Land Rover Owner Message Digest Contents


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The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest

Send Submissions Land-Rover-Owner@Land-Rover.Team.Net

msgSender linesSubject
1 "Benjamin G. Newman,MD" 10Re: The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest
2 "johnsonm (wk)" [johnson21Re: brakes (double pump syndrome)
3 "Niel J. P. Fagan" [NF@o19 Re: SI Questions
4 lopezba@atnet.at 24Re: Steering relay
5 Easton Trevor [TEASTON@D20Comparative Heights
6 twakeman@scruznet.com (T28Series @ high altitude
7 "johnsonm (wk)" [johnson19Re: Steering relay
8 Ron Franklin [oldhaven@b56[not specified]
9 Dixon Kenner [dkenner@em11Re: Downeast photo...
10 bb@olivetti.dk (Bent Boh29RE: Chassis questions
11 rscholl@lib.com 12Vacation
12 lopezba@atnet.at 18Re: Bronze Green
13 Dixon Kenner [dkenner@em23Re: Chassis questions
14 "Bobeck, David R." [dbob12Mid Atlantique Where?
15 marsden@digicon-egr.co.u14Re: Mid Atlantique Where?
16 lopezba@atnet.at 40Re: Brake pumping + Chassis
17 Dixon Kenner [dkenner@em17Re: Mid Atlantique Where?
18 marsden@digicon-egr.co.u36Re: Brake pumping + Chassis
19 "johnsonm (wk)" [johnson15Re: Steering relay
20 Russell U Wilson [ruwst+15Re: Comparative Heights
21 QROVER80@aol.com 10Re: Mid Atlantique Where?
22 jimallen@onlinecol.com 66Series @ high altitude
23 William Caloccia [calocc18[not specified]
24 "Mr Ian Stuart" [Ian.Stu19Re: I need a new title....
25 QROVER80@aol.com 13Roav Directions
26 murraycm@bc.edu 21Free-Wheeling Hubs
27 M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk (Mik10Re: Downeast photo...
28 Dixon Kenner [dkenner@em10Re: I need a new title....
29 pwakefie@esis.esrin.esa.31A subject close to my heart
30 QROVER80@aol.com 11Re: Downeast photo...
31 jouster@rocket.com (John27Free-Wheel hub opinion
32 Harincar@mooregs.com (Ti41Insurance
33 Gregspitz@aol.com 7Re: I need a new title....
34 Jeremy Bartlett [bartlet14XCL Equivalents? - Son of Tire Thread
35 Jeremy Bartlett [bartlet40Erratic Speedometer Problem
36 jouster@rocket.com (John15beneath the planet of XCLs
37 doug.forehand@Eng.Sun.CO27Re: XCL Equivalents? - Son of Tire Thread
38 ASFCO@aol.com 12Re: I need a new title....
39 Jeremy Bartlett [bartlet18Re: XCL Equivalents? - Son of Tire Thread
40 Jeremy Bartlett [bartlet32Re: beneath the planet of XCLs
41 "S. Vels" [svels@mail-se16Re: XCL Equivalents? - Son of Tire Thread
42 Tom Spoto [tspoto@az.com22Re: Free-Wheeling Hubs
43 12/4/95 [rsloan@titan.li29T-boned
44 "David Lee" [DJFLee@msn.23RE: Hi-Lift Jack
45 "D.A.T. S.A." [jtge@guat11Jon R. Haskell "El Peten"
46 "D.A.T. S.A." [jtge@guat11Jon R. Haskell "El Peten"
47 landrvr@blacdisc.com (Mi19Re: Downeast photo...
48 landrvr@blacdisc.com (Mi19Re: I need a new title....
49 Deezilbob@aol.com 8Mid-AtlanticRally
50 "M. ABERCROMBIE" [maa08113Re: Downeast photo...
51 Allan Smith [smitha@cand18rubber grease
52 Jeremy J Bartlett [Bartl11XCL Input
53 faurecm@halcyon.com (C. 15Re: What oil in Rangie tranfer case?
54 "P Burgers" [PBURGERS@CP18 Re: brakes (double pump syndrome)
55 Glenn_Rees@PARLON2.CCMAI33Re: Questions for real specialist S I owners
56 "Jens Vesterdahl" [jve@p33Re: brakes
57 M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk (Mik11Re: Downeast photo...
58 M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk (Mik8Re: I need a new title....


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Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 07:32:16 -0500
From: "Benjamin G. Newman,MD" <medone@iag.net>
Subject: Re: The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest

Does anyone have experience with RENEWED TRADITIONS out of Atlanta 
Ga.,importer of refuburished and remanufactured Classic Series Land 
Rovers.If so would you please share it eith me.
Thanks,
Benjamin G. Newman

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Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 08:09:53 -0400
From: "johnsonm (wk)" <johnsonm@borg.com>
Subject: Re: brakes (double pump syndrome)

Geoffrey Said wrote:
> From a while ago I am feeling the brake pedal sloppy.  The landrover brakes but
> the pedal is depressing much more than it was before.  The strang thing is that
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 13 lines)]
> Geoffrey
> 109" Series 3 diesel.

Everyone has double pump syndrome from time to time.  Sounds like to me
you need to adjust the break shoe tentioners ( I think they're called
).  There is a half inch bolt head on the backside of the break back
plate. Tighten this up one notch at a time till you get the right feel.
-- 
Mike Johnson
74 SIII 88 (Chester)
73 SIII 88 (Jezabel)
http://www.borg.com/~johnsonm

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From: "Niel J. P. Fagan" <NF@orc.soton.ac.uk>
Date:          Thu, 3 Oct 1996 13:24:15 GMT
Subject:       Re: SI Questions

1. Black plastic dipped,

2. Without ref. to manual, will check tonight, a length of angle 
steel 50mmx50mmx600mm long ish, drilled with lots of holes for 
implements to be bolted on to, bolted to the rear cross member.
For normal towing make up a plate and bolt direct to the rear member 
with your hitch attached.

