Land Rover Owner Message Digest Contents


[ First Message Last | Table of Contents | <- Digest -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest

Send Submissions Land-Rover-Owner@Land-Rover.Team.Net

msgSender linesSubject
1 Nathan Dunsmore [dunsmo116109 5 door hoop set?
2 mfarrall@well.ox.ac.uk (20Leaking swivelpin housing
3 Dixon Kenner [dkenner@em29Calling Discovery Owners (fwd)
4 rhodesia@juno.com (Chris22Fourth of July
5 jjbpears@ix.netcom.com (19Re: Leaking swivelpin housing
6 jjbpears@ix.netcom.com (45Re: Turner Engines, how do they do it?
7 Dixon Kenner [dkenner@em75Re: Turner Engines, how do they do it?
8 JDolan2109@aol.com 21National Rally...
9 "David J. Mercer" [merki30RE: How to find trails that lead to lake side camping sites in California?
10 jjbpears@ix.netcom.com (42Re: Turner Engines, how do they do it?
11 IIIDmentia@gnn.com (WILL26Nat Rally in middle is a joke
12 Russell U Wilson [ruwst+36Re: Nat Rally in middle is a joke
13 Dixon Kenner [dkenner@em47Re: Nat Rally in middle is a joke
14 Benjamin Allan Smith [be27[not specified]
15 "Darrell D. Murray" [rdg22National Rally/Federal Parks and Lands
16 Michael Carradine [cs@cr29LR Olympics (was: Nat Rally in middle is a joke)
17 Dixon Kenner [dkenner@em22Re: Nat Rally in middle is a joke
18 harincar@internet.mdms.c18Re: Turner Engines, how do they do it?
19 harincar@internet.mdms.c51Re: Nat Rally in middle is a joke
20 Benjamin Allan Smith [be21[not specified]
21 Dixon Kenner [dkenner@em22Re: Nat Rally in middle is a joke
22 David Place [dplace@SIRN10Re: National Ralley
23 David Place [dplace@SIRN8re: national rally
24 Rob Dennis [73363.427@Co32Rebuilding Trans
25 Gordon Rea [grea@net.gov24Re: Compression test question!!
26 twakeman@scruznet.com (T26Getting excited about Billing '96
27 Mage [mage@cia.com> 20Re: Turner Engines, how do they do it?
28 "Jens Vesterdahl" [jve@p21Who makes these tires?
29 Bill Anchors [ganchors@B105Nashville LR dealership, receiver winch mounts & lights


------------------------------ [ Message 1 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

Date: Thu, 04 Jul 1996 08:41:19 -0400
From: Nathan Dunsmore <dunsmo19@us.net>
Subject: 109 5 door hoop set?

Hi all,

Just a question, my wife asked me if 5 door 109's can be fitted with hoop
set and canvas top. 
Don't ask why she asked, it may ruin the karma :-)> (<- note the goutee'). 

Thanks
Nate Dunsmore
Rocking Horse Farm
Boring, MD 21020
dunsmo19@us.net

------------------------------
[ <- Message 2 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

Date: Thu, 4 Jul 1996 14:11:29 +0100
From: mfarrall@well.ox.ac.uk (Martin Farrall)
Subject: Leaking swivelpin housing

Our nearly 3 year old, 50K mile Disco TDi, started to leak from the big
inboard oil seal in the swivel-pin housing a few months back.  It is a
minor hassle to check the level and requires only occasional top ups.
Of course, it makes a bit of a mess (which complements the minor leaks
from just about every seal and gasket) but no oil is getting anywhere
near the brakes so I'm putting up with it.  I plan to replace it when
the hub needs stripping down for bearings or whatever to be replaced as
from the manual, it strikes me as a lot of fiddle for a stupid and I
presume fairly harmless leak.  It has been suggested by my farming
chums that I should shove a heavier (?EP120) oil in to slow the leak.
Any comments on my conservative approach would be appreciated.

TIA.

Martin Farrall

------------------------------
[ <- Message 3 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

Date: Thu, 4 Jul 1996 10:10:19 -0400 (EDT)
From: Dixon Kenner <dkenner@emr1.NRCan.gc.ca>
Subject: Calling Discovery Owners (fwd)

	Why let the Brits have all the fun.  I am sure that our friends
	south of the border (the non-Pink bit on maps of North America)
	would be delighted to fill LRO's mailbox with comments...  :-)

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Thu, 4 Jul 1996 13:55:15 +0100
From: Land Rover Owner magazine <lro@maxcom.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Calling Discovery Owners

Land Rover Owner International magazine will be featuring in a
forthcoming issue the definitive guide to buying a Land Rover Discovery.

If you've had any experiences with these vehicles -- good or bad -- we'd
be delighted to hear from you.

We'd particularly like tales of reliability or otherwise, best places to
buy, treatment from dealers etc. What do you use yours for? What advice
would you give potential purchasers?

We look forward to hearing from you...

