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The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest

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Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 00:43:31 -0700
From: don@direct.ca (donald l. macdonald)
Subject: Second Battery

        Second Battery,

Would a second battery be recommended for a major power draw from a winch
and x-tra lights even after an upgrade to a 66 amp alternator? Anybody got
any input
E-Mail me at the address below.
        Thanx,

        Don MacDonald           E-Mail  don@direct.ca
        333 E. Braemar Rd.      Voice   (604) 988-6519
        N.Vancouver  B.C.
        Canada   V7N 1R2        1966 Series IIA Petrol (Restoring)

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 19:01:32 +1000
From: Lloyd Allison <lloyd@cs.monash.edu.au>
Subject: Reliant Robin

I rather liked Reliants.
Isn't there organised racing of Robins?
There was also a rather futuristic Bond-Bug 3 wheeler,
the canopy opened upwards and forwards (?),
went very fast too, would have gone round corners fast if
it had 4 wheels.

Lloyd

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 05:34:10 -0500 (CDT)
From: wilsonhb@ctrvax.Vanderbilt.Edu (Henry B. Wilson)
Subject: '96 Hardtop D90

Hmm---no responses to my pondering on the "prudence" (shouldn't be allowed
to be used in the context of British cars) of purchasing a D90 hardtop.  No
opinions?
Would I be better off getting a current D90 and fitting a hardtop to it?
Any speculations on which will hold value better?  (C'mon; we all have to
think practically in order to rationalize these decisions).  
Seriously though, I would appreciate any opinions the group may share.

Henry B. Wilson             http://vumclib.mc.vanderbilt.edu/~wilsonhb

           '59 AHY 100-6                    '94 Disco
                              
      "The Healey's clean; the Rover's filthy.  Life is perfect."

------------------------------

From: Mr Ian Stuart <Ian.Stuart@ed.ac.uk>
Date:          Thu, 12 Oct 1995 11:43:18 +0000
Subject:       Re: Where to purshace LR

> I was thinking of purchasing a LR(used) with my wife and then
> re-importing it back to Canada. Where would it be cheapest to make
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 6 lines)]
> also include an approximate list of prices for used LWBs serie III
> in the UK.
Daft as it sounds, try organising a deal to buy a vehicle in South 
Africa!

Lots of people appear to drive down to S.A. and then try to flog 
their vehicle. This attracts a *huge* import tax - so a number are 
just abandoned.

You should be able to get a good, reliable, runner which has done a 
few miles for a modest sum.

Just my $0.02. Could our SA corrispondents cast some light here?

     ----** Ian Stuart (Computing Officer)        +44 31 650 6205
Royal (Dick) School of Veterinary Studies, Edinburgh University. 
 <http://www.vet.ed.ac.uk/> or <http://www.tardis.ed.ac.uk/~kiz/>

    Hero Figure: BOFH..

------------------------------

Date:     Thu, 12 Oct 95 7:23:54 EDT (1123Z)
From: LTC Larry Smith <smithla@arngrc-emh2.army.mil>
Subject:  Re:  Bat Fastards

Leslie,

Thanks for the response. The LR Supermarket catalog just hit the trash!

Larry

------------------------------

From: Mr Ian Stuart <Ian.Stuart@ed.ac.uk>
Date:          Thu, 12 Oct 1995 12:49:01 +0000
Subject:       Re: Reliant Robin

> I rather liked Reliants.
> went very fast too, would have gone round corners fast if
> it had 4 wheels.
The four wheeled version of the Robin is called a Kitten.

The big advantage of a single turnable wheel is that the steering is 
nice and light - so if you have weak arms and find a normal car 
difficult to steer, you can go for a Robin instead of power-steering

     ----** Ian Stuart (Computing Officer)        +44 31 650 6205
Royal (Dick) School of Veterinary Studies, Edinburgh University. 
 <http://www.vet.ed.ac.uk/> or <http://www.tardis.ed.ac.uk/~kiz/>

    Hero Figure: BOFH..

------------------------------

From: William Terry <wterry@sartre.minerva.bah.com>
Subject: Re: Where to purchase a LR
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 08:30:54 -0400 (EDT)

Eric Belanger writes:

> I was thinking of purchasing a LR(used) with my wife

I didn't think most places accepted barter these days. And I know that
Land-Rovers are getting good prices, but I'm not sure they're worth
that much.

;-) Bill

______________W__i__l__l__i__a__m_____D__a__n_____T__e__r__r__y______________
  How do we acquire wisdom along with all these shiny things? (David Brin)

  wterry@sartre.minerva.bah.com
  http://glenfiddich.minerva.bah.com:8062/CyberJungle.html
  MINERVA Development Team, Booz, Allen & Hamilton

------------------------------

From: Easton Trevor <TEASTON@DQC2.DOFASCO.CA>
Subject: More on Robins
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 95 09:43:00 DST

Now the geneology of Reliant Robins has been clarified. Just one thought on 
Robins, Morgans and Bond Minicars for off road use.
You can't get cross axled in a three wheeler!! I read once in Motor Sport of 
a Morgan that explored the wilds of the Pennines and was able to progress 
along quite bad tracks because the back (driving) wheel ran on the hump 
between the ruts. Even the uphill bits seemed like downhill.

Trevor Easton

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 09:43:19 -0400 (EDT)
From: Dixon Kenner <dkenner@emr1.emr.ca>
Subject: Re: Emulations

On Thu, 12 Oct 1995 LANDROVER@delphi.com wrote:

> OK... Knew what it was... what about the Trabant?? Wasn't that a three
> wheeler or did it have four in a diamond pattern? Something did, just can't
> remember what...

	Trabant is the little 2 stroke East German car.  One was featured in
	Car & Driver for a couple months after some visiting rock band/
	record company gave it ti them & the EPA found out.  Wanted it 
	crushed pronto.  They tested it on the Chrysler test track.  
	Performance?   Get a Mini or a Robin...  Not sure what vehicle you
	are thinking about here, but a Trabant or two, or three should
	happily fit in that British Army of the Rhine 101 you bring
	over...  (req. LR content)

------------------------------

Date: 12 Oct 95 10:16:54 EDT
From: "BENJAMIN G. NEWMAN" <71773.3457@compuserve.com>
Subject: Shopping

At the end of this month I will be travelling to the UK. While I am there I
would love to stop in some of the LR shops and look around. Does anyone have a
suggestion as to what store would be the most interesting? I will be near
Liverpool and will stop in at the LR Supermarket,but I am wondering if there
might be a more interesting place to shop. If anybody wants me to place an order
for them while I am there I would be most happy to do so. I also will be
spending a week in Belfast.
Thanks for any help I can get.
Benjamin G. Newman
ser11A 1962 88''
ser11A 1967 109 NADA wagon
1995 RR 4.0 

------------------------------

From: Daniel Grambihler <danielg@eskimo.com>
Subject: Re: '96 Hardtop D90
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 07:25:31 -0800 (PST)

Henry B. Wilson wrote:
> Hmm---no responses to my pondering on the "prudence" (shouldn't be allowed
> to be used in the context of British cars) of purchasing a D90 hardtop.  No
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 7 lines)]
> think practically in order to rationalize these decisions).  
> Seriously though, I would appreciate any opinions the group may share.

Henry -

I stopped at the LR Dealer here (AZ) and they told me that they were
getting 3 and that all 3 had deposits on them already. They had one 
of last years hardtops and took me out back to look at it. The hard-
top is riveted to the body. It's an aluminum hardtop, with a full
rear door and side seats (4) on the wheel wells. The front doors
have windows that rool down and "real" door handles. The top also
has a sun roof. The salesman told me that he had driven this vehicle
back from San Jose (CA) and that the top started to hum at around
75-80 MPH. I *think* I heard a number like 500 being the total number
that will be sold. I'm not sure where I got the number - perhaps
I'm thinking of the last year for the D110. Anyway - if the D90 HT
is anything like the D110, it should appreciate like crazy.

I considered buying one (if I could find one) but I think that I would
really miss being able to remove the top.

Hope this helps - 

Daniel

-- 
Daniel Grambihler
danielg@eskimo.com
GAT !d(--) -p+/-- c++++/--- l++ u++/- e+ m/+/++@ s-/ n--- h+ f* g-/+
    w+ t+ r y++/--/**

Coming soon: '95 D90 (today for sure!!!)

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 16:23:54 +0200 (GMT+0200)
From: Andrew Birrell <pdandrew@iafrica.com>
Subject: Re: Where to purshace LR

If one tries some of the "backpacker" lodges where overland travellers 
stay, you can usually find someone who wishes to sell a foreign 
registered LR. I do have a friend in London who has an SA registered 
Range Rover (he drove it from RSA to the UK), and is looking to sell it 
to someone wishing to drive it back to South Africa (who can then sell it 
without attracting the huge import duty). Contact me if you want his details

Andrew Birrell
Cape Town

On Thu, 12 Oct 1995, Mr Ian Stuart wrote:

> To change subscription write to: Majordomo@Land-Rover.Team.Net
> > I was thinking of purchasing a LR(used) with my wife and then
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 31 lines)]
>  <http://www.vet.ed.ac.uk/> or <http://www.tardis.ed.ac.uk/~kiz/>
>     Hero Figure: BOFH..

------------------------------

From: Roy_H._Caldwell@desktop.org (Roy H. Caldwell)
Subject: Re: STUCK THROTTLE....AHHHHHH!
Date: 11 Oct 1995 23:22:52 GMT

Sean,

Someplace near your throttle linkage, look around the throat on the outside
of course, there is a return spring.  This pulls you pedal and all of the
linage up after you get of the pedal.  You should see either the remnants of
it or wear indications that it once was there.  My dual Weber has one at the
linkage on the shaft of the butterfly valve.  Check that.  The spring I am
talking about is not part of the original Rover linkage but an add-on for the
Weber.

Roy - Rovers in the Rockies
--
.........................................................................
WestNet, the Information Service for People with a Passion for this Place
Modem: 406-442-3697 (28,800/8-N-1) Info via Internet: westnet@desktop.org
Sponsored by Desktop Assistance, Inc. Info via Internet: info@desktop.org
.........................................................................

