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Subject: Re: trip report and 202 overheating
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 96 07:23:19 GMT
From: dlanod@iafrica.com (Donald Abbot)

Daryl says to Paul:
> LR's.   The approach i took was to fit a mechanical VDO temp guage that I
> could trust, and replace the standard fan with thermo units. I placed one
> in front of the rad and one behind, diagonally offset.  I'd also suggest an
> oil cooler and oil temp guage.

I agree that the sender and the gauge probably don't match. When I bought my 
SIII with a Chev 4.1 in it, the Chev sender was hooked up to the Jaeger gauge. 
At the first service we noticed that the engine had been de-tuned. No wonder we 
struggled to get to 140kph. After resetting everything the temperature gauge 
went through the roof. We also noticed that the temperature gauge needle had 
been bent back.

The fix was to install a new meter and matching sender and the engine runs 
normally.

The strange thing is that almost all "knowledgeable" people I meet associate 
the Chev 4.1 conversion with temperature problems.

Donald   

------------------------------

Subject: WWW Mojave Road Trip & U bolt repair
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 00:17:57 -0800
From: Benjamin Allan Smith <bens@archimedes.vislab.navy.mil>

	I scanned a bunch of photos in and made a WWW if anyone was interested.

http://www.ridgecrest.ca.us/RoverWeb/trips/MojaveRd/MojaveRd.html

	(There are links off of the RoverWeb main page or the RoverWeb What's
New page if I made a typo).

	Below is the text on getting stuck and the Ubolt field repair.  The
full version of the story is on the RoverWeb.

Ben

--------------begin forward----------------------------------------------
        It was getting on towards noon so we started down.  I lead the way,
pausing only to reclaim my sand ladders.  I almost made it.  Right in the
spot where Rick locked his lockers and I had a hard time the Rover got stuck.
I couldn't back out.  We tried adding weight to no avail.  I was stuck on both
diffs.  We tried adding rocks, but I couldn't get out.  So Lynn attempted
to winch me back up the trail.  It was a nice winching setup and we even used
a snatch block.  On the first pull all we did was pull the Defender forward
so we had to reblock the Defender and pull again.  This time it worked and I
was pulled back about 2 feet.  Rocks were added so that my diffs would clear
and I started down.  Almost at the bottom I paused to gather gear.  Someone
noticed that my engine had dropped some 20w-50 while I was stuck, so I
pulled head of the Disco to a flat spot to check.  
 
        The instant I walked behind the Rover to get a rag, I knew something
was wrong.  The right rear corner was too low.  I peaked underneigth and saw
the problem.  The outboard Ubolt on the right side had snapped at the top of
the threads.  The Ubolt had bent and dropped the shock mount plate down a
few inches on that side. (The Ubolts clamp down on the shock mount plate to 
hold the spring against the axle.  The other UBolt was tweaked.  And the plate 
that the break line attaches to, the one that is supposed to be between the
shock plate and the spring had been kicked out, rerouting the brakeline.  
Luckily the brakeline hadn't kinked and wasn't leaking.  So I got out the 
high lift and jacked up the corner to get the weight off of the ubolts.
While everyone else sat down to eat lunch and watch (and was nice enough to
shove food in my direction periodically --thanks guys!).  The Ubolts came
off as did the brakeline plate and the shock mount plate.  I pulled out my
spares box and found 2 old Ubolts (I had replaced the existing ones 3 years
ago).  But the Ubolts were too short (from the front axle).  I puzzled a bit.
Then someone mentioned taking some leaves off of the spring.  A grand idea!
I undid the nut and removed the two lowest leaves (the ones that aren't held
in by the bent clips).  But the bolt that holds the leaves together isn't
threaded that far.  Despair not, I got a big washer from my toolbox to act
as a spacer.  I passed the end of the bolt through the shock mount plate,
put on the washer and bolted the plate directly to the spring.  Then the Ubolts
fit.  But I only had 3 nuts.  Luckily the Ubolt nuts are similar in thread
to the nuts that hold the SIII doortops in.  So I uses two of those nuts on
one side and two Ubolt nuts on the other and attached everything.  I was
back in business and the field repair had only taken 1 hour 15 minutes.  Then
I looked under the Rover for more damage.  There are now 2 dents in the
oils pan and the crossmember under the bellhousing is severely bent and crushed.The bellhousing is resting on the crossmember in fact.  It looks like it had 4
or 5 big hits (I didn't head any).  And now my front propshaft is scored from
rubbing on deformed crossmember while the axle articulated.  the rear propshaft
and both diffs show where they rubbed against rocks, but are undamaged.  The
oil leak proved to just be my valve cover gasket which started leaking 
recently.  For the most part on the weakened side the axles was resting on the
bump stops.

--------------end forward----------------------------------------------

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Benjamin Smith------------bens@vislab.navy.mil---------1972 Land Rover SIII 88
 Science Applications International Corporation
 Naval Air Warfare Center, Weapons Division, China Lake

"...If I were running such a contest, I would specifically eliminate any entries
 from Ben involving driving the [Land] Rover anywhere.  He'd drive it up the
 Amazon basin for a half can of Jolt and a stale cookie..."  --Kevin Archie

------------------------------

From: dwebb@waite.adelaide.edu.au (Daryl Webb)
Subject: Re: trip report and 202 overheating
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 19:00:14 +1030 (CST)

Donald replies:

> The strange thing is that almost all "knowledgeable" people I meet associate 
> the Chev 4.1 conversion with temperature problems.

This is not what I was implying.  I used the mechanical VDO guage so that I
knew just how hot the motor was running.  On some runs (eg Alice Springs to
Uluru temp around 40+C) I drove by the temp guage(s) not the speedo, was not
prepared to let water temp rise above ~ 105C or oil above ~135C, if I had to
slow down to maintain this then so be it.....

To take a WAG I suspect that the biggest problem with the 202/3.3L holden is
lack of sump capacity, without a cooler that oil gets real hot real quick and
doesnt have a chance to cool at all in the sump.  My 3.5 V8 doesnt get any
hotter tan my 202/3.3 did when asked to sit on 4000rpm, even after the 202
got its oil cooler... the 3.5 oil runs to about 130ish, its the transfer
box (LT95) that gets *hot* at those revs 140ish, ouch.... One day when I'm
feeling rich (hah) I'll get a large cap sump for the t/case...

cheers
-- 

  Daryl

------------------------------

Date: 16 Jan 1996 02:15:15 U
From: "Bill Wright" <Bill_Wright@cpqm.saic.com>
Subject: [1]The Land Rover Owner Dai

        Reply to:   [1]The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest

Warmest regards from Costa Rica.  I currently plan to return to the office on
January 29th.  If you absolutely need to contact me while I'm on vacation,
both Lynda Houston and Millie Steele have my itinerary and phone numbers.
I'll take action on your e-mail as soon as I can.
Bill
------------------------------

Date: 1/16/96 1:30 AM
From: Land-Rover-Owner@uk.stratus.co

!!! Original message was too large.
!!!
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	  Contents:
  1 HARALD.STEGAVIK@si.sintef.no Mon Jan 15 04:15   37/1511  RR DiffLock vacum
  2 paul@frcs.alt.za   Mon Jan 15 05:10  187/11097 trip report: Australian O
  3 paul@frcs.alt.za   Mon Jan 15 05:19   65/2385  Re: Magazine Subscription
  4 Bill_Wright@cpqm.saic.com Mon Jan 15 05:47  111/5557  [1]The Land Rover
Owner D
  5 gbfv08@udcf.gla.ac.uk Mon Jan 15 05:49   38/1991  Journey to the bottom of

  6 wassili@AMC.UVA.NL Mon Jan 15 06:02   41/1917  Re: Re: Names
  7 g@ix.netcom.com    Mon Jan 15 06:22   33/1573  Re: New Disco Owner Probl
  8 Ian.Stuart@ed.ac.uk Mon Jan 15 06:48   49/2358  Re: similarities (or 6 de
  9 barnett=childress%Eng%EMCHOP1@fishbowl02.lss.emc.com Mon Jan 15 07:47  
65/3489  Great Storm!/Comments.
 10 J.M.Steel@iti.salford.ac.uk Mon Jan 15 08:13   28/1436  Automatic 2-4wd
 11 IIIDmentia@gnn.com Mon Jan 15 08:16   34/1726  Mag subscription Rip-off.
 12 BDaviscar@aol.com  Mon Jan 15 08:27   22/1111  what do you put your tool
 13 IIIDmentia@gnn.com Mon Jan 15 08:49   30/1386  Re: Automatic 2-4wd
 14 jcwhite3@well.com  Mon Jan 15 09:06   81/3622  Re: New Disco Owner Probl
 15 PDoncaster@aol.com Mon Jan 15 09:15   45/2325  Hand Cranking
 16 Ian.Stuart@ed.ac.uk Mon Jan 15 09:16   43/2229  Re: Automatic 2-4wd
 17 rthomas@postoffice.ptd.net Mon Jan 15 09:21   34/1812  Re: Great Storm,
Amsoil
 18 TWakeman/Apple@eworld.com Mon Jan 15 09:23   42/1918  Re: U Bolts
 19 jcwhite3@well.com  Mon Jan 15 09:23   55/2321  Re: Journey to the bottom
 20 jcwhite3@well.com  Mon Jan 15 09:37   47/1699  Re: Automatic 2-4wd
 21 ericz@cloud9.net   Mon Jan 15 09:47   25/1403  Valve Cover and Oil Pan B
 22 ericz@cloud9.net   Mon Jan 15 09:47   29/1490  Anti-Seize
 23 STUARTW@po1.net.cho.ge.com Mon Jan 15 09:51   48/2433  Ghosts Of Lucas
 24 madhugo@best.com   Mon Jan 15 09:52   36/1909  Re: U Bolts
 25 crash@merl.com     Mon Jan 15 09:54   87/2752  What's in my tools kit?
 26 ericz@cloud9.net   Mon Jan 15 09:59   43/2169  Hand Cranking, Etc.
 27 M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk Mon Jan 15 10:06   40/1971  Re: Series IIA Dash
 28 M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk Mon Jan 15 10:06   33/1655  British Rail FWH (the wro
 29 wassili@AMC.UVA.NL Mon Jan 15 10:14   42/1869  Automatic 2-4wd
 30 i.mitchell@ic.ac.uk Mon Jan 15 10:21   33/1568  Calling UGANDA (or therea
 31 rvirzi@gte.com     Mon Jan 15 10:32   30/1302  RE: LRNA 800 Phone Number
 32 skidmore@mitre.org Mon Jan 15 10:38   46/1933  Re: The Land Rover Owner 
 33 jack@eco.twg.com   Mon Jan 15 10:45   24/1331  Update on Blizzard of 199
 34 azw@aber.ac.uk     Mon Jan 15 10:56   24/1267  Re: land Rover camping
 35 barnett=childress%Eng%EMCHOP1@fishbowl02.lss.emc.com Mon Jan 15 11:56  
20/1260  re:Re(2):Re: Time to purc
 36 barnett=childress%Eng%EMCHOP1@fishbowl02.lss.emc.com Mon Jan 15 11:56  
22/1045  re:Anti-Seize/Advice
 37 kirkwood@strider.fm.intel.com Mon Jan 15 12:01   86/3870  Re: New Disco
Owner Probl
 38 burns@cisco.com    Mon Jan 15 12:04   38/1812  Dealers.
 39 wharton@mail.scra.org Mon Jan 15 14:11   44/1692  Re: Hugo still for sale?
 40 DucNut@aol.com     Mon Jan 15 14:17   28/1315  Re: My 1980 Rover SD-1 / 
 41 ChrisF6724@aol.com Mon Jan 15 14:20   27/1623  Friendly smiles.
 42 Nick_Baggarly@cinnamon.mcafee.com Mon Jan 15 14:50   50/2561  Re: New
Disco Owner Probl
 43 ross@secant.com    Mon Jan 15 14:55   38/1467  Re: Friendly smiles.
 44 maddeng@Apple.com  Mon Jan 15 15:01   24/1208  junk mail!
 45 douglastmain@msn.com Mon Jan 15 15:19   27/1062  Used Parts
 46 lopezba@atnet.at   Mon Jan 15 15:24   44/1980  The beer bottle war is he
 47 a-robw@microsoft.com Mon Jan 15 15:50   44/2525  RE: junk mail!
 48 IIIDmentia@gnn.com Mon Jan 15 16:43   39/2005  Re: Hand Cranking,Broken 
 49 RMILL

------------------------------

From: Mr Ian Stuart <Ian.Stuart@ed.ac.uk>
Date:          Tue, 16 Jan 1996 10:39:36 +0000
Subject:       SLROC and ARC Regs..

