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 17:36:01 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: What a SIGHTING. I *need* a mug.

Forget the infamous LRW issue... What I just got in the mail is leaps and
bounds ahead.

On the cover of the latest Victoria's Secret catalog... a green SIII 109 with
a decent looking model standing in the rear door. More angles (of the 109 and
the model) inside.

Somewhere down in the caribbean... Allan Smith, do you have *anything* to do
with this. Please say it isn't your Rover!

Pat
93  "with *no* models near it"  110

------------------------------

From: SPYDERS@aol.com
Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 17:35:49 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: What a SIGHTING. I *need* a mug.

Forget the infamous LRW issue... What I just got in the mail is leaps and
bounds ahead.

On the cover of the latest Victoria's Secret catalog... a green SIII 109 with
a decent looking model standing in the rear door. More angles (of the 109 and
the model) inside.

Somewhere down in the caribbean... Allan Smith, do you have *anything* to do
with this. Please say it isn't your Rover!

Pat
93  "with *no* models near it"  110

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 15:24:45 -0700
From: "Clinton D. Coates" <Clinton_Coates@bc.sympatico.ca>
Subject: Norwegian surplus stores (Non LR Content)

Sorry for the non LR topic.

Anyway, I was wondering if any of the Norwegian members of the list knew of 
any good military surplus stores in Norway.  I know they exist becase when 
I was attending Hurdal Verk Folkehogskole, a couple of students there had 
some military stuff.

Tusen Takk

Clinton

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 15:48:50 -0700
From: "Clinton D. Coates" <Clinton_Coates@bc.sympatico.ca>
Subject: More non LR content for Norwegian readers!

Does anyone know what the name 'Leikney' means, or its origin?  We are 
thinking of naming our baby this (assuming of course she is a she!).

Regards

Clinton

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 19:07:23 -0400
From: David Cockey <dcockey@tir.com>
Subject: Re: Waxoyl: Good News

New web address for Triple-C:
http://www.triple-c.com/triple-c/
They are very pleasant folks to deal with. Recommended.

Regards,
David Cockey

> You can get all the info on them (Location, address, tele number) from their website:
> http://www.triple-c.com  (They are located in York, PA)

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 16:35:45 -0700 (PDT)
From: Uncle Roger <sinasohn@crl.com>
Subject: Re: What a SIGHTING. I *need* a mug.

At 05:35 PM 5/13/97 -0400, you wrote:
>On the cover of the latest Victoria's Secret catalog... a green SIII 109 with
>a decent looking model standing in the rear door. More angles (of the 109 and
 
(wink, wink, nudge, nudge, say-no-more, say-no-more)

Uncle Roger                       "There is pleasure pure in being mad
sinasohn@crl.com                             that none but madmen know."
Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates
San Francisco, California                  http://www.crl.com/~sinasohn/

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 20:23:13 -0400
From: Mike Johnson <johnsonm@borg.com>
Subject: Re: Waxoyl: Good News

>New web address for Triple-C:
>http://www.triple-c.com/triple-c/
>They are very pleasant folks to deal with. Recommended.

I called Triple-C and they said they don't carry it (Waxoyl) anymore. :(
Mike Johnson N7WBO
http://www.borg.com/~johnsonm

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 10:08:25 +1000
From: Ross <fax.rescue@hunterlink.net.au>
Subject: Series fishing -was BBQ grille.

Beckett, Ron wrote:
> Of course there was a trade off.  Too big and the mossies'
> stingers would spear the radiators and suck all the water out.

Actually there is more to the story; Lucas deliberately designed the
headlights and parkers to be dim or "low visibility" types so as to
avoid the nightime "bug" buildup hassles. Anything to minimise the
weight (and
hence performance loss) of dead mossies piling up on the front end. 
This thread reminds me of a Land-Rover off road experience, illustrating
LR design virtues. Land Rover purists and restorers stop reading now.
The
following bit is true. 
This story is about Ron, my mate. He likes fishing. Beach fishing is so
full of action and thrills that you tend to sleep standing up a lot or
drink amber medicine and not pay attention to things. He goes over there
one Sunday in "Harry" his 1968 2A LWB Exarmy, taking along the
girlfriend (now wife). Late in the day I get a frantic phonecall to come
over and help Ron out of a bog... bring the strap quick. I raced over
there arriving in my SWB just as the girlfriend returns from her hike to
a public phone. She gets in and explains that the tide is getting close
and Ron is stuck in the sloppy bit near the water. He has 7.50's (8 ply)
let out to 5psi. We go along the beach and find him a few miles later
and he's in trouble. The waves are crashing thru one on doorway and
emptying out the other. The doors are off and shoved under the wheels.
Ditto seat bits and spare and and tailgate and grille. The throttle lock
is on and he is pushing from the back standing in the water... We hook
up and have a hard time getting over the vacuum effect on the sand
supporting the chassis. But all turned out OK. Saith the raven
"Nevermore!".
Next day at the traffic lights my wife breaks the axle and drives home
on the spare one at the front...
But he did get some fish.(tailor)
Cheers, Ross.

