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msgSender linesSubject
1 LANDROVER@delphi.com 22Re: LRO Club Name List
2 William Caloccia [calocc27[not specified]
3 azw@aber.ac.uk (Andy Woo17Re: Les's silly hat!
4 maloney@wings.attmail.co21British Marque
5 K Schmidt [s20845@hp.rmc10add to list
6 "R. Pierce Reid" [PREID@43My 7.5 wheels
7 "T.F. Mills" [tomills@du19Re: post national rally car search...
8 "John R. Benham" [BENHAM28 Re: Is my clutch going?
9 William Caloccia [calocc27Research on safety
10 DEBROWN@SRP.GOV 21FTP site for Rover GIF's???
11 DEBROWN@SRP.GOV 30Newsgroup opinion.. (No, please)
12 DAVID SPENCER [x92nca@es53Re: clutch plates
13 brabyn@skivs.ski.org (Jo12Re: oil consumption V4 / catastrophic oil pressure loss
14 DEBROWN@SRP.GOV 45LR test area location???
15 Steven M Denis [denis@o34Questions questions.......
16 dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on20[not specified]
17 dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on25[not specified]
18 dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on24[not specified]
19 dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on25[not specified]
20 dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on31[not specified]
21 dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on49[not specified]
22 maloney@wings.attmail.co59Denis's Dipstick Doings
23 Steven M Denis [denis@o38Re: Maloney's Slapstick Doings
24 dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on28[not specified]
25 "Stefan R. Jacob" [1000460UNIMOG mayhem
26 S|ren Vels Christensen [26Re: Little Things......
27 llevitt@idcresearch.com 19a new thread?
28 David John Place [umplac14Re: Proposal: A new LR club
29 S|ren Vels Christensen [45Re2: Proposal: A new LR club
30 S|ren Vels Christensen [22Lube'ing the Hwy was Re: Proposal: A new LR club
31 S|ren Vels Christensen [34Re: Discovery / Defender Premium Fuel?
32 rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca113[not specified]
33 rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca21[not specified]


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From: LANDROVER@delphi.com
Date: Thu, 01 Sep 1994 02:05:38 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: LRO Club Name List

Spencer writes....
 

couple
> on the phone, but i think i was parked 75 feet from Mike Lodice in owl's
head
> and i never got to talk to him. (Although i did meet Steve Dennis the year
> before) A sticker perhaps?

Nope, wasn't me.. Never did get to Owl's head. But I saw a picture of
someone else's truck with almost an identical fern paint job... hmmmm..
Cheers
  Michael Loiodice       E-MAIL   landrover@delphi.com              
  166 W.Fulton St.       VOICE    (518) 773-2697                    
  Gloversville                                                      
  NY, 12078              1972 Ser III 88 Petrol (Fern)       

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Subject: Members of ARC (Association of Rover Clubs) related clubs. 
Date: Thu, 01 Sep 94 05:51:50 -0400
From: William Caloccia <caloccia@sw.stratus.com>

At the ARC nationals over May bank holiday in in Derby, there was some
discussion of using the net at the International ARC club meeting.

Toward that end,  I am in the process of writing to the ARC leadership about
the net and would like to be able to tell them how many club leaders and/or
members are already on the net.

If any of you are members of a Rover Owners Club, or other Rover Marque Club,
would you be so kind as to send me (e-mail directly to: caloccia@team.net)
the following particulars:

(Your) Name:	.
(Your) E-mail:	.
(Your) Position in the club: Member  OR  Office held: .
Club Name:	.
Club Location:	.
     (City/County/Region/State, Country)

If you aren't sure if your particular Rover club is ARC affiliated, don't
worry about it, as I've got a list of clubs that are.

	Cheers,
	- Bill   caloccia@team.net	caloccia@stratus.com

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From: azw@aber.ac.uk (Andy Woodward)
Subject: Re: Les's silly hat!
Date: Thu, 1 Sep 1994 08:42:08 UNDEFINED

>> The ultimate sillyhat has to be the one worn by the 'Bush Tucker Man'. What
>> a   wally.
none

>type dont.  Sadly the style looks silly and is know hard to come by, unless

Its such a suberbly sillyhat that I asked a freind who was working in Oz to 
bring me one back. Sadly he had to leave in a hurry, so I didnt get the hat.

Its so deliciously daft as it comes that it'd just be spoiled by 
corks..........

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Date: Thu, 01 Sep 1994 07:40:52 -0400
From: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney)
Subject: British Marque

I just received my September issue of British Marque, and the front page 
article covers the Stowe British Invasion September 16-18.  In the article it 
states "On Sunday there will be an expanded Tailgate Picnic 
competition... Expect the Canadian Land Rover group to present quite a 
spectacle!".

Dixon, what ever could they mean?

On the back cover are some shots from the UK ARC rally.  Now I know what John 
Hong's mug looks like.

Bill

maloney@wings.attmail.com

Wayne, NJ USA

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From: K Schmidt <s20845@hp.rmc.ca>
Subject: add to list
Date: Thu, 1 Sep 94 9:20:09 EDT

Could someone place me on this mailing list.  sorry, I no longer
have the LRO admin. address. I'm at s20845@sv1.rmc.ca 

thank you.

