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Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 14:18:24 +0200
From: Paul Oxley <paul@adventures.co.za>
Subject: Re: CB40 Finally Announced: URL's for Eletronic Telegraph

Mike Rooth wrote:
> >Richard
> Ouch! Now that is *really* scary.Can you imagine(if rumours are correct)
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 13 lines)]
> Cheers
> Mike Rooth

I dunno guys, maybe I'm a cynic but if it whimpers like a mongrel and
cringes like a mongrel, it's a mongrel!

Regards

Paul Oxley
"into Africa adventures" The African Adventure-travel Webzine
http://www.adventures.co.za
"AfricanAdrenalinDotCom" Sign up for adventure here...
http://africanadrenalin.com

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 08:49:20 -0500 (EST)
From: Erik van Dyck <erikvandyck@mindspring.com>
Subject: Is the Major asleep?

Am I the only one who has not recieved the Land-Rover Owner Daily Digest for
the past few days?  If someone who recieves this in Digest form would please
E-mail me I'll take that as a sign that I need to resubsribe.  Thanks, erik
Erik van Dyck
Stone Mountain, Georgia
1973 Series III   88"

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 08:24:16 -0500
From: Hank_Lapa@signalcorp.com (Hank Lapa)
Subject: NJ Pine Barrens Photos

     All,
     
     Some photos of last weekend's offroading by R.O.V.E.R.S., our local 
     L-R club, can be viewed on the club's web page at 
     http://calypso.math.udel.edu/rovers/PB97s/index.html
     
     Many thanks to Peter Monk, club webmaster, and Tom Bache, club 
     fearless leader, for organizing the event and putting the pictures up 
     on the web.  Plenty of wading and articulating Rovers from '97 Def 
     back to at least '63 109 with license plates from at least 4 or 5 
     states represented.  
     
     Hank

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 06:46:18 -0800
From: twakeman@scruznet.com (TeriAnn Wakeman)
Subject: Re: CB40 Finally Announced: URL's for Eletronic Telegraph

At  2:18 PM 3/21/97 +0200, Paul Oxley wrote:
;
>I dunno guys, maybe I'm a cynic but if it whimpers like a mongrel and
>cringes like a mongrel, it's a mongrel!
;
I don't know.  I said much the same about Range Rovers and Discoverys.  I
mean if they don't share any parts with my series Land Rover; if you can't
park one next to a 1948 series I and immediatly see a strong family
resemblence, it couldn't possibly be a real Land Rover.  Then the
Plushmobile owners took their mongrel cars off road and convinced me that I
was mistaken and should not judge a car on looks alone.

This Freelander thing looks to me to be as much of a Land Rover as the new
Range Rover.  Who knows.  Lets wait & see what they can do.  Don't judge
the new kid on the block before he moves into the neighborhood.

Besides we don't have to deal with them...They belong on the coiler list.
I am waiting to see if the Discovery owners complain that the Freelander
isn't a real Land Rover because its too different.

TeriAnn Wakeman            For personal mail, please start subject line
Santa Cruz California      with TW.  I belong to 4 high volume mail lists
twakeman@scruznet.com      and do not read a lot of threads..Thanks

Medium & large format photography, 1960 Land Rover 109,  1961 Triumph TR3A

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 07:11:19 -0800
From: John Ousterhout <jouster@redm.primextech.com>
Subject: glassfibre panels?

Mike R comments: (snip)
>Ouch! Now that is *really* scary.Can you imagine(if rumours are correct)
>the Army buying a 4x4 with glassfibre panels?Or farmers? Or aid
organisations?

Are you referring to the HMMMV, which has a few fiberglass panels? (not
used by many farmers or aid organizations that I know of)
JohnO

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 15:26:53 +0000
From: M.J.Rooth@lboro.ac.uk (Mike Rooth)
Subject: Re: glassfibre panels?

>Are you referring to the HMMMV, which has a few fiberglass panels? (not
>used by many farmers or aid organizations that I know of)
>JohnO
HMMV? Bad language,tut tut:-)
No,I'm referring to the rumours that say the successor to the
Defender will be a fibreglass bodied vehicle.Lets just hope that's
*all* it is..a rumour.
Cheers
Mike Rooth

------------------------------

From: marsden@digicon-egr.co.uk (Richard Marsden)
Subject: Re: glassfibre panels?
Date: Fri, 21 Mar 97 15:36:30 GMT

> >Are you referring to the HMMMV, which has a few fiberglass panels? (not
> >used by many farmers or aid organizations that I know of)
> >JohnO
> HMMV? Bad language,tut tut:-)

> No,I'm referring to the rumours that say the successor to the
> Defender will be a fibreglass bodied vehicle.Lets just hope that's
> *all* it is..a rumour.

<wears heathen hat>

What is wrong with fibreglass? Flexes, and doesn't corrode.

Okay, its not aluminium, but it doesn't work-harden either.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 11:10:54 -0500
From: Michel Bertrand <mbertran@interlinx.qc.ca>
Subject: RE: CKD article ba****d

At 01:34 97-03-20 UT, you wrote:
-
>Simon,

-Don't feel too bad... In theory there is no reason we in the USA could'nt get 
>hold of a CKD if Land ROver is already doing it for other countries. We are 
>rapidlly approaching the day when we will not see any new defenders due to US 
-Fed. Regulations. So this CKD option gives us a " KIT " landy to import and 
>avoid terrifs and reg's..
>rapidlly approaching the day when we will not see any new defenders due to US 
-

It would be rather difficult to get a CKD in the states or in Canada, and
for a few reasons:

1) Countries who get CKD's have a enormous duty fee for importing new
assembled vehicles, (ie: no local content). Not the case here.
2) CKD's are not assembled by the customers but by trained-manpower in a
purpose-built factory, not at the dealer's place.
3) CKD's do not come in direct competition with completely assembled
vehicles of the same brand, since they are all CKDs.
4) CKD's come in kits of 40 vehicles at a time. Therefore, one crate
contains 12 frames, another 10 engines, etc... Each vehicle is not packed in
one single crate but has its parts scattered in dozens of boxes, just like
the other 39 Landies of the batch. 

So, if I resume the conditions required to obtain a CKD Land Rover in your
driveway, :

In order to have a CKD, you have to find 39 of your friends to take the
plunge with you. You must have these shipped to a country that doesn't have
any LR dealers or from which you could then send to your home country, thus
preparing for a good, long discussion with the customs dudes and dudettes,
and try to find a way to get the thing in the country, regarding all
regulations, etc...

It would be much cheaper to buy a new truck over there, pay somebody to pull
it apart and ship it home in different crates and boxes, and to reassemble
it here. Then again, you'll have a new Defender, but not much of it would be
legal then. The Customs would come up one day and seize the vehicle, fine
you big time, and the truck will go at some auction for 150$, but having
previously been cut in different pieces...

Personnally, the only way that I could imagine CKD's getting in is to have a
deliberate willpower from Solihull (or Berlin) to export kit cars. I would
be very surprised cos I heard that BMW killed the Mini Line when they
realized that they were selling complete shells to customers. I am not
familiar with the Mini world, perhaps somebody could confirm/infirm this
affirmation.

Salutations, 

Michel Bertrand, with various Land Rovers in Kit form...

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 16:29:31 +0000
From: M.J.Rooth@lboro.ac.uk (Mike Rooth)
Subject: Re: glassfibre panels?

><wears heathen hat>
>What is wrong with fibreglass? Flexes, and doesn't corrode.
>Okay, its not aluminium, but it doesn't work-harden either.

So buy a Reliant Robin:-)
Doesnt work harden,but *does* shatter when hit.Thereby prompting
a trip to the franchise for a new,highly priced panel.At least
alloy just bends.
Mike Rooth

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 11:31:29 -0500 (EST)
From: Dixon Kenner <dkenner@nrn1.NRCan.gc.ca>
Subject: RE: CKD article ba****d

On Fri, 21 Mar 1997, Michel Bertrand wrote:

> It would be rather difficult to get a CKD in the states or in Canada, and
> for a few reasons:

	5.	Kit is considered as a vehicle under the transportation
act and must meet the current year safety and emission requirements (in
Canada at least)

> be very surprised cos I heard that BMW killed the Mini Line when they
> realized that they were selling complete shells to customers. I am not
> familiar with the Mini world, perhaps somebody could confirm/infirm this
> affirmation.