web- http://users.hunterlink.net.au/~derf/swb/index.html
        
   _____\___   'Castrol' -Australian Ex-Army Land-Rover SWB Series 2a
1964
  l._;|__|/-l                  
  `(*)~~~'(*)  'Pickles' -Australian Ex-Army Land-Rover SWB Series 2 
1959
                 
                                mailto:fax.rescue@hunterlink.net.au

                             "More oil stains than the road to Basra"

------------------------------

From: ASFCO@worldnet.att.net
Subject: Looking for lla Door bottoms
Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 01:18:58 +0000

     I am in need of good door bottoms for my series lla.. the ones that use
the check rod which fits into the cylinder on the bottom of the dash.
anybody here in the states have a pair?
TIA 
Rgds
Steve Bradke       96 Discovery
WA2GMC             72 S lll 88 (For Sale)
                   68 S lla 88                 

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 22:01:28 -0400
From: rover@pinn.net (Alexander P. Grice)
Subject: Zeniths, one more time

OK, gang...from the top.  If your Zenith/Solex 36IV is running rough and 
rich, there are only a few things that can be wrong.  There could be other 
problems - like an erratic run-up (accelerator pump) or faltering (plugged 
jet) - but for the moment, lets assume that these are in gook nick and that 
the distributor, particularly the points, are fine.  We'll leave the slow 
running idle screw alone for right now.  The problems are:

1) A warped body.  As Solex failed to anneal the various bits after casting, 
they can warp at some time after it goes through several heating/cooling 
cycles.  The cure is the glass plate grinding trick to make sure the two 
halves are absolutely flat.  Grind each half equally until you get a nice 
even shine on all the edges.

2) A buggered o-ring.  Oxygenated fuels do a number on o-rings, allowing 
excessive petrol to wash down the carb throat.  Fixing problem #1 often 
cures #2.

3) The extra port.  Don't ask questions.  Plug it.  You're done.

4) Too high float level. The float is composed of softer bronze than its 
cross-shaft, and sometimes it wears eliptical holes in the float.  Or, the 
needle valve has become worn and too much fuel gets pumped in.  There is a 
specific height for the float (7/32" ???) but maybe someone else can provide 
it.  Check the fuel pump pressure if you're running with an electric pump.  
Cheers

      *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"----*
      |               A. P. (Sandy) Grice                   |
      |     Rover Owners' Association of Virginia, Ltd.     |
      |    1633 Melrose Parkway, Norfolk, VA 23508-1730     |
      |  E-mail: rover@pinn.net  Phone: 757-622-7054 (Day)  |
      |    757-423-4898 (Evenings)    FAX: 757-622-7056     |
      |                                                     |
      *---1972 Series III 88"------1996 Discovery SE-7(m)---*

------------------------------

From: lenny@fof.coracle.com (Lenny Warren)
Date: 12 May 97 19:12:17 +0000
Subject: SER: oil pressure guage????

From: lenny@fof.coracle.com (Lenny Warren)

I fitted a Smiths Oil Pressure Guage in my Ser III, it's a capilliary 
gauge. However, the T-piece I had, which came from my Mini didn't fit! I 
went to my local L-R dealer to order one, BUT, he could only find an 
electrical guage, not mechanical!!!

Were any Landies fitted with a Capillary guage, if so does anyone know 
the part number?????

Someone a while back said the pressure sender was 1/2 20 but mines seems 
to be 3/8 20 BSF. ??????????

Anyone got a spare T piece for a ser III????????

