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1 Alan Richer/CAM/Lotus [A5Saw this on rec.autos.antique - cheap LR engine!
2 eheite@dmv.com (Ned Heit20Land Rover Magazines
3 Paul Snoek [P.M.A.Snoek@18RE: PARTS CATALOGUE
4 JDolan2109@aol.com 22Re: Thermo fit...
5 "Niel J. P. Fagan" [NF@o24 Re: Free wheel hubs
6 RoverNut@aol.com 26electrical rebuilds
7 "Mark Gehlhausen" [Gehl@9Re: Thermo fit...
8 RoverNut@aol.com 20Dissention in the Yanks
9 "Mark Gehlhausen" [Gehl@10Series Knuckle Busters
10 "Mark Gehlhausen" [Gehl@10High Parts Cost?
11 "Bobeck, David R." [dbob62Re: Dissention in the Yanks
12 "Bobeck, David R." [dbob15Re: electrical rebuilds
13 Tre McCroskey [tmccroske6Re: Land Rover Magazines
14 "Bobeck, David R." [dbob30Re: High Parts Cost?
15 "John J. Tackley" [jtack27Dual or Single Brake Sys.
16 Dixon Kenner [dkenner@NR34Re: High Parts Cost?
17 Easton Trevor [TEASTON@D17Overdrives
18 "Bobeck, David R." [dbob62Re: Dual or Single Brake Sys.
19 "John J. Tackley" [jtack32E-Z Bleed
20 marsden@digicon-egr.co.u17Re: E-Z Bleed
21 GElam30092@aol.com 27K&N filters
22 "Mark Gehlhausen" [Gehl@16High Parts Cost?
23 ben@bell-labs.com 24super-coil
24 "T. Stevenson" [gbfv08@u21Re: LRO International
25 cascardo@ix.netcom.com (16Check Engine light
26 Jeremy Bartlett [bartlet13Re: E-Z Bleed
27 M.J.Rooth@lboro.ac.uk (M22Re: High Parts Cost?
28 "Mark Gehlhausen" [Gehl@15Re: EZ Bleed
29 David_R@mindspring.com (36FINALLY a LRO
30 pwakefie@isd3.esrin.esa.53Lancastrians on tour
31 "Bobeck, David R." [dbob51Re: High Parts Cost?
32 Chris Brosious [brosious33Re: New LR sort of
33 "Mark Gehlhausen" [Gehl@12@Highway Speed?
34 ChrisF6724@aol.com 21Re: Free Wheel Hubs
35 Faye Ogilvie [ogilvi@hge48Re: fw hubs, rod knock
36 matthew stein [matthew_s19Rovers
37 matthew stein [matthew_s19Rovers
38 Jon Nyhus [bmc@syspac.co25Range Rover For Sale
39 Christopher Dow [dow@the12Speedo Cable
40 Alan Richer/CAM/Lotus [A5Re: @Highway Speed?
41 CompuServe_Mail [postmas8Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]
42 CompuServe_Mail [postmas40Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]
43 RICK_SNYDER@HP-Andover-o16Rangie Steering-play
44 Dixon Kenner [dkenner@NR17Re: High Parts Cost?
45 Harincar@mooregs.com (Ti25re: Chained again
46 AKBLACKLEY@aol.com 1672 Rangie
47 "Boehme, Doug" [dboehme@61RE: Fording with the Disco (was: Longer Range Antenna & Door R
48 "Tom Rowe" [trowe@aae.wi24Re: Gasahol - why shouldn't I use it?
49 12/4/95 [rsloan@titan.li39ice capades
50 "Boehme, Doug" [dboehme@55RE: ice capades
51 "Bobeck, David R." [dbob22Re: @Highway Speed?
52 Sanna@aol.com 37Re: Dissention in the Yanks
53 lopezba@atnet.at 21Re: MoT
54 lopezba@atnet.at 21Re: FWH's
55 "Bobeck, David R." [dbob31Re[2]: New LR sort of
56 Jeffrey A Berg [jeff@pur90Yankin' the hubs again
57 "Bobeck, David R." [dbob53Re[2]: Dissention in the Yanks
58 "Adams, Bill" [badams@us21Irie good time, mon!
59 Kevin Girling [lroshop@i14LROI
60 Jeffrey A Berg [jeff@pur30Re: FWH's
61 Tre McCroskey [tmccroske8Re: LROI
62 faurecm@halcyon.com (C. 43Re: Engaging 4wd on the move
63 Mike Johnson [johnsonm@b18Re: LROI
64 "William L. Leacock" [wl29LRO Magazine.
65 "Tom Rowe" [trowe@aae.wi26Re: LRO Magazine.
66 Andrew Howton [andrew_ho25Rover outing in Alberta
67 Kevin Girling [lroshop@i16Re: LROI
68 Kevin Girling [lroshop@i18Subscription Prices
69 rover@pinn.net (Alexande26Hotter coils, welded points
70 Uncle Roger [sinasohn@cr20Re: Hand Throttle
71 Uncle Roger [sinasohn@cr22Re: @Highway Speed?
72 rover@pinn.net (Alexande19LRO
73 "Beckett, Ron" [rbeckett53RE: Purchase of 1990 Defender 90 (NZ)/Diesel Engine Life
74 Andrew Howton [andrew_ho28Rover outing in Alberta
75 Wdcockey@aol.com 24Re: Engaging 4X4 on the move (mystery)
76 Wdcockey@aol.com 19Prefab Social Circle (AutoWeek Nov 4, 1996)
77 landrvr@blacdisc.com (Mi14Re: Free wheel hubs
78 rogers@batnet.com (Jeffr7NAS Defender 90 Information
79 Wdcockey@aol.com 28Replacing brake lines (Re: Dual or Single Brake Sys.)
80 "Beckett, Ron" [rbeckett67RE: Rover FWH
81 "Johnny Halverson" [halv7subscribe
82 CompuServe_Mail [postmas59Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]
83 CompuServe_Mail [postmas8Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]
84 CompuServe_Mail [postmas8Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]
85 CompuServe_Mail [postmas26Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]
86 rover1@sky.net (Steve Pa16Happy B-Day
87 CompuServe_Mail [postmas30Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]
88 CompuServe_Mail [postmas18Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]
89 CompuServe_Mail [postmas8Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]
90 CompuServe_Mail [postmas8Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]
91 CompuServe_Mail [postmas36Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]
92 CompuServe_Mail [postmas8Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]
93 CompuServe_Mail [postmas8Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]
94 CompuServe_Mail [postmas25Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]
95 Michael Carradine [cs@cr23Re: Happy B-Day
96 CompuServe_Mail [postmas8Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]
97 twakeman@scruznet.com (T18Re: High Parts Cost?
98 CompuServe_Mail [postmas24Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]
99 Paul Nash [paul@frcs.alt18Parts Books
100 Franz Parzefall [franz@m29Re: Chained again
101 Nathaniel Council [counc147[Fwd: [Fwd: FWD: Re: AIDS (fwd), it's a school project, send it on. (fwd)]]
102 marsden@digicon-egr.co.u20Re: LROI
103 bb@olivetti.dk (Bent Boh29RE: Purchase of 1990 Defender 90 (NZ)/Diesel Engine Life
104 Andy Woodward [azw@aber.24Re: Engaging 4X4 on the move
105 M.J.Rooth@lboro.ac.uk (M29Re: Lancastrians on tour
106 M.J.Rooth@lboro.ac.uk (M39Re[2]: Dissention in the Yanks


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From: Alan Richer/CAM/Lotus <Alan_Richer/CAM/Lotus.LOTUS@crd.lotus.com>
Date: 30 Oct 96  7:09:48 EST
Subject: Saw this on rec.autos.antique - cheap LR engine!

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 07:35:07 -0500
From: eheite@dmv.com (Ned Heite)
Subject: Land Rover Magazines

Great! The latest LROI just arrived, with lots of American coverage. I am
waiting breathlessly for LRW. Now, if the U S and Canadian suppliers would
advertise in the Brit rags, we might be able to get them over here more
often for this kind of coverage.

;->

 _______
 |___|__\__==    Rabbits exist, hence we can speak meaningfully
 | _ |  |  --]   about rabbits. Some people attempt       <DARWIN><
 =(O)-----(O)=   to study the evolution of human           "     "
================ intelligence. We might have a problem there.
                 Ned Heite, town crank, Camden, Delaware 19934

                             

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 13:42:44 +0100 (MET)
From: Paul Snoek <P.M.A.Snoek@net.HCC.nl>
Subject: RE: PARTS CATALOGUE

>From: Pieter  Erasmus
>To: 'rro@playground.sun.com'
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 19 lines)]
>Pieter Erasmus
>'72 RRC
Try Internet address   http:www.chariot.co.uk/index.htm     (= Homepage)
                                http:www.chariot.co.uk/208.htm
(=Roverpage)
Email: chariot@cardbox.co.uk

Goodluck!
P.M.A. Snoek   the Netherlands
E-mail : P.M.A.Snoek@net.HCC.nl

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From: JDolan2109@aol.com
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 08:33:23 -0500
Subject: Re: Thermo fit...