-- 
Land Rover Owner magazine

------------------------------
[ <- Message 4 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

From: rhodesia@juno.com (Chris R. Whitehead)
Date: Thu, 04 Jul 1996 10:31:32 EDT

	 dkm1955@aol.com, rmodica@east.pima.edu,
	 101730.2521@compuserve.com, 100234.1347@compuserve.com,
	 afsafmags@labyrinth.net.au, DSTIGLIN@x400.telkom400.inca.za,
	 SHOGZ@Protem.uct.ac.za, ron-webb@pixie.co.za,
	 pak00432@pixie.co.za, kolega@townsqr.com,
	 cn3434@coastalnet.com, zink@ns.oon.or.jp, cethered@mic10.redstone.army.mil
Date: Thu, 4 Jul 1996 07:14:26 PST
Subject: Fourth of July
Message-ID: <19960704.071629.4527.0.rhodesia@juno.com>
X-Mailer: Juno 1.00
X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-4

HAPPY 4TH OF JULY TO ALL OF YOU, EVEN IF YOU AREN'T AMERICAN.

CHEERS

CHRIS WHITEHEAD

------------------------------
[ <- Message 5 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

Date: Thu, 4 Jul 1996 08:56:01 -0700
From: jjbpears@ix.netcom.com (Jeremy Bartlett)
Subject: Re: Leaking swivelpin housing

You wrote: 
>It has been suggested by my farming
>chums that I should shove a heavier (?EP120) oil in to slow the leak.
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 9 lines)]
>TIA.
>Martin Farrall
That might stop or slow the leak, but it will proportionately stop or 
slow the lubrication of the joints.  This is an analogous issue to the 
SPOT of stuffing grease into the housing - not good.  Personally I'd 
rather swap the seal out than the joint; the choice is yours :)

cheers,

Jeremy

------------------------------
[ <- Message 6 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

Date: Thu, 4 Jul 1996 09:08:48 -0700
From: jjbpears@ix.netcom.com (Jeremy Bartlett)
Subject: Re: Turner Engines, how do they do it?

You wrote: 

>I am wondering what Turner does to their
>2.25 l motors to get extra power.  Do they
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 11 lines)]
>oneself instead of spending big$$$ on an
>import or a potentially troublesome
>motor swap.

I've not seen Turner's exact procedures (yet - I'm working on getting 
hold of them :) ).  They definitely do not scratch manufacture.  I 
understand that they use stock parts BUT match/balance etc. to get to 
"blueprint" tolerances. This would be very difficult to do here in the 
US since you'd have to order parts, check them, return those out of 
spec., re-order, etc. until complete.  I don't know to what extent they 
port/polish etc.  I don't believe they do this, but am not certain (not 
having had my Turner apart :) ).

By the way Turner, does not claim the 2.25l rebuild are build for high 
performance (i.e. tuned/rebuilt for power).  Rather they claim a high 
quality rebuild.  The extra power reported by various sources (e.g. the 
RN catalog) seems to be incidental to the care taken in reassembly.

I will say that my Turner turns over very smoothly and quietly (I also 
had the flywheel balanced); HOWEVER, I do not have a lot of stock 2.25 
l experience to compare it too, so beware of any recommendations from 
me :).  There's a lot of legitimate debate over the merits of a Turner 
vs. a US rebuild, mostly centered on opinions of cost vs. end 
performance.  I would note that there shouldn't be much trouble on an 
engine swap if you're currently running a 2.25l petrol; this is what I 
did with no real problems (trivial wiring differences between late and 
early blocks involving the choke).

cheers,

Jeremy

P.S.  You're probably aware of the secondary issue of buying through RN 
vs. importing from the UK - not really a problem in Canada, but 
relevant to warranty assistance vs. up front cost.

------------------------------
[ <- Message 7 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

Date: Thu, 4 Jul 1996 12:20:55 -0400 (EDT)
From: Dixon Kenner <dkenner@emr1.NRCan.gc.ca>
Subject: Re: Turner Engines, how do they do it?

On Thu, 4 Jul 1996, Jeremy Bartlett wrote:

> "blueprint" tolerances. This would be very difficult to do here in the 
> US since you'd have to order parts, check them, return those out of 
> spec., re-order, etc. until complete.  

	Turner is ISO9002 approved, which covers all of this type of 
	quality control, documentation etc.

> P.S.  You're probably aware of the secondary issue of buying through RN 
> vs. importing from the UK - not really a problem in Canada, but 
> relevant to warranty assistance vs. up front cost.

	I was curious yesterday...

Subject: Turner engines

	Got curious:

	2.25l 3mb diesel, zeus timing gears fitted	L1,595

	2.25l 5mb diesel, zeus, flywheel/housing fitted	L1,850

	2.5l diesel					L2,150

	2.5l turbo diesel				L2,550

	2.25l 3mb petrol, lead free			L1,095

	2.25l 3mb petrol, lead free, high performance	L1,145

	Seafreight - CIF Montreal - docks		L150.00
	Airfreight - CIF Ottaea - uncleared		L281.00

	These are all long blocks, stripped engines.  ie on the petrol,
	add a starter, distributor, fan, carb, etc.  On the diesel add
	injectors, distributor pump, etc.

	For fun:  Rovers North wants US$2,995 for the high performance
	engine.  This is at their door.  To bring this to something
	constant and unreal (ie Northern Peso's) this is approximately
	C$4,102.73.  Now I own it and have to get it out their door.

	The Turner costs L1,145 or $C2,145.95 plus shipping (and we will
	be lazy here and do air) of C$592.91 for a total of C$2,738.86.