I may have to adapt summat!! :-(
 
Catch you later,
Lenny...                                                                  35/5
_____________________________________________________________________________
                                                         _______ 
   Lenny Warren,                                    ____/_|(__)|
   Strathaven, Scotland, UK.                        |--|__|_--_| 
__ 1980 ser III 88" Diesel   _____" LURCH "__________(o)____(o)______________
_____________________________________________________________________________

 
... Smash the entire contents of your home with a sledge hammer before
... going away on holiday. Then any would be burglars who break in will get
... a taste of their own medicine.
--- Terminate 4.00/Pro
--
| Fidonet:  Lenny Warren 2:259/36.12
| Internet: lenny@fof.coracle.com

------------------------------

From: AKBLACKLEY@aol.com
Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 22:37:13 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Metric, schmetric and related ravings

George Washington may have started the Seven Years War by shooting  a
Frenchman on the banks of the O-hio, but I believe it was the more
revolutionary Jefferson who wanted the metric system then being introduced
into Republican France.
Which only goes to show the pedigree of that system. I think most of us
Landie lovers naturaly take to a system based on a human scale, not some
godless standard bar of platinum (or whatever).
I am a civil engineer by profession and it is a joke how the Federal Highway
Administration keeps flip flopping on metric. Several years back they
required all highway projects with federal funds (read almost every highway
project) to be designed in metric. So all the state DOTs converted their
specifications, details etc. to metric and made their consultants (us) design
in metric. Not nice round metric  numbers, but "hard" conversions of standard
dimensions which result in fractional metric numbers that would cause
engineers in the Europe to laugh out loud. Most engineers younger than 40-45
used SI in university (I did) and I even used it working for the Army in
Italy, so we grumbled, got out the old textbooks, and complied. No choice
really. But the big laugh is that the FHWA said recently it was no longer
requiring metric, something about gettin' the government off our backs. Too
late. But now that the states have spent all this money converting here they
are not going back. So we produce plans for projects in metric that the guys
in the field will have to red line back into feet in order to build them!
Sometimes I wonder if things would have been better if that frenchman got the
drop first....:>). Then right thinking people worldwide would be using a
system based the priciples of Common Sense, Fair Play, and of course,
Decency.
 Just my rant. Cheers. Andy Blackley

------------------------------

From: AKBLACKLEY@aol.com
Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 22:42:17 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Waxoyl at NAPA?

The NAPA stores that I know of would laugh themselves silly if I ever asked
for Waxoyl. As it is I usually have to think of some equivalent application
for something I need rather than admit its for a Range Rover (didja say
Ranger ...no..Land what.. hey aint that made by Toy-oat-a). 
I have found a reasonable substitute made right cheer in the U S of A. Its
called "Rusfre" (with a fruity accent over the e) made by 3B Products Co. of
New Kensington, PA, "All Purpose Rust Proofing No. 7002", "ordorless, light
tan waterproofing material that covers evenly penetrating cracks and
crevises, for inner panels and underbody protection blah blah..wont effect
mechanical or electrical ..blah blah...stays pliable - wont crack, chip or
peel..etc." I did find it at NAPA in 17 3/4 oz. (1 lb. 1 3/4 oz.) 503 grams (
dont know the equivalent in firkins) can. I might come in larger containers
(like elephants do). Seriously though, it does look, feel and smell amazing
similar to Waxoyl.
I use it mostly to cover areas under the hood , in doors, or other areas as a
temporary expedient. I am hoarding my genuine Waxoyl for the biennial frame
rustproof. Glad to hear Triple C is still getting it. It should be cheaper to
buy it from them instead of direct form the UK.
 cheers.  Andy Blackley

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 22:37:23 -0400
From: karlsson@edgenet.net (karlsson)
Subject: Progress Report:  On the Road Again!!

My 1966 88" Series IIa as back on the road after 20 years.  After a couple
of years of hard work (now and then) and an estimated $3000 spent on parts,
all moving parts except diffs and props have been rebuilt or replaced.  

I solved the problem of melting points with the help of Rovers North, who
pointed out that the genuine Land-Rover coil is internally ballasted.  My
locally purchased, generic 12V coil could be used with an external ballast,
but the lack thereof made things sizzle.  I had suspected the coil and
reverted to my old coil before I spoke to RN, but it was nice to learn the
true nature of the problem.

My goal was to be on the road in April.  I missed by only a few days,
registering on May 1, and maiden voyage on May 3.  Most of May 4 spent
fixing the brake fluid leak that I found.  

I had no trouble bleeding the brakes when the system was leaking.  After
the leak was fixed, I couldn't get the system bled, and the pedal kept
going to the floor.  I gave up on bleeding and readjusted the brake shoes,
then I had a little pedal.  I guess then Ned (new name for the newly
refurbished beast!) must have realized that I had given up, and the brakes
were suddenly perfect, as if by magic.  (Oh, how the memories come rushing
back from decades past!)

So, Ned is back on the road and red (mostly) and green (The doors were in
the barn the day I painted.  Out of sight, out of mind.) and blue (Well, I
forgot to paint the vent covers, too.)  But I hope to get all painted,
including the other top with tropical roof, in time for the Land-Rover
gathering on June 1 at Harkness Memorial Park in Connecticut.  

