Land Rover Owner Message Digest Contents

[ First Message Last | Table of Contents | <- Digest -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest

Send Submissions Land-Rover-Owner@Land-Rover.Team.Net

From: jgoldman@acs.bu.edu
Subject: Types of Webers and so forth...
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 02:44:32 -0500 (EST)

 Greetings all,

	After searching high and low for about six months, I finally found a
'71 SIIA in Mint Green that fit my criteria. Namely, it was cheap (direct
trade for a severly ailing '85 Camry that was taking up space) and very
restorable. Thanks to everyone for giving me a head-start with the necessary
reading, contacts, and general info!! Now that I have the beast, I will
proceed to take it apart piece by piece in order to get a new chassis under
it. So far, I'm enjoying it tremendously, or perhaps I'm just numb from the
cold...
	After AAA towed the Rover to my house I managed to start the engine
after replacing plugs and adjusting electrics. Seems to run fine, except that
the Rochester carburettor that was recently fitted by a fairly clueless
previous owner (1 month) doesn't seem to be set-up for Land Rover usage. Most
notably, I can never trounce on the accelerator without the engine stalling,
regardless of idle and mixture settings. I've not heard the greatest of praise
for the Rochesters, and Alan Richer tells me I should get a Weber. I tend to
agree. The question is, which model Weber? What are the major differences
between the 1bb and 2bbl models? Which will provide good economy with decent
performance? Which engines need a conversion plate? Basically, what do I ask
for?

	Other random questions include:

	What will be the real-world effect of running the 2.25L petrol and
standard IIA transmission through an overdrive, 3.51 axles/diffs, and 16" road
wheels? Is this too tall? The Rover will be used primarily on pavement, but I
don't want to severely sacrifice off-road capability.

	Theoretically, the front drive section of a Rover spins as fast as the
rear drive section (freewheeling hubs aside). If this is true, one should be
able to engage 4WD at any speed. Is this correct, and is it done in practise?

	Does anyone have any experience with Warick 4x4's coil conversions?
Details?

	Having heard the recent experiences with Craddocks, et al, has someone
compiled a list of reputable mail-order sources for LR parts?

	Sadly, my Rover is sitting in a garage instead of playing in the
snow. Now that's frustrating!!!

	Thanks for any info...

							Jeff Goldman
							(Boston, MA)

E-Mail: jgoldman@acs.bu.edu

	

------------------------------

Subject: Re: Opening bottles (was: Re: Range Rovers off road)
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 96 08:02:11 GMT
From: dlanod@iafrica.com (Donald Abbot)

Mike responds to Paul:
> >>    That's because he couldn't open his beer on the dash.  I've since 
> .....snip......
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 6 lines)]
> On a Real Land Rover (one with a *metal* dashboard) you use the curled lip
> at the bottom of the dash to pop off the bottle cap.

That's fine for my SIIA but what about my SIII?

Donald

------------------------------

Subject: Re: Types of Webers and so forth... 
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 00:37:46 -0800
From: Benjamin Allan Smith <bens@archimedes.vislab.navy.mil>

In message <199601110746.CAA10919@butler.uk.stratus.com>you wrote:

> 	Having heard the recent experiences with Craddocks, et al, has someone
> compiled a list of reputable mail-order sources for LR parts?

	Various people have have various different experiences with different
companies.  In the US I've had a lot of good British Pacific in Burbank and
Rovers North in Vermont.  A list of parts vendors has been compiled in the
Land Rover FAQ, which can be found at:

http://www.ridgecrest.ca.us/OVLR/FAQ.top.html     (for the FAQ)
http://www.ridgecrest.ca.us/OVLR/FAQ.5.part.html  (for the section on vendors)

Ben
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Benjamin Smith------------bens@vislab.navy.mil---------1972 Land Rover SIII 88
 Science Applications International Corporation
 Naval Air Warfare Center, Weapons Division, China Lake

"...If I were running such a contest, I would specifically eliminate any entry
 from Ben involving driving the [Land] Rover anywhere.  He'd drive it up the
 Amazon basin for a half can of Jolt and a stale cookie..."  --Kevin Archie

------------------------------

From: Trefor Delve <delve1t@nectech.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Webers
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 96 08:53:00 GMT

Jeff

re. your query on Weber Carburettors.

Whilst I am not an absolute expert on Webers, I do have some experience   
in their use - enough at least to outline the basics.

The principle of the carb is simple - however, its setup is complicated.

In the past, people have asked about the DCD and DGAS carbs in relation   
to fitting them on a Land Rover.

First of all - the numbers
 -----------------------------------

The number refers to barrel diameter in mm.  The DCD is a twin choke and   
is really referred to as a 28/36 DCD; the 28 being the primary barrel   
diameter, 36 being the secondary diameter.

With the 38 DGAS, the barrels are the same diameter: 38 mm.

Internals
 ------------

Components that affect the setup are Main jets, emulsion tubes, air   
correction jets, venturi sizes.  Consideration needs to be given to the   
idle jets although this is not really a perfomance issue.  The setup of   
the carb strictly speaking requires a dyno but I'm sure that there are   
people with a great deal of expertise in the setup.

The differences
 -----------------------

The difference between the carbs you have are in their application.  The   
38 DGAS is intented to be fitted to 6 cylinder engines with a manifold   
such that each barrel of the carb feeds 3 cylinders only.  In effect the   
DGAS consists of two separate carburettors with a common fuel supply and   
synchronised throttles.

The 28/36 DCD on the other hand may be fitted to 4 or 6 cylinder engines   
BUT the unit is intended to supply ALL of the cylinders.  The function of   
the two barrels is to provide a compomise between economy and   
performance.  The second choke only opens when the demand from the   
thottle is high.  In fact, the secondary choke does not open until the   
primary choke is 2/3 open.

The principle used to improve the economy with the DCD is directly   
related to the smaller barrel and hence smaller venturi.  With a smaller   
venturi, better fuel atomisation is obtained when the air flow through   
the carb is small.

Another difference between the carbs is the principle of the cold start   
operation.  With the DCD, the cold start device can effectively be   
considered as a separate carburettor.  With the DGAS there is a   
conventional choke at the top of each barrel.

Presumably, if there is someone who produces a manifold allowing this to   
be fitted to your SIIa, then there should be someone who can set it up.

Hope that this helps in some way.

If anyone out there spots any problems in the above, please let me know   
as I am clearly misinformed.

Trefor.

tdelve@nectech.co.uk

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 04:15:09 EST
From: "Steve Reddock" <steve_reddock@uk.xyratex.com>
Subject: Cheap insurance

There is a company who offer very cheap insurance for ex-MOD vehicles
in the UK.  The premium is 60 pounds fully comp, regardless of NCD
for vehicles up to 5K in value, with an extra 10 quid per 1000 value.
This is any driver cover as well!
  
There are extras, under 25s pay and extra 25 quid and under 20s and
extra 40.
  
They also want the vehicle to be over 20 years old, but they are
flexible.  Standard condition is preferred.  NO ENGINE SWAPS!!
The insured vehicle should also not be your main mode of transport.
  
These prices are a year old, but even if they go up they must be
the cheapest way to insure ex-MOD vehicles.
  
The scheme even covers tanks, but I'm not sure about any artillery
damage you might cause in a fit of road rage.
  
The company is AC Miles (insurance consultants) Ltd. 663 High Road,
Leytonstone, London E11 4RD.    0181 539 5995.
  
A friend of mine has insured his 19 year old 101 with no problems.
  
Hope this helps someone, Steve
  
Steve Reddock                         Product Evaluation, 26/12
Xyratex                  Ext.(01705) 486363 x4450  Int.721-4450
REDDOCK at HVTVM         Internet: Steve_Reddock@UK.XYRATEX.COM

------------------------------

Subject: Re: Opening beer bottles (was: Re: Range Rovers off road) 
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 02:22:11 -0800
From: Benjamin Allan Smith <bens@archimedes.vislab.navy.mil>

Donald wrote:

> > >>    That's because he couldn't open his beer on the dash.  I've since 
> > .....snip......
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 7 lines)]
> > at the bottom of the dash to pop off the bottle cap.
> That's fine for my SIIA but what about my SIII?

	And hence the arguement that *real* LR's have a metal dash and that
SIII are inadiquate because you can't open a beer.  Utter rubbish.  I
have found that if you don't have the metal headlinig piece that hides
the windscreen/hardtop junction you will see a number of bolts that attach
the hardtop to the windscreen.  If you can use any bolt to pry the top off
your beer.  I have yet to spill any beer or chip the bottle via this method.

          bolt
          ####
       |===||===  <-top of winscreen
      .|  (||)
   G  |  /`||
   L .| / \
  A  | /\  \__
  S .| ` \    \
 S  |    | B   \
   .|    \  E   \
   |      \  E   \
  .|       \  R ./
  |         \__/
  |
    

	Just hook the cap as shown and open the beer.

	Mmmm, ASCII beer.  (Though not as good as Guinness).

Ben
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Benjamin Smith------------bens@vislab.navy.mil---------1972 Land Rover SIII 88
 Science Applications International Corporation
 Naval Air Warfare Center, Weapons Division, China Lake

"...If I were running such a contest, I would specifically eliminate any entry
 from Ben involving driving the [Land] Rover anywhere.  He'd drive it up the
 Amazon basin for a half can of Jolt and a stale cookie..."  --Kevin Archie

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 06:15:43 EST
From: "Steve Reddock" <steve_reddock@uk.xyratex.com>
Subject: Hummers

>From looking at hummers (only on TV) I assumed they had independant
suspension as there was no visible diff and what I assumed to be
wishbones.
  
Is this just a bent live axle?
  
So that makes 1 gearbox, 1 xfer box, 3 diffs and 4 bevel gears (one
on each wheel).  Pass the ear plugs!
  
Cheers, Steve
  
Steve Reddock                         Product Evaluation, 26/12
Xyratex                  Ext.(01705) 486363 x4450  Int.721-4450
REDDOCK at HVTVM         Internet: Steve_Reddock@UK.XYRATEX.COM

------------------------------

From: Tom Stevenson <gbfv08@udcf.gla.ac.uk>
Subject: Diesel engine braking
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 11:28:23 +0000 (GMT)

Diesel engines have much more engine braking than petrol ones because of
their higher compression ratio. Descending steep slippery slopes in my
(diesel) 90 requires a bit of throttle to stop the wheels sliding since
the engine braking is so great.
Lorries often have exhaust brakes to increase the engine braking effect
at will, thus saving the wheel brake linings when descending a long
steep hill for example.
-- 
Tom Stevenson: gbfv08@udcf.gla.ac.uk
University Marine Biological Station, Isle of Cumbrae, Scotland
Tel:(01475) 530581  Fax:(01475) 530601

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 96 6:55:32 EST
From: "barnett childress" <barnett=childress%Eng%EMCHOP1@fishbowl02.lss.emc.com>
Subject: re:LR warranty

Bob,
I asked my dealer, LRMW in Natick, MA. about voiding the warranty on my 95 
Defender 90 when if I had Air Lockers installed. The answer I got was the 
only thing no longer covered would be the differentials the rest of the 
drivetrain would still be covered by LR.
Cheers,
Barnett. 

