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From: SPYDERS@aol.com
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 07:08:08 EST
Subject: Re: 6cyl pisons in a four?

In a message dated 11/4/98 9:37:18 PM, you wrote:

into
one of the the IOE four cylinder engines. Unless the stroke is different they
would not fit the 2 liter but isn't there a 1.7 or something?>>

Even farther off the mark, as I understand it.

The original theory was the interchangeability of parts between the
*santana-6* and the *lr-2.25-4* which Teriann pointed out have the same bore &
stroke. hmmm.

If she found one of those sixes, parts availability may not be too bad if
there's a bit of cross-over from the 4...

.02

I don't know which six Frank was talking about in his funny-racer's-story but
I assume it was the santana 6 for the same reason.

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From: john cranfield <john.cranfield@ns.sympatico.ca>
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 1998 09:00:29 -0400
Subject: Re: Trimming the Bulkhead

Paul Quin wrote:
> Very wet day here in S.W. BC.  Parked beside Sussex's '69 SIIA and we stood
> by our vehicles, comparing the size of our two oil slicks in all their
> rainbow glory.  I think that my Rover is letting more water in than oil
> out...
> Since overhauling my bulkhead last winter, it has never sat quite right on
> the frame.  I think that the problem is the new footwells that I had welded
> in.  They seem to stick a little too far forward and thus cause the bulkhead
	 [ truncated by list-digester (was 19 lines)]
> pillars to the frame, will this give me some more adjustment room to pull
> the bulkhead forward?  I only need about 1/2 an inch...
 Yes it  probably will, but Landrovers being what they are that
adjustment may be all used up.
   John and Muddy

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From: "Lee Dunkelberg" <lee_dunkelberg@hotmail.com>
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 07:17:53 -0600
Subject: Bill's Freelander Pix
	charset="iso-8859-1"

Well, all that Camel Trophy gear certainly makes the Freelander LOOK like an
off-road machine.
But, would a Beetle look the same with winches at both ends and a few lights
on top?

Lee & Clare Dunkelberg
94 D-90 #1584 (AA yellow - what else?)
98 Discovery (white - okay, so white's good, too)
San Antonio, Texas

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From: dbobeck@ushmm.org
Date: Wed, 04 Nov 98 22:54:51 -0500
Subject: Re[2]: Wanted: stuff 

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From: SPYDERS@aol.com
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 08:48:53 EST
Subject: Re:  Bill's Freelander Pix

In a message dated 11/5/98 9:19:57 AM, you wrote:

<<Well, all that Camel Trophy gear certainly makes the Freelander LOOK like an
off-road machine.
But, would a Beetle look the same with winches at both ends and a few lights
on top?>>

Beetles (the old ones, at least) have made very competent off-road desert
racers... I haven't seen a winch on one, but the few lights on top are
necessary for seeing rocks, dunes and ditches when running at high speeds at
night...

I'd say a well-equipped-and-built baja bug could give a Freelander a run for
its money in the Baja1000...

I know, it is like comparing apples & oranges, but the venerable beetle can go
places...

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From: "Chris Dillard" <cdillard@Aholdusa.com>
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 09:02:23 -0500
Subject: Re: Bill's Freelander Pix

Lee,
Just in case your still interested in the Brush bar and running boards the
guy (seller) to cantact is listed below.
Good luck.

Christopher Dillard Dba

(seller)
Chuck Pace
Land Rover Greenville ServiceManager
864-232-7493

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From: "Chris Dillard" <cdillard@Aholdusa.com>
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 09:04:44 -0500
Subject: Re: Bill's Freelander Pix NO LR (SORRY)

Woops,

Sorry to post to the list!!!! Brain Fart!!!

Cheers,
Christopher Dillard Dba          Ahold USA (BI-LO Inc)
95 Discovery V8i (Rusty II)        cdillard@aholdusa.com
55 Series I    (???)                     Greenville, SC USA
55 Series I (The Green Hornet)
1989 Thoroughbred Racehorse (the other Rusty!!)
SoLaRos #136
  _________
  |_|_|_|_|
 {|__|__ \
 {|__|__|__\___
  |_ - ____ - _|}
    (_)    (_)

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From: Fred Dushin <fadushin@blackcat.cat.syr.edu>
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 09:59:33 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: Santanna 6 cyl engines

/*
 * Subject: Santanna 6 cyl engines
 * 
 * Anyone know anything about them??
 * 
 * They are supposed to be a LR four cylinder with two added cylinders.  
 * Rumor has it that they take LR four cylinder engine parts.
 */

Gee I don't know, TeriAnn, I think you are starting to haul too much
camping equiptment in that doormobile of yours for your 4 cyclinder to
carry.  Maybe you should consider an RV for your Portland excursions ;)

At least you wouldn't have to wax the aluminum siding...

Cheers,
Fred"oh no, not another"Dushin

--
Fred Dushin                      mailto:fadushin@top.cis.syr.edu
PGP public key available at      http://www.cis.syr.edu/~fadushin/pgp

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From: "A. P. \"Sandy\" Grice" <rover@pinn.net>
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 1998 10:01:17 -0500
Subject: gettin belted

Bill Rice Jarvis64@aol.com wrote:
>I need some brackets for mounting the top of a inertia mount system.   Bren
>tells me that all SIIIs have these, even tho' on models w/o inertial belts
>they're covered up by the trim.

>They're RN part # 348874 and 348873.  Is he right--are there hundreds of
>these lurking under trim panels? 

I ordered those parts when fitting the inertia belts to the 88.  Went to
remove the fascia panel, and lo and behold, the bracket was already there
with the same thread (captive) nut welded in place.  Mine's one of the
earliest Series III's (built 5/72) so I imagine all would have this mod.
BTW, I remember the bracket as welded in place, rather than bolted.  RN
took 'em back since I didn't need 'em.

The only problem I had was in ordering.  Wasn't sure if it would fit at
first, so I only ordered one...the "driver's side".  Guess what?  When I
saw that it would fit, I ordered the "passenger side" for myself.  Cheers

  *----jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary----*
  |                                                   |
  |             A. P. ("Sandy") Grice                 |
  |    Rover Owners' Association of Virginia, Ltd.    |
  |     Association of North American Rover Clubs     |
  |    1633 Melrose Pkwy., Norfolk, VA 23508-1730     |
  |(O)757-622-7054, (H)757-423-4898, FAX 757-622-7056 |
  *----1972 Series III------1996 Discovery SE-7(m)----*

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From: "A. P. \"Sandy\" Grice" <rover@pinn.net>
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 1998 10:01:15 -0500
Subject: Lethal springs

Alan_Richer@motorcity2.lotus.com wrote:

>The spring won't be an issue, as the shaft is happily anchored still by the
>upper arm. It won't come out.

Really?  I've had the seals (and a spare spring) in the kit for many years,
but was always reluctant to fool with it with all the warnings in the shop
manual about a spring removing various body parts and attempting to enter
orbit once give its freedom.  Might just do it this weekend.  If you're
wrong, my next of kin will be contacting you Monday. ;-)

  *----jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary----*
  |                                                   |
  |             A. P. ("Sandy") Grice                 |
  |    Rover Owners' Association of Virginia, Ltd.    |
  |     Association of North American Rover Clubs     |
  |    1633 Melrose Pkwy., Norfolk, VA 23508-1730     |
  |(O)757-622-7054, (H)757-423-4898, FAX 757-622-7056 |
  *----1972 Series III------1996 Discovery SE-7(m)----*

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From: Alan_Richer@motorcity2.lotus.com
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 10:31:07 -0500
Subject: Re: Lethal springs

Sandy,

If you want to do the full overhaul then yes, you WILL be dealing with the
spring. For simply swapping the seals the spring and shaft will happily stay in
place all by themselves, thank'ee.