Steven Brown was commenting about the fit of his thermostat, the inability of
the O-ring to secure it and also the unavailibility of the wax type thermo.
What I did in the same situation was trim a piece of radiator hose to the
proper length (about 1/8", I seem to remember) and then by adjusting the
diameter of the hose by cutting it and removing a small piece, was able to
secure the thermostat (basically a generic unit) in place. What you'd be
making is a 'spacer'. To cut the hose to such a small dimension, I first fit
a piece of PVC pipe in the flexible hose to hold it rigid, then cut it in a
mitre box (hand powered of course, this is Vermont). 
Steve- If you stop by, I'll make you one up, or I might have a later style
thermo housing that you can have. This weekend I'm off to Toronto to pull
back a P5 behind the '84 RR, so next week or weekend is best. Oh, and it
ain't got cold here yet (save that piece of cardboard)....
see 'ya on the old road...
Jim '61 LR 88" SW  w/ 16's, OD 1 Bbl weber (econobox?)  "Nicky"
LR...quite possibly one of the best machines yet devised!  

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From: "Niel J. P. Fagan" <NF@orc.soton.ac.uk>
Date:          Wed, 30 Oct 1996 13:32:28 GMT
Subject:       Re: Free wheel hubs

Opinion, (+ personal experience),

1. Fuel econ. about the same (travels faster easier with them un-
locked), its speed verses drag = econ improvement. 
2. Reduces wear, not if the PO greased the new upper swivels too well, 
(prat), so the tiny splashes of oil can't get to them (engaged or not 
no lube. new bearings please).
3. No 4x4 on the move, without pre-planning (if in doubt think 
slippery, lock them before you need it).

As an aside, a French outfit has developed a free-wheeling hub, 
centre diff locking, front prop shaft disconnect system for the 
classic Range Rover, supposed to fit Disco's & Defenders to....
>.
Rgds Niel

Views expressed are personal and not those of the 
University, unless otherwise & expressly stated.

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From: RoverNut@aol.com
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 08:34:20 -0500
Subject: electrical rebuilds

My two pence concerning the question about the alternator (and the loss of
juice):
If you have the slightest suspicion that one of your electrical components is
failing, my opinion is: rebuild the sucker ~ finances, of course, permitting.
My starter was recently acting weird, so I yanked it out in about 20 minutes,
took it to a local motor re-build shop and picked it up the next day (only
$75). I would have tried it myself except for two very important reasons a)
including labor, it was cheaper to contract it out, and b) Lucas and amateur
electricians ~ never the 'tween shall favorably meet.
Normally with the Landy I think "ain't broke/don't fix." But one thing is for
sure, you can't hand-start an alternator. Even if by rebuilding you fix the
problem by simply cleaning all of the parts as you go, you know you've halted
a potential failure at all points (HEY! you in the back, stop laughing!).....
a stitch in time and all that rubbish. We Landy owners are rarely the first
owners of our vehicles, so this way you are sure of what's been done on your
truck.
Good luck
Alex Maiolo
69 IIa
89 Range Rover

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From: "Mark Gehlhausen" <Gehl@sphinx.nwscc.sea06.navy.mil>
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 08:38:18 -500
Subject: Re: Thermo fit...

I read of a one barrel Weber in use.  Tell me more?  Was this a 
factory option?  Might someone know the throat size?  
Mark

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From: RoverNut@aol.com
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 08:46:11 -0500
Subject: Dissention in the Yanks

I have a 69 IIa without free-hubs. My truck can do over 75 mph (with OD) and
cruises comfortably at 62mph (without OD). I have two friends with Series
LRs. Both have free-wheeling hubs. My car is faster, gets better gas milage
and is just as quiet, if not quieter. I don't think this has anything to do
with the fact that I don't have FWH, I think it's because, although we all
take really good care of our vehicles, mine was better maintained from the
get-go.
My experience is: you have nothing to lose or gain by installing FWH. Spend
the money elsewhere. Modifications are nice, but don't screw around with
something that seems to work fine.
Yours,
Alex Maiolo
69 IIa
89 Range Rover

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From: "Mark Gehlhausen" <Gehl@sphinx.nwscc.sea06.navy.mil>
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 08:40:58 -500
Subject: Series Knuckle Busters

Are all Series knuclkle busters?  Honestly, you can't remember a day 
when the drivetrain didn't need some work?  What engine would you 
choose for suitable tractability andf reliability?  The 2.25 petrol?
Mark

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From: "Mark Gehlhausen" <Gehl@sphinx.nwscc.sea06.navy.mil>
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 08:45:59 -500
Subject: High Parts Cost?

I was looking over a RoverLog catalogue and floored by the costs of 
Series swivel ball and brake rebuild kits.  Are all parts this 
expensive?  Holy Cow, these are not Range Rovers!!  Please
reveal your Series parts source stashes?  Mark    

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 96 09:32:29 EST
From: "Bobeck, David R." <dbobeck@inetgate.ushmm.org>
Subject: Re: Dissention in the Yanks

>I have a 69 IIa without free-hubs...snip... I have two friends with ..snip.. 
>free-wheeling hubs. My car is faster, gets better gas milage
>and is just as quiet,...snip...

>.. I don't think this has anything to do
>with the fact that I don't have FWH,

Whats your point then?

 I think it's because, although we all
take really good care of our vehicles, mine was better maintained from the
get-go.

Oh, I see. makes good sense...so free wheel hubs aren't necessarily a BAD 
thing...

>>My experience is: you have nothing to lose or gain by installing FWH.

Doesn't sound like you've tried it. That called experience now, eh?
Your truck might be even *faster* and *quieter* with FWH's, ever consider that?
Personally the OD was the last attempt to make my truck fast or quiet. Its a LR 
for chrissake, not a saloon car.

>>> Spend
the money elsewhere. Modifications are nice, but don't screw around with
something that seems to work fine.

But I thought you just said... nothing to lose or gain...now it sounds like you 
are against it...

Ok, now Im gonna rant..........

They just don't get it!!!!!
. Unfortunately all of our Land Rovers haven't been as well maintained as yours 
that they can dash up steep grades at 75 mph. I find my truck quieter and a 
litlle faster with the hubs unlocked. I just put in an OD but I havent tested 
its limits. so far I can nail 70 on the Speedo but its actually faster since its
set for 15" wheels. I don't really feel the need to have the ability to just 
shift on the fly all the time. There just isn't a need for it where I live 
unless you are some wanna-be cowboy and you need to run over someones lawn 
without getting out of your truck first. Its not likely that we'll come across 
sudden mud bogs in the middle of Arlington VA. Besides if I want the capability,
I can just lock my hubs. You on the other hand, have alot more work to do if you
dont want the front diff turning...I can just unlock mine "whenever" or "never".
The WARN hubs that came with my truck (read FACTORY OPTION) are simple reliable 
units that don't seem like they would be difficult to fix if something were to 
go wrong. 
Bottom line: Instalation of FWH's is not "screwing around" by any means. Its a 
viable option that increases the versatility of the Land Rover. Just don't 
forget to lock em once in a while...especially when you are using 4WD...:)
 All you people who are knocking free wheel hubs are just bummed cos' you aint 
got em!

Don't get excited, Im just giving the guy some grief...

Cheers
The Freewheelin' Dave B.

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 96 09:39:34 EST
From: "Bobeck, David R." <dbobeck@inetgate.ushmm.org>
Subject: Re: electrical rebuilds

My two pence concerning the question about the alternator (and the loss of
juice):
If you have the slightest suspicion that one of your electrical components is
failing, my opinion is: rebuild the sucker ~

Ummm...I think if I did that I'd end up rebuilding ALL of them...:)

Cheers

Dave B. "Mr. Suspicious"

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 09:52:07 -0500
From: Tre McCroskey <tmccroskey@CENTER.COLGATE.EDU>
Subject: Re: Land Rover Magazines

what kind of AMerican coverage does it have in LROI?      thanks  -tre

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 96 09:54:48 EST
From: "Bobeck, David R." <dbobeck@inetgate.ushmm.org>
Subject: Re: High Parts Cost?