>.
Rgds Niel

Views expressed are personal and not those of the 
University, unless otherwise & expressly stated.

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Date: Thu, 3 Oct 1996 14:49:01 +0100
From: lopezba@atnet.at
Subject: Re: Steering relay

Franz from Rosenheim wrote:
-Hi folks,
-a nonnetted friend with a 1973 SIII 109 phoned me yesterday. He
-has great problems to get out his steering relais (this thing
-sticking in the front crossmember). The manual says pull it up,
-maybe with the help of a rubber hammer. He has tried even some 
-more brutal methods like a 3kg hammer and a jack, but it's still
-in place :-{  Anyone got an idea?
Normally rather unemotional Lindsay Porter says:
A well rusted in relay will be *a swine* to remove because of the 
accumulation of corrosion and dirt between relay body and chassis. 
Then he describes using a jack to push out the relay, but I guess your 
neighbour already did that. I guess this calls fro patience, brute force and 
lots of wd40!
Good luck

Peter Hirsch
SI 107in S/W
Vienna, Austria (officially 1,000 years old this November 1)

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From: Easton Trevor <TEASTON@DQC2.DOFASCO.CA>
Subject: Comparative Heights
Date: Thu, 03 Oct 96 09:16:00 DST

> >As for the name of the 14? year old,
> >     that can be supplied by either: Spencer, Eric Z., or Jeff Berg...
         [ truncated by lro-digester (was 10 lines)]
> notebook.
> And why am I the only one fully named?  I'm the innocent bystander...

14? Jeff, come on man.  Just because she is the same height as you does
NOT make it O.K.

Russ W.

But she was taller

Trevor E

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Date: Thu, 3 Oct 1996 06:17:17 -0700
From: twakeman@scruznet.com (TeriAnn Wakeman)
Subject: Series @ high altitude

This is a question for those of you series owners who have 2-1/4L petrol
engined series Land Rovers and frequently spend time driving hills above 6
thousand feet. And have Rochester carbs,

I live at sea level and set my distributer timing per the manual (3ish deg
BTDC).  I have a 48 main jet on the Rochester.

When I drive at high altitudes the car has a hard time idling and looses
about 3/4 of its abundant HP, This leaves me in first gear going up some
paved hills and makes getting stuck off roading much easier.

What do you do to adjust timing and the carb for high altitudes?  Bigger
jet? retard timing?

Is there a rule of thumb per thousand feet?  I drive between 0 and 8 or 9
thousand feet and would like to take a little less time looking at scenery
at the higher altitudes.

Experienced advice would be most welcome.

TeriAnn

twakeman@scruznet.com

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Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 09:19:56 -0400
From: "johnsonm (wk)" <johnsonm@borg.com>
Subject: Re: Steering relay

lopezba@atnet.at wrote:
> Franz from Rosenheim wrote:
> -Hi folks,
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 10 lines)]
> -more brutal methods like a 3kg hammer and a jack, but it's still
> -in place :-{  Anyone got an idea?

I just did the very operation, I used a crows foot and a wrench.  Then
applied a large amount of never-seize to it when I put it back on.
-- 
Mike Johnson
74 SIII 88 (Chester)
73 SIII 88 (Jezabel)
http://www.borg.com/~johnsonm

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Subject: Fwd: Re: Steering relay removal
Date: Thu, 03 Oct 96 09:38:31 -0500
From: Ron Franklin <oldhaven@biddeford.com>

-- [ From: Ron Franklin * EMC.Ver #2.5.02 ] --

Sorry for those of you who saw this in Jan but maybe it will help Franz P.
with his relay removal.

------- FORWARD, Original message follows -------

Date: Tuesday, 30-Jan-96 08:24 AM

From: Ron Franklin             \ Internet:    (oldhaven@biddeford.com) To:  
Land-Rover-Owner@uk.stratus.com \ Internet:    (land-rover-owner@uk.stratus.
com)

The steering on my old beast had about 15 degrees of play due to a
combination of worn out rod ends and wear in the splines of the relay and
both relay arms.  (Be sure to keep the pinch bolts on these arms tight or
the movement will ruin the splines).  The arms and rod ends were easy, but
the relay could have been welded in and no amount of hammering, penetrating
oil or heat caused even the slightest movement.  Even jacking the vehicle up
using the relay shaft so the weight of the front end  was on the relay
didn't work.  I finally had to remove the grill and radiator and build a
fixture involving bars on top of the frame drilled to take 3/4 inch threaded
rod.  The rods went down along the sides of the crossmember and connected to
another bar against the relay shaft, using spacer blocks as necessary.  by
tightening nuts on the bottom of the lower bar I was able to put enough
pressure on the relay to cause the top of the crossmember to start to
distort.  At that point I got out the hammer and managed to get the thing to
move about 1/32 of an inch, enough to make a beer seem in order.  From then
on it was a slow process of tighten, hammer, tighten, hammer, beer....going
on for about 3 hours.  When the relay had moved high enough to get it above
the top mounting flanges I was able top use a large drift and hammer to turn
it back and forth in its socket by banging on the bosses for the bolts.  It
finally came out, but fought up to the last 1/2 inch.  What had been holding
it was 29 years of rust which had expanded the diameter of the relay enough
to effectively make it an interference fit in its bore.  The new relay
dropped right in.
Have fun.

--
 
 Ron Franklin
Bowdoin, Maine, USA
 

------- FORWARD, End of original message -------

--
 
 Ron Franklin
Bowdoin, Maine, USA
 

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Date: Thu, 3 Oct 1996 09:44:11 -0400 (EDT)
From: Dixon Kenner <dkenner@emr1.NRCan.gc.ca>
Subject: Re: Downeast photo...

On Wed, 2 Oct 1996 ericz@cloud9.net wrote:

> Or how about Mike "PERKY!" L. ?