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 96 7:02:21 EST
From: "barnett childress" <barnett=childress%Eng%EMCHOP1@fishbowl02.lss.emc.com>
Subject: re:: FYI: : Rental while baby is gone!

John,
I ended up with a mighty toyota corolla with an auto transmission. The 
only good thing I can say about it is the gas mileage. This thing is an 
absolute puke and again yesterday with only 3" of new snow I was stuck at 
the bottom of my 450' driveway. My wife even made it up in her car, (a 
toyota) but it has studded snows. Oh well. GEEEEEEEEE I miss my 
ROVER!!!!!!!!
Barnett.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 96 08:33:39 EST
From: "Bobeck, David R." <dbobeck@ushmm.org>
Subject: Hugo still for sale?

     Sorry I forgot your name, but i remembered the Landies', if that 
     counts! Is Hugo still for sale, or was it Jesse? Can't remember your 
     name so I'm putting this out to the whole world!
     Cheers
     'Dave.

------------------------------

Date: 11 Jan 96 08:46:22 EST
From: <Glen_Rees@parlon2.ccmail.compuserve.com>
Subject: Off Road Adventure (s)

     Steve  WA2GMC
     
     You refer in your thread about Marks dad.
     
                         I know this man!!    
     
     Your lucky it was only a small tree sticking out of your spare tyre! 
     What do you expect of someone who invites his son over from the States 
     to take him off road in Wales, but makes his son rough it in a damp 
     tent, whilst he sleeps in the back of his nice warm cosy little 101. 
     And on a previous (family) trip to Wales makes him bounce around in 
     the back of his S1 shed with all that loose off road gear, ask about 
     the High Lift jack shaped bruises. 
     
     These trips to Wales, have over the years, become know as "Talbot's 
     Tortuous Tours"
     
     Mark is relatively new to Solihull products, but he comes from good 
     sound (English) stock, it was only a mater of time before he would find 
     the answer to life, the universe & everything. Now it seems he is 
     unable to survive without them.
     
     Now you can see were Mark get that sense of humour from! 
     Get stuck in there, get off road.
     
     R  1  3        H
     +--|--|   FWD  |
        2  4        L            '55 Series One
     
     Glenn
     

------------------------------

From: azw@aber.ac.uk (Andy Woodward)
Subject:  D90 trip report
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 14:17:44 UNDEFINED

>After the trip, I have decided on one thing, I am going to get a pair of
>noise abating headsets (maybe aircraft headsets) to wear on long trips,
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 10 lines)]
>able to plug them into the stereo some how (I could not hear the radio above
>the road noise the whole trip).

No need. I ride a motorcycle - a lot noiser than the 90. I use the simple faom 
earplugs since svereal tests in bike mags found they gave 33+dB reduction 
across pretty much the whole range including by far the best reduction at low 
frequencies - better than noise reductrion earphones!!!

They take down low frequency windniose on teh bike that leaft me feeling sick 
after 5 miles!!! They are more than sufficient for my 90.

------------------------------

From: azw@aber.ac.uk (Andy Woodward)
Subject: Re: 2.25 Diesel
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 14:12:50 UNDEFINED

>> low revs and heaps better engine braking,
>I agree with everything you say Kevin except this. Diesels are known 
>for not having good engine braking. That's why the Jake Brake was 

They ARENT?????? With 22:1 compression?????

Take the foot off the throttle with mine and it's like hitting a wall. Or was 
till I had to compensate for stalling in very hot weather by resetting the 
anti-stall on teh DPS pump.

The problem is that if the governer is set to a slow dieback, the engine revs 
will decrease slowly.

------------------------------

From: debrown@srp.gov
Date: 11 Jan 96 08:42:31 MST
Subject: Hi-lift jack in a RR, gauge location.

FROM:  David Brown                           Internet: debrown@srp.gov
       Computer Graphics Specialist * Mapping Services & Engr Graphics
       PAB219 (602)236-3544 -  Pager:6486 External (602)275-2508 #6486
John asks where/how to mount a High-lift jack in his RR. I too have the same
question. For right now, it's laying along the floor in the back seat. I had
it laying along the rear floor once, and after some rough 4-wheeling, the
top of the jack gouged the carpet off the tailgate. A little weatherstrip
adhesive remedied the situation, but a more suitable and permanent solution
is required. I thought of actually mounting (with the lock/mount I have) to
the angled portion of the floor just in front of the rear seats. It limits
foot space a bit, but not too much.

BTW, I mounted my fire extinguisher on the seat pedestal on the front side
of the drivers seat, and the mag-light in the same place on the passenger
side. (I wanted them both to be handy!)

While I'm here, I also have a triple gauge (oil/water/amp) that I want to
mount. The only place that I have come up with is just to the left of the
steering wheel, right below the A/C vent on the left side (next to the
door). (UK, this would be the reverse.) Anyone else mount gauges? Where did
you mount them?

Thanks, Dave (snowbird, and lovin' it!) Brown

 #=====#         #========#          -------,___          _________
 |___|__\___     |___|__|__\___      |--' |  |  \_|_     //__/__|__\___
 | _ |   |_ |}   | _ |  |   |_ |}    |  _ |--+--|_  |    \__/-\_|__/-\_|}
 "(_)""""(_)"    "(_)"""""""(_)"    ||_/_\___|__/_\_|}      (_)    (_)
                                       (_)      (_)
 1971 "88" IIa   1970 "109" IIa     1994 Discovery (Sold) '87 Range Rover
 LIC: LION B8    Historic plates     (Too hard to "draw")  rear Lock-Right
 Phoenix Arizona USA                                       Crane cam

#=======#          ________           We make a living by what we get,
|__|__|__\___     /__/__|__\___        we make a life by what we give.
| _|  |   |_ |}   \_/-\_|__/-\_|}
"(_)""""""(_)"      (_)    (_)                       Winston Churchill

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 09:42:06 -0600
From: Robert Kolander <kolanrj@gw.startribune.com>
Subject:  LR Dealers

I am trying to compile a comprehensive list of all LR dealers in the
U.S., complete w/phone, address, etc...

If such a list already exists, could someone please point me in the
right direction? If it doesn't, I'll start collecting the Dealer
names, locations, and phone numbers from anyone with the gumption to
send them to me!

Thanks, 
Bob K.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 09:49:23 -0600
From: Robert Kolander <kolanrj@gw.startribune.com>
Subject:  Recent trip to the Dealer

2 days ago  (tues, jan 11) or the day before someone posted a message
about their latest trip to their local (I think they said "my local,
(yeah, local, 1 hour away)) LR Dealer and saw a D90 w/a fiberglass
top for sale on their lot. 

Could whoever submitted this message please contact me with that
dealer's phone number? I've been searching for a D90 and I usually
end up just missing it by a day or two! (aarrgh!) No one here (MN)
seems to want to sell their baby, so I've been scanning the globe (or
at least the continent) for one...

Any help is greatly appreciated! 
Thanks
Bob K.

------------------------------

From: slade@teleport.com
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 07:55:02 -0800
Subject: Re: D90 trip report

>To change subscription write to: Majordomo@Land-Rover.Team.Net
>>After the trip, I have decided on one thing, I am going to get a pair of
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 16 lines)]
>frequencies - better than noise reductrion earphones!!!
>They take down low frequency windniose on teh bike that leaft me feeling sick
>after 5 miles!!! They are more than sufficient for my 90.

A buddy of mine once gave me some US miliatary ear plugs that were made of
soft rubber and had a series of 3 baffles that were inserted into the ear
canal.

They were somewhat intimidating to use the first time as I was afraid of
damaging my eardrum, but when they were properly inserted they worked much
better than the soft squishy foam ones others have mentioned.

Alas, I included them with the sale of my '88 and have since aquired a 109.

My 109 is considerably quieter than the '88 but for long highway cruising
they certainly would be nice.  Conversation was easier than I thought it
would be even when wearing the earplugs.

Don't know where you would find them, except at a US military surplus
store.  Chad?

Later,

Michael

------------------------------

From: debrown@srp.gov
Date: 11 Jan 96 08:57:28 MST
Subject: Air dams on Disco / RR

FROM:  David Brown                           Internet: debrown@srp.gov
       Computer Graphics Specialist * Mapping Services & Engr Graphics
       PAB219 (602)236-3544 -  Pager:6486 External (602)275-2508 #6486
The air dam is the first thing that "had to go" on my RR. It got bent
forward, backwards, sidewards, and any other direction possible before I
removed it. (Only owned the vehicle for about a month. Kind of miss the fog
lights though...) It has greatly improved the off road approach angle.

The RR has separate end caps and looks "fine" (objective) without the air
dam. The Disco has a 1 piece end cap / bumper. I've seen ONE Disco with it
removed (the factory test unit) at the dealer in Phoenix Arizona, and as I
recalled, it looked fine. Actually more rugged looking, more truck like.

Give it a try, you can always put it back on. (But I wouldn't, I go for
utilitarian, not pretty.)

#=======#          ________           We make a living by what we get,
|__|__|__\___     /__/__|__\___        we make a life by what we give.
| _|  |   |_ |}   \_/-\_|__/-\_|}
"(_)""""""(_)"      (_)    (_)                       Winston Churchill

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 96 11:03:50 EST
From: Jack Stansbury <jack@eco.twg.com>
Subject: The Blizzard of 1996

I have enjoyed reading the experiences that other people had in the 
"Blizzard of 96." Here are our experiences in our 1996 5-speed Discovery. 
Sorry for the relatively long post.

My wife and I went skiing up at Ski Liberty (southern Pennsylvania) on 
Saturday evening around 8:00. It started snowing there around 10:00 or so. 
By the time we left at midnight, it was snowing pretty hard. What had been 
a 1.25 hour ride on the way up turned into a 2.5 hour ride on the way back. 
The only trouble we had was when a tractor trailer going about 60 mph 
passed us - we were in complete white-out for about 10 seconds. About 10 
miles down the road, a state policeman had him pulled over! :-) We made it 
home safely, but the snow was already at least 6-8 inches by then. 

