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Date: 31 Aug 95 03:56:03 EDT
From: "Stefan R. Jacob" <100043.2400@compuserve.com>
Subject: Re: Tires for Range Rovers?

> share regarding alternate tires for the Range Rover, particularly
> wider tires than the 205.

 ...
> My requirement is for driving in *very* deep, soft sand.  The 205's
> work OK however I have been in some scary situations with them even

Rick, I have done extensive experimenting with tires on a RR plus
raising the beast. The big problem with Range Rovers, especially the
more recent models, are the very tight, snug wheelarches which are
supposed to give this car its elegant sedan-like appearance while at the
same time allowing for sufficient axle and wheel articulation offroad.
The result is a construction which severely limits the size and type
of tyres you can use without major modifications to suspension and  body.

I tried out a variety of springs, shocks, propshaft extensions, and
6 or 7 different types of tires; some worked, others didn't, and some caused
outright damage. Based on my experiences, the conclusions are:
If you want to fit anything alse than the standard 205/75 tires and at
the same time do *not* want to cut away parts of the wheel arches you must
at the very least fit the strongest, highest stock springs available for
the RR, being the front diesel springs and the rear HD english police
spec. springs (don't have the parts numbers at hand but I can give them
to you if you're really interested). The spoiler, if fitted, must either
be removed or 1 1/2" must be cut away at the inner ends. Having done this,
the maximum you can fit is 225/75 or, at the very most, 235/75. With an
additional minor modification, i.e. raising the rear suspension by an
additional inch via a distance piece between spring and top spring mount,
and bending around the sharp inner rear wheelarch edge, you can also
squeeze in 235/85 (equivalent to 7.50x16).  But that's where it ends.  And
in all cases you will have to adjust and limit steering lock so the wheels
won't brush against the radius arms on full lock.  Anything wider/bigger
*will cause damage* when the axles go on full articulation offroad.  Don't
be fooled by Range Rover yuppie cruisers with big fat monster tires.  The
most articulation those cars ever get is running up a curb, and even that
is done very carefully.
Since you want to drive in deep sand you definitely don't want an aggressive
tread. A used, 3/4 bald, wide tire at minimum inflation pressure would
actually be ideal. The Michelin XS are excellent but very expensive, and
useless on tarmac (loud and fast-wearing, wander). BFG All-Terrains are
a good compromise. There have been extensive tire discussions on the list,
maybe someone has a thread archived or FAQed and can forward it - I don't.

Stefan
<Stefan R. Jacob, 100043.2400@CompuServe.com>

------------------------------

From: Mike Rooth <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Not specifically relaed to Rovers, but...
Date: Thu, 31 Aug 95 9:36:29 BST

> To change subscription write to: Majordomo@Land-Rover.Team.Net

	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 16 lines)]
> to me that this would be a good one... 
>   Pardon the digression, Alan
Dead easy! You dont even have to go to a scrapyard.You just find
someone that makes number plates,tell 'em what you want and hand
over the readies.Depends on the style though.Before(I think)'73,
correct me if I'm wrong folks,the plates were silver letters on
a black ground.Or white letters on a black ground.These can still
be had for vehicles of the appropriate age.As soon as I've got some
spare cash(I wish!)mine will have such a set.Later ones are black
letters on a white ground at the front,black letters on a yellow
ground at the rear.And there is square or oblong.Series Rovers
with headlights in the rad grille panel would typically have
square plates front and rear,the white or silver on black variety,
the front one screwed to one front wing under the sidelights,the
rear one under the rear lights.Late 11A and 111,with headlights
in the wings,like my 11A,have an oblong one fastened above the
front bumper,centrally,and a square one under the rear lights.
Take your pick!
Cheers
Mike Rooth

------------------------------

From: Mr Ian Stuart <Ian.Stuart@ed.ac.uk>
Date:          Thu, 31 Aug 1995 09:45:19 +0000
Subject:       Re: UK registrations

On 30 Aug 95, Duncan Brown wrote:

>     Anyway, with the very orderly, if somewhat confusing, rules for
>     British plates, what can we tell about the Lotus 7 driven by Patrick
>     McGoohan as "The Prisoner"?  It was KAR 120C
Area: AT - no idea
year: C - see earlier post... (mid 60's)

     ----** Ian Stuart (Computing Officer)        +44 31 650 6205
Royal (Dick) School of Veterinary Studies, Edinburgh University. 
 <http://www.vet.ed.ac.uk/> or <http://www.tardis.ed.ac.uk/~kiz/>

------------------------------

From: Mr Ian Stuart <Ian.Stuart@ed.ac.uk>
Date:          Thu, 31 Aug 1995 10:15:36 +0000
Subject:       Re: Right-of-ways

On 30 Aug 95, Alexander P. Grice wrote:

> While us folks in the US have witnessed the reduction of off-roading
> opportunities through closure of national forest trails, I never realized
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 10 lines)]
> the front door, through the kitchen and out the back door.  Apparently,
> *going around* the house was not even considered.  Sheesh....
Ah, the problems of "rights of way" and "Tresspass".

Under Scottish law, there is no "right of way", nor is there "tresspass" - 
if you insist on travelling some route, you must make reparation for 
"damaged caused".  There would be no right of way through a house and the 
walkers (each of them!) would have to pay for repairs to the home-owners.

