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The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest

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Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 07:35:42 -0500
From: Michel Bertrand <mbertran@interlinx.qc.ca>
Subject: Re: Military 109 Exhaust setup

At 09:00 97-02-20 GMT, you wrote:

>get at one of the gearbox mounts.
>The only thing is, mine is an SIII - might be different? (my exhaust has
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 9 lines)]
>a /\ in the front pipe that goes over the left gearbox mount)
>Richard (ex-Gurkha SIII 109 FFR)
I also have a setup for a Ser III and have that weird bend on top of the
gearbox mount. Thanks for your help.

Michel

Michel Bertrand
						______
Sherbrooke, Quebec, Canada, 		       /    __
					      /        \
1963 109 PU (Rudolph)	   		     | Lucas    |
1968 109 SW (in the works)		     |  Inside  |
1973 88 SW (21st century project)	      \        /
					       \______/

------------------------------

From: Deezilbob@aol.com
Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 07:41:23 -0500 (EST)
Subject: series wiring harness

you should be able to purchase a wiring harness for approximately $200.00
U.S. from British Wiring in Olympia Field. Il., ph. 708-481-9050. good luck

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 07:45:36 -0500
From: David Cockey <dcockey@tir.com>
Subject: Re: Military 109 Exhaust setup

> I am trying to install a new exhaust system on a 109 which has a
> military chassis. It has the military shackles. I have all the pipes for a
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 6 lines)]
> through a hole in the crossmember behind the gearbox. After that, it looks
> like it has to go straight to the back along the frame rail. 

I don't have a 109, much less a military one, but I'm very suprised that
the exhaust goes through a hole in the crossmember behind the gearbox.
This would be fundamentally different than the civilian models. I
thought the holes were for the rear PTO shaft when used. Has someone
confused the exhaust routing, possibly when fabricating a new exhaust?
Or am I confused?

Regards,
David Cockey (novice "old-timer)

------------------------------

From: Alan_Richer/CAM/Lotus@lotus.com
Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 07:11:12 -0400
Subject: Re: Shimmy

Welcome to the list!

First off, the shimmy you've got is most likely bad Railko bushes in the
swivel balls. They aren't trivial to fit, but not terribly expensive if the
swivels themselves are still good. You do have to take the front axle apart
to do so, though.

As far as taking it to bits and reassembling it, it's easy enough to do.
Here's what I plan on doing to my latest find:

Remove front end and rear body including seat base and floor (roof too, of
course).
Strip, repair and paint chassis
Rebuild axles with new seals and bearings
rebuild hydraulics with all-new lines
Overhaul drivetrain

And then comes the bodywork...

If it's running well and not making any odd noises, then simply replacing
the seals is more than viable.

If it's noisy or grindy, though, think about overhaul - bearings are
cheaper than transmission shafts.

                         Welcome! -ajr

------------------------------

From: Andy Woodward <azw@aber.ac.uk>
Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 13:58:29 +0000
Subject: Pure road tyres

Anyone know of any 100% road/0% offroad tread pattern tyres in 205R16 
radials? Something where the ribs run all the way round the 
circumference for maxmum tyre life like on proper truck tyres?

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 08:09:00 -0500
From: Michel Bertrand <mbertran@interlinx.qc.ca>
Subject: Re: Military 109 Exhaust setup

At 07:45 97-02-20 -0500, you wrote:

>I don't have a 109, much less a military one, but I'm very suprised that
>the exhaust goes through a hole in the crossmember behind the gearbox.
-This would be fundamentally different than the civilian models. I
>thought the holes were for the rear PTO shaft when used. Has someone
>confused the exhaust routing, possibly when fabricating a new exhaust?
-Or am I confused?
>Regards,
>confused the exhaust routing, possibly when fabricating a new exhaust?
-David Cockey (novice "old-timer)
>Regards,
-
On the military models, There is an extra hole in the crossmember behind the
gearbox, on the manifold side. It was designed to let a pipe go trhough. I
don't know if the exhaust routing is confused, but all the pipes that I have
are designed to fit a Land Rover and are from RN or ABP. In order to fit
properly, I would think that it needs another hole in the crossmember
between the rear crossmember and the gearbox crossmember. Richard might be
able to enlighten me on this.

Salutations, 

Michel Bertrand
						______
Sherbrooke, Quebec, Canada, 		       /    __
					      /        \
1963 109 PU (Rudolph)	   		     | Lucas    |
1968 109 SW (in the works)		     |  Inside  |
1973 88 SW (21st century project)	      \        /
					       \______/

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 10:15:41 -0500
From: Hank_Lapa@signalcorp.com (Hank Lapa)
Subject: To Dr. Ben Newman...

     If you would like, I'll try to find the name of the guy in Green Cove 
     Springs, (+/- 20 mi S of Jax) who rebuilt the brakes on a derelict 
     Series II 109 about 10 yrs ago for me, that is if you don't have 
     anyone closer.  (Ser I/II brakes are a good test of ability to "do it 
     right," esp the big II, where a perfect original system is marginal.)  
     He didn't adv himself as a L-R mech, but he could!!!  I will be away 
     from my terminal for about a week, but if interested, contact me 
     directly and I will respond.  
     
     Not taking sides or making judgements,
     Hank
     1960 Long SW
     1997 Short SW

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 07:28:20 -0800
From: rand@anv.net (Thomas Moore)
Subject: Re: The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest

UNSUBSRIBE-LIST

Thomas Moore

"And if you were my wife=8AI'd drink it."
                                                                Winston
Churchill.