	Mini is scheduled to go out of production in 1999 or so after 40
years of continuous production.  Mini was supposed to have been killed off
in the early 1970's but survived because BL countn't afford to kill it.
The Metro was another replacement vehicle for the Mini, but the Mini
outlasted its replacement.  Sales are pretty low for the Mini.  Some
20,000 a year.  Of course, there is no real reason to kill off the Mini if
you are still selling them in large enough volume to make a profit, the
production line was amortised 30 years ago, but times change and they want
to change for the sake of change.  Body shells will probably continue to
be produced by British Motor Heritage Trust, just as they are doing with
MGB, Midget, etc shells and body parts.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 11:32:24 -0500
From: Michel Bertrand <mbertran@interlinx.qc.ca>
Subject: Re: LR Male or Female?

To have an official answer, Solihull, in the seventies, qualified the Land
Rovers (and Range Rovers) as females. I have a bunch of brochures indicating
Land Rovers as "une land rover..."

Salutations, 
Michel Bertrand
						______
Sherbrooke, Quebec, Canada, 		       /    __
					      /        \
1963 109 PU (Rudolph)	   		     | Lucas    |
1968 109 SW (in the works)		     |  Inside  |
1973 88 SW (21st century project)	      \        /
					       \______/

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 08:50:01 -0800
From: John Ousterhout <jouster@redm.primextech.com>
Subject: HMMMV vs 109

Actually, I can proudly claim that my '64 109 pulled a Hummer out of the
place it had become stuck. Almost better (or worse, depending on point of
view), it was stuck in down-town Spokane traffic with a clogged fuel
filter, and even though it was pulled over onto the shoulder, it still
filled half the right-hand lane. (is that why Rover made Land Rovers so
narrow?)
Side-note: it is exceedingly difficult to turn the steering wheel of heavy,
wide-tired vehicles when the power steering pump is not being spun by a
powerful V-8 diesel.

>HMMV? Bad language,tut tut:-)
>Mike Rooth

JohnO
'64 109 ('Hummer-puller')
'hundreds of thousands of trouble free miles ;)

------------------------------

From: finchm@sky3.bskyb.com
Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 16:42:26 +0000
Subject: CB40 or Series 1

Hi all

I have come to the conclusion that land rover could not go far wrong, in
designing a new land rover based around the series 1, and get rid of the
CB40 concept.

I believe that this would a good idea as they could give it all the feature=
s
that the new LRs have but keep the small wheelbase so it would be a land
rover version of the Jeep Wrangler or the japanese rhino.

I don't know what other people think to this idea of drgging the Series 1
kicking and screaming into the 90s
but I'm sure that you will tell me

I would buy a vehicle like this instead of a frontera look a like

Yours Mark

------------------------------

From: NADdMD@aol.com
Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 11:52:02 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Fwd: American Team Chosen for 1997 Camel Trophy Adventure

Hot off the press:

<<  SEVILLE, Spain, March 21 /PRNewswire/ -- After four days of intense
 training and testing, two Americans have been chosen to participate in the
 1997 Camel Trophy Adventure.  Doug Mays, 35, a forest engineer from
Corvallis,
 Ore., and Christopher vanNest, 25, a multi-media software developer from
 Bethlehem, Pa., will join teams from nineteen other nations for the world's
 most unique four-wheel drive expedition when the event heads to Mongolia in
 May.
           Eighty candidates (four from each participating country) came this
week to
 Dehasa El Campillo, a working farm outside Seville, for the Camel Trophy
 International Selections.  Here they spent up to sixteen hours each day
 developing and demonstrating their skills in four disciplines -- 4x4
Driving,
 Orienteering, Mountain Biking and Kayaking -- in the hope of being selected
 for their national teams.
           "It's amazing to think that your life can change so quickly," said
 vanNest.  "One minute you think you're headed home, and the next you're
going
 to Mongolia!"
           A third American candidate, David Kelly, 35 of Aptos, Calif., was
forced
 to withdraw from the International Selections after sustaining a knee injury
 in the final hours of competition.
           Now in its eighteenth year, the adventure expedition known for its
 tortuous off-road conditions and endless days and nights of winching has
 evolved to varied competitions with a new emphasis on athletic ability.
           Teams will drive identical Land Rover Discoverys more than 1,000
miles
 through the remote steppes, mountains and desert lands of Mongolia.  Using
GPS
 coordinates, the participants will navigate their vehicles to eight points
 along the route where they will compete in the driving, orienteering,
mountain
 biking and kayaking events.
           The two U.S. team members will have just six weeks to prepare
themselves
 for the adventure of a lifetime, which takes place May 13-31.  Mays and
 vanNest will spend two weekends in Colorado, training for the event and
honing
 their skills.  "Chris and I have always had a pretty good synergy, and I
think
 that's going to help us, but we will have a lot more training to do,"
 reflected Mays.
           The twenty participating countries for 1997 are: Austria, Canary
Islands,
 the Czech Republic, France, Germany, Greece, Holland, Italy, Japan, Morocco,
 Portugal, Romania, Russia, South Africa, Spain, Sweden, Switzerland, Turkey,
 the U.K. and the U.S. >>

Nate
---------------------
Forwarded message:
From:	AOLNewsProfiles@aol.net
Date: 97-03-21 11:39:15 EST

    SEVILLE, Spain, March 21 /PRNewswire/ -- After four days of intense
training and testing, two Americans have been chosen to participate in the
1997 Camel Trophy Adventure.  Doug Mays, 35, a forest engineer from
Corvallis,
Ore., and Christopher vanNest, 25, a multi-media software developer from
Bethlehem, Pa., will join teams from nineteen other nations for the world's
most unique four-wheel drive expedition when the event heads to Mongolia in
May.
          Eighty candidates (four from each participating country) came this
week to
Dehasa El Campillo, a working farm outside Seville, for the Camel Trophy
International Selections.  Here they spent up to sixteen hours each day
developing and demonstrating their skills in four disciplines -- 4x4 Driving,
Orienteering, Mountain Biking and Kayaking -- in the hope of being selected
for their national teams.
          "It's amazing to think that your life can change so quickly," said
vanNest.  "One minute you think you're headed home, and the next you're going
to Mongolia!"
          A third American candidate, David Kelly, 35 of Aptos, Calif., was
forced
to withdraw from the International Selections after sustaining a knee injury
in the final hours of competition.
          Now in its eighteenth year, the adventure expedition known for its
tortuous off-road conditions and endless days and nights of winching has
evolved to varied competitions with a new emphasis on athletic ability.
          Teams will drive identical Land Rover Discoverys more than 1,000
miles
through the remote steppes, mountains and desert lands of Mongolia.  Using
GPS
coordinates, the participants will navigate their vehicles to eight points
along the route where they will compete in the driving, orienteering,
mountain
biking and kayaking events.
          The two U.S. team members will have just six weeks to prepare
themselves
for the adventure of a lifetime, which takes place May 13-31.  Mays and
vanNest will spend two weekends in Colorado, training for the event and
honing
their skills.  "Chris and I have always had a pretty good synergy, and I
think
that's going to help us, but we will have a lot more training to do,"
reflected Mays.
          The twenty participating countries for 1997 are: Austria, Canary
Islands,
the Czech Republic, France, Germany, Greece, Holland, Italy, Japan, Morocco,
Portugal, Romania, Russia, South Africa, Spain, Sweden, Switzerland, Turkey,
the U.K. and the U.S.
      CO:  Land Rover; Worldwide Brands, Inc.
      ST:  Maryland, Oregon, Pennsylvania, Colorado
      IN:  AUT
      SU:

To edit your profile, go to keyword NewsProfiles. 
For all of today's news, go to keyword News.

------------------------------

From: marsden@digicon-egr.co.uk (Richard Marsden)
Subject: Re: CB40 or Series 1
Date: Fri, 21 Mar 97 16:59:29 GMT

> I believe that this would a good idea as they could give it all the features 
> that the new LRs have but keep the small wheelbase so it would be a land 
> rover version of the Jeep Wrangler or the japanese rhino.

If you read "First Overland" (by Tim Slessor?) [the First Oxford & Cambridge
London-Singapore journey], one of the many reasons they chose the new
Land Rover was because it was notably bigger than a (Willy's) Jeep.
This was also mentioned in their summing up/suggestions to future
overlanders.

So, the 80" Series I was was initially considered a long wheelbase.