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Date: 01 Sep 94 10:17:24 EDT
From: "R. Pierce Reid" <PREID@csi.compuserve.com>
Subject: My 7.5 wheels

Greetings:

I just received and mounted a set of 7.5x16 wheels with Michelin radials on my
'62 '88 military. They replaced a set of 6.5x16 military split rims with very
aggressive firestone (British) uni-directional agricultural truck tires.

The difference is night and day.  The new wheels, combined with the overdrive,
give it incredible highway manners (I commute 25 miles each way down the
Interstate every day) and have reduced the engine speed from a frantic pitch, to
just loafing along comfortably.  The ride is much improved, and these tires are
so quiet, I can now hear wind noise!  I took it off road into some deep mud at a
construction site and it breezed through as if driving down blacktop.  I have
probably given up some measure of off-road ability, but gained far more in
roadworthyness.

Visually, the car looks better, too.  The wheel wells are "full" and it has a
better stance.  The new tires lift it up a little bit and give it a slightly
more imposing look and feel.  Interesting visual illusion, too... I went from
Bronze Green-painted military wheels to white ones (they are not the proper
limestone) and the visual effect makes the car look shorter.  It's an
interesting transformation, but something I noticed the minute I stepped back to
look at it.

Anyway, this weekend, I will be installing a set of add-a-leaf suspension front
and rear and I will update everyone on that project (I think I see an Aluminum
Workhorse Tech Article in this, too!) via a note.  The description of the kit
indicates that it can get about a 2" lift out of it, though I am more interested
in increasing load capacity a bit.

Anyway, anyone re-doing an 88, IMHO, should put the large, wide wheels at the
top of their list.  It is literally a whole different car!  

Cheers, 

R. Pierce Reid
'62 Series IIa Military -- the Sergeant Major (Is this name taken?)

*** An analog guy, muddling through in a digital world... ***

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From: "T.F. Mills" <tomills@du.edu>
Subject: Re: post national rally car search...
Date: Thu, 1 Sep 1994 09:28:47 -0600 (MDT)

Ray Harder asks about the LRs for sale in Westcliffe, CO.

I made no note of owners or anything, but recall that the 1969 88"
belongs to a mechanic on Main St.  (It was parked in the alley behind
Main.)  According to the phone book, there appears to be only one
mechanic on Main St. (and maybe only 2 in town):  Miller Automotive,
108 Main, 719-783-9694.  He probably knows who to contact about the
other one.

There goes a fine Rover!

T. F. Mills                                              tomills@du.edu
University of Denver Library  2150 E. Evans Ave.  Denver  CO 80208  USA

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From: "John R. Benham" <BENHAM@WFOCLAN.USBM.GOV>
Date:          Thu, 1 Sep 1994 08:37:14 +1100
Subject:       Re: Is my clutch going?

> To:             lro@stratus.com
> Subject:        Is my clutch going?
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 6 lines)]
> Date sent:      Wed, 31 Aug 94 08:44:52 -0500
> Organization:   FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada

> I find when I am driving, my clutch makes a intermitant high pitch whine. 
> When I press in the clutch, the noise goes away.  I notice no signs of 
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 9 lines)]
> Dale Desprey, dd@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca
> Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada
Dale,

    Try the throughout bearing.
    

Regards,

John R. Benham
Editor, `The Rover Runner'
Spokane, WA USA
> I find when I am driving, my clutch makes a intermitant high pitch whine. 

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Subject: Query on L/R product development / Safety research
Date: Thu, 01 Sep 94 12:06:30 -0400
From: William Caloccia <caloccia@sw.stratus.com>

>From riding in some of their vehicles, I wouldn't have thought Land Rover
had given safety much thought :-)

------- Forwarded Message
Date: Thu, 1 Sep 1994 14:46:20 -0800
From: Sarah Latchford <sarah@sbear.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Research on safety
Message-ID:  <9409011444.aa22233@post.demon.co.uk>

Hello,

I am part of a small group that design and develop safety products. We have
recently come up with a few ideas for car interiors. Do you have any idea
where Land Rover do research and development in this field? 
Any information would be a great help.
Thanks for your time

Sarah

sbear.demon.co.uk

------- End of Forwarded Message

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Date: Thu, 01 Sep 94 09:34:10 MST
From: DEBROWN@SRP.GOV
Subject: FTP site for Rover GIF's???

FROM:  David Brown                          Internet: debrown@srp.gov
       Computer Graphics Specialist
       AM/FM - PAB204 X-3544 - Pager:6486 External (602)275-2508 #6486
SUBJECT: FTP site for Rover GIF's???
Does anyone know of an FTP site where I can get GIF's of Rovers? I love
off road vehicles, but am a bit bored with the "jeeps and Jap junk" that
I have as a back drop for my unix screen. I'm not trying to bash them,
and have owned several, but since I'm soon to be a Rover owner (ordered
a Disco) that's what I'd like to see!

Thanks in advance... Dave (digest mode now) Brown

   #=====#              "Never doubt that a small group of individuals
   |___|__\___           can change the world... indeed, it's the only
   |   |   |  |          thing that ever has."
"  "`O'""""`O'"                                          -Margret Mead

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Date: Thu, 01 Sep 94 09:52:06 MST
From: DEBROWN@SRP.GOV
Subject: Newsgroup opinion.. (No, please)

FROM:  David Brown                          Internet: debrown@srp.gov
       Computer Graphics Specialist
       AM/FM - PAB204 X-3544 - Pager:6486 External (602)275-2508 #6486
SUBJECT: Newsgroup opinion.. (No, please)

I'd have to agree with John and TeriAnn, the potential for people to
bombard us with junk mail would probably be enough for myself and
probably many others to leave this "oasis home" for Land Rover owners.
As it is, I (as well as you all, I'm sure) get WELL OVER 100 e-mail
messages per day, even the 50 or so we got from the LRO list yesterday
was a bit heavy, although now, in digest mode, it's easier to manage.
I've only visited some of the "open" newsgroups on occasion, and from
what I've seen, don't care to have any part of it.