     ----** Ian Stuart (Computing Officer)        +44 31 650 6205
Royal (Dick) School of Veterinary Studies, Edinburgh University. 
 <http://www.vet.ed.ac.uk/> or <http://www.tardis.ed.ac.uk/~kiz/>

------------------------------

From: Mike Rooth <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk>
Subject: Uncle Joe Strikes Again!
Date: Thu, 31 Aug 95 11:26:56 BST

Now *there's* a subject heading to strike fear into the
stoutest heart!And you can all come back!Cowards!
The problem is as follows:
Two vehicles,my '70 88" diesel,and a friends '67 88"
petrol,mine with headlamps in wings,his with them in
the proper place.Both have the same fault,developed
independantly(or perhaps not,they have been parked
next to each other).The indicator warning lamp(the
little green one housed in the switch unit with the
rubber tyred cancelling wheel in it)is on all the time.
Mine glows faintly,his is at full brilliance.Turn off
the electrics,light goes out.Use the indicators,lamp
goes out,then flashes normally.
Remove the earth from the switch unit,lamp goes out,
as would be expected,since the circuit has been broken.
Looking at the circuit diagram(Yes,I did,just goes to
show how desperate we are getting),the only place the
lamp can get a feed from is the flasher unit itself.
Does anyone know whether the flasher unit has a
separate contact for the warning lamp,which may not
be fully opening "at rest" so to speak.Or indeed,
before we both start ripping our respective dash panels
apart,has anyone any other bright ideas?
I might add,mine has been this way for about a year,and
that we are talking home market vehicles here.The NADA
circuit diagram definitely *does* show a separate feed
for the warning light.The home market one doesnt.
Just shows a single wire from the flasher unit O/P
to the switch.
Any contributions gratefully received.Particularly
in my mates case,since he's getting a bit bored
driving round with a bright green light glaring
evilly at him all the time.His wife says it makes
him look like th Thing from Twenty Thousand Fathoms,
and its frightening the dog.

Cheers
Mike Rooth

------------------------------

From: Tom Stevenson <gbfv08@udcf.gla.ac.uk>
Subject: UK Reg plates
Date: Thu, 31 Aug 1995 12:36:06 +0100 (BST)

The advantage of having a Q-plate is that your vehicle is exempt from
the new MOT emissions tests, or at least it is in our local garage.
-- 
Tom Stevenson: gbfv08@udcf.gla.ac.uk
University Marine Biological Station, Isle of Cumbrae, Scotland
Tel:(01475) 530581  Fax:(01475) 530601

------------------------------

From: azw@aber.ac.uk (Andy Woodward)
Subject:  Tyres and Rims
Date: Thu, 31 Aug 1995 12:41:24 UNDEFINED

>> Tyres on the 16" rims should always be fitted with tubes. The rim is not
> >designed for a tubeless tyre and doesn't have the bead retainer that 
stops
> >you peeling the tyre from the rim under heavy side loads. With radials be 

>    I just bought 5 brand-new 16" Land Rover Genuine wheels (well, OK,
>  Dunlop makes 'em, but they came with a Land Rover piece of cardboard
>    >stuck in the center!)  I was told they were intended for use with
>   tubeless tires.  Does your statement above apply only to the
>  original (1960's/70's) wheels, or also the brand new ones?

My 1984  90 is on the original 16 inch rims. It has 3 tubes on, but the tyre 
place put a tubeless on the 4th corner before I checked. It works fine.

------------------------------

From: Haas <marcus@dcs.qmw.ac.uk>
Subject: Welding Land Rover chassis...
Date: Thu, 31 Aug 1995 14:13:01 +0000 (BST)

I have just been told by a chap who runs an independent Land Rover repair business in SE London that Land Rover chassis are constructed from a high-carbon steel which becomes brittle when arc-welded, and that I should therefore use a MIG when welding my new front chassis legs on.  A friend who has professional welding training agrees that if the chasssis is made of such steel, the advice given is sound.

The question I have is: is this true?  Is my  LR chassis made from high-carbon steel (it's a 1970 LWB)?  If so, is it possible to buy suitable rods which would allow arc-welding without the aforementioned embrittlement?

I ask because I don't particularly want to buy a MIG at the moment, hiring is too much bother (arranging transport, planning exactly when to do it...and then it rains all day!) and is relatively poor value for money.

Thanks for any advice.

Marcus.
(1970 109 2.25 petrol Station Wagon, now severely denuded...)

------------------------------

From: Mike Rooth <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk>
Subject: Returned mail: User unknown (fwd)
Date: Thu, 31 Aug 95 15:01:16 BST

Forwarded message:
>From Mailer-Daemon Thu Aug 31 14:57 BST 1995
Date: Thu, 31 Aug 95 14:57:44 BST
From: Mailer-Daemon (Mail Delivery Subsystem)
Subject: Returned mail: User unknown

   ----- Transcript of session follows -----
550 net... User unknown

While connected to bgate.lut.ac.uk [131.231.16.7] (ether):
>-> RCPT To:<lro@team>
<<< 550 Unknown domain 'team'
550 lro@team... User unknown

   ----- Unsent message follows -----
	id AA11360; Thu, 31 Aug 95 14:57:46 bst
From: Mike Rooth <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Welding Land Rover chassis...
Date: Thu, 31 Aug 95 14:57:44 BST
Cc: lro@team, net
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL0 (LUT)]

Marcus,
FWIW my 88" is '70 too.And again FWIW I've had it welded
with an ordinary stick welder with no ill effects.Like
the patches are still there,the outriggers are still on etc.
Frankly I dont beleive it.And even if I did,I cant see what
difference a MIG would make.As I understand it,the shielding
gas just prevents oxidation of the steel.You've got to get it
just as hot to melt the steel in the first place.Anyone know
any better?
Cheers
Mike Rooth

------------------------------

From: ScottFugate_Group8@ctdvns1.ctd.ornl.gov
Date: Thu, 31 Aug 95 9:57:34 EDT
Subject: Re: Transmission Brake Rehab

I. Harper asks how to remove the transmission brake hub...

I have just completed this operation.  If your brake is as well lubricated as 
mine was, it should slide right off.  Sounds to me like something is binding, 
or the proper fasteners haven't been removed.  Don't worry about losing the 
bolts into the transfer case.  They are retained by a flange on the driving 
member.  By the way, don't lose the all-metal lock nuts.  They are a weird 
size - 5/16 20 or 22 pitch.  Right in between a course and fine thread.  If 
all six bolts have been removed and it still won't come off, try this:

Remove the 4 U-joint keeper bolts and loosen the prop shaft.  These bolts are 
retained as well, as you shall soon see.  Remove the castellated nut from the 
output shaft.  Now the whole shooting match will slide right off.  You can 
then un-contort yourself and crawl out from under your truck and figger out 
why the dang thing won't come apart while your body is in a normal position 
and the light is better.  