(they also said that larger trucks wouldn't have made it through the jungle)

Richard

------------------------------

From: ericz@cloud9.net
Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 12:29:33 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: LR Male or Female?

On Fri, 21 Mar 1997, Michel Bertrand <mbertran@interlinx.qc.ca> wrote:

>To have an official answer, Solihull, in the seventies, qualified the Land
>Rovers (and Range Rovers) as females. I have a bunch of brochures indicating
>Land Rovers as "une land rover..."

Comme "une voiture".  In French, every car is feminine....:)  That is, except 
the U.S. "Le Car".....what advertising fool thought that up?

Rgds,
_______________________________________________________________________
Eric Zipkin  Bedford, NY  USA  *  ericz@cloud9.net  * www.cloud9.net/~ericz
SIII 109" V8 Hardtop * SII 109" SW (since new) * '63 Triumph Spitfire
SIIA 88" (project car)  *  '67 Mini-Moke * '94 Car Trailer: "NOT FOR HIRE"
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

From: dbobeck@ushmm.org
Date: Fri, 21 Mar 97 12:50:34 EST
Subject: Trade Tropical Roof for Soft Top

I've got a Safari Roof (just top, no roofsides) and Deluxe Bonnet, dished 
variety with tire mount. Both in OK condition. Bonnet straight, with some 
rust damage to stiffeners. Could be used as is or easily repaired. 
Limestone. Safari top has a dent on the rear face, but the door seal and 
gutter is straight. There is a 2" "U" shape cut out of the rear edge of the 
trop. panel, underneath which is a 2" round hole in the roof itself. 
Presumably for an antenna at one time. Alpine window seals look decent. 
Headliner is usable. Vents work, and are currently removed and seals are 
being replaced. Roof has been painted something akin to limestone, a bit 
glossier. 
 Looking to trade or partial exchange for full canvas hood and hoops, and 
tailgate.
Parts are in Arlington VA, USA

Contact Dave Bobeck at
202 488-6588 w
703 528 8727 h
or email
dbobeck@ushmm.org

later
Dave

ps, also have some other odd bits, but not much...

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 13:06:44 -0500
From: johnsonm@borg.com (myk)
Subject: Re: HMMMV vs 109

>Actually, I can proudly claim that my '64 109 pulled a Hummer out of the
>place it had become stuck. Almost better (or worse, depending on point of
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 6 lines)]
>filled half the right-hand lane. (is that why Rover made Land Rovers so
>narrow?)

For some photos of my fun with HMMV's see below;

http://www.borg.com/~johnsonm/DropZone.htm

Can't wait till Aug of this year.  There will be three LR owners on "Our" team.

74 SIII 88 (Chester)
73 SIII 88 (Jezebel)  everyone's gettin some
http://www.borg.com/~johnsonm

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 11:11:58 -0800 (PST)
From: gpool@pacific.net (Granville Pool)
Subject: Re: CB40 or Series 1

Mark,

>I have come to the conclusion that land rover could not go far wrong, in 
>designing a new land rover based around the series 1, and get rid of the 
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 13 lines)]
>but I'm sure that you will tell me
>I would buy a vehicle like this instead of a frontera look a like

There is something quite close to this, namely, the Foers Ibex.  The Ibex,
however, is on current Land Rover wheelbases (92.9", 100", and 110").  It's
rather wide, too, as it has essentially straight sides that are about the
width of the wide part of a Defender.  I'd not mind seeing something along
those lines with a shorter wheelbase and a bit narrower, with a soft top,
folding screen, and two-piece doors.  I think the 80" wheelbase would be a
bit too short for any on-road use as I've read in two or three articles that
80" coilers are too squirrely.  And I certainly wouldn't want to revert to
leaf-sprung design.  Maybe it'd work okay with 80" wheelbase and Kinetic
suspension...  8*P```

Granny

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 14:15:57 -0500 (EST)
From: cmw@tiac.net (cmw)
Subject: Number of...

>You never know where the name will come from. The state of Vermont 
>named mine. Sort of. When I first bought it and registered it, the 
>tags I received totoaly by chance (I hope) were 6A666.
>Any guesses as to what all my friends started calling it? (not "The 
>Beast")

Lucas? 

Chris
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
 Christopher Weinbeck       Office Logic, Inc.      V (508) 392-0288
   _______                  7 Littleton Road        F (508) 692-0897   
  |__][_[_\__               Westford, MA 01886    Computerization for 
  |___\_|_]__]                                      the healthcare
    (o)    (o)  '69 109" RHD OD 2.6 Dormobile        professional      
 
               Ask me about East Coast Rover Co.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

------------------------------

From: Easton Trevor <Trevor_Easton@dofasco.ca>
Subject: FW: RR 4.0 SE buying opportunity
Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 14:12:00 -0500

 ----------
From: Hemmingsen, Piers
Cc: Easton Trevor; gyp@inforamp.net at INTERNET
Subject: RR 4.0 SE
Date: Friday, March 21, 1997 1:52PM

     21 March 1997

     The vehicle for sale is as follows:

                1997 Range Rover 4.0 SE Oxford Blue w/ Tan Leather
Interior
                BRAND NEW - 0000083 KM on the clock (driven to dealer)
                Can be viewed at Bud's (Oakville)
                Still has factory plastic covering on it.
                Sun roof etc.

     Worth $93K CAD. Offers IRO $75-80,000 CAD.

     The owner is Mr. Marcel Shank of Sudbury, Ontario. He can be
     reached at 1-705-897-2712. It will also be advertised in the Globe
&
     Mail and Toronto Star.

     It was the first prize in the lottery. He won. If only I had ....

------------------------------

From: debrown@srp.gov
Date: 21 Mar 97 12:58:43 MST
Subject: '63 88 for sale.

FROM:  David Brown                           Internet: debrown@srp.gov
       Computer Graphics Specialist ~ S.R.P. ~ AM/FM - Graphic Records
       PAB219 (602)236-3544 -  Pager:6486 External (602)275-2508 #6486
Hello all,

Just wanted to put this "out there" for a friend that doesn't have
internet access.

For sale - '63 Series II red. New tires, (235x85x16) rims, fully
refurbished with new interior, even has a stereo. Solid frame, no rust
anywhere. I don't know everything he replaced, but he has done an
excellent job of it! Some of what I noticed were all new door seals,
(better style than factory) window channels, vent seals, upholstery,
carpeting, rear jump seats, and more! Excellent looking rig! Asking $10K
or best offer, (actual words were "we'll go from there.") will take
payments. (I think he was asking $12K for it last year.)
Lives in Phoenix Arizona. USA

Call Martin Davis 602-437-9491 Tell him "Dave Brown sent me."
(I could use the "Brownie" points!) ;-)

I know he's had it for a while, hasn't really advertised. if interested
Make him an offer the worst he can do is counter offer!

Dave (racking up the brownie points) Brown

Habit is the best of servants,       #=======#         _____l___
or the worst of masters.             |__|__|__\___    //__/__|__\___
- Nathaniel Emmens                   | _|  |   |_ |}  \__ - ____ - _|}
-                                    "(_)""""""(_)"      (_)    (_)

------------------------------

From: Hudson29@aol.com
Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 15:27:25 -0500 (EST)
Subject: No Subject

 

------------------------------

From: Hudson29@aol.com
Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 15:51:10 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Missing Lists

	I didn't receive the daily digest for the Land Rover Owners list that would
cover March 19 & 20. Have I been banished from the list for the lack of a
Land Rover name, or being new to confusers, have I screwed something up? Can
I get copies of the missing days? Please reply off the list, as I don't
appear to be getting the list currently.

Paul O'Neil
'71 SIIA SW (unchristened)
Fullerton, CA USA
Hudson29@aol.com

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 13:14:06 -0800 (PST)
From: "Paul Gussack" <pcg@tennis.org>
Subject: Brick Wall

SIII SWB,
Thanks for the response on fuel pump break down, I had a new one overnight from
oversray-orthnay and with a little fiddleing about got it in and it works
great.  

Went to back "Grendal" out of the driveway got 10 feet and my Rover stops like
it's hit a brick wall.  I shift it into forward and pull up a little, shift it
back and there's that wall again.  

Any ideas. Did I damage my reverse gear( broken tooth) on the long tow home or
is something in the primary of my tranny.  I think the bearing is wearing out
as it is noisy.

Any suggestions
Paul G
SIII SWB "Grendal"

------------------------------

From: "Pratt, Randy" <RPratt@sjeccd.cc.ca.us>
Subject: RE: The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest
Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 15:12:34 -0800

please remove me from your mailing list.