If you look at the design, the tapered bushings are pushing down/out against the
machined cones on the shaft - unless the bushings are completely fragged, the
spring can't escape unlees you shove the shaft out of the housing.

I will warn you, though, that the shaft running surfaces are most likely scored
- they didn't harden the running surfaces to prevent seal wear, and most of them
got grooved (not unlike LR engine front pulleys).

If you want to have a look at
http://www.fourfold.org/LR_FAQ/Series/FAQ.S.steering_relay.html, you'll find the
article I wrote on overhauling steering relays in the chassis. I've come up with
further data since then, so give me a yell before you attempt it.

                         Alan

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From: NADdMD@aol.com
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 11:08:37 EST
Subject: Any other vehicles which came with Lucas Dizzy?

Hi all,

About to go to the junkyard (auto recyclers) to look for a "new style" Lucas 4
cylinder distributor to get dizzy cap clips from.  Are there any other makes
that used this?  I assume later Triumphs and MG's did, true?  Any others?

Thanks,

Nate

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From: john cranfield <john.cranfield@ns.sympatico.ca>
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 1998 12:32:01 -0400
Subject: Re: Any other vehicles which came with Lucas Dizzy?

NADdMD@aol.com wrote:
> Hi all,
> About to go to the junkyard (auto recyclers) to look for a "new style" Lucas 4
> cylinder distributor to get dizzy cap clips from.  Are there any other makes
> that used this?  I assume later Triumphs and MG's did, true?  Any others?

 this true so did Minis , Austin Americas and English Fords of the 60s
and 70s and maybe some Volvos
     John and Muddy

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From: M.J.Rooth@lboro.ac.uk (Mike Rooth)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 16:39:18 +0000
Subject: Re: Any other vehicles which came with Lucas Dizzy?

 I assume later Triumphs and MG's did, true?  Any others?

Beware of the slant four Triumphs (Dolomites) Nate.They had AC Delco dizzy's.
Only damned dizzy I ever had trouble with."Cant rebush Delcos sir".Yes you
bloody well can if you make your own....What with that and French Ducellier
wiring,long live Lucas,say I.

Cheers
Mike Rooth

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From: "Wilson, Scott" <wilsons@msmail.vislab.com>
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 1998 11:45 -0500
Subject: RE: Little Nash Rambler(No LR Content)

> I didn't follow this thread so I apologize if I am wrong.
> The line from the song is about a a person driving a Cadillac and the
> "Little Nash Rambler" is behind the Caddie going "Beep Beep."

Thanks... nice to know that I'm not going crazy... used to hear that
song on Dr Demento...

I only brought it up cause someone mentioned a british car company
named Nash, and I didn't  know if that is what they were referring to.

 -Scott  

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From: Michael Carradine <cs@landrover.net>
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 09:10:32 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Re: Sikkens paint codes needed

At 10:11 PM 11/4/98 -0500, you wrote:
>I am in need of the Sikkens code numbers for pastel Green and Limestone
>Checked the FAQ but found no Sikkens codes
>Anyone have this info?
>Rgds
>Steve Bradke

 Some manufacturers are able to use or cross-reference codes.
 See the codes at  www.landrover.net/paint

-Michael

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From: GElam30092@aol.com
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 12:12:01 EST
Subject: Re: Lethal springs

<<Really?  I've had the seals (and a spare spring) in the kit for many years,
but was always reluctant to fool with it with all the warnings in the shop
manual about a spring removing various body parts and attempting to enter
orbit once give its freedom.  Might just do it this weekend.  If you're
wrong, my next of kin will be contacting you Monday. ;-)>>

It's probably of no value knowing this but I recently replaced the bottom seal
on the SIII also.  Piece of cake.  The finger reattachment was more difficult
though.  Just kidding of course!

Gerry Elam
PHX  AZ  USA
'73 Series III Soft top "Tigger"  (daily driver until it hits 110 F / 43 C)
'63 Series IIA " Soldado Sangrando"
'64 Series IIA Dormobile "Humpty Dumpty"  (interior currently in pieces)
'95 Disco "Great White"

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From: M.J.Rooth@lboro.ac.uk (Mike Rooth)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 17:15:37 +0000
Subject: RE: Little Nash Rambler(No LR Content)

>I only brought it up cause someone mentioned a british car company
>named Nash, and I didn't  know if that is what they were referring to.
*Frazer*-Nash Scott.Built sports cars with chain drive in the twenties
(and thirties??)

"Frazer-Nash did not like cogs,
 So they built a car with chains and dogs"

..As the saying went..:-)

Mike Rooth

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From: Faye and Peter Ogilvie <ogilvi@hgea.org>
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 1998 07:19:59
Subject: RE: Little Nash Rambler(No LR Content)

	Nash was also an American Car Company.  Made autos for many years and
eventually got blended into American Motors.  If you remember the old
"Boston Blackie" tv series, the cop cars were all Nashs.  My parents had
one, had the annoying habit of not starting whenever temperature dropped
below freezing.  Not a popular problem in Michigan.  Anyway, they had a
foray into the small car field called the Rambler in the 50's.  Notorious
for being slow and not especially reliable.  Hence the humor in the song,
like a Geo Metro pushing a Porsche at 150 mph.  Another historical note,
those were the days of three speed on the column manual transmissions.  The
linkage was rather complicated and notorious for getting stuck in one gear
after a little wear set in.
Aloha Peter

At 11:45 AM 11/5/98 -0500, you wrote:

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From: Faye and Peter Ogilvie <ogilvi@hgea.org>
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 1998 07:23:40
Subject: Re: Beep Beep and other Nash Rambler History.

	Nash was also an American Car Company.  Made autos for many years and
eventually got blended into American Motors.  If you remember the old
"Boston Blackie" tv series, the cop cars were all Nashs.  My parents had
one, had the annoying habit of not starting whenever temperature dropped
below freezing.  Not a popular problem in Michigan.  Anyway, they had a
foray into the small car field called the Rambler in the 50's.  Notorious
for being slow and not especially reliable.  Hence the humor in the song,
like a Geo Metro pushing a Porsche at 150 mph.  Another historical note,
those were the days of three speed on the column manual transmissions.  The
linkage was rather complicated and notorious for getting stuck in one gear
after a little wear set in.
Aloha Peter

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From: "Chris Dillard" <cdillard@Aholdusa.com>
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 12:26:09 -0500
Subject: Springs (SORRY fot DOUBLR POST)

SORRY FOR THE DOUBLE POST BUT......