I was looking over a RoverLog catalogue and floored by the costs of 
Series swivel ball and brake rebuild kits.  Are all parts this 
expensive?  Holy Cow, these are not Range Rovers!!  Please
reveal your Series parts source stashes?  Mark    

Ok, ok, well let you in on the secret!
Way up in the backwoods of the Vermont wilderness, there's a place called Rovers
North that has ALL the old Land Rover parts left over from the dealerships that 
closed in the 70's. The parts are still wrapped in the original boxes and wax 
paper and some of them have never even been seen. In fact, some of them are 
hermetically sealed inside individual vaccuum packed containers which are then 
stored in a locked climate controlled vault that can only be accessed by two 
different people using different keys simultaneously in locks that are on 
opposite sides of the room. They have new parts too, but the secret is in the 
old parts that go for less than 1/4 the price of the new parts. These secret 
parts are reserved for the most dedicated and dyed-in-the-wool Land-Rover owners
and enthusiasts. If you call and ask about them they will usually pretend they 
don't know what you are talking about, but it might be worth a try. Call 
1(802)879-0032 and ask Lanny about the secret new-old-stock parts stash. Careful
though, don't let on that you know too much or you might find yourself being 
shadowed by mysterious black Range Rovers 4.6's with tinted windows and funny 
antennas... 

Cheers
Dave B. 

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From: "John J. Tackley" <jtackley.dit@state.va.us>
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 11:14:40 -500
Subject: Dual or Single Brake Sys.

OK, I need some expert advise, at the risk of starting a thread.
Its time to replace brake lines on my '74 88".  Presently has a 
single circuit master cylinder that a PO had swapped in for the dual 
m/c, (which some say is a more reliable system, albeit prone to 
complete failure).  My current system works great.  Firm, full pedal, no 
fade, no leaks.  But the lines are very rusty.  Hard to tell 'em apart from 
the frame, actually and I can't believe they don't leak (and anyone even 
thinking of suggesting I not fix what ain't broken, forget it).  Should I rebuild 
the current m/c, if retained?  What about the 'brass inserts' I've 
heard about ? Obviously, need to change out the flex lines too, 
but what about the connecting block(s)?  If corroded, wouldn't it make 
the job easier ?  What type of lines ?  Steel?  Copper ?  Pre-bent or 
make 'em up as I go from the old ones ?  Tools needed to fabricate lines ?  
Bender and flairing tool ?  Available as rental tools ?  Yadda, yadda..............
So, single ?,  or dual ?; that is the main question posed to the collective 
wisdom resident here.  Any comments on the rest of the ?'s graciously 
accepted.  I will advise as to the final decision and reasons why.
*** John J. Tackley, Richmond, VA ***
* '74 SIII 88" "Gen. P. Lee" *
* '81 300SD *
* '89 FLHS "OINK" (That'l do, pig) *

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 10:22:30 -0500 (EST)
From: Dixon Kenner <dkenner@NRCan.gc.ca>
Subject: Re: High Parts Cost?

On Wed, 30 Oct 1996, Bobeck, David R. wrote:

> and enthusiasts. If you call and ask about them they will usually 
> pretend they don't know what you are talking about, but it might be 
> worth a try. Call 1(802)879-0032 and ask Lanny about the secret 
> new-old-stock parts stash. Careful

	Er, Dave, you were not supposed to tell anyone about this...
	It was the secret of the old-time list people who are in
	the know.  Now you have gone and told the world about this.
	We will remember this disloyalty...

  	Besides, All Lanny has left are some Lucas tri-polar mount antennas
	that stick to aluminium, one Sea-Rover conversion kit, some left
	handed starting cranks (for those living south of the equator.
	Silly British phlegm-sucking Leyland sending the entire stock to 
	Vermont rather than to South Africa or Australia), Mansfield anti-roll
	bar kit, and two neutral earth conversion kits that allow you to run 
	both -ve and +ve earth electrics and electronics (very expensive,
	but I know that you have one in your Land-Rover...  Better lock it
	up now...) at the same time, side by side.  (You know the one, the
	thing that you added so you wouldn't have to change the switches 
	in your LR from the +ve earth type to the -ve earth type when you 
	rebuilt it last year.  You didn't understand that the electrons move 
	in different directions, and thus require different switches.  
	Lanny was in a good mood that day.  I have tried for years to get 
	one of those conversion kits)

	Rgds,

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From: Easton Trevor <TEASTON@DQC2.DOFASCO.CA>
Subject: Overdrives
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 96 10:24:00 EST

>From the recent correspondence it appears that one of the problems with the 
overdrive is limited oil capacity. Since there is plenty of room around the 
overdrive why not increase the capacity with a separate reservoir. The oil 
could even be circulated by a small pump or maybe by suitable location of 
the supply and return ports the natural circulation could be used. Miss 
Golightly doesn't have an overdrive but Alex's Series III did and it 
suffered from the exhaust via the vent hole syndrome. I'm thinking in terms 
of using the centrifugal action of the gear cluster to pump fluid to the 
reservoir from whence it returns by gravity. Since many NA Landies spend 
time cruising on Interstates the additional oil capacity should help a lot 
with cooling and oil preservation. 

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 96 10:31:16 EST
From: "Bobeck, David R." <dbobeck@inetgate.ushmm.org>
Subject: Re: Dual or Single Brake Sys.

>>> But the lines are very rusty.  Hard to tell 'em apart from 
the frame,

Strip the body off so you can undo some of the rust on the frame...and make 
putting the lines alot easier.

>>> Should I
rebuild 
the current m/c, if retained?

why, if it works?
Personally i'd want the dual system...
 
>>> What about the 'brass inserts' I've 
heard about ? 

like cylinder liners? How much does that cost?

>>>Obviously, need to change out the flex lines too, 
but what about the connecting block(s)? 

flex lines yes, just dont buy $20 dollar ones from RN. get em from DAP or BP, 
and save 1/2 price. Connecting blocks no, they can be cleaned up good since they
are brass.
 
>>>What type of lines ?  

Steel

>>>Steel?

Yes, they have a nice coating on them to keep em from rusting (haha). also you 
can paint em or hit em with Waxoyl

>>> Pre-bent or 
make 'em up as I go from the old ones ?  

Make em up as you go. I don't know any source for pre bent brake lines. Using 
the old ones as a pattern would have been nice but there weren't any old ones 
left on mine, just PO stuff.

>>>Tools needed to fabricate lines ?  

Bender, flaring tool if you're actually going to make them yourself (id just buy
the appropriate lines) benders aren't that expensive. Pencil, tape measure, lots
of patience. Flare nut wrenches nice too.

>>>So, single ?,  or dual ?

Well, if its a single system and everithings new and well maintained, then you 
oughtta be alright. I still like the dual sytem, they seem to work better. The 
servo is a big player in that game.

Good luck, may the wind be at your breakfast and the gods of inertia be on your 
side

Dave B.

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From: "John J. Tackley" <jtackley.dit@state.va.us>
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 11:30:54 -500
Subject: E-Z Bleed

Anyone familiar with the EZ-Bleed brake bleeder ?  FWIW, it's a 
brake fluid bottle to which air pressure is applied, usually at @20 lbs., from a 
spare tire.  Has a connecting hose and a temporary fluid resevoir cap 
that connects to the pressurized bottle.  After connection, simply 
release the wheel cylinders one-at-a-time and the pressure pushes new 
fluid thru the system.  A simple, one person method of both bleeding 
and changing out brake fluid completely.  Just keep the pressurized 
bottle topped up.  

The E-Z Bleed is available from Auto Expert at 800-795-6958, for $35, 
COD only, no credit cards accepted.  It comes with several resevoir 
caps to fit a variety of vehicles,( for instance all German vehicles 
are covered) with the caps supplied, as well as the Series LRs.  It 
comes highly recommended from a respected Tech Committee Engineer 
from Mercedes Benz Club of America (MBCA).  Just wondering if the 
Lucas 'FM' might spill over to the brake system of LRs, preventing 
the application of logic and common sense, and this tool.
So, has anyone used this tool successfully with a Series LR ?
Just curious.  It would help after replacing those brake lines.  I 
have no connection to Auto Expert, BTW.  I'm waiting for some lit. 
from Auto Expert, and will post it to the List.
L8r.
*** John J. Tackley, Richmond, VA ***
* '74 SIII 88" "Gen. P. Lee" *
* '81 300SD *
* '89 FLHS "OINK" (That'l do, pig) *

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From: marsden@digicon-egr.co.uk (Richard Marsden)
Subject: Re: E-Z Bleed
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 96 15:39:11 GMT

> Anyone familiar with the EZ-Bleed brake bleeder ?  FWIW, it's a 

Yes

> So, has anyone used this tool successfully with a Series LR ?