The Scottish Land Rover Owners Club home page has been expanded again 
(trophies and awards are still to follow). I've finally got a membership 
form in place, for those that want it.

The ARC regulations have been completed and updated to the 1996 release.

Both are available from my home page:

http://www.tardis.ed.ac.uk/~kiz/

     ----** Ian Stuart (Computing Officer)        +44 31 650 6205
Royal (Dick) School of Veterinary Studies, Edinburgh University. 
 <http://www.vet.ed.ac.uk/> or <http://www.tardis.ed.ac.uk/~kiz/>

Quote of 1995: "The archididascalus is to be rusticated and will
                cease to be an abecedarian on the 1st of April"

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 06:11:05 EST
From: "Steve Reddock" <steve_reddock@uk.xyratex.com>
Subject: Mole wrench

Some body asked what mole wrenches where...
  
Mole wrenches are very useful things.  They are small furry animals
who can crawl around in small dark spaces where you cannot reach and
they have phenomenal grip & strength and can remove even the most
heavily rusted nut :-)
  
Not really (what do you mean you had guessed already?).  They are
essentially locking pliers with the benefit of a force amplifying
mechanism.  They are a bodging tool, great at chewing up nuts with
their serrated teeth - they almost fit almost all nuts.
  
But when nothing else will work they are a godsend.  The grip can be
phenomenal on an other wise un-grippable nut.  Also known as vice-grips.
  
One word of warning though, whilst tightening the grip on a bolt prior
to wire brushing the mud & rust off I had a bolt fire out a few weeks
ago.  It was just before I put on the safety goggles (I wear them for
wire brushing) that it fired out.  I was looking the other way (for the
safety goggles!) and didn't see the bolt coming.  It hit me square
in the eye with great force, fortunately it was quite small (3/16 x 1.5
inches).  I don't think I closed my eye before impact as I did not see it
coming and it was too fast for my normal reflexes (honed to lightening
speed by a severe caffeine addiction).
  
The net result was a lot of pain for a couple of days whilst my cornea
regrew.  85% of the cornea had been removed (it's the clear layer
covering the eye).
  
Whilst I am not suggesting that everybody always wears safety goggles
(that would probably cause more accidents through restricted vision), do
bear in mind what can happen, even with the most innocent tools.
  
5 weeks later the sight in my left eye is still not what it was, but
is slowly improving.
  
YOU ONLY HAVE ONE SET OF EYES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  
Sorry to preach, but my carelessness did nearly cost me an eye and I
would hate to have it happen to anybody else.
  
Thanks to Andy Harrington & Steve who fixed my Landy in time
for the MOT, and even put up with my one eyed supervision.
  
Cheers, Steve "Eye eye, captain" Reddock
  
Steve Reddock                         Product Evaluation, 26/12
Xyratex                  Ext.(01705) 486363 x4450  Int.721-4450
REDDOCK at HVTVM         Internet: Steve_Reddock@UK.XYRATEX.COM

------------------------------

From: "Gawie van Blerk" <A48462@bfnnfs01.eskom.co.za>
Date:          Tue, 16 Jan 1996 14:01:44 GMT+200
Subject:       What do I put my tools in?

Hi all

Asked the wife to make me a nice roll up canvas
bag with little stiched compartments for each
tool. Works very nice just unrol and use what you
want then put back and roll op and store in...
you guessed it ... the rear side toolbox. The 
advantage of this system is you see if you have
something missing and you can start the search
before it is to late. On the one end comes two
shoe laces to bind it with.

Picture of toolbag rolled open --->

   |----_____
\  |         -------_______
 \ |----_____              ---------______
  \|  |  |  |-------_______               |
  /|  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |--------------|
 / |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |
/  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |
   +---------------------------------------

Greetings

Gawie

D110 V8 1990 (The Little Green Dragon)

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jan 96 7:44:54 -0500
From: "barnett childress" <barnett=childress%Eng%EMCHOP1@fishbowl02.lss.emc.com>
Subject: re:More on Dealers.

Hi all,
After reading about the dealer complaints again for the last couple of 
days I can't help wondering... is there a difference in professionalism, 
and the level of training provided to the sales and service staffs from 
LRNA? 

Does an "Official Land Rover off-road centre" that sells strictly Land 
Rover product get better training and provide better service than say, a 
"dealer that sells other than Land Rover"?

My dealer, Land Rover Metro West is set up as an "official off-road 
centre". They have there own building and are a separate entity from their 
parent dealership Foreign Motors West, that sell Rolls Royce, BMW, 
Mercedes, Etc.

I was and still am a tee shirt and jeans guy. I have always entered the 
dealership that way and I have always been treated with courtesy and 
respect.
Many of the staff are LR enthusiasts, and everyone from the sales, to 
service, and parts have been extremely helpful.

It would be interesting to find out from those of you out there that feel 
you have been mistreated weather or not it was a "Joe's Foreign Imports" 
type of dealer or a "Land Rover Centre" you went to.

If this turns out to be the case I am sure LRNA would like to know.

Just a thought.

P.S. Please don't rule out the purchase of a LR because of a poor 
dealership, rather find a good dealer give them your business and tell 
them why. After your purchase why not let the other dealer know you bought 
from someone else, and why. This will show them that you were not just a 
"looker" and they lost a sale due to their own stupidity!  

Good luck 
Barnett
Childress
1995 Def 90
Sturbridge, MA.    

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 06:43:53
From: CarDoctor@gnn.com (Robert Davis)
Subject: Engine swaps in the US?

Hi All,

I have been wondering if any one out there has any experience 
convering a series LR to install a Chevy 4.3 V6 engine. I have had 
some experience with the engine in a Astro van & liked it's 
performance.  
 So far I have heard that chevy 250 6 cylinders are not worth the 
trouble of the conversion. 
 I read so many stories about conversions in England with engines 
available there.  What conversions are possible with engines here 
in the US?  The GMC desiel seem to extreme & 350 chevy seem like to 
much power( is that possible?)
 I am looking for a little more power on the expressways with good 
offroad preformance as well.  (Of course on a short budget.)

  For those interest in a reliable parts source in England try 
Steve Parker( ad in LRO). Many peole have used him from the Chicago 
land rover group & he has been very helpful to us.
 
Thanks
Rob Davis_Chicago 

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jan 96 7:56:01 -0500
From: "barnett childress" <barnett=childress%Eng%EMCHOP1@fishbowl02.lss.emc.com>
Subject: re:Anti-Seize/Advice, and apology!

Eric,
It was meant as a JOKE! Sorry if you didn't take it that way!
I love series vehicles and ANY advice about Rovers!
Friends?
Olive branch accepted and one to you.
Barnett

------------------------------

From: Easton Trevor <TEASTON@DQC2.DOFASCO.CA>
Subject: Thom McCann and Land Rover
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 96 08:20:00 EST

Re the thread about Boots,Shirts and Knapsacks bearing the name Land Rover, 
of which I also have some examples (Deck shoes, Boots).
Does LRNA know about this? Are they harrassing the manufacturer like they 
are our parts suppliers? Did the manufacturer just tell them to " get 
stuffed"?
After all if you rove the land in your boots they are land rovers. Shouldn't 
the deck shoes be sea rovers (oh no, not this again)?  A rose by any other 
name.

Then again see Tristan Jones explanation of roving in one of his anthologies 
of nautical tales. (Private explanations available by direct Email)

Trevor Easton

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 09:12:23 -0500 (EST)
From: Dixon Kenner <dkenner@emr1.emr.ca>
Subject: Re: New Disco Owner Problems

On Mon, 15 Jan 1996, Aryeh Goretsky wrote:

> and I though the SQA I had seen was very bad, but it looks like Land Rover QA
> did not test, fix, and fix-verify this nor did the beta-testers pick it up.  
> This is one feature I do not want.

	Mr. Lucas can be tricky and devious when it comes to him spreading
	the message of darkness across vehicles whilst the vehicle is
	being assembled at Solihull.  I also understand that Mr. Bosche
	may be tainted by Mr. Lucas' ways too...

	Rgds,

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 14:09:28 +0000
From: M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk (Mike Rooth)
Subject: Re: Thom McCann and Land Rover

  A rose by any other
>name.

Shouldnt this be "A *rove* by any...."

Cheers
Mike Rooth

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 09:23:37 -0500
From: rover@pinn.net (Alexander P. Grice)
Subject: Used RR

There's a used '90 County RR advertised in the local paper...went to see it 
Saturday, but the chap took it out of town.  Any particular caveats or 
points of concern with this model year (like the power steering pump)?  The 
asking price is $16,600 which *seems* reasonable, but then I haven't seen 
the vehicle.  Cheers
      *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"----*
      |               A. P. (Sandy) Grice                   |
      |       Rover Owners' Association of Virginia         |
      |    1633 Melrose Parkway, Norfolk, VA 23508-1730     |
      |  E-mail: rover@pinn.net  Phone: 804-622-7054 (Day)  |
      |    804-423-4898 (Evenings)    FAX: 804-622-7056     |
      *-----------------------------------------------------*

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jan 96 10:05:42 EST
From: jib@big.att.com (Jan Ben)
Subject: lucky guy's post included

I don't think this guy was able to post to the list,
so I am posting it for him, sorry if you've seen this :

----- Begin Included Message -----

At the suggestion of one of your group I am posting this in hopes of some
advice or offers. I posted a notice on a newsgroup <rec.auto 4x4> and
apparently made so many LR blunders that I will try to be politically
correct here - and in any case I assume you know Rover.

I bought some raffle tickets from the Philadelphia Fairmont Park Grand
Vintage Grand Prix. The prize was a new Land Rover Defender. Last week I
found, to my amazement, that I won the car. (based on my past life
experience - one buys tickets - winning is not part of the deal)
Unfortunately timing (and my physical shape) are such that I cannot use the
car. I just bought one and that I do need, and since I am 6'6" tall and
weigh in at 365 pounds the fit is - shall we say - a bit tight <g>. Actually
I would like to keep it - but paying the tax, paying the insurance, not
converting it to cash to have a very enjoyable toy - would probably mean my
assassination by my wife of 35 years. Had it happened a few months earlier I
would have traded for a Discovery - but they are a lot more money.

In any case I would like to sell the car. Title is currently held by Rover -
and it is residing in at a dealer in West Chester, PA. The car has 1100
miles on it - put on by the members of the group holding the raffle and
driving it to various car events as part of their promotion. It has never
been titled - and I would like to avoid that simply because to get a tag in
Pennsylvania means I pay a 6% tax on a car I plan to sell - and means that
the buyer would get a car with a "b" title - a used car even if I don't
drive it a mile.

I think you guys probably know the car better than I do. I have been told -
but can't confirm, that this is the last new 1995 Defender in the US and
that Rover does not plan to import any more - so there are no 1996's. The
car is yellow, has a soft top, roll bars at every angle they could think of,
a 4.0 liter V8 that develops 182 hp. It has a 5 speed stick shift - and
looks as if it could go anywhere.

I am seeing what the dealer will offer me for it. I would rather that the
car go to someone who really loves Rovers and cars. Let me know if you are
interested or if you know what a fair price would be for a car like this.

Somehow using the word "car" to describe a Defender doesn't seem right.

Bob Sobolevitch

----- End Included Message -----

------------------------------

From: crash@merl.com
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 10:27:55 -0500

>     I notice no manuals in your tool kit.  Are they not useful in
	the field?

Oh yes.  The owner's manual is under the driver's seat where it
protects the carpet from mud; the mechanicals manual and 
the electricals manual are taped shut (to keep the pages from
getting ripped) and in the wayback as well.

I forgot about 'em, just like I forgot about the lock de-icer, band-aids,
and bottle opener in the center console, and the "AMC Guide to the White
Mountains" in the door pockets and the tyvek maps in the overhead nets.

I also have a small spiral-bound notebook in the console- it's the 
vehicle log; everything I do to the car (including fuel usage) gets
logged.  It's a darn handy thing to have.  ("Gee, when _did_ I do the
swivel-pin oil?")

	-Bill

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jan 96 15:53:47 UT
From: "Douglas Main, jr" <douglastmain@msn.com>
Subject: Big Sky Rovers

Hello Friends,

It's Doug Main again with a questions for the Land Rover masses.