 With the thread on springs going around, I though that I woudl throw in an
unrelated question. I was at the dealership the other day and they happen
to have the Camel Trophy Mundo Maya Disco  (Daphne Green and Jim Swett) and
I was crawling around under it and noticed that the rear springs were aet
up with an outer spring and a smaller diameter inner spring. I have never
seen or heard of this set-up before and was wondering if anyone had any
info or specs on this spring set-up. Thanks for the info (if anyone knows)
(cause' I don't)

Cheers,
Christopher Dillard Dba          Ahold USA (BI-LO Inc)
95 Discovery V8i (Rusty II)        cdillard@aholdusa.com
55 Series I    (???)                     Greenville, SC USA
55 Series I (The Green Hornet)
1989 Thoroughbred Racehorse (the other Rusty!!)
SoLaRos #136

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From: Thorsten Klein <kleit001@mail.Uni-Mainz.de>
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 1998 18:33:16 +0100
Subject: Re: Springs (SORRY fot DOUBLR POST)

Chris Dillard schrieb:

> I was crawling around under it and noticed that the rear springs were aet
> up with an outer spring and a smaller diameter inner spring. I have never
> seen or heard of this set-up before and was wondering if anyone had any
> info or specs on this spring set-up. Thanks for the info (if anyone knows)

It is a heavy duty setup. The standard Defender130's have this setup,
and the Camel Trophy 110s also (I had to replace a gearbox on one a year
ago). 

Bye, Thorsten

Thorsten Klein
Mainz, Germany
kleit001@mail.uni-mainz.de
SIII Lightweight (almost sold)
Defender 110 (ordered, Tdi or Td5, I do not know)

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From: Alan_Richer@motorcity2.lotus.com
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 13:21:58 -0500
Subject: Overweight Rovers - was Re: Santanna 6 cyl engines

Y'know, Fred's comment on the weight of a Dormobile interior on a 4-cylinder 109
got me to thinking. I wonder if a lot of the complaints and suggestions of
alternate power plants for Rovers are simply bad weight management on the part
of owners adding accessories?

The 4-cylinder 109 was never meant to haul a 6000-pound vehicle - by that weight
you're getting into serious Range Rover territory and a V8 or the like is
starting to look mandatory. For myself and Mr. Churchill (who is now sporting a
fresh 2.25 rebuild) we can haul a load of firewood or building materials at
65-70 on a standard motor in overdrive without having to floor the motor for
moderate hills.

Outside of an offensive taste for walnut in my 109 I keep the accessories and
gewgaws to a minimum - or if I do add them I make damned sure that they're
suitable to the vehicle and the motoring I do. This is why Mr. C hasn't been
fitted with 50 gallons worth of fuel tankage, or the Carawagon top I almost
bought when last in the UK - he's simply not powerful enough to lug an extra ton
of structure without sacrificing the performance and fuel economy I enjoy now
(18 MPG at 65 MPH is nothing to spit at!)

An example of not paying attention to the big picture was in LRW last month -
some bloke who should have known better had bought a Series III 2.25 that had
been built-up as a camper conversion a la Winnebago - and was remarking how
badly it handled, braked and went.

(vulgarity mode on)

NO S***, SHERLOCK!

(vulgarity mode off)

I think my purpose in mentioning this is perhaps to suggest that examining the
entire design of a vehicle modification is a good idea before going mad with the
accessories. Using camper conversions as above as an example, this might have
been better off being done on a 6-cylinder base (as Martin Walther did) or on an
already-modified chassis rather than subjecting a 2.25 to the slow death of
hauling too much weight.

I understand the principle of "do what you can with what you have", but
sometimes a look at the big picture first might suggest better ideas to explore
first.

          aj"food for thought"r

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From: Allan Smith <smitha@candw.lc>
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 1998 14:15:23 -0500
Subject: Re: Springs 

I was working under an ex-Kalimantan D110 in the UK a couple of weeks ago
and it had the same spring set up. If you don't get any specific info from
elsewhere you could get it from the people who are doing mods on the
vehicle: Paul Ridgeway, MRTS, fax + 44 1327 857917
Allan

At 12:26 05/11/98 -0500, you wrote:

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From: BEN_NIBALI@denso-diam.com
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 13:12:54 -0500
Subject: Alternate Intake Plumbing- Another Solution

Now THIS is what I was looking for:

hi there
so this is what you need
1 2" mechanical joint clamp go see the plumbing store guys and tell them
you want a clamp for cast iron pipe. they should give you a clamp that has
a neoprene sleeve with a stainless steel cover.
get also a 2" ABS street elbow, 90 degrees also known as a fit elbow.
you will need a short bit of 2" ABS pipe.
the clamp goes on the carb the elbow goes in the clamp and the pipe goes in
the elbow. there you have it new plumbing for real.
if you want oil breather holes other plumbing bits can be had for that too
just take the breather hose to the plumbing store with you.
good luck

kevin willey
73 air portable
96 disco - Edith

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From: Alan_Richer@motorcity2.lotus.com
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 13:43:47 -0500
Subject: Re: Alternate Intake Plumbing- Another Solution

Re: This was what I was looking for:

I LIKE it! The only thing I'd be afraid of is static charge build-up on the
PVC....

Cool - definitely a 3-banana bodge!

Seriously - it's a nice design, if you don't have the original bit.

                    ajr

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From: "Kevin and Company" <willeys@cyberus.ca>
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 13:40:11 -0500
Subject: intake,alternate
	charset="iso-8859-1"

hi there and greetings to the list

so this is what you need
1 2" mechanical joint clamp go see the plumbing store guys and tell them =
you want a clamp for cast iron pipe. they should give you a clamp that =
had a neoprene sleeve with a stainless steel cover .
get also a 2" ABS street elbow, 90 degrees alos known as a fit elbow.
you will end a short bit of 2" ABS pipe.
the clamp goes on the carb the elbow goes in the clamp and the pipe goes =
in the elbow. there you have it new plumbing for real.
it you want oil breather holes other plumbing bits can be had for that =
too just take the breather hors to the plumbing store with you.
good luck

kevin willey
73 air portable
96 disco - Edith

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From: "Adams, Bill" <badams@usia.gov>
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 14:21:19 -0500
Subject: Re: Round Smiths Heater

Take the old one out, toddle on over to Grainger with it and order a new 
one. If you can't find a Grainger in the phone book, try looking for a 
place that sells electric motors. These are an easy off-the-shelf item.

Bill Adams
3D Artist/Animator
'69 Buick LeSabre Ragtop
'66 Land Rover S2A 109 Diesel Station Wagon,
'81 Honda Goldwing 1100 Standard:
"Practicing the ancient oriental art of ren-ching"

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From: Casey McMullen <st93wxta@drexel.edu>
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 14:51:46 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: Round Smiths Heater

I don't know about the round "shin burner" but the blower motor recently 
went in my '72 SIII.  I went to a British car used parts place (mail 
order junk yard) they looked in the Smith's catalog and found that it 
shares motors with a 70-79 Sprite, so they sold me a used one.  It is the 
same motor, I just had to disassemble it and switch the mounting flange.  
When I went to install it, I discovered that the basket fan spins in the 
wrong direction.  Works ok for now, have to go back and swap fans.

If you want to maintain originality maybe there is an equivalent motor for 
the older round type???

Glad to have some heat, it's below 32 at night here in southeastern PA,
Casey M

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From: "Luis Manuel Gutierrez" <lgutierr@jccr.co.cr>
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 15:20:13 -0600
Subject: RE: Round Smiths Heater

>When I went to install it, I discovered that the basket fan spins in the
>wrong direction.  Works ok for now, have to go back and swap fans.

Isn't that just a matter of switching cables so it would spin the other way?