Its the dogs bollocks! (as they say in the Land of Rover).
You may find you need a little bit of tubing to direct the brake fluid from
the bleed nipple into a suitable container (I have the screw kind).

Richard (ex-Gurkha SIII 109 FFR)

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From: GElam30092@aol.com
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 10:41:40 -0500
Subject: K&N filters

John Tackey writes "K&N filters last forever.  They are washable.  <snip> If
your filter was physically damaged, obviously it would need 
to be replaced, but that is the only reason I can think of for doing 
so."

I agree but since this is a new (to me) vehicle, I wanted to establish a
maintenance baseline but changing all the fluids & filters along with
checking the brakes.  I have absolutely no idea when any of this was done.
 The filter that I changed wasn't damaged but I had doubts if it would come
clean.  Changing it gives me a chance to start fresh.  

Ounce of prevention or waste of money?  As bad as it looked, I prefer the
prior.

Steve:  did your AZ adoptees arrive yet?  What color is the Flagstaff
vehicle?  James Howard is wondering how he missed it!
Cheers..
Gerry Elam
PHX  AZ
'96 Disco "Great White"
'64 Series IIA " Soldado Sangrando"

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From: "Mark Gehlhausen" <Gehl@sphinx.nwscc.sea06.navy.mil>
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 10:45:49 -500
Subject: High Parts Cost?

Dave,
I just returned from a summer in Maine.  Visited East Coast Rover
in Warren and came away believing I could never afford a LR.  
All the while, so close and yet so far away.  I will keep my old 
Scout on guard for the black Range Rover, but where I live,
RRs never tread.  I have looked at a number of Series 11A 109s, but 
the cost of making them reliable scares me.  Then I go to the corner 
AutoZone for International parts and stuff is so cheap.  BTW, I enjoyed
your comments on hubs.  I have a set of manual Warn hubs on the 
Scout and I love them.  But then, mud never bothers me.  Mark    

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From: ben@bell-labs.com
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 11:03:08 -0500
Subject: super-coil

Greg Moore wrote:
Yesterday I installed an Accel 'supercoil' I had laying around from a
previous project. I put a ballast resistor on the positive side to cut
the voltage but apparently that wasn't enough. One trip around the block
and the points were welded. Does anyone know how much resistance I will
need in order to run the supercoil?
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
better you than me.. sorry.
I replaced the coil this past WE, and came *this* close to plopping the
accel on, good thing I was too lazy to make up a bracket for it..

I dunno, I don't think you can really reduce the voltage or current
output by a (reasonable) ballast resistor.  I'd get a basic $10 round
coil, or get a little solid-state relay that will just use the points
for switching.  I think JCW sells them for $10-15.  Then you can use the
new Accel 10MV flux capacitor to light up the mixture...

rgds

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 16:10:44 GMT
From: "T. Stevenson" <gbfv08@udcf.gla.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: LRO International

>> >My wife, a secondary school teacher (pupils are aged 12-18 yrs), managed
>> >to convince some 14yr-olds that Yorkshire was part of Scotland -
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 8 lines)]
>really are a different race of people - there are no folk like the Yorkshire 
>folk.

I have heard tell that a Yorkshireman is basically the same as a Scotsman,
but with all the financial imprudence squeezed out.
Now where did I put my red rose?

Tom
________________________________________________________________________
Thomas D.I. Stevenson			gbfv08@udcf.gla.ac.uk
SNL Mussel Project			Tel: 01475 530581
University Marine Biological Station, Millport	Fax: 01475 530601
Isle of Cumbrae, Scotland KA28 OEG		http://www.gla.ac.uk/Acad/Marine

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 08:28:27 -0800
From: cascardo@ix.netcom.com (Lucas Andres Cascardo)
Subject: Check Engine light

What does the Check Engine light exactly indicate on a D90 '95.  In the 
manual it says it could either be a problem with the electronic fuel 
injection or the exhaust system?  How does it monitor both?  Reason 
asking is that mine lit up and after about 10 min the car started 
billowing white smoke from the exhaust and I could not accelerate, 
driving slow I made it to the dealer.  Surprisingly, the car did not 
stop.

God I hope this isn't going to cost me.......

Lucas C. 

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 09:26:47 -0800
From: Jeremy Bartlett <bartlett@slip.net>
Subject: Re: E-Z Bleed

John J. Tackley wrote:
> So, has anyone used this tool successfully with a Series LR ?

Yes and I'd recommend it.

cheers,

Jeremy

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 16:50:13 +0000
From: M.J.Rooth@lboro.ac.uk (Mike Rooth)
Subject: Re: High Parts Cost?

>        Besides, All Lanny has left are some Lucas tri-polar mount antennas
>        that stick to aluminium, one Sea-Rover conversion kit, some left
>        handed starting cranks (for those living south of the equator.
>        Silly British phlegm-sucking Leyland sending the entire stock to
>        Vermont rather than to South Africa or Australia),
Doesnt matter now Dixon.He cant sell them.What I heard was that the
Land Rover Thought Police,whilst checking on the legitimate use of
the logo,said that if any were found to be sold,the guilty party
would *have* to display the British Leyland logo with *equal prominence*
outside their premises.Which as we all know is instant death(well,a
lingering one,anyway) to any business.As well as giving rise to lots
of time wasting queries from *very* odd people about spare parts for
er..Austin Allegro's.

Mike Rooth
(And I really wanted that built for SAS water soluble Pink Porpoise
propeller).

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From: "Mark Gehlhausen" <Gehl@sphinx.nwscc.sea06.navy.mil>
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 11:49:23 -500
Subject: Re: EZ Bleed

>From your original description, it sounds like the EZ Bleed 
pressurizes the reservoir from a full tin of brake fluid via spare 
tire.  Does the MC reservoir overflow make a mess when removing
the lid after bleeding?  I have always simply opened the wheel 
cylinder and slipped on a plastic hose and empty tin.  I pump the 
pedal until clear fluid flows generously.  With the hose curved 
upward, I can inspect and retain a column of good fluid.  I close off
the cylinder and go to the next.  Is there a better method?  Is my
method OK?  I really am describing how I do it.  Honest.  M 

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 11:59:20 -0500
From: David_R@mindspring.com (David Russell)
Subject: FINALLY a LRO

I'm a *REAL* LRO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Last night a 1969 Series IIA SW, #24435855F was deliverd to my door here in
Rockville, MD. The short version (the long version and pictures will be
available at http://www.mindspring.com/~david_r) of the story is:
My wife made me buy this vehicle from it's second owner who is now 80 yrs
old. It certainly looks like it's only got 43,000 miles on it. The interior
is perfect, the exterior is almost perfect (except the dent in the roof
courtesy the transport company), all of the electrics work, except the
interior dome light, the engine starts and purrs like only a Rover can, the
brakes do not work and the frame turns to powder when you look at it. I've
got a replacement frame waiting for me to pick up and factory manuals in
the post.

The sellers agent, Bryan Davies of the Classic Rover, (see: the above URL)
thinks the engine has never been worked on and recommended replacing the
clutch because of age. Any comments?

Also on the agenda:
New axles (per TeriAnn's recent reccomendation)
New or rebuilt springs
New tires, new fluids, the basics, etc.
Am I forgetting anything? With luck, we'll make it to Maine next year.
I'll be updating my progress at the above URL and undoubtedly asking for
more help from the list. Am I excited?!?!

David
1969 Series IIA

p.s.: I need a name for the Rover.
 p.p.s.: anyone want a 1977 T*y*ta Land Cru****

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 18:07:25 +0200
From: pwakefie@isd3.esrin.esa.it (Paul Wakefield - System Manager (SERCO) X492)
Subject: Lancastrians on tour

Hi people

Subject: Re: LRO International
>>> More UK content!  :-)
>> More Scottish content!! :-}

More Euro content for the Euro-boys
oh, sorry, I don't get it anymore here :-(

Subject: Re: Free wheel hubs

I've got 'em and I love 'em but it's damn hard making the gasket that fits 
between the ally bit and the hub, the ones I got from my local LR bits shop were 
wrong. Ball pein hammer for 20 Mins was preferable to the 20 mile drive.

For my next trick, a head gasket fashioned from a sheet of annealed copper.....

Re: Yorkshiremen

I'm a Lancashire man myself, that's even further from Scotland on my map
(Cumbria gets in the way)

Re: MOT's
Mike rants:

> The tests are run by *private* licensed garages, with no guarantee that the 
> so-called mechanic that is giving you the benefit of his expert opinion can
> even *read*.