The next thing you should do is pry out the old output shaft seal, take it 
down to the local bearing store, and buy a replacement.  This rascal is 
undoubtedly why the transmission brake is shot anyway.  Check the wearing 
surface on the shaft.  If there is a groove you can catch your fingernail in, 
get a speedy sleeve and fit it.  Bearing store will have this, too.  Take the 
driving member with you to ensure right size is acquired.  I found it very 
useful to remove the backing plate and completely degrease at this point.  
Remove and clean mechanism of adjuster and expander.  Lightly lube with grease 
before refitting.  If you disassemble the oil catcher from the inside of the 
backing plate, note you will need a new gasket.  I made my own, and now have 
enough gasket material left over to last 5 or 10 years, acquired at a cost of 
$1.50.  You'll also need a new felt washer for the output shaft.  Good idea to 
keep some of those things laying around.  Degrease the speedometer housing on 
the transfer box while you're at it.  

NOTE THIS: I was most surprised to find that there is a groove machined in the 
bottom of the housing designed to drain oil away from the oil catcher via the 
OUTSIDE of the backing plate.  (Pretty swift, huh?)  Mine was completely 
gunked up with dirt/oil/mud that it heretofore had gone unnoticed, and 
blocked.  You can bet I will make sure that sucker remains open from now on.

To quote Mr. Haynes.  "Reassembly is the reverse of removal."  Factory manual 
sez don't tighten up adjuster bolts right away.  turn adjuster so that shoes 
are firmly against hub and are centered.  Then tighten nuts.  Back off on 
adjuster a couple of clicks, and the hub should turn.  Lifting one wheel 
slightly off of the ground help in the adjustment process.  Or leave the prop 
shaft unhooked until brake is adjusted.  Just don't try it parked on a hill.  
Torque castellated nut to 85 ft/lb.

Good luck.

Scott Fugate
1970 IIA
1989 Range Rover

BT

------------------------------

From: Easton Trevor <TEASTON@DQC2.DOFASCO.CA>
Subject: EZ Bleed and Number Plates
Date: Thu, 31 Aug 95 08:30:00 DST

As posted previously, I used a modified reservior cap and small pump to 
pressurise the reservior which then allows you to go from wheel to wheel and 
bleed until fluid runs clear. Be sure to keep the fluid level up in the 
reservior or you'll be starting over with a system full of fresh air.  A 
really handy pump is the Mityvac kit which can be used  to suck or blow and 
has multiple uses outlined in the manual that comes with it. eg tune ups, 
brake servos, etc

If you are lucky maybe some of our British subscribers could send you old 
plates. An alternative is to purchase a new set from any one of various 
suppliers, see UK auto mags. This way you could even have a vanity plate!

Trevor Easton

------------------------------

From: Russell Burns <burns@cisco.com>
Subject: Oil issues
Date: Thu, 31 Aug 95 7:51:21 PDT

 Since filling sumps with oil is a major passtime for landrover owners.
I was wondering if any one had some easy/clean method for defying
gravity, and pumping oil into our beloved Land-Rovers.
My current method is to use a cheap plastic pump which tends to
blow the filler hose off, and takes a lot of arm work.

Any one out ther have an easier way ???

Thanks
Russ

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 31 Aug 95 08:00:30 MST
From: DEBROWN@SRP.GOV
Subject: Discovery A/C... Dual air.

FROM:  David Brown                           Internet: debrown@srp.gov
       Computer Graphics Specialist * Mapping Services & Engr Graphics
       PAB219 (602)236-3544 -  Pager:6486 External (602)275-2508 #6486
SUBJECT: Discovery A/C... Dual air.
Some have complained about the Discovery's A/C being "wimpy". Well, it's not
the best, (I live in Arizona where it gets to over 120 degrees F, 45
Celcius?) I had dual air, and noticed that with the rear A/C turned on, the
air blowing out of the front vents was not as cold as when the rear A/C was
turned off.

Just an observation...

#=======#                Never doubt that a small group of individuals
|__|__|__\___            can change the world... indeed, it's the only
| _|  |   |_ |}          thing that ever has.
"(_)""""""(_)"                                          -Margaret Mead

------------------------------

From: Andrew Grafton <A.J.Grafton@lut.ac.uk>
Subject: Welding LR chassis...
Date: Thu, 31 Aug 95 16:51:14 BST

I've drilled, cut and welded a few LR chassis now...

It certainly worked like mild steel.

Either that or *very* special high-carbon steel, that is stronger
than mild steel but retaining the same working properties!  
(I wish).

Attempt at explanation follows;  correct if wrong, anyone!

When welding anything you create a heat-effected region that will be
stronger but more brittle than the surrounding metal.  The more carbon
there is in the steel, the more this effect shows itself.
The heat-effected region causes stresses that can lead to premature
failure of the component, usually in the heat-effected but otherwise
unaltered material on either side of the weld itself...