	Oh yeah, forgot about perky... :-)  Should also mention that there
	were a pair of them, the second turning 16 the next day...

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From: bb@olivetti.dk (Bent Bohlers)
Subject: RE: Chassis questions
Date: Thu, 3 Oct 1996 15:47:18 +-100
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Geoffrey Said[SMTP:Geoffrey.Said@magnet.mt] wrote:

Q:Do outriggers often get cut off and replaced?
A:Yes
Q:Is the last crossmember also prone to rust?
A:Yes
Q:When a chassis is beyond help and cannot be repaired?
A:It is possible to buy a complete new 
chassis, in black or galvanized

This is the most common problem in countries 
where the roads are covered with salt during 
the winter.

	Happy Rovering

Bent Boehlers
 110" 1983 V8, on its second set of outriggers 
and rear crossmember.

------ =_NextPart_000_01BBB142.2A1074A0

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Date: Thu, 03 Oct 96 09:53:58 EST
From: rscholl@lib.com
Subject: Vacation

     You haven't lost a new member, I am unsubscribing for a week while I 
     4-wheel through the woods of Maine.  Don't want mail returned to 
     bother you guys.  Nice chatting and see you 10/14.
     
     rfs
     rscholl@lib.com
     1970 SIIa 88" DD

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Date: Thu, 3 Oct 1996 15:57:10 +0100
From: lopezba@atnet.at
Subject: Re: Bronze Green

Ian Harper was concerned about Bronze Green.
I don't know whether this helps, but colour codes for Bronze Green are:
Herberts       0428
ICI            P030 2651
Needless to say the outside of your vehicle has been exposed to the elements 
and to ultraviolet light for some years, so the paint will have changed to 
some degree. If you want to paint only parts, have a panel computer analyzed 
and a batch of paint mixed to match. In most cases, the original paint will 
only be useable for a total respray.
Regards
Peter Hirsch
SI 107in S/W
Vienna, Austria (officially 1,000 years old this November 1)

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Date: Thu, 3 Oct 1996 10:01:55 -0400 (EDT)
From: Dixon Kenner <dkenner@emr1.NRCan.gc.ca>
Subject: Re: Chassis questions

On Thu, 3 Oct 1996, Geoffrey Said wrote:

> Do outriggers often get cut off and replaced?
>.
	Often?  No...  Get cut off and replaced?  Yes.

> Is the last crossmember also prone to rust?
>.
	Rear crossmember is usually toast up here...  Complicated design that
	catches all the water and salt.  Buy one with extensions (makes 
	it easier it install, stronger) and gon't bother with galvanised.

> When a chassis is beyond help and cannot be repaired?
>.
	You phone up England, RN ABP BP, etc. and buy a new one which
	is galvanised...

	Rgds,

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Date: Thu, 03 Oct 96 10:08:56 EST
From: "Bobeck, David R." <dbobeck@inetgate.ushmm.org>
Subject: Mid Atlantique  Where?

So, I hate to ask a REALLY stupid question...but,

does anybody have directions to the Mid Atlantic? I'm pretty sure I've got em in
last years newsletter, nut I want to make sure...
Tanks!

Dave b.

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From: marsden@digicon-egr.co.uk (Richard Marsden)
Subject: Re: Mid Atlantique  Where?
Date: Thu, 3 Oct 96 15:16:45 BST

> So, I hate to ask a REALLY stupid question...but,
> does anybody have directions to the Mid Atlantic?

Its sort of between Bermuda, Azores, and Ascension Is...

(sorry, someone had to say it)

Richard (ex-Gurkha SIII 109 FFR - but that would be stating the obvious)

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Date: Thu, 3 Oct 1996 15:57:54 +0100
From: lopezba@atnet.at
Subject: Re: Brake pumping + Chassis

Geoffrey Said said:
>From a while ago I am feeling the brake pedal sloppy.  The landrover brakes 
but 
>the pedal is depressing much more than it was before.  The strang thing is 
that 
>when the pedal is slightly depressed, released and then pressed again it feels 
>as it was normal i.e good brake feeling without the pedal going down too 
much.  
>I have also checked the brake oil level and is not decreasing.  At first I 
that 
>that a wheel cylinder must be leaking but if so the oil would decrease and I 
>dont think that after the first depress the pedal will get normal.

>Any suggestions on what the cause might be?

Geoffrey, sounds like somehow or other air got into your system. Try 
bleeding your brakes, that is simple and cheap, except if your bleed nipples 
are corroded to the wheel cylinders; they will probably shear then, and you 
will have to get a new cylinder. Should not be a problem in Malta, from what 
I understand. If you need any info on the bleeding process, let me know. 
I've had very good success with a contraption called Eezi-Bleed, btw, which 
allows you to bleed your brakes without an assistent, and also provides a 
steady stream of brake fluid through your system, which gets rid of stubborn 
airpockets. Less than ten gbp at Halfords, if that helps.

About the chassis:
Outriggers do get exchanged quite routinely. Rear crossmembers are prone to 
rust. If the chassis is beyond being saved, get a new one from the UK and do 
a frame-over. Not *too* complicated, and leaves you with a sense of 
accomplishment, very good knowledge of every component of your vehicle, a 
large collection of tools, skinned knuckles and empty pockets.
Good luck
Peter Hirsch
SI 107in S/W
Vienna, Austria (officially 1,000 years old this November 1)

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Date: Thu, 3 Oct 1996 10:31:52 -0400 (EDT)
From: Dixon Kenner <dkenner@emr1.NRCan.gc.ca>
Subject: Re: Mid Atlantique Where?

On Thu, 3 Oct 1996, Richard Marsden wrote:

> > So, I hate to ask a REALLY stupid question...but,
> > does anybody have directions to the Mid Atlantic?
> Its sort of between Bermuda, Azores, and Ascension Is...