Come on Mike, there are _some_ duff testers out there, but they have all had to 
pass the DOT course to say they can test vehicles. This privilege can be revoked 
if they let a death trap back on the road. (Even though the test certificate 
only certifies the condition of the vehicle at the precise moment of the test)

Personally, I'm quite happy about the MOT, I'm not happy about the licence to 
print money it gives some (unscrupulous) garages.

Subject: Steering Relay

Franz says: 
> I'm pretty sure, that this won't get the 90w were it should (at least if you
> don't wait a long time)

There is no other easy option on the later type, so it's best to crank out the 
bolts (2) & syringe it in through one hole. I didn't have a syringe, hence 
having to drip in EP90 for about 1/2 hour.

Cheers, Paul.

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 96 12:10:48 EST
From: "Bobeck, David R." <dbobeck@inetgate.ushmm.org>
Subject: Re: High Parts Cost?

Dave,
I just returned from a summer in Maine.  Visited East Coast Rover
in Warren and came away believing I could never afford a LR.

Afford? None of us can afford them! Its just not an issue...I was stupid enough 
to add up my receipts...over 10K invested now...but it's going to drive into the
next millenium...
  
All the while, so close and yet so far away.  I will keep my old 
Scout on guard for the black Range Rover, but where I live,
RRs never tread.  I have looked at a number of Series 11A 109s, but 
the cost of making them reliable scares me.

It's not that hard to do one on a shoestring budget, and its still going to be 
cheaper than a new truck of more questionable quality or longevity than a newer 
truck of different manufacture. Key to saving money is doing everything yourself
and shopping around for parts. I could have saved a bundle by getting parts from
the UK, but I was sort of in a hurry and hadn't tried it yet, so i just went 
with the guys that i knew would get me my parts in two days or so...
Hence the 10K cost. Also key is really doing a thorough inspection of the truck 
to determine its real value. Value in my opinion is average market price minus 
estimated repair costs. My rover was about $1500 over what it turned out to be 
worth. Some stuff is hard to tell, systems that worked fine when I got it 
quickly went south for the winter. I would suggest going wth someone who realy 
knows Rovers and has done a frame off or frame over restoration. They are the 
people that have been there and done that and they will better be able to see 
beneath the surface rust...I think most Rovers that are sold as "restored" by 
individuals who do that for a living are going to end up being the worst value. 
Maybe some of the more reputable larger companies put out a better product, I've
seen some really nice trucks from EC Rover and Roverworks(defunct don't go 
there)...Better off buying one that was restored by somebody like me who 
intended to use it as a daily driver, not to just turn around and sell it. 
Otherwise get a middle of the road(4-6K) rover that needs work but has a decent 
frame and firewall, or a complete basket case that needs frame and 
everything.($500-1000). 

>>>Then I go to the corner 
AutoZone for International parts and stuff is so cheap. 

yeah but you don't have a really cool British Land Rover. Part of the fun is 
making the guys at Auto Zone look up parts that you know they wont have...

   
Good luck...
Dave B.
 

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 10:28:22 -0700
From: Chris Brosious <brosious@pogo.den.mmc.com>
Subject: Re: New LR sort of

Nate Dunsmore writes:
>>Hi all,

>>Just purchased a new LR for rebuild, a SIII 88".  It reportedly hasn't
>>run for a year.
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 6 lines)]
>>before trying to start it up. Any suggestions on other things to do 
>>before firing it up?

Nate,
once you get all the old fluids out of the motor and the new ones in,
take all of the plugs out and put normal engine oil into each plug hole,
after all 8 have their share, crank the engine by hand about a dozen
rev's or so.  Use a suitable wrench on the crank bolt, and don't be
afraid to really 'bear down' it.  Turning it over by hand will loosen it
up and let the starter have an easire time of it.  Turning it over a
dozen times or so really works the oil around and empties the cylinders
(which you just filled).  If its hard to turn by hand, sometimes letting
it sit for a bit to let the oil soak down in and around the pistons will
help.  If it sits over night after you put the oil in and still won't
turn, it siezed up good - bummer.
Also, make sure the water pump turns freely, its bearing may have siezed
up as well.

Good Luck

Chris Brosious
'94 D90

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From: "Mark Gehlhausen" <Gehl@sphinx.nwscc.sea06.navy.mil>
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 12:20:42 -500
Subject: @Highway Speed?

Dave,
You're right about the obscure part search being more fun.  But can 
you really use a 11A everyday and drive faster than 60 mph?  I saw a 
HMN ad for 100 mph LRs?  Has one ever gone that fast?  I also saw a 
photo of a 11A 109 towing a 105 howitzer.  What engine would that 
vehicle have?  Do you find that LRs cost you lots of girlfriends?  M   

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From: ChrisF6724@aol.com
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 12:39:22 -0500
Subject: Re: Free Wheel Hubs

>>I don't live in the flatlands anymore. No locked hubs = no
parking brake or gearbox resistance<<
You can buy and install a brake lock.  They are mainly used by drag racers so
they can lock the front and "burn out" the rear (which of course applies just
as well to a Land Rover ;-0 )  What they do is basically lock the pressure
lines going to your brakes.  This would be a effective emergency brake when
the drivetrain is not "hooked up".  I'm probably installing them in my hybrid
instead of a proper emergency brake (room is tight cause it's not a Rover
tranny).  The brake locks will work as long as your brake system doesn't leak
and is in good working condition...  I also believe the lock can be keyed so
it can also be used a theft deterent.  Try dragging around a Rover with all
four tires firmly locked up :-)

Chris Fisher
'73 Land Rover 88 Series III hybrid (still in the shop, sigh .... )

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 07:47:03 -1000
From: Faye Ogilvie <ogilvi@hgea.org>
Subject: Re: fw hubs, rod knock

IMHO free wheeling hubs make no difference.  I have a set of Faerie hubs and
have used them on a 109 and 88 with no effect on performance or gas mileage.
The 109 had a very sick engine and would barely climb a certain hill in 4th
gear.  Made no difference with the hubs engaged or not.  Feel I would have
felt the effect of even a single horsepower difference as such a small
factor as rain was the difference between 3rd or 4th gear.  Checked the
mileage engaged and disengaged on both lrs with no discernable difference.  

The individual that claims the hubs paid for themselves in two months is
defying the laws of economics.  If hubs doubled your mileage they might have
a chance of paying for themselves in a couple of months.  I don't think even
Warn or other hub manufactures would claim more than 10% improvement.  Even
using that doubtful figure it would take more than a year before they repaid
their cost, not to mention labor to install.

Engine rattle on startup:  The above 109 had the rod knock when started but
went away as soon as oil pressure showed on the gauge.  Oil pressure was
normal when warm, something like 50psi.  I had never driven a 109, so
assumed its subtle lack of pep compared to my 88 was due to the weight of
the 109.  No other indications of advanced geriatric disorders.  I decided
to check the bearings when I took the transmission out for some work.  The
supposedly rebuilt engine had virtually no bearing material left and the
crank was already scored.  It was a hearbeat away from spewing its guts all
over the highway.  Low oil pressure may be an indication of a worn engine
but then again may not.  The rod knock, when there is no or low oil
pressure, is a much surer indication that death is imminent.

I had an MGA back in the 60's.  It had good oil pressure at start up but
slowly dropped to 10-15 psi as it warmed up.  It started doing this
overnight with no other signs that anything was wrong with the engine.  Took
it to the local dealer who immediately diagnosed a rebuild.  Decided to sit
on it as I was a poor college student who couldn't afford the car, let alone
an engine rebuild.  Ran into the mechanic who worked for the dealer in a bar
that same night. He told me it was probably the oil pressure relief valve
sticking full open.  Said it was very common and was a source of great
profit for the dealer. He fixed it in the parking lot of the bar in a few
minutes for a couple of beers.  Ever wonder why the British car industry
nearly became extinct? 

Aloha
Peter Ogilvie
1970 '88'
1965 '109'

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 96 12:52:20 -0500
From: matthew stein <matthew_stein@gw.proctor.pvt.k12.nh.us>
Subject: Rovers

Two questions...
How could I get one of the Limited Edition Rovers...one of the last 25
classics made?

Is there a way to boost the pick up on my '91 GDE Rover?
Thanks,
Matthew

--

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
         Sent via ExpressNet/SMTP(tm), Internet Gateway of the Gods!
               ExpressNet/SMTP (c)1994-95 Delphic Software, Inc.
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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 96 12:54:15 -0500
From: matthew stein <matthew_stein@gw.proctor.pvt.k12.nh.us>
Subject: Rovers

Two questions...
How could I get one of the Limited Edition Rovers...one of the last 25
classics made?