	We have omitted our favoured Goods and Services tax (soon to be 
	combined with the Provincial sales taxes at 15% and turned into
	a VAT) because it may not be applicable on the Rovers North
	purchase (Charlie offered me once the garage space to do the
	swap down there), but there is a core charge from RN, there
	is not a core charge from Turner (the result of a phone conversation
	last year when I told Frida Turner that she would basically get an
	engine back that had sat in a stream for the last twenty years.
	ie.  They wouldn't want what I shipped them.  They agreed)  Don't
	know the core charge offhand, so:

	GST (Turner)	C$191.72 for a new total of $2,930.58
	GST (RN)	C$287.19 for a new total of $4,389.92

	Now, for our friends south of the border in the un-pink area of North
	America rubbing shoulders with Jesse Helms, you have decided that
	you want a Turner.  You know the RN price, plus the core charge,
	what does the Turner cost if you buy via Canada.  Well...

	C$2,930.58 = US$2,139.32

	RN at their door, no sale on, = US$2,995 + Core.

	Where do you buy?

------------------------------
[ <- Message 8 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

From: JDolan2109@aol.com
Date: Thu, 4 Jul 1996 12:31:26 -0400
Subject: National Rally...

Pappa Sappa (Black Hills) sounds good to me. I stopped by Sturgis last August
on my way back to Vt. from Co. to see the HD rally, and can say that they do
allow/support gatherings. Another possibility would be to move over a bit to
around Mule Creek Junction, Wyoming. Surely there's a land owner  (*BIG*
ranches) there who would be open to such a thing. I think a town near there,
Wells or something, is totally wired, and maybe someone could access someone
in that community to help find a locale. I'd try that myself, but my poor
little computer is maxed out just keeping up with the LROD...
Didn't go to the 'National Rally' in Co., as it was limited to the first 25
vehicles or something. Didn't understand, didn't even investigate. Apparently
philosophies are changing... I think I'll be at the national rally this
weekend, provided everything holds together...
see 'ya on the old road...
Jim '61 LR 88" SW  w/ 16's, OD 1 Bbl weber (econobox?)  "Nicky"
LR...quite possibly one of the best machines yet devised!  

------------------------------
[ <- Message 9 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

From: "David J. Mercer" <merkin@sierra.net>
Subject: RE: How to find trails that lead to lake side camping sites in California?
Date: Thu, 4 Jul 1996 09:19:58 -0700
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

A good place to camp near many lakes a few hours from SF is Jackson =
Meadows, Bowman lake area N 39* 27 ,W 120* 36. Take I80 east till you =
get to the highway 20 exit take it go about 3 miles turn right on Bowman =
road and drive about 15 miles back to Bowman Lake, there are numerous =
roads back there and some beautiful camping areas. Get a DeLorome =
Northern Cal map and go.

----------

David Mercer
PO BOX 2570
Olympic Valley CA 96146
ph  916-583-4150
fax 916-583-4829
merkin@sierra.net
53 S1 80"
57 S1 107" SW, FOR SALE
63 SII 88"
65 SII 88", FOR SALE
66 SII 88"
86 MB 280GE
------ =_NextPart_000_01BB698B.FBE0B980

------------------------------
[ <- Message 10 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

Date: Thu, 4 Jul 1996 09:47:40 -0700
From: jjbpears@ix.netcom.com (Jeremy Bartlett)
Subject: Re: Turner Engines, how do they do it?

You wrote: 
>	Turner is ISO9002 approved, which covers all of this type of 
>	quality control, documentation etc.

Correct.  If a call to Turner for information doesn't yield results, 
this is what I'm trying to follow up on.  The ISO9000 series of 
protocols call for documentation of the manufacturing procedure, the 
procedure is also audited by a certified individual.  I believe that 
the protocols make the documents public domain.  If that is the case we 
can find out what steps Turner takes in their manufacturing.

>> P.S.  You're probably aware of the secondary issue of buying through 

>	I was curious yesterday...

>	I was curious yesterday...
snip
>	GST (Turner)	C$191.72 for a new total of $2,930.58
>	GST (RN)	C$287.19 for a new total of $4,389.92
snip
>	Where do you buy?
>	GST (RN)	C$287.19 for a new total of $4,389.92

Your costs come surprisingly close to my analysis for the US.  Even 
buying via second party in the UK (necessary to avoid the exclusive 
contract Turner has with RN for the US), my total cost including sea 
freight, customs, dock extortion, etc. came to about $2,225 US (I don't 
think there was a core charge included in that but even if there 
was..).  RN's core charge is $500.  Even at their sale prices that puts 
them, with US delivery of $300, at about $3,600.  Off sale is closer to 
$4,000 US.

So where DID I buy ? :)

cheers,

Jeremy

------------------------------
[ <- Message 11 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

Date: Fri, 05 Jul 1996 13:08:15
From: IIIDmentia@gnn.com (WILLIAM ADAMS)
Subject: Nat Rally in middle is a joke

Having a 'National' Rally in the center of the country (i.e. Sturgis, like 
we're Harley riders or something) puts it 1500 miles away from everybody 
instead of having it on one of the coasts and making it within a day's drive 
of half the Rover owners.
More practical would be to make it like a convention where it moves locations 
yearly in order to accomodate people in different areas of the country. 
Keeping it in one place would lead to staleness and disinterest, not to 
mention rancor (from those unable to attend year after year).
Let the west coast folks host it one year and the east coast the next. That 
way, if people wish to attend they can at least fly in without having to 
mortgage the kids to do it.
I volunteer myself to organize the east coast one next year. Anyone else wish 
to join in?