------------------------------

From: Easton Trevor <Trevor_Easton@dofasco.ca>
Subject: BBList(The Birmabrite Brotherhood
Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 10:54:00 -0500

I just sent out copies of the latest Birmabright Brotherhood. If you
think you should have recieved a copy and didn't please email me. Please
note my address has changed to"trevor_easton@dofasco.ca". I think my old
address still works but this one will find me on any server within the
organisation.
Several member's mail gets bounced as no longer at this address so
please check your BBlisting (on your old list because of course you
won't have got the new one) and confirm for correct email address. This
time around if the mail bounces and I dont receive a
confirmation/correction  I'm deleting that member from the list.

Regards and  keep the faith
BB Trevor

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 11:05:00 -0500 (EST)
From: Dixon Kenner <dkenner@emr1.NRCan.gc.ca>
Subject: Re: BBList(The Birmabrite Brotherhood

On Thu, 20 Feb 1997, Easton Trevor wrote:

> I just sent out copies of the latest Birmabright Brotherhood. If you
> think you should have recieved a copy and didn't please email me. 

	For those wishing more information on the Birmabright 
        Brotherhood, it cna be found at 

	http://204.119.251.4/LR_FAQ/FAQ.5.clubs.bb.html

------------------------------

From: Alan_Richer/CAM/Lotus@lotus.com
Date: Wed, 19 Feb 1997 18:59:45 -0400
Subject: Re: Def-90 Battery to small?

Winch capacities and the like:

I'd be more suspicious of the cabling going to the winch and its
connections than I would of the battery. A 525CCA battery backed by a
running alternator should be able to push that winch.

Take a good look at the cabling and connections to the winch, especially
making sure that the winch isn't grounding only through the bumper bolts. A
properly set-up winch should have large cables linking it to the battery
and to the engine block/frame- the longer the cables the larger the
diameter, to make up for voltage drop at the high currents involved.

Most likely, you've either got a duff relay, crimp connector or an
undersize cable somewhere in the lot.

                              ajr

------------------------------

From: CAMARO380@aol.com
Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 11:32:05 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest

unsubscribe-list

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 11:02:35 -6
From: "Tom Rowe" <trowe@cdr.wisc.edu>
Subject: Re: Re.McMaster-Carr

A recent McMaster-Carr transaction. I ordered some SS fastners from 
them. I needed them before the weekend, I figured ship Tuesday from 
Chicago to Madison, WI would be no problem. Friday, no package. I 
called McMaster who has a UPS link and they told me the package was last 
seen in Indiana somewhere. :-( 
A call to UPS. UPS provided no help, they couldn't locate it. I could file a search 
request and should have an answer in 10 days. Hmmm, that wouldn't 
help much.
Back on the phone to McMaster-Carr to get more details on the 
location of the package but the dept was closed I needed to talk to 
(this is at about 5:15 or 5:30 Friday). I gave my sob story to 
someone else who transfered me to the order dept which was still 
open. They redid my oder and shipped it FedEx for Saturday delivery. 
At their expense.
A good company to deal with.

Tom Rowe
UW-Madison Center for Dairy Research    
Madison,WI, USA
608-265-6194, Fax:608-262-1578        
trowe@cdr.wisc.edu                

 Four wheel drive allows you to get
 stuck in places even more inaccessible.

------------------------------

From: "Kaplan, Richard" <KaplanR@CTEP.NCI.NIH.gov>
Subject: e-mail address update for Rick Kaplan
Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 11:51:07 -0500

Please note that, due to internal system changes, my only functional e-mail 
address (though why you might wish to send a message, I cannot imagine) 
will now be:

		rk61m@nih.gov

------------------------------

From: "Mark Gehlhausen" <Gehl@sphinx.crane.navy.mil>
Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 12:09:50 -500
Subject: Camera Repair Help

At the risk of being off the mark, the recent camera topic leaves me 
with one question. 
 
Adrian, TeriAnn, ....
Who can repair/adjust my old Honeywell Pentax 35mm camera?

Locally, I struck out.  Their solution, to buy a new camera, is not my 
solution.  Please respond to me directly.  Mark  

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 10:16:14 -0800
From: Jeremy Bartlett <bartlett@slip.net>
Subject: Re: Storing/Preserving a Rebuilt Engine

BRITPAC@aol.com wrote:
> I recommend Lucas assembly lube. This is a 70wt oil mixed with their
> stabilizer, and it will not run off during prolonged storage. Available at
> most larger parts stores or speed shops.snip

Thanks to one and all for the suggestions to date.  One follow up question:

I'm assuming there's no partial disassembly cleaning required after use of these
products.  Is this true?  Will such oils/stabilizers merely wash away after
start up with regular oil?  Or do I need to take it appart again and flush
the stuff out/off?

> ps: Looking forward to all comers! Of course, if it takes a few years, Hippo
> may need a freshening up to stay competetive.

Hmm... time to look at fitting that 2bbl Weber/Pierce,2.5 cam,10.5:1,header equipped
gas flow/ported,balanced, diesel cranked, overbored 2.25 into my topless 80" with  
a SIII tranny. :)

cheers,

Jeremy

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 14:53:08 -0500
From: "Benjamin G. Newman,MD" <medone@iag.net>
Subject: Rover Friends

Fellow Rover Fans

A few people have asked me about my 1967 109 NADA truck and what kind of brake 
problem I had. First of all, the VIN number is 34300129A. It is all original and nothing 
has been replaced except I took out the 6-cylinder engine and replaced it with a 
4-cylinder Turner rebuilt. The original color of this truck was tan and it is now 
limestone. It is my understanding, according to an article published in LRO that there 
were approximately 500 of these vehicles brought into the North American market.