I WOULD however, like to see us organized, or united by a name. Yes, we
have the "Team.net" name, and maybe that's all we need. But I think it'd
be nice to be able to refer to this... Internet network mailing list
thing by a name, other than "Internet network mailing list thing."

Thanks for putting up with me...

   #=====#              "Never doubt that a small group of individuals
   |___|__\___           can change the world... indeed, it's the only
   |   |   |  |          thing that ever has."
"  "`O'""""`O'"                                          -Margret Mead

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Date: Thu, 01 Sep 1994 13:57:11 AST
From: DAVID SPENCER <x92nca@esseX.stfx.ca>
Subject: Re: clutch plates

>Sorry for not responding to your Aug 17th mail about clutch covers.
>I just got back from vacation -- hope you got things sorted our
>(er, sorted out).  I figure any comments at this point are far
>after the fact!

>See ya,

>Randy

Not quite after the fact.... I found a 9 1/2 cover in my collection of parts
to replace the  series III 9 1/2 cover which had "naked fingers" instead a 
collar for the series IIA throughout bearing to ride on. 

When the previous owner put the sIIA Trans in the SIII LR they used the SIII
clutch cover. 
A note of interest pertaining to an earlier discussion...it seemed to be 
working fine but there was "some" wear on the "naked 
fingers" at the point of contact with the throughout bearing.
 
The progress so far is... the pressure 
plate has been removed from the clutch cover ...also the fly wheel and are 
both sitting in a box waiting to be taken to a machine shop and resurfaced.
I have not yet orderd the new friction plate.

so whats holding me up? well... while at work on the clutch I also decided to 
do some "small" amount of work on the frame...so I removed the rear and seat 
box. At this point a friend came over to see it and made me an offer I am 
still stuggling with...he could have it submitted as a "trade school" project
and have the entire frame and  and all the springs rebuilt....

The cost involved would be only materials but.... It would be laided up
for  2  months or so...

I am tempted to do the "small" amount of welding ( the present frame is old 
and tired but still solid enough for on road driving ) and then reassemble 
all the bit lying around the house and yard ...if the trade school
really needs a class project they can build me a new frame from scratch?

but ....now I ramble.. I'll have made up my mind soon.

One question I had about variations on Trans. types...can a dip stick
be retrofitted for those without? I have heard that some earlier types
had a dip stick?
 
I'll leave it at now for now.

David S.
Antigonish, Nova Scotia

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Date: Thu, 1 Sep 94 10:08:52 PDT
From: brabyn@skivs.ski.org (John Brabyn)
Subject: Re:  oil consumption V4 / catastrophic oil pressure loss

>From my experience when any warning light or gauge registers abnormal,
there is a 50/50 chance that the problem lies in the sensor!!

Cheer to Lucas

John Brabyn
89 RR

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Date: Thu, 01 Sep 94 10:25:48 MST
From: DEBROWN@SRP.GOV
Subject: LR test area location???

FROM:  David Brown                          Internet: debrown@srp.gov
       Computer Graphics Specialist
       AM/FM - PAB204 X-3544 - Pager:6486 External (602)275-2508 #6486
SUBJECT: LR test area location???
I found this on another mailing list thing that may be of interest to
some of you:

 To all those interested:  You can get to the Rover test area from four
 directions
 South: From Rte 301 north bound go under Rte 214 Central Ave and make a
 left at the Lowes (Hardware) and another left so you are heading
 southbound on 301.  Cross over 214 and on your right 200 years will see
 a paved road, turn here and you will see the "no dumping" signs.  On the
 left you will see some antique stores and a connecting road toe 301
 North.

 North:  Southbound Rte 301, south of route 50 and north Rte 4 (Penn
 Ave.) then follow directions above.

 West and DC Beltway:  Take Rte 214 (central Ave.) east bound toward
 Wild/Adventure World.  After W/A World, 214 will open to a 4 lane
 divided highway.  Take the next exit for Rte 301 South. On your right
 you will find a paved road to exit off.  wait at the "No dumping" signs.

 East:  From Annapolis you can either go on Rte 50/301 or Rte 214.  If
 214 then take the 301 south exit (be careful) and get over to the right
 lane so you can get off Rte301s at the paved entrance road.

Oh dear!!! I've deleted the original posting and don't know which city
(U.S.) this is near. But it looks like the DC area. Maybe someone on the
net could verify this???

P.S. I hope the directions from the south don't REALLY take "200 years."

Good luck!!!

   #=====#              "Never doubt that a small group of individuals
   |___|__\___           can change the world... indeed, it's the only
   |   |   |  |          thing that ever has."
"  "`O'""""`O'"                                          -Margret Mead

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Date: Thu, 1 Sep 1994 13:35:35 -0400 (EDT)
From: Steven M Denis  <denis@oswego.Oswego.EDU>
Subject: Questions questions.......