------------------------------

Date: 12 Oct 1995 09:52:39 -0500
From: "Sean McInerney" <smcinerney@mail.nrgn.com>
Subject: Throttle Fixed........Thank

 Throttle Fixed........Thanks!
Regarding my stuck throttle which was giving the Rover a bit too much
enthusiasm for the rear bumpers of my fellow motorists.....

Thanks for the input several of you offered to my revving dilemma.  I
disconnected successive linkages until I found the one with an incorrect
degree of travel.  I basically undid the nut securing it, gave it more travel
in the direction of the idle position, and tightened it back up.  Took about
five minutes total....even took the time too do a quick idle adjustment.  Yet
another hurdle crossed.  Again thanks for all the responses to what ended up
being an incredibly simple problem.

Sean C. McInerney
1963 88" SIIa  ...purrs like a kitten, runs smooth as glass....
                       ...in other peoples dreams!

------------------------------

Date: 12 Oct 1995 08:35:47 U
From: "Guzelis.Pete" <guzelis.pete@ssdgwy.mdc.com>
Subject: RE: The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest

Anyone out there know of non-genuine air & oil filters for 94 Discovery models.
Don't want to use anything other than the original but when I'm in the toolies
it's best to have a second source in the event of. Appreciate data.
_______________________________________________________________________________
From: Land-Rover-Owner@uk.stratus.com on Wed, Oct 11, 1995 4:34 PM
Subject: The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest

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	  Contents:
  1 M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk Tue Oct 10 03:37   32/1497  Re: New Jeep
  2 gbfv08@udcf.gla.ac.uk Tue Oct 10 04:05   24/1340  new jeep
  3 terje@tvnorge.no   Tue Oct 10 04:40   36/1418  Spin on oil filter adapto
  4 danny@tlpgate.lonpar.co.uk Tue Oct 10 06:17   33/2172  Re: The Land Rover
Owner 
  5 hlapa@Zeus.signalcorp.com Tue Oct 10 07:09   32/1472  Fuel Tanks from
Famous Fo
  6 hlapa@Zeus.signalcorp.com Tue Oct 10 07:09   40/1882  LRs in Bermuda
  7 hlapa@Zeus.signalcorp.com Tue Oct 10 07:09   32/1699  Re: Winchless
  8 TEASTON@DQC2.DOFASCO.CA Tue Oct 10 07:56   33/1880  Oil Levels
  9 hlapa@Zeus.signalcorp.com Tue Oct 10 08:56   42/1579  Re[2]: Fuel Tanks
from Fa
 10 Harincar@mooregs.com Tue Oct 10 09:23   45/2166  Yet another stupid P.O. t
 11 Alan_Richer/CAM/Lotus.LOTUS@crd.lotus.com Tue Oct 10 10:18   40/2124 
Overdrive whine - Is it s
 12 100043.2400@compuserve.com Tue Oct 10 10:21   46/2663  Re: New Jeep!
 13 DEBROWN@SRP.GOV    Tue Oct 10 10:35   49/2677  Cheers Taffiny!!!
 14 dbobeck@ushmm.org  Tue Oct 10 12:11   49/2373  leaky traNS
 15 rosenbau@u.washington.edu Tue Oct 10 12:28   33/1882  Hearing the radio
(stereo
 16 don@direct.ca      Tue Oct 10 13:04   21/1240  alternators!!
 17 trowe@ae.agecon.wisc.edu Tue Oct 10 14:05   52/2353  Re: leaky traNS
 18 trowe@ae.agecon.wisc.edu Tue Oct 10 14:15   32/1564  Wisconsin alumni (not
LR 
 19 cs@crl.com         Tue Oct 10 16:13   45/2139  Re: Weber Carb Tuning
 20 Andre_Maier@mindlink.bc.ca Tue Oct 10 16:26   20/1108  West Coast Challenge
 21 dplace@SIRNet.mb.ca Tue Oct 10 17:01   17/1047  Other British Vehicles
 22 rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Tue Oct 10 17:51   30/1372  Land Rover Stamps For
Sal
 23 cs@crl.com         Tue Oct 10 19:34   47/1784  Re: West Coast Challenge
 24 chrisste@clark.net Tue Oct 10 21:17   30/1149  Richmond Raves Rover Rall
 25 Spenny@aol.com     Tue Oct 10 22:03   20/865   Re: New Jeep
 26 100042.254@compuserve.com Tue Oct 10 23:11   36/1708  Bat Fastards
 27 jcwhite3@well.com  Wed Oct 11 00:00   63/2194  Re: West Coast Challenge
 28 cs@crl.com         Wed Oct 11 00:25   39/1708  Re: West Coast Challenge
 29 cs@crl.com         Wed Oct 11 01:17   33/1571  Say it ain't so, Jimmy?
 30 jawa@i-max.co.nz   Wed Oct 11 01:37   40/2091  Booby trap

------------------------------

From: Mike Rooth <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: New Jeep
Date: Tue, 10 Oct 95 9:36:05 BST

Oh I say!Well said,old girl!Ahem.
No need to draw and quarter the Jeep.It'll be a traffic
bollard in ten years time.
Perhaps it is worth pointing out that although the wartime
Jeep may have provided the Wilkes brothers with a certain
number of ideas(mainly,one gathers because of its shortcomings)
the Land Rover was no more a copy than the Mitsubishi Type O
was a copy of the Supermarine Spitfire.Unless,of course,having
the same sized wheels and,in the case of the 80",wheelbase,made
it a copy.
If that be so,about the only vehicle that doesnt copy any other
would be the Reliant Robin:-)
Cheers
Mike Rooth

------------------------------

From: Tom Stevenson <gbfv08@udcf.gla.ac.uk>
Subject: new jeep
Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 10:00:19 +0100 (BST)

I think that the guy who lost his Land Rover on a New Zealand beach was
caught out by the incoming tide because of an electrical fault rather
than because he was bogged down. Does this sound typical?
-- 
Tom Stevenson: gbfv08@udcf.gla.ac.uk
University Marine Biological Station, Isle of Cumbrae, Scotland
Tel:(01475) 530581  Fax:(01475) 530601

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 10:36:03 +0100
From: terje@tvnorge.no (Terje Krogdahl)
Subject: Spin on oil filter adaptors

I believe this was discussed some time ago, but anyway...

Does anyone know of a European source for spin on oil filter adaptors for
SIII 2.25 engines? I've just about had enough of the leaky oil filter
assembly on my engine.. I looked into using a 2.5 adaptor, but the price 
turned out to be around 250#163#, and I believe someone makes an adaptor kit
for the old type oilfilter mountings.

Terje K.
http://www.tvnorge.no/~terje/index.e.html - My homepage
http://regina.uio.no/nlrk/index.e.html - Norwegian Land Rover Club pages
1972 SIII 88"

>.

------------------------------

From: Danny Phillips <danny@tlpgate.lonpar.co.uk>
Subject: Re: The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest
Date: Tue, 10 Oct 95 12:17:52 BST

Does anyone know of a good shrink for Ben <G> has some sort of delusion <G>

Seriuosly, that incident in New Zealand, was published in the UK mags and the
end part made us all smile. But locally there is a beach were people launch
boats and them water bike jobbies (can't remember what they are called), just
went for ride in the series iia with my mate as some of his windsurf buddies
may
have been down there. 

to cut a long story short, a suzuki vitara was stuck trying to pull out a 
trailer with a jet ski (remembered), big fat low profile tyres, no grip and no
brain. well they asked if we would give them and their trailer a tug. so as the
water was lapping at his back wheels i suggested that i try and tug them both
at the same time. he was dubious, but despite, complete poo, road tyres we got
him out quite easily, but he was not very happy when he saw a) the mud all up 
his car, and b) i told him not to tie the rope to his A bar. not my fault it 
bent, i wanted to use his lashing eye. my mate was so impressed, he has bought
a 110 as a second car (1988) and it takes all his windsurf gear, with just the
board on top. now i want a 90 or a 110 for off road. you just can't win can
you..

unless a 101 (thinks aloud) <G>

danny

------------------------------

From: hlapa@Zeus.signalcorp.com
Date: Tue, 10 Oct 95 08:03:09 EST
Subject: Fuel Tanks from Famous Four?

All,

A while back there was a thread on repair/replacement of 
fuel tanks.  I believe Famous Four was recommended as a 
source.  (RN wants $400 for a new 109 SW tank.)  Is a 
galvanised tank available?

Anyone have FF's phone number or recommend another souce 
with reasonable prices for a good, new tank?

Apologies in advance if the FAQs obviate this enquiry.

Cheers,
Hank

------------------------------

From: hlapa@Zeus.signalcorp.com
Date: Tue, 10 Oct 95 07:57:48 EST
Subject: LRs in Bermuda

All,

Just had a very pleasant few days in Bermuda, despite the 
growing influence of American "culture" since I was last 
there.

Sighted what appeared to be a Ninety with a reefer back end 
and a Series tow truck, out and about, with a 109 Police 
vehicle parked outside a small station in the west end.  
Thought that was all there was until passed by the Bermuda 
Regiment compound, in which were parked several LRs as well 
as the more common (for Bermuda) lighter stuff.  

Back in mid-80s, noted the RN had a number of Series 
vehicles at the naval fuelling depot, but it seems that's 
gone, as is the US Naval Air Station, where the EOD guys had 
an OD USN Rangey.

Wife on back of moped: "What are you turning around for?"
Hank on front of moped:  "Thought I saw a Land-Rover back 
there."

------------------------------

From: hlapa@Zeus.signalcorp.com
Date: Tue, 10 Oct 95 07:47:43 EST
Subject: Re: Winchless

I, too, am still waiting for parts from a subscriber who has 
cashed my checks 6 months ago, but seems too busy taking 
care of his own fun and projects than delivering his For 
Sale parts as promised.  "Winchless" was awfully polite not 
to mention this fellow by name, but having already reminded 
the subject of this note at least once about the parts owed 
to me, I'm close to warning my fellow subscribers.  

So if you're reading this my friend, time to make things 
right.  I want my Series parts, not my money back.  Jeeps 
are famous, and you are almost infamous.