Now, to the brakes: having no mechanical skills myself, I am told by others that the 
brake system in the 109 is one of the most difficult items to repair. The problem I was 
having in Florida was my brakes became very soft; a simple problem to remedy, I 
thought. I find out that my booster pump and master cylinder were not functioning 
well. I have had the master cylinder replaced twice and the booster pump for the 109 
(extremely difficult to get) but I finally managed to get one which did not operate 
well. The problem was we never could adjust the screw that would allow the hydraulic 
brake system to release when appropriate. Consequently, the brakes would become 
very hot and the pedal became very hard. Despite having some very capable people look 
at it, it could not be fixed well. That is the reason, basically for safety, that I decided 
to have it shipped to ECR. There is no need to go into what happened there, as it has 
been previously discussed, but nevertheless, I continue to have the same problem that 
I had in Florida.

My truck is now in the hands of a master craftsman in Connecticut who has authored 
many articles about Rovers in publications and, though a hobbyist himself, he takes 
great pride in doing detailed work. He presently owns four Rovers himself that were 
derelict vehicles and personally restored them from the frame up to mint condition, 
both mechanically and cosmetically. Obviously, I am concerned about the additional 
expense, but when it comes to brakes, one must think "safety first."

I want to thank all those who have supported me in this problem that I have had and I 
will keep you posted.

regards
benjamin g. newman

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 15:33:09 -0500 (EST)
From: cmw@tiac.net (Christopher Weinbeck)
Subject: Goodbye? -work & Q's

There's been a lot that I would like to comment on for the last few days,
but I'll keep it to a minimum.

I've had the benefit of having thoughtfull friends forwarding posts from the
real-time list when they seemed particularly interesting.  Thank you.  Now
I'm trying to wean myself back to merely one big daily dose of the list.

I was getting absolutely nowhere trying to deal with East Coast Rover Co. up
until I first posted a note to this list about my "registration problem".
For whatever reason that prompted an immediate "we'll take care of it" call.

When the months went by again, with nothing but excuses and promises being
provided it became clear that I had nothing to loose by explaining my
situation in detail.  It was my hope that by putting things out on the table
I might be taken seriously and have my questions answered -I had hopes that
there might be good, simple answers.

I was (and am) very appreciative of the many suggestions and messages of
support.  I was also very surprised to recieve phone calls from two
gentlemen with stories remarkably similar to mine.  It was nice to know it
wasn't just me -that I wasn't imagining that I was being treated poorly.

Now, unfortunately, it seems the answers will not be offered.

Mike Smith has opted to abandon the list in favor of providing some direct
answers.

Given the simple questions that have been posed this speaks volumes.

Describing dissatisfied customers as "whiners" -especially considering the
facts- was adding insult to injury.

I have not recieved the initial "bill" that was to precede my registration
documents in the mail.  It was supposed to have been "mailed...yesterday" as
of 2-11-97.

Nor have I recieved whatever documents Mike Smith said in a post here that
he would mail -paperwork that has been repeatedly offered to me and claimed
not to exist.

Enough of that.

-Good news,

Took out my rear and front floors, and even got a wing off by myself last
night (thank you mr. torch) -I've got to work on my door posts (front and
rear) and foot wells.  Any suggestions as to repairing VS replacing?

Also, RE POR-15 I'm trying this stuff out myself and I think I like it quite
a bit.  It is dangerous to spray and it's UV sensitive but it is some really
tough urethane!

Anyone have experience with Corroless??

Chris
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
 Christopher Weinbeck       Office Logic, Inc.      V (508) 392-0288
   _______                  7 Littleton Road        F (508) 692-0897   
  |__][_[_\__               Westford, MA 01886    Computerization for 
  |___\_|_]__]                                      the healthcare
    (o)    (o)  '69 109" RHD OD 2.6 Dormobile        professional      
 
               Ask me about East Coast Rover Co.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 11:53:12 -0500
From: "Bren & Lynne' Workman" <bworkman@alaska.net>
Subject: Series III gauges

Would anyone have any idea as to the correct, factory gauges in a
Series III?  I have the Oil Pressure SMITHS gauge in the left gauge hole
of three.  XK Unlimited has SMITHS gauges for a reasonable price but I
would like to install the correct ones.  I know I've asked this before
and I don't want to badger, but if anyone might know how to get this
information, I would appreciate your input, Bren Workman.
bworkman@alaska.net  '72 Ser III 88"  "Tilly"

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 12:03:45 -0500
From: "Bren & Lynne' Workman" <bworkman@alaska.net>
Subject: Contaminated Front Brakes

I have replaced the Rear Hub Seals and Races on my rear axle to stop
contaminating my rear brakes with 90 wt oil.  I need to do the same in
the front but, frankly, I am scared of that beast known as the Swivel
Pin Housing.  Is the process for replacing hub seals and races on the
front similar to doing the same on the rear?  I need to replace my front
brake shoes (poorly riveted linings), should I go to the bonded lining
type or order riveted type?
  Also, does anyone have any ideas on how to to remove a broken drain
plug fron a Swivel Pin Housing?  I broke the head off and now I'm
wondering what I'm going to do.  I have an assortment of broken bolt
extractors, the kind you use with a reversible drill, but none seem
small enough.  My fear is stripping the original threads out of the
housing.  Thanks for any help you can throw my way, Bren Workman.
> bworkman@alaska.net  '72 Ser III 88"  "Tilly"

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 16:26:13 -0500
From: "Adams, Bill" <badams@usia.gov>
Subject: Re: Rover Friends

Hey Dr. Ben, what happened to that old six? Bill McD. can sure use it !