I had to ask! :-]

Lic. LUIS MANUEL GUTIERREZ CHACON
Jose Cartellone Construcciones Civiles S.A.
E-mail: lgutierr@jccr.co.cr
Tel: (506) 296 2743
Fax: (506) 296 2744
>When I went to install it, I discovered that the basket fan spins in the

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From: Casey McMullen <st93wxta@drexel.edu>
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 16:29:22 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: Round Smiths Heater

> >When I went to install it, I discovered that the basket fan spins in the
> >wrong direction.  Works ok for now, have to go back and swap fans.
> Isn't that just a matter of switching cables so it would spin the other way?
> I had to ask! :-]
> Lic. LUIS MANUEL GUTIERREZ CHACON

Valid question Luis, yes I did switch the cables, but the fan is designed 
to spin the other direction.  The "blades" are shaped like little troughs 
push air with their concave surfaces, now they are trying to push air 
with a convex surface.  Probably isn't quite as effective.

Casey M

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From: "Dr. Russ" <rgdushin@blackcat.cat.syr.edu>
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 18:13:17 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: Round Smith's Heater

'twas written: 
*** 
Valid question Luis, yes I did switch the cables, but
the fan is designed to spin the other direction.  The "blades" are shaped
like little troughs push air with their concave surfaces, now they are
trying to push air
with a convex surface.  Probably isn't quite as effective.
***

uh, flip the blade around the other way (so's the concave blades
face out) AND switch the cables around the other way?

r"barely works anyhow..."d/nige

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: "Frank Elson" <frankelson@felson.freeserve.co.uk>
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 18:19:27 -0000
Subject: Re: RR low beams are dead

I've always thought that the idea of dazzling the driver of a vehicle coming
towards me may just be a little bit self defeating......

Best Cheers

Frank
             +--+--+--+
            I !__|  [_]|_\___
            I ____|”_|"__|_ | /   B791 PKV - Bronze Green 110 CSW
            "(o)======(o)"

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: "Frank Elson" <frankelson@felson.freeserve.co.uk>
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 18:28:12 -0000
Subject: Re: Beep Beep and other Nash Rambler History.

like I said in an earlier mail, the Metropolitan was actually built by
Austin in the UK but sold in the States as a Nash.
No connection with the British Frazer Nash company.
BTW the song was also released in Britain but possibly because most people
(not car mad like I was - very young of course) wouldn't know what a Nash
was the slower car was changed to a 'bubble car'.

look, my fault we started this thread, can I call it off please??

Best Cheers

Frank
             +--+--+--+
            I !__|  [_]|_\___
            I ____|”_|"__|_ | /   B791 PKV - Bronze Green 110 CSW
            "(o)======(o)"

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: "Frank Elson" <frankelson@felson.freeserve.co.uk>
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 18:40:59 -0000
Subject: Re: Little Nash Rambler(No LR Content)

That's how I started this thread, they company is still around, I went there
recently, but they no longer make cars was all I said... then we get into
all this stuff..... :-)>
Best Cheers

Frank
             +--+--+--+
            I !__|  [_]|_\___
            I ____|”_|"__|_ | /   B791 PKV - Bronze Green 110 CSW
            "(o)======(o)"

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: "Frank Elson" <frankelson@felson.freeserve.co.uk>
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 18:33:37 -0000
Subject: Re: gettin belted

In the UK we didn't have the trim or the bracket. Bought a pair for my son's
71 Ser 3 the other week. bolt on......
Best Cheers

Frank
             +--+--+--+
            I !__|  [_]|_\___
            I ____|”_|"__|_ | /   B791 PKV - Bronze Green 110 CSW
            "(o)======(o)"

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: "Frank Elson" <frankelson@felson.freeserve.co.uk>
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 23:27:14 -0000
Subject: Re: Overweight Rovers - was Re: Santanna 6 cyl engines

Not the worst idea I have ever heard.
My power plant improvements have been planned and incorporated into my
budget along with my add-ons.
I simply assumed everyone did the same thing.....
if you build it, you gotta haul it.....
Best Cheers

Frank
             +--+--+--+
            I !__|  [_]|_\___
            I ____|”_|"__|_ | /   B791 PKV - Bronze Green 110 CSW
            "(o)======(o)"

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: Russ Wilson <rwwilson@mho.net>
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 05:56:31 -0700
Subject: For Sale  

I'm selling my 1967 RHD 88"  known as "The Pig".  I'm in Denver, The Pig is
in Denver... Galv. Frame, Rebuilt Engine, Weber 2 bbl, Unleaded Head,
Overdrive..
Tailgate/liftgate, 16" wheels, Mansfield heater etc....I have a JPEG shot
for anyone interested.  Asking price is $8,000  or best offer.

Russ Wilson
Leslie Bittner

"That's just my opinion; I could be wrong...."
				Dennis Miller

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: Jarvis64@aol.com
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 19:21:51 EST
Subject: Anchoring belts

Howdy everyone,
One more dumb question.  I'm about to put Saab 900 belts up front (got 'em for
$5 ea. at the local junkyard).  The reels mounted flat on the floor in the
Saab, so I ought to mount 'em flat on the floor in my 109SW.  Here's the
question:

The chassis outrigger is directly under the floor right behind the front
seats.  Can I just drill right through the floor and outrigger and use grade 8
stuff to mount the reel right there, or is there too much body/chassis play
for this to be a good idea?

Thanks for any controversial answers,
Bill

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From: Jarvis64@aol.com
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 19:21:57 EST
Subject: daveb, what did you say?

Dave,
You replied to my seatbelt bracket question but your message got exorcised.
What were you trying to say?

Bill

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: Jarvis64@aol.com
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 19:21:40 EST
Subject: Re:  Re: Wanted: stuff

Enzo asked what the bracket I want looks like.

It's about 5 in. long and 3/4 in. across.  Mounts vertically just above and
behind the driver's (and passenger's) seats.  On a 109SW, it's mounted in the
corner formed by the rooftop and the long upright support between front and
middle doors.  On a SIII 88" I reckon it's mounted just forward of the sliding
glass window in the roofside.  Bren sez they're there, even if they're lurking
behind your trim.

Anyone got some?

Bill

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: DNDANGER@aol.com
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 19:36:36 EST
Subject: Re: 6cyl pisons in a four?

In a message dated 98-11-05 07:11:19 EST, you write:

<< I don't know which six Frank was talking about in his funny-racer's-story
but
 I assume it was the santana 6 for the same reason.
   ** >>

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: DNDANGER@aol.com
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 19:59:47 EST
Subject: Re: Little Nash Rambler(No LR Content)

In a message dated 98-11-05 12:05:53 EST, you write:

 I only brought it up cause someone mentioned a british car company
 named Nash, and I didn't  know if that is what they were referring to.
  >>
Frazer-Nash was a british car company with no relationship to either the
american Kaiser/ Frazer  or Nash companies. They specialized in limited
production sports cars and built cars which were quite competetive in their
class. The one eccentric feature of these cars up into the fifties was their
reliance on chain drive to the rear wheels. Affectionados of these vehicles
are therefore referred to as "the chain gang".

Bill Lawrence
Albq, NM

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From: "David and Cynthia Walker" <wahooadv@earthlink.net>
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 00:41:34 -0800
Subject: looking for oil filler cap

I am looking for the oil filler cap - that fits on a Bedford.....the flip
open type with the catch.

I saw it put in a Series I and thought that it looked great.
Any leads out there?

Cheers
David
Full-time father of Alexander - 3.85 years old
1970 Land Rover IIA, 88" - "BEAN TOAD"
S/V KALAKALA  - our home, ketch rigged
wahooadv@earthlink.net

end of message

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: Winn Bearden <wbearden@americus.net>
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 1998 20:33:07 -0500
Subject: Re: Any other vehicles which came with Lucas Dizzy?