	The annual rally of the Sargasso Sea Sea-Rover Club, or Float-
	Rover (the pontooned version of the special produced by 
	Supermarine and Messerschmidt with fore and aft pto drive 
	propellors)  Generally taking place somewhere off the coast of 
	Bermuda, within binocular range of the babes on the pink beaches.
	See anti-faq for details on the Sea-Rover.

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From: marsden@digicon-egr.co.uk (Richard Marsden)
Subject: Re: Brake pumping + Chassis
Date: Thu, 3 Oct 96 15:36:36 BST

> >From a while ago I am feeling the brake pedal sloppy.  The landrover brakes 
> but 
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 12 lines)]
> >that a wheel cylinder must be leaking but if so the oil would decrease and I 
> >dont think that after the first depress the pedal will get normal.
> >Any suggestions on what the cause might be?

> Geoffrey, sounds like somehow or other air got into your system. Try 
> bleeding your brakes, that is simple and cheap, except if your bleed nipples 
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 9 lines)]
> steady stream of brake fluid through your system, which gets rid of stubborn 
> airpockets. Less than ten gbp at Halfords, if that helps.

Yep, Eezibleed is well recommended. Make sure you get this - it has a bottle
and various bits of piping - and not something similar (I had a pipe
contraction with valve but it was next to useless - its now been cannibalised
to add to the Eezibleed!).

If you don't have air in the system, it could be mud in your brake drums.
ATM my brakes are similar to how you describe, but I've lost no fluid.
Also, it occurred quite suddenly whilst off-roading. A number of people have
told me that I've almost certainly got mud in the drums. If I have time
(moving house) I'll be replacing my hub seals this weekend, and will clean
my brakes and drums at the same time.

Seized nipples: Been there, done that. My rear ones still are, so I'm slowly
stocking up on rear brake bits, ready for re-doing them. Then the whole
brake system will be maintainable and bleedable on *my* terms!

Richard (ex-Gurkha SIII 109 FFR).

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Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 10:39:42 -0400
From: "johnsonm (wk)" <johnsonm@borg.com>
Subject: Re: Steering relay

johnsonm (wk) wrote with foot in mouth:

> I just did the very operation, I used a crows foot and a wrench.  Then
> applied a large amount of never-seize to it when I put it back on.
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 7 lines)]
> 73 SIII 88 (Jezabel)
> http://www.borg.com/~johnsonm

After reading I see you meant removing the relay itself,  I was refering
to the removal of the arms.  THUWEE get that foot out of here...

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Date: Thu, 3 Oct 1996 10:44:19 -0400 (EDT)
From: Russell U Wilson <ruwst+@pitt.edu>
Subject: Re: Comparative Heights

On Thu, 3 Oct 1996, Easton Trevor wrote:

> > >As for the name of the 14? year old,

	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 17 lines)]
> But she was taller
> Trevor E
I have a thing for tallish women myself but........

Russ W.

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From: QROVER80@aol.com
Date: Thu, 3 Oct 1996 10:51:42 -0400
Subject: Re: Mid Atlantique Where?

That must be one hell of a wading kit............
Do you want to go down with US?  Safety/spare parts in Numbers
Leaving Fri Aft/eve
Quintin Aspin

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From: jimallen@onlinecol.com
Date: 3 Oct 1996 08:24:48 MDT
Subject: Series @ high altitude

LA>This is a question for those of you series owners who have 2-1/4L petrol
LA>engined series Land Rovers and frequently spend time driving hills above 6
LA>thousand feet. And have Rochester carbs,

LA>I live at sea level and set my distributer timing per the manual (3ish deg
LA>BTDC).  I have a 48 main jet on the Rochester.

LA>When I drive at high altitudes the car has a hard time idling and looses
LA>about 3/4 of its abundant HP, This leaves me in first gear going up some
LA>paved hills and makes getting stuck off roading much easier.

LA>What do you do to adjust timing and the carb for high altitudes?  Bigger
LA>jet? retard timing?

LA>Is there a rule of thumb per thousand feet?  I drive between 0 and 8 or 9
LA>thousand feet and would like to take a little less time looking at scenery
LA>at the higher altitudes.

LA>Experienced advice would be most welcome.

LA>TeriAnn

LA>twakeman@scruznet.com

TeriAnn,

       Problems at altitude come with the territory. It's difficult to
have a vehicle set up for sea level and run good at altitude - or vice
versa. There are, however, some tuning tips. Step one is to advance your
ignition timing one degree for every 1500 feet of altitude. Next, when
you get up there, readjust your idle speed and mixture just as you would
at sea level. Bear in mind that the vehcile will run richer at higher
altitude. In case you don't know about the carb adjustment, first set
your idle speed where you like it (700rpm roughly) then screw the
mixture adjustment in (clockwise) until the engine starts to lean roll
(run rough). The turn the screw clockwise until it smooths out. If you
have a tach, play with the mixture until you get the highest idle rpm.
Lastly reset the idle speed a final time.
       If you don't mind frankness, the Rochester may not be your best
carb choice. Of course, there are several Rochesters and some are
better than others. The best one is the pre-66 model B with a manual
choke. These came on 235cid truck engines. The Throttle bore will be
approximately 1.5" in diameter (thats the diameter where the throttle
plate is at the botton of the carb - you'll need to remove it to
measure).The best "B" will also have a tall top cover(tall at the point
where the cover mates to the float bowl) and it should have a power
valve that look like a missile and not like a needle. You already have
the number 48 main jet.
       My opinion is that all the Rochesters are a bit too large for the
2.25 and this would make your altitude problemsworse. Going one or two
steps smaller on the main jet above 6000 feet should help - if you
don't mind swapping jets every time.
       I'd recommend the Zenith for all around use on a stock engine.
Properly set up, it's a great carb.
       As an aside, you lose approximately 40% of your power going to
10,000 feet. A good running 2.25 (high compression) makes 65hp on a
dyno. That leaves you with 39 to play with!
       Good luck!