Bill Adams
3D Artist/Animator
'66 Land Rover S2A 109 Diesel Station Wagon:
"Practicing the ancient oriental art of ren-ching"

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 05:29:55 -0800
From: con & greg <seitl@ns.sympatico.ca>
Subject: Re: Contaminated Front Brakes

Bren & Lynne' Workman wrote:
> I have replaced the Rear Hub Seals and Races on my rear axle to stop
> contaminating my rear brakes with 90 wt oil.  I need to do the same in
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 16 lines)]
> housing.  Thanks for any help you can throw my way, Bren Workman.
> > bworkman@alaska.net  '72 Ser III 88"  "Tilly"

Removing the drain-plug can be tricky at the least. I had one that came into the garage 
and the only thing I could do was drill and retap. This means removing alot of gear! On 
a note of your hub seals and races, make sure your axle vents are clean, clear and 
working! Most of the guys that show up here to get seals have a vent problem, not a seal 
problem. They put new seals in and because they are new, the oil starts to leak out the 
pinion seals. I'm new to this list,for about a week, and just had to write. I seen what 
goes on in here, so please guys, go easy on me !!!

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 15:47:11 -0500
From: Hank_Lapa@signalcorp.com (Hank Lapa)
Subject: Serious Request for Response (No L-R Content)

     All,
     
     Apologies (and thanks) in advance, but I *truly need* as many serious 
     responses to the below question as I can get.  This involves a serious 
     legal matter!!!  Please help.
     
     The word "acceptable" is closest in meaning to --
        a.  "perfect"
        b.  "excellent"
        c.  "good enough"
        d.  "bad"
     
     Again, I beg your forgiveness, but it *is* important!
     
     Regards,
     Hank
     1960 109 SW
     1997 Def 90 SW

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 16:39:51 -0500
From: "Adams, Bill" <badams@usia.gov>
Subject: Re: Serious Request for Response (No L-R Content)

"c"

Bill Adams
3D Artist/Animator
'66 Land Rover S2A 109 Diesel Station Wagon:
"Practicing the ancient oriental art of ren-ching"

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 05:43:28 -0800
From: con & greg <seitl@ns.sympatico.ca>
Subject: Re: Serious Request for Response (No L-R Content)

Hank Lapa wrote:
>      All,
>      Apologies (and thanks) in advance, but I *truly need* as many serious
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 20 lines)]
>      1960 109 SW
>      1997 Def 90 SW

       Giving a qualified opinion , I would say that " good enough " is closest, 
       not entirely correct. This would have to be clarified in the context of use.
       Its like throwing horse-shoes and hand grenades.
       

       Regards,  Con.....
       1973 88  Pig
       1962 88  Millie

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 16:48:43 -0500
From: "Adams, Bill" <badams@usia.gov>
Subject: Re: Contaminated Front Brakes

I think bonded linings are all that's out there these days. Riveting is a 
pain and noone does it much anymore. 
You do not have to disassemble the SPH just to install new shoes or a hub 
seal/race. 
The frozen drain plug means..guess what...noone has drained and filled 
the SPH in a very long time. It is your task to get this sucker out and 
refill the no doubt bone dry housings so that you can watch with glee as 
it immediately goops out the swivel ball seal.
Time for a rebuild!

Bill Adams
3D Artist/Animator
'66 Land Rover S2A 109 Diesel Station Wagon:
"Practicing the ancient oriental art of ren-ching"

------------------------------

From: "Ron Franklin" <oldhaven@mail.biddeford.com>
Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 17:12:48 -0500
Subject: Private Problems, Public Forum

All,

I have found the last few days on LRO pretty discouraging.  I feel like I 
have been used as an unwilling judge in a private matter between  a couple 
of list members who have had a commercial misunderstanding with another list 
member.  We are very quick to jump on those who use the list for commercial 
purposes, even if they are highly knowledgeable and helpful without 
commercial content in 90 precent of their contributions.  I feel we should 
all have to adhere the  same standard and keep private legal or retail 
disagreements off the list.   I have no voyeuristic 
need to get into others legal problems, and I do not intend to be an 
audience for someone to vent their spleen, justify their work, or sell 
bumpers.

I have had problems in the past with a LR retailer and did find a very brief 
post useful in finding others with a similar problem, but long drawn out 
descriptions of what my problems were had no place here as far as I was 
concerned. I have no way of knowing who is at fault in these sorts of 
things, since it is impossible to get an unbiased report from either party. 
None of this is really my business, and I am left saddened to see so many 
people who love LR's stop contributing useful information or even leave the 
list because it is just not worth the aggravation.

Please understand that I make no judgements here about who did what to whom 
and who is in the wrong.  People have been badly hurt financially and 
reputationally. I just don't want to see it discussed at length in this 
forum.  I guess the delete key will be my first line of defense, but if the 
list becomes a place to hurt each other, I'm leaving.

With sadness,
Ron Franklin

Bowdoin, Maine, USA

------------------------------

From: "T.F. Mills" <tomills@du.edu>
Subject: Land Rover Series IIA (fwd)
Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 15:28:49 -0700 (MST)

Please answer directly to DEMCOKARL@aol.com as well as the list:

#< I am thinking of purchasing a 1970 Land Rover Series 88IIA.  I live in
#< Minnesota and I am wondering if there is any chance that this vehicle could
#< be used as a daily driver.  The seller is asking $17,000.  The vehicle is
#< completely restored.  Is this in the right neighborhood?
#< Is there anything that I should know about the heaters in these things before 
#< I buy one in this climate?
 
#< I would apreciate any information that you can send to me.

#< Thank you, Karl email: demcokarl@aol.com

T. F. Mills
tomills@du.edu                               University of Denver Library
http://www.du.edu/~tomills                          Denver  CO 80208  USA

------------------------------

From: "Beckett, Ron" <rbeckett@nibupad.telstra.com.au>
Subject: RE: Serious Request for Response (No L-R Content)
Date: Fri, 21 Feb 97 09:17:00 EST

Hank,

"Acceptable" means, IMHO, "good enough"

According to the Australian Macquarie Dictionary (noting that
we speak what we laughingly describe as "English")
the definition of "acceptable " is:

1. capable or worthy of being accepted.
2. pleasing to the receiver; agreeable; welcome.