Regards,
Hank  (It ain't libel if it's true)

------------------------------

From: Easton Trevor <TEASTON@DQC2.DOFASCO.CA>
Subject: Oil Levels
Date: Tue, 10 Oct 95 08:59:00 DST

Jeremy Bartlet writes that his gearbox level has risen. Jeremy,  I note you 
say the wading plug is in. Have you been wading lately? Try removing the 
drain plug after the vehicle has been standing for some time to check if you 
have been inadvertently adding water to your gearbox.  We all carefully 
affix breathers to our axles but the gearbox vents are not much higher and 
can easily ingest water as it flows up and around the box, During the Darien 
Gap expedition one of the major supply items was transmission oil as they 
would change it after every significant wading excursion to remove the 
water.

Trevor Easton, 

------------------------------

From: hlapa@Zeus.signalcorp.com
Date: Tue, 10 Oct 95 09:51:03 EST
Subject: Re[2]: Fuel Tanks from Famous Four?

Thanks Mike.  Just phoned Famous Four and ordered the "exact 
copy" new tank for 99 Pounds, less VAT.  Genuine was 245 
Pounds.  

Hank  (1960 Series II LWB SW)

> Subject: Re: Fuel Tanks from Famous Four?
> Author:  Mike Rooth <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> at Zeus

	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 20 lines)]
> Cheers
> Mike Rooth

------------------------------

From: Harincar@mooregs.com (Tim Harincar)
Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 09:20:04 -0700
Subject: Yet another stupid P.O. trick

Last spring the list was having a big discussion regarding Series heaters. I 
was reading this with interest because my '66 IIa has a kodiak heater, but I 
couldn't figure out why I was hardly getting any heat out of it. 

I decided that before this winter, I'd dive in and check the whole system out 
so I don't freeze again this year, starting with a cold weather thermostat 
from RN (on sale now).

I discovered that someone had swapped the cable controls for temperature and 
fresh air - i.e. the water control valve and the damper! My whole problem was 
that if I pulled the temp control out, nothing would seem to change much. I 
thought the valve had rusted shut or the cable was broken or something.

Looking through the P.O. logs, I found a reciept for a new heater core for 
it, I wonder if he was having the same problem... :-) He wasn't noted for 
his trouble shooting ability. Either that or his shop screwed it up (also not 
an unlikely situation).

Looking forward to a warm(er) winter,

Tim
---
tim harincar                      moore graphics services
harincar@mooregs.com              minneapolis, mn
'66 IIa 88 
SW

------------------------------

From: Alan Richer/CAM/Lotus <Alan_Richer/CAM/Lotus.LOTUS@crd.lotus.com>
Date: 10 Oct 95  9:53:38 EDT
Subject: Overdrive whine - Is it supposed to?

Now that Churchill is running well and stopping well, I've been driving him on 
some extended trips out and about. One thing I've noticed is that the overdrive

is QUITE whiny when under power. Is this typical of the Fairey unit, or could 
it be a sign of a loose castellated nut or some other malady? 

Anthing over 60-65 is noisy...but  can still hear the steeo! (I know, damned 
yuppie......8*)..)

The lubricant levels are fine, and removing the top cover revealed gears that 
looked great, with no sign of chipped teeth or any such damage. Also, the 
synchros on it are smooth, going in and out with no problems at any speed.

With the OD out, he's fine - OD in, he whines like the Enterprise's warp drive.

Lastly, does anyone have a manul for the Fairey overdrive? I'd be quite willing

to pay copy costs to get a copy of it for my files.

    aj" I love my Series IIa !"r

Also, anybod got an idea of the speedo correction for 235-diameter tires vs. 
the 7.50s on a IIa? Seems to be about 5 MPH low..... -Alan

------------------------------

Date: 10 Oct 95 11:19:11 EDT
From: "Stefan R. Jacob" <100043.2400@compuserve.com>
Subject: Re: New Jeep!

Talk about asking for trouble...

> if you do your research.  By the way, the President of Land Rover North
> America son owns a Sidekick.  I guess all I am trying to say is be
> respectful to all other four-wheels and don't live in your own litte world.

Well, being a father myself I am aware how sons have a tendency to rebell
and oppose their fathers on practically every issue, I guess it's part of
growing up and becoming a man. When they eventually do, they usually come
to their senses again - so, there's still hope for the son of the President
of Rover North...
Respectful - oh, but yes, I have great respect for people who dare go
offroading to remote areas all alone in something like Jeeps or Suzukis,
really gutsy! Nothing for cautious, security-minded people like me...
Little world... ok, I agree that the Earth is one of the smaller planets of
our solar system, but for the time being there still seems to be enough
room for Land Rovers and their owners to enjoy themselves; others of course
may be more limited in the terrain they have to choose from.
Actually, I would advise *Jeep* owners to stay in their own little world,
because I have a very sad story to tell (tongue-almost-coming-through-cheek):
About 4 years ago the 'Frankfurt Jeep Club' got in contact with us and asked
if we would like to have regular offroad meets together with them, as they,
just like B.K.Fenwick, thought it silly for each group to keep entirely to
themselves. Much to their surprise we didn't object at all and subsequently
had some very nice offroad runs, outdoor BBQ's, camping in the woods etc.
Now, almost five years later, the Jeep club is on the verge of extinction
because two-thirds of them have meanwhile bought... LAND ROVERS! They all
caught the Land Rover virus!! So, offroad-clubs, be warned...

Stefan
<Stefan R. Jacob, 100043.2400@CompuServe.com>

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 10 Oct 95 08:32:18 MST
From: DEBROWN@SRP.GOV
Subject: Cheers Taffiny!!!

FROM:  David Brown                           Internet: debrown@srp.gov
       Computer Graphics Specialist * Mapping Services & Engr Graphics
       PAB219 (602)236-3544 -  Pager:6486 External (602)275-2508 #6486
SUBJECT: Cheers Taffiny!!!

That's a great rebuttal Tiffany! (I hope I spelled your name right...) I've
owned Jeeps and Scouts, both good vehicles, but not Land Rover's. Until I
actually owned one I didn't really know. Before I bought my 1st LR ('94
Disco) I started researching for about 6 months. Libraries, magazine
articles, trips to various dealers, (Actually only Toyota and LR, I had
narrowed it down to these two.) and numerous questions directed towards both
the LRO list and an "offroad" list. (No, I'm not "the infamous Tayler"). I
just figure that anyone who criticizes LR's is just un-educated and/or
miss-informed. LR doesn't exactly over advertise!

BTW, I've spent my share of time fixing broken Scout axles and doing Jeep
repairs, enough to say that I *am* capable of judging these two vehicles as
inferior to LR's.

Again, great reply.

P.S. I *had* to run out and buy the 4-wheeler magazine with the D90 poster.
Looks great! Thanks Michael! (Nice Mog too!)
 #=====#         #========#          -------,___           ________
 |___|__\___     |___|__|__\___      |--' |  |  \_|_      /__/__|__\___
 | _ |   |_ |}   | _ |  |   |_ |}    |  _ |--+--|_  |     \_/-\_|__/-\_|}
 "(_)""""(_)"    "(_)"""""""(_)"    ||_/_\___|__/_\_|}      (_)    (_)
                                       (_)      (_)
 1971 "88" IIa   1970 "109" IIa     1994 Discovery (Sold) '87 Range Rover
 LIC: LION B8    Historic plates     (Too hard to "draw")  $8500 bargain

#=======#          ________           We make a living by what we get,
|__|__|__\___     /__/__|__\___        we make a life by what we give.
| _|  |   |_ |}   \_/-\_|__/-\_|}
"(_)""""""(_)"      (_)    (_)                       Winston Churchill

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 10 Oct 95 13:14:06 EST
From: "Bobeck, David R." <dbobeck@ushmm.org>
Subject: leaky traNS

          Hi all.
          Here's a good one.
          A friend took his SerIIa to a local garage that
          claims to know landies. His problem was a clutch
          that didn't work too well. The mechanic said he
          thought it was the throwout bearing getting stuck.
          We have since ascertained that the problem is due
          for the most part to bad clutch cylinders, since
          you haveto pump them up to get pressure and then
          it quickly fades.
          So here's the real problem. The mechanic said he
          would add something to the brake/clutch reservoir
          that would swell the rubber. It did. That's the
          first problem. (it didn't fix anything, it just
          made the rubber "balloon" up to twice its size!)

          Problem number two: The gearbox now spews out
          about a teaspoon of oil every couple of seconds
          from the flywheel hole. The mechanic said he would
          try to "stick a coat hanger in there" and spray
          around some WD40 to loosen up the throwout
          bearing. Having looke at the service manual, I see
          there is a gasket between the front of the gearbox
          and the throwout bearing cover. I assume this is
          where his leak is. I can't find any reference to
          any other seals, in there, but we want to replace
          everything when the box comes out.

          Any ideas?
          Mucho Appreciado
          David Bobeck
          Washington DC
          dbobeck@ushmm.org

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 10:27:10 -0700 (PDT)
From: David Rosenbaum <rosenbau@u.washington.edu>
Subject: Hearing the radio (stereo) at speed

On 10 Oct 1995, Alan Richer/CAM/Lotus wrote:
> Anything over 60-65 is noisy...but  can still hear the stereo!
 
Here in Seattle, the rainy season has begun. My NAS '94 D90 still has just 
the "surrey" top, so the dash and gauges get pretty wet in the rain. But I 
can tell without looking at the speedometer when I'm over 65 mph because I 
can no longer hear the radio. ( I do wipe the inside of the windshield so 
that I can see the road.)
 
(Others may have a different calibration standard. My ears are 46 years 
old and spent a few years in the 60's and 70's too close to large 
speakers listening to not-too-good rock and roll while I was after all 
the beer I could get, hoping that some fine young woman would find me 
irresistable.......before I passed out)

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 11:01:23 -0700
From: don@direct.ca (donald l. macdonald)
Subject: alternators!!

I want to upgrade my 20amp generator from my 66 SWB to a 60-70 amp
alternator with a regulator. I was thinking about putting a ford alternator
in but I don't know how easy it fits. Is there an alternator which fits
right in and how does it plug in to bypass the old regulator box??????