A friend of mine has a junkyard/ towing service.  He has an Austin America if 
anyone
needs some parts off of it.  By the way, (main reason I'm writing), is that he 
gave
me a catalog that caters to tow companies.  This catalog has all kinds of 
recovery
equipment (winches, straps, chains, etc) but also has gas cans AND gas can 
holders
that some of you were asking about.  Prices were fair to average.  The name of 
the
outfit was AW Direct and I think that they are out of CT.  If anyone wants their
number I can probably find it.

john cranfield wrote:

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: Winn Bearden <wbearden@americus.net>
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 1998 20:43:29 -0500
Subject: Re: Any other vehicles which came with Lucas Dizzy?

A friend of mine has a junkyard/ towing service.  He has an Austin
America if anyone
needs some parts off of it.  By the way, (main reason I'm writing), is
that he gave
me a catalog that caters to tow companies.  This catalog has all kinds
of recovery
equipment (winches, straps, chains, etc) but also has gas cans AND gas
can holders
that some of you were asking about.  Prices were fair to average.  The
name of the
outfit was AW Direct and I think that they are out of CT.  If anyone
wants their
number I can probably find it.

john cranfield wrote:

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: James Wolf <J.Wolf@worldnet.att.net>
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 1998 21:56:47
Subject: see below

>GE Capital IT Solutions
>This email is confidential. If you are not the intended recipient,
>you must not disclose or use the information contained in it.
>If you have received this mail in error, please tell us
>immediately by return email and delete the document.

What a croc. 

Jim Wolf

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: SPYDERS@aol.com
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 21:00:58 EST
Subject: Re:  see below

In a message dated 11/5/98 9:58:50 PM, you wrote:

<<What a croc.>>

Thanks to *lro-lite*, I didn't even have to "see below"

The wonders of the digester, saving me from having to look at crocs. It is bad
enough I live in Florida with all the gators around... crocs do liven things
up a bit <chomp>

--pat.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: john taylor <jht@easynet.on.ca>
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 1998 21:19:56 -0500
Subject: Re: d.h.and 101

Hi Dave 
Did you ever describe for the list your illfated trip in the dear 101?
I only heard the Storey second-hand, not the full version with all the juicy
details.
j.t.
IIa V6 bastard

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: Jpslotus27@aol.com
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 21:13:47 EST
Subject: Help with Overdrive Installation again

OK - The Toro OD is in place, but it is VERY stiff going into and out of
overdrive.  Will this loosen up once oil get splashed around in there or will
I have to start lifting weights to be able to shift it?  

Thanks
Enzo

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: jimfoo@uswest.net
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 1998 19:36:24 -0800
Subject: Re: Help with Overdrive Installation again

Jpslotus27@aol.com wrote:
> OK - The Toro OD is in place, but it is VERY stiff going into and out of
> overdrive.  Will this loosen up once oil get splashed around in there or will
> I have to start lifting weights to be able to shift it?

Mine was very stiff also, and then got easier, and then got harder. When
I changed the oil, I put synthetic in and overfilled it a little. It now
stifts out of od easier, but shifting into od requires letting off the
gas quickly while shifting without the clutch. You might try adding more
90wt and see what happens.

Jim Hall
Elephant Chaser 1966 88" truck cab

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: jimfoo@uswest.net
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 1998 19:37:34 -0800
Subject: Re: 6cyl pisons in a four?

DNDANGER@aol.com wrote:
> In a message dated 98-11-05 07:11:19 EST, you write:
> << I don't know which six Frank was talking about in his funny-racer's-story

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: Art Bitterman <artbitt@rmi.net>
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 1998 19:54:47 -0700
Subject: Re Alternative plumbing

Hi all!!

Alan Richter Commented:

I LIKE it! The only thing I'd be afraid of is static charge build-up on
the
PVC....

Easy fix-just ground the PVC. A length of wire from the PVC to ground!

Same principle as what you do when working with Computer chips.

Art
1960 SII "Aardvark"

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: DNDANGER@aol.com
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 22:32:22 EST
Subject: Re: 6cyl pisons in a four?

In a message dated 98-11-05 21:44:07 EST, you write:

<< I had it. It said the 2.6
 Jim Hall >>
Thanks Jim, that's what I thought. The displacement of four of the 2.6 liter
pistons (assuming constant a stroke) is about 1.7 liters. The second range of
SI engines was 1.6 liters. I suppose if the engine block was overbored the 2.6
pistons would fit. I don't know what the comparative compression ratios were
but I assume the 2.6, being a more modern engine (barely), would be higher.

Bill Lawrence
Albq, NM

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: "Piet Fourie : pah@saao.ac.za" <pah@saao.ac.za>
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1998 07:19:29 +0200 (SAT)
Subject: Re: Any other vehicles which came with Lucas Dizzy?

> About to go to the junkyard (auto recyclers) to look for a "new style" Lucas 4
> cylinder distributor to get dizzy cap clips from.  Are there any other makes
> that used this?  I assume later Triumphs and MG's did, true?  Any others?

Have a look at the Mini (the car that is), they used the same distributor
as a landy.

Piet

P.A.H. Fourie   ( pah@saao.ac.za )
South African Astronomical Observatory.
P.O. Box 25 Sutherland 6920 South Africa.
Tel 023 5711135. Fax 023 5711413

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: TeriAnn Wakeman <twakeman@cruzers.com>
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 98 21:51:53 -0800
Subject: Re: Santanna 6 cyl engines

/*
 * Subject: Santana 6 cyl engines
 * 
 * Anyone know anything about them??
 * 
 * They are supposed to be a LR four cylinder with two added cylinders.  
 * Rumor has it that they take LR four cylinder engine parts.
 */

;>Gee I don't know, TeriAnn, I think you are starting to haul too much
;>camping equiptment in that doormobile of yours for your 4 cyclinder to
;>carry.  Maybe you should consider an RV for your Portland excursions ;)
;>
;>At least you wouldn't have to wax the aluminum siding...

I agree I am hauling around too much fuel, water, parts and camping 
equipment for the 2-1/4L engine.

I have discovered that the longer you stay out in the field the more you 
need.  Anyone can put up with just about anything for 2 or 3 days.  
Longer than that minimalist camping can get very old very fast.  

If you are in the field two or three weeks or months at a time, being 
comfortable makes a big difference on morale and enjoyment.

How you equip a LR depends upon how you use it.  If you just tootle 
around town or go on weekend jaunts you don't need to equip the LR at 
all.  However if you go out for longer trips away from civilization you 
need to worry about carrying quantities of fuel & water, sleeping and 
cooking dry and keeping food cool longer than a block of ice will last.  
Personally, I like to go on long trips away from people into primitive 
areas.  I DO hope that you are not implying that an old LR does not have 
what it takes to become a long range expedition vehicle.

I do drive to places other than Portland..at least when I have $$$ for 
petrol :^(

Take care

TeriAnn
Motel 23

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: TeriAnn Wakeman <twakeman@cruzers.com>
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 98 21:57:40 -0800
Subject: Re: Overweight Rovers - was Re: Santanna 6 cyl engines

>Y'know, Fred's comment on the weight of a Dormobile interior on a 
>4-cylinder 109 got me to thinking. I wonder if a lot of the complaints 
;> and suggestions of alternate power plants for Rovers are simply 
;> bad weight management on the part of owners adding accessories?