> One question I had about variations on Trans. types...can a dip stick
> be retrofitted for those without? I have heard that some earlier types
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 8 lines)]
> David S.
> Antigonish, Nova Scotia
 
*I've* got a question.....I have a wealth (ok,pocket change) of 
information on the early transmission etc.......BUT I get the idea that 
the techical stuff really only interests the very few..(You disco 
owners*PLEASE* don't take your gearbox apart!!!) I'm kinda new at this so 
is there a format where we can identify if the question has been 
answered,but dosesn't fill everyone's mail box to bursting? So...do I 
answer this type of thing on the net with my usual lack of 
breivity,speeling and accuracy,or do I post it to the info file and hope 
those that need to know will look it up....I've had several direct 
queries on some topics that have asked the same question,and if I answer 
them all,my poor little piggies get tired......maybe*everybody* else 
knows how to do this but not me.....
Ok,short and sweet...
the dipstick transmissions are series1 and 2....some very early 2a's...so 
to get a dipstick (stop it Maloney...) you have to use at least the case 
and top cover from one of these....(the case and top cover on all LR 
trannies are matched BTW)..the trouble here is that these units have a 
smaller layshaft (*get* a life,Maloney!...).)and the later "guts" will 
require 
some machining of the case to use.....It really isn't worth it in my 
estimation...but I've done it...If you really leak that much oil,perhaps
an "IV bag" is in order :-)
steve.......

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Subject: Proposed Club Name
From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner)
Date: Thu, 01 Sep 94 09:30:54 -0500

maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney) writes:

> A club motto could be "Show Us Your Layshaft" or "I've Got More Knobs Than Yo
> and I Know How to Use 'Em". 

        As long as you don't steal the unofficial OVLR motto "Shit Happens"...
        :-)

        Rgds,

        Dixon

--
dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca
Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada

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Subject: P O R T L A N D  ! ! ! !
From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner)
Date: Thu, 01 Sep 94 08:42:01 -0500

/G=Hui/S=Ben/OU2=IL02M/OU=ILBH/P=MOT/A=MOT/C=US/@email.mot.com writes:

> I suggest that all those rover guy that are on the net that intend  on attend
> the rover/brit car meet have some sort of exterior flag/marking or somthing t
> distinguish ourselves from the norm??  

        British-cars mailing list has done this.  Deposited a "crest" at
        a reputable printer and have available shirts, coffee mugs etc with
        the logo.

        Logo is a Union Jack with crossed con rod & spanner in front as well
        as the letters SOL.  mailing list addrss is at the bottom...

        Rgds,

        Dixon

--
dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca
Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada

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Subject: Discovery / Defender Premium Fuel?
From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner)
Date: Thu, 01 Sep 94 08:49:54 -0500

"Stephen O'Hearn" <72700.3262@compuserve.com> writes:

> Regarding the use of standard unleaded gas all I can say is I wouldn't.

        Just some trivia.  In Canada gasoline uses a number of additives
        for replacing lead (MMT et cetera) that are banned in the USA.  Thus
        running unleaded is not as bad here as it is in the USA.  I have
        also not heard any horror stories from anyone up here visa-vis their
        Rover and head problems from unleaded gasoline.

        Rgds,

        Dixon

        (Guess this justifies paying $2.50 (approx) a gallon for gasoline)

--
dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca
Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada

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Subject: Re: Oil consumption for the 3.9l
From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner)
Date: Thu, 01 Sep 94 08:38:21 -0500

Steven M Denis <denis@oswego.Oswego.EDU> writes:

> and while I'm at it.....My understanding on the oil leaks is that on 
> equipment that is designed to operate under severe dirt and grime 
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 8 lines)]
> out the seal and related parts before noon....ummmmmm *could just be more 
> hype to cover up poor quality control......

        Hence why is is desirable to use double lipped seals on the hubs,
        yet is very bad idea to use triple lipped seals (yes they are
        available in the correct size for a Land Rover hub).  Single
        lipped seals on the hub just let a little too much get past.

        Rgds,

        Dixon

--
dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca
Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada

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Subject: Newsgroup?  Bio, thanks from BP
From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner)
Date: Thu, 01 Sep 94 08:44:24 -0500

Fred Heald <justfred@netcom.com> writes:

> Why not a rec.autos.land-rover Usenet newsgroup instead of or in addition 
> to this mailing list?  It would give a lot more exposure, and threads 
> would actually be 'threaded'.

        More for the same reason that the much larger British-cars mailing-
        list has refused this.  People on this list want to be here and have
        gone to the effort to get here.  Access is controlable.  In a
        newsgroup every yahoo with some other 4x4 can stop by, or cross-post
        into the newsgroup just to be a pain in the ass.  This format
        is far superior to having a newsgroup.

> The problem is, I'm not sure how to go about creating the newsgroup.  I 
> guess it's easier to create groups in the alt. hierachy, but I think with 
> some sort of a vote it would be possible to create a rec. group.

        Alt is easy.  Rec requires a vote.

        Rgds,

        Dixon

--
dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca
Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada

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Subject: Re: Proposal: A new LR club
From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner)
Date: Thu, 01 Sep 94 09:21:42 -0500

IAN@lab0.vet.edinburgh.ac.uk writes:

> This "InterNet" thing is a big unknown for a lot of people here in 
> the UK. Getting access is not *that* difficult, the cheapest 
> commercial system I could use works out at 120pounds (pa) for 
> subscription and ~1pound per hour telephone charges (I've got a local 
> modem bank).