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 10 Oct 95 14:06:02 EDT
From: (Tom Rowe) <trowe@ae.agecon.wisc.edu>
Subject: Re: leaky traNS

On Tue, 10 Oct 95 13:14:06 EST David Bobeck wrote:
>          Hi all.
>          Here's a good one.
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 7 lines)]
>          thought it was the throwout bearing getting stuck.
>          Any ideas?

First, If it's IIA it likely doesn't have a throwout bearing (at least
in the usual sense).
Second, the mechanic seems to be in to cobb jobs. Intentionally ruin
your clutch system seals? Well, he owes you a system rebuild. There
are some rather stringent consumer protection laws in your area if I
recall.
Third, spray silicone in the area of a friction disk? Doesn't sound
real bright to me.
Rebuild the clutch hydraulic system & send the mechanic the bill.
And hope he didn't get WD40 on the disk. If he did you may be able to
remedy it with BrakeKleen.
As for the leak, you didn't say if it was for sure gear oil or motor
oil, they smell very different. That will tell you where the leak is
from.

Tom Rowe
UW Center for Dairy Research
Madison, WI 53706	| Four wheel drive allows you to get stuck
wk 608-265-6194	| in places even more inaccessible
hm 608-243-8660

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 10 Oct 95 14:15:39 EDT
From: (Tom Rowe) <trowe@ae.agecon.wisc.edu>
Subject: Wisconsin alumni (not LR realted exactly)

Someone on this list (from VA I think) sent me a story about thier
grandparents (both UW alum) and how they met. I've missplaced the file
since my HD crashed. Please send it to me and I'll forward it to the
UW alumni assoc. (I found their address).

Tom Rowe
UW Center for Dairy Research
Madison, WI 53706	| Four wheel drive allows you to get stuck
wk 608-265-6194	| in places even more inaccessible
hm 608-243-8660

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 14:10:47 +0100
From: cs@crl.com (Michael Carradine)
Subject: Re: Weber Carb Tuning

 Stuart H. Moore <smoore@acc.roanoke.edu> writes:
>      A friend has a weber carb. conversion on his series III and
 is having problems with hesitation and general rotten running. 
 Does anyone out there have a book on the carb. that would have good
 directions on how to properly tune it.

 Pierce USA makes an intake manifold for the LR 2.25L engine using
 the Weber carburetor.  These guys are Weber specialists for all cars
 and have replacement parts and jets for proper tuning.  They also
 have a Weber rebuild, diagnosing and tuning book for about $20 which
 is "The Bible".  Contact Pierce at Tel. 408-842-6667 or 800-874-3728

 These guys and other high performance US aftermarket manufactures are
 listed on the Land-Rover Connection WWW page maintained by Mike Hoskins
 at  http://www.crl.com/~cs/rover.html

                          ______
 Michael Carradine        [__[__\==                     Rumpole of the Bay
 cs@crl.com               [________]                            '65 IIA 88
             ___________.._(o)__.(o)_______...o^^^^^^
 _________________________________________________________________________
 Mercedes-Benz Unimog 4x4 WWW page at:  http://www.crl.com/~cs/unimog.html

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 10 Oct 95 14:26:37 -0700
Subject: West Coast Challenge
From: Andre_Maier@mindlink.bc.ca (Andre Maier)

The West Coast Challenge will be on the 14th and 15th of this month near
Deroche(wingdam).
Saturday will be the trials event and it starts at 9 am
Sunday will be the sasquatch traverse run.
Camping is available at wingdam.
For more info call Bill Lange at 430 6991
or Andre Maier at 951 3214 or fax at the same number.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 17:03:53 -0600 (CST)
From: David Place <dplace@SIRNet.mb.ca>
Subject: Other British Vehicles

I hope I don't get a lot of hate mail, but I can't find a source of 
Austin parts in North America. Can someone please E-Mail me direct with a 
source State Side or in Britian.  Thanks Dave VE4PN

------------------------------

Subject: Land Rover Stamps For Sale
From: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (Robin Craig)
Date: Tue, 10 Oct 95 17:11:58 -0500

Thanks to all of you who have replied to my posting of stamps for sale, 
msg 13608. I am going to extend the dealine though as interest seems to 
be high and I would like to give everyone a chance to get in on it.

So this Friday 13th at midnight will be the deadline.

later, Robin 

--
Robin Craig, rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca
FourFold Symmetry, Ottawa, Ont. |  Ottawa Valley Land Rovers

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 17:32:00 +0100
From: cs@crl.com (Michael Carradine)
Subject: Re: West Coast Challenge

 Andre Maier <Andre_Maier@mindlink.bc.ca> writes:

>The West Coast Challenge will be on the 14th and 15th of this month near
>Deroche(wingdam).

 The first part of the 'Challenge' is to determine which West Coast.
 Sooo... select a country with <lro@team.net> subscribers:

              1.  Australia
              2.  California*
              3.  Canada
              4.  Germany
              5.  Hong Kong (aka China)
              6.  Netherlands
              7.  New Zealand
              8.  Norway
              9.  South Africa
             10.  Sweden
             11.  Switzerland
             12.  United Kingdom
             13.  United States
             14.  Other (..sorry if I missed any)

 *Not really a country (yet!), but hey, with the world's seventh largest
  economy...

-Michael (If it's Tuesday it must be... ?) Carradine
 cs@crl.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 22:14:09 -0400
From: chrisste@clark.net (Chris Stevens)
Subject: Richmond Raves Rover Rally

Just got my copy of the last week's Richmond Times Dispatch covering the
Mid-Atlantic Rover Rally. Good story. Good photos. Good work, Sandy.

Chris Stevens                   1969 88" IIA SW 2.25

BCG Corporate Communications
Towson, Maryland, USA
(410) 583-1722
(410) 583-1935 (FAX)
chrisste@Clark.net

------------------------------

From: Spenny@aol.com
Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 23:04:13 -0400
Subject: Re: New Jeep

Mike writes:

      EXACTLY! So, what do we do??? Draw and quarter this guy's Jeep?? 

Naw, just wait and it will rust itself away.  <g>
     

spenny

------------------------------

Date: 11 Oct 95 00:08:11 EDT
From: Leslie Stutsman <100042.254@compuserve.com>
Subject: Bat Fastards

Having bought bulk orders from many outfits in England, I can categorically
tell
you that Bat Fastards is the lowest grade quality in the industry.  Although
they handle calls very businesslike,  they do not meet promised deadlines.  The
owner of the LandRover Supermarket and Bat Fastards were once partners, and
started Bat Fastards to try and meet the low end market demand.  I have seen
springs from them, and although they are made in England, they are definately
not made of British Steel or to British Specs.  The price does reflect that
fairly, as you get what you pay for.  My suggestion to you : changing them is a
pain - pay the extra and get the quality!  Good Luck!

Cheers

Leslie 

'56 Series I 86" Trialer     "Big Bird"
'58 Series II 88"              "Scouser"
'69 Series IIa 109 5 door   "Cheez burger"  in paradise

For Sale
'62 Series IIa 109 regular  "Everton"
'65 Series IIa Military 88"  "Cedrych"

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 22:00:56 -0700 (PDT)
From: "John C. White III" <jcwhite3@well.com>
Subject: Re: West Coast Challenge

Well, Andre's e-mail address ends in "ca," which is Canada.  I'll guess 
Canada.

What do I win?

Cheers!
John
San Francisco, California "Republic"

(Well it says "California Republic" on the state flag.)

On Tue, 10 Oct 1995, Michael Carradine wrote:

> To change subscription write to: Majordomo@Land-Rover.Team.Net
>  Andre Maier <Andre_Maier@mindlink.bc.ca> writes:
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 33 lines)]
> -Michael (If it's Tuesday it must be... ?) Carradine
>  cs@crl.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 22:22:31 +0100
From: cs@crl.com (Michael Carradine)
Subject: Re: West Coast Challenge

 John C. White III <jcwhite3@well.com> writes:

>Well, Andre's e-mail address ends in "ca," which is Canada.  I'll guess 
>Canada.

 Oooh poo!!  A correct answer already.  I knew you couldn't get it by
 the town/area names mentioned ---too obscure, or by the country or area
 codes given ---there weren't any!  Actually I was hoping all that smoke
 about "CA"lifornia would be diversionary (Rovers are too smart for that!).

>What do I win?

 A personal invitation to visit with Andre at the West Coast Challenge,
 and to do a write-up with photos for the lro list, Left Coast Rover list,
 Aluminum Workhorse, Rover Runner, Ottowa Valley Newsletter, LRO and LRW.

 Congradulations!!!  You have met the first 'Challenge'.

-Michael (If it's Tuesday it must be... ?) Carradine
 cs@crl.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 23:14:22 +0100
From: cs@crl.com (Michael Carradine)
Subject: Say it ain't so, Jimmy?

 Jimmy,

 Could you quell the rumor that as your first official act as new editor
 of LROA/NA's Aluminum Workhorse you plan on renaming this classic magazine
 and correct it's title to 'Birmabright Workhorse'??

 Anxiously waiting,
                           _____
 Michael Carradine        [__[__\==                     Rumpole of the Bay
 cs@crl.com               [________]                            '65 IIA 88
             ___________.._(o)__.(o)_______...o^^^^^^
 _________________________________________________________________________
 Land-Rover Connection 4x4 WWW page at:  http://www.crl.com/~cs/rover.html
 

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 18:35:12 +1200
From: jawa@i-max.co.nz (leonard john hobart)
Subject: Booby trap

I was preparing Loftys new frame in the garage this evening while he sulked
out in the car port. The frame appeared mint, (ex 79 LWB diesel) but I have
found one area of corrosion under the battery shelf, the battery obviously
has leaked at some stage. this area is around the steering box slave thingy
that goes through the front cross member, so it needs to be repaired
correctly. Well I proceded to undo these tiny bolts, top and bottom and 2
long bolts that hold a casting to the frame. A bit of oil leaked,..... well,
the next thing was to give it a bit of tap with a soft hammer. Did you know
that inside that gizzmo there is this bloody great spring. (and other
things) It flew apart and scattered the parts all over the garage.   Well
now I've been and changed some items of clothing, and had a smoke I have a
few questions.