Bill Adams
3Dmentia computer animation
4016 Spruell Drive
Kensington, MD 20895
301-949-9475

'66 Land Rover S2A 109" Station Wagon Diesel  ...all there

------------------------------
[ <- Message 12 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

Date: Thu, 4 Jul 1996 13:33:06 -0400 (EDT)
From: Russell U Wilson <ruwst+@pitt.edu>
Subject: Re: Nat Rally in middle is a joke

On Fri, 5 Jul 1996, WILLIAM ADAMS wrote:

> Having a 'National' Rally in the center of the country (i.e. Sturgis, like 
> we're Harley riders or something) puts it 1500 miles away from everybody 

Slow down before you say something bad about Harley people

> More practical would be to make it like a convention where it moves locations 
> yearly in order to accomodate people in different areas of the country. 

This is the most intelligent idea I've yet heard on this whole subject of 
a "National Ralley".  It is one thing for the Brits to have a "Billings" 
in the same spot every year. But it's  another thing entirely for the 
folks in the USA/Canada to try the same trick because of the size of 
the area involved.

> Keeping it in one place would lead to staleness and disinterest, not to 
> mention rancor (from those unable to attend year after year).
This is a good point.  It would be interesting to have it move from 
location to location.....hosted by local clubs???
 
> Let the west coast folks host it one year and the east coast the next. That 
> way, if people wish to attend they can at least fly in without having to 
> mortgage the kids to do it.

The travel has nothing to do with it....you mortage the kids to get the 
new Marsland Frame  ;)

Russ W.
67 RHD  88
"The Pig"

------------------------------
[ <- Message 13 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

Date: Thu, 4 Jul 1996 13:48:13 -0400 (EDT)
From: Dixon Kenner <dkenner@emr1.NRCan.gc.ca>
Subject: Re: Nat Rally in middle is a joke

On Fri, 5 Jul 1996, WILLIAM ADAMS wrote:

> Having a 'National' Rally in the center of the country (i.e. Sturgis, like 
> we're Harley riders or something) puts it 1500 miles away from everybody 
> instead of having it on one of the coasts and making it within a day's drive 
> of half the Rover owners.

	Very true, but it is probably the only opportunity to get east 
	and west coast folks together at one place, or at least those
	that might be interested to travel a bit of a distance.

	You make an interesting argument for rallies on either coast, but
	for all purposes, the east coast has the OVLR Birthday Party in June,
	the BSROA Fall Heritage Rally in September, the ROAV Mid-Atlantic
	Rally in October, British Car Day in Bowie in June, the Downeast
	Rally in July, the British Invasion in September.  East coast wise
	we have quite a few to choose from.  To do anything in 1998 for 
	the 50th anniversary of Land Rover I can assure you that on the
	east coast, not only will all the clubs be doing their rallies
	as above, but will probably be doing something together in some 
	mid-point.  (OVLR, BSROA, and ROAV have discussed this in the past
	for 1998).  Besides the Pacific Coast Rover Club, I am not sure
	what other large rallies there are on the west coast (outside
	the many that the Mendo-list seems to have come by)

> More practical would be to make it like a convention where it moves locations 
> yearly in order to accomodate people in different areas of the country. 

	We need some sort of umbrella national organisation to help
	organise this (Down Michael down...) which currently does not exist
	to co-ordinate the clubs.  

	We are discussing something in the centre, basically for the people
	on these lists right now.  As for a truly "National Rally", that is
	just a name, a designation.  To move it about as you describe all
	we have to do is get a list of the large rallies (and this exists)
	and move the label around.  Flip a coin who gets it one year.  
	This year can be the Solihull Society (the "name" was actually 
	first used by LROA in the ancient past, then "appropriated by SS 
	(big deal)), Pacific Coast next year, the Mid-Atlantic the next,
	Birthday Party after that, Bay State after that.  Maybe by then
	LROA will be ready to organise one for the west coast...

------------------------------
[ <- Message 14 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

Subject: Re: Nat Rally in middle is a joke 
Date: Thu, 04 Jul 1996 11:03:38 -0700
From: Benjamin Allan Smith <bens@ridgecrest.ca.us>

In message <bulk.17933.19960704100556@Land-Rover.Team.Net>you write:

> More practical would be to make it like a convention where it moves locations
> yearly in order to accomodate people in different areas of the country. 

	This is what the ARC does in the UK.  Each year a different club
organizes the event.  Over the last year or so I know a number of people 
have been talknig about creating a US Association of Rover Clubs (or maybe
a North America ARC so the Canadians don't feel excluded) with the purpose
of exchanging information between clubs and running a National Rallye. 
Unfortunatly those that were doing the talking have thier hands full with
running the local clubs.  If such and organization was to be created, it would
be an ideal way to organize such an event. 

