Land Rover Owner Message Digest Contents

[ First Message Last | Table of Contents | <- Digest -> Archive Index | <- Browser -> ]

The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest

Send Submissions

Subject: forwarded
Date: Wed, 04 Jan 95 05:13:03 -0500
From: William Caloccia <caloccia@sw.stratus.com>

------- Forwarded Message

	id WAA15043; Tue, 3 Jan 1995 22:25:16 -0500
Date: 03 Jan 95 22:23:23 EST
From: "WILLIAM  L. LEACOCK" <75473.3572@compuserve.com>
Subject: Various
Message-ID: <950104032322_75473.3572_FHQ48-1@CompuServe.COM>

 Overdrives, the Spanish version was previously marketed by Bearmach, it is a
copy of the Fairy design , many of the parts are simlar to but not always
interchangeable with the fairy. I bought a Fairey ( now called superwinch from
Craddocks a couple of months back.

 Alternators. The windings in the Lucas alternators are generally very good, the
rectifier and the voltage regulators are not so good, when I worked in the
aircraft industry our technicians used to make thier own  assemblies for
rectification and regulation which were very good with the standard windings .

regulators, there are also a lot of cheap imitations on the market , usually
used by the reconditioning trade, for reconditioning read, clean of the thick
muck, fit replacement diodes and brushes and regulator, if necessary put some
grease in the bearings or maybe even replace them.

Speedometers. Most of the cars made by the former British Leyland Group used
speedos manufactured by Smiths, sometimes badged as Jaeger, the part number
written round the dial; somewhere has 3 or 4 numbers at the end. this number
represents the number of revolutions per mile of  the input , for example the
swb LR has the number 1500 ( some have 1503) on a vehicle with 7.50 tyres this
number changes to 1400 because of the increased circumference of the tyres, they
make fewer revolutions per mile. Thus if you change the gearing an acurate
speedo can be found by looking round other vehicles for one with a better
number,or now you know how to tell the difference between an 88 and a 109
speedo. It is often possible to find speedos suitable for LR's fitted to other
cars, some with trip meters, some with higher speed ranges for the fast boys,
the chrome bezels can be interchanged for the posers, in addition some of the
auxiliary 3 in instruments can yield some good additional instrumentation. If
you are having trouble with a speedo it is surprising how many common parts
there are, there are only a few fixed ratio's, from memory I have seen 750,
1000, 1100, 1250, 1350, 1400 and 1500.

 Whilst on the subject of instrumentation, whenever you have problems with oil
pressure or with oil or water temperature always check the accuracy of the gauge
first, automotive instruments are not generally of good quality and the
calibration is poor, particularly the electrical types. I recommend using a
calibrated Bourdon  tube type pressure gauge with a pipe connection in parallel
with the electrical instument to check the acuracy. ( if you are not sure about
the acuracy of the gauge do not rely too heavily on the local garages air line
because they are also notorious for being inacurate. On the temperature gauge I
recomend removal of the sender unit and with the 12 volt supply and an earth
wire fitted drop  it into a kettle of boiling water, on the boil you should see
100 deg c or the red line. Normal rad systems run at pressure so the boiling
point is higher than 100, it also depends on the antifreeze strength, but
calibrating for 100 ( or 212 is safest ). My first RR in which I siezed the
engine after only  2 weeks of ownership had an instrument which read N  all the
time, after the engine siezed and I tested it i found that at the 2nd leg of the
N the temperature was 100 deg C Take my advise and test yours!!.

 On one occasion I tried 22 different sender units before I found one that gave
me an accurate reading on the gauge,

 More diversions. 2 1/4 oil pressure. As above check the instrument, oil
pressure switches are also poor indicators of actual pressure,  The main
bearings , particularly the centre one are a comon source of pressure drop, the
timing chain adjuster when it is taking up the slack for a badly worn timing
chain can also be the source of pressure loss. When inspecting the pump I
recommend the re seating of the pressure relief ball, to do this glue a similar
sized ball to a piece of tube and using valve grinding paste lap in the seat.
ensure that you clean out the ports thoroughly afterwards. Stretching the spring
a little will increase the relief load a little.

I read with concern all the writings on emission testing etc, does a 67 or
earlier still have to pass the tests over here ?

 I have a good spare parts list from 1967 and 1970 for the Lucas equipment
covering starters alternators dynamoes, lights, regulators windscreen wiper
motors distributors  etc,
  Happy New Year. Bill

------- End of Forwarded Message

------------------------------

Date: 04 Jan 95 10:03:49 EST
From: "Stefan R. Jacob" <100043.2400@compuserve.com>
Subject: Re: Used Range Rover caveats?