1. Is this a common area for rust

2. Could somebody tell me how to get the cast steel body out of the cross
member, (it's stuck)

3. How will I compress the spring to get this thing-a-ma-jig back together
again

thanks in advance

John 

------------------------------

  END OF LAND ROVER OWNER DIGEST 
 Input:  messages 29 lines 1091 [forwarded 57 whitespace 264]
 Output: lines 867 [content 524  forwarded 25 (cut  32) whitespace 255]

------------------------------

From: Mike Rooth <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk>
Subject: Flashers
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 95 15:34:11 BST

To all those who replied most helpfully re the problem of
a permanently illuminated flasher warning light in S11A's.
The cure turned out to be a new flasher unit.Which is to be
expected,since if you look at the circuit diagram,otherwise
known as a Land Rover wish list,the flasher unit is the one
thing that cant *possibly* cause the effect.So that's what
it must be.Simple,annit?
Cheers
Mike Rooth

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 12 Oct 95 10:04:40 MST
From: DEBROWN@SRP.GOV
Subject: Locker installed in '87 RR, now I need steering track rod.

FROM:  David Brown                           Internet: debrown@srp.gov
       Computer Graphics Specialist * Mapping Services & Engr Graphics
       PAB219 (602)236-3544 -  Pager:6486 External (602)275-2508 #6486
SUBJECT: Locker installed in '87 RR, now I need steering track rod.
Hello! I just installed a "Lock-Right" differential locker in my '87 RR last
weekend, and soon after, while giving it a test run, I bent my steering
track rod. I was able to bend it back into some resemblance of straightness,
(had to remove it and wedge it into the slot on a huge trash bin, then with
*much* effort, I was able to bend it. Large hammer and vice had no effect!)
but I know that once it's been bent, it's weaker at that point and will bend
again, even more easily. BTW I also managed to smash both the lights that
"were" hanging from underneath the rear bumper. Broke both the housings, one
is dangling by the wires! Stupid place for lights! But it came that way. I
had wondered how long it would be before I destroyed them... now I know,
about a month! (Did I mention I'm *not* the smartest man alive?)

My question is this: Has anyone ever welded a length of angle iron along the
length of the track rod for strength? I did this once on a '67 Dodge van and
it worked for many years. (at least until I sold it.)

Also, while I have your (collective) ear, Where can I get "Old Man Emu"
suspensions for LR's? How about a catalogue? A phone number? (USA) I have
the phone # from the LR FAQ for OME in Australia, looking for a more local
source. (ARB in Seattle?) Jim Jackson, are you "there"?

I'm also interested in locating things like skid plates. No relation to
bending the track rod. ;-)

Thanks all! Dave (All bent out of shape) Brown

 #=====#         #========#          -------,___           ________
 |___|__\___     |___|__|__\___      |--' |  |  \_|_      /__/__|__\___
 | _ |   |_ |}   | _ |  |   |_ |}    |  _ |--+--|_  |     \_/-\_|__/-\_|}
 "(_)""""(_)"    "(_)"""""""(_)"    ||_/_\___|__/_\_|}      (_)    (_)
                                       (_)      (_)
 1971 "88" IIa   1970 "109" IIa     1994 Discovery (Sold) '87 Range Rover
 LIC: LION B8    Historic plates     (Too hard to "draw")  $8500 bargain
                                                           Rear lockers.

#=======#          ________           We make a living by what we get,
|__|__|__\___     /__/__|__\___        we make a life by what we give.
| _|  |   |_ |}   \_/-\_|__/-\_|}
"(_)""""""(_)"      (_)    (_)                       Winston Churchill

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 13:24:53 +0600
From: srae@bev.net (Susan Rae Henderson)
Subject: for andi's eyes only

>X-Sender: durablty@mail.vt.edu
>Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 09:06:07 -0500
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 48 lines)]
>>I do not like them Sam I Am
>>=============================================

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 12 Oct 95 12:35:55 EDT
From: (Tom Rowe) <trowe@ae.agecon.wisc.edu>
Subject: Re: Locker installed in '87 RR, now I need steering track

Gee Dave. If Lockers cause this much damage when installed, maybe I'll
re-think getting them.  ;-)

Tom Rowe
UW Center for Dairy Research
Madison, WI 53706	| Four wheel drive allows you to get stuck
wk 608-265-6194	| in places even more inaccessible
hm 608-243-8660

------------------------------

From: ASFCO@aol.com
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 15:11:39 -0400
Subject: Sog /Leatherman Knife

Some time ago I saw an article here regarding a Sog or Leatherman knife which
comes with a belt pouch with the Land- Rover logo sewn in.  This would make a
good Gift and I'd like to know where its available would appreciate any
assistance.   Thanks............

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 15:39:03 -0400
From: jeff@purpleshark.com (Jeffrey A. Berg)
Subject: Re: Sog /Leatherman Knife

>To change subscription write to: Majordomo@Land-Rover.Team.Net
>Some time ago I saw an article here regarding a Sog or Leatherman knife which
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 7 lines)]
>good Gift and I'd like to know where its available would appreciate any
>assistance.   Thanks............

Actually, I thought it was the Gerber Multiplier, and I believe it's
available from Land Rover dealers.

FYI, the SOG Paratool and the new "won't pinch your hands style "
Leatherman are both superior tools, IMHO.  To see why, use the Gerber to
cut through a heavy piece of wire.  *OUCH*, that blood blister where the
pad of your hand got pinched between the handles looks awfully painful.  No
such problem with the SOG or the new Leatherman.  (Old Leatherman has flush
closing handles though, so make sure you buy the correct one.)

Seriously, if you (or your recipient) plans on using the tool, skip the
logo pouch and go for one of the other brands.

Keep on Roverin'

JAB

==                                                                 ==
 Jeffrey A. Berg        Purple Shark Media              Rowayton, CT
                       jeff@purpleshark.com
                        ==================
                   Love is fine until you taste
          This melancholy bouillabaisse called letting go
                                                       Jimmy Buffett
==                                                                 ==

------------------------------

From: morison@alumni.caltech.edu (Dark Dream Mists)
Subject: Disco review: Consumer Report Aug 95
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 14:00:52 -0700 (PDT)

 I am close to buying a new Disco after much research.  Up until
 this time everything I read confirmed that it is a good vehicle
 with bad fuel economy.  In addition, I have been a bit concerned
 about slugishness in acceleration but I was willing to deal with 
 that.  

 Now I have read this report in Consumer Reports that stated during
 testing it had this problem, "The Discovery offers a relatively 
 comforatable ride and full-time four wheel drive.  It did the best
 in our off-road tests.  But it's cursed with difficult access, an
 awkward driving position, long stopping distances on wet roads, and
 a V8 that manages to combine anemic acdeleration with miserable fuel
 economy."

 These are some more low lights it mentioned:

 "The four-speed auto transmission dosen't downshift readily, and the 
  shift lever is stiff."

 "The steering feels a bit vague and slow in tight bends."

 "The Disco stopped reasonably well from 60 mph on a dry track, but
  it need 202 feet to stop on a wet track-among the worst performances
  we've measured in years, and truly surprising in a vehicle with anti-
  lock breaks."

 "Uneven pavement makes it rock incessantly."

 "The driveline whines audibly except on the highway, where tire hum
  and wind noise drown it out."

 "The pedals are too close to the seat and too far left."

 "The front seats feel lumpy and a bit too firm."

 "The seat lacks side support."

 "The power-window switches, on the center console, are illogically
  arranged and awkward to reach."

 "The rear 3-point safety belts are hard to buckle, and the shoulder 
  portion rides on the neck of some occupants."

  Well, I can say that it did not get very good reviews.  This is a list
  of the other vehicles they tested and it is in order of their best
  to worst overall scores.

  1. Ford Explorer Limited (recommended model)
  2. Toyota Land Cruiser (recommended model)
  3. Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited V8
  4. Chevrolet Blazer LT
  5. Isuzu Trooper (recommended model)
  6. Land Rover Discovery
  7. Mitsubishi Montero
  8. Honda Passport (Isuzu Rodeo)

  *PLEASE*  I want feedback.  I am especially concerned with the stopping
  on wet pavement 202 feet!  I just returned from England and Scotland
  and saw tons of Disco's everywhere.  Most notable were the sightings
  in Edinburgh, they were everywhere... even used as airport vehicles.  Now
  how can a vehicle that may have a bad breaking record be so popular in 
  a region where it rains all the time?

  Janine
  morison@alumni.cco.caltech.edu

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 14:40:48 -0700
From: russ burns <burns@cisco.com>
Subject: Re: Disco review: Consumer Report Aug 95

The Land-rover is an off road vehicle, not a 2 inch  of snow four wheel drive
utility vehicle with car-like engineering. It is heavy, strong, has a payload
greater than most pickup trucks on the road. To compare it to an explorer,
 cheep cherokee (the real name  is a registored trademark)
or other sport utility vehicle, is sort of like comparing a semi to a pickup
truck.

I think consumers whatever's described the Disco correctly. The questions is
what 
other vehicle will carry 7 people, 200+ lbs on the roof, towing a 5000 lbs
trailer,
and still out perform any other non-landrover off road.

As far as 202 ft on wet pavement, this is a functions of the vehicle weight.
load an explorer to the 4500 lbs or so a Disco weighs, and see if it will stop
 on wet pavement. (anti-lock brakes don't do squat for stopping distances.)

There is nothing like a landrover.

Russ Burns
91 R-ROver
94 D-90

At 02:00 PM 10/12/95 -0700, Dark Dream Mists wrote:
>To change subscription write to: Majordomo@Land-Rover.Team.Net

	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 72 lines)]
>  a region where it rains all the time?
>  Janine
>  morison@alumni.cco.caltech.edu

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 17:51:37 -0500 (EST)
From: Duncan Brown <DB@CHO004.CHO.GE.COM>
Subject: Disco ratings by qualified professionals

Janine

>  Now I have read this report in Consumer Reports that stated during

>  These are some more low lights it mentioned:

    All I can say is "consider the source".  Would you trust Consumer
    Reports to choose a sport-utility vehicle for you?  To paraphrase
    some other things they said in that article:

    -- We didn't really test these vehicles' offroad capabilities
    because nobody that buys them uses them that way.

    -- Sure the Discovery seemed to do real well offroad, but we didn't
    include that in our ratings.  (See above.)

    -- Our overall favorite SUV is still the Isuzu Trooper.