Martin Walters did it because the 2-1/4L engine was all that was 
available.  I did it because it was what I had and I could not afford to 
purchase nor could I legally import a 110 two door with a bigger engine.

I think I'm dealing with a North American problem.  In Europe, Africa, 
Australia & New Zealand someone would just start building an expedition 
LR with a LR that has a more powerful engine.  Since LRs are common in 
those areas owners wouldn't think twice about swapping in a more powerful 
engine if needed. LRs are common there & swapping engines is no big deal. 
 It's kind of like Jeep owners swapping engines in North America.

But in North America, they stopped importing 109s at the end of '67.  
This drastically limits options for LRs to modify for long range 
expedition.  And for some reason Americans seem to think that an engine 
that Rover discontinued because it wasn't powerful enough is sacred.

Maybe a more powerful engine is just one step in building a long range 
expedition out of a pre-'68 109.  I hope that you are not saying that old 
Land Rovers do not have what it takes to be converted into long range 
expedition vehicles.

;>The 4-cylinder 109 was never meant to haul a 6000-pound vehicle

I sure agree with that.  At 5400 pounds my car is seriously slow.

> I keep the accessories and gewgaws to a minimum

I used to to it your way, back when my car was a working farm LR.  But 
even then she was VERY slow pulling a loaded two horse trailer or driving 
through the mountains with about 1430 pounds of hay in the back(11 bales 
@ 130 lb ea).  Back in those days my car was a short range farm car and 
was seldom out for longer than 3 days on a trip.  You don't need much in 
a car if you just take short drives, Or longer drives for a weekend.

But I sold the livestock and decided that I wanted to go on long trips 
into the outback.  So my minimalist LR 109 has been built into a long 
range LR.  Had I been in countries where newer & more powerful LRs were 
common I would have started with a more powerful 110 two door.  
Unfortunately for me US regulations prohibited me from doing this and 
staying legal.  SO I do what I can with what I have.

Yes I have a lot of gear in the car, but try to stay out in the field for 
months at a time without much gear.  

;> Using camper conversions as above as an example, this might have
:>been better off being done on a 6-cylinder base (as Martin Walter did)

Martin Walters built most of their LR based Dormobile conversions onto 
four cylinder Land Rovers. They offered a version with 2-1/4L diesel if 
you want to talk about underpowered.   The 6 cylinder wasn't available 
until '67 which was the last year 109s were imported into North America.  
Only a small number of the Dormobiles originally sold into North America 
had six cylinder engines.

;>I understand the principle of "do what you can with what you have", but
;>sometimes a look at the big picture first might suggest better ideas to 
;>explore first.

I reject a big picture that says I have to keep the car as a short range 
car that isn't suited for trips longer than 3 or 4 days.  I do not 
believe that that is part of the original Land Rover spirit.

Why is it that in North America the 2-1/4L engine considered to be the 
heart and soul of a LR?

:>          aj"food for thought"r

I wonder about this a lot.

TeriAnn Wakeman                       The Green Rover, rebuilt and
Santa Cruz, California                and maintained using parts from
twakeman@cruzers.com                  British Pacific 800-554-4133
http://www.cruzers.com/~twakeman      

Walk in harmony with the earth and all her creatures and you will create 
beauty wherever you go.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: "Franklin H. Yap" <FHYap@ix.netcom.com>
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 1998 22:21:25 -0800
Subject: Re: Overweight Rovers - was Re: Santanna 6 cyl engines

TeriAnn Wakeman wrote:

> >Y'know, Fred's comment on the weight of a Dormobile interior on a
> >4-cylinder 109 got me to thinking. I wonder if a lot of the complaints
> ;> and suggestions of alternate power plants for Rovers are simply
> ;> bad weight management on the part of owners adding accessories?...
> I think I'm dealing with a North American problem.

I think it is a North America problem in that North America is so large you
have to cover a lot of freeway miles to get from here to there.  I had a
diesel VW Vanagon Westfalia that I used to take long trips across the US and
Canada.  It was probably slower that TW's 109.  I kept wishing for more
power.

Frank

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: Joseph Broach <jbroach@selway.umt.edu>
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 23:26:42 -0700
Subject: Re: Overweight Rovers - was Re: Santanna 6 cyl engines

>Why is it that in North America the 2-1/4L engine considered to be the
>heart and soul of a LR?

Because after 31 years -without- being opened up my 2 1/4 still chugs along
without burning any oil? You must admit that the 2 1/4 is as overbuilt as
the rest of a Land Rover and does suit it well from that perspective. But,
then again, a Land Rover's main purpose is to suit the needs of its owner,
and versatility is a trademark. It really is a shame Rover never really got
into the I-6 craze like so many other manufacturers of the day; maybe this
is where the Santana engine could fit in?

-joseph and sidney
missoula, mt

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: "The Becketts" <hillman@bigpond.com>
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1998 06:02:26 +1100
Subject: cheap window tracking

Dr. Russ wrote:

>but don't look now folks...one supplier of bits here in the NE
>USA (uh, happens to "sponsor" this list) sells decent window
>channel with synthetic felt (not sure what Derlin slides are?)

"Derlin" is probably a spelling error. I think it should have read Delrin -
a type of plastic.

Ron

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: "The Becketts" <hillman@bigpond.com>
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 23:10:22 +1100
Subject: Series III colors

>Limestone and Desert Sand were two very distinct colors. The Limestone, as
you state, was a cream or off-white color while the Desert sand was a darker
tan
color and actually quite attractive IMHO.>

Martin replied:
<I never knew that.  I've seen perhaps one or two Series Land Rovers in the
darker tan color, but I always assumed they had been resprayed.  >

Desert Sand was, I think, the most common colour for Series III LR in
Australia.  I assume that was the colour.  Check the LR advert "Wash The Car
This Weekend"
on my web site at
http:\\www.users.bigpond.com\hillman\rover\serieads.html

Regards,

Ron

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: "The Becketts" <hillman@bigpond.com>
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1998 06:13:20 +1100
Subject: Fuel Tank Positions

Bill Wrote:
>I have a fundamental philosophical problem with using the
>auxilliary fuel supply for a bumper. Anyone remember the Pinto?

Art replied:

>Yep-and also remember the Stick NBC's "Dateline" made about side mounted
>gas tanks on GM pickup trucks. So familiar as to the posistion of Land
>Rover Gas Tanks!! How many Landies  have burst into flames when Hit?

I have toyed with the idea of fitting 2 of Rangie Spares sill mounted tanks
(each 40 litres capacity) to my rangie to increase the fuel capacity to 160
litres (42 US gals or 35 Imperial gals) but I can't quite convince myself
that having fuel tanks under the sills is a good idea.  I guess I'll go with
the conventional 120 litre (32 US gal or 26 Imperial gal) replacement tank.

Perhaps one of the sill tanks might get fitted for as a water tank.

Regards,
Ron Beckett

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: Faye and Peter Ogilvie <ogilvi@hgea.org>
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 1998 20:43:41
Subject: Re: Fuel Tank Positions

	Typical hatchet job by a tv editorial.  Yes there were more fires in
chevies with the saddle tanks, though not a whole lot more than ford, but
the chevy trucks had a lower number of fatal accidents.  Doesn't matter
whether your dead fried or dead crushed, you are still no longer with us.
Think its a non problem that makes good television but bad logic, like Alar
(sp).  Also an excuse for a runaway jury to make some poor souls relatives
rich.
Aloha Peter

>>Yep-and also remember the Stick NBC's "Dateline" made about side mounted
>>gas tanks on GM pickup trucks. S

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: Faye and Peter Ogilvie <ogilvi@hgea.org>
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 1998 20:50:54
Subject: Re: Jade Green, any idea what paint code is for that.