I gather you'll be buying your car in Texas, so I guess I can skip the part 
about where to look for rust and corrosion.

One of our club members who makes a living with a non-licenced LR parts
mail order business and also does some occasional used car dealings has
these observations to make about used Range Rovers:
The most frequent and costly damage in such vehicles are - sometimes
substantial - damages in the drive train that can extend all the way from
the front half-axle constant velocity bearings via propshaft joints to
the gearbox itself, automatics being more susceptible than manuals. 
Diffs are rarely affected. There are three main reasons for such damages
that can be found even in relatively new vehicles:
Main cause is the wrong use (or abuse) of the central diff-lock. Range
Rover owners, who are rarely off-roaders (would you believe), are notorious
for hastely slamming into diff-lock as soon as it starts raining and the
road gets a *bit* slippery, at freeway speeds, and they'll drive like this
for hours. This habit obviously wreaks havoc on the drivetrain. Even off-road,
unwise use of the diff-lock can be fatal. Given the brute power of the V8,
if in 1st or 2nd low with a wide throttle opening and the diff locked, 
just one of the wheels is blocked for even for a second, the damage to the 
drivetrain is immediate.
The next two causes are oil-related: RR-gearboxes, unlike those of the 
'Series', *don't leak* and are sealed tight (incredible but true), _however_ 
they have and need two vents, one for the main box, the other for the 
transfer case. These are two thin plastic hoses that run from the top of the 
casings up front into the engine bay where they are suspended rather close to 
the exaust manifold. If by accident or negligence these vent hoses are torn 
out of their suspensions they will drop onto the manifold, melt and close up,
the pressure in the gearboxes rises, and - pow! - out come the seals :-o , 
leading to oil loss. Rapid oil loss also occurs when the hand brake is 
adjusted too tight (a fault frequently perpetrated by garages), the RR is 
run with partially engaged hand brake (which you most likely won't notice 
with the power of the V8) and the hand brake drum becomes red hot to the 
extent that it melts down the rear transfer case seal. Since Range Rover 
owners, unlike the Series-folks, *never* crawl under their car regularly 
to check out the state of their 90-weight, such oil loss usually goes 
unnoticed, the vehicle is driven over extended periods with little or no oil 
in the gear box, and again the result is a severely damaged drivetrain.

So, when you test drive a Range, close all windows, turn off radio, 
ventilation and air conditioning, and *listen*. In high ratio with disengaged
diff-lock, the Range Rover gearbox should be absolutely silent. Any whining,
rumbling or grinding is a warning sign. Next test, come to a stop, turn the 
steering to full lock, and drive off accelerating sharply. Does the car
pull away smoothly, or do the front wheels behave irregularly like jumping
or wobbling or making the steering wheel jerk? If so, there's something
wound up in the front part of the drivetrain. Finally - this involves getting
a bit dirty - get underneath, open the oil filler plugs of both main gearbox
and transfer case and stick your finger in, feeling down into the casing.
Your finger should come out all wet and shiny from clear red or amber -
colored oil. If it comes out black and sticky - thanks.
Also, don't forget to check the state of the brake pads; more likely than
not they'll be completely down. Electronics: Usually no problem.

Wish you luck...

Stefan
<Stefan R. Jacob, 100043.2400@CompuServe.com>

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 4 Jan 1995 10:10:18 -0500
From: Jimmy Patrick <jimmyp@cksp.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: sacul (lucas backwards)

Mike,

>Get the battery checked to begin with. Yes, you can get a hand-crank. Fits
>through the hole in the bumper.

Where can I get one of those cranks....

I'll start with the battery and then I will follow your advice. I can't
remember if the oil lights were on or not after I threw the key switch. I
don't have a charge light, though, I do have a meter that shows whether it
is charging or not. The last time I drove it the meter was on -25 which is
about as far as it can go from charging. The meter is a bit screwy though
because sometimes it goes more positive when you turn on the dash light or
the heater or... whatever, I would expect the meter to go more negative
when you add more lights or whatever. It does have an alternator, not a
dynamo.

It may be some of the last bit you mentioned, about the elctrical genius
rewiring the thing so as to confuse and befuddle me.

AHHHHH Land-Rovers. I knew I wanted one of these for some reason. My
co-workers believe it would make a great flower pot.