It snowed all day Sunday, Sunday night, and finally stopped Monday 
afternoon. By that time, we had anywhere from 20 to 30 inches, depending on 
how much drifting there was.

We have a driveway that is about 500 feet long. In the middle is a 90 
degree turn. I used our garden tractor to plow out the driveway Sunday 
morning. But the additional snow on Sunday and Sunday night just filled it 
up again. Unfortunately, the snow I plowed to the sides of the driveway 
would be in the way for later plowings. 

On Monday we plowed and shoveled our way down to the turn. We would go out 
in the morning, shovel for about 2-3 hours, come inside, change out of our 
soaking wet (from sweating) clothes, put on dry clothes, eat something, and 
go back out again for another 2-3 hours - Monday, Tuesday, and Wednesday we 
did that. 

>From the turn in the driveway, there is a slight hill, which proved to be 
too much for the tractor (with chains). From that point on, we had to use 
the Discovery and shovels to go the remaining  200 feet. We would shovel 
some, then drive the Discovery as far as it would go (usually about 10-15 
feet), shovel it out, back it up, and do the same thing again. I had the 
differential locked and I was using low-speed 2nd or 3rd. Since this was in 
snow that was about 1.5-2 feet deep, the Discovery would only go so far 
before the snow in the middle of the road would lift the wheels up off the 
driveway, and the snow in front would stop it. (Many times I wished I had 
bought chains for it!)

After many hours of doing that on Monday, we finally made it through to the 
road. When we were almost to the road, a car-load of neighbor boys came by 
in their car and laughed at us. Grrrr. However, they couldn't even make it 
into their plowed driveway, so I had the last laugh! :-)

Of course, when the snow plows came to clear the streets on late Wednesday 
afternoon, they piled up snow again in front of the driveway. That usually 
didn't take too long to clear out though. Out on the roads, the Disco 
worked quite well. The ABS started working a few times on the ice spots, 
but mostly it stopped and started quite well. No problems with starting it 
in the cold weather.

Not sure what we are going to do when it snows another foot or so Thursday 
night and Friday. I called the local Land Rover dealer but they don't keep 
chains in stock.

All in all, I'm glad we had the Disco. If we didn't have it, we would still 
be at home digging the cars out.

Jack and Kippi, grateful Disco owners
Rockville, Maryland

------------------------------

From: Treit Le <Treit_Le@apprise.com>
Date: 11 Jan 96 10:45:52 
Subject: Is there any such thing as a rear brush guard (not kidding)?

No, lamp guards are not enough. Since I occasionally hit things when backing 
up, it could be real useful. Can't quite figure out how it would attach, maybe 
the hitch.

Didn't see a lot of LRs on the streets of Manhattan this past week. Lots of 
Caprices and Crown Victorias, though (ie. the unstoppable yellow cab.) No 
Hummers, Defenders, a couple of RRs and several Discos. Did spot an impeccable 
black Land Cruiser with a bright yellow snorkel. This vehicle was concours in 
the middle of the blizzard. And one f**king incredible F-250 with a lift kit 
that managed to park on top of a snow mound higher than a car roof. Wranglers 
seemed to be the most efficient vehicles as they were short and agile enough to 
fit into any recently vacated parking spaces. Several people were spotted 
standing on the roofs of their cars digging them out.

Can't wait for tonite's storm:(

Triet Le
'95 Classic (finally got to see the traction control light come on)
the canyons of Manhattan, NY

------------------------------

From: "Tom Rowe" <TROWE@AE.AGECON.WISC.EDU>
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 10:57:48 GMT -0600
Subject: re:freezing discovery 

John C. White, III writes: 

> "UW-Madison Center for Dairy Research"?
 
> Never heard of it.  ;-)

John,
Well, I thought that LR owners were better snoops than that. You 
know, having to get those hard to find parts and all. My area code is 
in my sig as well as the old abreviation for Wisconsin. :-)
But point taken.

Tom Rowe
UW-Madison Center for Dairy Research    
Madison,WI, USA           --------------Better?-------------------
608-265-6194, Fax:608-262-1578        
trowe@ae.agecon.wisc.edu                

 Four wheel drive allows you to get
 stuck in places even more inaccessible.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 08:56:43 -0800
From: "John C. White, III" <jcwhite3@well.com>
Subject: Re: LR Dealers

The owners' manuals in all of the new Land Rovers list them in the back.

Cheers!
John
At 09:42 11.01.96 -0600, Robert Kolander wrote:
>To change subscription write to: Majordomo@Land-Rover.Team.Net
>I am trying to compile a comprehensive list of all LR dealers in the
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 18 lines)]
>Thanks, 
>Bob K.

------------------------------

From: "Tom Rowe" <TROWE@AE.AGECON.WISC.EDU>
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 11:03:19 GMT -0600
Subject: engine braking

Ok Ok. I stand corrected. I gues we're talking about different kinds 
of diesels. I'll do some checking and post the info about where they 
differ, if people want.

Tom Rowe
UW-Madison Center for Dairy Research    
Madison,WI, USA
608-265-6194, Fax:608-262-1578        
trowe@ae.agecon.wisc.edu                

 Four wheel drive allows you to get
 stuck in places even more inaccessible.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 12:21:06 -0500
From: veal@execulink.com (Tim Veal)
Subject: re: Cranks

I have a 1972 Ser. III s.w.b. model with a 2.25 petrol engine.  I read about
crank problems, and I thought I'd ask about how tight my engine seems.  When
it's cold, it's all I can do to muster up enough strength to turn the engine
over once.  It's seems extremely tight- I've never started it with the crank
successfully, and I'm no 90lb weakling either.  Could it be that my engine
bearings have been over-tightened?  Or maybe my clutch is the problem?  I've
started many other cars this way... my old MGA and a friends Series IIA
landie, so I am using the correct procedure.  WHY? WHY? WHY?

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 12:16:31 -0500 (EST)
From: jonny@hookup.net (Jonathan M. Rosenthal)
Subject: Locking the Differential on a Disco

My 95 Disco is in for service today and I am having a bit of a dispute with
my dealer.  I am unable to lock the differential without shifting the
vehicle into Neutral and shifting in the same manner as from high to low.
My salesman
says this is the only way to do it.  The manual and the video on
off-roading say the diff can be locked while moving at a reasonable speed
by simply moving the shift lock to the left.

Am I totally confused or is my dealer correct.

The difficulty with his method is I would have to be travelling at a very
low rate of speed. Further even if I do this the light never stays on for
more than a few seconds. Is something wrong here.

Any help would be appreciated.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 12:17:33 -0500 (EST)
From: Dixon Kenner <dkenner@emr1.emr.ca>
Subject: Re: Vehicle ID Suffix Question

On Wed, 10 Jan 1996 ASFCO@aol.com wrote:

> Anybody have a clue as to  what the letter  after the serial number
> represents?? I do beleive it is a design modification indicator but what
> exactly I don't know. Anybody have any idea??? The letter in question is D

	Assuming it is a IIA, suffix D came into effect on April 1967.
	It denoted the change to negative earth, rocker brackets, Zenith
	Carb, single grommet bell housing, cranked handbrake.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 12:43:14 -0500 (EST)
From: Dixon Kenner <dkenner@emr1.emr.ca>
Subject: Re: 2.25 Diesel

On Thu, 11 Jan 1996, Andy Woodward wrote:

> >I agree with everything you say Kevin except this. Diesels are known 
> >for not having good engine braking. That's why the Jake Brake was 
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 6 lines)]
> They ARENT?????? With 22:1 compression?????
> Take the foot off the throttle with mine and it's like hitting a wall. 

	My experience (vis only with Dale's diesel) is that his diesel
	decelerates much faster that my petrol 109 sw when you take your
	foot off the gas.  22:1 vs 7:1 makes quite the difference.

------------------------------

From: "Gerald" <g@ix.netcom.com>
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 13:25:36 -0500
Subject: Re: Hi-lift jack in a RR, gauge location.

On 11 Jan 96 at 8:42, debrown@srp.gov wrote:
. . . .
> John asks where/how to mount a High-lift jack in his RR. 
. . . .
I've done this with light things in bumpy conditions and heavier 
things in smooth: Straps made of Velcro to hold things to the 
carpeting. Nice because they can be moved around easily depending on 
loading of other things. Would it work with a Hi-lift jack?

--
Gerald
Massachusetts, U.S.
g@ix.netcom.com

------------------------------

From: "Gerald" <g@ix.netcom.com>
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 13:25:36 -0500
Subject: Analog clock to replace digital in Disco

I recall pictures of Disco's before the 96 model year that had analog 
clocks. These appear to fit in the space used by the digital clock. 
Can I get one a replace the digital clock?

Why? It is easier for me to tell time on an analog device because I
view time as an analog thing.

--
Gerald
Massachusetts, U.S.
g@ix.netcom.com

------------------------------

Date:  Thu, 11 Jan 1996 13:11:00 -0500 
From: "christian (c.j.) szpilfogel" <chrisz@bnr.ca>
Subject:  re:freezing discovery 

>From: "Gerald" <g@ix.netcom.com>
>I must have missed something. Who sells block heaters for Discoverys?

Mine came standard with the vehicle. Until now I had assumed it was
put on all NAS Discoverys. As Dixon mentioned, you can get one at a
local auto store. They are usually pretty easy to install as they just
screw into a hole in the block where it heats the coolant.

But then again my Discovery has a number of unique features. For example,
apparently I have the only Discovery in Ottawa that has a Range Rover
diagnostic box under the passenger seat. Anybody else have one? I
speculate that the guys on the Range Rover line got piss drunk one night
and installed them on a few Discoverys as props.

Cheers,

  -Christian

------------------------------

Christian Szpilfogel  - '95 Discovery
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
chrisz@bnr.ca   Work: (613) 763-5713   FAX:  (613) 765-4855           
---------------------------------------------------------------
My Opinions are my own and you may borrow them, if you wish, 
but I want them back when you're done.

------------------------------

From: PurnellJE@aol.com
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 13:32:37 -0500
Subject: Re: Broken Rules

In a message dated 96-01-10 18:21:40 EST, you write:
>Someone posted yesterday asking me what off-roading "rules" I broke that led
>to me getting stuck the other night in the snow.  While there are probably
>multitudes of off-road do's and don't's; here are some that I knew and
>disregarded.