I subscribe to the Hemmings Motor News and under Land Rover parts section I  
have seen two interesting ads for land rover parts.  The first ad is for AAA 
automotive down in Texas,  the other is for Big Sky Land Rover in Montana.  
Both ads both claim to be breaking up LRs for parts of all models.  Has anyone 
out there done business with them?  If so; How are their prices?  Do they ship 
UPS?  Are the parts usally decent quality?  
Any other info on these places would be great!

Thanks,

Doug-->   douglastmain@msn.com

------------------------------

Date: 16 Jan 1996 11:06:20 -0500
From: "Sean McInerney" <smcinerney@mail.nrgn.com>
Subject: HELP!...Darkness upon me...

 HELP!...Darkness upon me...
To all those in the world of positive earth,

  I hope that I am not about to induce sympathetic failures throughout the
LRO list but...Joe Lucas rears his dim head.  Within the last two weeks, my
ignition system has been periodically cutting out while driving.  I think
that this can be traced to the ignition switch failing.  Attempting to turn
the key further clockwise when such failure occurs has no effect.  Turning
the key to its "off" (12 o'clock) position and then giving it a sharp flick
into the "on" (3 o'clock) position usually returns power to the ignition
system.  This generally requires several attempts as you begin to lose speed
in traffic.  This ignition "cut-out" has now been occurring with greater
frequency and I can loosely relate it to times when the Rover has been out in
a cold wind (the Rover and I live in Connecticut).  I have checked the
connections to the switch behind the dash panel as well as all other parts of
the ignition in the course of a tune-up over this last weekend.
  The cold weather and increasing frequency of failure brings me to call upon
the collective wisdom.  What can I do?  Do I need to bite the bullet and
spend the $75 necessary to replace the switch?  Can it be serviced?  And as
an emergency option...What wires need to be connected to hot-wire the beast
(I do not want to end up shorting anything, electrocuting myself, or starting
a fire)?  Anyone knowledgeable please post answers to this last query
directly to me as such knowledge may be unsuitable for general, unsecured
consumption.
  I hope the description of my problem makes sense and rings a bell with a
few of you.  Speedy replies will be greatly appreciated....I'm getting pretty
worried.  My baby is usually rock-solid reliable.

Sean C. McInerney
1963 SIIa  88" Petrol....occasionally slows to enjoy the scenery
                                 ....tailgaters beware!

------------------------------

From: Harincar@mooregs.com (Tim Harincar)
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 10:21:47 -0600
Subject: Frame Over, week one

The Frame Over, week #1

This is sort of a cronicle of replacing the frame and bulkhead of my
1966 IIa 88. Just for the record, this is the largest project of this
type I have ever attempted...

This week was preparation week. Get everything organized and inventoried
for the project. This included removing the roof and doors outside of
the garage (where there was room to manouver the top), and repositioning
the rover inside the garage (to facilitate easier removal of the motor).

Also included was a bit of PR with my neighbor. She is graciously
allowing me both halves of her two car garage in exchange for our
single stall for the duration of the project. As part of the thanks
for this, we had her and her kids over to dinner and conversation for
an evening.

Also, there was a bit of PR with a friend who was loaning me her pickup
truck for the "Frame Retrival Adventure" that I will describe in a
minute. Its not anyone who would let a friend put 1200 miles on a 1995
vehicle. As part of the exchange, I added a towing package to the truck
at my cost. Thanks, Heidi.

I also organized all of my tools and supplies, taking one evening
to make a Wal-Mart run to fill in some of the gaps.

With those completed, it was time to get the frame. The beast in
question was located 600 miles south of me in Missouri, owned by
fellow list member Ray Harder. Through 100's of K in email, the
date was set to pick up the frame, do some necessary repairs, and
bring it back.

My friend David and I left home around 11:30 pm for a late morning
arrival at Ray's. We arrived shortly after 10 am, exchanged
introductions and set out on the first task of the day, excracting
the frame from its storage shed. The three of us were able to
remove it without too much trouble.

It was a perfect day for working on a Rover - sunny, mid 60s for
the temp, and not very windy. This felt like heaven from the single
diget temps I was coming from.

The repairs we made consisted of replacing two damaged crossmembers,
straightening the outside of the rear crossmember that was bent on
one side, and patching a damaged outrigger.

Ray did all the metalwork, and did an excellent job with the mig
welder. While Ray did that, I worked on cleaning up the bulkhead
that had come back from the galvanizing shop - removing burrs and
polishing exposed surfaces. It took all three of us to straighten
the rear crossmember - Ray on the torch, David pushing with his foot
and me with the hammer, and changing as required. When that was done,
Ray welded new plates to the top of the crossmember for added
strength.

I also spent some time with the hand grinder, working on surface
rust in preparation for painting.

8 hours after we arrived, repairs were complete, the frame loaded on
my rented trailer, and my friend and I were heading home. I wanted to
get the trailer returned by 2 pm sunday and avoid an extra day charge
(money that will no doubt find its way into my Rover...). On the
return trip, a nasty cold took hold of me which, combined with my
lack of sleep, knocked me out for all of sunday. We arrived back
home at about 5:30 am, unloaded the trailer in the dark, and I spent
the next 30 hours mostly in bed.

I want to thank Ray again for all his help preparing this frame. It
was a lot of work that I couldn't have done myself. It was good fun,
too. Ray is definatly a Rover Head, with bits and pieces of Rovers
anywhere and everywhere one looked. Once again, it is shown to me that
members of this list are a great group of people.

(See, Ray, I told you I wouldn't tell them about the state of your
garage - ahem, I mean, Rover workshop :-)  )

This week the plan is to finish surface preparation of the frame and
get it painted.

Tim
 ---
tim harincar
harincar@mooregs.com
'66 IIa 88 SW

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 08:25:00 -0800
From: Christopher Boese <cboese@co.san-bernardino.ca.us>
Subject: Re: Chain mail & Junk mail

WILLIAM ADAMS wrote:
 
> In the USA, chain letters are illegal, they constitute mail fraud. Whoever is
> behind this letter is trying to fleece you out of your money. This goes for
> E-mail as well. If these people are dealt with for what they are, thieves,
> then perhaps we will have fewer idiots out there who'll try to pull this
> crap.

This might be a good time to call everyone's attention once again to the Blacklist of Internet 
Advertisers at http://www.cco.caltech.edu/~cbrown/BL/. There's information on this particular 
spam and scam here, and a link to more. BTW, this link is for information only and I must stress 
that I don't urge anyone to use this information to avenge themselves upon the spammer(s).

-- 

Christopher Boese
County of San Bernardino, California
Information Services, Information Systems Security Office
'95 beluga black Discovery V8i

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jan 96 16:15:38 UT
From: "Douglas Main, jr" <douglastmain@msn.com>
Subject: FW: PCV

----------
From: 	Douglas Main, jr
Sent: 	Tuesday, January 16, 1996 11:09 AM
Subject: 	PCV

Gordon,

I wrote the answers to chris' questions on a series III that led to the 
discussion of PCV valves.  On the ser I, II and early IIA's they did not use 
PCV valves.  Intead they used a breater style oil fill cap that looked very 
similar to the breather on the valve cover.  The PCV valve was brought on 
later due to pollution regulations.  The fumes that come out of the breathers 
are not terribly healthy.  The solution was to send the fumes to the carb base 
and burn them in combustion.  So thats why your car does not have a pcv valve 
and will never need one.

Have Fun,

Doug Main   (douglastmain@msn.com)

------------------------------

From: William Terry <wterry@sartre.minerva.bah.com>
Subject: Re. Hand Cranking
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 11:48:24 -0500 (EST)

I am bit confused about the concern with hand cranking. The starter dog on my IIA (and the one pictured in the parts catalog) only grab the starter handle in one direction. The other direction is angled to push the handle out. Thus when the engine starts going the handl is pushed out and thereby disconnected. Is there some sort of kick back people are experiencing? The times I've hand cranked my Rover have never exhibited any kick back.

Bill

______________W__i__l__l__i__a__m_____D__a__n_____T__e__r__r__y______________
  How do we acquire wisdom along with all these shiny things? (David Brin)

  wterry@sartre.minerva.bah.com
  http://glenfiddich.minerva.bah.com:8062/CyberJungle.html
  MINERVA Development Team, Booz, Allen & Hamilton

------------------------------

From: William Terry <wterry@sartre.minerva.bah.com>
Subject: Rovers near Ft Collins, CO, USA
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 11:54:18 -0500 (EST)

I've just moved to the Ft Collins, CO area and was wondering if there were any list members in the area.  Also, I'm looking for a recommendation for a local mechanic. I don't have the tools nor the facilities to do my own work. And I'm still learning about the quirks in doing things on the Rover.

TIA, Bill

______________W__i__l__l__i__a__m_____D__a__n_____T__e__r__r__y______________
  How do we acquire wisdom along with all these shiny things? (David Brin)

  wterry@sartre.minerva.bah.com
  http://glenfiddich.minerva.bah.com:8062/CyberJungle.html
  MINERVA Development Team, Booz, Allen & Hamilton

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jan 96 12:01:23 EST
From: jib@big.att.com (Jan Ben)
Subject: parting '90 RR lwb (US only)

Dear List:

This is a follow-up on my earlier post about RR parts.  Several Series
owners are pulling together to pull a RR apart :)
It's a '90 lwb 4-door , rolled.  This is the parts cost and availability
at this point.  If you're interested (for either replacement or conversion),
please e-mail or call me.  I am not looking to get more $ by starting bidding, just
want to get all the goodies assigned, so I don't end up $4,000 in the hole and with 
another pile of metal in my back yard.

1. chassis, incl coils, brake lines - must get $1700 -  available ???
2. front and rear axles, disc brakes   $1000a for both - might be spoken for
3. auto tranny + x-fer case	       $800           - available
4. propshafts ???
5. AC ???
6. PAS ???

Please let me know ASAP, and we can work out the details
Jan in NJ
(908) 949-9537(w)
(908) 872-9641(h) - don't tell my wife what this is about, please :)

Each purchase comes with a complimentary bottle of amber lager homebrew.

------------------------------

From: clapp.carol@mail.viacomcv.hybrid.com (Carol Clapp)
Subject: Automatic 2-4wd
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 10:01:45 +0000

My Wrangler shifts on the fly "at any legal speed" the book says.  Not
totally automatically, as you have to hand move a lever - just give it a
shove.  In my SIII I had to stop and get out and turn the knob on the free
wheeling hub, which is what I'll have to do for my SII (in due course).  Am
now about to go out in a storm in my Wrangler, wish I had the weight of a
Series LR in this wind!
Carol
SII 88" 1959

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 09:57:50 -0800
From: Christopher Boese <cboese@co.san-bernardino.ca.us>
Subject: Re: More on Dealers.

barnett childress wrote:
 
> It would be interesting to find out from those of you out there that feel
> you have been mistreated weather or not it was a "Joe's Foreign Imports"
> type of dealer or a "Land Rover Centre" you went to.
> If this turns out to be the case I am sure LRNA would like to know.

Once again, here's my experience (Sorry to those who have read this already):

When I was shopping for my Discovery, I had a
similarly disappointing and rather insulting experience at the Mission
Viejo Land Rover Centre. I did find a salesman right away (he was
following the LR Centre dress code exactly -- khaki shirt, shorts, hiking
boots), but the first thing he insisted on telling me was, "We're selling
these for sticker price. We're basically not giving discounts, just so
you know." I hadn't asked about Discovery prices. The "test drive" I got
("I've got a customer coming later.") was five minutes up the road with
the salesman driving, up over a curb the "demonstrate" the suspension,
then me driving the mile or so straight back to the dealership. When I
asked about transmission whine, the guy got crabby. But he promised that
I'd be invited to various upcoming events at the "Centre". I never heard
another word.

I bought my Discovery from Symes Cadillac/Land Rover in Pasadena for $800
under sticker.

-- 

Christopher Boese
County of San Bernardino, California
Information Services, Information Systems Security Office
'95 beluga black Discovery V8i

------------------------------

From: clapp.carol@mail.viacomcv.hybrid.com (Carol Clapp)
Subject: Land Rover Boots
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 10:23:43 +0000

        Where are your Green Wellies?
        Absolutely obligatory for Series Owners.
        Preferably with straps on top.
        
Carol
SII 88" 1959
Did someone suggest he be called Bagger, or was that a misprint?!!!!!

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 10:25:42 -0800 (PST)
From: John Brabyn <brabyn@skivs.ski.org>
Subject: Re: parting '90 RR lwb (US only)

As far as I know there was no LWB Range Rover in 1990. Is the vehicle in 
question a regular RR for that year??