Thanks for your help,

Jimmy

--

CKS|Partners                                            0344-382114
Advertising & Marketing Communications            fax   0344-303192
                                                  

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 4 Jan 1995 10:06:57 -0600
From: hiner@MAIL.UTEXAS.EDU (Greg Hiner)
Subject: RoverWeb may need to move

Though it is not final yet the RoverWeb may need to move to a new home. If
somebody has got space I would be happy to ftp the whole set of files to
them. Think about it and let me know if you are interested.

The RoverWeb gets about 200 requests a day. It is running on a Macintosh
right now.

Best-

Greg

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 4 Jan 1995 17:14:10 +0200 (METDST)
From: S|ren Vels Christensen <velssvch@inet.uni-c.dk>
Subject: Re: Oil pressure problems... reply.

On Tue, 3 Jan 1995 DEBROWN@SRP.GOV wrote:

> FROM:  David Brown                          Internet: debrown@srp.gov
>        Computer Graphics Specialist * Mapping Services & Engr Graphics
>        PAB219 (602)236-3544 -  Pager:6486 External (602)275-2508 #6486
> SUBJECT: Oil pressure problems... reply.
> Greg Brown,
[snip] 
> With (I forget exactly) around 40 psi at idle, that doesn't sound like a
> oil pump problem. When your pressure drops as the angle of your vehicle
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 8 lines)]
> the vehicle is at an angle, maybe yours are missing, or became
> dislodged???
ad 3.:
I had the pan of recently. There is a lateral plate inside with a hole to
the rear where the pump tube is. But of course, it only withholds the oil
if the oil is in the pan.
(Yesterday my oil warning light went on when braking. I had brakelight 
trouble a couple of months ago and i thought i might have wired something
wrong until i topped 2 l of oil. At least the warning light didn't 
flicker :-) )
> If it were me, I'd first check the oil level. If the dipstick reads
> full, drain the oil and measure the quantity removed. If that's okay,
> I'd drop the pan and look for a loose pick-up tube, or.... ???
> Anyone else have any suggestions?
> "in" the oil at an angle. 3.) I've read about oil baffles within some

Clean and check the pump/net/filter anyway. Wouldn't hurt. 

> Dave Brown (I like your last name!) '94 Discovery (for sale. :( ) Phoenix AZ
> #=======#                Never doubt that a small group of individuals
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 8 lines)]
> | _|  |   |_ |           thing that ever has.
> "(_)""""""(_)"                                          -Margaret Mead
sv/aurens
velssvch@inet.uni-c.dk

------------------------------

From: Russell Burns <burns@cisco.com>
Subject: Re: D-90 hardtop
Date: Wed, 4 Jan 95 8:25:47 PST

> Headliner eh, did that also help with the noise? I get quite the echo off all
> that fiberglass when the radio is on. 
none
The real reason for the headliner is that on those 0 F days the fiberglass
is real cold next to my thinning hair.

I think it helps with the noise also.

The dynomat I plastered all over the interior body helped tremdously.

I also noted that none of the R-Rovers or Discover owners out east would
wave back. 

Russ
94 D-90
91 RANGE ROVER (which goes off road)

------------------------------

Subject: Re: D-90 hardtop 
Date: Wed, 04 Jan 1995 08:44:12 -0800
From: Mike Fredette <mfredett@ichips.intel.com>

Russ,

The dynomat I plastered all over the interior body helped tremdously.

I also noted that none of the R-Rovers or Discover owners out east would
wave back. 

	I did the same thing, dynomat inside the doors, 1/4 inch accumat
under the floormats and under the entire rear bed liner, and 1 inch foil lined
dynomat under the hood. It made a huge difference.
	Yea, those Range Rover/Disco folk, they tend to forget where thier roots
are. That or they just plain don't know that they are driving decendants of 
greatness.
							Rgds
							Mike Fredette
							D90
							90 Range Rover County (wifes)

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 04 Jan 1995 12:43:05 -0500
From: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney)
Subject: Jimmy's Charging problem

Jimmy writes:    

none
Where can I get one of those cranks....
none

1st look behind your seats towards the bottom.  It may be there (if it is, 
don't feel bad.  My neigbor thought his was missing until I pointed it out.
If not any LR parts supplier would have them.

none
I don't have a charge light, though, I do have a meter that shows whether it
is charging or not. The last time I drove it the meter was on -25 which is
about as far as it can go from charging. ... It does have an alternator, not a
dynamo.
none

BINGO!!!  Actually, you do have a charging light.  If you have an early IIA 
with ammeter in the instrument cluster (amps/fuel), it is located at the lower 
left hand corner of the instrument panel.  If you have a later IIA where the 
ammeter is an add on it is located at the bottom of the instrument cluster 
(fuel/temp).  If you have a III, it is located at the bottom of the instrument 
cluster (fuel/temp).  