Welding up high-carbon steel by any method is usually followed by
heat-treatment to relieve the residual stresses and return the metal
to its prior state with the carbon finely and evenly distributed 
within the iron.

I'm not sure how using MIG welding will alter this although MIG tends 
to heat the base metal less than stick welding, and is (depending on 
the operator) usually less likely to leave slag inclusions in the
weld.  If I wanted to weld hi-carbon steel without heat treatment, 
I'd consider using oxy-acetylene and letting it cool slowly.  Perhaps 
this is the wrong approach?

In summary, tho'

If your Landrover chassis isn't mild steel, I'd be surprised.
Even if it isn't, there must be half a million out there with
major chassis work undertaken with stick arc welding machines.
And mild steel rods.

Perhaps Landrover will confirm the chassis material?

All the best,

Andy
A.J.Grafton@lut.ac.uk

------------------------------

From: "Tom Rowe" <TROWE@AE.AGECON.WISC.EDU>
Date:          Thu, 31 Aug 1995 10:52:45 GMT -0600
Subject:       Re: Oil issues

 Russell Burns asks:
>  Since filling sumps with oil is a major passtime for landrover owners.
> I was wondering if any one had some easy/clean method for defying
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 7 lines)]
> blow the filler hose off, and takes a lot of arm work.
> Any one out ther have an easier way ???

Back when I did more automotive work than I do now, I got a couple of 
pumps for lube oil. One from Sears the other I don't remember where, 
but Central Tractor sells them I know. Also most auto parts houses 
can get them. They were about $20 US and fit on a 5gal pail of lube. 
I used them mostly for gear oil. They have a metal cover that replaces 
the pail lid. A extendable center tube fits down into the pail and 
has a manualy operated pump on the top. A hose about 5 feet long ends 
 in a u-shaped metal tube that fits nicely in filler holes. These will also fit 30 gal 
drums if you have *really* bad leaks.

Tom Rowe
UW-Madison Center for Dairy Research    
608-265-6194, Fax:608-262-1578        
trowe@ae.agecon.wisc.edu                

 Four wheel drive allows you to get
 stuck in places even more inaccessible.

------------------------------

From: hlapa@Zeus.signalcorp.com
Date: Thu, 31 Aug 95 11:28:30 EST
Subject: Discovery Rear A/C & Taillights

Just replaced the RH taillight assy on 95 Discovery.  It was 
necessary to undo the upper hinge points of the jumpseat -- 
no big deal, but your access to change a burnt out bulb is 
the same.  Seems like the rear A/C would make changing a 
bulb in the LH side even worse.  If the rear A/C is nothing 
more than some ductwork and a fan (no compressor), and since 
it forces LH jumpseat out into the cargo area several 
inches, I'm glad I didn't elect to get the rear A/C.

Hank

------------------------------

From: NADdMD@aol.com
Date: Thu, 31 Aug 1995 12:17:29 -0400
Subject: Dings in a new Galvinized Frame: Follow-up

Bother!
This is the second attempt at this note.  The first was eaten by the AOL mail
server.  No back up copy.

1.  I'd like to thank everyone who sent me input.  I learned a great deal
about frame evaluation.

2.  Last night I spent a fair amount of time measuring all the factory specs
on the frame, including diagonals.  In addition, I ran the frame with a
framing square looking for possible problems not detected by measurement
alone.  Today, I called my local garage (they work on ALL our vechicles from
the Ford tractor to the 1963 Dodge horse van to a 1986 Volkswagen GTI, to our
1994 Jeep Grand Cherokee.  They are presently doing some work on my 67 88"
SIIa.  They say "It's sorta like them old Jeeps we used ta see.  It's got
them front axles like Toyota uses.") I HIGHLY recommend them not only for
LR's but any other vehicle with a four stroke engine. (For anyone in the
Baltimore Region who wants their name/number, just e-mail me).  Their
opinion: " If it measures out to spec and is square, AND the damage is out at
the end of the support AND there's no visible damage to the galvinized
coating, don't worry about it."  In their experience, when done correctly,
galvinized heavy gauge steel can be pounded nearly to a 45 degree angle
without cracking the coating.  They also felt that in more cases than not,
minor damage was to be expected on chasses that are shipped.

3.  As for Atlantic British, I was quite satisfied with their response to
this whole situation.  They suggested without prompting that I check the
squareness and dimentsions of the frame.  Further, they faxed me the factory
specs.  They were not opposed at all to return of the frame or to the
possibility of replacement of outriggers which were damage.  All they asked
was to check the frame first.  In addition, they provided this all in writing
which they also faxed to me.  Again, I found their customer service very
acceptable.  

4.  AB imports the frame from England, it came with my brake drum shipment.

5.  Boring MD is in northern Baltimore County, up where foxhunting is avidly
pursued.

Again, I'd like to thank everyone for their comments, they're much
appreciated.
Look for my future postings as my restoration progresses.

Nate Dunsmore
Rocking Horse Farm
Boring MD (Baltimore County) USA
NADdMD@aol.com
(410)429-4964

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 31 Aug 95 12:52:07 EDT
From: jib@big.att.com (Jan Ben)
Subject: importing from UK - info in Bristol Needed.  

Hello, 

I am importing a vehicle from UK to US.   I am getting it at Avon LandRovers
in Bristol.  A recent post on this group led to some unfavorable comments
about the Avon integrity.
? Do you have any experience with them?

Do you know any LR fans in Bristol, who might be willing to take a quick
look (if nothing else, to confirm that all work was done as described)?

I am getting the AA or RAC to give me a report, can you recommend a better/
cheaper alternative?