Cheers

JOhn Brabyn
89RR

On Tue, 16 Jan 1996, Jan Ben wrote:

> To change subscription write to: Majordomo@Land-Rover.Team.Net
> Dear List:
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 25 lines)]
> (908) 949-9537(w)
> (908) 872-9641(h) - don't tell my wife what this is about, please :)

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 13:29:49 -0500
From: benedick@pa.net (Darwyn/Kris Benedict)
Subject: re:More on Dealers.

Barnett:

>Does an "Official Land Rover off-road centre" that sells strictly Land 
>Rover product get better training and provide better service than say, a 
>"dealer that sells other than Land Rover"?

That's an idea, but I'd be willing to bet no.  My reasoning: our dealer
(whom also sells Mazda, Volvo and Jags) was supposed to be putting in an
"Off-Road" area.  When we ordered our Disco (May 94) we saw all the heavy
equipment in the "feild" behind the 'ship.  It looked like they were doing
it.  As far as I know, they still haven't completed it.  At that time, we
were told that LR want all ships to have this type of place (for demos and
training)(which would be hard for the "city" dealers) AND that LR wanted all
of the ships be seperate from any other makes.  THEREFORE, I come to the
conclusion that IF they were going this route; they would probably have the
SAME staff (with probably the same training)

I know it's a lot of guesses and little facts, but it's something to think
about.  In my opinion, some of the poor service has to do with pride and
doing a well done job.  Don't even get me started on the service staff.  On
one hand, all you with series and older RR that do your own service are
fortunate- You know that the job is done right (hopefully) or at least what
kind of effort went into the job.

Kris-94 Disco. "Thumper" (the name gives it personality)

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jan 96 13:10:24 EST
From: "Bobeck, David R." <dbobeck@ushmm.org>
Subject: Re[2]: Hand cranking

Just to add fuel to the "fire", I was told ny a British "sports car" "mechanic" 
that retarding the timing a little reduced the chances of the hand crank kicking
back. Old cars that were made to be started this way had a control for this 
inside the cab. 

Cheers

Dave "or was it advancing" Bobeck

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jan 96 11:07:31 PST
From: "BREAKFIELD ERNEST" <breakfield.ernest@smtpgateway.centigram.com>
Subject: (not quite) Automatic 2-4wd

        prerequisite initial disclaimer/confession for the LR exclusive 
     types;
        my current 4x4 wasn't built overseas, and is NOT full time 4wd. 
     however, in the context of this discussion, it doesn't matter...
     
        being, amongst other things, a "wintersports recreationalist" (the 
     Natl. Park Service calls us something like that!), i have found (in 
     seasons when we really had SNOW here in Nor Cal!) that the MANUALLY 
     controlled option of shifting in and out of (part-time) 4wd 
     'on-the-fly' was very desirable on snowy roads when going on and off 
     of sections of roadway that were in varying degrees of "clearage"... 
     (i don't know if i'd like anything or anybody determining FOR me when 
     i should and shouldn't be 'in lock' or 2wd.) while i wasn't anxious to 
     run with a locked dif on the cleared sections of pavement, it was 
     comforting to be able to grab the xfr case lever while moving ("at any 
     legal speed"!) whenever i might happen upon a slipperier patch of 
     roadway. getting out to lock hubs, etc., would have been an additional 
     inconvenience, and i have to imagine that some less hardy souls would 
     probably have gotten out even less often than i did in order to 'lock 
     up' their hubs thereby missing the added security of the additional 
     traction, and/or unnecessarily winding up the drivetrain!
        my last (foreign!) all-wheel drive was comforting the same way, but 
     i didn't end up locking the center dif quite as often, knowing that 
     all 4 were supposed to be twisting. as soon as ANY wheel spun though, 
     all forward traction was lost as the dif's allowed all torque to spin 
     the one free wheel, and i'd throttle-off to lock up (at least) the 
     center dif, using the rear locker only when it was coming over the 
     hood!
     
                                                        happy trails,
                                                                e

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jan 96 13:38:14 EST
From: "Bobeck, David R." <dbobeck@ushmm.org>
Subject: Re[2]: LANDROVER BOOTS

To change subscription write to: Majordomo@Land-Rover.Team.Net

Mark sez...

>Those looking for a good pair of leather boots for the winter mud season, can 
>do no wrong than go to your local "THOM MCANN" Shoe store. They are selling 
>"LANDROVER" footwear. Not the same brand as our beloved vehicles, but they do 
>say "LANDROVER" on them, ALL TERRAIN at that ! 
-

They also sold shirts and assorted knapsacks with thier "LANDROVER" logo.
I've got one of the shirts... Not a bad deal.

Now, if Thom Mcann can get their sales staff to be a little more snobbish, it'll
give that "Genuine" Land Rover feeling...

Dave

------------------------------

From: "Tom Rowe" <trowe@AE.AGECON.WISC.EDU>
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 13:23:15 GMT -0600
Subject: misc.

Sandy Grice writes in answer to my question regarding thread size for 
a 2.25 block heater. Someone wanted a PN.

"They're 1" NPT.  Mine is about 400 watts.  Installation requires"
-snip
Zero Start PN for a 600 watt heater is 880-3293. I don't know the 
element profile so no idea if it will fit.

ericz@cloud9.net writes:

"Just read a message recommending 'never-sieze' for the brake drum
screws.  I would also highly recommend this substance for spark plugs
on aluminum engines (Defender, Disco, RR, Stage I).  The corossion
between the steel plug and the aluminum head can sometimes make it
near impossible to remove the spark plug."
-snip
A warning on anti seize compounds and spark plugs. If they aren't 
designed for them they could interfere with heat transfer and/or 
electrical conductivity. NeverSeeze (brand name) is the only one I am 
familar with (I'm sure there are others) that can be used on spark 
plugs and also diesel fuel injectors. I've been using it for years 
that way and never a problem. Besides that, and bolts, I  use it on 
brake drum screws, and lug nuts. Mixed with a little motor oil it makes a 
great cuting oil also. For high temp applications (use on my exhaust 
manifold) they make a nuclear grade that has nickel in it. For those 
of you that cook on your series grill, they also make a food grade. 
:-)

On the Land Rover boots:
Thom McCahn (sp?) has been making those boots for at least 15 years 
but now that BMW owns LR maybe they will harass them. Buy 'em while 
you can. There's also company that makes two mountain bikes
called Land Rover and Range Rover. Or at least there used to be.
And for all you geeks, there's the comm server from Shiva called the 
LAN Rover.

Tom Rowe
UW-Madison Center for Dairy Research    
Madison,WI, USA
608-265-6194, Fax:608-262-1578        
trowe@ae.agecon.wisc.edu                

 Four wheel drive allows you to get
 stuck in places even more inaccessible.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jan 96 19:30:20 UT
From: "Douglas Main, jr" <douglastmain@msn.com>
Subject: Swivel pin balls

Hello again friends,

I thought of another Land Rover tid bit.  I heard that there is a place that 
will strip, repair and rechrome a pair of swivel pin balls (found on all LR 
front axles) for around $150.00.   The big question is of course; does anyone 
know the name, address, etc. of this shop.  I saw a car that had them done and 
they looked beautiful (and no leaks, believe it or not!!).  Unfortunately I 
did not get the information that I am now asking for.

Thank you all so very much,

Doug      
73 88" and 66 88"
Danbury, CT
douglastmain@msn.com

------------------------------

Subject: Re: Big Sky Rovers 
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 11:44:12 -0800
From: Benjamin Allan Smith <bens@archimedes.vislab.navy.mil>

In message <199601161606.LAA23893@butler.uk.stratus.com>you wrote:
  
> I subscribe to the Hemmings Motor News and under Land Rover parts section I  
> have seen two interesting ads for land rover parts.  The first ad is for AAA 
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 7 lines)]
> UPS?  Are the parts usally decent quality?  
> Any other info on these places would be great!

	In general in the US, if a parts vendor isn't in the FAQ, then it is 
new or does very low sales volume (and hence not many people know of it).  ]
(I'll be adding Mohammad in Long Island soon)

	Big Sky LR:  Isn't that the chap that was selling parts off of Canadian 
military artillery targets and claiming they were in good shape.  "Yes its
a fine gas tank", but when it arrives you find 3 bullet holes.  Sandy Grice
or Roy Caldwell could you confirm or deny that Big Sky LR is who I think it
is?

Ben
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Benjamin Smith------------bens@vislab.navy.mil---------1972 Land Rover SIII 88
 Science Applications International Corporation
 Naval Air Warfare Center, Weapons Division, China Lake

"...If I were running such a contest, I would specifically eliminate any entry
 from Ben involving driving the [Land] Rover anywhere.  He'd drive it up the
 Amazon basin for a half can of Jolt and a stale cookie..."  --Kevin Archie

------------------------------

Subject: Re: misc. 
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 12:00:14 -0800
From: Benjamin Allan Smith <bens@archimedes.vislab.navy.mil>

In message <199601161921.OAA24376@butler.uk.stratus.com>you wrote:
  
] On the Land Rover boots:
] Thom McCahn (sp?) has been making those boots for at least 15 years 
] but now that BMW owns LR maybe they will harass them. Buy 'em while 
] you can. There's also company that makes two mountain bikes
] called Land Rover and Range Rover. Or at least there used to be.

	If I correctly recall an LRO article on this from a number of
years ago, in the US, registered trademarks are related to a specific type
of product.  So LR owns the name Land Rover as related to automobiles.   
Thom McCahn ownes the name Land Rover as related to footwear.  And there
is nothing that LR can do about it (or vise versa).  

	Of more concern to LR would be keeping their ownership of the
name world wide.  The same article mentioned that in one of the South
American countries (Brazil?  Argentina?) LR had late the trademark run out.
And some individual bought the name.  When LR went to re-enter that
market, they couldn't get the trademark back.   Legally, LR couldn't sell
their product there without this individual's permission.

	I think the article was in a 1992 or 1993 LRO.

Ben
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Benjamin Smith------------bens@vislab.navy.mil---------1972 Land Rover SIII 88
 Science Applications International Corporation
 Naval Air Warfare Center, Weapons Division, China Lake

"...If I were running such a contest, I would specifically eliminate any entry
 from Ben involving driving the [Land] Rover anywhere.  He'd drive it up the
 Amazon basin for a half can of Jolt and a stale cookie..."  --Kevin Archie

------------------------------

From: "Hugh Grierson" <Hugh_Grierson@trimble.co.nz>
Date:          Wed, 17 Jan 1996 10:04:02 +1300
Subject:       Re: (not quite) Automatic 2-4wd

>      i have found (in 
>      seasons when we really had SNOW here in Nor Cal!) that the MANUALLY 
>      controlled option of shifting in and out of (part-time) 4wd 
>      'on-the-fly' was very desirable on snowy roads when going on and off 

Agreed.  In the (series) Landy if you leave the hubs locked then it is
possible to shift from 2 to Hi-4 on the fly, but not back again (unless
you're _really_ good at rev matching).  I've always wondered if there
is some way the t'box could be set up to release the hi4 knob
when the hi-low lever is just shifted to neutral, rather than having
to shift all the way to low.  Then 4 to 2 shifting could be done on
the fly.
-- 
Hugh Grierson   hugh_grierson@trimble.co.nz  

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 13:05:55 -0800
From: greg@triteal.com (Greg White)
Subject: Smiths Gauges

Does anyone know a source of kits for connecting Smiths guages to a Series II 
Diesel?  I've just acquired a rebuild dual oil/water Smiths guage, but I have 
not been able to connect to the previous guage connector on the oil filter.  It 
seems to be a mis-match of any but standard connectors.  Any supplier or vendor 
references would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in Advance!

Gregory Jay White
TriTeal Corporation
2011 Palomar Airport Road, Suite 200
Carlsbad, CA  92009-1431
Phone:  619-930-2077, Extension 5515
Fax: 	619-930-2081
http://www.triteal.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jan 96 16:09:43 EST
From: "Bobeck, David R." <dbobeck@ushmm.org>
Subject: Re[2]: land Rover camping

I lived for 3 months last winter in my 90. Cots? I just used a sunlounger. 
Fits along the sideboxes and over the bulkhead just like the cots. Cost a 
fraction and is more use outside the lorry too.

What's a sunlounger?
Where can I get one?
Dave"Mr. Inquisitive"

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 15:02:21 -0800 (PST)
From: John Brabyn <brabyn@skivs.ski.org>
Subject: RE: Hi-lift jack in a RR, gauge location.