	My 1966 or possibly 1965 109 pickup was repainted slime green, probably 
an
imitation of pastel green.  The original colour was a darker, much more
attractive green, however.  Somewhere along the line, I've heard it
referred to as Jade Green probably because that is what it resembles.  Any
one have any idea if there is a paint code for that colour.
Aloha Peter

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: Faye and Peter Ogilvie <ogilvi@hgea.org>
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 1998 20:59:46
Subject: Re: Getting engine to mate up with transmission.

	Trying to get my new 5 main bearing engine into my 88 by myself.  Got 
the
engine in the bay and bell housing studs into the transmission but can't
get it to go any further.  It is in slightly off center as I can just
barely get nuts on two of the studs on the right side.  I've tried turning
the engine over with a breaker bar and socket as I rock it every which way
I can, tried raising and lowering the engine, moving it from side to side,
putting nuts on the studs that are through and then doing all the above.
Cannot get the transmission splines to mate with the clutch.
	Any tips or ideas would be appreciated.  The last time I did it, had 
help
from my son and went right together with a little rock and roll from both
of us.  Do I just need more manpower???
Aloha Peter

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: Art Bitterman <artbitt@rmi.net>
Date: Fri, 06 Nov 1998 00:49:30 -0700
Subject: Fuel Tank Posistions

Peter (from Hawaii) Wrote:

 Typical hatchet job by a tv editorial.

And

Think its a non problem that makes good television but bad logic, like
Alar
(sp).  Also an excuse for a runaway jury to make some poor souls
relatives
rich.

My point exactly!! I never knew there was a problem until "Dateline"
Brought it up. Never have seen or heard of a GM pick-up, that burnt up
after getting t-boned-or for that matter, a Pinto going up in Flames
after getting rear ended.

I was saying thet our beloved alumunum friends have the petrol tank in
the same spot!!

Oh NO!!! Don't tell NBC!!

I can see it now--"Tonight on Dateline-The Killer British Classic"

Film at 11

Art
1960 SII "Aardvark"

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

From: Andy Grafton <braag@sherco.co.za>
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1998 09:51:28 +0200 (SAT)
Subject: Re: Getting engine to mate up with transmission.

> 	Any tips or ideas would be appreciated.  The last time I did it, had 
help
> from my son and went right together with a little rock and roll from both

Try removing the engine mountings - that gives you much more room to manipulate 
the
engine vertically.

All the best,

Andy

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From: "Huub Pennings" <hps@fs1-kfih.azr.nl>
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1998 09:30:41 +0100
Subject: Re: Getting engine to mate up with transmission.

Hello Peter,
	if  the transmission splines won't mate with the clutch.
you better check the alignment of the clutchplate, I guess it is out 
of center..........

Been there.

Regards,

Huub Pennings
(private e-mail to jpennings@worldonline.nl

e-mail adress
Pennings@kfih.azr.nl

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From: Paul Oxley <paul@adventures.co.za>
Date: Fri, 06 Nov 1998 10:47:38 +0200
Subject: Re: Fuel Tank Positions

Guys, guys, guys, why all the fuss?

I have two Jerry cans full of high octane fitted to my FRONT bumper.
They're mounted so that the actually protrude beyond the bumper by at
least a third of their length. I've used this mounting position for
three years now with nary a problem (I only use solid ex-military, NATO
standard jerries, and figure that they're stronger than most car's
petrol tanks in any case).

Besides, I'm sitting way back behind the spare wheel so hopefully I will
have a birds-eye view of the resulting conflagration without being
intimately involved.
 
Regards

Paul (just how well-done would you like your steak sir?) Oxley
http://AfricanAdrenalin.co.za
http://Adventures.co.za

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From: "Steve Mace" <steve@solwise.co.uk>
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1998 08:49:40 -0000
Subject: LR Schematics

Sorry to go over old ground; I'm sure that this has been 
covered in the past but I just can't find the postings in 
question in the archive.

I'm trying to obtain schematics for the dirty bits of a D90. 
You know the engine, axles, gearbox etc.... I'm pretty 
sure I remeber someone pointing to a sight which has 
them but I just can't find the reference (a case of wood for 
the trees I think).

Can anyone point to the correct URL?

Thanks...

Steve Mace

1972 SIII LtWt
1993 D90
In the UK
Name: Dr Steve Mace
E-mail: steve@solwise.co.uk
www: http://www.solwise.co.uk
Tel: +44 1482 473899
Fax: +44 1482 472245

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From: Paul Oxley <paul@adventures.co.za>
Date: Fri, 06 Nov 1998 10:51:36 +0200
Subject: Re: Series III colors

The Becketts wrote:
>  Check the LR advert "Wash The Car
> This Weekend"
> on my web site at
> http:\\www.users.bigpond.com\hillman\rover\serieads.html

Hey Ron,

So not only are you Aussies upside-down, but also back-to-front...

But never-the-less, really cool advert :-)
 
Regards

Paul Oxley
http://AfricanAdrenalin.co.za
http://Adventures.co.za

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From: Robert Tryzell <tryzell@ket.kth.se>
Date: Fri, 06 Nov 1998 10:25:57 +0100
Subject: Re: LR Schematics

Steve Mace wrote:

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From: Faye and Peter Ogilvie <ogilvi@hgea.org>
Date: Fri, 06 Nov 1998 00:05:02
Subject: Re: Getting engine to mate up with transmission.

	Its in!!!!!!   Decided to pull the engine out and start over.  Checked 
the
clutch alignment and it was spot on so that wasn't the problem.  Did notice
some fine metal pieces indicating that the clutch and splines shaft were at
least getting together.  Took off the engine mounts as suggested by Andy,
went in the house and had something to eat, looked through a classic car
magazine, then went back to it.  Slipped the engine in, fiddled with it a
bit, could feel the splines starting to match up, shoved on it good and
hard and it was in.  Taking off the engine mounts gave it a little more
room to maneuver but not one whole hell of a lot.  Think it just decided
that it had given me enough grief and was time to play nice.  
	Mahalo for the input Huub and Andy.  My neighbors would have gotten 
really
pissed if my compressor had gone on one more time after 11pm.
	One last question.  I sprayed engine storage stuff in the motor when I
finally admitted it wasn't going to get installed right away.  The motor
was freshly rebuilt and not run when I did this three years ago.  Do I have
to worry about this stuff causing problems with ring seating or other
problems with the break in.  Thought about spraying lacquer thinner in the
engine and turning it over with the starter motor to dissolve the gunk
before actually firing it up in earnest.  I think it is basically a wax
that seemed much like LPS3.  Really don't want to take the head off again
though I have been threatening to mill it to up compression.
Aloha Peter

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From: Faye and Peter Ogilvie <ogilvi@hgea.org>
Date: Fri, 06 Nov 1998 00:16:07
Subject: Re: Getting engine to mate up with transmission.