Jim

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Subject: I need a new title....
Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 10:52:35 -0400
From: William Caloccia <caloccia@OpenMarket.com>

We're changing phones here at work, so we get new business cards, and
we get to put down the titles...

Any suggestions ?

    Cheers,
          Bill                 httP://www.Senie.com/billc/
                   caloccia@OpenMaRket.com
       http://www.Land-Rover.Team.Net/~majordom/lr/
   R  1  3  2wd  H		  D
   +--|--|   o   |             L  3	Land Rovers First
      2  4  4wd  L             |  2	    because
   '63 SIIa RHD 88"            H  1	Land Rovers Last
      793-PTA            '90 RR County

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From: "Mr Ian Stuart" <Ian.Stuart@ed.ac.uk>
Date: Thu, 3 Oct 1996 16:15:13 +0000
Subject: Re: I need a new title....

Quoting William Caloccia, from  3 Oct 96

> We're changing phones here at work, so we get new business cards, and we
> get to put down the titles...
> Any suggestions ?

Communications Facilitator ?

     ----** Ian Stuart (Computing Officer)        +44 31 650 6205
Royal (Dick) School of Veterinary Studies, Edinburgh University. 
 <http://www.vet.ed.ac.uk/> or <http://www.tardis.ed.ac.uk/~kiz/>

However strong my opinions are, they are mine and no-one elses.

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From: QROVER80@aol.com
Date: Thu, 3 Oct 1996 11:48:15 -0400
Subject: Roav Directions

To all those who need directions to the ROAV Rally
Translated from the ROAV..

Penlan farm is on County rd 671 approx two mi west of US rt 15 The turn is
about six mi south of the James River Bridge; look for the yellow and green
signs.  
Q note, It seems to be about 30 miles south of Charlottsville VA

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Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 11:58:10 +0000
From: murraycm@bc.edu
Subject: Free-Wheeling Hubs

Hello All!

I'm thinking about fitting some f.w. hubs on my '64 88.  I have heard that this
is: 

a)   more trouble than its worth 

      and

b)   a huge improvement.

any comments defending these statements?
part numbers?

thanks!!!
chris

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Date: Thu, 3 Oct 1996 16:51:19 +0000
From: M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk (Mike Rooth)
Subject: Re: Downeast photo...

  As for the name of the 14? year old,
>        that can be supplied by either: Spencer, Eric Z., or Jeff Berg...
>        :-)
14?....Big girl for her age..:-)
Mike Rooth

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Date: Thu, 3 Oct 1996 12:03:21 -0400 (EDT)
From: Dixon Kenner <dkenner@emr1.NRCan.gc.ca>
Subject: Re: I need a new title....

On Thu, 3 Oct 1996, William Caloccia wrote:

> Any suggestions ?

	"Majordomo"  :-)

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Date: Thu, 3 Oct 1996 18:17:48 +0200
From: pwakefie@esis.esrin.esa.it (Paul Wakefield - System Manager (SERCO) X492)
Subject: A subject close to my heart

Hi everyone,

(sorry about no LR content - please forgive this one time)

I am reading with interest the traffic light/cannot see them threads

> From: "Adams, Bill" <badams@usia.gov>
> Subject: re: Green=go, Red=stop (STOOOPP !!!), yellow=go faster!
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 10 lines)]
> Those friendly folks behind you will be quite happy to let you when the
> light changes with a happy toot of their horn.

Here (in Rome) if you do not move off the microsecond the light changes to green 
you will certainly receive a "happy toot of the horn" !!! if not from the entire 
line of vehicles behind !

This rule does not apply at night where if you actually show signs of stopping 
at a red light you will be roundly abused and overtaken (through the red light)

The rule here appears to be, when approaching traffic lights (especially if they 
have just changed to green) treat them like you would a "T" junction 
(or an unexploded bomb)

Regards, Paul.

PS, Do I hold the record for the furthest separation from their LR (~1400 miles)

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From: QROVER80@aol.com
Date: Thu, 3 Oct 1996 12:16:46 -0400
Subject: Re: Downeast photo...

>        :-)
14?....Big girl for her age..:-)
Mike Rooth
Thats exactly what Eric said :-)
Quintin

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Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 09:29:26 -0700
From: jouster@rocket.com (John Ousterhout)
Subject: Free-Wheel hub opinion

chris asks:
>I'm thinking about fitting some f.w. hubs on my '64 88.  I have heard that this
>is: 
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 6 lines)]
>      and
>b)   a huge improvement.

Chris, et al:
IMHO: hubs are nice to be able to unlock on long highway trips, gaining 
about 1-2mpg, slightly "quieter" (if that term even applies to series 
vehicles without an acoustikit), and slightly faster. I leave mine locked 
the rest of the time to insure lubrication of the swivel pins. Warn hubs 
were on the vehicle and have been trouble free for several hundred thousand 
miles. I have replaced the sph seals once, but have had to do absolutely no 
other work on them. (I had to replace the front and rear diffs immediately 
after the purchase due to rust on the ring gears where they were not 
immersed in oil from sitting for 5 years). Bottom line: if you don't drive 
much on the highway, keep it simple.

'64 109 diesel 5-door (Safari-SoGoodi) 465,000 miles on the few remaining 
original parts.
jouster@earth.rocket.com (John Ousterhout)

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From: Harincar@mooregs.com (Tim Harincar-MS)
Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 11:34:23 -0500
Subject: Insurance

Just something to add to the insurance conversation. My company is   
allstate, and they have my vehicle correctly listed as a '66 LR, not RR   
or something.

My policy states that it is for "recreational use only" which means that   
I don't use it to commute regularly and put less than 5K miles on it per   
year. I do drive it to work when its nice. I asked my agent if that meant   
I could *never* drive it to work, and he said, no not never, but it was   
kind of grey.

Re: appraisals. I asked my agent specifically about appraisal and   
"replacement value" policies. He told me that allstates position is that   
the policy *is* basically replacement value - i.e. they'd pay what the   
vehicle was worth on the market if they were to "total" it out, as long   
as I could prove it with receipts, photos, etc.