Thanks for the list.  I think the only thing I have regarding the list is the
Defender.  I'd better go shopping...:)
John.
D90

------------------------------

From: PurnellJE@aol.com
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 13:32:50 -0500
Subject: Re: Load space protector

In a message dated 96-01-09 21:39:54 EST, you write:

>I haven't seen the video, but I've got a spider-web bunji cord thingee that
>I use to secure the load on my VW Westfalia luggage rack. I think I bought
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 6 lines)]
>Cheers
>Mike Loiodice

thanks Mike.  I'll check the Kmart too, David R. told me he got one at a 4WD
place, called a "spiderweb"

JOhn.

------------------------------

From: Mark.Kraieski@mailport.delta-air.com
Date: 11 Jan 96 13:33:40 -0500
Subject: RE: Recent trip to the Dealer

Are you looking for a new D90? Hennessy Land Rover in Atlanta has several of 
them available at this time, maybe 10. Just dropped my Disco off this 
morning and was looking them over. You can even pick from a couple of 
colors, no yellow though. I think all yellow NAS D90's have been sold 
everywhere! They will not deal on the price - out the door at list - though 
you may be able to bargain on options. Contact Ned Neilson at 770/587-2000. 
Tell him Mark Kraieski sent you.

Mark
 ----------
>From: kolanrj@gw.startribune.com

>Could whoever submitted this message please contact me with that
>dealer's phone number? I've been searching for a D90 and I usually
>end up just missing it by a day or two! (aarrgh!) No one here (MN)
>seems to want to sell their baby, so I've been scanning the globe (or
>at least the continent) for one...

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 11:04:00 -0800
From: Christopher Boese <cboese@co.san-bernardino.ca.us>
Subject: Re: freezing discovery 

christian (c.j.) szpilfogel wrote:

> But then again my Discovery has a number of unique features. For example,
> apparently I have the only Discovery in Ottawa that has a Range Rover
> diagnostic box under the passenger seat. Anybody else have one?

I do. A label calls it a "Range Rover On Board Diagnostic Display". I wonder if this is helpful 
for anyone but the dealers. I remember a post some weeks ago about how to read the display on a 
Defender or Discovery. Anyone know how to do this? Does the shop manual cover it?

-- 

Christopher Boese
County of San Bernardino, California
Information Services, Information Systems Security Office
'95 beluga black Discovery V8i

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 14:22:34 -0500 (EST)
From: Ross Leidy <ross@secant.com>
Subject: RE: Recent trip to the Dealer

>>From: kolanrj@gw.startribune.com
>>Could whoever submitted this message please contact me with that
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 7 lines)]
>>seems to want to sell their baby, so I've been scanning the globe (or
>>at least the continent) for one...

Unless your (relatively) local dealer is different from mine, they should be
able to find a D90 for you and have it trucked/driven back to them.  That's
what my dealer did for me.  I told them what color/options I wanted and they
did a search and found what I wanted.  I'm in Cleveland, OH and my D90 was
in Chicago, IL.  There should be no cost to you; dealers swap vehicles all
the time.

Happy hunting,

- Ross
______________________________
Ross Leidy    ross@secant.com
Secant Technologies
95 NAS D90

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 96 14:40:07 EST
From: "Bobeck, David R." <dbobeck@ushmm.org>
Subject: Burlieth LR club activities

     Dateline: January 7th, Washington DC, USA...Major snowstorm paralyzes 
     entire city! Land Rovers take over the streets...(appropriate "news" 
     musical track along with video lead-in, showing convoy of Series 
     Rovers plodding through drifts of virgin white snow).
     
      This weekend provided ample opportunity for the various Rovers in our 
     neighborhood to display their amazing abilities. Ron O'Day and i 
     started Sunday morning by escorting our friend out to the Beltway in 
     his Vovlo wagon. Had it not been for the fresh tracks we cut, he would 
     surely have been stuck. He left us when Ron's Rover decided to stop in 
     the middle of the highway... With Ron up and running again (still a 
     mystery) we were on our way to Potomac MD, where we negotiated a tough 
     obstacle course around a bus which had gone sideways. Then it was back 
     to DC, to pick up Nancy (my co-pilot on my return trip from buying the 
     beast) so that she could get a taste of Land-Rovering. We tried both 
     Rovers and executed many recoveries of two wheelers and inferior 
     4x4's. Nobody went to work Monday, so it was back to the streets. We 
     drove otut to Bethesda to buy sleds, I bought one but preferred to 
     ride my skateboard with the wheels off. Much more challenging and you 
     get more snow down your pants! Monday night we did our usual "Urban 
     off-road" course through the back alleys of Burleith, which had not 
     yet been traveled by anything or anyone. Snow up to the sills was 
     about the deepest we got. The only time I got stuck was trying to go 
     through virgin drifts that were at least two feet. Fortunately I was 
     equipped with a (small) shovel so I was able to free myself without 
     having to (blush) flag down a j**p. We ferried Will's Mum and Dad to a 
     dinner party Mon. night, amazing everyone (myself included) with the 
     Rovers ability. I felt obligated to do this as I had in a fit of 
     helpfulness broken a brake-pipe on Will's IIa. Each day saw more 
     recoveries of stuck motorists. Tuesday I got a call from Ron in the 
     morning that he couldn't start his Rover, so I drove the two blocks to 
     his house and found him there with a smoking starter solenoid. The 
     connection from the battery was glowing red hot. I told him the 
     connections were dirty and that was the problem, but he didn't believe 
     me so i decided to break the solenoid out of spite:-) now he'll 
     replace it and have nice, clean connections. At least he can start it 
     with a screwdriver now. Actually you don't even need a screwdriver, 
     just move the broken post over so it touches the other one, and voila!
     Wednesday was a nightmare as everyone decided it was okay to drive 
     about in normal cars again. At least when there's a 4x4 coming you can 
     both move over to the side to let each other pass, but in a regular 
     car you get stuck, so they just sit there nose to nose and stare at 
     each other. i tried going up R street 3 times before i lost patience 
     and refused to move. I made 4 cars back up to get out of my way. Ha!
     
     Here's a small piece from the Washington Post:
     
     "Trudging across the tundra of the suburbs, The Source noticed that a 
     caste system had emerged in the blizzard. There were those on foot, 
     their expensive foreign sedans immobilized. There were those with 
     four-wheel-drive vehicles, smugly peering out their tinted windows, 
     wearing snow-eating grins. And elevated beyond their ordinary status 
     to the highest caste were Range Rover operators. They can plow through 
     drifts without ever hanging up the car phone. Maybe they're all 
     talking to each other in some Rover Friends and Family network." 
     
     If only they knew...
     
     So anyway, after all is said and done, here's the weekends tally.
     
     Sightings:
     
     Tons of Rangies
     Tons of Disco's. (One stuck in Glen Echo, refused tow)
     1 Series IIa 109, ex-MoD with capstan winch. Parked next to it at 
     Safeway:-) Came out to find owner peering into my truck... 
     Five or six Defender 90's, One waved. (McArthur Blvd, Yellow, driver 
     wore plaid coat)
     
     Recoveries of Inferior 4x4's
     
     Jeep Wrangler
     Geo Tracker
     Isuzu Rodeo
     Oldsmobile Bravada
     Nissan(?) Pickup
      
     Earnings from Recoveries
     
     $26 US
     2 12oz bottles of Guiness
     3 12oz bottles of Rolling Rock
     1 Washington Post
     
     Also my mom as well as a local friend said they caught a clip of a 
     Series Rover on the news from DC.
     
     Neighborhood Rovers that didn't move
     
     1 Series III 88. Still buried.
     1 Series II(A) 109 SW. NEVER moves. Owner also has RR.
     1 Series IIa 88 SW. Will's, my fault for breaking brake line. :-(
       (I let him drive mine though)
     
     Regards to all.  Enjoy the weather. The funny thing is, this was a 
     relatively minor storm compared to what alot of you guys get, and yet 
     it still managed to literally paralyze an entire city. Sheesh. 
     
     Glad I got my Rover,
     Dave Bobeck. 
     72 Series III 88 "Green Car"
     Washington DC. USA
     

------------------------------

From: ASFCO@aol.com
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 14:49:04 -0500
Subject: 2  D90's for sale

 If it's a help to anyone....  There are 2  D90 hardtops at the local dealer
here..One Blue/white, the other all white.  E-mail me direct if you need any
further info .....I am in Albany NY.
                                                                  Rgds
    Steve     72 s lll 88

                                                                            "
Keep the Whole World Singing "

------------------------------

Subject: WD-40/ABS/Waterton Lakes
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 96 14:53:24 -0500
From: Dick Hahn <dreams@nexusprime.org>

-- [ From: Dick Hahn * EMC.Ver #2.5.02 ] --

As I came in from the dock because the fish thought it too cold to bit (62 F
.)  I thought it would be enjoyable to read the latest digest.
WD-40.  I recommend the use of this type product for frozen locks.  It is
best to use before they freeze.  W D stands for Water Dispersant. (40 stands
for fortieth formula)  By using it, it will force the water away from the
parts which are freezing.
ABS  -  The insurance company which I have my policies with is no longer
giving rate reductions for vehicles with ABS brakes.  Their study has shown
that there is little if any difference in the accident rates between cars
with or with ABS.
WATERTON LAKES.  Fantastic fairy tale which made my day

dick hahn

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 15:07:59 -0500
From: rvirzi@gte.com (Robert A. Virzi)
Subject: LRNA comments on Warranties and aftermarket parts

I just got off the phone with Carol Gay (sp?), warranty department of LRNA.
I asked her about the effects of aftermarket parts on the LRNA new car
warranty.  Bottom line - if there is a problem and LRNA can show it was
caused by a defect in the aftermarket part, you are out of luck.  An
aftermarket part does not, just by being there, mean your warranty is void.

I asked some hypotheticals.  First, ARB Locker on rear and the xfer case
explodes.  (Carol actually went and asked an engineer about this one.)  She
said LRNA would stand by the xfer box as long as they could not show that
the ARB locker caused the problem.  A defective locker would be suspect,
and investigated.

Queried about front bumper.  Got the impression you'd be on very solid
ground so long as the bumper used same attachment points as original.  She
specifically mentioned two 'gray areas' with bumpers.  (1) If you reworked
frame/sheet metal and later corrosion appeared near modifications.  (2) If
the airbag wiring harness, "which runs all through there," were damaged or
altered and the airbags failed.

She went on to lecture me regarding the fairly liberal policy LRNA takes
towards this, and how they really just want to protect themselves from
faulty aftermarket parts causing failures elsewhere.  (Story she gave about
"not covering a cooked engine if JiffyLube filter blows a leak" deleted.)
She also seemed puzzled as to why I didn't just buy a d90 if I wanted to
take the thing offroad, anyway.   Sigh.