>----------
>From:
>	=
Owner-LRO-Digest@playground.sun.com[SMTP:Owner-LRO-Digest@playground.sun.=
com
>]
>Sent: 	Thursday, August 29, 1996 2:58 AM
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 17 lines)]
>=09
>Tell your friends SUBSCRIBE send a message to:	=
MajorDomo@Land-Rover.Team.Net
>with the text:					subscribe lro-digest
>Majordomo can also respond to other commands, send text:	help
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 9 lines)]
>    3 mbertran@interlinx Wed Aug 28 04:33   54/1808  Re: Comments...
>    4 krm@mtnms.att.com  Wed Aug 28 05:01   43/1702  Rear Brake =
question on a
>    5 girardey@montrouge Wed Aug 28 05:51   34/1258  Re: French Members
>    6 Darrell.Fremont@un Wed Aug 28 06:10   26/1086  Re: Rear Brake =
question
>r
>    7 Darrell.Fremont@un Wed Aug 28 06:30   31/1197  Re: Can of Worms =
input
>    8 rotero@huillinco.i Wed Aug 28 06:37   28/1065  Re: hydraulic  =
wlnch
>    9 dbobeck@inetgate.u Wed Aug 28 07:10   55/2181  Re[2]: Land Rover =
Diesel
>   10 johnliu@earthlink. Wed Aug 28 07:35   21/994   JPEG of hub/swivel
>   11 dbobeck@inetgate.u Wed Aug 28 07:41   54/2757  IT LIVES!!!!!!!!!!
>   12 badams@usia.gov    Wed Aug 28 07:46   24/830   Re: Re[2]: Land =
Rover
>Die
>   13 uf974@vifa1.freene Wed Aug 28 07:48   40/1510  Santana Motor =
Swaps?
>   14 dkenner@NRCan.gc.c Wed Aug 28 07:54   41/1349  Re: Series =
Database
>   15 rovah@rovah.sdi.ag Wed Aug 28 07:56   42/1783  Jacob's
>   16 mbertran@interlinx Wed Aug 28 08:00   46/1631  weird 16" wheels
>   17 dunsmo19@us.net    Wed Aug 28 08:24   33/1017  Re: IT =
LIVES!!!!!!!!!!
>   18 dkenner@NRCan.gc.c Wed Aug 28 09:11   97/3916  Re: Comments...
>   19 debrown@srp.gov    Wed Aug 28 09:21   56/2731  Broke something in =
the
>re
>   20 badams@usia.gov    Wed Aug 28 09:55   24/827   Re: Broke =
something in
>th
>   21 rgrant@cadvision.c Wed Aug 28 10:07   34/1404  Re: Broke =
something in
>th
>   22 dkenner@NRCan.gc.c Wed Aug 28 10:17   29/1017  Re: Re[2]: Land =
Rover
>Die
>   23 m8f@ornl.gov       Wed Aug 28 10:18   32/1287  LR Database
>   24 debrown@srp.gov    Wed Aug 28 10:34   41/1665  "Pop goes the =
axle."
>   25 gpool@pacific.net  Wed Aug 28 10:38   29/1105  Re: Santana Motor =
Swaps?
>   26 jcasteel@mindsprin Wed Aug 28 11:14   48/1822  Re: LR Database
>   27 scooper@scooper.se Wed Aug 28 11:13   24/1156  Trip
>   28 jcasteel@mindsprin Wed Aug 28 11:23   31/1231  Re: Santana Motor =
Swaps?
>   29 dboehme@rad1.pcmai Wed Aug 28 11:28   60/2316  RE: D90 BestTop
>   30 channel6@post2.tel Wed Aug 28 12:48   76/3139  Re: How do I get =
the
>head
>   31 mbertran@interlinx Wed Aug 28 13:46   49/1860  weird 16" wheels
>correcti
>   32 fisk@emerald.gene. Wed Aug 28 14:01   35/1653  Paint Code- Camel =
Trophy
>   33 channel6@post2.tel Wed Aug 28 14:04   62/2542  Re: weird 16" =
wheels
>corr
>   34 jcasteel@mindsprin Wed Aug 28 14:59   38/1498  Re: Paint Code- =
Camel
>Tro
>   35 johnliu@denmark.it Wed Aug 28 15:31   44/2154  Broke something in =
the
>re
>   36 bothe@itz-koeln.de Wed Aug 28 15:44   39/1549  V8 - Engine
>   37 smitha@candw.lc    Wed Aug 28 17:41   36/1234  RE: D90 steering =
wheels
>   38 75347.452@CompuSer Wed Aug 28 18:27   21/878   Diffs
>   39 jcasteel@mindsprin Wed Aug 28 20:24   64/2413  Series Database
>   40 ericz@cloud9.net   Wed Aug 28 22:01   37/1215  Driveshaft Drama
>   41 PDoncaster@aol.com Wed Aug 28 22:40   16/614   Re: Driveshaft =
Drama
>   42 bfinley@awinc.com  Wed Aug 28 22:43   48/2138  Re: Land Rover =
Diesel
>   43 dow@thelen.org     Wed Aug 28 22:54   80/2890  Re: Series =
Database
>   44 dwebb@waite.adelai Wed Aug 28 23:37   35/1295  Re: Driveshaft =
Drama
>   45 bb@olivetti.dk     Wed Aug 28 23:58  111/5639  RE: V8 - Engine
>   46 channel6@post2.tel Thu Aug 29 02:49   41/1555  Re: Driveshaft =
Drama
>   47 EWHITE2@ALPHA2.CUR Thu Aug 29 03:35   47/1994  Re: Kangaroo-bars =
vs
>bull
>------------------------------
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 9 lines)]
>Subject: hydraulic  wlnch
>help! i still can not get the winch to rotate. the engagement lever =
along the
>chassis engages the drum freely, the cables that go to the p.t.o. pump =
and
>the control valve box also are free. the drum itself does not freespool =
as an
>electric winch would, so i think it might be frozen. any ideas? i tried
>p.b.blaster on brake collar and backed off the 2 pads, and tapping so =
it does
>move back and forth albiet not aesily. brian cotton i believe in rsa =
has a
>similar winch, maybe you might be able to help. thanks in =
advance...d.b. 
>------------------------------
>Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 07:21:11 -0400
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 85 lines)]
>Subject: Re: Rear Brake question reply
>     rovers north has an excellent instruction sheet you can get from =
thier
>     web site. http://www.roversnorth.com  when i did my brakes, one
>     replacement did not have the pin. was not too difficult to remove =
from
>     old brake and spot weld on new one. good luck
>     darrell.fremont@uni.edu
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 13 lines)]
>     darrell.fremont@uni.edu;http://www.uni.edu/cet/STAFF/Fremont,
>     lro-net,working on a ground up restoration;added a canvas top for =
the
>     summer months;second owner since 1995;found vehicle in south =
dakota
>    
>     i will try to get information for the database as i know of 12 =
more
>     series vehicles in iowa.
>    
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 16 lines)]
>Not to much power  but at least it goes on both directions.
>It does not  frespool as you say. so  I am thinking of disasembling it =
and
>search for rusted parts etc.
>If you have any progress E- Mail me. We might run into  similar probles =
and
>similar solutions
>Regards,
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 13 lines)]
>Subject: Re[2]: Land Rover Diesel (Gearbox incompatibility)
>>SIII gearboxes are not directly interchangeable with SIIA boxes. The =
clutch
>>operating mechanism is completely different and incompatible.
>...snip...
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 6 lines)]
>> The alternative .... swap in the entire
>>SIII box with bellhousing and clutch mechanism, then reroute the =
clutch line
>>to the other side and fabricate brackets as needed. ....
>Hello people! I don't nkow why this is so uncommon. All that is =
>> The alternative .... swap in the entire
required is
>the
>SIII slave cylinder and a line to reac it form the flex hose. The next =
step
>is
>to cut away the gusseting to the engine crossmember, as this will be in =
the
>way.
>Definitely alot easier than retrofitting a 'box with a different =
bellhousing.
>There wouldn't be any fabrication required, the only thing I can think =
of is
>removing two bolts from the top of the flywheel housing to add a clip =
for the
>clutch pipe. The SIII slave goes right into the bellhousing, so no =
brackets
>required. Than you can get rid of that ungodly SIIa setup...
> BTW- The cutting you have to do on the frame is alot easier if you =
have Bill
>Adams around...:-)
>Cheers
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 10 lines)]
>Considering the apparent non-running status of this vehicle, and the
>incompatibility of some of the potential drivetrain, I'd regard this as =
a
>project rather than a soon to be daily driver. But then I'm pesimistic =
(by
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 14 lines)]
>Subject: JPEG of hub/swivel
>Who wanted the JPEGs of the hub/swivel?  I wrote down lodelane@aol.com =
but
>forgot the other address -- in South Africa, I think?  Email me your =
address
>and I'll send this off to you.
>------------------------------
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 13 lines)]
>connections
>and swapping batteries and buying solenoids, I finally got my engine =
started
>again. After exactly four months (April 27th), the Green Car finally =
moved
>under
>it's own power.
>The first time, it started, ran like crap, and then a big blast of fire =
came
>out
>of the carb and then it died. Cool!!! I went ahead and set the timing =
(duh)
>and
>she started easy and ran *a little* better. The exhaust was clean and =
she ran
>smooth and quiet, once the oil pressure came up.
>I hopped into the driver's seat, gingerly crashed the rebuilt gearbox =
into
>reverse and slowly eased off the clutch and backed her out of the =
garage.
>Well
>actually, something happened and I sort of lurched out, nearly removing =
the
>regulator from our air compressor. I drove forward in first and tried =
again.
>This time we went striaght out into the driveway, where I let the rest =
of the
>smoke (assuming it was from various substances I had sprayed on the =
manifolds
>and pipes and block and head..) burn off and dissipate. After that I =
waited
>another few minutes for the garage to clear out, and all was well. Then =
it
>stalled. I simply reconnected the jumper cable from the negative =
battery
>terminal to the starter ground cable (that's why it wouldn't start) and =
she
>fired right up.
>She was overheating though so I shut her off. There was a bit of =
(duh)
antifreeze
>coming out of the front of the head...ugh. I shut it off and sure =
enough the
>head needed retorquing.
>Head retorqued and plugs out I turned the engine over with the valve =
(duh)
cover
>off
>to see if my rockers were oiling, and they seemed to be doing a fine =
job,
>better
>than I remebered. I topped off the rad and went home.
>Tonight I'll get the carb and accelerator linkage squared away and =
>and
hopefully
>find out what's going on with the head. It'd be a shame if they skimmed =
the
>head
>just so that I could end up skimming the block too...
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 60 lines)]
>On Tue, 27 Aug 1996, John P. Casteel wrote:
>> I have deduced from this sample that all Series Land Rovers are in =
the
>> USA and that 75% are daily drivers.  The other 25% are drivable.  The =