He cautioned me to avoid appraisal policies because they often don't   
reflect the actual value of the car. If you get your rover appraised for   
$7,500, then put a galvanized frame under it, and it gets wiped out   
before you get a new appraisal, your screwed. They'll pay the value on   
the policy PERIOD. No matter how much crying you do. So if you're into   
annual appraisals, than maybe that would work, or if in the case of OVLR   
and you ins. company accepts the clubs appraisals, you could have it done   
fairly often. But the cost of the policy is going to be reflected in the   
appraisal value.

I don't remember the exact cost of my policy, but I suppose it doesn't   
really matter since the cost is based more on where you live than how you   
drive.

Tim
 ---
tim harincar
harincar@mooregs.com
'66 IIa 88 SW  

------------------------------
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From: Gregspitz@aol.com
Date: Thu, 3 Oct 1996 14:19:41 -0400
Subject: Re: I need a new title....

Land Rover Liason.....L.R.L.

------------------------------
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Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 12:04:38 -0700
From: Jeremy Bartlett <bartlett@slip.net>
Subject: XCL Equivalents? - Son of Tire Thread

I must admit I've not really followed much of the tire
threads and now find myself asking a tire question.
Does anyone know of a currently produced tire available
in the US that is a close match to the Michelin XCL?
Doesn't Dunlop produce something?

cheers,

Jeremy

------------------------------
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Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 12:43:08 -0700
From: Jeremy Bartlett <bartlett@slip.net>
Subject: Erratic Speedometer Problem

One of the problems revealed on Mathilda's (109 SIIA SW) latest
test run is an erratic speedometer problem.  

I just replaced the speedo cable with a new unit which is routed
 as close as I can judgeto where the original cable ran.   I have
no idea if the speedometer was originally functioning or not since
it was non-op when I purchased the vehicle.

With the new cable installed the speedometer will now sometimes 
read what seems a reasonably accurate value (20 to 30 mph), but 
will occasionally fluctuate wildly, occasionally go all the way 
clockwise and peg on the reverse side of the 0mph pin ( .. honest
officer I was only doing 25 :) ).  Sometimes the unit will read
20 or so at a stop (yes the clutch is out and the prop. shafts are
there :) ).  I think the most erratic behavior is during
acceleration or deceleration, but I need to check this.

Given the new cable, which I'm pretty sure is correctly installed 
and engaged, I'm wondering what the problem might be.

I did rebuild the transmission and shimmed/torqued the output
following instructions, so I don't think (I hope) that the problem's
in the speedo-transmission worm gear area. 

Does anyone know if this is a characteristic of failed 
speedometers (my suspicion) or does the problem probably 
lie elsewhere?

I'll probably pull the speedo cable at the panel and drive
around a bit with it open to watch its behavior.  Hopefully, this
will isolate which component the problem lies in.

cheers,

Jeremy

------------------------------
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Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 12:58:56 -0700
From: jouster@rocket.com (John Ousterhout)
Subject: beneath the planet of XCLs

My local Michelin dealer says he can still get XC's from the warehouse in 
Reno. These are listed in his Off-Road Equipment catalog under roadgraders. 
16-inch is the SMALLEST size listed. They are not USDOT approved, but the 
tread pattern is the same as the XCL. $129 +tax, shipping, etc. Be warned, 
XCL's are very soft compound and wear out quickly on the road (So avoid 
roads?), and don't do as well in snow as others.

'64 109 diesel 5-door (Safari-SoGoodi) 465,000 miles on the few remaining 
original parts.
jouster@earth.rocket.com (John Ousterhout)

------------------------------
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Date: Thu, 3 Oct 1996 12:49:30 -0700
From: doug.forehand@Eng.Sun.COM (Douglas W. Forehand)
Subject: Re: XCL Equivalents? - Son of Tire Thread

> From bens@unix.off-road.com  Thu Oct  3 12:27:24 1996
> I must admit I've not really followed much of the tire
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 7 lines)]
> in the US that is a close match to the Michelin XCL?
> Doesn't Dunlop produce something?

If you're interested in the real thing, Greg at Safari Guard
has a couple of sets of XCLs. I even have a picture of Simba
with a set on. It seems Greg wanted to see how the Disco performed
on his test track with XCLs, so after he finished all the work on
my car he mounted up a set a drove it around his track. He
claims they worked great. Little or no wheel spin in the deep
dust. 

My preferance is for wider tires (265/75R16 Mud Terrains) since 
rock crawling is the most likely senario where I'll be needing 
traction.

Road noise is also an issue with the XCL's; worse than the
Mud Terrains I'm told.

-Doug

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From: ASFCO@aol.com
Date: Thu, 3 Oct 1996 15:51:36 -0400
Subject: Re: I need a new title....

In a message dated 96-10-03 12:07:06 EDT, you write:

>On Thu, 3 Oct 1996, William Caloccia wrote:

 Playground  Manager/ Supervisor
 P.M.S.

------------------------------
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Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 13:32:50 -0700
From: Jeremy Bartlett <bartlett@slip.net>
Subject: Re: XCL Equivalents? - Son of Tire Thread

Douglas W. Forehand wrote:
snip
> Road noise is also an issue with the XCL's; worse than the
> Mud Terrains I'm told.
> -Doug

Thanks for the info.  Since I wouldn't be using such for street tires
(that's what the 60,000 Mud Terrains are for :) ) noise wouldn't be an
issue.

cheers,

Jeremy

------------------------------
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Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 13:42:17 -0700
From: Jeremy Bartlett <bartlett@slip.net>
Subject: Re: beneath the planet of XCLs

John Ousterhout wrote:
> My local Michelin dealer says he can still get XC's from the warehouse in
> Reno. These are listed in his Off-Road Equipment catalog under roadgraders.
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 8 lines)]
> XCL's are very soft compound and wear out quickly on the road (So avoid
> roads?), and don't do as well in snow as others.