Is there a way to boost the pick up on my '91 GDE Rover?
Thanks,
Matthew

--

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
         Sent via ExpressNet/SMTP(tm), Internet Gateway of the Gods!
               ExpressNet/SMTP (c)1994-95 Delphic Software, Inc.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 10:59:42 -0700
From: Jon Nyhus <bmc@syspac.com>
Subject: Range Rover For Sale

I am selling my 1991 Range Rover, County SE.  This vehicle is Black and has
the Grey interior in it.  It has the Dog Guard and the "Scottsdale Cart
Guard"  on the front.  It has a new ABS pump and brake pads all the way
around.    It has new power steering pump, steering box and hoses fitted.
The front and rear suspension mounts have all been changed out.  The
interior is in good shape with no tears or cracks in the leather.  It has
the Pioneer sound system with the six pack CD player in the rear. It also
has memory controled driver seat, for different drivers each having their
own postions.   And It has never been smoked it.  

This vehicle is a Land Rover Ex-Test vehicle that I purchased from the Hot
Enviromental Test Base here in Phoenix.  I have the papers to prove that it
was part of Land Rover History.  

I am asking  $16,500.00 for it.

If interested please e-mail me at address above or call me at work,
602.995.2028.

Regards,     Jon

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 10:01:36 -0800
From: Christopher Dow <dow@thelen.org>
Subject: Speedo Cable

What can I say?  I goofed.  While taking off and putting on and taking off
and putting on the instrument panel during my rewiring, I was hasty.  I
didn't always disconnect the speedo cable.  Guess what?  It's buggered.
Does anyone know if I have to have a special Rover cable, or can I use one
of the 'universal speedo cable' thingies at the local parts shop?  

C

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From: Alan Richer/CAM/Lotus <Alan_Richer/CAM/Lotus.LOTUS@crd.lotus.com>
Date: 30 Oct 96 13:03:47 EST
Subject: Re: @Highway Speed?

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 11:01:42 -0500
From: CompuServe_Mail <postmaster@compuserve.com>
Subject: Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]

Message "Re: High Parts Cost?", sent at 10:27 EST on 30-Oct-96, could not
be delivered to [106344,3302] at 11:01 EST on 30-Oct-96 because the
recipient mailbox is full.

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 11:01:42 -0500
From: CompuServe_Mail <postmaster@compuserve.com>
Subject: Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]

	id JAA09692; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 09:58:39 -0500
	id GAA18592; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 06:51:11 -0800
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 96 09:54:48 EST
From: "Bobeck, David R." <dbobeck@inetgate.ushmm.org>
X-To: Land-Rover-Owner@playground.sun.com
Subject: Re: High Parts Cost?
X-edited-by: LRO-Lite
Message-ID: <bulk.18571.19961030065050@Land-Rover.Team.Net>

I was looking over a RoverLog catalogue and floored by the costs of 
Series swivel ball and brake rebuild kits.  Are all parts this 
expensive?  Holy Cow, these are not Range Rovers!!  Please
reveal your Series parts source stashes?  Mark    

Ok, ok, well let you in on the secret!
Way up in the backwoods of the Vermont wilderness, there's a place called Rovers
North that has ALL the old Land Rover parts left over from the dealerships that 
closed in the 70's. The parts are still wrapped in the original boxes and wax 
paper and some of them have never even been seen. In fact, some of them are 
hermetically sealed inside individual vaccuum packed containers which are then 
stored in a locked climate controlled vault that can only be accessed by two 
different people using different keys simultaneously in locks that are on 
opposite sides of the room. They have new parts too, but the secret is in the 
old parts that go for less than 1/4 the price of the new parts. These secret 
parts are reserved for the most dedicated and dyed-in-the-wool Land-Rover owners
and enthusiasts. If you call and ask about them they will usually pretend they 
don't know what you are talking about, but it might be worth a try. Call 
1(802)879-0032 and ask Lanny about the secret new-old-stock parts stash. Careful
though, don't let on that you know too much or you might find yourself being 
shadowed by mysterious black Range Rovers 4.6's with tinted windows and funny 
antennas... 

Cheers
Dave B. 

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From: RICK_SNYDER@HP-Andover-om3.om.hp.com
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 96 11:13:12 -0700
Subject: Rangie Steering-play

Item Subject: cc:Mail Text
At first I thought it was me, or the wind, but now I'm sure that the 
steering in my Rangie has gone sloppy.  In my IIA, there is an adjustment 
on the steering box that tightens up the steering play quite nicely - is 
there such an adjustment on the '91 Range Rover steering box?  Has anybody 
else experienced this problem?  

Rick Snyder
'91 RR
'71 IIA

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 13:25:40 -0500 (EST)
From: Dixon Kenner <dkenner@NRCan.gc.ca>
Subject: Re: High Parts Cost?

On Wed, 30 Oct 1996, Mike Rooth wrote:

> of time wasting queries from *very* odd people about spare parts for
> er..Austin Allegro's.

	Allegro's?  That can be handled fairly easily.  It is those after
	Marina parts that have to be watched.

> (And I really wanted that built for SAS water soluble Pink Porpoise
> propeller).

	Me too...

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From: Harincar@mooregs.com (Tim Harincar-MS)
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 12:27:41 -0600
Subject: re: Chained again

Re: ice & snow driving

LRs, or at least mine in my experience, are technically 'loose' as NASCAR   
drivers would say. What that means is that they have a tendancy to want   
to swap ends on greasy surfaces, like ice. Adding a couple hundred pounds   
of sand in the back would help some, but being in 4 wheel drive or not   
won't make a whit of difference.

Chains would help in those situations just by virtue of biting into the   
ice and preventing sideways motion, so would a good tire (Trak Edge?).

Someone once told me that winter driving success (or lack thereof) can be   
attributed as follows: 50% tire, 25% vehicle and 25% driver skill.

Tim
 ---
tim harincar
harincar@mooregs.com
'66 IIa 88 SW  

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From: AKBLACKLEY@aol.com
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 13:31:50 -0500
Subject: 72 Rangie

Ian: If that RR is truly "refurbished" and the price is $CAN I 'd say its
worth it. I love my '83 RR it far more practical and more off road capable
than my old SII A but it does lack the character. I think the early 2 dr. RR
are true classics. Look for the obvoius stuff ( if you subscribe to LROI
there have been numerous buyers guides). Look and listen for engine/lifter
noise, signs of overheating, rear main leaks, too much noise in the gearbox,
leaky swivels etc. The worth of any vehicle is subjective but ask yourself
what else could you find that will do the same things for the money, and how
much would you havre spent if you had done the refurbishing. Please feel free
to contact me if I can help. Cheers. Andy Blackley, fellow TARC member.

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From: "Boehme, Doug" <dboehme@bestinforsg.com>
Subject: RE: Fording with the Disco (was: Longer Range Antenna & Door R  
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 96 14:31:00 PST

I had heard that on the new Land Rovers, extending the axle vents wasn't   
needed...  Or does that just apply to the D90?

Douglas Boehme
'95 Red D90 #2767

 ----------
From:  Bob Watson[SMTP:bobw@microsoft.com]
Sent:  Wednesday, October 30, 1996 10:08 AM
Subject:  RE: Fording with the Disco (was: Longer Range Antenna & Door   
Rattle)

One word of caution to a new Disco owner such as yourself WRT fording.
The rear axle vents just below the rear floor board and as such is
suceptible to water ingestion when fording water over the hubs. If you
plan on making a habit of fording (and who doesn't :-) you should extend
the axle vents to "higher ground" and/or get into the habit of
frequently checking the axle oil for water contamination after each
fording adventure. The axle seals are another place that can allow water
to come in to the axle oil.

In brief summary:
For water at or below the hubs, you should be ok as is
For water above hubs, but below the top of the bumper, make sure you
have a good bow wave and a steady speed.
For water above the top of the bumper, then you'll probably have to take
more drastic measures (like an alternate route) or:
 cover the radiator opening (front grille)
 raise the axle vents
 maintain a good bow wave & steady speed
 hope you don't get stopped/stuck in the middle (or you'll be bailing)

Happy trails!
 -- Bob W.
>------------------------------
>Subject: Longer Range Antenna & Door Rattle
>Date: Tue, 29 Oct 96 16:23:28 -0600
>From: "Keith W. Cooper" <kwcooper@aristotle.net>

<snip>
>P.S. We had some flooding rains in my area over the last two days and I
>took advantage of this last evening and ventured into some very deep mud   
>From: "Keith W. Cooper" <kwcooper@aristotle.net>

>puddles - WOW, did the Disco ever perform!  Some of these were muddy   
bogs
>that I never would have tackled in another 4x4, but the Disco never
>skipped a beat!!   Its this fact that makes me not mind the little   
quirks
>with my Disco.
>Go Land Rover!!
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 10 lines)]
>Little Rock, AR
>kwcooper@aristotle.net

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From: "Tom Rowe" <trowe@aae.wisc.edu>
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 13:45:33 +0000
Subject: Re: Gasahol - why shouldn't I use it?