Sorry to be slow getting back on this due to being out of the office!

No, actually I don't currently have a hi lift, mainly because I don't 
know what to use as jacking points on the RR except for the trailer hitch.

What I do have in the right rear wheel arch area, hidden by the carpet 
flap, is a shovel, pick, axe and pry bar.
(as well as the standard jack -- which has failed on me once in the outback!)

Let me know if you folks have any ideas on where to store and how to use 
a hi lift on an RR. I think you could make a bracket to fit one along 
under the front of the rear seat. But the question remains how to USE it 
without wrecking the bumpers etc. (same applies to the Discovery).

Cheers

John Brabyn

89RR

On Thu, 11 Jan 1996, Mark Talbot wrote:

> To change subscription write to: Majordomo@Land-Rover.Team.Net
> Think John Brabyn (SP?) mounted his hi-lift inside the rear wheel arch of his 
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 55 lines)]
> #=======#          ________           We make a living by what we get,
> |__|__|__\___     /__/__|__\___        we make a life by what we give.
> | _|  |   |_ |}   \_/-\_|__/-\_|}

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 18:10:44 -0500 (EST)
From: Dixon Kenner <dkenner@emr1.emr.ca>
Subject: Re: misc. 

On Tue, 16 Jan 1996, Benjamin Allan Smith wrote:

> 	Of more concern to LR would be keeping their ownership of the
> name world wide.  The same article mentioned that in one of the South
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 6 lines)]
> market, they couldn't get the trademark back.   Legally, LR couldn't sell
> their product there without this individual's permission.

	Brazil...

	Considering how LR abandoned North America in 1974 (no official
	notice, etc.) one wonders about the few dealerships left from that
	era still with the yellow and green LR sign hanging outside
	(yes, there are a few...) and claiming to be offical LR centres.

	Rgds,

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 15:15:55 -0800 (PST)
From: John Brabyn <brabyn@skivs.ski.org>
Subject: Re: (not quite) Automatic 2-4wd

An interesting approach to this is the 1996 Jeep Grand Cherokee with the 
Quadratrac option. I gather they've changed it so the viscous coupling is 
the only connection to the front driveshaft?? Anyway the effect is that 
"90%" of the torque goes to the rear wheels under normal conditions and 
the front wheels only grab if one of the rear wheels starts slipping. So 
you never know whether you're in 2 or 4 wheel drive.

Four Wheeler Magazine seemed to like this arrangement well enough to give
the Jeep the Four Wheeler of the Year award over the new RR and 7 other
vehicles. It was never clear from reading it that the Jeep was any good
off road. It had the worst ramp travel index (RTI) of the test (as well as
one of the worst breakover angles) whereas the RR had the best of both.
The RTI was 600 (even better than a Disco) compared with the Jeep's 400,
and the breakover was 29 degrees versus the Jeeps 17. Instead, the comment
was made about the Jeep that IF you should "add a sway bar disconnect, big
tires and lockers, it should go anywhere". 

Such is progress.

Cheers

John Brabyn
89RR

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 15:34:00 -0500
From: landrvr@blacdisc.com (Mike Loiodice)
Subject: Re: Are PCV valves needed??

Gordon asks about PVC valves..

>There was discussion last week regarding PCV valves that vent presure	
>build-up in the crankcase. I checked my engine (2.25l) and I see
>a short hose dirrectly from the valve cover to the air intake. 
>I suspect that the valve was removed and never replaced and the engine
>seems to run as well as can be expected.
-

The hose from the valve cover to the air intake is OK. The PVC valve mounts
on top of the intake manifold. On a '65 it would have been ported directly
into the manifold - on later IIa's and III's it would have been ported into
an adaptor between the carb and the manifold. There should be a vent tube on
the oil fill tube. A short hose connects the vent to a pipe which runs
around the front of the engine. Another short hose connects the pipe to the
PVC valve. At least that's the way my '65 was. (It was originally purchased
in Pennsylvania). 

Cheers
Mike Loiodice
166 W. Fulton St.                  1965 SerIIa 88 Petrol - Faded Green     
Gloversville                       1972 SerIII 88 Petrol - Fern Camo
NY  12078  (USA)        7          1971 SerIIa 88 Petrol - Red and Blue
                     #:-}>

------------------------------

From: PurnellJE@aol.com
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 18:20:44 -0500
Subject: Re: More on Dealers.

In a message dated 96-01-16 13:47:24 EST, you write:

> Don't even get me started on the service staff.  

I am very fortunate so far.  The dealer I must use, over an hour away in
Milwaukee, called Berndt Land Rover, has been good so far.  My check engine
light came on a day or so before my trip to Vermont, called the service
writer, and he said he'd "red carpet" me as soon as I got in tehre in the
morning, about 9am.  THis was on my way out of town mind you.  He pulled the
mechanic off a job and read the code on the ECU, fortunately no big deal, and
cleared it and sent me on my way.  (The light has since returned though.)  

Also, the sales staff have always been happy to have me crawling around the
rigs there.  Granted, they see me pull up in a Def90, but always spend time.
 (they don't know a whole lot, but they try.)  Now, it could be that this
dealership is more friendly to the jeans/teeshirt crowd (fits me) because
they are a Buick  dealer also.  And the 'hood they're in is blue collar.
 Maybe they realize that all "credit approvals" are green.  

I wrote a letter to LRNA commending this  check engine light service from
Berndt, and they sent me a nice letter back.  I guess they spend more time on
the "good" reports than the bad ones.  

John. 
94 D90, Madison, Wisconsin

PS  Anyone from Milwaukee on this list?  Someone there has a  green D90 1995
with the fiberglass hardtop and "muy fuerte" bumper/winch?  

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 15:34:00 -0500
From: landrvr@blacdisc.com (Mike Loiodice)
Subject: Re: Hand Cranking

Peter...

>Let me get this straight about hand cranking etiquette?? Thumbs on the same
>side of the crank as fingers, and always pull up?? Is that the consensus??
-

Should work.. Key on, tranny in neutral (duhh), choke and hand throttle as
you see fit... Mind that crank if it kicks. I've never started my Rover with
a crank, but I used to have to start the tractors on the farm with one when
I was a lad... The big, nasty Oliver kicked back one day. The crank (which
was much higher than the one one the Rover) caught me in the chest and threw
me back 8 or 10 feet. Hurt like hell too.

>Now, if your battery is completely dead, will cand cranking work? Do you need
>some juice, or does the alt. create it all?  Could you run without a battery
>at all? or how about vice versa, you have a good battery, and your
>alternator/generator goes out??? 
-

You gotta have *something* to provide a spark with. In a pinch, a 6 volt
lantern battery hooked to the + side of the coil and to ground will work.
All you need power for is the coil. You can forget all the other stuff like
lights, wipers, etc. You can run the engine without a battery if the
alternator is good. Probably not on a generator though...

>I noticed, as I was parked in a small water filled culvert, that there was
>some flourecent green liquid mixed in with the mud brown liquid that was
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 6 lines)]
>till I get it out.It is a small leak. Is this somthing that can be repaired,
>or am I better off with a new radiator?
-

You can solder the radiator or pull it out and take it to a shop that does
radiators. I had mine repaired a couple of months ago. They fixed two leaks
and resoldered the bracket on one side. Total cost was $30.00 US. 

>Lastly, does anyone have a good way to get broken bleed screws out of the
>wheel cylinders?????
>I have three broken, and that means 4 new cylinders. Is there a better way?
-

Your probably better off just going for new cylinders. 

Cheers
 
Mike Loiodice
166 W. Fulton St.                  1965 SerIIa 88 Petrol - Faded Green     
Gloversville                       1972 SerIII 88 Petrol - Fern Camo
NY  12078  (USA)        7          1971 SerIIa 88 Petrol - Red and Blue
                     #:-}>

------------------------------

From: debrown@srp.gov
Date: 16 Jan 96 16:30:33 MST
Subject: Responses to threads...

FROM:  David Brown                           Internet: debrown@srp.gov
       Computer Graphics Specialist * Mapping Services & Engr Graphics
       PAB219 (602)236-3544 -  Pager:6486 External (602)275-2508 #6486
Waving:
I wave to ALL LR's. "Normally" I drive my '87 Range Rover, occasionally, my
'70 109. I RARELY get to see the Series models around Phoenix Arizona, but
when I do, they will always get a BIG wave! As for newer RR's not waving,
some is probably "snobbery", while another part is most likely ignorance.
The "yuppy types" (no offense, please) mostly don't know that their
expensive vehicles are a derivative of the series vehicle that's waving to
them, and therefore must be assuming that they must have gotten some grey
poupon spilled on them of something. When I wave to some other RR's, again,
I think sometimes they don't recognize it from the front since the air dam
is off... either that, or I need to use more of a "Ralph Lauren" type wave,
instead of a crazed LR owner wave! ;-)

Bottle openers:
It's good to know that I have an instant bottle opener in my IIa, now where
can I open a bottle inside my RR??? Guess I'll just have to keep that opener
on my 2-part keychain. Wish I liked beer more. (Is that "non-Roverish??) ;-)

Dealers:
The LR dealer in Scottsdale Arizona is pretty good. I've been in there all
"dressed up", and jeans, tee shirt, hiking boots, and even with sales droids
that haven't seen me before, I always received a warm and courteous welcome.
Knowledge of the product, however, is quite another story.

Magazine subscription offers:
This REALLY burns me!!!! There MUST be some way to keep these #@$%- things
off the net!!!

Temperatures:
Looks like we're in the high 70's again! Sigh, no sign of rain... ;-)

Dave (no more comments) Brown

 #=====#         #========#          -------,___          _________
 |___|__\___     |___|__|__\___      |--' |  |  \_|_     //__/__|__\___
 | _ |   |_ |}   | _ |  |   |_ |}    |  _ |--+--|_  |    \__/-\_|__/-\_|}
 "(_)""""(_)"    "(_)"""""""(_)"    ||_/_\___|__/_\_|}      (_)    (_)
                                       (_)      (_)
 1971 "88" IIa   1970 "109" IIa     1994 Discovery (Sold) '87 Range Rover
 LIC: LION B8    Historic plates     (Too hard to "draw")  rear Lock-Right
 Phoenix Arizona USA                                       Crane cam

#=======#         _________           We make a living by what we get,
|__|__|__\___    //__/__|__\___        we make a life by what we give.
| _|  |   |_ |}  \__/-\_|__/-\_|}
"(_)""""""(_)"      (_)    (_)                       Winston Churchill

------------------------------

From: brucet@iimef-emh1.clb.usmc.mil
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 96 18:22:20 EST
Subject: Getting a Winch!

Hi All!!
	I have finally set aside enough (almost) money to put a winch on 
my 94 D90 (#003).  I am looking for advice on which set up to get.  The 
two presently in the running are the Warn 9000i and the Superwinch Huskey 
8500.  For the Warn I would use the standard winch bumper offered by LRNA. 
For the Superwinch I would use the RN set up.  In either case I plan to 
purchase the winch from RN and install it prior to the BRLC get together 
2-3 Feb.   Unfortunalty I don't have a bottomless check book and the 
additional requirements, springs, second battery, HO alternator, accessory 
kit, etc... threaten to cause great turmoil on the homefront, unless I can 
manage to keep the "hidden costs" of the project hidden from my better 
(and less LR fanatical) half.
So the point is 
1.  Does anyone have any experience good or bad with the two whinches in 
question?
2.  What are the minimum required initial outlays in addition to the winch 
and the bumper?  What can I do without for the time being?
3.  How difficult is the actual installation?  

Thanks,
Thom Bruce  D90 #003

------------------------------

From: smitha@candw.lc
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 15:44:10 -0800
Subject: diesel

Dixon - the information in the gasoline and oil FAQs is just great. It is 
particularly good to get the definitive word on oil additives. Is there any plan 
for something similar in diesel? How useful are all the injector cleaners, water 
dispersants, etc.? They all sound good, but then so did Slik 50.
Cheers.
Allan Smith
300Tdi 90
St. Lucia

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 19:16:34 -0500
From: Joseph Broach <calas@utkux1.utk.edu>
Subject: Door top removal

Hello all,

Could some enlightened Rover owner tell me the trick to separating 
the lower door and top? The bolts came off with ease after a good 
soaking, but now I am baffled. Thanks in advance!