    Need I say more, after that last one?!  If you agree that the
    Trooper is the superior vehicle for your style of usage, by all
    means don't buy the Disco!

    A friend of mine who loves to argue, and who owns a new Grand
    Cherokee, made sure to point this article out to me.  He also
    forwarded me some comments about the dismal showing of the Disco vs.
    other sport-utes in an article in Popular Science.

    POPULAR SCIENCE?!?!?  If you believe they're the ultimate judges of
    offroad vehicles, you should definitely DEFINITELY not be buying a
    Disco...

    Duncan, owner of a 1960 88, and sometimes passenger in a Disco, who
    wishes he had enough money to own one of those too...

------------------------------

From: Leland J Roys <roys@hpkel13.cup.hp.com>
Subject: Real Trucks
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 95 15:20:20 PDT

Hi, I agree with Russ Burns about the disc vs Ford Explorer. There is an
unbelievable difference between a Ford Explorer and a Defender-90 or Disco.
And I don't care what consumer reports or any other magazine says. I can 
say this after owning other trucks including a 1993 Toyota 4-Runner with 
every option imaginable. The difference is that the Ford explorers and
4-Runners of the world are yuppie vehicles made to go to the mall parking
lot, I wish I would have know this when I bought my 4-Runner, I took it 
to Baja and completely trashed it after only 1500 miles on the odo. The same
roads I went on with the 4-Runner would not have even phased my current
Defender-90.

My response to the subscriber asking about the comsumer reports (Sorry I 
forget the name) is that , if you want a truck that just looks nice in the
mall parking lot or to go to Tahoe in 2 inches of snow, get a Ford exploreer,
if you want to really go off-road or do anything serious, get a disco or
Defender-90. 

And to end, is it my imagination, or does the Ford Explorer just look cheap?
That new chrome grill makes me want to vomit!

Leland Roys
roys@cup.hp.com
Cupertino, Ca 
1994 Def-90 (Red)

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 12 Oct 95 15:19:38 -0700
Subject: West Coast Challenge
From: Andre_Maier@mindlink.bc.ca (Andre Maier)

ok ok,so i for got to tell you what country.
Canada,British Columbia.oct.14 and 15.
also in the new issue of LRO the article on the rocky mountain rovers,the
writer of the article should do some more research before the statments
about the availability of Landy's and parts are mentioned concerning the
rest of Canada.The writer is totally wrong.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 12 Oct 95 15:35:28 -0700
From: "TeriAnn Wakeman"  <twakeman@apple.com>
Subject: Re: Disco review: Consumer Report Aug 95

In message <199510122103.QAA14682@butler.uk.stratus.com> Dark Dream Mists 
writes:
> To change subscription write to: Majordomo@Land-Rover.Team.Net

	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 6 lines)]

> To change subscription write to: Majordomo@Land-Rover.Team.Net
>  I am close to buying a new Disco after much research.

snip

>  Now I have read this report in Consumer Reports that stated during
>  testing it had this problem, "The Discovery offers a relatively 
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 7 lines)]
>  a V8 that manages to combine anemic acdeleration with miserable fuel
>  economy."

SNIp  SNIP sNIP

>   Well, I can say that it did not get very good reviews.  This is a list
>   of the other vehicles they tested and it is in order of their best
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 7 lines)]
>   1. Ford Explorer Limited (recommended model)
>   *PLEASE*  I want feedback. 

So go out & buy a Ford.  It sounds like it has more of whats important to you.

TeriAnn
Land Rover 109 2.4L... 0 to 60 same day (assuming level road or down hill 
grade and no major headwinds)

------------------------------

From: Jeff Gauvin <jeffg@minerva.ncrmicro.ncr.com>
Subject: Rhino's & D90s...
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 95 16:36:44 MDT

From: "Doug Carmean" <dcarmean@ichips.intel.com>

    The local LR dealer is finally having their grand opening party
    later this month.  The rumor is that they are going to have the 1996
    D90 from the ad mentioned above at the dealership.  Apparently, LR
    decided not to fix the nice hole that the Rhino put in the side of
    the D90.  So, it's supposed to be here, Rhino hole and all.

I've always wondered:  are the sides of a D90 single wall or double
wall?  (Not that this would matter to a rhino) If something hard and/or
pointy dents the inside wall, will I see a bump on the outer surface?  I
know the rear gate is double wall, but I can't tell if the sides are too
(they look single wall to me).

And speaking of D90 cargo areas and Rhino's:  Has anybody ever applied a
spray-on liner (like Rhino Liner [tm]) to theirs?  Are there access
panels or bolts under that rubber mat that one wouldn't want to cover
with a permanent 1/4 inch thick layer of rubber?  Since Rhino Liners can
also be applied to vertical surfaces, it would provide an additional
measure of dent resistance to the sides of the cargo area.  I'm just
trying to prevent dents that haven't been properly earned!

An unrelated (and not very funny) story:  I went to my dealer last
Saturday to inquire about trading my '94 Limited Edition Beluga Black
D90 w/Hardtop and leather front/rear seats (original sticker $36K [I
didn't pay nearly that much!]) on a '95 D90 SW, and maybe put down a
deposit.  Without even looking at my vehicle he said he'd only give me
about $24K in trade - $12K depreciation in just over 6 months!  Needless
to say, I walked out.  Is this typical?  Do D90s really depreciate that
quickly or is the dealer trying to reserve the SWs for customers with
briefcases full of money?  The dealer does still have a few new & used
D90s on the lot, but admitted he's had several requests for black ones.
On an earlier visit he even bragged that he sells about one D90 per
week, so I don't think re-selling my trade would be a problem!  What's
the deal?

----
Jeffrey J. Gauvin		email: jeff.gauvin@symbios.com
Symbios Logic Inc.		Voice: 719-573-3563
1635 Aeroplaza Dr.		FAX: 719-573-3824
Colorado Springs, CO 80916

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 13 Oct 1995 06:54:28 +0800 (WST)
From: TONY YATES  <tonyy@waalpha.wa.BoM.GOV.AU>
Subject: Re: Disco review: Consumer Report Aug 95

In Australia we have several 4wd magazines and just about every month
they have comparison tests between Disco/RR and "Toyonissan wankmobiles"
(Ben Elton). The off road part of the test is usually restricted to one 
paragraph that goes something like - "the Disco/RR outperformed
everything off road". They spend pages discussing top speed, acceleration,
stereo systems, trim levels etc, generally bagging the Disco/RR then in
conclusion the reviewer usually states that the Disco/RR would be his
vehicle of choice.

==========================================================
                                      ()  (  )      ()
Tony Yates                           (  ) (   )    (  )
Bureau of Meteorology               (    )(    ) (      )
Port Hedland                       (       )   )(        )
Western Australia                 (          ) ) --------
                                   ------------
ph:  (091) 401 350                 \\\**\\**\
fax: (091) 401 100                   \***\*\
                                       \\*\
email: A.Yates@bom.gov.au                \\

==========================================================

------------------------------

From: kirkwood@strider.fm.intel.com (Clayton Kirkwood)
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 16:43:33 -0700
Subject: Re: Disco review: Consumer Report Aug 95

On Oct 12,  2:00pm, Dark Dream Mists wrote:
> Subject: Disco review: Consumer Report Aug 95
> To change subscription write to: Majordomo@Land-Rover.Team.Net
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 11 lines)]
>  about slugishness in acceleration but I was willing to deal with
>  that.

Quite true, quite true. But then when did you ever want to accelerate more
than sluggishly when trail and rock riding??? :>)

>  Now I have read this report in Consumer Reports that stated during
>  testing it had this problem, "The Discovery offers a relatively
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 8 lines)]
>  a V8 that manages to combine anemic acdeleration with miserable fuel
>  economy."

Difficult access? Well, yeah, you do have to climb up a step or two to get
in, but I find that better than dropping down into our Saturn where I am
always concerned about bumping the side of my head. Awkward??, Oh yeah, you
have to sit up in this vehicle. That is somewhat awkward I suppose.>) For
stopping distance, try tailgating at 200 feet which usually a good thing. And
of course it's anemic: what do you expect? It is aluminum. Miserable fuel
economy? This is not an economy car; it is expensive and has the thirst to
prove it. :>)

>  These are some more low lights it mentioned:
>  "The four-speed auto transmission dosen't downshift readily, and the
>   shift lever is stiff."
>  in our off-road tests.  But it's cursed with difficult access, an

In comparison, I find most auto shifters to be stiffer than manuals; they
aren't typically moved all that much. Ours is fine. In fact, the shifting is
very smooth I think most of the time.

>  "The steering feels a bit vague and slow in tight bends."
>  "The four-speed auto transmission dosen't downshift readily, and the

We have found that we have to pay attention to steering: it tends to waver
down the road at highway speeds. Tight bends are no problem for us.

>  "The Disco stopped reasonably well from 60 mph on a dry track, but
>   it need 202 feet to stop on a wet track-among the worst performances
>   we've measured in years, and truly surprising in a vehicle with anti-
>   lock breaks."

I haven't had anything we to try this on and I don't usually intentionally
slam the breaks on. May they didn't crunch the brakes but pushed them like
non-anti-lock brakes. It makes a difference.

>  "Uneven pavement makes it rock incessantly."
>   it need 202 feet to stop on a wet track-among the worst performances

I would assume that a semi would be even worse and that a lowslung sports car
is much better. The Disco has a high profile and carries its weight above the
heigth of most other cars. I also has a offroad suspension unlike all of the
other trucks mentioned below. They are designed as mallmobiles while the
Disco is meant to be used off road. Big difference.

>  "The driveline whines audibly except on the highway, where tire hum
>   and wind noise drown it out."
>  "The pedals are too close to the seat and too far left."
>   lock breaks."

The fix for too close pedals is the adjustable seat. All you have to do is
reach between your legs (under the seat a little) and lift up and push back.
 Alternatively, don't let your wife drive it (unless of course her legs are
the same length). As far as too far to the left, yeah I suppose, but here in
America, we do let our drivers sit on the left and when sitting on the right
it might be a reach to get to the pedals when they are on the left.

>  "The front seats feel lumpy and a bit too firm."
>   and wind noise drown it out."