        I can't think of the address off-hand, but there is a much cheaper
        system accessable via modem in London.  They were originally thumbing
        their node at the formal internet structure over there by routing
        mail and news via two locations, one in Ottawa, the second in New
        York.  My understanding is that access is very reasonable.  Other
        than them, access in the UK has been rather restricted and expensive.

> Most people don't really understand what this e-mail thing is all 
> about -- it tends to be 'a serious tool for company use only', so 
> they don't think about the possibility of a leasure use for it.

        Ths assumes they have an idea in the first place.  Don't really
        understand the whole concept I find to be more common.  Interest
        is there and growing, at least here in Ottawa and within OVLR.

> I suppose it comes down to the fact that I feel we should recognise 
> ourselves as a club. Just because we don't have a membership fee or 
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 8 lines)]
> mention once or twice doesn't really do that, a listing in the Club 
> pages does.

        This "club" does a lot more than many formal clubs, at least in
        terms of communications between members and the occassional
        regional gathering where people may get together to actually
        meet some of the other list members (Speaking of which, there
        are about a dozen OVLR members going down to the British Invasion
        at Stowe Vermont (Sept 17-18), and at least four will be bringing
        their Land Rovers.)

        Rgds,

        Dixon

--
dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca
Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada

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Date: Thu, 01 Sep 1994 15:16:35 -0400
From: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney)
Subject: Denis's Dipstick Doings

Steve Writes:

none
...the dipstick transmissions are series1 and 2....some very early 2a's...so 
to get a dipstick (stop it Maloney...) you have to use at least the case 
and top cover from one of these....(the case and top cover on all LR 
trannies are matched BTW)..the trouble here is that these units have a 
smaller layshaft (*get* a life,Maloney!...).)and the later "guts" will 
require 
some machining of the case to use.....It really isn't worth it in my 
estimation...but I've done it...If you really leak that much oil,perhaps
an "IV bag" is in order :-)
steve.......
none

Steve is correct in saying that the top and bottom halves of the main 
gearboxes are matched.  What this means to you is that the selector shaft 
passages are line bored with the halves bolted together.  The result is that 
if you mix top and bottom halves from different boxes together, then bolt 
them down, the selector shafts are held TIGHT.  They don't move for 
nothin'!!!  If you are patient you can, by way of careful machining of the 
pasages of the top halve's passage way, make it fit.  You must be patient, 
however.  I found this out the hard way (Don't ask, Stevo) and learned that 
the quickest way to remove the material is with a dremel with a drum sanding 
attachment.  Make an even pass though all 3 passages (top half only) then 
flush & dry thoroughly.  Bolt it down,  Move the selectors back & forth using 
a rubber mallet.  Unbolt the cover and examine the passages.  You will see 
where the shafts contacted the high spots.  Repeat the process working on the 
high spots 'til the selectors slide easily.  Actually once you can rotate 
them slightly with your fingers that's enough.  Pull it off once more and 
finish with fine abrasive paper and oil or steel wool & oil.  Be very careful 
to remove all traces of filings/abrasives as you don't want them in your 
tranny.

Regarding responding to previously asked questions, I see a lot of new folks 
come on the net with questions.  They may have been addressed before, but 
these folks really need help and I'd rather put up with a few extra messages 
in my mailbox than leave them out in the cold.  For the past couple of months 
when I see a question that has been addressed previously, I pull the response 
out if I've saved it and send it to the requestor direct if the return 
address is accurate.  

I remember when I got my first Rover and how a lot of very generous folks 
helped me with tips and advice.  In the end I'd say definately respond, and 
it's your choice/judgement as to whether you want to reply direct or through 
the net.  

My 2 Cents worth.

Bill

malonet@wings.attmail.com

Wayne, NJ USA

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Date: Thu, 1 Sep 1994 16:41:49 -0400 (EDT)
From: Steven M Denis  <denis@oswego.Oswego.EDU>
Subject: Re: Maloney's Slapstick Doings

ok...some technical stuff for hard boiled rover cases out there...btw i'm 
typing "Righty only" 'cause i opened up a hot radiator for laughs and 
giggles...didn't find either......

the early S2 trans has a smaller layshaft....so if that is perceived 
to be a problem for you due to breakage, stop now and hit delete....
in concert with this,the input shaft with gear and the counter gear are a 
different ratio than the "B" and later trans. So,ifin' ya put the late 
input shaft and matching counter gear in an early trans,you get a lower 
1st,2nd,and 3rd gear...!!!!!(4th,being "direct", stays the same) Cool!
you can now get that 109sw started on a hill in high range!
But wait!!!! the early S2 had a different low range ratio to make up for 
the higher 1st gear in the "correct" main gearbox.....sooo if you use one 
of these transfer boxes with the later trans,you get a lower 1st gear/low 
range....*And* if you use the handy-dandy gear box i just discribed,you 
get a real rock crawling low range and still maintain the same top 
gear/high range! Can you say"wide ratio"?.....the transfer box also,is 
"weaker" due to the smaller intermediate shaft (easy to identify...it's 
alot smaller...you can see it by looking just to the left of the parking 
brake drum) However.....*I* haven't been able to break mine yet.....
hot rod antics,big whompin' engines and general tomfoolery, need not apply...
all others....try it,you'll like it!
ps. the final overall ratios in the book are the same for 2 and 2a...but 
the *way* that these ratios are obtained are different.....check part 
numbers etc.   ......
steve.....