All Land Rovers have a charging light.  If it is burned out/missing, your 
alternator/generator will not charge.  The light should come on when you turn 
the key to indicate all is well, then go out once the engine is started and 
running (and charging).  

I'm not certain, but you might try to undo the instrument cluster, pull that 
bulb, then see if you can match it with another bulb in the system. It may 
have a match and get you going.

Good Luck

Bill

maloney@wings.attmail.com
(Sorry, I couldn't post you direct-my mail package eats the addresses once 
they've gone through the LRO list)

                                                  

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 4 Jan 1995 18:39:48 +0200 (METDST)
From: S|ren Vels Christensen <velssvch@inet.uni-c.dk>
Subject: Re: Jimmy's Charging problem

[stuff snipped]

On Wed, 4 Jan 1995, maloney wrote:
> I don't have a charge light, though, I do have a meter that shows whether it
> BINGO!!!  Actually, you do have a charging light.  If you have an early IIA 
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 18 lines)]
> bulb, then see if you can match it with another bulb in the system. It may 
> have a match and get you going.

Mr Lucas (or one of his deciples) precision manufactured the sIII charge
light so that it will fall away from the panel back into the wirepit when 
hitting a class 3 hole in the city tarmac. If you find it in there, bend the 
little teeth a bit away from the bulb and reinsert it. You can only do this
a few times before the teeth break. If you glue it on, the bulb will most
definitely go shortly after.
As far as i remember (HA!) the bulb is similar to the instrument back light.

FWIW

sv/aurens
velssvch@inet.uni-c.dk

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 4 Jan 95 14:43:12 EST
From: robdav@sunshine.vab.paramax.com (Robert Davis)
Subject: Re:  The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest

Paul D. Guild wrote about connecting his ind leed on his alternator 
to ground and having an intermittent warning light for the charging
system and so on.
Paul:
page 84.4 of the Series III manual and similar sections in the
IIA manual show that the ind warning light is wired from the 
white circut (ignition) to the small lead on the alternator.
disconnecting half the circut will naturally cause the warning 
light to come on because the ground completes the circut, again
see manual.
The way the circut works is very elementary Watson.  When
the ignition is switched on the battery has more voltage than
the small lead on the alternator co the filament in the bulb
glows as the electrons pass to the altermator and ground.
When the engine is started the voltage at the alternator
exceeds that of the battery so the electrons on longer flow
to where there is least resistance and the light goes out.
If the alternator is not putting out power, then the electrons
will continue to flow and the bulb will glow.  More power
from alternator than in battery bulb no glow.  More power,
or rather voltage in battery than being produced by alternator
then bulb glows.

Glad you got your LR and nice talking with you in Nov.
Wonder if Andree managed to sell that 109 SW with the 
blown 6 cyl for 5K.

R&D

------------------------------

Subject: Stuff!
Date: Wed, 4 Jan 1995 19:16:29 -0800 (PST)
From: "Kelly Minnick" <kminnick@owens.ridgecrest.ca.us>

Hi folks. Just thought I would respond to a couple of comments.  Guess I will
just start in order.

All the above charging issues are correct. To overcome the power rating of
your alternator would require about 400 watts.  Don't know about you, but
most quartz lights are only about 60 watts each.  There are off-road driving
lights that are over 300 watts each...  I don't remember if the voltage reg.
rectifier is the standard diode type or a selinium (sp?) like the old dirt
bikes, but a bank of diodes went out in my SAAB and caused 1/3 of the power
to go away. (3 phases rectified to DC).  Also, I have had windings short
internal that cut out about 1/2 the magnet wire.  The alternator still put
out power, but little.  This can easily be checked by a shop, also (usually
for free!).

Used RRovers.  My US '87 had leaking power steering unit and leaking power
steering pump.  This is NOT uncommon from the early RRovers I looked at. I
got a good deal 'cause this scared the owner.  Most well to do Rover owners
do not change their oil every 3000-3500.  They take them in at their scheduled
changes every 8000 miles - what a crock.  Most of them are so gunked up in the
valve covers/heads and all the breather passages.  I have also seen plenty
with front automatic trans seal leaks and trans cooler line leaks where the
hard lines meet the rubber lines up front.  Most of these things can be fixed
easily, but take time.  If people would use the right fluids... Everything
else is build pretty tough!