Ever hear of the play, "The Princess and the Pea". It sounds like the
evaluator was a little too upper crust for a Disco. I like my seats firm. I
think this because when one is bouncing around crawling rock one has more
bounce. At that point the seat isn't so firm: it is better able to absorb the
bum blows. Besides, after 10 years it will just start to be broken in for the
next 30 years. Let's not forget that these cars are brand new when tested.
The planned usage for a Disco vs the others is dramatically different (I hope
you do plan on taking it offroad???)

>  "The seat lacks side support."
>   and wind noise drown it out."

That's what the doors are for.

>  "The power-window switches, on the center console, are illogically
>   arranged and awkward to reach."
>  "The pedals are too close to the seat and too far left."

You know, I thought this at first too. I have a Topaz and the buttons are
reversed. Now when I get in the Topaz, I think they are reversed. It's just
what you get used to. Some cars I get in with manual windows, roll clockwise,
while others roll counter. Who knows?

>  "The rear 3-point safety belts are hard to buckle, and the shoulder
>   portion rides on the neck of some occupants."
>  "The pedals are too close to the seat and too far left."

It depends on how tall or short you are. Most cars will rub wrong depending
on the individual's height.

>   Well, I can say that it did not get very good reviews.  This is a list
>   of the other vehicles they tested and it is in order of their best
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 13 lines)]
>   6. Land Rover Discovery
>   7. Mitsubishi Montero
>   8. Honda Passport (Isuzu Rodeo)

Now look closely at this list. Most of the articles you read relate how most
are the "new" stationwagons and mallmobiles. Price wise, most also are at or
above the cost of the Disco. The Disco is truly meant to be used offroad and
enjoyed at places other than around town and to and from the snow. Realize
also that most buyers are not buying for the offroad capability but the size,
capacity and style. That is what CR is catering to. If you take a bunch of
Disco owners and ask them to rate these same cars (keeping in mind what they
want the car for) you will get a different list order with the Disco at the
top.

>   *PLEASE*  I want feedback.  I am especially concerned with the stopping
>   on wet pavement 202 feet!  I just returned from England and Scotland
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 7 lines)]
>   how can a vehicle that may have a bad breaking record be so popular in
>   a region where it rains all the time?

Either the Brits are smart and know what's good or it explains why they don't
leave the island often. Who ever heard of flying a Disco around: they are
cars!!!!! (Airport vehicles =? planes)

>   Janine
>   morison@alumni.cco.caltech.edu
>-- End of excerpt from Dark Dream Mists
>   in Edinburgh, they were everywhere... even used as airport vehicles.  Now

Buy one and don't tailgate. They are very nice vehicles. After six months we
still get a kick out of just getting in the thing.

-- 
Clayton R. Kirkwood, FM1-58, 916 356-5838

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 12 Oct 95 16:43:28 PDT
From: Bennett Leeds <bennett@mv.us.adobe.com>
Subject: Consumer Reports on the Discovery

Here's a few quotes:

	SUVs serve as family transportation for most buyers.
	Accordingly, CR rated them much the way sedan are
	rated. We didn't include off-road capability as a
	Ratings factor.
	
	It {LR Discovery} did the best in off-road tests...
	
	As a group, minivans make more sense than SUVs for
	most people.

Basically, CR thinks the Disco is a so-so minivan. They're probably  
right. You want a minivan?

But CR is right about the pedals being too far left and about front  
seat comfort. The power seats in '96 seem much improved, but I've  
only been on test drives so far.

- Bennett Leeds

'96 Disco (silver/grey) on order

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 20:12:43 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Kier M. Ouderkirk" <km_ouderkirk@sunyit.edu>

subscibe lro-digest

------------------------------

Subject: MORE LR STAMPS, NEW ONES
From: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (Robin Craig)
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 95 18:28:01 -0500

A couple of months ago I posted a message about some new stamps coming 
out from Tristan Da Cunha. Theyre here at last

There are four stamps in the set , a van, pair of motorbikes, pick up, 
and a Very nice Defender 110 RHD station wagon in white with the union 
flag (not jack 'cos it aint flown from a jackstay, but thats another 
thread) ona little pole flown from the front corner of the vehcile. The 
vehicle is off road with nice green grass and a stream.

These sets are of a high denomination for a start so that is refelcted in 
the price that I must ask for them

Each set will cost $11 including postage.

I have only five sets available, so bids again please. Closure will be 
sunday night after the Diefenbaker Bunker tour, you have to a Canuck to 
get that one.

I know a number of people had asked for sets to be put aside, I will give 
them consideration as long as they remind me.

Rgds

Robin

--
Robin Craig, rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca
FourFold Symmetry, Ottawa, Ont. |  Ottawa Valley Land Rovers

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 13 Oct 1995 09:55:28 +0930
From: Tiffany Downing <tiffanyd@tafe.sa.edu.au>
Subject: Re: Disco review: Consumer Report Aug 95

At 02:00 PM 12/10/95 -0700, you wrote:

> I am close to buying a new Disco after much research.  Up until
> this time everything I read confirmed that it is a good vehicle
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 13 lines)]
>  in Edinburgh, they were everywhere... even used as airport vehicles.  Now
>  how can a vehicle that may have a bad breaking record be so popular in 
>  a region where it rains all the time?

Try not to take some of the scarcastic remarks of these people too much to
heart.  They can be pretty blunt at times and I know (from experience)  :-)

You really need to determine what you need the vehicle for.  4WDriving,
Shopping, Long on-road travel, whatever and then list what is important for
you in a vehicle excellent off-road ability (4WDriving), Good stopping
ability nice stereo (Shopping), Comfortable seats and good fuel economy
(Long on-road travel), etc. 

I wouldn't just look at the top 10 recommended cars and say well that one
gets the best reports.  People are biased (I oughta know) and often
Magazines are also biased (if the writer drives a certain vehicle or the
article is sponsored by a paticular company you could be seeing a one sided
view.  Are you prepared to buy a vehicle on hearsay of a journalist who's
next story is about the rare black spotted baboon in the jungles of Africa!

You need to think of what YOU require from a vehicle, what's really
important to you and then test drive the ones that have the most of what
you're looking for. Don't be shy test drive them all, speak to people that
own these vehicles, what are the cost of parts, are they readily available,
who will work on your vehicle, can you work on your own vehicle.  DOES IT DO
WHAT YOU WANT IT TO!!!!

That's just my $0.04 worth (well it's too long for $0.02)  :-)

All the best in finding a vehicle.

Regards

Tiffany Downing

********************************************
Co-ordinator, International Student Programs
TAFE South Australia, AUSTRALIA
Phone:   (61 8) 226 3202
Fax:     (61 8) 226 3655
E-Mail:  tiffanyd@tafe.sa.edu.au
********************************************

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 12 Oct 95 17:36:00 -0700
From: "TeriAnn Wakeman"  <twakeman@apple.com>
Subject: Re: Disco review: Consumer Report Aug 95

In message <199510122258.PAA14859@alumni.caltech.edu> Dark Dream Mists writes:
 

> > So go out & buy a Ford.  It sounds like it has more of whats important to 
> > you.
 
> > TeriAnn

>   Dear TeriAnn-
;  
>   I am shocked at your rude e-mail to me.  I posted the quotes from
;   Consumer Reports because I wanted to hear feedback from other LR owners
>   on things which were reported.  The listing of vehicles was in order
>   to elucidate the list as to which vehicles the Disco was being 
;   compared to.  It in no way reflected my choices.  If you had read the 
>   post more intelligently, perhaps, you would have understood that.
; 
>   Most important is that I thought the Land Rover digest was a forum in
>   which people could discuss LR topics.  Unlike the mail you sent me, I
;   have recieved numerous intelligent and fact filled messages regarding
>   my post.
; 
>   -Janine
   

Whats so rude about my reply.  You stated your reservations about certain 
characteristics of the discovery.  The artical you quoted said that the Ford was
best at things that seemed very important to you and the Disco scored low.  I 
simply suggested that you purchase the car the scored best on the things you 
seemed most concerned about.

I don't think you should be talked into a car that you would be unhappy with.  
It should perform as well as possible in the parameters that are most important 
to you.  Discoverys are not the best car for everybody, inspite of what the 
dealer may say.

Saying the Disco takes more space to stop than a Ford because its heavier, just 
explains why.  It doesn't change the fact that it takes longer to stop on wet 
pavement, nor does it address your concern that it takes a long distance to 
stop.

No replys I have read yet addressed your concerns over poor performance and gas 
milage.

If all these things are very important to you, then maybe you ARE looking at the
wrong car for you.

Other replies addressed its off road, load and towing capabilities.  You did not
mention them as being important parameters in your posting so I ignored them.

Given the parameters you listed as being important, the Ford makes the best 
sense for you  period.

I assumed you weren't posting just to start a marque bashing session. I assumed 
that you were interested in certain characteristics.  No reply that I have seen 
has argued with those characteristics.  They have said that other 
characteristics are more important to them and have described them.  You just 
didn't mention those same characteristics as having been important to you.

maybe if you posted a list of characteristice that are most important to you in 
a car, we could discuss how well the Discovery meets those characteristics.  
Since you are evidently interested in a 4X4, you might want to cross post it to 
a general 4X4 mailgroup/newsgroup and get the opinions of people who own other 
marques.

Its a lot of money to pay.  You should get the car you'll be happiest with.

TeriAnn
"Have you driven a Ford lately"

------------------------------

From: "Gerald" <g@ix.netcom.com>
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 21:03:06 -0400
Subject: Re: Emulations

> > Somebody mind filling in the rest of the Real World (and the US) on
> > whatthehell a Reliant Robin is ? -Alan
>         A little three wheeled car available in the UK.  Most commonly 

Was there an Isetta 300 in the early 1960's that was 3 wheel? It had
a front door and I guess a 300 cc engine. Two wheels in front and
one in back. I think the 500 model had 4 wheels.