Joseph
'67 IIa 88"

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jan 96 16:15:54 EST
From: jib@big.att.com (Jan Ben)
Subject: more on RR parts.  Haynes D90/110 fs

Hello again,

1. Re: RR parting co-op:

	- auto tranny/xfer case _may_ be spoken for, no $ down yet, tho.
	- I called it LWB, I guess it is a "regular" 4-door
	- we're down to rolling chassis (incl gas tanks?) ,
	  so please don't ask me about seats, burl dash or stereo :)

2. I don't need the Haynes  "90/110 diesel", almost new, only
a couple of grease fingerprints.  $25 + shipping

3. Started working on the Olds 215 to replace the 3.5l.  I can see why the cam goes
  in 70k miles on these babies.  There are some fixes to the oiling problem.
  One cyl. is seized, all bores are scored.  Looks like I will be getting new pistons,
 afterall.  The olds heads are different from Buick and Rover.  They supposedly flow
  better then the Buick 215, but not as good as post-SD1 Rover heads.
  The 4bbl intake is nice, though.  Easy replacement for either dual Strombergs or
  a dying EFI.

Happy Rovering
Jan

------------------------------

From: paul@frcs.alt.za (Paul Nash)
Subject: Split swivel seals
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 1996 11:35:33 -0200 (EST)

A few people have asked me about the split seals that I recently
fitted to my S3.  These make life _far_ easier, as you don't even have
to lift the front of the car (althoug it`d probably help) -- the worst
bit of the job is getting a hacksaw in to cut through the old seal.

The split seals do not have a metal rim -- they're rubber, with a
joinable spring.  After unbolting the retainer & removing the old
seal, you just fill the new one with grease, wrap it around the ball,
join the sprint & slip it into the seal.  Bolt up the retainer and
you're away.  Dead easy.

I got mine from "4 Wheel Drives" in Melbourne, having been tipped off
by Daryl Webb in Adelaide.  I phoned them to ask where they sourced
them, but the parts person didn't know, other than that they import
them from England.  Anyone in Melbourne with some time on their hands
want to visit them and find out?

4WD sell them at A$ 15.00 each (plus P&P), and are quite happy to take
creidt cards and to send international mail off.  Their contact
details are:

	Four Wheel Drives
	304 Middleborough Road
	Blackburn South
	VIC 3130
	Australia

	Tel: +61 3 890-0509 (becomes +61 3 9890-0509 sometime)
	Fax: +61 3 898-6374 (becomes +61 3 9898-6374 sometime)

I hope that this helps.

	paul

------------------------------

Subject: Re: diesel 
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 16:43:21 -0800
From: Benjamin Allan Smith <bens@archimedes.vislab.navy.mil>

In message <199601162345.SAA24755@butler.uk.stratus.com>you wrote:
  
] Dixon - the information in the gasoline and oil FAQs is just great. It is 
] particularly good to get the definitive word on oil additives. Is there any 
] plan for something similar in diesel? How useful are all the injector 
] cleaners, water
] dispersants, etc.? They all sound good, but then so did Slik 50.

	Dixon probably off drinking Guinness by now...  I dunno how Dixon
origionally found those FAQs.  In general, if anyone finds an FAQ that they
think would be of use to the LR community, I (and assume all of the other
Rover pages) would be more than happy to add the links.  I personally
don't know of any and a quick search didn't find any specific information.
(though I did find the US code on how fuel is taxed).

Ben
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Benjamin Smith------------bens@vislab.navy.mil---------1972 Land Rover SIII 88
 Science Applications International Corporation
 Naval Air Warfare Center, Weapons Division, China Lake

"...If I were running such a contest, I would specifically eliminate any entry
 from Ben involving driving the [Land] Rover anywhere.  He'd drive it up the
 Amazon basin for a half can of Jolt and a stale cookie..."  --Kevin Archie

------------------------------

From: BDaviscar@aol.com
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 19:55:45 -0500
Subject: Why won't it work?

In a message dated 96-01-16 09:25:29 EST, you write:

>On Tue, 16 Jan 1996 BDaviscar@aol.com wrote:
>> I did but after fitting a delco alt.  I made it - earth. but what is the
>> difference in the senders?  Electron flow should not make any difference

in
>> how the sender works.
>	Bloody good question...  I've asked why I can't use a - earth sender
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 9 lines)]
>	anyway to see what happens.  It is just a coil sending a esistance
>	down the line...

Can anyone  answer this one? I can't And I am a electronic tech!

Bruce  Chicago
6 SIIA 88 Patches

------------------------------

From: BDaviscar@aol.com
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 19:55:50 -0500
Subject: Re: Series Parts

In a message dated 96-01-16 17:30:25 EST, you write:

>Sounds like you need a speedo cable, not a speedo.  $20 vs 
>$200.  Call Rovers North at (602) 748-8115 or Atlantic 
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 6 lines)]
>$200.  Call Rovers North at (602) 748-8115 or Atlantic 
>British at (518) 664-6169 and get one.
Thanks  to all of you for this type of info.  I forgot to tell you that when
I got Patches(67 SIIA 88) It had no speedo cable and I had  to installed a
new one. the speedo only makes the noise/ does the "jig" when it is cold out.
and the OD don't work anyhow.
so I thought I might need a new/used one  Someone as parting out two or three
Series LR's a short time ago DO you have one that works you can part with?
 Sorry I don't remeber who.

Bruce  Chicago

67 SIIA 88 Patches (well named that is for sure!) 

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 17 Jan 1996 02:22:08 -0600 (CST)
From: "Soren Vels Christensen" <velssvch@inet.uni-c.dk>
Subject: RE: Door top removal

In message Tue, 16 Jan 1996 19:16:34 -0500,
  Joseph Broach <calas@utkux1.utk.edu>  writes:

> Could some enlightened Rover owner tell me the trick to separating
> the lower door and top? The bolts came off with ease after a good
On the sIII there are two little hole on the bottom of the door tops. I just
put in a screwdriver and wiggle it up and down a little. The rubber seals
seems to stick the two halves together. Holes or not, put in the screwdriver
or the bowie knife and wiggle.

rgds
sv/aurens

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 17 Jan 1996 02:21:59 -0600 (CST)
From: "Soren Vels Christensen" <velssvch@inet.uni-c.dk>
Subject: Re: (not quite) Automatic 2-4wd (LONG!)

In message Wed, 17 Jan 1996 10:04:02 +1300,
  "Hugh Grierson" <Hugh_Grierson@trimble.co.nz>  writes:
:: you're _really_ good at rev matching).  I've always wondered if there
:: is some way the t'box could be set up to release the hi4 knob
:: when the hi-low lever is just shifted to neutral, rather than having
:: to shift all the way to low.  Then 4 to 2 shifting could be done on
:: the fly.

Quite simple (i think?).

Take your manual(s) and view all the drawings of the GB. Especially the one
on page 206 in the DIY guide by Lindsay Porter (i blew that up to incredible
size on a copier at work) and [1RC61] in the workshop manual (sIII). You'll
see that the rod that engages the dog clutch comes out through the front end
of the reduction box above the front driveshaft flange. There is a cover (i
hope) with two blinded tubes that allows the clutch rod and the rod with the
little hole to move in and out of the box. A simple approach is to make an
extra mechanism that allows you only to disengage 4WD. In the following i
assume LHD. RHD is much simpler.
Drill a hole in the cover. Drill a hole in the clutch rod and cut a thread.
Make a mounting plate that fits over to or three bolts at the end of the
box. Modify a hi/lo shift lever and fit the end to the plate. Undo three
bolts from the box and mount the assembly to the box with slightly longer
bolts. Mount the angled plate (where the ball is) to the rod. The lever
should be hammered flat on top and have a hole drilled there.
Gearboxes with OD have a piece of bend iron on top. If not there, make one.
At the rear facing side weld on two pieces of 4mm plate and drill one hole
in each. Take a piece of pipe and drill a hole (3-5mm) in one end. Make a
piece of 4mm steel about 1/2 inch wide and a certain length (to be
calculated). Drill a hole in each end. One about 3mm and one the same dia.
as the pipe. Slide the plate over one end of the tube and weld. Cut a thread
in the hole in the other end of the tube. Take a lenght of 3-4mm rod and cut
a thread in each end. Run the pipe throught the holes in the plates on the
bend iron on top of the GB. Cut a slot in the seatbox. Insert the rod in the
thread at the end of the pipe. Find a knob that fits the other end of the
rod. Take a length of rod (calculated or probed), hammer it flat on both
ends and drill a hole in each end about 3mm. Bolt one end of the rod to the
other end of the 1/2 inch wide plate and the other to the end of the
modified lever.
You should now be able to engage as usual (provided that you didn't use the
yellow knob for the new lever). To disengage, just pull (or push if you
mounted the 1/2 inch wide iron plate 180 deg. from the lever) the new lever
and the yellow knob should pop up like usual. 2/4/2WD on the fly.

A far more interesting approach is to integrate these two levers in one. It
is very difficult to engage with old fashioned (by some preferred) fixed
seat belts. And also you never know what you'll see in front of you when you
return from the dive. (I almost hit a tourist last summer at the beach).
Making a two-in-one only requires a little more work. The following is just
an example.
Remove the little metal pin that goes into the hole in the centre rod. Well,
remove the whole engage assembly, but keep it in the back with the U-bolts.
Plug the hole in the housing or cut a thread and draw a breather tube to a
T-pipe and breathe both boxes remotely.
Take a piece of 3mm steel about 1 inch wide and of a suitable length
(depending on lever travel) and drill four 6 mm holes. Two at each end.
About an inch between them. Between the two innermost holes cut a slot the
same with as the lever dia. plus a typical Solihull tolerance. Find a short
(about 1.5 inch) piece of pipe that fits over the lever (with a
sligh tolerance) about 10mm outer dia. Using a lathe or a file remove 4.2mm
outer dia. about6-7mm up.
Bend the steel band to half a circle and angle the ends. The outermost 6mm
holes are of course for fitting the thing to the seat box. With the guide in
place and the knob off the lever, slide the little tube over the lever with
the lathed end against the guide followed by a suitable spring and the knob.
The length of the slot needs not be precise. You can always drill the
"engaged"-hole along the line at engaged+10mm. The tolerance is similar to
the nescessary slack in the clutch pedal. If it's too difficult to get a
grip on the lock tube when shifting (we're always up to our elbows in 90wt)
one can make a pin arrangement that clamps on the tube. Autostick type. Real
plush!. Disco and all that. With a pink fur knob.

Now - The most most important of all. My question to you is: Have i
overlooked a detail that makes all this impossibel? Is it all Wallace and
Grommit?. I'm just beginning to understand the gearbox and how all the rods
and shafts and axels moves.

All comments, critics, flames and incoming anvils welcome. I need to know.

regards
sv/aurens

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 17 Jan 1996 02:22:05 -0600 (CST)
From: "Soren Vels Christensen" <velssvch@inet.uni-c.dk>
Subject: RE: Responses to threads...

In message 16 Jan 96 16:30:33 MST, debrown@srp.gov  writes:

> Bottle openers:
> It's good to know that I have an instant bottle opener in my IIa, now
> where can I open a bottle inside my RR??? Guess I'll just have to keep
Is there a slot in the CD-player?

> that opener on my 2-part keychain. Wish I liked beer more. (Is that
> "non-Roverish??) ;-)
Yes.

rgds
sv/aurens

------------------------------

From: KKelly6788@aol.com
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 20:25:14 -0500
Subject: NHTSA Web Site

I just found (well I saw it posted on the BMW list) a great Web Site.  It has
all the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration Safety recalls.

http://www.autosite.com:80/library/nhtsa/recalls/reclmenu.htm

I looked and found the gas tank recall for my Range Rover (I had my new one
put in last week). 

Kevin Kelly

------------------------------

Date: 16 Jan 96 22:35:48 EST
From: "AMEDEO (Denver, CO)" <102505.3511@compuserve.com>
Subject: Land Rover Videos

 There have been inquiries about videos...

Well, just go to any LR dealer and you will find in the new Gear Catalogue
and probably displayed in the showcase many videos for around $ 20.
Here are some:
Range Rover: Off-Road Driving the Exceptional Way
Defender 90: Exceptional Off-Road Adventure
Discovery Off-Road: Driving La Ruta Maya
Camel Trophy 93 (Tis the one with LR pulling locomotive)
Camel Trophy 94
Winching with a Rather Exceptional vehicle
The Great Divide Expedition
Land Rover Adventures

Amedeo
Land Rover Denver East
87 RR

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 23:06:40 -0500
From: rover@pinn.net (Alexander P. Grice)
Subject: Spares and tools

Following the thread on tools and spares, here's how I've dealt with the 
problem.  Owing to the places that I go, I carry *a lot* of spares and can 
perform just about any task short of a complete engine rebuild at trailside.