-Bob Virzi (Mass., USA)

  rvirzi@gte.com             Think Globally. ===
  +1(617)466-2881                            === Act Locally!

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 96 15:39:17 EST
From: "Bobeck, David R." <dbobeck@ushmm.org>
Subject: Re[2]: One Brahmin Writes

To change subscription write to: Majordomo@Land-Rover.Team.Net

Re: Secret handshakes and other amusing pastimes:

Actually, REAL Rover owners don't need any such silly things as secret 
handshakes, as the partial deafness, weak bladders and grease under the 
fingernails identifies us far better than any copyable series of actions. 8*)

     ajr

 P.S.: This was a JOKE!!!! ...8*)

what? oh...
phew. I thought you were serious "again". Write more later, gotta check out the 
"head"

Dave "Pass the fingernail grease" Bobeck

------------------------------

From: ChrisF6724@aol.com
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 15:49:13 -0500
Subject: Rabies?

I just found out what that smoke was in my engine bay; steam.  My oil has
turned into a pretty white froth (similar to the "limestone" color).  I have
it in yet another shop to check it for a cracked block, bad head gasket, or
just bad luck.  

Maybe they'll diagnose rabies.... ;-)

Oh what fun to make a Land Rover run....

Chris Fisher  '73 LR88 Series 3

------------------------------

From: "Robert Watson (CNA)" <a-robw@microsoft.com>
Subject: RE: Analog clock to replace digital in Disco
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 12:59:46 -0800

>From my rides in a (NAS) RR Classic, I noticed the center dash console looks 
remarkably like the one in my Discovery, with one exception being the clock. 
The RR has an analog unit where the Disco has the Digital. I suspect you 
could get a RR clock to replace it with (but I bet you'll part with and "arm 
and a leg" in the process.  OBTW, my 95 Disco has a digital clock.

----------
From: 	Gerald[SMTP:g@ix.netcom.com]
Sent: 	Thursday, January 11, 1996 10:25 AM
Subject: 	Analog clock to replace digital in Disco

I recall pictures of Disco's before the 96 model year that had analog 
clocks. These appear to fit in the space used by the digital clock. 
Can I get one a replace the digital clock?

--
Gerald
Massachusetts, U.S.
g@ix.netcom.com
---------------------------------
    _____
   /|__|_\__(|                           Bob Watson
  |   |   |  \                 a-robw@microsoft.com
  |---|___|___\____      Mountlake Terrace, WA, USA 
  |  _|=  |=  |o_  }\                
 [|_/_ \__|___|/_\_}|    '95 Beluga Black Discovery
    \_/        \_/                            N7UMU

------------------------------

From: "fisk.spencer" <fisk@gene.com>
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 13:10:00 -0800
Subject: Series I 88

I am in the process of rebuilding my Series I 1958 88, and am in need of
helpful electrical, brake lines and engine rebuild advice.  Basically, I
have stripped it down to the frame, rebuilt the diff's, gearbox and hubs,
but I still have a long way to go.  I am replacing the engine with a
series II 2.25L, and have it partially re-built, but I need parts, or a
whole engine.  If any of you have helpful hints on the electrical and
engine re-build, or anything elso for that matter,I'd love to hear from
you!  My Rover has been garaged for three years now, and I am very
anxious about getting it running!  I can be reached directly by E-mail
at:   Fisk.Spencer@Gene.com.  I welcome any replies.  Thanks!

------------------------------

From: "Tom Rowe" <TROWE@AE.AGECON.WISC.EDU>
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 15:38:46 GMT -0600
Subject: painting near computers

Anyone aware of any real hazards (other than fire) of spray painting 
around operating computers? Bldg maint just walked in and is painting 
ceiling tiles.

Tom Rowe
UW-Madison Center for Dairy Research    
Madison,WI, USA
608-265-6194, Fax:608-262-1578        
trowe@ae.agecon.wisc.edu                

 Four wheel drive allows you to get
 stuck in places even more inaccessible.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 96 13:36:11 PST
From: rlarson@lsil.com (Rick Larson)
Subject: re:Re: Differentials

>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 96 8:00:37 EST
>From: "barnett childress" <barnett=childress%Eng%EMCHOP1@fishbowl02.lss.emc.com>
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 10 lines)]
>for Hummers!
>Barnett.

They have stock limited slip.  I'd guess the torque "doubling" is due to 
portal axles.  There are reduction gears in those "wheels" to allow the axles
to come into the wheel above the hub line.  

-Rick

Richard Larson
LSI Logic Corporation
(408) 433-7149

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 96 13:53:55 PST
From: rlarson@lsil.com (Rick Larson)
Subject: re:  DIFF GUARDS RE: MARK TALBOTS QUESTION

>Date: 10 Jan 96 08:41:57 EST
>From: Mark Ritter <70472.1130@compuserve.com>
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 14 lines)]
>							Mark Ritter
>							94 Disco...
>							Keeps getting better
I'll 2nd.

Got a bunch of Safari Gard stuff.  The diff guards work.  Mine have scars to prove it.
So do the rock sliders.  Favorite toy from them has to be the rear work/backup light
though.

Rick, '94 D90,  Safari Gard round 2 scheduled for Feb 4,5th.
		(Rear skid plate, some additional tow clevis, other misc. stuff....)

Richard Larson
LSI Logic Corporation
(408) 433-7149

------------------------------

From: ChrisF6724@aol.com
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 16:58:21 -0500
Subject: RE: Rabies?

I got great news from my mechanic.  He did not find anything wrong except
water in the oil pan.  No cracked block, no blown head, not bad valves, no
water in fuel tank,...  As near as we can figure is that when I degreased the
engine a couple of weeks ago , I somehow managed to get water down the oil
filler.  The other possibility is that it's been really slushy in Denver
lately and somehow that contaminated the oil.  Go Figure!   A simple oil
change and it's ready to go again...  BTW, I have also noticed lately that
the "blue fog" trailing my LR has mysteriously disappeared.  Do these things
fix themselves?

>From now on I'll wash everything with baggy covers.

Happy again,
Chris Fisher

------------------------------

From: "Tom Rowe" <TROWE@AE.AGECON.WISC.EDU>
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 16:19:43 GMT -0600
Subject: Re: painting near computers

Boy,
What a screw up. I meant to send that to the campus tech partners 
list, not LRO. Someone walked in and started talking to me as I was 
sending it and I selected the wrong list.
My appologies for the non LR related post.

Tom Rowe
UW-Madison Center for Dairy Research    
Madison,WI, USA
608-265-6194, Fax:608-262-1578        
trowe@ae.agecon.wisc.edu                

 Four wheel drive allows you to get
 stuck in places even more inaccessible.

------------------------------

From: clapp.carol@mail.viacomcv.hybrid.com (Carol Clapp)
Subject: Hand cranking
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 14:45:48 +0000

Sorry to hear Granville has a problem with a hand after hand cranking.

I used to do a lot of hand cranking - it was the way it often was when I
started driving, can even be useful now to loosen up an engine if there is a
hole and you have a handle.   I was always taught to keep my thumb on the
same side of the handle as the fingers - that avoids hand/wrist injury.

Hope this will help someone avoid injury.
Carol
SII 99" 1959

------------------------------

From: "Robert Watson (CNA)" <a-robw@microsoft.com>
Subject: RE: Any reason? 
Date: Wed, 10 Jan 1996 18:11:24 -0800

re: UK vs. US pricing....

Ben, do your UK prices include VAT? If so, this is not quite an Apples v. 
Apples comparison. While the sales tax on a vehicle in my neighborhood is 
not the same as VAT (fortunately) removing it from the UK prices would level 
the prices a bit: e.g.:

                    --- UK Price --     US Price
  Disco 5dr V8i S   L22,935  $38,072    $29,950
      w/o 17.5% vat           32,401

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 16:31:15 -0600
From: William Owen <ib011ca@smtpaoc.tsc.state.tn.us>
Subject:  LR instructional video

Several years ago I saw an ad for an off road instructional video put out
by LR.  It featured a RR.  Don't remember much else at all except it had
some basic advice like cross ditches at a 45 angle etc.  Seemed to be
mostly promotional.  
Does anyone know how I can obtain one of these?  LRNA  (1800fine
4wd) operator says all she can do is give me dealer names and numbers.
 Local dealer says their only videos are promo and not for sale.  Anyone
seen this or know where I can find it?
Thanks, William

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 09:39:33 +1000
From: Richard Clarke <clarker@goldy.agvic.gov.au>
Subject: Re: The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest

This is my first attempt at writing to the LRO Digest so I hope this 
is right!

Can anyone in Australia let me have/sell me cheap a carby body (or 
whole carby) for a 2.25 landy engine?  I want the Zenith one not the 
Solex.

Mine has had some water in it which has coroded the accelerator pump 
section. - apparantly this cant be fixed. (we tried washing it out 
with battery acid but that didn't work)

I guess when I get it stuch in the back dam I should blow out the 
carby as well as changing the oils - last time I found out I should 
make sure the clutch is dry b4 letting it sit for a couple of weeks 
and rusting to the flywheel

Any replies by email would be appreciated
Richard Clarke
Manager Internal Audit Services
Department of Agriculture, Energy and Minerals
Victoria 
Australia

------------------------------

From: Mark.Maslar@software.rockwell.com (Maslar, Mark)
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 17:45:51 -0500
Subject: South of the border -- Hi octane fuel

Several messages in today's digest got me thinking about the availability   
of high octane fuel in Mexico and Central America:

* Benjamin Smith posted a message about the Panama / Alaska rally   
 (sounds like an excellent adventure)
* Leyland Roys posted a message about driving in Baja  (His adventure   
will last longer than the trip.)

What can be done for fuel in Mexico and Central America? The D-90   
requires 92 octane fuel (and lots of it!). When I drove the Baja   
peninsula a few years back (paved road; rented VW Golf) the only fuels   
available were "Nova" leaded and regular unleaded. (NoVa means "doesn't   
go -- this leaded fuel has only ~80 octane.)

It strikes me as odd that the Rover's drivetrain can take it nearly   
anywhere, but the fuel requirements seem to tether it to North America.   
Am I missing something?

Mark Maslar
'95 D-90  (Soft top in Cleveland. I don't mind brushing snow off the   
outside of the vehicle, but the driver's seat?)

------------------------------

From: clapp.carol@mail.viacomcv.hybrid.com (Carol Clapp)
Subject: Auto insurance for Land Rovers
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 15:00:23 +0000

I pay a high rate of auto insurance on my Wrangler, about 3x what my husband
pays on his new Eagle Vision, and I have a better record than he, as he had
3 vehicles written off in one year when they were parked!