	Swapping coasts is a good idea.  I think an even better idea would
be to add a midwest one to make a 3 year rotation.

Ben
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Benjamin Smith----------bens@ridgecrest.ca.us----------1972 Land Rover SIII 88
"...If I were running such a contest, I would specifically eliminate any entry
 from Ben involving driving the [Land] Rover anywhere.  He'd drive it up the
 Amazon basin for a half can of Jolt and a stale cookie..."  --Kevin Archie

------------------------------
[ <- Message 15 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

Date: Thu, 04 Jul 1996 11:06:56 -0600
From: "Darrell D. Murray" <rdgrnr@flash.net>
Subject: National Rally/Federal Parks and Lands

There our Parks and we should be able to use them.  How do the Parks 
handle all the other thousands of individual visitors?  They must have 
hundreds visiting every day?  Any way, you do need permits for groups of 
vehicles/peoples attending the parks.  The Local National Forest, I off 
road in, has a 4x4 user as the Boss, so it's easier here, with out the 
tree huggers crying foul-in charge of that office, to get out in the 
forest.  So little remains of our access to trails by vehicles, we need 
to get on the ball and write our government and insist they re-open the 
off road trials to off road vehicles!  It's our land!  The 
Constitution, (or some other important founding father's 
writtings/documents, such as the bill of rights.) states, that no one 
will be denied access through or across lands held in the public 
trust!(not excat words), but it seems today, the government doesn't 
respect the rights of it's citizens very much anymore.
Darrell, Discovery owner, serious user and abuser, of my vehicle, but 
not neglected! 
rdgrnr@flash.net

------------------------------
[ <- Message 16 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

Date: Thu, 4 Jul 1996 11:35:38 -0700
From: Michael Carradine <cs@crl.com>
Subject: LR Olympics (was: Nat Rally in middle is a joke) 

At 11:03 AM 7/4/96 -0700, Benjamin Smith <bens@ridgecrest.ca.us> wrote:
>	Swapping coasts is a good idea.  I think an even better idea would
>be to add a midwest one to make a 3 year rotation.

 I like it!!

 Why not a four year rotation with one year in Canada?

 This way every four years would be one Land Rover MEGA-Rally in your own
 neighborhood, so to speak (just like the Olympics, he he).

 For the 1998 rally I might suggest St. Louis, MO the traditional American
 jumping off point for settlers, the seperation between east and west.
 The Flatland Rovers assure me that St Louis has a national park a few
 miles west which has off-road trails and is quite hilly.  The scenery is
 supposedly quite alluring, but can always be enhanced by Land-Rovers :)

 Cheers,
                         ______
 Michael Carradine       [__[__\==                    Rumpole of the Bay
 510-988-0900            [________]               Land-Rover Roughmobile
 cs@crl.com  __________.._(o)__.(o)____...o^^^  '65 IIA 2.235m (was 88")
 _______________________________________________________________________
 Land-Rover 4x4 Connection WWW page:   http://www.crl.com/~cs/rover.html

------------------------------
[ <- Message 17 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

Date: Thu, 4 Jul 1996 14:37:47 -0400 (EDT)
From: Dixon Kenner <dkenner@emr1.NRCan.gc.ca>
Subject: Re: Nat Rally in middle is a joke 

On Thu, 4 Jul 1996, Benjamin Allan Smith wrote:

> 	Swapping coasts is a good idea.  I think an even better idea would
> be to add a midwest one to make a 3 year rotation.

	An ideal solution, but...  To do a large rally you need a local
	infrastructure, or a solid club.  The west coast has the Mendo-list
	Pacific Coast, possibly LROA.  The rest of the clubs are very small,
	but potential candidates.  In the midwest we have the Solihull Society
	in Colarado which is good sized.  The rest are smaller at this
	time.  The east is littered with clubs, four of which Virginia,
	Blue Ridge, Bay State, Ottawa are good sized.  Of course, you could
	always start to look towards BP, RN etc. to do something too, if not
	just be asked to support the Rally.  Numbers right now imply
	that there would more east coast venues, but at the rate clubs
	are appearing and existing ones growing, this could all change
	very quickly

------------------------------
[ <- Message 18 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

From: harincar@internet.mdms.com
Date: Thu, 4 Jul 1996 13:18:03 -0500
Subject: Re: Turner Engines, how do they do it?

One thing to add to the cost of a turner from RN - don't forget the restoration
program discount. I don't have the numbers handy, but I think you'd get 10
or 15 percent back (in RN merchandise) on a purchase over $2K. Thats another
$300 to $450 discount. Although still more than buying direct from the UK,
we're getting close to the Hassle Factor. If the difference works out to only
a couple hundred bucks...

Tim
---
tim harincar
harincar@mooregs.com
'66 IIa 88 SW

------------------------------
[ <- Message 19 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

From: harincar@internet.mdms.com
Date: Thu, 4 Jul 1996 14:25:54 -0500
Subject: Re:  Nat Rally in middle is a joke

> Having a 'National' Rally in the center of the country (i.e. Sturgis, like
> we're Harley riders or something) puts it 1500 miles away from everybody
> instead of having it on one of the coasts and making it within a day's drive
> of half the Rover owners.