Anyway, I've mounted a Sears tool box in place of one of the rear bech seats 
in the back of the 88.  A strand of 1/4" sailboat shroud wire with swaged 
eyes is threaded through the metal channel beneath the windows and through 
two U-bolts on the side of the body box.  This prevents the tool box from 
walking off in the night as well as coming adrift when off road.

Old-style metal milk crates make great spares bins.  Mine is bolted down 
with a plywood lid heavily bungeed in place.  The space behind both is a 
safe, secure place to store extra axles (wrapped in grease/paper/plastic, of 
course).  Happy trails
      *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"----*
      |               A. P. (Sandy) Grice                   |
      |       Rover Owners' Association of Virginia         |
      |    1633 Melrose Parkway, Norfolk, VA 23508-1730     |
      |  E-mail: rover@pinn.net  Phone: 804-622-7054 (Day)  |
      |    804-423-4898 (Evenings)    FAX: 804-622-7056     |
      *-----------------------------------------------------*

------------------------------

From: slade@teleport.com
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 12:27:26 -0800
Subject: Pacific Northwest Team Trophy Challenge (long)

>From Doug Shipman's hand to your screen:

Pacific Northwest Team Trophy Challenge
May 18th and 19th 1996
Lee's Camp, Oregon

Test your off-road skills in a competitive event against others.  This two
day team even will allow you and your 4x4 to test your preparedness for the
unknow.  You and your team mates will be encountering a variety of tasks,
not limited to just driving.  Over the two day period you will cover three
routes, each with their own challenges.  Expect to be required to read a
map and compass, to do team tasks, balance your truck, drive a trials
setion, winch, and anything else we can throw at you.  Your passenger will
even leave you for short periods,, and hopefully you'll pick him or her
back up.  The winning team will have the best score over the two day
period.

What is a team?

A team shall consist of two vehicles and not more than four people tota.
That means only two per vehicle!  At least one vehicle shall have a working
winch.

Vehicle Requirements:

All are to be street legal and licensed in their respective states.  O.R.V.
stickers will be needed where applicable.  (see below)

Dune buggies, jeeps, and 4x4's are required to have ATV operator permits
only in state-designated areas.  The landowners in these areas reaquire
permits purchased from any Oregon Motor Vehicles Division office.  Permits
ae not required in some areas, so contact the landowner before arriving.
ATV permits are valid for two years.  An operator of a motor vehicle is
required to have a valid driver's license.  Any unlicensed operator of a 3
or 4 wheeler, if unaccompanied by a licensed driver at least 18 years old,
must complete a rider safety course taught by a state certified instructor.
Unless registered in a state that participated in a reciprocal agrement
with Oregon, out-of-state enthusiasts must register like residents.  Be
sure to check with your local Motor Vehicles Division office to make sure
you are properly registerd.
(copied from the Oregon Tread Lightly pamphlet)

All must have road legal liability insurance.
Hard tops or roll bars are required.
Tow points front and rear.
Must carry a fire extinguisher, shovel, jack, and a spare tire would be
helpful.  Seat belts!
All vehicles will have a safety inspection before you are allowed on the course.
Note- We have no size restrictions at this time, but, this is put on with
SWB in mind.  You may be routed around if we feel your size may cause
damage to the trail.

This is a limited entry event.  We will be accepting oly forty teams of two
vehicles each.  Please have your entry mailed by May 12th to: Region III
PNW4WDA, 11661 S.E. 272nd Ave., Boring OR  970009, and recieve your
reserved spot with a discounted registration fee.  Entries mailed after
that date should be brought to the event site if we have not reached our
limit.

Entry fee if recieved by May 12th- $50 per vehicle.  Day of registration
will be $60 per vehicle.  T-shirts pre-ordered are $15 ea and available in
s, m, l, xl.

New this year will be a special Club Trophy.  This will be awarded to the
club which has the best score of thier three best teams.

For more info call:

503 661 3220 and leave a message.

Schedule of events:

Friday- Camp is opened up by 4pm.  For those that show this day, at 9pm we
will have a short tech session on map and compass reading (orienteering).
Tech inspections 7-9 pm.

Saturday- Teams begin departing at 8am.  Departure times will be determined
by a random selection process of pre-registered teams.  Late entries will
leave last.  That evening at 10pm we will have a short tech session on
rally time computation and reading route charts.  Tech inspections
6:30-8am.

Sunday- Teams begin departing at 8:30am.  Departure times will be
determined by a random selection prodess.  The top ten from the previous
day will leave earliest.  Lunch will be provided as you return and we
tabulate sores.  WE should be all wrapped up by 2 or 3pm.

Where to go:

Go west on Hwy 26 out of Portland.  Take the Hwy 6 exit towards Tillamook.
The campground is 3/4 miles west of Lee's Camp on the right.  The only
facilities at camp will be port-a-potties.  Gas is available 20 miles back
at the BP you passed or down the road in Tillamook.

Don't pass up the chance!

Last years winners probably have aspirations of repeating!  But, there are
many other teams who are making other plans.  With a different course and
many new tasks to conquer,, this could be anybodies year.  Even if your'e
not the hard core competitive type, you'll have a good time.

(end)

Hope to see many of you there.  I'll be photographing and helping with
timing because unfortunatly now I have a 109!  (should have held onto that
88!)

Later,

Michael

PS  Don't send me inquiries, call the #.

------------------------------

From: HMEdwards@aol.com
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 23:13:21 -0500
Subject: Re: RR in the Movies (Re: Casper's Brain Transplant)

Rob,

May I suggest "Abby Normal"  in light of Uncle Joe's supposed expertise in
the field of electrics.

Harry Edwards
72 Series III
Las Vegas

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 17 Jan 1996 12:11:16 +0800 (WST)
From: TONY YATES  <tonyy@BoM.GOV.AU>
Subject: Polyair 'springs'

Anyone had any experience with Polyair 'springs', ie those inflatable 
plastic things that fit inside coil springs to act as a load leveller?

They are made in Oz, are they available in US/UK?

My rear spring sare starting to get a little low. Still within tolerance 
according to the manual, but noticeable when compared to other vehicles.
They are not sagging enough to justify replacing th esprings so I was 
wondering if now is the time to invest in some Polyairs.

Any comments?

PS I think they are made in Oz?!

Cheers.

====================================================================
                                      _____________________
                                     /_____________________\
Tony Yates                          |                       |
                                    |                       |
Port Hedland                     _  | _________ _ _________ |  _
Western Australia               |-| |[_________] [_________]| |-|
                                |_|  -----------------------  |_|
                                   \|  \ =============== /  |/
A.Yates@bom.gov.au                   =======================
                                    |o  _ |===========| _  o| 
Opinions expressed                 /|  (_)|===========|(_)  |\
here are almost but                ||o____|===========|____o||
not quite entirely                 ||_______________________||
unlike those of the                \[_______________________]/
Bureau of Meteorology.              |\|/|---\_/---------|\|/|
                                    |\|/|               |\|/|
'85 110 V8 (Pamela)                 -----               -----
=====================================================================
                    

------------------------------

From: "Robert Watson (CNA)" <a-robw@microsoft.com>
Subject: RE: (not quite) Automatic 2-4wd
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 20:18:14 -0800

>From: 	John Brabyn[SMTP:brabyn@skivs.ski.org]
>Four Wheeler Magazine seemed to like this arrangement well enough to give
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 8 lines)]
>The RTI was 600 (even better than a Disco) compared with the Jeep's 400,
>and the breakover was 29 degrees versus the Jeeps 17. 
I suspect they were subtly "pressured" to select something other than a LR 
for a change. Since Jeep's a big advertiser... well you do the math :-)

>Instead, the comment
>was made about the Jeep that IF you should "add a sway bar disconnect, big
>tires and lockers, it should go anywhere". 
At least the tell you what to add to make it as good as a Disco or RR so you 
can go shopping after you've bought a JGC. The important part that's missing 
is, will it bring you back! 
    _____
   /|__|_\__(|                           Bob Watson
  |   |   |  \                 a-robw@microsoft.com
  |---|___|___\____      Mountlake Terrace, WA, USA 
  |  _|=  |=  |o_  }\                
 [|_/_ \__|___|/_\_}|    '95 Beluga Black Discovery
    \_/        \_/                            N7UMU
(ok, so I'm a little biased.)

------------------------------

From: Wdcockey@aol.com
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 23:29:49 -0500
Subject: FWH - Locked

This is probably well know to (almost) everyone on the net:
Free wheeling hubs can be left locked while driving in 2wd. This is the same
as not having FWH installed. There is no need to unlock your hubs everytime
you shift out of 4wd.

So if you have FWH, headed into a situation where 4wd may be needed, and you
don't want to get out in mud or snow just to engage the hubs, lock the hubs
before starting out and leave them locked. The downside is the increased drag
and potential front drivetrain wear but just the same as original without
FWH. Also remember to engage the hubs periodically to splash lubricate the
upper swivel ball bearings.

I once followed a 4wd Ford pickup after a major snowstorm, and everytime we
reached a bare stretch of road little brother would climb down and unlock the
hubs. At the next snow covered stretch he would climb down again to lock
them. Boring.

------------------------------

From: HMEdwards@aol.com
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 23:24:51 -0500
Subject: Re: Series Parts

Bruce,

You might also try RN for a used Speedo.  I have had to raid their parts bin
on several ocassions before, especially when the checkbook was low and I
needed my Series III on the road.

Harry Edwards
72 Series III
Las Vegas

------------------------------

From: slade@teleport.com
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 17:40:56 -0800
Subject: Pacific Northwest Team Trophy Challenge (long)

>From Doug Shipman's hand to your screen:

Pacific Northwest Team Trophy Challenge
May 18th and 19th 1996
Lee's Camp, Oregon

Test your off-road skills in a competitive event against others.  This two
day team even will allow you and your 4x4 to test your preparedness for the
unknow.  You and your team mates will be encountering a variety of tasks,
not limited to just driving.  Over the two day period you will cover three
routes, each with their own challenges.  Expect to be required to read a
map and compass, to do team tasks, balance your truck, drive a trials
setion, winch, and anything else we can throw at you.  Your passenger will
even leave you for short periods,, and hopefully you'll pick him or her
back up.  The winning team will have the best score over the two day
period.

What is a team?

A team shall consist of two vehicles and not more than four people tota.
That means only two per vehicle!  At least one vehicle shall have a working
winch.

Vehicle Requirements:

All are to be street legal and licensed in their respective states.  O.R.V.
stickers will be needed where applicable.  (see below)

Dune buggies, jeeps, and 4x4's are required to have ATV operator permits
only in state-designated areas.  The landowners in these areas reaquire
permits purchased from any Oregon Motor Vehicles Division office.  Permits
ae not required in some areas, so contact the landowner before arriving.
ATV permits are valid for two years.  An operator of a motor vehicle is
required to have a valid driver's license.  Any unlicensed operator of a 3
or 4 wheeler, if unaccompanied by a licensed driver at least 18 years old,
must complete a rider safety course taught by a state certified instructor.
Unless registered in a state that participated in a reciprocal agrement
with Oregon, out-of-state enthusiasts must register like residents.  Be
sure to check with your local Motor Vehicles Division office to make sure
you are properly registerd.
(copied from the Oregon Tread Lightly pamphlet)

All must have road legal liability insurance.
Hard tops or roll bars are required.
Tow points front and rear.
Must carry a fire extinguisher, shovel, jack, and a spare tire would be
helpful.  Seat belts!
All vehicles will have a safety inspection before you are allowed on the course.
Note- We have no size restrictions at this time, but, this is put on with
SWB in mind.  You may be routed around if we feel your size may cause
damage to the trail.

This is a limited entry event.  We will be accepting oly forty teams of two
vehicles each.  Please have your entry mailed by May 12th to: Region III
PNW4WDA, 11661 S.E. 272nd Ave., Boring OR  970009, and recieve your
reserved spot with a discounted registration fee.  Entries mailed after
that date should be brought to the event site if we have not reached our
limit.

Entry fee if recieved by May 12th- $50 per vehicle.  Day of registration
will be $60 per vehicle.  T-shirts pre-ordered are $15 ea and available in
s, m, l, xl.

New this year will be a special Club Trophy.  This will be awarded to the
club which has the best score of thier three best teams.