>> most popular color is Light Green.  Finally, half of all Series Land
>> Rovers are in Arizona.
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 16 lines)]
>	We won't discuss which have MOT's :-)
>	Colours?  Blue =3D 2, Sand =3D 2, Red =3D 1, lgreen =3D 2, black =3D =
1,
>		  dgreen =3D 4 (one with purple underneath)
>------------------------------
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 10 lines)]
>Rich,
>     I had the Engergy Team by Jacobs in my Chevy p/u and was VERY =
pleased
>with it!  Seat of the pants improvement was notable.  Traded in the =
Chevy
>for a RR, and can't get the Jacobs to work with the system!  They make =
a
>product that looks like it would be perfect for Series owners, it's =
called
>the Power pack or some such thing.  It goes between the coil and
>distributor and looks like a replacement coil.  Apparently, it's a =
beefed
>up coil and computer that optimizes spark to each cylinder in one unit!
>     Rich!  Just found the article!  It's called the Omni-Pack, and was =
in
>the September 1994 Issue of Four Wheeler magazine, on page 98!  The
>installed the unit on their 1946 Jeeo which had a 1960 era 4-banger.  =
They
>found the improvements dramatic!
>The company has always offered tech support if needed(usually not), and =
>Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 10:59:16 -0400 (EDT)
I
>think you would find improvement on a Series truck!
>Cheers!  John
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 21 lines)]
>Just a question for the experts out there.
>I have 16" rims on Rudolph that came off my 68' 109 SW Nada. I would =
like to
>know the diameter of the rim and the offset, since I am about to change
>tires (is Trac Edge a good choice?) The part number on the rim reads
>FV607510 and the year: /68 .
>I can't find that number anywhere in the parts catalog. I would like to =
>she started easy and ran *a little* better. The exhaust was clean and =
buy
>another rim just like it, cos I only have 4 of them, the PO chucked out =
the
>spare.
>Was this rim available only on the 6-cyl Nada's?
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 79 lines)]
>	Dixon
>=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
>Date: Tue, 27 Aug 1996 15:41:41 +0100
>Cc: dkenner@emr1.nrcan.gc.ca
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 12 lines)]
>coverage.
>It's a difficult one to get over to club enthusiasts, but the club =
scene
>is still very much a minority activity for the bulk of our readers.
>While I accept it may be different in the States and Canada, it's a =
>From: Land Rover Owner magazine <lro@maxcom.demon.co.uk>
case
>that expanding the club coverage means something else has to be knocked
>out that, I believe, appeals to a greater number of readers. Remember,
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 6 lines)]
>which would apply to 50,000 has to be thrown out or reduced.
>The falling sales of Land Rover World suggest that greater club =
coverage
>does not satisfy the bulk of the readers.
>Land Rover Owner International carries far more club coverage than ever
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 17 lines)]
>Carl Rodgerson, editor
>Land Rover Owner magazine
>=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=

>------------------------------
>From: debrown@srp.gov
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 18 lines)]
>work under front wheel drive. The grinding is not really that loud, but
>it is noticeable. Not able to hear it over the engine noise, to give =
you
>an idea how loud. I thought it was a broken U-joint, and the grinding
>sound was the drive shaft (propshaft) hitting the ground. (Been there,
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 11 lines)]
>I've abused the beast.
>2.) Can or should I drive approx 11 miles home before pulling the =
axles,
>opening up the diff? I have ONLY a screwdriver with me. (Either sheer
>stupidity, of overconfidence in the 109?) Since the RR is down with a
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 12 lines)]
>it's contagious) Brown.
>#=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D#         _________         "What lies behind us =
and what lies
>|__|__|__\___    //__/__|__\___    before us are tiny matters compared
>| _|  |   |_ |}  \__ - ____ - _|}  to what lies within us."
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 11 lines)]
>Subject: Re: Broke something in the rear diff!
>You broke a half shaft, you broke a half shaft, nyah nyah nyah nyah =
nyah!
>A quick call to RN will cure yer ills. Get out the checkbook!
>Bill Adams
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 14 lines)]
>At 12:42 PM 28/08/96 -0400, Adams, Bill, wrote
>>You broke a half shaft, you broke a half shaft, nyah nyah nyah nyah =
nyah!
>>A quick call to RN will cure yer ills. Get out the checkbook!
>You know, from the number of times this happens to people I think I'll =
>3D Artist/Animator
lash
>a couple (I have 4 spares) under the frame with duct tape.  If they're =
there
>permanently that will guarantee I will never need them. (I hope)
>                                                         Rick Grant
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 17 lines)]
>Subject: Re: Re[2]: Land Rover Diesel (Gearbox incompatibility)
>On Wed, 28 Aug 1996, Bobeck, David R. wrote:
>> clutch pipe. The SIII slave goes right into the bellhousing, so no =
brackets
>> required. Than you can get rid of that ungodly SIIa setup...
>>.
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 14 lines)]
>Subject: LR Database
>For the database, does daily driver mean that it's actually used as a
>primary vehicle, or just capable of such?  My IIa is in real good =
shape, but
>I've got  a modern car (don't worry, its English) in which I do my 50 =
mile
>RT commute.  The IIa handles the commute in stride when one of the =
other
>vehicles is sick (it's a liitle warm in August, though).  Some of the
>vehicles I read about on this list sound, well, marginal for daily =
duty.
>Is mine a dd or a dr?  I want this to be right, you know.
>Scott Fugate
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 19 lines)]
>       PAB219 (602)236-3544 -  Pager:6486 External (602)275-2508 #6486
>Please bear with me as I have a little fun with my apparent broken =
axle...
>Sung to the tune of "Pop goes the weasel."
>  A round and round the axles do go,
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 15 lines)]
>;-) keep on rovering...
>#=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D#         _________         "What lies behind us =
and what lies
>|__|__|__\___    //__/__|__\___    before us are tiny matters compared
>| _|  |   |_ |}  \__ - ____ - _|}  to what lies within us."
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 15 lines)]
>>Didn't Santana import into Mexico?
>I doubt it.  From what I've heard, there are precious few Land-Rovers =
of any
>kind in Mexico (and I've always wondered why as it seems like prime =
terrain
>for 'em).
>Lots of Santanas in Central America and the Carribean, though.
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 20 lines)]
>As they say, use your best judgement.  I don't know what this category
>will show other than which cars are destroyed.  There are probably some =