So you hold a 'national rally' on a coast. BFD. Whats the difference between
that and any other coastal rally, except a title? Do you really think that
giving it a new title will draw people from the opposite side of the continant?
Not likely. Rather, you'll see the same old people you always do, except for
maybe a couple of die hards that drive a long ways.

And isn't that the point? You have local rallies to see the people in your
neighborhood, you have a national rally to see the people from around
the country. In order to get people from all over, you need to minimize
the amount that has to be driven for everyone.

> More practical would be to make it like a convention where it moves locations
> yearly in order to accomodate people in different areas of the country.

You don't typically bring your car to a convention. *Everyone* flys so it
doesn't matter where you put it.

Flying to a car rally is a bit like going to the beach in business clothes.
Sure, the water *looks* fun...

> Keeping it in one place would lead to staleness and disinterest, not to
> mention rancor (from those unable to attend year after year).

Coming from someone who can attend 4 or 5 rallies a year. I bet the black
hills are bigger than Maryland. Do you *know* how long it would take to
explore that? And that is not the only interesting place in the midwest.

We could hold it once every three years, 'in the middle', so it doesn't get 
stale. You gotta make people *want* to drive 1500 miles in a series Rover,
Much less 3000. Who's going to sacrifice 2 weeks of vacation to drive from
one coast to the other? Most people could do the midwest on a week.

Doing it every year and moving it around will just make people wait until it 
comes around home. 

Tim
---
tim harincar
harincar@mooregs.com
'66 IIa 88 SW

------------------------------
[ <- Message 20 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

Subject: Re: Nat Rally in middle is a joke 
Date: Thu, 04 Jul 1996 13:33:17 -0700
From: Benjamin Allan Smith <bens@ridgecrest.ca.us>

In message <bulk.603.19960704125241@Land-Rover.Team.Net>you write:
> We could hold it once every three years, 'in the middle', so it doesn't get 
> stale. You gotta make people *want* to drive 1500 miles in a series Rover,
> Much less 3000. Who's going to sacrifice 2 weeks of vacation to drive from
> one coast to the other? Most people could do the midwest on a week.

	I must be one of the crazy ones.  The only thing that stops me
from attending all of the Rallyes is vacation time.  (Well gas money too
sometimes)   Everyone should experience a 3000 mile trek in  a Sereis 
Rover at least once. 

Ben
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Benjamin Smith----------bens@ridgecrest.ca.us----------1972 Land Rover SIII 88
"...If I were running such a contest, I would specifically eliminate any entry
 from Ben involving driving the [Land] Rover anywhere.  He'd drive it up the
 Amazon basin for a half can of Jolt and a stale cookie..."  --Kevin Archie

------------------------------
[ <- Message 21 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

Date: Thu, 4 Jul 1996 16:48:19 -0400 (EDT)
From: Dixon Kenner <dkenner@emr1.NRCan.gc.ca>
Subject: Re: Nat Rally in middle is a joke

On Thu, 4 Jul 1996, Russell U Wilson wrote:

> This is a good point.  It would be interesting to have it move from 
> location to location.....hosted by local clubs???

	For those interested, the rallies in North America that I know
	of that have more than about thirty Land Rovers at them are
	listed at:

	http://www.ridgecrest.ca.us/RoverWeb/Events/annual_events.html

	If anyone has more information on those I missed, or more 
	details etc, drop a line.  We will fix it up.  If the threshold
	should be dropped below thirty, send a list of the rallies,
	when they generally are, where, size, sponsor, events, age.
	Missing is the annual rally held by the Pacific Coast Rover club
	(Northwest Challenge?)  Anyone have information on this?

------------------------------
[ <- Message 22 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

Date: Thu, 4 Jul 1996 17:19:30 -0500 (CDT)
From: David Place <dplace@SIRNet.mb.ca>
Subject: Re: National Ralley

Well Tim, If you held it in the National Forest at Bimiji, I guess a few 
of us from Manitoba could help out.  Things like letter writing and that 
sort of thing would be no problem.  That area has some nice logging 
trails, fishing, camping etc.  Fall after mosquitoes or spring before 
would be a great time.  Dave VE4PN

------------------------------
[ <- Message 23 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

Date: Thu, 4 Jul 1996 17:49:20 -0500 (CDT)
From: David Place <dplace@SIRNet.mb.ca>
Subject: re: national rally

I think Sturgis has been the location of some great motorcycle get 
togethers over the years.  They are probably used to "nuts" like us :-)
Dave VE4PN]

------------------------------
[ <- Message 24 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

Date: 04 Jul 96 18:56:33 EDT
From: Rob Dennis <73363.427@CompuServe.COM>
Subject: Rebuilding Trans

I am rebuilding my SerIII transmission and in the process replaced 1st and 2nd
gears. I have put it back together, but can hear a constant knocking in the
transmission. Nothing seems to make it disappear, and 1st gear seems to make it
a little louder. I have basically limited it to either the layshaft or 1st,2nd
or 3rd gear since these are constantly turning, and everything else has been
swapped out without making a difference. Also I didn't notice this with the old
gears in. I don't notice any imperfections on the gears, but am about to pull
the mainshaft out for the fourth time to scrutinize them. I can't hear anything
when I turn the input shaft by hand, it only appears when it starts turning at
engine speed. I would appreciate any suggestions, I am about to go crazy trying
to get this done in time for nationals.