For more info call:

503 661 3220 and leave a message.

Schedule of events:

Friday- Camp is opened up by 4pm.  For those that show this day, at 9pm we
will have a short tech session on map and compass reading (orienteering).
Tech inspections 7-9 pm.

Saturday- Teams begin departing at 8am.  Departure times will be determined
by a random selection process of pre-registered teams.  Late entries will
leave last.  That evening at 10pm we will have a short tech session on
rally time computation and reading route charts.  Tech inspections
6:30-8am.

Sunday- Teams begin departing at 8:30am.  Departure times will be
determined by a random selection prodess.  The top ten from the previous
day will leave earliest.  Lunch will be provided as you return and we
tabulate sores.  WE should be all wrapped up by 2 or 3pm.

Where to go:

Go west on Hwy 26 out of Portland.  Take the Hwy 6 exit towards Tillamook.
The campground is 3/4 miles west of Lee's Camp on the right.  The only
facilities at camp will be port-a-potties.  Gas is available 20 miles back
at the BP you passed or down the road in Tillamook.

Don't pass up the chance!

Last years winners probably have aspirations of repeating!  But, there are
many other teams who are making other plans.  With a different course and
many new tasks to conquer,, this could be anybodies year.  Even if your'e
not the hard core competitive type, you'll have a good time.

(end)

Hope to see many of you there.  I'll be photographing and helping with
timing because unfortunatly now I have a 109!  (should have held onto that
88!)

Later,

Michael

PS  Don't send me inquiries, call the #.

------------------------------

From: Wdcockey@aol.com
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 23:57:39 -0500
Subject: Re: Re. Hand Cranking

> Thus when the engine starts going the handl is pushed out and thereby
>disconnected. Is there some sort of kick back people are experiencing?

The kick-back is if the engine fires too soon and reverses for a revolution
or two. Then the crank spins backwards violently, and if your thumb is around
the crank nasties can happen. So keep you thumb next to your fingers and pull
upwards only.

David Cockey

------------------------------

From: Wdcockey@aol.com
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 1996 00:06:23 -0500
Subject: Re: (not quite) Automatic 2-4wd (Question)

I've missed some of this thread, but I've also wondered about the following:
> I've always wondered if there
>:: is some way the t'box could be set up to release the hi4 knob
>:: when the hi-low lever is just shifted to neutral, rather than having
>:: to shift all the way to low.  Then 4 to 2 shifting could be done on
>:: the fly.
The info which was posted on mods to make this possible is most appreciated.

What has been a mystery to me is why the complicated mechanism with the need
to shift into low range to release 4wd was used in the first place. Old Jeeps
with Warner transfer cases had two levers, one for 2wd - 4wd, and the other
for H - N - L with a very simple interlock which prevents shifting out of H
unless in 4wd or into 2wd unless in H. No need to go to L to shift from 4wd
to 2wd.

Why didn't Rover use a similar, simple system? Does it have anything to do
with the early LRs using a free-wheel system for "full time" 4wd? Or maybe
patent infringement although it is very had to understand how the two lever
system could have been patented? Any info or slightly informed speculation.

David Cockey

------------------------------

From: TWakeman/Apple@eworld.com
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 21:19:07 -0800
Subject: Re: Smiths Gauges

----------------------------- Begin Original Text -------------------------

Does anyone know a source of kits for connecting Smiths guages to a Series II

Diesel?  I've just acquired a rebuild dual oil/water Smiths guage, but I have

not been able to connect to the previous guage connector on the oil filter.
 It 
seems to be a mis-match of any but standard connectors.  Any supplier or
vendor 
references would be greatly appreciated.

----------------------------- End Original Text -----------------------------

If memory serves, the Land Rover sender & brass fittings are Whentworth and
the Smith sender units are National pipe fittings.  You would need to pick a
connection & rethread it with the next larger pipe fitting to adapt/

TeriAnn
"Celebrating my 10th year connected to the Usenet/Internet"

------------------------------

From: Simon Barclay <sbar@jna.com.au>
Subject: RE: Polyair 'springs'
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 96 16:34:00 EST

>Tony asked

>Anyone had any experience with Polyair 'springs', ie those inflatable
>plastic things that fit inside coil springs to act as a load leveller?

Hi Tony

I have Polyair Springs in my '90 RR.  They are adjustable in pressure from 
zip to around 28-30lb.  You will find you need to experiment a bit with 
pressures to achieve a comfortable ride, particularly if your vehicle runs 
with no load often.

I frequently tow a tandem axle double horse float and will pump them up to 
between 22-26lb and this makes a great difference - Hayman Reece (made in 
Oz.) towing mechanism - helps the balance as well.

 Also do a lot of country runs to my 'in laws' sheep property north of 
Lighting Ridge, so these are sort of re-supply missions carrying all sorts 
of loads which often include things like generators, and parts for drilling 
rigs (even Land Cruiser diffs on one trip) to sacks of potatoes (which you 
just can't get out there), all the sort of things working properties need. 
 As you can imagine a lot of black dirt roads (badly corrugated), but put a 
bit of air in the Polysprings and the ride even with these loads is very 
good, helps keep the front down so you have plenty of feed back from the 
steering.

When running around with no load I usually let all the air out as you'll 
find the tail gets a bit on the bouncy side.  So I don't know if I would 
recommend them as a replacement for tiring springs, but they certain are 
worth it (around $300 Oz fitted) if you are going to be towing or carrying 
heavy loads.

I'm not sure where they are made - you could ring Graeme Cooper Automotive 
(Land Rover specialist here in Sydney)  on Freecall 1800 647 999 and they'll 
fill you in, and even mail them to you.  Ask for Andrew Lawrence - he's the 
parts manager.

Hope that helps......

Simon Barclay
Sydney Australia

'90 5sp RR
'51 Series 1 (Louie)

------------------------------

From: TWakeman/Apple@eworld.com
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 21:41:53 -0800
Subject: Re: Door top removal

----------------------------- Begin Original Text -------------------------

Could some enlightened Rover owner tell me the trick to separating 
the lower door and top? The bolts came off with ease after a good 
soaking, but now I am baffled. Thanks in advance!
----------------------------- End Original Text -----------------------------
The door tops sit on the door sides.  there are two threaded rods that stick
down through steel pipes.  If your nuts were rusted on, chances are good the
the rods are rusted to the tubes.  Get a rubber or plastic hammer and strik
the bottom of the rods sharply  upwards.  With any sort of luck that should
 break them lose.  Pull straight up.  They will hang up if you cock them.

I would suggest a new rubber seal between the top & bottom, cleaning up the
rods & painting them with something that doesn't build up much & the same for
the insides of the cylinders in the lower door.  Rethera the rods with a die
& install new nuts with anti-seize.  You might even rub some on the shaft.

TeriAnn
"Celebrating my 10th year connected to Usenet/Internet"

------------------------------

From: SACME@aol.com
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 1996 01:04:17 -0500
Subject: Overdrive stress and noise

This is my first mail to the lro digest.  Hope I'm doing it right.  My thanks
to Mark Talbot, a frequent contributor, for intro to the lro digest.  I
download it daily and save interesting items to specific directories.  It's
great!

Last Spring I completed a frame-over (galv, from AB, sure wish their supplier
could get the forward rear body brackets in the right place, but that's a
whole 'nother story) on my 72 Ser III (bought new in '72 - in my book, it's
the only car worth having!).  As part of frame-over, installed
Fairey/Superwinch overdrive.  

Questions, (1) Where is OD located in engine/main gearbox/transfer case
sequence?  If it is connected where the PTO used to be, then it would seem to
be after the main gearbox to reduce the RPM of the PTO shaft to the 500-550
used by most PTO driven machinery.  Reason for question is concern for
stressing the OD unit.  If it is first in line after engine, then max torque
on it can never exceed the max torque of the engine and it can be left
engaged, if desired, all the time.  If it is after the main gearbox, then, I
should think, it should be engaged only when 4th gear has been "satisfied",
to keep it's torque loading to a safe level.  (2) The OD seems to be noisy,
in fact, very noisy even compared to all the other "very noisys" of the
engine, etc.  The noise is a high-pitched scream loudest at about 50-55 on
the speedo (I am running 16 inch wheels, so this could be off by "x"
percent).  AB suggested pulling the OD and checking for unusual wear on the
input gear, also checking that the nut is tight on the (I can't remember what
it was) that I had to install on the (PTO) shaft to accomodate the OD.  Oil
level in the OD is checked weekly and is staying right on the dipstick notch.
OD shifts very smoothly and other than the noise seems to work fine.  Any
guidance would be most appreciated.  Thanks to all who respond.

Final note:  We are now a 2 S-3 family - bought Mark Talbot's S-3 for my son,
who has been bitten by the LR bug big time.  Number 3 S-3 will probably be
along any day now, as my wife of 31 years (married to me, not age) of which
ten years or so spent commuting in our original S-3, insists that she really
DOES want to get rid of her Toyota Corolla SR-5 All-Trac (sorry about using
profanity in the LR digest) and get her very own Series 3!  We have a spare
LR engine and tranny, so I should be able to keep three of 'em running,
swapping out engines and rebuilding them as necessary.  If you're looking for
me, I'll be in the garage...forever!

Looking forward to this year's Owl's Head, Maine, LR Rally (I've never been
before), and to meeting many of my new LRO digest friends in person. 

Doug Scott (and Ingrid and Andy)
2 ea., Series III 88...so far.

  

  

------------------------------

From: clapp.carol@mail.viacomcv.hybrid.com (Carol Clapp)
Subject: Hand cranking and bleed screws
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 1996 22:26:04 +0000

Hi folks, this is Carol - my husband has something to say to answer Peter
Doncaster's last message:
        First.  If the battery is completly dead, cranking will not work.
The ignition needs current to generate the spark and there is no way any
mortal person could crank fast enough to get any output from the alternator.
        Second.  You can run on the battery without the alternator working.
How long depends on the state of charge before the alternator went out and
how much auxiliary load you must carry.  Turn off everything not essential
and you should be good for a couple of hours, especially if you don"t need
lights.
        Third.  It is possible to run on the alternator only but not
recommended.  The secret is to keep the revs up high enough that the
alternator is always charging.  At idle speed there may not be enough output
to supply the ignition system.  Again, turn off auxiliaries.
        Fourth.  Any good radiator shop should be able to fix a small leak
in a radiator.  If it turns out to be in the top tank you could probably
solder it up yourself if it's a brass radiator.
        Fifth.  Haven't started working on our wheel cylinders yet so am not
sure of the configuration of the bleed screws, but if they are anything like
American bleed screws there should be a hole in the end.  Try using an
Eazy-out that will just fit into the hole.  An Eazy-out is a tool with a
tapered left hand flute designed to insert into a hole drilled into a broken
off stud for removing same. 
        Hope some of this is useful.
                                  Maury, other half of Carol and her SII.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 17 Jan 1996 00:12:04 -0700
From: Aryeh Goretsky <aryeh@tribal.com>
Subject: Re: New Disco Owner Problems

Hello,

I received the Discovery back today and it was a loose alternator wire.  They
fixed it and tested the other things just to make sure they worked correctly.

I also asked them about the fuse panel and alternator wires, so they drove 
the vehicle back into the maintenance bay and examined it for loose
connections--none were found.

So it looks like the problem can be traced to faulty assembly.  I strongly
suggested to the dealer that they check the alternator and fuse box
connections and left with my now-working 1996 Discovery.  I plan on driving
it locally for the next week to ensure there are no further problems, and
enjoy my new vehicle.

Thanks for everyone for their helpful comments!

Regards,

Aryeh Goretsky

At 09:12 AM 1/16/96 -0500, Dixon Kenner wrote:
>On Mon, 15 Jan 1996, Aryeh Goretsky wrote:
>> and I though the SQA I had seen was very bad, but it looks like Land Rover QA
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 17 lines)]
>	may be tainted by Mr. Lucas' ways too...
>	Rgds,
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tribal Voice Software  |Aryeh Goretsky - http://www.tribal.com/staff/aryeh/
627 W. Midland Dr. #210|WORK EMAIL support@tribal.com AND powwow-faq@tribal.com
Woodland Park, Colorado|TEL +1 (719) 687-0480
80863-1100  USA        |FAX +1 (719) 687-0716

------------------------------

  END OF LAND ROVER OWNER DIGEST 
 Input:  messages 74 lines 3425 [forwarded 236 whitespace 797]
 Output: lines 2858 [content 1861  forwarded 133 (cut  103) whitespace 760]

	
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