What sort of 6 monthly costs do you fork out for Land Rover insurance?

I was paying $17 per month, fully comprehensive in UK on my SIII.
My Wrangler is about $280 per month, fully comp.
My Land Rover does not go on the road yet so does not have that sort of cover.

In UK insurance on 4x4 is usually low as they are considered a low risk, but
here in USA they are usually considered high risk as they are often driven
by young people, who obviously have yet to build up a lot of experience in
driving before they graduate to being a low risk.

Land Rovers are tough.  My son in his 90 had a new, limited edition, Ford
run into him when the Ford driver lost control.  The Ford was totally
written off (and not insured for that risk), and my son had to search for
damage to his Landy and couldn't even find a scratch!   The Ford driver was
furious, but their own fault entirely, admitted going too fast on windy
country lane.  High banks, no where to get off the road.

Thanks for guidance from some of you.  I'm in SF Bay Area.
Carol

------------------------------

From: ericz@cloud9.net
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 15:22:30 -0800
Subject: LR Dealer Disaster

Time to vent.

My father and I walked into the local dealer (Pepe motors in White Plains, NY) 
this evening to peruse the offerings. It seems my father's Acura is giving up 
the ghost and he was considering coming back into the fold (With a D90 or 
Disco).

Pepe motors is a high-line auto dealership, with Mercedes, Ferrari and all other 
manner of plushmobiles.  We walked in, looking a little worse for wear because 
of the snow but nonetheless respectable.  For at least 15 minutes we were 
ignored by the more than 10 salesmen in the place!  Several salesmen walked 
right by us, as we stared incredulously. We had dutifully registered with the 
receptionist when we walked in and spent our time opening and closing doors of 
the Disco, genuinely interested in what was in stock, pricing and availability 
of the D90 hardtop.  

I am absolutley disgusted by the utter lack of respect given us in that 
dealership.  True, we weren't dressed by Barbour (I was wearing my RN fleece 
with LR embroidered on it, though) but we were there to buy.  There were no 
other customers in the place and we were blown off like a couple high school 
kids in a Ferrari dealer.  That is no way to run a business.  I wonder how the 
service department is if the salesmen are so snotty.

Is this the image that LRNA wants to present?  I certianly hope not.  I now 
understand why most new LR owners are a bunch of limp wristed, stuck up, pricks 
(mailing list people and the like excluded).  You would have to be in order to 
deal with such an operation.  If anyone affiliated with LRNA reads this (yeah, 
right!), I have already spoken to the Dealership managment and will soon contact 
LRNA managment in the US as well as the operation in Solihull.

To give equal time, I spoke with the LR manager at the dealership and he said he 
would try and make it right.  I don't know how but I'll keep you posted.

Pissed off in NY

Eric

------------------------------

From: ASFCO@aol.com
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 18:33:41 -0500
Subject: Block heater for 2.25

anyone have the Zero-start part number which will fit the threaded plug
behind the manifold????   I remember there was some discussion on this a few
weeks back but can't find the info ...a call to Zero-start (Phillips Tembro
corp. )   produced no results .
                                            Thanks      Steve Bradke   WA2GMC
 72 s lll 88

                                                                        "Keep
the Whole World Singing"

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 96 23:38:28 UT
From: "Mark Talbot" <Land_Rover@msn.com>
Subject: RE: Hi-lift jack in a RR, gauge location.

Think John Brabyn (SP?) mounted his hi-lift inside the rear wheel arch of his 
RR. John, can you confirm, I remember reading an article he wrote. 

Mark

----------
From:  debrown@srp.gov
Sent:  Thursday, January 11, 1996 10:43 AM
Subject:  Hi-lift jack in a RR, gauge location.

To change subscription write to: Majordomo@Land-Rover.Team.Net

FROM:  David Brown                           Internet: debrown@srp.gov
       Computer Graphics Specialist * Mapping Services & Engr Graphics
       PAB219 (602)236-3544 -  Pager:6486 External (602)275-2508 #6486
John asks where/how to mount a High-lift jack in his RR. I too have the same
question. For right now, it's laying along the floor in the back seat. I had
it laying along the rear floor once, and after some rough 4-wheeling, the
top of the jack gouged the carpet off the tailgate. A little weatherstrip
adhesive remedied the situation, but a more suitable and permanent solution
is required. I thought of actually mounting (with the lock/mount I have) to
the angled portion of the floor just in front of the rear seats. It limits
foot space a bit, but not too much.

BTW, I mounted my fire extinguisher on the seat pedestal on the front side
of the drivers seat, and the mag-light in the same place on the passenger
side. (I wanted them both to be handy!)

While I'm here, I also have a triple gauge (oil/water/amp) that I want to
mount. The only place that I have come up with is just to the left of the
steering wheel, right below the A/C vent on the left side (next to the
door). (UK, this would be the reverse.) Anyone else mount gauges? Where did
you mount them?

Thanks, Dave (snowbird, and lovin' it!) Brown

 #=====#         #========#          -------,___          _________
 |___|__\___     |___|__|__\___      |--' |  |  \_|_     //__/__|__\___
 | _ |   |_ |}   | _ |  |   |_ |}    |  _ |--+--|_  |    \__/-\_|__/-\_|}
 "(_)""""(_)"    "(_)"""""""(_)"    ||_/_\___|__/_\_|}      (_)    (_)
                                       (_)      (_)
 1971 "88" IIa   1970 "109" IIa     1994 Discovery (Sold) '87 Range Rover
 LIC: LION B8    Historic plates     (Too hard to "draw")  rear Lock-Right
 Phoenix Arizona USA                                       Crane cam

#=======#          ________           We make a living by what we get,
|__|__|__\___     /__/__|__\___        we make a life by what we give.
| _|  |   |_ |}   \_/-\_|__/-\_|}

------------------------------

From: "Tom Walsh" <tomw@netcom.com>
Date:          Wed, 10 Jan 1996 16:11:03 +0000
Subject:       Re: Dual battery location for Disco.

> From:          debrown@srp.gov
> Date:          11 Jan 96 14:19:27 MST
> To:            <mendo_recce@owens.ridgecrest.ca.us>
> Subject:       Dual battery location for Disco.
> Reply-to:      mendo_recce@ridgecrest.ca.us

Actually,
Where I thought it could go was also where the Windsheild washer 
fluid container is, if.... you remove the floor jack ( in between the 
air intake and power steering pump ) you can then put a smaller windsheild 
resevoir ( or smaller battery ) in that spot. if you go the route of 
moving the windsheild resevoir then you have a large area  (rather 
short in height ) to put another battery.

> When I had my Disco, I looked for a location to put a 2nd battery. The only
> locations I found under the hood were: 1.) In place of the windshield washer
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 10 lines)]
> Check it out, it looked like this would have worked. Shouldn't be too
> difficult to come up with a place to relocate these things.

Tomw
---------*---------*---------*---------*---------*---------*
                       Fluent Networks
             "Intelligent Networking Solutions"
Tom Walsh
tomw@netcom.com soon to be tomw@fluentnet.com
95 LR Disco "The Green Monster"
#include <std_disclaim.h>
*---------*---------*---------*---------*---------*---------*

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 16:13:15 -0800
From: Christopher Boese <cboese@co.san-bernardino.ca.us>
Subject: Re: LR Dealer Disaster

ericz@cloud9.net wrote:

> Pepe motors is a high-line auto dealership, with Mercedes, Ferrari and all other
> manner of plushmobiles.  We walked in, looking a little worse for wear because
> of the snow but nonetheless respectable.  For at least 15 minutes we were
> ignored by the more than 10 salesmen in the place!  Several salesmen 

Etc.

This doesn't surprise me. When I was shopping for my Discovery, I had a 
similarly disappointing and rather insulting experience at the Mission 
Viejo Land Rover Centre. I did find a salesman right away (he was 
following the LR Centre dress code exactly -- khaki shirt, shorts, hiking 
boots), but the first thing he insisted on telling me was, "We're selling 
these for sticker price. We're basically not giving discounts, just so 
you know." I hadn't asked about Discovery prices. The "test drive" I got 
("I've got a customer coming later.") was five minutes up the road with 
the salesman driving, up over a curb the "demonstrate" the suspension, 
then me driving the mile or so straight back to the dealership. When I 
asked about transmission whine, the guy got crabby. But he promised that 
I'd be invited to various upcoming events at the "Centre". I never heard 
another word.

I bought my Discovery from Symes Cadillac/Land Rover in Pasadena for $800 
under sticker.

-- 

Christopher Boese
County of San Bernardino, California
Information Services, Information Systems Security Office
'95 beluga black Discovery V8i

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 20:00:11 -0500
From: benedick@pa.net (Darwyn/Kris Benedict)
Subject: Re: LR Dealer Disaster and Opposite

Eric and all:

>Is this the image that LRNA wants to present?  I certianly hope not.  

Try being in your late 20's and Female!!!!!!  I got the same crap attitude
in Naple, Fla (at Sheldon).  I drove by the dealership and saw a couple of
Rangie and wanted to check them out for my husband (2 weeks prior I got my
Disco, but not there-I was there on vacation)  I drove in a Pontiac
Transport and went right over to the vehicles and spent a good 15 minutes
walking around them and checking them out.  There were many money grubbers
(I mean salespeople- No offense I know your not all this way) that saw me
but wouldn't come out to talk with me.  I almost walked into the 'ship and
showed them the picture of my baby (Disco) that I had with me, but I thought
why bother.

TIME 2:  In Towson, MD at HBL, inc.  This time I drove in in my husbands
Caddie and spoke with a salesman.  I told him I had a Disco and knew all
about the 4.0 and basically just wanted prices (for the Caddie-No I really
didn't expect them to "deal" on the Rover)  Anyhow, I was treated like a 16
dumb blonde and sent on my way.  Ok all you in the MD area go ahead and
defend them.  Just in case anyone  talks to one of these salepeople: we
bought a 4.0, but not from you!!  Who had that last laugh????

On the bright side:  My dealership in Lebonon, PA has been great- from the
start!  AND Frankel(?) outside Baltimore, MD was exceptional nice and
helpful (even on used ones) Ask for Ron.