  
     -------------------       
    |         |         |
    | _ _ ____|____ _ _ |       Rob Dennis
  O |[___|>>>>>>>>>|___]| O     73363.427@Compuserve.com
   \____===_=====_===____/      Atlanta, GA USA
   |oo   |(_)###(_)|   oo|      (404) 875-4537
   |     |   ###   |     |      
   |     | ####### |     |      1972 SerIII 88
   |_____|_#######_|_____|      1990 RangeRover
  [_______________________]     1996 Discovery
     EEEI           EEEI

Send By: Rob Dennis 73363.427@Compuserve.com
 On 04-Jul-1996

------------------------------
[ <- Message 25 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

Date: Thu, 04 Jul 1996 15:57:52 -0700
From: Gordon Rea <grea@net.gov.bc.ca>
Subject: Re: Compression test question!!

David Place wrote:
> Try checking the valve stem seals especially watch for smoke when you
> start up after sitting for awhile.  They are easy to change and if you
> use the spark plug adapter that puts compressed air into the plug hole,
> you don't have to remove the head to put a new seal in.  Dave VE4PN

I'm going to do this on saturday. I did the tilt test again last night
with the same results. ~15degree to the left, smoke. ~15deg up,
smoke. 15deg down, smoke. 15deg right, NO smoke!.
I waas told of another way of changing the valve seals that sounds
even easier.:
Pull the plugs, insert ~12" of rope into the spark plug hole.
Use the crank to raise the piston up untill it pushes the rope
against the valves. Remove the springs.
This way you don't have to worry about losing pressure and droping
a valve. Sounds good to me.
Can anyone see a problem with this method?

Regards, Gordon

------------------------------
[ <- Message 26 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

Date: Thu, 4 Jul 1996 18:20:41 -0700
From: twakeman@scruznet.com (TeriAnn Wakeman)
Subject: Getting excited about Billing '96

I just received my field camping pass for Billing  along with the show
guide.  i guess its time to start getting excited.  Looks like there will
be Keith Hart's open air classroom for off road driving techniques, and one
for Winching and recovery techniques plus much more,

A partial list of companys include:Arrow Services, John Craddock,Derbyshire
Land Rover SparesM M&M Land Rover Spares(used parts), B. J. Acoustics,
Warwick 4X4, Trakkers, Mantec Services, Safety Devices, Dakar Cars,
Paddock, Acoustikit, Servicetune, E.G.R., Caranex, W&H Wheel carriers,
Famous Four, National power steering, and many more, including used parts
dealers.  Plus who knows what private individuals will be bringing to sell.

Oh & a few Land Rovers will be there as well.

I'm lookin forward to this one!

TeriAnn

twakeman@scruznet.com   <- NOTE NEW ADDRESS

Celebrating my tenth year on Usenet/Internet

------------------------------
[ <- Message 27 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

From: Mage <mage@cia.com>
Subject: Re: Turner Engines, how do they do it?
Date: Fri, 5 Jul 1996 00:39:30 +0100

At 09:47 AM 04/07/96 -0700, you wrote:

>Correct.  If a call to Turner for information doesn't yield results, 
>this is what I'm trying to follow up on.  The ISO9000 series of 
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 6 lines)]
>the protocols make the documents public domain.  If that is the case we 
>can find out what steps Turner takes in their manufacturing.

ISO does not make procedures public domain.  The auditors normally sign
confidentiality agreements before being allowed to audit.  If this were not
the case, you could find out any trade secret you wanted.  eg. the formula
for "classic" coke, alloy composition of certain metals, etc....

Rick

------------------------------
[ <- Message 28 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

Date: Fri, 05 Jul 96 10:53:02 
From: "Jens Vesterdahl" <jve@phaseone.dk>
Subject: Who makes these tires?

Hi all.

A few months back I got new tires all around my 109. I'm quite satisfied with 
them, but they are not marked with any manufacturer's name, so I'm a bit curious 
about where they're made.

They are called "All Season King", dimensions are 235/85 and they are made in 
the USA. That's all I know.

I suspect that some major tyre manufacturer sells these tires OEM or something. 
Does anybody know where they come from?

Happy Rovering

Jens Vesterdahl
Copenhagen, Denmark

------------------------------
[ <- Message 29 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

Date: Fri, 05 Jul 1996 05:15:59 -0600
From: Bill Anchors <ganchors@Bledsoe.Net>
Subject: Nashville LR dealership, receiver winch mounts & lights

Friends,
I want to thank everyone for responding to my question regarding the
possibility of moving my Defender 90's emergency brake handle to the
right side of the transmission hump for more leg room, and for your
responses regarding the trouble I had at the LR dealer in Nashville.

I had, in fact, complained over the phone for nearly an hour to LRNA but
the representative seemed totally indifferent to what I had to say. I
never heard from her again, and did not pursue the subject. Maybe I
should have, now that I've heard other complaints about the dealer. The
bottom line for me was that since I only have two dealers to chose from
for service, it was probably best not to alienate the people there
completely. I might eventually regret it even though I have no plans on
ever returning.