Any help is greatly appreciated, as I need to resolve this one way or the
other in the next couple of days.

Jan
jib@big.att.com
(908)872-9641 

PS. Ian, thanks for your advice.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 31 Aug 1995 19:38:16 +0200
From: vortex@worldaccess.nl (Bert Palte)
Subject: Life-time Tool Warranty

Hello fellow readers,

Though the following does not relate specifically to British cars, you may
find it amusing to read.

In 1970 I bought my first car, a rather rusty small vehicle of French origin,
a Renault R4 of 1963.
Almost everything needed attention or replacement, including most
of the bodywork. 
Mechanical work was also involved, especially on the brakes and the suspension.
It was already clear to me, then (at the age of 17 - a year before being able
to attend driving lessons) that working on cars would probably become a 
lifetime commitment. So, I started buying  tools whenever they were required.

One of the tools I bought then was an open  10 x 11 mm ring spanner by Belzer. 
You need such a special tool to unscrew the brake pipe from a brake cylinder
(there simply is no other way to do the job properly). 

A few weeks ago I helped one of my colleagues with a brake job on his 
Nissan Vanette. I saw him put this same spanner on a brake line nipple - 
and one of the jaws broke off.
The same guy told me then that there was a lifetime warranty on Belzer, so, 
just to see what would happen, I went back to the store where I bought it 
about 25 years ago.
(No, no, I could _not_ find the bill any more...).

They told me that, in principle, this lifetime warranty thing was true,
but they could'nt help me because they since had changed to selling a different
manufacturers' products.

So I decided to mail the tool directly to Belzer in Germany to see if, and how, 
they would react. This was about four weeks ago.

Much to my surprise, I received a telefax from them today, a very nice letter 
stating that they had investigated my claim. 
(Without formally confirming or denying the warranty claim - they just didn't
mention it) they are going to send me a new one, free of charge...
.. and hoping that il will serve me equally well over a similar period of
time...

Thanks, Belzer!

Bert Palte
Soest, The Netherlands

(Yes, of course, I have another one, in 3/8"  x 7/16" size,  for my British
cars).

(Disclaimer: I have no personal interests in B.)

------------------------------

From: Jeff Gauvin <jeffg@minerva.ncrmicro.ncr.com>
Subject: '94 D90 Limited...?
Date: Thu, 31 Aug 95 11:38:38 MDT

Anthony Verriello <verriello_anthony@jpmorgan.com> asks:

>Can anyone tell me if there is a way to identify a 94 D90
>originally set up as a limited production black/leather or
>one thats been painted and had leather installed?

Not exactly, but...

When I first started looking at the '94 D90 that I eventually
bought, the salesman told me it was a "limited", but he never
mentioned it again after that. Mine is optioned as follows:

  Alloy wheels (obviously)
  Hardtop (probably not part of the "limited" package)
  Rear safari cage
  Beluga Black Paint
  Leather front and rear seats
  Spare tire cover
  Aluminum fender protection plates
  Chrome "A-frame" front bumper guard w/2 Hella-500 lights

Mine is #1930, which is only 28 away from a '95 I've seen mentioned here
in the digest (jpappa), so mine was definitely near the end of the '94
production run.  Until you (Anthony Verriello) mentioned it, I'd never
heard anybody else talk of the "limited" D90, other than the one
reference by the salesman, and we all know they'll say anything...

How many were made?  Were they the last '94s made?  Does it sound like I
have one?  If so, so what?

My "limited" didn't cost extra.  In fact, because LRNA was trying to get
rid of remaining '94s to make room for the '95s, I got $$$$ off the
sticker; drove away for just under $30K !

--
Jeffrey J. Gauvin

------------------------------

From: Alan Richer/CAM/Lotus <Alan_Richer/CAM/Lotus.LOTUS@crd.lotus.com>
Date: 31 Aug 95 14:06:33 EDT
Subject: Re: Uncle Joe Strikes Again!

1. Replace the flasher unit. You probably are getting some
current feedback through its heating coil or a funky contact.

2. Re: The Thing From 20,000 Fathoms:

  Don't all LR owners look like that?

  Tongue in cheek... -Alan

------------------------------

Subject: Re: Funny Questions...
From: paul@frcs.alt.za (Paul Nash)
Date: Thu, 31 Aug 1995 07:43:52 +1000

>      I have a question from David Bobeck..."Does anyone have any secrets 
>      for keeping there Rover from tipping over it's "High-Lift" jack when 
>      lifting from the front bumper?"

A couple of large-ish rocks placed in front of (or behind) the rear
wheels will do the trick.  Because the handbrake acts on the prop
shaft, the rear wheels are free to turn in opposite directions, 
which is what happens when the jack topples.  Chock the wheels and
it won't topple.

The toppling action is a feature, not a bug, BTW.  It is useful for
getting a stuck vehicle out of deep ruts (lift & topple at front and
rear).

	paul
--
   Paul Nash <paul@frcs.alt.za>       turbo-nerd & all-round nice guy
       14/114 Blamey Cres, Campbell, Canberra ACT 2601, AUSTRALIA

------------------------------

From: Alan Richer/CAM/Lotus <Alan_Richer/CAM/Lotus.LOTUS@crd.lotus.com>
Date: 31 Aug 95 14:13:28 EDT
Subject: Re: Welding Land Rover chassis...

Re: MIG vs. stick welding:

Rover chassis are relatively common mild steel. The rule I've always
followed with this stuff is to hit it with a magnet. If it sticks, stick-weld is
OK. If not, then find out what it is and go from there.