And today I had a surprise.  For the first time in many months, I saw a
Series IIa on the road.  This was a 109", headlights in the breakfast, RHD,
Limestone w/ hardtop/ fixed windows, which was pulling out of the parking
lot of Charlestown Elementary School in Charlestown, Rhode Island.  Anybody
on this list??

John Karlsson
Hope Valley, Rhode Island

------------------------------

From: "FHYap" <FHYap@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Metrics (No LR Content)
Date: Mon, 12 May 1997 19:00:15 -0700

> My first visit to the rainy island was before their money went metric.
> Pound, Shilling and Pence seemed somehow appropriate 

Don't forget farthing, crown, guinea ...

Frank

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 20:36:16 -0700
From: Michael Carradine <cs@crl.com>
Subject: Re: Metric, schmetric and related ravings

At 10:37 PM 5/13/97 -0400, Andy Blackley <AKBLACKLEY@aol.com> wrote:
:I am a civil engineer by profession and it is a joke how the Federal Highway
:Administration keeps flip flopping on metric. Several years back they
:required all highway projects with federal funds (read almost every highway
:project) to be designed in metric. So all the state DOTs converted their
:specifications, details etc. to metric and made their consultants (us) design
:in metric. Not nice round metric  numbers, but "hard" conversions of standard
:dimensions which result in fractional metric numbers that would cause
:engineers in the Europe to laugh out loud.

 The SI system does not use fractions, it is a decimal system, which is
 precisely it's main advantage.  Even with the English system engineers have
 long ago used a decimal system, ie by having an engineering scale to measure
 maps and drawings of engineering works, and make legal property descriptions.

 Here in the US building industry the architect's scale is still prevalent in
 dimensions of a foot or less, which makes it difficult to combine dimensions.
 The industry could do well to eliminate inches and fractions, and could do
 so very easily.  1/8" is very close to 0.01', so for example, a 1/2" thick
 plywood board is about 0.04' (only about 4% smaller), etc.

:....So we produce plans for projects in metric that the guys
:in the field will have to red line back into feet in order to build them!

 This sounds implausible since engineering drawings are generally in feet
 and decimal feet, so a conversion from metric is the straight application
 of a multiple factor.  Todays modern CAD systems can easily show both
 types of dimensions, ie  25.60m (83.99') is reasonable enough, the
 conversion to 83'11-7/8" is what sucks!!

 Regards,                And all this babble coming from an architect!
                       ______ /
 Michael Carradine     [__[__\==                  72-88, 89-RR Land Rovers
 Architect             [________]               www.crl.com/~cs/rover.html
 510-988-0900 _______.._(o)__.(o)__..o^^ POBox 494, Walnut Creek, CA 94597

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 23:58:57 -0700
From: Daniel Oppenheim <daniel5@best.com>
Subject: Re: Snark & Leaks...

Steve and others- where can you get your engine and underbelly steam
cleaned in the Bay Area? I too, or should I say Kermit, has a little
blow-by, I think, and I am constantly looking out a slimy, then dust-caked
rear window. Thanks for the leads on possible leak sources.(AKA leak-leads?)

For those of you with Weber 2bbl, what kind of mileage are you getting. [If
it would help reduce the normal tall tale report,  you can respond directly
to me, rather than with a list-wide post.] I'll bare my soul, Kermit has
gotten 13 mpg at the high end, and more typically 10-11 mpg, whether
off-road, city, or highway (that's going 70-75 mph)  What jets are you
using. What is the optimal set for power and fuel consumption? What do you
recommend at sea level,5000 feet, 8000 feet? As we've come to discover, the
price of petrol in South Africa might necessitate some carb. adjustment.
Also, the tour is going through the above mentioned altitudes.  Help...
Thanks in advance

At 11:03 AM 5/13/97 PDT, you wrote:
>Hi Granny,
>Yeah I haven't been out for a while now..been traveling for biz alot.   
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 26 lines)]
>Happy Hunting...
>Steve " Hutch' Hutchins  - 74 Series III  unofficially  'the Beast'  

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 09:33:55 +0200
From: Peter Kutschera <peter@zditf2.arcs.ac.at>
Subject: Need help: parts-info in SIIa Gearbox !

Hello World Wide Wisdom!

Anyone out there with a SIIA Parts catalog nearby?

In my SIIA Gearbox (Gearbox number 25347943E) the layshaft cracks.

On this layshaft there was a split ring holding gear 2 in position.
The layshaft broke under this ring.