Cams, intakes, exhausts...  I have the capability to degree cams.  As I just
got done re-building my '73, I bought a new stock 2.25L cam ($65). I 
degreed this.  ABP talked me into a 2.5L high-lift, long duration much better
cam for $175 (actually bought it from Craddocks for $120). Degreed this too.
DON'T be fooled, people. If I hadn't done this, of course I would have more
power after spending twice the money (wouldn't I?)...  NO MORE duration
and only .010" more lift on the exhaust lobe (barely noticible). Porting
your head will give you more power, but loss on low-speed torque.  Large
intake valves do the same.  We need high velocity at low speed and low
air drag at high speed. Now comes the 2 barrel carb.  The large throat
Rochester works well at freeway, but gives up low speed grunt. My bud
just bought a 2.5L from the UK that had a 24/28mm bolted to it. Don't
know if this was stock.  Works great except the cold weather thing. The K&N
filter thing is great except out here in the desert where there is lots of
very fine sand/dust.  On long trips, my buds have to change their filters
while I just keep running! No harm in opening up the exhaust system, though!

Sorry about the stolen car parts - very bad.

De-coking. have even seen guys dump ATF at high speed into their carbs. WE
did tear the motor down later. Boy was it clean. Even unstuck his rings for
a while. Any respectible shop can insert hardened seats and do a head job.
Unless you've been swayed that only a Rover person can work on a Rover...

Little hard to finish painting my rear box covered with 4" of snow!  This
is Southern California where we never get more than 4" of rain in a year!
Later (sorry, can't paint the Rover, so I'm bored)
Kelly Minnick  '73 88" Safari
Ridgecrest, CA

------------------------------

From: "T.F. Mills" <tomills@du.edu>
Subject: ruta maya?
Date: Thu, 5 Jan 1995 00:25:08 -0700 (MST)

happy new year all!

quick question:  did LROI publish a piece on the Ruta Maya Disco 
Expedition?  If so, would somebody kindly post full bibliographic 
details?  (author, title of article, issue number, date, page numbers).
Mucias gracias.

to all who have sent me private messages:  please hang on (but go ahead 
and breathe) -- I've got some catching up to do.

T. F. Mills                                              tomills@du.edu
University of Denver Library  2150 E. Evans Ave.  Denver  CO 80208  USA

------------------------------

From: LANDROVER@delphi.com
Date: Thu, 05 Jan 1995 02:45:34 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: sacul (lucas backwards)

Jimmy...
> Where can I get one of those cranks....
>From your E-Mail address, you're somewhere in the UK... Lots of Land Rover
none
parts suppliers there... Can't help you any more than that.

> I'll start with the battery and then I will follow your advice. I can't
> remember if the oil lights were on or not after I threw the key switch. I
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 9 lines)]
> when you add more lights or whatever. It does have an alternator, not a
> dynamo.

OK... First, see Bill Maloney's reply about the location of your charge
indicator light. If we make the assumption that you *do* have a light and it
is wired correctly and it hasn't fallen out then the lack of a charge light
means that you aren't charging.... The charge light is part of the circuit.

You mentioned that your truck is NEGATIVE ground... What year & model???
Maybe it was originally POSITIVE ground with a generator and was converted
to a negative ground alternator. If so, then the ammeter should have been
wired in reverse too... What if the ammeter wasn't re-wired?? The ammeter
would read backwards showing a negative amount when charging and then would
move towards the + when under load. This gets more fun as we go on!

Of course, I'm just theorizing... Lots of What Ifs... 

> AHHHHH Land-Rovers. I knew I wanted one of these for some reason. My
> co-workers believe it would make a great flower pot.

I *have* one of those Land Rover flower pots in my back yard!  :(

Cheers
  Michael Loiodice       E-MAIL   landrover@delphi.com              
  166 W.Fulton St.       VOICE    (518) 773-2697                    
  Gloversville                                                      
  NY, 12078              1972 Ser III 88 Petrol (Fern) R.I.P.      
              7          1971 Ser IIa 88 Petrol
           #:-}>         1965 Ser IIa 88 Petrol

------------------------------

  END OF LAND ROVER OWNER DIGEST 

World Wide Web Sites:
        http://whitman.gar.utexas.edu/roverweb/roverweb.html
        http://www.cs.monash.edu.au/~lloyd/tildeLand-Rover/

If majordomo barfs at something, and you're convinced he should have 
understood what you sent him, contact majordomo-owner@chunnel.uk.stratus.com
-B

Back	Forward
Photos & text Copyright 1990-2011 Bill Caloccia, All rights reserved. Digest Messages Copyright 1990-2011 by the original poster or/and Bill Caloccia, All rights reserved.