>parts cars that are occassionally driven.
>Thanks,
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 9 lines)]
>> For the database, does daily driver mean that it's actually used as a
>> primary vehicle, or just capable of such?  My IIa is in real good =
shape,
>>but
>	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 15 lines)]
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 13 lines)]
>Subject: Trip
>I`m getting the Rover ready to drive from Seattle to Portland Oregon.  =
The
>"Beastie" is still stock in all respects except for a Zenith carb =
installed
>a few months ago, even the fuel pump is 27 years old.  I was just =
wondering,
>I know there is a land-rover song, but is there a land-rover prayer?
>Going to the Portland British auto show...maybe
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 30 lines)]
>Rob,
>Get some climbing rope and some locking carbines (sp?) and prepare to   =

>repel!
>Just kidding.  The top does get easier to put on, but heed this =
>John Cooper 1969 11a
warning:  
>trying to put the top on as it gets colder become MUCH more of a  
>challenge.
>I don't know about the other D90 owners, but at some point in the Fall, =
>------------------------------
I  
>decide it's not going to get much warmer, and I plan to put it on.  =
When  
>I say plan, I mean: take the top with you when you go to work and =
spread  
>it out over the roll bars in the sun.  Go out at lunch time, and =
install  
>it (at this point, it's expanded as much as possible).
>All of this is moot, of course, if you enjoy a great challenge, and  
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 13 lines)]
>D90-style
> BestTop roof and added the subsequent hardware necessary to handle the =
 
>new
> roof, i.e. the "track" system. It being summer and all, I quickly took =
 
>the
> roof off after purchase and went with the Bimini top to go along with  =

>the
> nice weather etc..  I decided to beat today's inclement weather and
> tried to place my new roof back on yesterday, and found it to be an
> *incredibly* tight fit - nothing like the Tickford was (!). Anyway, =
will  
>this
> roof become *any* easier to put on as it wears a bit? OR should I  
>prepare to
> attach myself to the little tabs on the bottom of the roof, and repel  =

>down
> the side of the vehicle trying to hook the tabs to the tracking =
system?!  
>------------------------------
>Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 21:51:11 -0700
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 10 lines)]
>> Hello all,
>> A couple of weeks ago someone wrote about the "coughing" of his =
Landrover,
>	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 29 lines)]
>> janjan@xs4all.nl
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 8 lines)]
>when visiting my trusty LR mechanic I asked his advice.
>"Oh that one" he said "that's often a problem on the older vehicles =
with
>old fibre gaskets - age just seems to weld the whole lot togther - if
>all else fails, remove the fuel supply (and ignition if petrol engine)
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 7 lines)]
>replace the plug/injector, and slowly roll the car in gear so that the
>piston pushes the oil up - don't turn the engine over, just roll in =
gear
>- the head will come easily free this way"
>You may have already solved it, but I couldn't resist passing this gem
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 19 lines)]
>Subject: weird 16" wheels correction
>Hello all,
>In my last message, I was asking about the diameter of my 16" rim. Duh. =
It's
>the width that I would like to know, 5", 5.5", or 6". Thanks again
>        Just a question for the experts out there.
>        I have 16" rims on Rudolph that came off my 68' 109 SW Nada. I =
>Denmark telephone +45 86 95 42 07)
>car to move the piston down, and fill the cylinder with oil!" then
would
>like to         know the diameter of the rim and the offset, since I am
>about to change tires         (is Trac Edge a good choice?) The part =
number
>on the rim reads FV607510 and the         year: /68 .
>        I can't find that number anywhere in the parts catalog. I would =
>        I have 16" rims on Rudolph that came off my 68' 109 SW Nada. I =
like
>to buy         another rim just like it, cos I only have 4 of them, the =
PO
>chucked out the         spare.
>        Was this rim available only on the 6-cyl Nada's?
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 32 lines)]
>have checked the after market page (the 4x4 connection) and did not see
>a code match.  I did see that "Sandglow" was an early Jag colour =
though.
> Anyone got any ideas on where I might be able to track down a reliable
>paint code and source??
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 18 lines)]
>Michel Bertrand wrote:
>> Hello all,
>> In my last message, I was asking about the diameter of my 16" rim. =
Duh.
>>It's
>	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 32 lines)]
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 43 lines)]
>jacking up each rear wheel and rotating it.  Probably that is what you
>have.  I drove happily for a week in front-wheel drive after breaking a
>halfshaft, with no ill effects.  However, the grinding would worry me: =
e.g.,
>what if bits of halfshaft are mucking up the differential so a easy fix =
is
>being converted to a costly one?  Unlikely, but a thought.
>Personally, I would find or buy a couple
>of wrenches, disconnect the propshaft from the transfer case, wire it =
>>                                                \______/
up
>securely (very, very securely!), and then drive it home.  If that is =
not
>possible, then maybe your AAA card should be used (as the owner of two
>British cars, you do have Auto Club membership, don't you?)  Or maybe =
there
>is a service station close to you that could take off the propshaft.
>If none of that is
>possible -- well, I wouldn't spend the night at work (or whereever you =
>>                                                \______/
are)
>just because of some grinding!  When you get home, since you need
>transportation until the halfshaft arrives, just disconnect the =
propshaft
>completely and rely on the front axle for a while.  Don't leave the
>propshaft wired up since the consequences of it coming loose and the =
front
>end dropping down and lodging in a pothole as you whistle along at 50 =
mph .
>. . sorry, I guess I'm stating the obvious.
>John Y. Liu
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 18 lines)]
>Subject: V8 - Engine
>Helo Landy-Owners!
>After finishing the frame-over now it's time to have a closer look at =
the
>engine
>of my 109 Station SIII V8 (1983).
>1. I find in the database of a petrol-station that the V8 engines runs =
>>                                                \______/
with
>"normal" 91 octane fuel unleaded. Can anybody confirm this?
>2. At the moment our baby takes around 20 litres of fuel per 100 km. =
>1. I find in the database of a petrol-station that the V8 engines runs =
This
>seems to
>be much, because she doesn't grow any more. What experiences made other =