> Ahhhh!  Now you've got me worried.  I have been using it for some months now 
 in my 1971 Hillman with no problems (as yet.   I bought the Hillman new so I 
 know how it has been treated).
 
 The car doesn't have a fuel filter apart from the one in the mechanical fuel 
> pump and it looks OK.
-
Sorry. Either ignore what I wrote, or put in a good filter/sedment 
collector like Racor.

Tom Rowe
UW-Madison Center for Dairy Research    
Madison,WI, USA
608-265-6194, Fax:608-262-1578        
trowe@aae.wisc.edu                

 Four wheel drive allows you to get
 stuck in places even more inaccessible.

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 14:49:35 -0500 (EST)
From: 12/4/95 <rsloan@titan.liunet.edu>
Subject: ice capades

Paul asked for the experiences of list members driving rovers in 
snowy/icy conditions, so here's my two cents...

My D90 has performed quite admirably in heavy  snows, in fact, pulling me 
through two major storms that stopped most other traffic dead in their 
tracks.  The only person joining me on the road was a hummer, who was 
driving too fast and floated all over the road, so I let him pass.  I am 
a volunteer driver for hospital staff during heavy snows, so I have some 
experience driving in snow and ice, I'm also an avid snowboarder, and 
the most important thing about driving in snow and ice (and one of my 
personal pet peeves) is that just because you have 4 wheel drive don't 
think you can drive "normally" in snow and ice.  I can't tell you how 
many times I've seen these yutzes driving their trucks like there's 
nothing on the ground.  They are a bigger risk than the weather, in my 
opinion.

Here's the deal, depending on your tires, speed = a tendency to float, 
floating can be fun if there's nobody around and you are in a field, but 
otherwise should be avoided.  Braking is obviously affected, and the 
transmission should be employed here as much as possible.  Loss of 
traction is what you're worried about, because that's when you go out of 
control.  Ice is a different animal, if you lose traction on a sheet of 
ice avoid making sudden movements, avoid stomping on the brakes, then 
pray.  Other than that, I've found my rover to be quite an acceptable 
means of transport in hazardous winter conditions, I've gotten through to 
nurses and doctors where j**ps and toys could not, that's not bragging, 
that's a fact. (now, about those patients...any old LR ambulances in Long 
Island?)

excitedly anticipating old man winter,
Rich
D90 #2948

 

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From: "Boehme, Doug" <dboehme@bestinforsg.com>
Subject: RE: ice capades
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 96 15:31:00 PST

It's funny that you should mention a Hummer driving like a Yutz.  During   
our big storm last year (Philadelphia, PA - 2 ft) some butt-munch in a   
Hummer went flying right by me, and right in front of my very eyes,   
plowed into a snow drift and couldn't get out.  Well, being a nice guy, I   
beeped at him and asked him if he needed help.  He must have been   
embarrassed because he gave the international sign for touch-down and   
told me to f*** off.

Equally looking forward to old-man-winter,
Douglas Boehme
'95 Red D90 #2767

Paul asked for the experiences of list members driving rovers in
snowy/icy conditions, so here's my two cents...

My D90 has performed quite admirably in heavy  snows, in fact, pulling me   

through two major storms that stopped most other traffic dead in their
tracks.  The only person joining me on the road was a hummer, who was
driving too fast and floated all over the road, so I let him pass.  I am
a volunteer driver for hospital staff during heavy snows, so I have some
experience driving in snow and ice, I'm also an avid snowboarder, and
the most important thing about driving in snow and ice (and one of my
personal pet peeves) is that just because you have 4 wheel drive don't
think you can drive "normally" in snow and ice.  I can't tell you how
many times I've seen these yutzes driving their trucks like there's
nothing on the ground.  They are a bigger risk than the weather, in my
opinion.

Here's the deal, depending on your tires, speed = a tendency to float,
floating can be fun if there's nobody around and you are in a field, but
otherwise should be avoided.  Braking is obviously affected, and the
transmission should be employed here as much as possible.  Loss of
traction is what you're worried about, because that's when you go out of
control.  Ice is a different animal, if you lose traction on a sheet of
ice avoid making sudden movements, avoid stomping on the brakes, then
pray.  Other than that, I've found my rover to be quite an acceptable
means of transport in hazardous winter conditions, I've gotten through to   

nurses and doctors where j**ps and toys could not, that's not bragging,
that's a fact. (now, about those patients...any old LR ambulances in Long   

Island?)

excitedly anticipating old man winter,
Rich
D90 #2948

   

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 96 15:46:58 EST
From: "Bobeck, David R." <dbobeck@inetgate.ushmm.org>
Subject: Re: @Highway Speed?

>Dave,
>You're right about the obscure part search being more fun.  But can 
>you really use a 11A everyday and drive faster than 60 mph?  I saw a 
>HMN ad for 100 mph LRs?  Has one ever gone that fast? ...snip...
> Do you find that LRs cost you lots of girlfriends?  M   

No, more so that a girlfriend costs me a lot of Land Rovers.

Rob David in VA has made 100mph+ Rovers using marine engines. Pretty neat, not 
for the faint of heart or thin of wallet. Robert generally does a good job of 
making things work.
Yes you can drive a LR more than 60 mph everyday if its running well, you just 
need to tune it up and stay on top of it a little more than usual. Also for lots
of long trips at 60+mph an overdrive will put your engine into a more suitable 
range of rpms...and also i think you will find that you will burn valves faster,
especially without and OD. A valve job with hrdened exhaust valves and seats 
will remedy this problem.

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From: Sanna@aol.com
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 16:01:52 -0500
Subject: Re: Dissention in the Yanks

>I don't really feel the need to have the ability to just 
>shift on the fly all the time. There just isn't a need for it where I live 
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 7 lines)]
>sudden mud bogs in the middle of Arlington VA.
>Its a viable option that increases the versatility of the Land Rover. Just 
don't 
>forget to lock em once in a while...especially when you are using 4WD...:)
> All you people who are knocking free wheel hubs are just bummed cos' you 
>aint got em!

...and don't want them.  

I bought my IIa brand spankin' new in 1970, and drove her as a "working 
Rover" for the first ten years (constant off-road/no-road, income 
producing means of transportation).  I bought her without hubs, because 
NONE of the Land Rovers at that time were imported with FW hubs, factory 
option or not.  Lulubelle is now almost 27 years old and has traveled 1/3 
million miles, and while I've repaired, replaced, or serviced almost 
every square inch of the car, the front end is still 100% "factory".

...And unlike you 4WD "hobbyists" exploring the trackless wilderness of 
Arlington, VA, being able to shift-on-the-fly 4WD was a real and much 
used advantage in the bush.  I just don't agree with your position that 
hubs are "a viable option that increases the versatility of the Land 
Rover".  In the enviorment that the LR was designed for, they do just the 
opposite.

Anthony R. Sanna
SACO Foods, Inc.
Middleton, WI  53562
1-800-373-7226

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 22:04:41 +0100
From: lopezba@atnet.at
Subject: Re: MoT

Doug Boehme asked the

>Stupid question #1: What is an MOT (in England)?

Well, you have gotten explanations. I think the US has something similar in 
most states. So the MoT is more or less the same as the TUEV in Germany, and 
the so-called Pickerl in Austria. Far from the inspections in Japan, which 
cost about 2,500 USD for a five-year old vehicle, which wipes most of those 
off the road and provides the Japanese automakers with a very sound home 
market (and lots of scrap to melt for new cars)! At least in Austria this 
has taken a lot of wrecks off the roads and has made life a little safer and 
the air a little less polluted.
Regards
Peter Hirsch
SI 107in S/W
Vienna, Austria (officially 1,000 years old this November 1)

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 22:04:44 +0100
From: lopezba@atnet.at
Subject: Re: FWH's

Jeffrey Berg says

>I'm even thinking about bolting a set of free wheeling hubs on the rear to
>make flat towing the beast a little easier and less stressul on the drive
>train.  Different strokes I guess.

This also seems to be a good anti-theft device - disengaging all four fwh's, 
I mean. The problem then is that you nothing except its own weight, and 
maybe the curb, will hold the vehicle when you park it. 