Now I was asking for a new layshaft and ring (and bearings, gaskets,..)
and got the answer:
suffix e gearboxes don't have split rings on them. They are part of the lay
shaft.
So:
 a) Was there the wrong layshaft in my gearbox?
 b) Was the gearbox cover with the number replaced?
 c) I had the gearbox open 2 years ago (rear layshaft bearing).
    The split ring was falling from the layshaft. Maybe it originally
    was welded on the layshaft and this was a reason why the layshaft 
    now cracks there?
 d) If there was different layshafts are the interchangeable?

Thanks for your fast anwers - I need the Landy!
 Peter Kutschera <peter@atnet.at>

-- 
Signature: Cogito ergo sum....I think....
Homepage:  http://zditr1.arcs.ac.at/~peter
Landrover: http://zditr1.arcs.ac.at/~peter/LR

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 00:36:26 -0700 (PDT)
From: Don MacDonald <don@direct.ca>
Subject: Another New Land-Rover List!!

Sorry for cross posting.

There is a new small Land Rover list set up for anyone who lives in or near 
   
   British Columbia, Canada. 

Please post to: <bclandrover@ics.bc.ca>

Thanks,
Don
Don MacDonald				               <don@direct.ca>
	          <http://mypage.direct.ca/d/don>                           

------------------------------

From: marsden@digicon-egr.co.uk (Richard Marsden)
Subject: Re: Need help: parts-info in SIIa Gearbox !
Date: Wed, 14 May 97 9:14:08 BST

> Hello World Wide Wisdom!
> Anyone out there with a SIIA Parts catalog nearby?
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 13 lines)]
> suffix e gearboxes don't have split rings on them. They are part of the lay
> shaft.

*If* the suffix letters are continuous across SII and SIII 'boxes then this
would make sense. I have a suffix C, the truck is early SIII ('73).
Of course, vehicle and age doesn't necessarily bare any resemblence to
gearbox age.
If this is so, a 'C' suffix has the solid "moulded" layshaft.

About part way through SIII production, they metal was treated differently.
The SIII Manual says not to mix and match parts across this change.

> So:
>  a) Was there the wrong layshaft in my gearbox?
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 8 lines)]
>     now cracks there?
>  d) If there was different layshafts are the interchangeable?

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 09:25:25 +0000
From: M.J.Rooth@lboro.ac.uk (Mike Rooth)
Subject: Re: Metrics (No LR Content)

>Don't forget farthing, crown, guinea ...
>Frank

It was better than that,Frank.Ha'penny,thrupenny bit,tanner,bob,
florin,half-crown,ten bob note...those were the days.....:-)

Mike Rooth

------------------------------

Subject: Re: Need help: parts-info in SIIa Gearbox !
From: Ketil Kirkerud <ketilk@a.sol.no>
Date: 14 May 1997 10:44:01 +0200

marsden@digicon-egr.co.uk (Richard Marsden) writes:

! > Hello World Wide Wisdom!
! > Anyone out there with a SIIA Parts catalog nearby?
! 	 [ truncated by lro-lite (was 13 lines)]
! > suffix e gearboxes don't have split rings on them. They are part of the lay
! > shaft.
! 
! *If* the suffix letters are continuous across SII and SIII 'boxes then this
! would make sense.

They aren't - The latest SIII box was suffix 'C' or possibly 'D'. 
As far as I remember, all SII(a) boxes have the "non-solid" type layshaft.
(Butr then, I don't have a II(a), so I haven't read the parts catalogue 
for a while)

! I have a suffix C, the truck is early SIII ('73).
! Of course, vehicle and age doesn't necessarily bare any resemblence to
! gearbox age.
! If this is so, a 'C' suffix has the solid "moulded" layshaft.

All SIII-gearboxes have a solid layshaft (mine is a suffix "A", and it
does indeed have the solid layshaft)

-- 
---Ketil Kirkerud, 1979 109"SW 21/4Petrol

------------------------------

From: marsden@digicon-egr.co.uk (Richard Marsden)
Subject: Re: Need help: parts-info in SIIa Gearbox !
Date: Wed, 14 May 97 10:03:43 BST

> ! > Hello World Wide Wisdom!
> ! > Anyone out there with a SIIA Parts catalog nearby?
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 10 lines)]
> ! would make sense.
> They aren't - The latest SIII box was suffix 'C' or possibly 'D'. 

Oh well, discount everything I said! As most of the bits are
roughly-interchangeable, I guess they might use the same numbering system.
(I believe its possible to add a 1/2 synchro to a SII)

> As far as I remember, all SII(a) boxes have the "non-solid" type layshaft.
> (Butr then, I don't have a II(a), so I haven't read the parts catalogue 
> for a while)

That's what my Haynes tells me.

Richard (ex-Gurkha SIII 109 FFR)

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