>V8-Parents?
>3. I know there have been some discussion, but maybe somebody could =
>1. I find in the database of a petrol-station that the V8 engines runs =
give me a
>summerize of how to reduce this extensive fuel-consuming (remember in =
Germany
>1
>litre fuel costs about 1$)
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 16 lines)]
>On Thu, 22 Aug 1996, GeorgeEsq@gnn.com (George S. Szydlowski) wrote:
>>for your info I have a motolita wheel and hub on my 73 sIII. I bought =
a
>>spare wheel from rovers north and had the bushing cut out and pressed =
in to
>	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 7 lines)]
>>plus shipping and you can try the same.  g.s.s.
>>George - thanks for the offer. However, I do have the option of Series =
wheel
>that is available here, and I am thinking of using it.
>Cheers
>Allan Smith
>St. Lucia
>>for your info I have a motolita wheel and hub on my 73 sIII. I bought =
a
>>spare wheel from rovers north and had the bushing cut out and pressed =
in to
>------------------------------
>Date: 28 Aug 96 21:29:50 EDT
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 12 lines)]
>bolt-in
>positive locking diff to fit a 72 Land Rover with either a 10 or a 24 =
pline
>axle
>for about 300$ US.  Any horror stories, words of wisdom, etc...
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 27 lines)]
>I am sure that this information will change. <g>
>Again, the format follows.  Any deviation from the comma delimited =
slows
>down my data entry.  Thanks
>VIN,year,type,size,name,color,current location,country,shape,original
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 36 lines)]
>Subject: Driveshaft Drama
>Thanks to all that offered your advice reference my driveshaft =
problems.
>Here's the score:
>Rear Driveshaft: Destroyed front yoke, bent shaft, rear u-joint and =
>dealer,e-mail,lro-net,notes (limit of 250 characters)
>St. Lucia
spline on
>their way out.
>Front Driveshaft: All u-joints bad, spline bad.
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 7 lines)]
>Cause:  Both shafts out of phase...duh!
>Effect: I'm now $471 poorer but my Rover runs much more smoothly (and =
has two
>nice new custom-made driveshafts).
>Effect#2:  I will NEVER let my driveshafts get out of phase!
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 24 lines)]
>Subject: Re: Land Rover Diesel
>People have been talking about a $4500 diesel and whether that =
constitutes
>a good price.
>I'm in Canada, and I've just bought my first Land Rover after doing =
>"Ouch, my wallet hurts!"
some
>research (reading all the web pages and FAQ), looking in our regional
>classifieds, talking to two local owners, and finally making two phone
>calls, and one 600 km round-trip drive to talk to the seller (then =
another
>drive to get the vehicle), and the purchase price was $1500 Canadian. I
>only had to talk to that one seller, and go to see that one car.
>I already described what I got (1968 109" IIA NADA 6 cyl works fine) =
>St. Lucia
from a
>guy here with 31 Rovers. It needs tons of minor things, and I did find =
that
>all other Rovers cost more, but they were all somewhat restored.
>Maybe the good life is just cheaper here, but I think you could find =
>I already described what I got (1968 109" IIA NADA 6 cyl works fine) =
all
>Land Rovers here in better shape than mine would be about $4000 to =
$7000
>Can, but not diesel.
>One Rover owner in my town bought his current Series III dead in a =
>I already described what I got (1968 109" IIA NADA 6 cyl works fine) =
field
>and paid $2500 Can two years ago, and it needed lots of work under and
>around, but was nice inside, so he still paid seemingly more.
>The Rovers North vehicle flyer (Aug.) has lots of listings for the more
>restored and expensive models, and that's what a fixed up Rover should =
>>for your info I have a motolita wheel and hub on my 73 sIII. I bought =
sell
>for anywhere I would think.
>So maybe $4500 is good. What have other recent buyers been paying and
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 15 lines)]
>Subject: Re: Series Database
>        I noticed one inconsistency:  There are no pre '64 LRs in the =
list,
>but one vehicle is listed as a IIa.  I think the IIa came out earlier =
than
>'64, so that must be a mistake--either that or I'm full of it :-).  But
>anyway, I think what you are doing is way cool.  Thanks a bunch.
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 25 lines)]
>In which case the SPOT is to take it apart and put it back in phase.
>Of course this is only a SPOT if you actually tell the new owner, and =
at
>least it prevents them from making the same mistake
>cheers
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 19 lines)]
>>Helo Landy-Owners!
>>After finishing the frame-over now it's time to have a closer look at =
=3D
>the >engine
>>of my 109 Station SIII V8 (1983).
>>1. I find in the database of a petrol-station that the V8 engines runs =
>restored and expensive models, and that's what a fixed up Rover should =
=3D
>with
>>"normal" 91 octane fuel unleaded. Can anybody confirm this?
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 6 lines)]
>and 180000 km.
>>2. At the moment our baby takes around 20 litres of fuel per 100 km. =
=3D
>>This seems to
>>be much, because she doesn't grow any more. What experiences made =3D
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 7 lines)]
>use and 14/100km on long holliday trips.
>>3. I know there have been some discussion, but maybe somebody could =
=3D
>>give me a
>>summerize of how to reduce this extensive fuel-consuming (remember in =
=3D
>>Germany 1
>>litre fuel costs about 1$)
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 33 lines)]
>Hi again,
>You are probably right about the banter, although I have spoken to many =

>who would prefer to miss these animals altogether. It is just another
>case of enonomy coming before nature. I have often wondered what right =
we
>have at all to do the damage we do to this magnificent country. Despite =

>the size of this country, nearly all the different environments are
>exceptionally fragile. Even simple tyre marks can start a sequence of
>erosion that can be catastrophic. So it seems then, either on or off =
road
>we need to be aware that both the 'gore' or remnants of scrub we carry =
on
>our bull bars and roo bars, can have such consequences. For the time
>being, I might add, my landrover S3 is barless as I don't really get up =

>enough speed to harm any wildlife!!.
>Cheers, Chris.
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 6 lines)]
>On Tue, 27 Aug 1996, Adams, Bill wrote:
>> I can just imagine the truck-stop banter as to who rolls in with the =
most
>> gore dripping from the front of his rig.
>	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 10 lines)]
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 10 lines)]
> Input:  messages 47 lines 2028 [forwarded 260 whitespace 480]
> Output: lines 1418 [content 915  forwarded 97 (cut  163) whitespace =
419]
>Land Rover Owner Subscription Information:
>	* All new subscription requests are via the digest. *
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 7 lines)]
>In addition so subscribing and unsubscribing, the Frequently Asked
>Questions (FAQ) file and the last month of daily digests may be =
retrieved
>(by mail) from majordomo@Land-Rover.Team.Net
>Useful commands for this are 'index lro-digest' which returns a list of
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 11 lines)]
>If majordomo barfs at something, and you're convinced he should have
>understood what you sent him, contact =
majordomo-owner@Land-Rover.Team.Net
>  -B
>Useful commands for this are 'index lro-digest' which returns a list of
>files available, as well as 'get lro-digest <filename>', etc.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 22 Mar 1997 02:41:16 +0000
From: The Big Guy <guru@manhole.ow.nl>
Subject: Frame rot

Hello all,

I'm just finishing up a thorough spring cleaning on the frame of my 109 
and made a modification that may be of interest to some of you to prevent 
rotten outriggers. First of all I must say that I was lucky enough to 
have a military model as these are (a bit too ;-) ) thoroughly 
rustproofed from the factory so I didnt come accross any holes. What I 
did find was sand, and LOTS of it, both inside and outside the frame. I 
always thought that I was pretty thorough with washing it but was I ever 
wrong after I started poking my finger around in all the nooks and 
crannies ;-( . Anyway after "re-cleaning" the frame I stuck the hose from 
the rustproofing can into the outriggers and it only went in about an 
inch. When I pulled it out it was covered with sand. Anyway, when I was 
at the local LR garage I was telling the story of the hose only going in 
about an inch and the mechanic interrupted me and said "so, it was full 
of sand". Appearently this is a big problem with LR's (and I assume why 
outriggers rot off). So, what I did is take a 7/8" hole saw and drilled a 
hole on the inside (opposite the wheels) of each outrigger and then 
COMPLETELY rinsed out the outriggers and frame. This was a real bugger of 
a job because the drain holes kept plugging up but with a little 
perserverence I had clean water draining out of the frame after about 20 
minutes (20 min per outrigger ;-( ). With this completed I then let it 
dry out (a couple of days) and then sprayed in the rustproofing and 
closed it off with a rubber cap. With the cap in place I smeared it in 
really good with "tar" to prevent water/salt becoming trapped between the 
plug and metal. 

Now, each spring I can pull the caps and give it a good rinsing out and I 
assume that this will help keep me from ever having to replace my 
outriggers. One word of caution though, should you decide to do this to 
your vehicle, make sure you keep the hole as small as possible to prevent 
significantly weakening the outrigger, and make sure that the hole is 
"deburred" to prevent the hole being a starting point for a tear.

Hope this helps someone. 
Greetings,
Todd
  

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 20:21:17 -0500
From: David Cockey <dcockey@tir.com>
Subject: Re: CB40 or Series 1

> If you read "First Overland" (by Tim Slessor?) [the First Oxford & Cambridge
> London-Singapore journey], one of the many reasons they chose the new
> Land Rover was because it was notably bigger than a (Willy's) Jeep.
> So, the 80" Series I was was initially considered a long wheelbase.

Comparative dimensions (inches)
                  SI 80"    CJ2A
Length overall     132      123 (does not include taillamps, etc.)
Width overall       61       57
Wheelbase           80       80
Track               50       48

While the original SI was larger than the contemporary Jeep CJ in most
dimensions, the wheelbase was the same. Did the FO&CL-S party use 80s,
86s or 107s?

Regards,
David Cockey

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 20:28:28 -0500
From: David Cockey <dcockey@tir.com>
Subject: Re: glassfibre panels?

> >What is wrong with fibreglass? Flexes, and doesn't corrode.
> >Okay, its not aluminium, but it doesn't work-harden either.
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 6 lines)]
> a trip to the franchise for a new,highly priced panel.At least
> alloy just bends.