Kris- 94 disco. Thumper

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 20:26:04 -0500
From: rover@pinn.net (Alexander P. Grice)
Subject: Rovers in the news

>From the AP wire:

"Three if by Land Rover"
        Comedian Denis Leary drove eight hours over snowy highways to attend 
the Boston premier of his new movie, but co-star Sandra Bullock was stranded 
by the Blizzard of '96.
        Leary drove a four wheel drive Land Rover from New York, since 
airports in both New York and Boston were closed.  Bullock planned to fly 
from Newark, NJ, but her flight was cancled.... "Two If By Sea", set on a 
mythical island off Cape Cod, opens nationally on Friday.
      *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"----*
      |               A. P. (Sandy) Grice                   |
      |       Rover Owners' Association of Virginia         |
      |    1633 Melrose Parkway, Norfolk, VA 23508-1730     |
      |  E-mail: rover@pinn.net  Phone: 804-622-7054 (Day)  |
      |    804-423-4898 (Evenings)    FAX: 804-622-7056     |
      *-----------------------------------------------------*

------------------------------

From: PurnellJE@aol.com
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 20:28:27 -0500
Subject: Re: Rabies?

In a message dated 96-01-11 17:16:14 EST, you write:
>  The other possibility is that it's been really slushy in Denver
>lately and somehow that contaminated the oil. BTW, I have also noticed
lately that
>the "blue fog" trailing my LR has mysteriously disappeared.  Do these things
>fix themselves?
>Chris Fisher
yes Chris, they can fix themselves in cold climates.  The slush gets up into
the oil rings and exhaust valve seals, and freezes, causing a "sealing" of
sorts. It's quite common.
John P.  

------------------------------

From: PurnellJE@aol.com
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 20:28:27 -0500
Subject: Re: Auto insurance for Land Rovers

In a message dated 96-01-11 18:03:08 EST, you write:
>What sort of 6 monthly costs do you fork out for Land Rover insurance?

Hi Carol,
here are insurance rates for my DEF90, I'm single (not for long...) 32 (not
for long...), no tickets (knock on wood), no accidents (again, knock on
wood):
in Los Angeles:  700/6mo.s
in Wisconsin:      350/6mo.s
John P,. (just moved to Wisc)
(what? registration? Oh, well, in Calif it was 600.00, but here it is 40.00.
 I bought a D90SW with the savings.)  

------------------------------

From: PurnellJE@aol.com
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 20:28:28 -0500
Subject: Re: South of the border -- Hi octane fuel

In a message dated 96-01-11 18:03:10 EST, you write:
>Mark Maslar
>'95 D-90  (Soft top in Cleveland. I don't mind brushing snow off the   
>outside of the vehicle, but the driver's seat?)

Ha!  Welcome to the (inside) snow brushers of America (NAS) Land Rover Assoc.
 We meet daily during the winter.  Isn't it funny how you simply CANNOT open
the door with out creating that little cloud that comes in to the driver's
seat.  And even if you get the brush out of the back of the def before
opening the drivers door, and brush off the snow, you will find little piles
already deposited there for you by mother nature.  
JOhn, Softy90  in Wisconsin, (aka Dr. Leaky)
94 D90 (aint got none of them 'suspensive style fancy-assed features like map
pockets, lockable rear door, or doors that stay open.)  

------------------------------

From: PurnellJE@aol.com
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 20:28:29 -0500
Subject: Re: South of the border -- Hi octane fuel

In a message dated 96-01-11 18:03:10 EST, you write:
>The D-90   
>requires 92 octane fuel. 
This brings up a good question, do the Land Rovers and/or Range Rovers have
electronic knock control?  Can the ECU adjust timing for optimimum ignition
advance relative to its fuel?  I don't remember reading anything like that in
the material I had access to.

Mark, I have run poor quality unlead regular on a recent trip (only fuel I
could find at a few fillups) where I was pulling a 5x8 trailer with around
2000lbs in it, and don't remember hearing any knocking or pinging.  I use
premium whenever I can find it, but I'm not afraid of running low octane fuel
if that is all that is available.  Keep an ear out for pinging, and for
poorer idle quality and maybe a touch harder starting (probably won't notice
the last two  in the states even on lower grade, too high fuel regulation
standards).  

John.,

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 96 17:29:18 -0500
From: ttownsend@why.net (ttownsend)

-- [ From: Anthony J. Townsend * EMC.Ver #2.5.02 ] --

Hello All,

I also stopped by my local Land Rover dealer today (Land Rover Dallas) and
they have 2 Defender 90 Station  Wagons available. One is a new '95 and the
other is a used(excuse me "preowned" ;-) )'94 with 14k miles (low $30's). 
They also have a '93 D110 with 4,500 miles (high $40's).  All look to be in
very good condition.  If any one is interested, contact Ryan Wingate at
214/691-4294.  No, I don't work for them I'm just a satisfied customer.  

I'm a newbie to the list here and have been thoroughly enjoying it for about
a month now.  

Tony Townsend
'93 RR  (no name yet!) 

------------------------------

From: "Robert Watson (CNA)" <a-robw@microsoft.com>
Subject: RE: LRNA comments on Warranties and aftermarket parts
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 18:07:24 -0800

I'm impressed that you got a reasonable and researched answer.  When I 
called about an ARB bumper, all I got was the answer out of the "LRNA book 
of answers to give over the phone" as read by some automated human. I really 
didn't press the issue though.

>She also seemed puzzled as to why I didn't just buy a d90 if I wanted to
>take the thing offroad, anyway.   Sigh.
>-Bob Virzi (Mass., USA)
Did you say the same reason the Camel Trophy team doesn't use D-90's? :-)
    _____
   /|__|_\__(|                           Bob Watson
  |   |   |  \                 a-robw@microsoft.com
  |---|___|___\____      Mountlake Terrace, WA, USA 
  |  _|=  |=  |o_  }\                
 [|_/_ \__|___|/_\_}|    '95 Beluga Black Discovery
    \_/        \_/                            N7UMU

------------------------------

From: Leland J Roys <roys@hpkel13.cup.hp.com>
Subject: Def-90 Oil leaks
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 96 18:10:20 PST

Hello,

I did fail to mention, the only problem I had on my Colorado trip was oil
leakage from all 4 outside bolts of the valve covers. By the end of the 
trip it had turned into a pretty good stream of oil.

I was all ready to take it into the dealer and complain, when I noticed 
that the bolts were finger loose, I was suprised to find that all 4
bolts were very loose and I could move them all without a wrench. Well,
I tightened them all down with a 5/16th socket (I could not reach the 
4 bolts on the other side of the valve cover) and the oil leak is gone.

Is it normal for the bolts to loosen on there own like that? The trip
was about 2500 miles total (I have 17500 miles on the Def-90 and took it
in to Land Rover for the 7500 mile service). 

I will now check them more often, but I do need to find the proper tool
or technique to reach the other 4 bolts, I am assuming they are also 
loose.

Leland Roys
1994 Def-90 (red)
roys@cup.hp.com

------------------------------

From: "Robert Watson (CNA)" <a-robw@microsoft.com>
Subject: RE: Hummers
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 18:18:28 -0800

>>From looking at hummers (only on TV) I assumed they had independant
>suspension as there was no visible diff and what I assumed to be
>wishbones.
I know this is the "Land Rover" alias, but....
I was by our local Hummer dealer to look at how they do things and saw the 
following on a Gas one (the only one at the time) 
	Geared Hubs
	fully independent suspension (with BIG coil springs) so that makes for 8 
u-joints on the axles alone!
	Central Tire Inflation System (way cool!!!)
	The tires and wheels are VERY tall
	Disk brake rotors on the Diff side of the u-jointed axle, not the wheel 
side. This keeps them up and out of harm's way, I presume.
	Skid "cage" (made of round steel pipes) under the diff's and 
transmission/xfer case
Obviously with the independent suspension and geared hubs, the 
undercarriages is prety clean and the chassis is far from the ground. 
The frame material didn't look that much thicker or "beefier" than my 
Discovery, though there was a bit more of it, mainly more cross-members.
  
>So that makes 1 gearbox, 1 xfer box, 3 diffs and 4 bevel gears (one
>on each wheel).  Pass the ear plugs!
indeed!
    _____
   /|__|_\__(|                           Bob Watson
  |   |   |  \                 a-robw@microsoft.com
  |---|___|___\____      Mountlake Terrace, WA, USA 
  |  _|=  |=  |o_  }\                
 [|_/_ \__|___|/_\_}|    '95 Beluga Black Discovery
    \_/        \_/                            N7UMU

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 19:02:22 -0500
From: landrvr@blacdisc.com (Mike Loiodice)
Subject: Re: Opening bottles (was: Re: Range Rovers off road)

John C. White, IIi adds...

>And if you drive a Plushmobile, you don't need one.  Champagne corks just
>twist out. :-)
-

Corks? They're supposed to have corks?? All my champagne bottles have screw
caps!

Hic! ;-}

Cheers
Mike

------------------------------

From: slade@teleport.com
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 19:08:15 -0800
Subject: Powder Coat

Just got my 4 brand spanking new wheels from British Pacific today and a
few local LR owners had suggested getting them powder coated.

I went by the powder coat place and got the full tour, got a good
explanation of how it works and why it is a good idea.

Needess to say I bit and left my wheels with them.  I did manage to color
match to the limestone tropical top on my 109 perfectly, so the wheels
should look factory perfect when done.

One thing I didn't realize was that you could not powder coat on top of
liquid-based paint.  One quick call to BP and it was confirmed that the
black paint was indeed liquid-based.  So, a quick arrangement with a local
sand-blaster and the deal was done.

All told, the wheels were $70 ea, sand blasting is $10 ea, and the powder
coat will be $25 ea.  I think that I've gotten a pretty good deal.

However, I have absolutely no experience with powdercoating, and was
looking for some advice or tips on how to care for parts that are treated
this way.  It's not too late to back out on the whole deal, the
sandblasting won't happen until tomorrow, so if anyone feels strongly that
this is a bad idea don't hesitate to speak up.

Thanks,

Michael

PS  Any suggs. for other parts that would be worthwhile to powdercoat on a
series LR?

------------------------------

From: Simon Barclay <sbar@jna.com.au>
Subject: RE: Def-90 Oil leaks
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 96 14:09:00 EST

Hi there

>I did fail to mention, the only problem I had on my Colorado trip was oil
>leakage from all 4 outside bolts of the valve covers. By the end of the
t>rip it had turned into a pretty good stream of oil.

>Is it normal for the bolts to loosen on there own like that? The trip

I haven't had problems with these particular bolts, but on all four RR's 
I've owned over the last 12 years,  I found that  you have to check (and 
tighten) the exhaust manifold nuts.

>I will now check them more often, but I do need to find the proper tool
>or technique to reach the other 4 bolts, I am assuming they are also
>loose.

I usually check them when I check the oil!  Yes they can get finger tight 
(finger loose??) very quickly and you can often hear the (extra) noise from 
inside before you realise what the problem is.