	Its in!!!!!!   Decided to pull the engine out and start over.  Checked 
the
clutch alignment and it was spot on so that wasn't the problem.  Did notice
some fine metal pieces indicating that the clutch and splines shaft were at
least getting together.  Took off the engine mounts as suggested by Andy,
went in the house and had something to eat, looked through a classic car
magazine, then went back to it.  Slipped the engine in, fiddled with it a
bit, could feel the splines starting to match up, shoved on it good and
hard and it was in.  Taking off the engine mounts gave it a little more
room to maneuver but not one whole hell of a lot.  Think it just decided
that it had given me enough grief and was time to play nice.  
	Mahalo for the input Huub and Andy.  My neighbors would have gotten 
really
pissed if my compressor had gone on one more time after 11pm.
	One last question.  I sprayed engine storage stuff in the motor when I
finally admitted it wasn't going to get installed right away.  The motor
was freshly rebuilt and not run when I did this three years ago.  Do I have
to worry about this stuff causing problems with ring seating or other
problems with the break in.  Thought about spraying lacquer thinner in the
engine and turning it over with the starter motor to dissolve the gunk
before actually firing it up in earnest.  I think it is basically a wax
that seemed much like LPS3.  Really don't want to take the head off again
though I have been threatening to mill it to up compression.
Aloha Peter

	Is the major hijacking my posts.  I posted this a little while ago but 
got
no confirmation message.  Did it go out and can I quit double posting.
Seems to happen randomly but quite often.  Don't know whether I should
resend the messages or assume that they went through and I just didn't get
a copy.

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From: "Frank Elson" <frankelson@felson.freeserve.co.uk>
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1998 10:17:51 -0000
Subject: Re: 6cyl pisons in a four?

hey guys, I'm here...

had a quick look for the actual paperwork describing the fitting of the
pistons but not found it yet and I'm preparing for an off-roading trip
(leaving in about ten minutes) so ain't got too much time.
It was the 2.6 litre Six cylinder engine NOT from Santana but fromL/R.

I'll find the complete details one day but it was at least fifteen years ago
that this became one of those "secret" tips that everyone knew about, at
least in the UK.

Under Association Of Rover Club rules we were tied down to what we could do
to a vehicle, Rover part numbers etc (not a lot better these days) for
competition.

I went a different route and fitted a 2.2 TC engine (out of the Rover P6
saloon so therefore a Rover part #) into my Lightweight. It flew, with
Rangie diffs, but was a bit too highly geared for off-roading.

Best Cheers

Frank
             +--+--+--+
            I !__|  [_]|_\___
            I ____|”_|"__|_ | /   B791 PKV - Bronze Green 110 CSW
            "(o)======(o)"

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From: M.J.Rooth@lboro.ac.uk (Mike Rooth)
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1998 10:18:46 +0000
Subject: Re: Overweight Rovers - was Re: Santanna 6 cyl engines

>Maybe a more powerful engine is just one step in building a long range
>expedition out of a pre-'68 109.  I hope that you are not saying that old
>Land Rovers do not have what it takes to be converted into long range
>expedition vehicles.
They do,but one of the first and most frequent bits of advice from
the experts in this field is *dont overload them*.
. They offered a version with 2-1/4L diesel if
>you want to talk about underpowered.
I recall a certain young gentleman,now reappearing on this list,who took
two 2 1/4 diesel 109"'s from England to S.A.I've *seen* him pull out
of a carpark here with a ton aboard (most of it on the roof,if memory
serves) bound for London.The roll factor was awe-inspiring,and that was
in bottom gear! However,the 109" cruised at fifty *and* returned a better
fuel consumption than the petrol would have done.Moral of story,dont
criticise the 2 1/4 diesel until you've had one awhile.

>Why is it that in North America the 2-1/4L engine considered to be the
>heart and soul of a LR?
>Land Rovers do not have what it takes to be converted into long range
Because,probably,its a perfectly adequate power unit.If you're in a hurry
buy a Ferrari,and if you want to haul gear,try a Mack.

Mike Rooth

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From: Peter =?iso-8859-1?Q?Thor=E9n?= <peter.thoren@genetik.uu.se>
Date: 	Fri, 06 Nov 1998 11:05:58 +0100
Subject: more gearbox problems

Dear friends,

As I said a couple of days ago I couldn´t shift gear after I reassembled my
gearbox. The obvious and easy answer was that the gearshift lever was in
the wrong slot (yes, I know I am stupid...). After correcting this all
gears now works nicely except the reverse. I was about to go for a
testdrive and started the engine pressed the clutch, put the gearshift
lever iinto reverse and released the clutch slowly and...an expensive and
horrible sound told me that the gears didn´t engage properly.  When moving
the gearbox lever into reverse it feels allright until you release the
clutch. This does not happen for gear 1-4. Here is a short resume of what I
have done:

Gearbox out of the car
Bellhousing off the gearbox
Changed primary pinion bearing and layshaft bearing 
Put everything back together using new seals
Adjusted the reverse stop (the one which is supposed to stop you from shift
to reverse instead of first gear)

I have not touched anything else. I unscrewed the adjusting screw quite a
bit in order to feel any stop for the reverse gear. Could this be my
problem, I also noticed that the holes for the bolts holding the gearshift
lever is quite large making it possible to move the whole gearshift
assembly a little bit. Could it be that the gearshift lever should be
moved? I would very much appreciate any help in this matter. I cant even
testdrive the car because I need the reverse to get out of the outhouse
where I am working with the car and no I cant push it out because the state
of the ground outside is such that I need reverse in low gear and 4wd to
get out...

Thanks,

Peter

Peter Thorén, PhD 
Department of Genetics
Uppsala University
Box 7003; S-750 07 Uppsala
Sweden
Tel. +46 18 67 12 69
Fax  +46 18 67 27 05
e-mail: Peter.Thoren@genetik.uu.se

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From: "Huub Pennings" <hps@fs1-kfih.azr.nl>
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1998 11:41:15 +0100
Subject: Re: Getting engine to mate up with transmission.

>  Thought about spraying 
>lacquer thinner in the engine and turning it over with the starter 
>motor to dissolve the gunk before actually firing it up in earnest.  

Don't know, the thinner might be aggressive and dissolve your oil 
seals? I would flush it with diesel, but it might be that I am 
over cautious.

Regards,

Huub Pennings
(private e-mail to jpennings@worldonline.nl

e-mail adress
Pennings@kfih.azr.nl

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From: Alan_Richer@motorcity2.lotus.com
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1998 06:44:15 -0500
Subject: Re: Getting engine to mate up with transmission.

First off, make doggone sure that the plate and such actually will mate with the
output shaft of the transmission. I've seen bad clutch plates new that were
burred so that the splines wouldn't slide in.

Second - you did line up the plates when you were assembling the clutch onto the
flywheel, right? I'm sure you did, but sometimes it pays to examine the obvious.

My personal favorite trick is to support the transmission's front end with a
block of wood on the front crossmember (a chunk of 2x2 is perfect for this).
Then, I cut 3 long 3/8" coarse-thread bolts and point the tips, then slot them
with a hacksaw. These get put in place of 3 of the studs, giving you a guide
path to work along. The slots are so you can use a screwdriver to remove them...

After putting these in, sling the motor in and catch it on the studs, then slide
it back. The trick to alignment is making sure that the engine and tranny are in
the same plane in all 3 dimensions - height, tilt and lateral angle. What's
probably happening in your instance is that the front or rear of the engine is
tilted compared to the transmission, so the shaft will go in but the splines are
too far out of angle to lock in.

You may need to pop out the motor mounts to give yourself enough swing room, or
shift the engine on the lift chain.

It will go in, though.

Lastly, a bit of grease on the splines and the pilot bearing makes things a lot
easier - don't overdo, though, as you don't want it slinging all over the clutch
later.

                    Alan

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