Interesting.  The Michelin dealers I contacted said it was unavailable and hadn't
been made in the last 7 years - probably true as far as "street tires" go.  Of
course, most dealers know diddly about their products.  For example:
"No the XCL isn't available, we do have the LTX which is a good substitute"...
What's the tread pattern?
"Uh.."
How aggressive is it? ...
"Pretty good... it's a nice quiet All Terrain tire"...
Um.. I currently run Mud Terrains and was looking for something more aggressive.
"More aggressive than Mud Terrains?!"...
Well thanks...

Not to far from all the BFG dealers who told me there was no such thing as the Trac-Edge.

I wonder what issues there might be in the sale of non DOT tires to non-commercial 
customers.  Maybe I'll look into this and post if I discover anything.

cheers,

Jeremy

------------------------------
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From: "S. Vels" <svels@mail-server.dk-online.dk>
Date: Thu, 3 Oct 1996 22:43:00 +0001
Subject: Re: XCL Equivalents? - Son of Tire Thread

> Date:          Thu, 03 Oct 1996 12:04:38 -0700
> From:          Jeremy Bartlett <bartlett@slip.net>

> Does anyone know of a currently produced tire available
> in the US that is a close match to the Michelin XCL?

Check the pattern on the Goodyear G42. Similar but bidirectional.

rgds
sv

------------------------------
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Date: Thu, 3 Oct 1996 14:25:43 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Spoto <tspoto@az.com>
Subject: Re: Free-Wheeling Hubs

On this multiple choice I pick b) a huge improvement

my $.02

Tom Spoto

2 x 72 '88's'  Warn Hubs on both
1 x 67 '88'    AVM Hubs

On Thu, 3 Oct 1996 murraycm@bc.edu wrote:

> To change subscription write to: M  ajordomo@Land-Rover.Team.Net
> Hello All!
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 27 lines)]
> part numbers?
> thanks!!!
> chris

------------------------------
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Date: Thu, 3 Oct 1996 17:22:07 -0400 (EDT)
From: 12/4/95 <rsloan@titan.liunet.edu>
Subject: T-boned

I tested my red light viewing technique and, well, with some adjustment, 
the light is reflected in the hood, but I thought of something even better.  
Use of a small plastic mirror is much easier to find the appropriate angle 
with, otherwise you've got to contort and adjust your seat, almost so it's 
quite pointless and far easier just to stoop and look under, unless 
you're a swami and used to contorting.

I happen to agree with you Bill.  A healthy pause before negotiating your 
forward move is an excellant suggestion.  Many people around me also feel 
that a red light, or light ready to turn red are not mandatory stops but 
are quite inconvenient and are at their discretion.  I've driven through 
red lights but only after being stopped at them and when it's very late at 
night.  There is one particular light at the entrance to my development 
that will not change.  I've sat there for five minutes once without a 
soul in sight except for the cop across the street.  Eventually, after 
the series of changes went through and I got skipped he was nice 
enough to wave me through.  Must have been an LRO.  

Running a red light is assinine.  I enjoy watching figure 
eight racing but would never participate in it, and that's what running 
red lights is like.

Rich
D90

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Date: Wed, 2 Oct 96 23:07:24 UT
From: "David Lee" <DJFLee@msn.com>
Subject: RE: Hi-Lift Jack

Andy Woodward writes:

>This is a perfectly normal US-UK real world exchange rate. In general 
>you takee the US price. Change the dollar sign to a pund sign and 
>that's teh UK price. If there is a discrepancy, the UK price will be 
>even more expensive >:-[

You are right mate! although I thought an exchange rate was where you take a 
sum in one currency and convert it to the same value in another. Not in the 
real world though.
I was in the US last spring and compared prices on a Gran Cherokee Limited 
(just idle curiosity I assure you!) 30,000 dollars against 30,000 pounds in 
the UK, and people over here keep going on about what good value it is! :-{

Dave Lee
SIII 109 Safari (1500 pounds and proud of it)
Triumph TR2
Kinloss, Scotland

------------------------------
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From: "D.A.T. S.A." <jtge@guate.net>
Subject: Jon R. Haskell "El Peten"
Date: Thu, 3 Oct 1996 16:23:22 -0600
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64

IAA=

------ =_NextPart_000_01BBB147.620AF420

------------------------------
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From: "D.A.T. S.A." <jtge@guate.net>
Subject: Jon R. Haskell "El Peten"
Date: Thu, 3 Oct 1996 16:16:16 -0600
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64

IAA=

------ =_NextPart_000_01BBB147.5DD2A1A0

------------------------------
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Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 19:23:40 -0400
From: landrvr@blacdisc.com (Mike Loiodice)
Subject: Re: Downeast photo...

Yer gettin things mixed up a bit, mate.

>> Or how about Mike "PERKY!" L. ?
>	Oh yeah, forgot about perky... :-)  Should also mention that there
>	were a pair of them, the second turning 16 the next day...

Perky was at Stowe. 

The young babettes ("Does anyone else want to be jacked up?" - she said
that, hosest!) were in Maine. You really got to ask Zipkin, Berg, Spenny or
even Dixon about them - although Dixon was blotto through most of it. 

Cheers
Mike

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Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 19:23:38 -0400
From: landrvr@blacdisc.com (Mike Loiodice)
Subject: Re: I need a new title....

Bill Caloccia sez...

>We're changing phones here at work, so we get new business cards, and
>we get to put down the titles...
>Any suggestions ?

William Caloccia, BGSTM

(the Big Guy who Snores Too Much)

Heh,heh,heh..

Cheers
Mike

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From: Deezilbob@aol.com
Date: Thu, 3 Oct 1996 21:35:50 -0400
Subject: Mid-AtlanticRally

heading out to the mid-atlantic rally tonight, hope that everyone who attends
will enjoy themselves and arrives safely, see y'all there....d.b.