"Accept"
1. to take or receive (something offered); receive with approval or favour;
2. to admit and agree to; accede or assent to;
3. to take with formal acknowledgement of responsibility or consequences

there are other meanings for "accept" but they are not applicable in this 
situation.

In no way can it mean any of the others.

Best Regards,

Ron Beckett
Editor Hillman Owners Club Of Australia Newsletter "Hillmanews"

Emu Plains, Australia
'87 Range Rover 4.8L auto
'67 Hillman Gazelle
'71 Hillman Hunter Royal 660
 -  for pictures see  http://www.brigadoon.com/~craigb/hillman/hunter.html

 ----------
From: Hank_Lapa@signalcorp.com
Subject: Serious Request for Response (No L-R Content)
Date: Friday, 21 February 1997 7:47AM

     All,

     Apologies (and thanks) in advance, but I *truly need* as many serious
     responses to the below question as I can get.  This involves a serious

     legal matter!!!  Please help.

     The word "acceptable" is closest in meaning to --
        a.  "perfect"
        b.  "excellent"
        c.  "good enough"
        d.  "bad"

     Again, I beg your forgiveness, but it *is* important!

     Regards,
     Hank
     1960 109 SW
     1997 Def 90 SW

------------------------------

From: Sanna@aol.com
Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 18:02:51 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: Land Rover Series IIA (fwd)

>The seller is asking $17,000.

Wooa...  Way too high.  I bought my '70 IIa new for $3,600.  (I live in 
Madison, WI)

If it's the original heater, expect it to keep you toasty when the 
ambient is 65 or above.  I put a R-N Mansfield in many years ago for 
$600.  I understand the price has gone up.  Even though I tossed my hard 
top for canvas 20 years ago, the Mansfield will roast your knees at -30.  
It's a great truck (mine has 340,000 on the clock), but it'll be a tired 
Rover unless he's done more than the superficial.

Write if you have ?.

Anthony R. Sanna
SACO Foods, Inc.
6120 University Ave.
Middleton, WI  53562
1-800-373-7226

------------------------------

From: ericz@cloud9.net
Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 18:10:11 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Sighting...

Just flipping through the U.S. Cavalry catalog (neat, if you need to outfit a 
paramilitary organization or start your own country)  Page 26 features a "NATO 
Issue Camo Net".  Guess what's under it in the pic....that's right a Land Rover. 
 Not just any one either....a White 109" Regular with a Dormobile Roof....(guess 
the camo net isn't that good :)

Terri-Ann, you been hanging out in Waco again?  :)

Rgds,
_______________________________________________________________________
Eric Zipkin  Bedford, NY  USA  *  ericz@cloud9.net  * www.cloud9.net/~ericz
SIII 109" V8 Hardtop * SII 109" SW (since new) * '63 Triumph Spitfire
SIIA 88" (project car)  *  '67 Mini-Moke * '94 Car Trailer: "NOT FOR HIRE"
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

From: "Alan Logue" <logue@a011.aone.net.au>
Subject: Re: Serious Request for Response (No L-R Content)
Date: Fri, 21 Feb 1997 09:46:38 +1030

c
Logue and Associates
PO Box 689
Morphett Vale 
South Australia
Phone Aust (61) 08-83844443

----------
> From: Hank Lapa <Hank_Lapa@signalcorp.com>
> To: Land-Rover-Owner@playground.sun.com
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 11 lines)]
>      All,
>      Apologies (and thanks) in advance, but I *truly need* as many
serious 
>      responses to the below question as I can get.  This involves a
serious 
>      legal matter!!!  Please help.
>      The word "acceptable" is closest in meaning to --
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 14 lines)]
>      Hank
>      1960 109 SW
>      1997 Def 90 SW

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 18:24:30 -0500
From: Jeffrey A Berg <jeff@purpleshark.com>
Subject: Re: Serious Request for Response (No L-R Content)

>     The word "acceptable" is closest in meaning to --
>        a.  "perfect"
>        b.  "excellent"
>        c.  "good enough"
>        d.  "bad"

My trusty American Heritage Dictionary says:

ac*cept*a*ble adj.
1. Worthy of being accepted.
2. Adequate to satisfy a need, requirement, or standard; satisfactory.

So I must go with "c".

RoverOn!

JAB

Jeffrey A. Berg     Purple Shark Media        Rowayton, CT
                    jeff@purpleshark.com
                     ==================
	I believe in heavy thinking, I believe in heavy sound,
	I believe in heavy images, To hold it all down.
				--Chris Smither, Happier Blue

------------------------------

From: Alan_Richer/CAM/Lotus@lotus.com
Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 16:44:47 -0400
Subject: Re: Contaminated Front Brakes

Replacing the front seals and races is identical to doing it on the rear
axle - though I personally prop the stub up with a jack and a block of
woood to avoid stressing the bearings in the swivel as I whack the hell out
of....er, chisel split the distance piece.

The drain plug is no excessive biggie - drill it out and get on it with an
Ezy-out and it should come out.

Even if you do damage the threads, they're simply NPT (tapered pipe)
threads - the replacement drain plug and a tap to fix threads with are
available in a good hardware store.

Been a while since the plug's been out, has it? <grin>

                    ajr

------------------------------

From: Alan_Richer/CAM/Lotus@lotus.com
Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 16:49:46 -0400
Subject: Re: Serious Request for Response (No L-R Content)

Acceptable - depends on context, wouldn't you think?