Personally, I have a MIG I use as a wire-feed (gasless) welder for
chassis repairs. Hasn't boken yet... -Alan

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 31 Aug 95 14:56:44 EST
From: "Bobeck, David R." <dbobeck@ushmm.org>
Subject: Re: company's address (British Leyland)

This came from a friend at work- DB
Thought you might find all this interesting, particularly
          the WWW address at bottom.  (Forwarded from
          STUMPERS-LIST).
                                   --BillC

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

In response to Mai Po~ldaas' question:

< we have a patron who is interested of address of British Leyland
< Public Limited Company. Can you somebody help, please?

Rose-Ann Movsovic responds:

< To cut a very long story short (which would involve the entire history of
< the ailing British car industry), suffice it to say that the company which
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 6 lines)]
< is owned by British Aerospace, unlike most other "British" car companies
< which are owned by US or French companies)

< Rover Group Ltd
< International House
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 6 lines)]
< B37 7HQ
< UK

Since I am the resident Rover W*mb*t, this calls for an update correction. 

While British Aerospace acquired the Rover Group in 1988, they sold it 
last year to BMW.  Honda, which had a 40% interest in the company and 
marketed Land Rover Discovery in Japan under their badge, was also 
interested in taking over the Rover Group, but was so miffed by BMW's 
successful bid that they sold all their interest.

Land Rover, the 4WD division of the Rover Group, has been since its 
founding in 1948, immensely successful (more so today than ever), and its 
profits have often been used to prop up the ailing car division.

The Rover Group has an official home page at http://www.rover.co.uk
but so far it consists only of engineering employment opportunities.
The Personnel Dept address:
 Gaydon Test Centre
 Banbury Road
 Lghthorne
 Warwickshire CV35 ORG

Land Rover Ltd is at Lode Lane, Solihull, Warwickshire.  This was the site
of the original Rover car factory, but has for some time been devoted
solely to Land Rover. 

Some other web addresses:
http://sun1.bham.ac.uk/D.Hejcman.mes/ROVER/rover.html
(an unofficial Rover Group page, showing locations of all Rover plants 
and operations).

http://www.du.edu/~tomills/landrover.html
(links to all known Land Rover and Rover Group web sites, and a history 
of Land Rover)

http://www.du.edu/~tomills/lrtfm.html
(a picture of me and my Land Rover)

T.(eutonic) F.(ourwheeler) Mills
tomills@du.edu                               University of Denver Library
http://www.du.edu/~tomills                          Denver  CO 80208  USA

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 31 Aug 95 12:33:55 PDT
From: Bennett Leeds <bennett@mv.us.adobe.com>
Subject: Re: Discovery Questions (was: Newbie Questions)

I am inches away from purchasing a Discovery. I've got two questions:

1) The dealer is offerring a 100K mile/7 year bumper to bumper  
extended warranty from GE, with a $50 deductible. He says it's $1500,  
but naturally I expect that reflects at least a 100%, if not more,  
markup. How much do think this is worth?

2) I drive dark moutain raods at night regularly, and so want to put  
"fog" lamps on. To do this on a '95 I either need to get a belly pan  
for $150 or get a brush bar and attach them to that. Any thoughts?  
The brush bar is $575 from the parts department - don't know what the  
dealer wants for it. Someone mentioned the '96s will have a fog lamp  
option. Considering the price involved to get the lights should I  
wait for the '96s?

Also, I've got dealer invoice on the car and factory options from  
Edmunds, but not on the dealer added things like brush bars, etc. If  
you know them and can share them with me, I'd appreciate it much.

Thanks!
- Bennett Leeds
bennett@mv.us.adobe.com

------------------------------

From: kirkwood@strider.fm.intel.com (Clayton Kirkwood)
Date: Thu, 31 Aug 1995 13:16:14 -0700
Subject: Re: Discovery Questions (was: Newbie Questions)

On Aug 31, 12:33pm, Bennett Leeds wrote:
> Subject: Re: Discovery Questions (was: Newbie Questions)
> To change subscription write to: Majordomo@Land-Rover.Team.Net
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 20 lines)]
> option. Considering the price involved to get the lights should I
> wait for the '96s?

Perhaps you saw my "testimony" about the brush bar vs deer. As with most
anything posted these days, I received a fair amount of flack from an offroad
list for being totally insensitive to the plight of deer (and who cares about
my ongoing living family). I would suggest getting one. Besides, it lends a
certain style to the already cool car.

> Also, I've got dealer invoice on the car and factory options from
> Edmunds, but not on the dealer added things like brush bars, etc. If
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 9 lines)]
> bennett@mv.us.adobe.com
>-- End of excerpt from Bennett Leeds

-- 
Clayton R. Kirkwood, FM1-58, 916 356-5838

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 31 Aug 95 17:05:50 EST
From: lenagham@bachman.com
Subject: Aftermarket EFI info

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 31 Aug 1995 18:00:57 -0400
From: bbonner@mail.htp.com (Brian Bonner)
Subject: D90 oil change

Sounds like a silly post huh? Well, today was the first time I changed the
oil on my D90 myself. What a mess!! When I took out the drain plug the oil
shot over 3 feet ouyt of the whole! It bounced off my drivers side tire and
made quite a mess. Is there some trick I have missed? I used to be an
auto-mechanic about 10 years ago and I have changed alot of oil. I can't do
another oil change like this one. I live in a condo and making a mess in the
parking lot is a big no no. I cleaned it all up with kitty litter. It also
tool 7 qts of oil. My book said 6. Any way I would appreciate any help.
                                        
                                   -=>Brian<=-

------------------------------

From: GARCAY@aol.com
Date: Thu, 31 Aug 1995 18:58:05 -0400
Subject: Re: The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest

Hello All !