"HEY! NICE JEEP,MISTER!"..........."Look,Kid,it's a ..Oh never mind..."

"NOTAJEEP"-1967 109 Station Wagon          Steven M. Denis
"        "-1957 107 Station Wagon          PO Box 61
"        "-1964 109 Pickup                 Erieville,New York USA
"        "_1967 109 NADA SW                13061

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Subject: British Marque
From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner)
Date: Thu, 01 Sep 94 14:55:44 -0500

maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney) writes:

> I just received my September issue of British Marque, and the front page 
> article covers the Stowe British Invasion September 16-18.  In the article it
> states "On Sunday there will be an expanded Tailgate Picnic 
> competition... Expect the Canadian Land Rover group to present quite a 
> spectacle!".

        Where is Dale, aka Baldrick, aka something very silly... :-)

> Dixon, what ever could they mean?

        No idea.  We are very prim, proper, serious, teetotalers up here
        where some live by the motto "shit happens" when the above fails
        to occur...

        Rgds,

        Dixon

--
dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca
Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada

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Date: 01 Sep 94 17:59:47 EDT
From: "Stefan R. Jacob" <100043.2400@compuserve.com>
Subject: UNIMOG mayhem

On 30 Aug 1994 Roeland van Delzen <roeland@inter.nl.net>
wrote:

> <...snip...snip...>
> <...snip...> I encountered Germans in a brand new UNIMOG, completely 
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 6 lines)]
> drive. He dared not to go into the dessert any further, because he was 
> afraid of damaging his vehicle !

Ah, the UNIMOG "adventurers" ... they are SO pathetic, aren't they?

I was at a globetrotter meet last weekend where all sorts of strange folks 
and vehicles congregated. You had converted ex-military MAN 8X8 
(not a typo!) monsters with fully air conditioned stainless steel 
cabins strapped to them, contrasting with a guy who had just come back
from Greenland which he had crossed... *walking* !
Anyway, come sunday morning when it was time for leaving it was raining,
and had been raining all night. Now the site was a kind of big 
sloping meadow surrounded by woods & cow fences, very picturesque and
Black-Forest-like, *but* the entry/exit gate where all had to go through
was uphill at the _top_ of the site. Well, you can imagine that 
after the first couple'o dozen vehicles had gone over that patch of
grass the ground around the exit gate was pretty mucked up and slippery,
the usual rutted mud w/grass sods.  Nothing that would worry a 
Land Rover, though, and the Rovers, Toyotas and *most* other 4WDs
quite effortlessly ploughed their way up through the gook and made it 
out through the gate. One VW Beetle, having failed on first try, turned
back to take a long run and had a go for it, lifting off on a few
bumps, then skidded uphill right across the muddy part more or less
on its belly and litterally catapulted himself through the gate out 
onto the street - good aim! This performance must have given a wrong 
conception to someone about how to properly negotiate uphill in mud, 
because suddenly we hear a deafening roar behind us somewhere, and 
there comes this UNIMOG "ActionMobil" expedition rig sort of thing 
tearing across the premises, its stacks blowin' thick black like it was 
the Rubber Duck out of "Convoy", flinging mud, grass & cowchips all 
over the place, enters the muddy part and... skids out of control,
flattens a (fortunately empty) VW Jetta parked alongside the entry,
crashes through the fence sideways, skids across the street and 
continues backwards into an orchard where it collects a few young 
apple trees in its path. You should've seen the kids applauding, it was 
better than the movies! Lateron when damage assessment and recovery was 
in progress you could see this guy fumbling through the manual of his
h-u-g-e  Warner winch - he had never used it before! And as for the 
skidding part, someone took the trouble to explain to him a) what a 
locking central differential was, b) how and when to use it, and c) that 
his rig was actually equipped with one. Well, that's UNIMOG drivers for you. 
Finally, to give this narrative a clear Rover purport, let me
finish by saying that not a single one of the Land Rovers got
stuck or even had a wheel slip on that part.

Take care,

Stefan  <100043.2400@compuserve.com>
LROC of Hessen

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Date: Fri, 2 Sep 1994 02:22:18 +0200 (METDST)
From: S|ren Vels Christensen <velssvch@inet.uni-c.dk>
Subject: Re: Little Things......

On Wed, 31 Aug 1994, Steven M Denis wrote:

> Not from Austrialia I fear, the hat with the folded up brim is from 
> northern India!...As much as I would like to think that the "King's Guraka 
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 21 lines)]
> "        "-1964 109 Pickup                 Erieville,New York USA
> "        "_1967 109 NADA SW                13061

The Gurka's used to wear them and i think they still do. If you call
N.A.A.F.I., they might be able/willing to tell who's making them.
Personally i prefer a tweed sixpence which IMO goes fine with a Landie, 
-along with my John Lennon sunspex.

Yours

+----------------------------+--------------------------------+
| Soren Vels                 | 1976  sIII  109"   2.25 petrol |
| velssvch@inet.uni-c.dk     | "Lawrence of Arabia"           |    ((|||))
| Royal Danish Air Force     | Dansk Land-Rover Klub no. 3564 |   ((|||))
| Communications Specialist  | DL-RK: Approx. 1000 members.   |    ((|||))
+----------------------------+--------------------------------+__((|||))______

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From: llevitt@idcresearch.com
Date: Thu, 01 Sep 94 20:37:02 EST
Subject: a new thread?