For an LR, it's good enough. For medical equipment it's excellent or
better.

For anything mission-critical on any piece of gear I own, it's perfect.

          aj"Serious answer, best I can do."r

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 15:30:40 -0800
From: Jeremy Bartlett <bartlett@slip.net>
Subject: Re: Sighting...

ericz@cloud9.net wrote:

> Just flipping through the U.S. Cavalry catalog (neat, if you need to outfit a
> paramilitary organization or start your own country)  Page 26 features a "NATO
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 6 lines)]
>  Not just any one either....a White 109" Regular with a Dormobile Roof....(guess
> the camo net isn't that good :)

At this risk of blowing my own horn, I sent this in about a year ago to RN
and did actually manage to get a coffee cup out of it. :)
cheers,

Jeremy

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 Feb 1997 01:21:12 -0800
From: Adrian Redmond <channel6@post2.tele.dk>
Subject: Re: Serious Request for Response (No L-R Content)

Hank Lapa wrote:
>      All,
>      Apologies (and thanks) in advance, but I *truly need* as many serious
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 20 lines)]
>      1960 109 SW
>      1997 Def 90 SW
In my limited legal experience words like "acceptable" or "Reasonable"
often form the basis of a good tort! In Europe, such terms are usually
deemed as meaning "acceptable" in the context of the agreement, subject
to the judgment of the court - in other words, one must expect something
to be "acceptable" if an average lay-person would, given the
circumstances, accept the fact, terms or situation. As that is a matter
of argument and or interpretation, it will often be up to the judge or
the court to decide, on the basis of the presented facts and arguments
of both parties, what they deem reasonable or acceptable.

Such terms are open to wide interpretation - for instance - what is an
acceptable paint-finish for a 25 yr old series III - surely not the same
gloss and depth of laquer as a new BMW? There are good arguments for
both points of view, but the court would often decide on the basis of
simple human expectations - and how do most people view a land Rover -
as a sort of rugged, semi-agricultural vehicle, whose paint is covered
80% in mud most of the time.

Such terms can often lead to disagreement, but their discussion in court
can also often lead to a general sympathy towards the weaker part, which
is usually (though not always) the customer.

Without more details opf the context of your question, I cannot be more
specific - I hope this answer is "acceptable" - and whether that means
good enough or just perfect is for you to decide :-)

good luck, whatever the problem may be!
-- 
Adrian Redmond

---------------------------------------------------
CHANNEL 6 TELEVISION DENMARK       (Adrian Redmond)
Foerlevvej 6  Mesing  DK-8660  Skanderborg  Denmark
---------------------------------------------------
telephone (office)		    +45 86 57 22 66
telephone (home)		    +45 86 57 22 64
telefacsimile / data		    +45 76 57 24 46
mobile GSM (EFP unit)		    +45 40 74 75 64
mobile GSM (admin)		    +45 40 50 22 66
mobile NMT			    +45 30 86 75 66
e-mail			     channel6@post2.tele.dk
HoTMaiL (www.e-mail)	channel6denmark@hotmail.com
---------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 18:19:54 -0600 (CST)
From: Lorri Paustian <lorri@sound.net>
Subject: Re: Serious Request for Response (No L-R Content)

In my opinion, the correct answer is c.  "good enough".
At 03:47 PM 2/20/97 -0500, you wrote:
>     All,

	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 23 lines)]
>     1960 109 SW
>     1997 Def 90 SW
Lorri Paustian, Flatland Rover Society
Lenexa, Kansas
'95 Coniston Green D90 SW
'95 Arles Blue D90 SW

------------------------------

From: "Beckett, Ron" <rbeckett@nibupad.telstra.com.au>
Subject: I'm gonna unsubscribe
Date: Fri, 21 Feb 97 11:03:00 EST

unsubscribe rro

end

I'm unsubscribing (at least temporarily) from the lists but will continue to 
monitor the daily digests.

Direct email still available of course

Best Regards,

Ron Beckett
Editor Hillman Owners Club Of Australia Newsletter "Hillmanews"

Emu Plains, Australia
'87 Range Rover 4.8L auto
'67 Hillman Gazelle
'71 Hillman Hunter Royal 660
 -  for pictures see  http://www.brigadoon.com/~craigb/hillman/hunter.html

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 16:57:00 -0800
From: Michael Slade <Slade@imagina.com>
Subject: Re: Private Problems, Public Forum

Ron writes...

>I have had problems in the past with a LR retailer and did find a very brief
>post useful in finding others with a similar problem, but long drawn out
>descriptions of what my problems were had no place here as far as I was
>concerned.

As one who knows exactly what Ron is talking about, and who has had similar
experiences with the same LR retailer, I for one thought that it was not
only in my best interest to keep it off of the list, but to those of you
out there and also to the 'retailer' in question.

I thought that thrashing it out in public was needless, irrational, and a
good way to get no where.

I'm finding out that common sense isn't so common.

Till later,

Michael *ask me about RoverWorks* Slade
(bending over and grabbing ankles)

------------------------------

Subject: Freakin' Glow Plugs!
Date: Thu, 20 Feb 97 19:06:36 -0600
From: "Keith W. Cooper" <kwcooper@aristotle.net>

As I mentioned in my last e-mail, I have sold my recently acquired 
2.25L Diesel'65 Series IIA. 
Well, the buyer comes to pick it up day after tomorrow (Sat.) and he's 
driving about
500 miles to get it.

Well, like any good Land Rover, tonight it won't start!

I went out to crank her up just as a final test to make sure everything
is good for the buyer, and the light on the dash that normally indicates
that I'm warming things up with the glow plugs, won't light, and hence, I
assume that the glow plugs aren't doing their job, because it won't start.