I have a friend who is currently rebuilding a Rover and is looking for :
   INDIVIDUAL REAR JUMP SEATS (FOUR) S11-S111 88 
   STATION WAGON (not bench seats)

Anyone who has a set of four for sale or trade will be greatly received !!!
If you know where a set can be purchased for not too much money, I would
greatly appreciate knowing where.

Thanks!!

George Arcay (for Greg Long)
Alexandria, Va.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 31 Aug 95 16:43:02 -0500
From: "John B. Friedman" <johannes@scribes.english.uiuc.edu>
Subject: Unisyn dual carb tool FS

Thanks to all who have helped me clean my shelves of old tools. But  
there at the back is a Unisyn, designed for dual Solexes or SU's or  
whatever where you need to read and match the vacuum on two separate  
throats. This is a real piece of 60's-70's automotive history and I  
have tuned many a MG sprite, Porsche, dual Weber and Solex set up  
with it. Heavy die casting with a rubber seal on a plate about 2  
inches in dia. which sits on the top of carb. A float in a glass tube  
reads the vac and you go from one carb to the other. I will take  
25.00 and include shipping on it. 

	The piston ring compressor seemes still to be for sale too. 

		John Friedman 

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 1 Sep 1995 07:24:18 +0800 (WST)
From: TONY YATES  <tonyy@waalpha.wa.BoM.GOV.AU>
Subject: Child restraints

Anyone had any experience fitting child restraints into the back seat of 
a LWB, particularly 110 County?

Thanks.

==========================================================
                                      ()  (  )      ()
Tony Yates                           (  ) (   )    (  )
Bureau of Meteorology               (    )(    ) (      )
Port Hedland                       (       )   )(        )
Western Australia                 (          ) ) --------
                                   ------------
ph:  (091) 401 350                 \\\**\\**\
fax: (091) 401 100                   \***\*\
                                       \\*\
email: A.Yates@bom.gov.au                \\

==========================================================

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 31 Aug 1995 20:13:18 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Francis J. Twarog" <ftwarog@moose.uvm.edu>
Subject: 109 stuff.

	Does anyone in New England know of or have a pair of door posts 
for a 109 station wagon - they are the only things we're really lacking 
for the resto project that starts next week (plus and engine, though) - 
the "t" posts, by the way.  Again, it will be for sale or could be built 
to one's specification...

Frank Twarog
Burlington, VT

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 31 Aug 95 16:43:02 -0500
From: "John B. Friedman" <johannes@scribes.english.uiuc.edu>
Subject: Unisyn dual carb tool FS

Thanks to all who have helped me clean my shelves of old tools. But  
there at the back is a Unisyn, designed for dual Solexes or SU's or  
whatever where you need to read and match the vacuum on two separate  
throats. This is a real piece of 60's-70's automotive history and I  
have tuned many a MG sprite, Porsche, dual Weber and Solex set up  
with it. Heavy die casting with a rubber seal on a plate about 2  
inches in dia. which sits on the top of carb. A float in a glass tube  
reads the vac and you go from one carb to the other. I will take  
25.00 and include shipping on it. 

	The piston ring compressor seemes still to be for sale too. 

		John Friedman 

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 31 Aug 1995 17:13:50 +0100
From: cs@crl.com (Michael Carradine)
Subject: Re: Discovery Questions

 Clayton Kirkwood <kirkwood@strider.fm.intel.com> writes:

>Perhaps you saw my "testimony" about the brush bar vs deer. As with most
 anything posted these days, I received a fair amount of flack from an offroad
 list for being totally insensitive to the plight of deer (and who cares about
 my ongoing living family). I would suggest getting one.

 Now Clayton, certainly I didn't want to hurt your feelings by offering
 another perspective to your 'testimony'.  We all like you and your's very
 much and are glad you're safe from the attack of that mean deer!  (I already
 said I was 'Just Jealous', didn't I?)

 While you're outfitting your Disco with protective devices giving you the
 confidence to continue speeding around Georgetown country roads Sunday
 mornings, consider that you may have been just lucky *this time*, nothing
 more!  Next time, while turning to your wife at 60 mph, it may be a child
 on a bike caught in your bull bar; or maybe just another deer which next
 time jumps on your bonnet and comes through the windscreen.  Forgive me, but
 somehow it makes me ill to think of all these nice vehicles needing armour
 to manage highway obstacles.  I always thought of Rovers as slow and easy
 going trucks, recognizing obstacles ahead and effecting a defensive maneuver
 like slowing down and stopping, but then that's just me!

 It's not the bar that's alarming, it's the change in driver attitude that's
 frightening.  I'm not concerned about a few deer, there seems to be an
 overpopulation of them in California anyway (they were probably teenages
 anyway crowding the bank daring each other to jump... you know the type! :)

>Besides, it lends a certain style to the already cool car.

 How can you tell how cool the car is after attaching the bull bar?  All of
 these type of off-highway vehicles look more alike by adding bull bars (as
 do passenger vehicles with bras!).  Are we now supposed to recognize
 vehicles by the type of bull bar they have on?  One thing that always
 impressed me by Range Rovers was how civilized they looked when cleaned up
 and driven in the city, certainly not by carrying around the iron gate to
 the pasture on the front bumper.

 Happy holidays (for the US!  Others, well...),

 Michael Carradine, Architect                          Ph/Fax 510-988-0900
 Carradine Studios, PO Box 494, Walnut Creek, CA 94597 USA    <cs@crl.com>
 _________________________________________________________________________
 Mercedes-Benz Unimog 4x4 WWW page at:  http://www.crl.com/~cs/unimog.html

------------------------------

From: JCassidyiv@aol.com
Date: Thu, 31 Aug 1995 22:07:07 -0400
Subject: Oiling Frames

I know someone posted a message regarding spraying "bar and chain" chainsaw
oil onto their frame.  What kind of sprayer are you using-can you use just a
simple plastic garden-type pressure sprayer.  We're hurtling into fall and
I'd like to spray the frame soon-anything for a little extra protection.
Cheers,  John Cassidy

------------------------------

From: jpappa01@interserv.com
Date: Thu, 31 Aug 95 20:53:18 PDT
Subject: Re: 	Misc.