Not to interrupt the discussion of the club name, but the folks over at rally-l 
are having a neat little conversation about Lucas' having invented daytime 
running lights and intermittent wipers (they just weren't the manufacturer to 
label the switch intermittent...

>> A free Lucas 3-position toggle switch ("Off," "Flicker," and "Dim") is
>> offered as an inducement to the first five new members <g!>

> I thought that the Lucas switch was "Dim", "Flicker", and "Short"... :-)

Tee hee.

Lee

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Date: Thu, 1 Sep 1994 19:58:09 -0500 (CDT)
From: David John Place <umplace@CC.UManitoba.CA>
Subject: Re: Proposal: A new LR club

Perhaps we might consider using the IRC system on Internet.  For those who
don't know what IRC is, it stands for Internet Relay Chat, and is a real
time connection to other people on the net.  In my area you type dp enter
and when you get a prompt, you type irc space _d space enter and you are
on.  You type / list and you get a list of people wishing to chat.  If we
post a title like Land Rover, you type /join Land Rover and now you can
talk to other Land Rover types in real time.  It would mean having like a
meeting from time to time instead of just sending Email.  Just an idea.
Dave VE4PN

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Date: Fri, 2 Sep 1994 03:20:20 +0200 (METDST)
From: S|ren Vels Christensen <velssvch@inet.uni-c.dk>
Subject: Re2: Proposal: A new LR club

On Wed, 31 Aug 1994, John R. Benham wrote:

> > From:           IAN@lab0.vet.edinburgh.ac.uk
> > Organization:   Vet-lab,The Univ of Edinburgh
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 83 lines)]
> John R. Benham
> Spokane, WA USA
I certainly agree with John. Skipping all the diesel stuff shows on the
phonebill.No seriously.

The list CAN be used for club purposes, as we see from time to time. Also,
the net (list) is a fine media if a (semi-)national club welcomes outside/
international participation in arrangements. Netters can pass information on
to their respective clubs. Wide spread club to club/individual info with 
only a few Kb af ascii.

May i instead suggest two lists to be maintained by volunteers:

A. A world wide Land-Rover club list with addresses and club secretaries.
B. A world wide Land-Rover dealers/part shops/garage list.

Both lists could be useful and interesting to travellers and circumnavigators.
The lists should preferably be maintained where it could be FTP'ed. (I have
dial-in access).

The ''B'' list is an invitation to commercial advertisement, but the 
maintainer could cut out ''irrelevant'' text and mask the entries to be more
or less standard.

BTW, i'm about to make a presentation on Dansk Land-Rover Klub. Just need
a few details before posting.

Yours

+----------------------------+--------------------------------+
| Soren Vels                 | 1976  sIII  109"   2.25 petrol |
| velssvch@inet.uni-c.dk     | "Lawrence of Arabia"           |    ((|||))
| Royal Danish Air Force     | Dansk Land-Rover Klub no. 3564 |   ((|||))
| Communications Specialist  | DL-RK: Approx. 1000 members.   |    ((|||))
+----------------------------+--------------------------------+__((|||))______

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Date: Fri, 2 Sep 1994 03:36:44 +0200 (METDST)
From: S|ren Vels Christensen <velssvch@inet.uni-c.dk>
Subject: Lube'ing the Hwy  was Re: Proposal: A new LR club

On Wed, 31 Aug 1994, TeriAnn Wakeman wrote:

> In message <Pine.3.89.9408302115.D25303-0100000@gidney.oswego.edu> Steven M 
> Denis  writes:
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 24 lines)]
> 408-974-2344                         TR3A - TS75519L, 
>                        MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561

I tried to mail to a friend who runs a BBS with fido. It didn't arrive yet.
Must have landed in the middle of landie convoy jamming the gateway.

+----------------------------+--------------------------------+
| Soren Vels                 | 1976  sIII  109"   2.25 petrol |
| velssvch@inet.uni-c.dk     | "Lawrence of Arabia"           |    ((|||))
| Royal Danish Air Force     | Dansk Land-Rover Klub no. 3564 |   ((|||))
| Communications Specialist  | DL-RK: Approx. 1000 members.   |    ((|||))
+----------------------------+--------------------------------+__((|||))______

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Date: Fri, 2 Sep 1994 04:52:39 +0200 (METDST)
From: S|ren Vels Christensen <velssvch@inet.uni-c.dk>
Subject: Re: Discovery / Defender Premium Fuel?

On Thu, 1 Sep 1994, dixon kenner wrote:

> "Stephen O'Hearn" <72700.3262@compuserve.com> writes:
> > Regarding the use of standard unleaded gas all I can say is I wouldn't.
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 22 lines)]
> dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca
> Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada

I use Shell 92oct unleaded for my '76 2.25. It used to run on gas (not gas!),
so it can do without the lead. 1990 > Disco and Defender are modern cars,
made in Europe where leaded petrol is getting extremely unpopular. I can't
think of a modern (Defender modern?) eurocar that needs lead. In Sweden 
leaded petrol is forbidden. (And diesel is extremely overtaxed. Taking more
than 200l of diesel into Sweden results in a SEK 10.000 (1.000 pounds) fine.)
Anyone can find the engine number and check with the nearest LR dealer to 
find out if the engine runs with unleaded. 
In 1988 unleaded fuel was a newish thing in Denmark. People were afraid to
use it. DTU (Danish Tech. Univ.) did a survey and found that 85% of the cars
registered in Denmark could use unleaded. And with 180% car tax upon first
registration, cars get old in this country.