There is fuel in the rover, as I just started it and drove it the other 
day.

The only thing I've done in the meantime, is change the engine oil and 
wash
him up a bit.  But I intentionally avioded spraying the engine with water 
during
the wash and even drove the rover around some to dry everything off.

My battery is new and is cranking the engine without difficulty, he just
won't crank up.  It is warm here today and so he shouldn't need alot of
glow-plug heating.

Help!!!  I need a quick fix to get these things working again!

Thanks in advance.
Keith W. Cooper

Keith W. Cooper,MD
 -----------------------------------------------------------------------
*            Dept. of Family and Community Medicine - UAMS              *
*           co-founder -   "Arkansas Land Rover Association"            *
*                          1996 Discovery SE                            *
*                                                                       *
*    Visit my page at - http://www.aristotle.net/~kwcooper/LRV.html     *
 -----------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

From: Hudson29@aol.com
Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 22:03:45 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Land Rover Names

Fellow Maniacs!
	OK, OK you guys convinced me, I gotta getta name for my Land Rover! Lets
see, my old Volvo 122S is "Olaf The Lazy", the Norton Commando is "Rolling
Thunder", the Triumph Bonneville is "Glorious" and my elderly Ford station
wagon is "The Ford".
	What should the Land Rover be called? How about "Sir Leaks A Lot" (It Leaks
Oil), or "Lightning" (70 HP, 3000 lbs), or maybe "Blitzen" because BMW bought
the company, or how about "The Aluminum Snail", or "Breezy" (It's drafty
inside that cabin) or "Boneshaker" ( 50 mph on the Santa Ana Fwy), or "George
The III's Revenge" or "The Marquis De Sade"?
	My best two names so far are "Old Thrasher" & "The Unstoppable." Come on you
guys help me out here!

Paul O'Neil
Fullerton, CA
Hudson29@aol.com

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 19:09:29 -0800
From: twakeman@scruznet.com (TeriAnn Wakeman)
Subject: Re: Sighting...

At  6:10 PM 2/20/97 -0500, ericz@cloud9.net wrote:
>Just flipping through the U.S. Cavalry catalog (neat, if you need to outfit a
>paramilitary organization or start your own country)  Page 26 features a "NATO
;Issue Camo Net".  Guess what's under it in the pic....that's right a Land
Rover.
; Not just any one either....a White 109" Regular with a Dormobile
Roof....(guess
>the camo net isn't that good :)
;
>Terri-Ann, you been hanging out in Waco again?  :)
;
Not me The GREEN Rover is staying very close to home.  I broke my sixth
rear axle last weekend on a 45ish degree damp forrest hill.  I'm on front
wheel drive untill the Salisbury and new set of military springs get
delivered and installed.

Since '78 I've broken 6 axles, but only two of them have been off road.

TeriAnn Wakeman            "Large format photographers look
Santa Cruz California       at the world upside down and
twakeman@scruznet.com       backwards"

------------------------------

From: "Mark Kocour" <mkocour@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Remove from lro
Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 15:39:09 -0600

unsubscribe lro mkocour@ix.netcom.com

------------------------------

From: "Mark Kocour" <mkocour@ix.netcom.com>
Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 21:36:56 -0600

unsubscribe rro mkocour@ix.netcom.com

------------------------------

Subject: Lists
From: robot1@juno.com (Mark E Hardig)
Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 23:03:03 EST

Maybe we should split the list into people who want to deal with ECRover
and those who don't.  8-)

Mark

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 17:13:43 -0500
From: "Bren & Lynne' Workman" <bworkman@alaska.net>
Subject: Re: Ser III parking lamp bulb

Bren & Lynne' Workman wrote:
> Would anyone know what the part number for my parking lamp bulb is?  I
> have a '72 Ser III 88" U.S. spec.  I have ordered the part by name from
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 15 lines)]
> for any help you that you can give me, Bren Workman.
> bworkman@alaska.net  '72 Ser III 88"  "Tilly"

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 23:53:14 -0300
From: rover1@sky.net (Steve Paustian)
Subject: Re: Serious Request for Response (No L-R Content)

>     All,
>     Apologies (and thanks) in advance, but I *truly need* as many serious
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 13 lines)]
>        c.  "good enough"
>        d.  "bad"

could I buy another vowel?

 c.  "good enough"

Steve Paustian
Flatland Rover Society
D90 SW
Keep the oily side down

------------------------------

From: "P Burgers" <PBURGERS@CPLS.WCAPE.GOV.ZA>
Date:          Fri, 21 Feb 1997 07:55:01 +0200
Subject:       MOT info needed.

Can any UK Landy owner furnish me with a detailed list of what is
checked for an MOT.

The Govt. are thinking of introducing the test here in S.A. and I am
curious to see _exactly_ what is tested for and what is checked.

Ta muchly.

Peter Burgers
SIII Chev. 4.1 gas guzzling conversion

------------------------------

From: Jim Pappas <roverhed@idt.net>
Subject: GPS
Date: Fri, 21 Feb 1997 01:19:25 -0500

I've had the Eagle Accutrail GPS unit for almost three years now - it's =
parallel processor usually acquires and locks within 60 seconds and is =
very robust in signal retention - only full canopies for sustained time =
will result in DR mode...

This unit was hideously priced at the time ($1000) from Dick Cepek but =
has a very large backlit display and window type interface. The plot =
function is outstanding in this model.

There are much newer units on the market now - but I can certainly =
recommend the Eagle. Also the Trimble line.

Cheers
Jim

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 Feb 1997 07:33:40 +0000
From: Mike Cattell <mike@mikecat.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: MOT info needed.