Another area that used to cause some (expensive) problems on earlier V8's - 
early to late '70s, was the big end bolts would come loose and fall out, 
 then the crank could break and the con rods could go through the block.  I 
have had experience of this, '7&8 out of bed', even the cam broke - not very 
pleasant - and of course it has to happen in the middle of nowhere.  However 
I believe this problem has been solved, I certainly haven't heard of it 
happening in recent times!

Simon Barclay
Sydney Australia
'90 5sp RR
'51 Series 1 (Louie)

------------------------------

Subject: Re: Any reason? 
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 19:15:40 -0800
From: Benjamin Allan Smith <bens@archimedes.vislab.navy.mil>

Robert Watson wrote:

] re: UK vs. US pricing....
  
] Ben, do your UK prices include VAT? If so, this is not quite an Apples v. 
] Apples comparison. While the sales tax on a vehicle in my neighborhood is 
] not the same as VAT (fortunately) removing it from the UK prices would level 
] the prices a bit: e.g.:
  
]                     --- UK Price --     US Price
]   Disco 5dr V8i S   L22,935  $38,072    $29,950
]       w/o 17.5% vat           32,401

	In my haste to type those numbers in (or was it late at night?) I
failed to notice that they included VAT.   So subtract 17.5% from all of
the UK prices to compare to the US prices.  (and comparing US vs UK
vehicles isn't fair either due to different specificiations anyway...) 
(I was wondering why some of those UK prices seemed too high)

Mea Culpa.

Ben
bens@vislab.navy.mil

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 20:49:42 -0700
From: Lee Zeltzer <lzeltzer@isdtuc2.isdnet.com>
Subject: Re: South of the border -- Hi octane fuel

Great question. Mexico now has a new gasoline. "Magna sin " ; premium, 
without lead. I have used it in my Discovery without problems but I 
really don't have clue what the octane is.
-- 
Lee Zeltzer, Senior Consultant
Innovative System Design
100 N. Stone Ave. #605
Tucson, AZ 85701
lzeltzer@isdnet.com

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 22:56:42 -0500
From: Jeff & Laura Kessler <lmkessler@srnet.com>
Subject: Range Rover back on the road

As I mentioned a few days ago my RR (like many I read about in the digest)
failed to start dispite our best effort.  So it had to be carried back to my
mechanic.

By Wednesday, when he got around to working on it, it solved his big concern
as to how to get it in the shop by starting up and running.  Wednesday was
+20F and sunny.

He did find the plugs to be fouled badly due toall the gas pumped in while
trying to start it.  He also said the Bosch W7DC plugs I have are too cold a
plug compared to the Champions listed in my service manual.  The comparable
plug is a Bosch WR10LC or WR9LP.

Since the W7DCs came from Rovers North I checked with them.  RN told me the
W7DCs are the correct plugs to use and that even new LRs suffered like my 88
RR in the cold here last weekend.  One of their employee's new Disco was a
victim of fouling.

The fault they feel is with the electronics.  The vehicle computer reads the
coolant temperture as very cold and over enriches the mixture when starting.
The solution is to install a block heater to warm up the coolant.  Per RN
the vehicles that are plugged in do not have this problem.

My question for all of you with V8 LRs in this cold, what are you using for
plugs?

Jeff Kessler
88 RR
Newport NH

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 23:21:36 -0500
From: Jeff & Laura Kessler <lmkessler@srnet.com>
Subject: LRNA 800 Phone Numbers

LRNA's 1-800-FINE-4WD number is nice to call to find the name of a dealer
but the real support phone number (at least for RR, Defender and Disco) is
1-800-637-6837.

Jeff Kessler
88 RR
Newport NH

------------------------------

From: ericz@cloud9.net
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 20:26:00 -0800
Subject: Re: LR Dealer Disaster

>I'm assuming your father is the fascinating gentleman who was at Owl's Head
>last year with the expedition Land Rover. I really enjoyed talking with him
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 10 lines)]
>willingness to buy. LRNA should be very concerned.
>David Cockey
Yes, that's my father.  You would think that his Rover might be of interest to a 
dealership as a promotional item to show LR's ruggedness and longevity.  But no, 
we approached another nearby dealership about exhibiting our rover in exchange 
for a loaner...we got nothing but blank stares.  

LRNA is definitely going to hear about this situation, I'm just trying to figure 
out who best to contact within the organization.  1-800-FINE4WD is certianly not 
going to be of any help.  Any suggestions?  I'm usually not the complaining type 
but this situation has really got me steamed.

When my father bought his Rover new in 1959, he was accorded respect above and 
beyond the call of duty.  Our home is full of various promotional items that 
were given to him during a personal tour of the Solihul factory, in order to see 
his vehicle being built.  He was given mountains of technical and travel advice 
from both within and without the Rover Company on any subject relating to his 
expedition. Each and every customer was treated as an asset...not some overly 
wealthy fool that happens to want to pretend he's an adventurer because his 
girlfriend likes that image.

I can't summon up the words to describe how I feel (actually, I can't in good 
concience write them on the 'net).  I knew LRNA was incompetent and knew little 
about their heritage, but this is too much.  LRNA is going to have to eat a lot 
of Crow to ever see our business again.

Eric

Bedford, NY  USA
109" V8 hardtop
SII LWB SW (my father's)

------------------------------

Date: 11 Jan 96 23:35:57 EST
From: "AMEDEO (Denver, CO)" <102505.3511@compuserve.com>
Subject: Miscellaneous

Jim Pappas/ABS : thanks for elucidating on the difference in the RR and
Disco systems... Mike Lojodice and Mark Ritter should read that and learn.

Rob Modica/Discovery loss of power: sounds like the distributor rotor
may have been dislodged and causes misfiring. Easy fix.

Insoo Bay/Disco Air-Dam: You can remove the spoiler and purchase plastic 
corner end caps from your dealer rather cheaply.

Leland J. Roys/Trip: I drove to Guaymas-Mexico on the Sea of Cortez side
and back to Denver. There is a ferry that gets there from Baja. There is
an excellent toll highway (Mexico 15) from Guaymas through Hermosillo and
the U.S. The beaches were fantastic and the water calm, warm and clear in
October. Unleaded gas is available. If you have old clothes you don't need
take them with you and give them away to the locals; they need clothes
(ropa in spanish).

Amedeo
Land Rover Denver East
87 RR 

 

------------------------------

From: PurnellJE@aol.com
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 23:49:44 -0500
Subject: Re: LR Dealer Disaster

In a message dated 96-01-11 18:46:12 EST, you write:
  I now 
>understand why most new LR owners are a bunch of limp wristed, stuck up,
>pricks 

Ouch!

>(mailing list people and the like excluded).

Oh, ok then.   :>)

John, old 1949 Defender 90 (or is it a 1953?) any way, it's old...REAL old

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 00:41:34 -0500
From: rthomas@postoffice.ptd.net (Randall Thomas)
Subject: Re: Range Rover sidelined again

>The problem I thought was a frozen fuel line is back.
>My RR does not want to start again.  Only 10 F ABOVE 0 but windy.
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 12 lines)]
>It ran fine this morning and at lunch time but after work, nothing.
>Any thoughts?

Jeff,
You're problem sounds very similar to the one I had with my 88RR.  In my
case it was the age of 
the fuel pump causing the problem.  Apparently, the fuel pump activates for
about 2-3 seconds
once you switch the ignition on.  The ECU controls this.  It does not
reenergize the pump until 
the engine actually starts.  If you're pump is old, it can no longer
maintain the pressure in the fuel 
line after shutdown due to the integral check valve being worn out. So, the
2-3 seconds is no longer enough to get enough pressure in the rails to start
the engine.  The problem is worsened in cold 
weather when the fuel is a bit slushy and the pump is sluggish. 

The permanent solution is to replace the pump.  I did this at a cost of
$350USD for a new pump.
However, I affected a temporary solution by bypassing the ECU.  The fuse for
the pump is right next 
to the fuse for the lighter in the main fuse panel in the dash.  Unplug both
fuses.  Make a jumper between the feed side of the lighter fuse socket to
the load side of the pump fuse socket with a 10 amp fuse in line.  This will
allow the pump to start and keep going while the ignition is on.  You should
hear it whirring in the tank.  Good luck.

By the way, if it turns out it is the pump, and you're RR, like mine, is
getting its fuel tank recalled,
you can have the dealer replace the pump while they have the tank down.  I
did it on my back and it wasn't fun.  
Cheers, Randall
88RR
67IIA
68P6
70P6B

------------------------------

From: PurnellJE@aol.com
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 01:21:37 -0500
Subject: Re: Def-90 Oil leaks

In a message dated 96-01-11 21:33:22 EST, you write:

>Is it normal for the bolts to loosen on there own like that?
>Leland Roys
>1994 Def-90 (red)
>roys@cup.hp.com

Leland, I remember some posts a while back about exhaust pipe-to-manifold
bolts either becoming very loose or disapearing too.  Something to keep in
mind.  

John, 94 D90, "Portofino Red"

------------------------------

From: JEPurnell@aol.com
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 01:43:07 -0500
Subject: The snow plow that ate the Defender 90...or a small part of it anyway.

Noticed a "bruise" on my left front wheel flare teh other day, and thought
"Gee, I don't remember scraping the tree on my way through the back yards, I
missed it by a good 4 inches..."  Well, then I noticed my RIM! Ack!  My rim
has a big narf in it, a chunk out of it, a serious gouge.  I thought darn,
somebody hit'n'runned me.  Fortuanatley no body damage, heck, if I get bent
panels, at least I want to do it offroad.  Couldn't figure out where or when,
until:  the snow plow came by plowing the little snow we had yesterday and I
watched it as it went by the truck and I noticed the height of the plow
blade.  Yup.  I'd say a darn near perfect match.   

Well, does anyone have suggestions for what to do with the aluminum rim
gouge?  Clean it and "bondo" it with something? Is there an alluminum filler
out there?  

 It's not really bad enough to replace  but someone looking at it with a
critical eye would say "what the heck is that."  

thanks 
John. Wisconsin 

------------------------------

  END OF LAND ROVER OWNER DIGEST 
 Input:  messages 82 lines 3296 [forwarded 226 whitespace 812]
 Output: lines 2659 [content 1589  forwarded 146 (cut  80) whitespace 776]

	
    Forward
	


	
    
          
	



Photos & text Copyright 1990-2011
	Bill Caloccia, All rights reserved. 

Digest Messages Copyright 1990-2011 by the original poster or/and
	Bill Caloccia,
	All rights reserved.