Be careful with the term "fiberglass/glassfibre". There are many other
glass/etc. reinforced polymers than glass/polyester resin. I've heard
that LR is investigating some very innovative structural concepts for
the Defender replacement. Presumably "plastic" panels would be more like
tupperware than a Reliant Robin for durability.

Regards,
David Cockey

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 17:46:25 -0800
From: Uncle Roger <sinasohn@crl.com>
Subject: Re: CB40 Finally Announced: URL's for Eletronic Telegraph

At 10:13 AM 3/21/97 +0000, you wrote:
>That's the problem,though Roger,isnt it?Land Rover doesnt make
>ordinary cars.That's not what its about.There are plenty of

I see it a little differently.  True, LR doesn't make ordinary cars.  If
they're going to make a car, it should be an extraordinary car.  They make
Land Rovers, Range Rovers (luxury version or LR) and now they also sell a
car.  But not an ordinary car.

>large degree it is hamstrung.Produce *one* model that isnt in
>line with,or falls short of,that reputation,and the whole house

Perhaps, but I've seen some amazing comebacks (Intel, for example, with the
pentium bug).  On the other hand, maybe it will flop, BMW will get pissed,
the ARC, LROA, OVLR, Etc. will rise up and collectively buy it back for a
song, and refocus on making the best 4x4 on the market...  (yeah, that'w
what we said about Atari, too...)

>assumes,poor off-road performance.And all that tacky plastic!Granted,

Of course, tacky plastic is nothing new -- look at the sIII.

>my assumptions may be wrong,I hope they are,but it doesnt look good

I try to be an optimist.  I hope you're wrong too!  8^)

>I blame BMW.Well,you do,dont you?:-)

Of course!  (But in reality, I think there's plenty of blame to go around!)

As an aside, Do you know why nobody sells light bulbs that never burn out
and razor blades that never need sharpening?  (No, it's not to protect the
light bulb joke industry!)  It's because if they did, they'd go out of
business because nobody would ever need more than one.  I think maybe LR got
caught by this -- LR's last so long, there's all these potential customers
still driving their old one instead of a new one!

P.S., I know there's a movement afoot to change syntax to put only one space
after a period, rather than two, (fight it! fight it!) but none?    8^)

--------------------------------------------------------------------- O-

Uncle Roger                       "There is pleasure pure in being mad
sinasohn@crl.com                             that none but madmen know."
Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates
San Francisco, California                  http://www.crl.com/~sinasohn/

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 17:49:07 -0800
From: twakeman@scruznet.com (TeriAnn Wakeman)
Subject: Re: Brick Wall

At  1:14 PM 3/21/97 -0800, Paul Gussack wrote:

>Went to back "Grendal" out of the driveway got 10 feet and my Rover stops like
>it's hit a brick wall.  I shift it into forward and pull up a little, shift it
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 11 lines)]
>Paul G
>SIII SWB "Grendal"

I think you broke something in you transmission, possibly the lay shaft.
The more you move it, the more expensive it could be.  When you towed it.
Was the rear drive shaft attached?  Was it in gear?  Was the transfer case
in neutral?

TeriAnn Wakeman            For personal mail, please start subject line
Santa Cruz California      with TW.  I belong to 4 high volume mail lists
twakeman@scruznet.com      and do not read a lot of threads..Thanks

Medium & large format photography, 1960 Land Rover 109,  1961 Triumph TR3A

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 21:36:34 -0800
From: Gene Spagnuolo <espagnuo@gte.net>
Subject: Range Rover Repair Manuals

I am a new owner of a 1988 Range Rover.  It is in need of several small
repair jobs.  I was wondering if anyone out there had any experience
with the repair manuals and had any ones which they found most useful. 
I'm considering the manual offered by Land Rover.  Is it worth the $140
(+supplements) or are there better options.
Thanks
Eugene Spagnuolo
Espagnuo@gte.net

------------------------------

From: CIrvin1258@aol.com
Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 22:13:03 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: Brick Wall

Same thing happened to my SII 109 Diesel, though I was on the road at the
time!

My problem, however, covered both reverse, AND first gears. I drained the
gearbox oil, and found one broken tooth each, off first gear, and second gear
(possibly the layshaft gears), and the remains of the second-speed laygear
retaining ring!

I haven't taken it apart yet (this happened a few months ago), but I am
"HOPING", that it's just the gears on my laygear, that shifted a bit, since
that retainer broke. Only other possibility, would be the loss of the
layshaft bearings.

Charles Irvin
1962 SIIa 109 3dr diesel
1958 SII 88 petrol

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 19:42:37 -0800
From: Michael Carradine <cs@crl.com>
Subject: Re: Range Rover Repair Manuals

At 09:36 PM 3/21/97 -0800, Gene Spagnuolo wrote:
:I am a new owner of a 1988 Range Rover.  It is in need of several small
:repair jobs.  I was wondering if anyone out there had any experience
:with the repair manuals and had any ones which they found most useful. 
:I'm considering the manual offered by Land Rover.  Is it worth the $140
:(+supplements) or are there better options.

 For the '88 and '89 you only need the first book, the second book
 has supplements for the later years.

 Join the RRO list for Range Rovers, etc.

 Regards,
                       ______
 Michael Carradine     [__[__\==                  72-88, 89-RR Land Rovers
 Architect             [________]               www.crl.com/~cs/rover.html
 510-988-0900 _______.._(o)__.(o)__..o^^ POBox 494, Walnut Creek, CA 94597

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 12:53:28 -0800
From: "Con P. Seitl" <seitl@ns.sympatico.ca>
Subject: Re: Brick Wall

CIrvin1258@aol.com wrote:
> Same thing happened to my SII 109 Diesel, though I was on the road at the
> time!
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 18 lines)]
> 1962 SIIa 109 3dr diesel
> 1958 SII 88 petrol

I also had the same symptoms, but the repair was quite different. I was 
on the move ( about 30 kph ) when I heard some grumbling and squealing,  
(just like a Pig eh?) and then the rear wheels locked up. I could 
get it to roll back and forth about 6 feet or so, but thats it, even 
after I dropped the prop shaft. Had to have it TOWED home! Very 
embarrasing. Turned out to be the diff bearings broke and fetched up on 
the crown. Popped in a new diff and end of story, back on the road again 
to go up and pay the towing bill with it. Had to save face you see!

Con Seitl
1973 III 88 "Pig"
1962 II  88 "Millie"

------------------------------

From: CIrvin1258@aol.com
Date: Sat, 22 Mar 1997 00:20:31 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: Brick Wall

I forgot to mention, that I got lucky: I was at a standstill when my gearbox
went. No noises, no nothing. The light turned green, I put it into first, and
it stalled! I re-started it, tried first again, and nothing. Second-fourth
are fine, but no first/reverse.

Odd.

Charles

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 Mar 1997 21:28:56 -0800 (PST)
From: scooper@scooper.seanet.com (John & Sandy Cooper)
Subject: 3 sightings and unimog

I was out and about the Puget Sound area today and spotted a red 88 with
canvas top, series 11 or 11a.  Also a green series 11a with hoops and no
canvas in the Ballard area, also an 88 swb.  Spotted a lightweight in north
Seattle heading west around 5:00 P.M.  Tonight I spotted an orange unimog
with no back section, only frame.
Keeping my eyes open (for a change)

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 22 Mar 1997 01:28:43 -0300
From: rover1@sky.net (Steve Paustian)
Subject: Kinetic Suspension-just a dream?

        I've been hoping we'd hear somthing more about this incredible set
up.  More to the point, when it might be imported to the US.  Has anyone
heard anything about what's going on down under with this?

Steve Paustian
Flatland Rover Society
D90 SW
Keeping the oily side down

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 22 Mar 97 00:20:00 est
From: "Lotus Mail Exchange" <Lotus_Mail_Exchange_at_BLEMAIL@blwn0009.bausch.com>
Subject: NON-DELIVERY of: Re: Brick Wall

I forgot to mention, that I got lucky: I was at a standstill when my
gearbox went. No noises, no nothing. The light turned green, I put it into
first, and it stalled! I re-started it, tried first again, and nothing.
Second-fourth are fine, but no first/reverse.

Odd.

Charles
FailureReason: MailEx0105: Unable to deliver message to cc:Mail.
IntendedRecipient: Land-Rover-Owner@playground.sun.com at Internet@CCMAIL

------------------------------

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