In article <bulk.6938.19970220215513@Land-Rover.Team.Net>,
P Burgers <PBURGERS@CPLS.WCAPE.GOV.ZA> writes
>Can any UK Landy owner furnish me with a detailed list of what is
>checked for an MOT.
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 13 lines)]
>Peter Burgers
>SIII Chev. 4.1 gas guzzling conversion

Here is a general list taken from a fail certificate, I seem to have a
lot of these!!! Hope it helps :)

LIGHTING EQUIPMENT
Front & rear lamps etc
Headlamps
Headlamp aim
Stop lamps
Rear reflectors
Direction Indicators & Hazzard lamps

STEERING AND SUSPENSION
Steering control
Steering mechanism/system
Power steering
Transmission shafts
Wheel bearings
Front suspension
Rear suspension
Shock absorbers
Wheel alligment

BRAKES
ABS warning system / controls
Condition of service brake system
Condition of parking brake system
Service brake performance
Parking brake performance
Additional braking devices

TYRES AND WHEELS
Tyre size/type
Tyre load/speed ratings
Tyre condition
Roadwheels

SEAT BELTS
Mountings
Condition
Operation

GENERAL
Drivers veiw of the road
Horn
Exhaust system
Exhaust emissions
General vehicle condition
Mirrors
Fuel system
Registration plates & VIN numbers
Speedo
Driving controls
Glazing

The big catch all is the innocent General vehicle condition bit. This
covers corrosion of load bearing members etc. The emmision
limits are also quite tough. If you have a diesil its even worse!! I
have known testing stations who have tuned cars to meet the
standards at test time only to retune them back again to enable
the owners to drive them away from the garage!!

 
Mike Cattell, Christleton, Cheshire, U.K.
http://www.mikecat.demon.co.uk/

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 Feb 1997 10:20:23 +0200
From: Marko Ylikorpi <mylikorp@bart.lpt.fi>
Subject: Glowplugs

Hi Iwan,

My SIIA is a petrol model, so I don't have personal experience with Rover
glowplugs.  But I do have experience with two Mercedes diesels.  In both the
plugs were changed after 300 000 km, not because they did not work, but only
just in case.  And here during the winter they are used a lot.  So Rover,
MB, or any other diesel, the glowplugs should not give you much trouble.  If
they do, I think it's an indication of problems somewhere else.

Cheers,

Marko
SIIA 88 -61

------------------------------

From: "Erik Hupje" <378219@sepa.tudelft.nl>
Date:          Fri, 21 Feb 1997 09:35:48 MET
Subject:       Unleaded in LR V8 ??

Hi everybody,

In a recent issue of Land Rover Owner International it was stated 
that a Land Rover V8 can run on unleaded petrol without replacing the 
original seats with hardened seats and such. There would only have 
to be a change in the timing; if running on super (octane 98) this wouldn't 
even be necessairy !?

My question is: in theory this can be true, but does someone have 
experience with this? And does this also hold for an older engine, 
i.e. a 1980 3.5L V8?

Regards,

Erik Hupje (378219@sepa.tudelft.nl)
Delft, The Netherlands
1980 109" Stage I V8 hardtop

------------------------------

From: bb@olivetti.dk (Bent Bohlers)
Subject: RE: Unleaded in LR V8 ??
Date: Fri, 21 Feb 1997 10:51:51 +-100

Erik Hupje[SMTP:378219@sepa.tudelft.nl] wrote:

In a recent issue of Land Rover Owner International it was stated 
that a Land Rover V8 can run on unleaded petrol without replacing the 
original seats with hardened seats and such. There would only have 
to be a change in the timing; if running on super (octane 98) this wouldn't 
even be necessairy !?

My question is: in theory this can be true, but does someone have 
experience with this? And does this also hold for an older engine, 
i.e. a 1980 3.5L V8?

I have a 110" V8 from 1983, motor prefix 13G, 
compression 8.13:1, it have been on unleaded 91 octane 
since I bought it in 1987. That means 180000 km, without 
problems with the valves.

98 octane is only nessesary if you have higher compression.

I hope this will only go out once.

Happy Rovering
Bent

_____________________________________

Bent Boehlers

Herlev, Denmark

e-mail: bb@olivetti.dk
URL: http://www.geocities.com/motorcity/3542

110" STW 12 seats, V8, 1983
 86" softtop, 2 litre, 1955

begin 600 WINMAIL.DAT

	[Attachment Removed, was 45 lines.]	end

------------------------------

From: marsden@digicon-egr.co.uk (Richard Marsden)
Subject: Re: Military 109 Exhaust setup
Date: Fri, 21 Feb 97 8:54:33 GMT

> >I'll have a look tonight. I currently have the front pipe out - in order to
> >get at one of the gearbox mounts.
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 8 lines)]
> I also have a setup for a Ser III and have that weird bend on top of the
> gearbox mount. Thanks for your help.

Well, had a look lastnight. My exhaust does go through a hole in the x-member
(I thought it did). The /\ I mentioned over the mount, is inline with a 
"bolt-on" crossmember that looks quite thin.

Th exhaust also has a /\ which is inline with the rear axle and bump stop.
The bump stop is below the exhaust at this point.
The exhaust-stop distance is less than the axle-stop distance. Didn't measure
it, or crawl underneath for a detailed examination as it was cold and windy,
and the ground was wet!

Hope this helps,

This chassis is believed original - the Army took delivery of the vehicle in
January 1973. The exhaust was fitted complete by Blanchards in East Yorkshire,
just before they sold it to me. They're military specialists.

Richard (ex-Gurkha SIII 109 FFR)

------------------------------

  END OF LAND ROVER OWNER DIGEST 
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