Yours

+----------------------------+--------------------------------+
| Soren Vels                 | 1976  sIII  109"   2.25 petrol |
| velssvch@inet.uni-c.dk     | "Lawrence of Arabia"           |    ((|||))
| Royal Danish Air Force     | Dansk Land-Rover Klub no. 3564 |   ((|||))
| Communications Specialist  | DL-RK: Approx. 1000 members.   |    ((|||))
+----------------------------+--------------------------------+__((|||))______

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Subject: LRO MAGAZINE
From: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (Robin Craig)
Date: Thu, 01 Sep 94 23:06:33 -0500

I have been watching the change that is going on with LRO since the emap 
take over recently, and talking to a whole bunch of people about it. what 
one gleans I have to say is for the most part scuttlebutt , but that can 
have a grain of truth in it. So for what its worth heres what I have 
picked up and noticed, all disinterestd parties exit here.

The orgainsation is being run with Martin Hodder as the over seeing 
editor , Paul Horrell assisted by Carl Rogerson are the editors and 
junior / asst ed. Not really Land Rover people from what I hear apart 
from Martin that is..

Alot of insiders see that EMAP looks at LRO as a cash cow wainting to be 
milked.

We the readers should get of our butts and be more expressive of what we 
feel about alot of things. 

For instance, LRO used to run some appaling adverts from one of the major 
tyre companies. it was an advert that would not have made it into any 
North American magazine because of its derrogatory and belittleing 
treatment of aboriginl persons.

I felt strongly about that advert. To me a magazine like LRO that claims 
to have an international appeal should be more carefull of its content.

I wrote the tyre company, its US head office, and LRO magazine.

I got a phone call from the UK from the HEAD of the UK division of the 
company saying that they were very sorry for the advert but it was 
pressed on them form European head office. They would pass my comments 
on.

A week later I got a letter from the person responsible for the ad, they 
had now pulled it and apologised.

The power of one.

So for all those of you who get LRO and whine about it , write them and 
let them know, they will never hear about it otherwise.

The sept 94 issue came a few days ago and I have these cooment s about 
it.

I think that the yellow 88 on the front has occupied that spot once 
before. Will have to check back on that one.

on page 8 Richard Thomas is going on about how Land Rover is protecting 
it sname and getting tough on the subject. Turn to page 17 and look at 
the Discovery in the back ground that sports "UN" on the door, a little 
bit of a double standard here?

The 127 on the bottom of page 153, four doors storage area behind, great 
looking vehicle, take off the lights and  this would be a great civvy 
vehicle. One of the best land Rovers for a long time IMHO.

The coastguard article on 188 really bugs me. i think this was ghost 
written seing as there is no name credit for it, that really bugs me when 
no one will put their name to something.

page 194, Vincent Hammersley states: "the greatest quantity of Defenders 
built in one year was 56,000 in 1970...."  WRONG , WRONG and WRONG again. 

Defenders are a coil sprung vehicle, in 1970 no one had thought up the 
ghastly name. it really bugs me when Land Rover, and dont forget that 
Vincent Hammersley is one of the top pr peole at Lode lane, try and ride 
the suceess of the the "Defender " on top of the IMHO sometimes better 
quality older series of vehicle. They make some outlandish calims to 
production figures these days, like "To date Land Rover has produced 
nearly two million vehicles and DEFENDER accounts for more than 1.5 
million of these."

See what i mean?

I have by the way, always been somewhat outspoken about what Lnad Rover 
says and have clashed horns with Mr Hammersley in public before!

On the interesting side take a closer look at the 110 rolling down the 
line on page 197, yes the white on in the foreground, interesting spec if 
you look at it long enough.

Congrats to dixon for his work that gets him a name check on p 220. 
having been involved with OVLR or a number of years i know what it is to 
"do" a monthly newsletter. I put out one myself aswell.

Whilst reading International Off Roader, yes I write for them aswell, so 
I do have an interest, there has been lively coverage of the "BULL BAR" 
debate going on  in the UK that has been for the most part kept fairly 
low in profile in LRO.

it seems that the traffic boffins say that bull bars do lotsa more injury 
to pedestrians in accidents, they are not "soft" etc etc. So they should 
be pulled and banned etc. One wise person asked roufully what about the 
18 wheelers? they are pretty unfriendly to pedestrians too!

Dont you love it when a bureaucrat gets his / her teeth into an issue.

Must say that the contents section for his issue was alot better this 
time.

I am still waiting for my LRW to appear.

thanks for the minute

Robin Craig

--
Robin Craig, rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca
Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada

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Subject: names
From: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (Robin Craig)
Date: Thu, 01 Sep 94 23:02:57 -0500

Become a club, have a president and secretary, UG. Who wants that job? 
Seems like it would remove all the fun out of the system.

We are on the most part a fairly civilised bunch, we even know how to 
apologise if we have too.

I like the informal threads and things that go on here, lets keep it fun, 
sometimes getting all organsised kills it for most people.

Thats how I feel, 

Robin.

--
Robin Craig, rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca
Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada

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