- A lot on D90 hood latches. Similar to hoopla on D110 hood latches. Yes, one 
problem is convoluted path that cable takes. Main problem is internal wire 
inside outer jacket is some sort of mild steel which, yes, *CORRODES!* Just 
received a bulletin from LRNA that newest cable assy's feature *STAINLESS* 
inner wire in addition to `95 models being easier to pull anyway... These 
should be easy to retro to `94 models and if you're in for warranty 
replacement be sure to ask for the stainless one...

- Have driven three Grand Cherokees which were traded with LRMW lately - and 
couldn't believe how loose (all were `93 models - two Laredos and one Limited 
- all V8s) and tinny they felt. All rattled, creaked and groaned. The highest 
mileage one was 41,000. The lowest? 650 miles!!! On a GC Limited Orvis 
edition. Traded on a Disco. The wife absolutely despised the Jeep - they had 
originally traded their `90 Rangey on the Orvis!! So it was no surprise that 
they came back to auntie Rover...

- Latest Land Rover Gear item is a really neat Gerber multi-purpose tool which 
comes in a slick black ballistic nylon sheath with LR logo sewn-in. This is a 
cool tool! At all LR Centres...

cheerz
Jim - Rover and out

`67 2A 88 5.0L hybrid
`67 2A 109 5.0L hybrid
`68 2B 110 F/C Diesel
`70 P6B 3500S
`90 Range Rover County
`93 D110 (#457/500)
`95 D90 #1958

------------------------------

From: iharper@afm.org
Subject: Zenith Jets
Date: Fri, 01 Sep 95 00:20:27 EST

Further to the discussion about Zenith Carbs and altitude changes, what 
are the correct jets for different altitudes?  (i.e. at sea level, 1000ft, 
2000ft, 3000 etc.)  Is the main jet the only one that needs to be changed 
or should all be changed?

Since I now understand that you cannot change the mixture in a Zenith 
without changing the jets, is it possible, while travelling through 
mountainous regions to temporarily compensate for the richer condition of 
the higher altitude?  Should you jet it for the higher altitude and then 
just put the choke on as you descend??

Ian Harper, Stratford, Ontario.... iharper@afm.org

---
 This copy of Freddie 1.2.5 is being evaluated.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 31 Aug 1995 21:27:59 -0700
From: Roger Sinasohn <sinasohn@crl.com>
Subject: Re: Plasti-Dip

> I'm giving some serious thought to trying an appliance epoxy on mine,
> just to givi it a stable coating, thn blowing a few dollars on a leather
> cover... yuppie wimp that I am...<grin>

I'm going to go for one of those thick rubber covers with all the bumps on 
it.  As I get older, gripping the thin steering wheel causes some serious 
stiffness and pain in my fingers, and I think the resulting thickness will be 
pleasing.  The other advantage is that they just slip on -- no lacing 
required.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Uncle Roger                         "There is pleasure pure in being mad
sinasohn@crl.com                                that none but madmen know."
Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates
San Francisco, California

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 31 Aug 1995 21:28:04 -0700
From: Roger Sinasohn <sinasohn@crl.com>
Subject: Re: Tyres and tubes

>     I just bought 5 brand-new 16" Land Rover Genuine wheels (well, OK,
>     Dunlop makes 'em, but they came with a Land Rover piece of cardboard

Hmmm!  So, do you think they might be available direct from Dunlop?  As in, 
like, here in the states?  Like, Affordable???

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Uncle Roger                         "There is pleasure pure in being mad
sinasohn@crl.com                                that none but madmen know."
Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates
San Francisco, California

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 31 Aug 1995 21:27:48 -0700
From: Roger Sinasohn <sinasohn@crl.com>
Subject: Re: Rear seats in Series LRs

> The rear seat from an old-style Suzuki jeep (the ones that kept falling
> over going round corners) fits perfectly between the rear side boxes,
> creating a forward-looking seat for 2!  Some short work with a hacksaw 

Or, I suppose it could be fitted directly behind the front seats, facing 
backwards...  (Better, perhaps, in a 109.)

> Yup, our LR now has Suzuki donor parts (Aaargh!).  The seat back even

Well, at least there should be no problem in finding wrecked vehicles in 
scrapyards, eh?

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Uncle Roger                         "There is pleasure pure in being mad
sinasohn@crl.com                                that none but madmen know."
Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates
San Francisco, California

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 31 Aug 1995 21:44:24 +0100
From: cs@crl.com (Michael Carradine)
Subject: Re: Misc.

 Jim <jpappa01@interserv.com> writes:

>- Latest Land Rover Gear item is a really neat Gerber multi-purpose tool which 
 comes in a slick black ballistic nylon sheath with LR logo sewn-in. This is a 
 cool tool! At all LR Centres...

 Gerber makes good stuff, a 'merican company, although they were bought out by
 Solingen or somebody.

>`67 2A 88 5.0L hybrid
 `67 2A 109 5.0L hybrid
 `68 2B 110 F/C Diesel
 `70 P6B 3500S
 `90 Range Rover County
 `93 D110 (#457/500)
 `95 D90 #1958

 Think you have enough Rovers there?  One for every day of the week!

-Michael Carradine
 cs@crl.com

------------------------------

  END OF LAND ROVER OWNER DIGEST 
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