--
Gerald
g@ix.netcom.com

------------------------------

From: "Robert Watson (CNA)" <a-robw@microsoft.com>
Subject: RE: Disco review: Consumer Report Aug 95
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 18:44:34 -0700

Consumer Reports does not like the Discovery and perhaps for a valid  reason as 
they stated up front in the article. "...did not test the vehicles off road 
because that's not how they'll be used...." Talking to a couple of dealers, 
however, it seems that the Discovery is usually the bought as the "wife's" car. 
(this surprised me until I let my wife drive mine... I may not ever get it back 
now, but that's a separate issue :-)  "Four Wheeler" magazine DID test it off 
road and it was voted the 1995 Four Wheeler of the Year.

In any case, IMHO, If you are not going to take it off road, then heed the CR 
article and buy something else. If you plan on taking it off road, and plan to 
take 7 people in it (and do not want to buy a GMC Suburban), then the Discovery 
is an ideal choice. You don't buy these for the fuel economy, but the utility.

I won't waste space echoing Clayton Kirkwood's response to the items below, 
because I think he covered everything.

I will comment on the list, though..

  1. Ford Explorer Limited (recommended model)
Great for the mall, but not much ground clearance for off road. (especially 
with those running boards.) A Car shaped like a truck.
  2. Toyota Land Cruiser (recommended model)
Sure if you want to spend US $45K + on a vehicle
  3. Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited V8
Another Mall-wagon. I wonder how many of these you'll see on (or off) the road 
after 100K miles.
  4. Chevrolet Blazer LT
Another On-Road vehicle made to look like it could go off road. (just look at 
the stock tires on most of them.) I've owned several GM products and I'm not 
impressed with the fit and finish of the components.
  5. Isuzu Trooper (recommended model)
This is a reasonable value.
  6. Land Rover Discovery
Enough said (as if that's possible :-)
  7. Mitsubishi Montero
  8. Honda Passport (Isuzu Rodeo)

  *PLEASE*  I want feedback.  I am especially concerned with the stopping
  on wet pavement 202 feet!  I just returned from England and Scotland
  and saw tons of Disco's everywhere.  Most notable were the sightings
  in Edinburgh, they were everywhere... even used as airport vehicles.
I'll be honest, the Disco doesn't start fast, nor does it stop fast, but it'll 
go anywhere. I think this a pretty common Land Rover characteristic.  Don't 
tailgate in it (or any other vehicle for that matter). I learned this the hard 
way. (another story).

I bought mine to go off-road, carry up to 7 people, and was impressed by the 
sturdiness of the construction. So for me it was a good fit and I'm quite 
pleased with it. Good luck with your purchase.

-- Bob Watson
'95 Discovery

------------------------------

Date: 12 Oct 95 22:03:59 EDT
From: "William L. Leacock" <75473.3572@compuserve.com>
Subject: Steering idler

Hugh,
 yes it is possible to over haul the steering idler without removing the
complete assembly from the chassis. 
remove the idlers, remove the bottom plate and thrust washer, push slowly down
on the shaft, as the bearing starts to protrude from the bottom fit a hose clip
over it,then push down further until the top bearing starts to prtotrude from
the bottom, put a hose clip on that to hold it in place, remove the entire
assembly to a workbench, dismantle, clean and fit the new bearings, fit new oil
seals to the end caps
 assembly is the reverse process. Keep out of a direct line of the assembly just
in case  you slip up. It can easily be achieved with care, I have done it dozens
of times. 
 Side play is usually caused by the bearings siezing up in the box through lack
of lubricant, refurbishing can easily be accomplished by fitting new bearings
and seals
 Proper lubrication afterwards is the key to longevity, it can take a week to
fill up the idler with oil.

 Regards  Bill Leacock  Limey in exile

------------------------------

Subject: Walt Swain where are you?
From: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (Robin Craig)
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 95 21:49:32 -0500

Would Walt Swain or anyone knowing his e mail address please contact me 
pls asap.

Tx In Adv

Robin

--
Robin Craig, rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca
FourFold Symmetry, Ottawa, Ont. |  Ottawa Valley Land Rovers

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 13 Oct 1995 00:16:24 -0400
From: jeff@purpleshark.com (Jeffrey A. Berg)
Subject: Re: Disco review: Consumer Report Aug 95

> Now I have read this report in Consumer Reports
[SNIP]

I gave up on Consumer Reports about the time that they rated a Ford Escort
as a better car than my Rabbit GTi.

Also, as an Audio Engineer, I can attest that their definition of what
makes a stereo component "better" differs seriously from mine.

Consumers is great for things about which you have no passion: Dishwashers,
Air Conditioners, etc.  But if the object involved has any "soul" to you
whatsoever, the "objective" criteria by which CR judges them just won't cut
it.

So if what you drive is more of a "romantic" decision, let your heart be
the guide.  If you don't really care, and you're not going to be doing
serious off roading, take CR's (and Teri Ann's) advice and buy the Ford,
though I confess that I do rather like my Mother's Grand Wagoneer.  What
the hell do I know, I drive a Series IIa for everyday transportation!

Keep on Roverin'

JAB

==                                                                 ==
 Jeffrey A. Berg        Purple Shark Media              Rowayton, CT
                       jeff@purpleshark.com
                        ==================
                   Love is fine until you taste
          This melancholy bouillabaisse called letting go
                                                       Jimmy Buffett
==                                                                 ==

------------------------------

From: "Robert Watson (CNA)" <a-robw@microsoft.com>
Subject: Discovery specs
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 21:45:11 -0700

With regards to the recent postings of the Consumer Reports & Popular Science 
reviews of SUV's, I  was perusing the Nov. Four Wheeler mag (that comes with 
the nifty Rhino-chasing-Defender calendar) and in the middle they have a 
summary table of all 4wd vehicle specs. I thought it was very interesting to 
note the following items (sorted in order of payload).

Vehicle 		Gross Wt. 	Payload
-----------------	---------	-------
Hummer		10,300	 4,100 (just for kicks)
L.R. Def 90		 6,003	 2,443 (WOW!)
Chev. Tahoe		 6,800	 1,666
L.R. Discovery	 6,019	 1,640 (*)
Chev. Blazer	 5,300	 1,229
Isuzu Tooper	 5,500	 1,290
Jeep G. Cherokee	 5,300	 1,150
Ford Explorer	 4,700	 1,050
Isuzu	Rodeo		 4,900	   955
Jeep Wrangler	 3,880	   800

The fact that the Disco has a gross wt. of 2,100 pounds more than the Explorer 
and 1,500 pounds surprised me, but I didn't realize the difference in payload: 
an extra 500 pounds over the G.C.! The Def. 90's no slouch, either.

I guess you really can say that the G.C., Explorer and Rodeo are 
"lightweights!"

    _____
   /___|_\___     Bob Watson <a-robw@microsoft.com>
  |   |   |  \                  6405 235th Place SW
  |---|___|___\____     Mountlake Terrace, WA 98043
  |  _|   |   | _  }\
 {|_/_ \__|___|/_\_}|    '95 Beluga Black Discovery
    \_/        \_/

Bob Watson
<a-robw@microsoft.com>
Tonight's feature is bought to you in living color.

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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 13 Oct 1995 19:11:22 +1200
From: jawa@i-max.co.nz (leonard john hobart)
Subject: re steering idler

Thanks  to all who replied to my steering idler prob (see, got the right
terminology), Bill L. when I looked at the bits, I  discovered that if I
could keep the the 2 halves of the conical composit bearing togeather, with
the spring in the middle, I would then have a stable item. (as you already
knew) I was looking at pieces of exhaust tubing to do this when I saw your
hint using hose clips, thanks. I think I will wear my old fire fighters hat
with the clear face protector when I compress the spring in the vice though.
(can you picture that)  my wife thinks I am in my second childhood. I have
this large crow bar over a meter long that I was using last night to try and
prise the caste body out of the frame, but I am in danger of damaging the
frame (it was bending). I also used an axel stand, a steel bar, a chain, a
large washer, and a hydrolic jack. but chickened out when the chain became
ridged (sp) and I started hearing creaks.  The problem I have is, if I don't
remove it (the steel casting) to do the repair correctly, it will always be
a question mark. Bugger.can  I wield the frame to the casting??  Of course I
could always sell it and get a couple of Vauxhall Viva's

regards John (kiwi pom)

will it ever go again?

(moan mutter whine)

 I mean, apart from that, it's mint,............true

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 13 Oct 1995 02:22:50 -0500 (CDT)
From: Mark Perry <rxq281@freenet.mb.ca>

I've just got caught up with a month's work LRO digests (whew)
There was a question about heat shields, so I looked up the p/ns, in case 
anyone is interested.(LHD petrol 88):

587095 shield
515506 brace (attaches to top rear of shield and to manifold)
515505 spacer, middle bolt, between shield and manifold
SH505051 front bolt (this is just a 5/16UNF x 3/4 set bolt)
SH605061L rear bolt ( 5/16UNF x 5/8 set bolt, shield to brace)
SH505071 middle bolt (5/16 UNF x 7/8 set bolt)
RTC613 plain washers 5/16 (3)
GHF332 spring washers 5/16(3)
GHF201 nut 5/16UNF (1) (brace to shield)
The front and middle bolts screw into the threaded holes on the manifold; 
the L-brace, when bolted to the shield by the shorter end, is attached to the 
engine by the rearmost bolt that attaches the manifold to the head. Once 
you get the bits in hand, it should be self-evident.

It's easy to install, and does make a real difference in footwell heat - 
no more burning rubber smell from my duck shoes. I 
do, by way of caution, believe I read at least one claim that fewer manifold 
cracking problems have been had with heat shields removed. (I think it was Dixon 
Kenner of OVLR who said this). On the other hand, I have also read that having the shield on forestalls 
vapor lock in the carb by sinking heat away from it.

The whole set up cost me something like C$30, but I bought it as a kit 
from a pricey U.S. supplier ;^) with exchange and import costs. Someone handy with sheet 
metal could surely make one up if there were someone else's to follow for a 
pattern, and one 
would able to find OK Grade 5 standard hardware locally. 

Cheers,

Mark Perry   Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
1966 Ser.IIA 88 Petrol Hardtop (Puke pastel green) 
"Yes, I can see quite well over the spare tire."

------------------------------

  END OF LAND ROVER OWNER DIGEST 
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Photos & text Copyright 1990-2011
	Bill Caloccia, All rights reserved. 

Digest Messages Copyright 1990-2011 by the original poster or/and
	Bill Caloccia,
	All rights reserved.