------------------------------
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Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 22:04:05 -0400 (EDT)
From: "M. ABERCROMBIE" <maa0818@ritvax.isc.rit.edu>
Subject: Re: Downeast photo...

At 07:23 PM 10/3/96 -0400, you wrote:
>Yer gettin things mixed up a bit, mate.

	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 18 lines)]
>even Dixon about them - although Dixon was blotto through most of it. 
>Cheers
>Mike
Was this photo that has been talked about so much taken in Owles Head?

------------------------------
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Date: Thu, 3 Oct 1996 22:21:06 -0500
From: Allan Smith <smitha@candw.lc>
Subject: rubber grease

Hi all - sorry, but this clutch stuff just won't go away. When filling a slave 
cylinder dust cover with a *suitable rubber grease*, what is an appropriate 
product that NAPA would know about?
TIA
Allan

  
Allan Smith
Caribbean Natural Resources Institute
Vieux Fort
St. Lucia, West Indies.
Tel +(758) 454 6060
Fax +(758) 454 5188

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Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 22:11:18 -0700
From: Jeremy J Bartlett <Bartlett@slip.net>
Subject: XCL Input

Thanks to one and all for the input so far.  I'll be following up
on all the useful hints.

cheers,

Jeremy

------------------------------
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Date: Thu, 3 Oct 1996 22:47:18 -0700
From: faurecm@halcyon.com (C. Marin Faure)
Subject: Re: What oil in Rangie tranfer case?

The lubricant used in the transfer case of my 1991 Range Rover Vogue SE
equipped with the automatic transmission is Dexron IID automatic
transmission fluid, the same fluid that is used in the transmission.
According to the chart in my Range Rover factory service manual, the LT230
transfer case uses EP 80 or EP 90 gear oil.  The Borg Warner transfer case
uses Dexron IID.

Marin Faure
  1973 LR Series III 88
  1991 RR Vogue SE

------------------------------
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From: "P Burgers" <PBURGERS@CPLS.WCAPE.GOV.ZA>
Date:          Fri, 4 Oct 1996 08:04:30 +0200
Subject:       Re: brakes (double pump syndrome)

> Everyone has double pump syndrome from time to time.  Sounds like
to me
> you need to adjust the break shoe tentioners ( I think they're called
> ).  There is a half inch bolt head on the backside of the break back
> plate. Tighten this up one notch at a time till you get the right feel.

Have you checked that the master cylinder plunger & seals are ok?
Corrosion in the master cylinder, particularly in the single
cylinder Centre valve type can lead to this as well

Peter B.
SIII Chev 4.1 conversion>

------------------------------
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From: Glenn_Rees@PARLON2.CCMAIL.CompuServe.COM
Date: 04 Oct 96 01:41:01 EDT
Subject: Re: Questions for real specialist S I owners

        Peter
        1/The door handles were not coated, they were galvanised (long      
        since worn off)

        2/The bracket is like 2 pieces of angle iron about 450mm long       
        welded together to form an S shape, it bolts to the 3 tapped holes  
        under the rear crossmember. The flat section sticking out the back  
        has a row of holes along the rear edge (about 8 x 13mm)
                
                |     |<---crossmember
                |__|__| 
                 --|---|
                       |<------bracket
                       |
                       ---"-   <----plate with holes

                I hope that makes sense

        Cheers

        Glenn
> Subject: Questions for real specialist S I owners
> Author:  INTERNET:lopezba@atnet.at at CSERVE

	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 23 lines)]
> SI 107in S/W
> Vienna, Austria (officially 1,000 years old this November 1)

------------------------------
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Date: Fri, 04 Oct 96 09:30:03 
From: "Jens Vesterdahl" <jve@phaseone.dk>
Subject: Re: brakes

Hi all.

Geoffrey wrote:

- From a while ago I am feeling the brake pedal sloppy. The landrover brakes but 
- the pedal is depressing much more than it was before.  The strang thing is
- that when the pedal is slightly depressed, released and then pressed again it
- feels as it was normal i.e good brake feeling without the pedal going down too
- much. I have also checked the brake oil level and is not decreasing.  
- At first I that that a wheel cylinder must be leaking but if so the oil would
- decrease and I dont think that after the first depress the pedal will get
- normal.

- Any suggestions on what the cause might be?

Yeah - it sound like the brakes need adjustment. I have the same symptom on my 
109 and I'm getting myself together to adjust them.
When I had the brakes renewed in a garage a few months back, the local LR guru 
there had had the same experience. He vented the brakes over and over again 
without effect, but when he adjusted the brakes they became as good as new.

Lift up the wheels, tighten the adjusters until the brake works and then loosen 
the adjusters two clicks.

Happy Rovering

Jens Vesterdahl
1972 109 STW

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Date: Fri, 4 Oct 1996 09:57:52 +0000
From: M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk (Mike Rooth)
Subject: Re: Downeast photo...

>Was this photo that has been talked about so much taken in Owles Head?
It was indeed...and she was surrounded by the most lecherous looking
bunch its ever been my priviledge to see.And that bloke at the back
with the pipe was *the* worst:-)

Mike Rooth

------------------------------
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Date: Fri, 4 Oct 1996 11:12:24 +0000
From: M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk (Mike Rooth)
Subject: Re: I need a new title....

All Terrain Executive? (ATE)

Mike Rooth

------------------------------
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  END OF LAND ROVER OWNER DIGEST 
 Input:  messages 58 lines 2819 [forwarded 211 whitespace 540]
 Output: lines 1547 [content 874  forwarded 115 (cut  96) whitespace 491]

Land Rover Owner Subscription Information:

	* All new subscription requests are via the digest. *

In addition so subscribing and unsubscribing, the Frequently Asked
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(by mail) from majordomo@Land-Rover.Team.Net

Useful commands for this are 'index lro-digest' which returns a list of
files available, as well as 'get lro-digest <filename>', etc.

World Wide Web Sites start at
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