On another subject, I'd like to add some thoughts about the recent
discussions on receiver hitch winch mounts. After trying to use such a
set up for a year, I finally gave up because, although the idea of being
able to winch forward or back was appealing, in practice this system
just doesn't work because:

1.Trying to install 100 pounds of winch and mount was difficult under
the best circumstances (such as in your driveway) but nearly impossible
once stuck in deep, slimy mud where it's difficult to stand up let alone
carry a winch. Trying to wrestle one through mud can be downright
dangerous.

2.In this case you then discover that your low hanging receiver is below
the water/mud line. Oh, joy! Winching can be tough enough without going
through this. And since your receiver is low, so will be your winch. If
it is underwater how do you see if the cable is being taken in correctly
or is about to jam up from reeling in on one side? You could conceivably
find yourself without an operable winch and really stuck.

3.The receiver hitches are not study enough for big winches. And
although some digest readers have recommended a medium size winch for
their vehicles, I'm a firm believer in bigger is better. I once drove
through the run-off by-products of an active mining operation. Whatever
the substance was it seemed to be a cross between mud and Super Glue! My
pickup sank immediately up to the frame and the Warn 9000i refused to
budge the truck. We doubled the line but then started pulling down trees
without making any forward progress (yes, I believe it Tread Lightly,
but we were in a totally trashed mining area and was more concerned
about getting out than a couple of dying trees). We finally broke lose
by using an extension cable to reach a substantial enough anchor point -
but even then the brand new 9000i (with a double line and 18,000 pounds
of pull) could barely cope. I was only ever stuck once this bad, but it
was enough to learn a valuable lesson. Although a Range Rover might get
by with an 8,000 or 6,000 pound winch, I'd use an 8,000 as an absolute
minimum for a heavy Defender. The fact that Land Rover switched to a
9,000 pound winch is sufficient evidence that 8,000 was too small. Of
course, an extremely heavy 12,000 pound unit would probably be overkill
and create more problems than it would solve, but a 10,000 pound winch
would not be out of hand - although not on a receiver hitch!

4.After wrestling through the mud once with the winch to install it, I
began leaving it mounted on the front or back of my truck. This was
unacceptable also - on the front it was consistently impaled into the
ground on steep slopes, and on the rear was dragged through the dirt.
Receiver mounts are simply too low.

5.Adding to all of this, where do you put 100 pounds of steel and iron
when not in use? I tossed mine into the pickup bed figuring its own
weight would keep it in place. Wrong! It slid all over until fastened
down, although I never did find an acceptable method to secure it. If
you are carrying one inside a sport utility you'd better find a very
secure place for it. A rollover with a loose winch inside could ruin
your whole day - and possibly kill someone.

I eventually fabricated a mount on the rear of my truck for a second
winch and bought a bumper mount for the front - yet another lesson
learned the hard ($$$) way. Receiver mounts are acceptable for light
duty off roading (where you probably wouldn't need one anyway) and might
be more practical in a dry environment, but they are still the least
desirable mounting system.

Lastly, keep in mind that hidden winch mounts (such as on 1994
Defenders) are also a compromise design intended mainly to keep an
unsightly winch off the front of the vehicle. This is understandable for
a vehicle used for daily transportation, but off road it also suffers
from being down low, catching all sorts of debris (Warn winches are NOT
waterproof, by the way) and making it difficult or impossible to see the
cable as it is being spooled on. These observations are not meant to be
critical of anyone using this set up, but is something to keep in mind.
For heavy duty off roading I've found that the winch should be kept as
high (and dry) as possible. Keep in mind that my observations are from
dealing with typical southern terrain: lots of deep mud. Other
conclusions might be reached under different off-roading conditions.

I hope this information will be of help to someone.

Question: I didn't buy dealer-installed lights on either of my D90s as
the roll bar mounting would no longer make it possible to get my trucks
in the garage. I want to install lights on the bumper but haven't a clue
as to where to route the wiring or where to put the switch. How is it
done at the dealership?

Bill Anchors
1995 Defender 90 ragtop
1995 Defender 90 station wagon

------------------------------
[ <- Message 30 -> end | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

  END OF LAND ROVER OWNER DIGEST 
 Input:  messages 29 lines 1352 [forwarded 86 whitespace 291]
 Output: lines 1086 [content 639  forwarded 72 (cut  14) whitespace 278]

Land Rover Owner Subscription Information:

	* All new subscription requests are via the digest. *

In addition so subscribing and unsubscribing, the Frequently Asked
Questions (FAQ) file and the last month of daily digests may be retrieved
(by mail) from majordomo@Land-Rover.Team.Net

Useful commands for this are 'index lro-digest' which returns a list of
files available, as well as 'get lro-digest <filename>', etc.

World Wide Web Sites start at
	 http://www.Land-Rover.Team.Net/~majordom/lr/pages.html
(shadow) http://www.Senie.com/billc/lr/pages.html

If majordomo barfs at something, and you're convinced he should have 
understood what you sent him, contact majordomo-owner@Land-Rover.Team.Net

  -B
[ First Message | Table of Contents | <- Digest 960705 -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]


Back Forward

Photos & text Copyright 1990-2011 Bill Caloccia, All rights reserved.
Digest Messages Copyright 1990-2011 by the original poster or/and Bill Caloccia, All rights reserved.