Disengaging rear fwh's while you are driving does not increase fuel 
efficiency any further, btw.
Regards
Peter Hirsch
SI 107in S/W
Vienna, Austria (officially 1,000 years old this November 1)

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 96 16:14:49 EST
From: "Bobeck, David R." <dbobeck@inetgate.ushmm.org>
Subject: Re[2]: New LR sort of

Nate Dunsmore writes:
Nate's trying to start an old SIII...

Chris Brosius writes

>take all of the plugs out and put normal engine oil into each plug hole,
>after all 8 have their share, crank the engine by hand about a dozen
>rev's or so.  Use a suitable wrench on the crank bolt,

OY VEY, these coil spring guys...
FYI, SIII's are usually fitted with the good old brick shithouse 2.25 four 
banger. Unless of course one of those SIII's is a stage one...c'mon now Nate, 
fess up ol' boy...:-)
Also the "crank bolt" is one of the unpleasantries of life that us Series owners
needn't bother with. We just get out our handcranks (left or right hand 
depending on which hemisphere you're in, since engines run counterclockwise in 
the southern half of the globe) and start spinning away. Unless of course you 
are like me and you bought a Gigantic Winch That Would Surely Pull Your Vehicle 
>From The Depths Of The LaBrea Tar Pits If You Weren't Afraid Of Draining Your 
Battery Or Forcibly Removing Your Front Bumper, and mounted it using the bent up
hacked excuse for a bumper that came with it which also happens to block the 
hole for the crank. Also I understand Ned Heite is the town crank of Camden DE, 
he would probably be happy to crank your engine for you...

Cheers
Dave B.

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 16:34:44 -0500
From: Jeffrey A Berg <jeff@purpleshark.com>
Subject: Yankin' the hubs again

Peter Ogilvie comments:

>IMHO free wheeling hubs make no difference.  I have a set of Faerie hubs and
>have used them on a 109 and 88 with no effect on performance or gas mileage.
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 7 lines)]
>factor as rain was the difference between 3rd or 4th gear.  Checked the
>mileage engaged and disengaged on both lrs with no discernable difference.

As you admit that you had a "sick" engine to begin with, I respectfully
submit that your findings are questionable.  If you can't build the
momentum to begin with then I would agree, hubs locked or unlocked are of
minimal consequence.  Same for gas mileage -- we're talking modest
improvements, which I'm sure could be easily offset by an improperly tuned,
or otherwise flawed, engine.

No one (I hope) has claimed an increase in horsepower due to the unlocking
of free wheeled hubs.  Horsepower is a constant in this system: a
measurement of power -- the rate of work -- your engine is capable of
producing.  What we're talking about is the drivetrain's efficiency -- the
ratio of useful energy output to energy input.  Actually, we're not really
dealing with efficiency's internal to  the drivetrain system itself,
because once you've disengaged 4WD, you're no longer putting drivetrain
power through the front propshaft and differential anyway.  We have to look
then to an external force that affects the system-- the coefficient of
friction.  By not having to turn the differential and prop shaft (through
the wheels) you reduce friction which prevents that system from doing it's
job -- moving the car.  All other things being equal, the less the force
working against the system, the more efficient it is.

There should be no doubts that this is all true. The real question is
whether there is any noticeable real world effect or if it's just something
that we could design a bunch of experiments to measure and prove.  I find
that unlocking the hubs provides subtle, but useful, benefits under some
conditions.  I find a definite difference in being able to *maintain*
speed, especially while climbing steep grades, while the hubs are
disengaged.  I attribute this to decreased rolling resistance -- a
reduction of friction.

I lay no claim to being able to start from standing still and climb faster.
However, when starting up a hill at 60MPH, it takes much longer to be
reduced to, for example, 45MPH.  I also find that the speed that I'm
finally reduced to on any given hill, is about the same -- assuming the
hill lasts long enough.  Sometimes on shorter grades I can "get over the
top" before I'm forced to reduce gear though.  Thus I speculate that there
is a point where the relative difference in efficiency is canceled out by
the systems power and it becomes a non-factor.

I think that friction reduction is also responsible for the Rover feeling
slightly peppier with the hubs unlocked, but will freely admit that the
increase in pep is much more subjective and less noticeable than the "hill"
benefit.  I definitely find other factors, such as temperature (or maybe
it's the humidity), have much more effect than the state of the hubs.  Some
days the car runs like a top, (relatively) quick and smooth -- others it
doesn't.  The same is true for differences in top speed --  other
influences which make judgements about the hubs more suspect.  The ability
to keep speed, once it's aquired, is constant in my experience -- it applys
no matter how the car is running, and is always improved when the hubs are
unlocked.

I agree totally that paying for a set of hubs in two months time, solely
though improved fuel economy, seems extremely optimistic.  But hey, even
with the highest gas tax in the U.S., I pay little per gallon compared to
other countries so YMMV. Besides, I've never calculated fuel efficiency so
I make no claims. However, knowing Al Richer as I do, I'd be willing to
state that his findings are worth further analysis.

One thing that hasn't been discussed yet is the reduced wear on the front
diff and propshaft when you've got the hubs unlocked.  There must some
benefit in this.  Opinions?

In conclusion, I stand by my original statement: Free Wheel Hubs have their
place, and the blanket notion that they shouldn't be installed *under any
circumstances* -- or advice to that effect -- is inherently flawed.

RoverOn!

JAB

==
 Jeffrey A. Berg     Purple Shark Media        Rowayton, CT
                    jeff@purpleshark.com
                     ==================
	Guidance Counselor said your scores are anti-heroic.
	Computer recommends hard-drinking calypso poet.
	--Jimmy Buffett, If It All Falls Down (by Matt Betton)

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 96 16:38:36 EST
From: "Bobeck, David R." <dbobeck@inetgate.ushmm.org>
Subject: Re[2]: Dissention in the Yanks

 

>I bought my IIa brand spankin' new in 1970, and drove her as a "working 
>Rover" for the first ten years (constant off-road/no-road, income 
>producing means of transportation).

Well, then YOU didn't need them. Good job. You saved a few bucks. 

>>...And unlike you 4WD "hobbyists" exploring the trackless wilderness of 
Arlington, VA,

Oooh, you're making me angry...you wont like me when I'm 
angry!!!!ARRRRGGGGHHHH!!!....(clothes start to split under the strain of 
grotesquely engorged neck muscles....)

>>> being able to shift-on-the-fly 4WD was a real and much 
used advantage in the bush.

Actually, we can shift on the fly too. I just have to lock my hubs at the 
beginning of the day, and VOILA, its the same as yours! Imagine that! As for us 
hobbyists and our on and off road pursuits, if I could off-road on my lunch hour
I would, but it just isn't practical. I bought a Land Rover because I wanted a 
4wd that could survive being owned by me. I'm hard on my gear and I like 
quality. I decided to make it into a vehicle that is a reasonably stressless 
daily driver as well. I wasnt out for luxury, so I didn't paint it or put fancy 
walnut trim on the inside (sorry ajr) but i also didn't want it to be a rolling 
stress test. Everything functions well so why shouldn't I use it on the road?. I
take it out into the dirt whenever I can which unfortunately isn't so often but 
does that mean Im not allowed to drive it on the pavement the rest of the year?.
Give me a f**in break Tony. 

>.  I just don't agree with your position that 
>hubs are "a viable option that increases the versatility of the Land 
>Rover".  In the enviorment that the LR was designed for, they do just the 
>opposite.

If its a completely, one hundred percent off-road only vehicle then you are 
right. There's just no need for it. Once you are out on pavement it certainly 
does not make anything less versatile, unless you are an idiot and never lock 
them. The general consensus seems to be take them or leave them...no difference.
It's when they are used improperly that they cause problems. Just like any other
piece of machinery.

 Dreaming of getting into some of that Wisconsin bush, with my front propshaft 
already engaged...

Dave B.
Arlington VA. home of the trackless wilderness full of damned hobbyists

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 96 16:33:32 -0500
From: "Adams, Bill" <badams@usia.gov>
Subject: Irie good time, mon!

Just got back from the British Virgin Islands and there are quite a few 
Land Rovers down there! OK the trip was a blast and the sailing great, 
but the Rovers were cool! At Foxy's bar on Jost Van Dyke there is a lime 
green s3 with square headlights and no glass from the windshield back. 
There's also a green station wagon that looks pretty venerable.
On Virgin Gorda, the Fire brigade drives a 110 fire engine. I got a 
picture of the firemen standing in front and they ran the lights and 
everything for me!
On the way to the airport yesterday I saw three series trucks; a powder 
blue 88, a peach(!) 88 truck cab and a brown soft top 109 on the road.
Also saw a Gelandewagen and two discos and one RR. 

Bill Adams
3D Artist/Animator
'66 Land Rover S2A 109 Diesel.
Soon to be Triumph Trophy owner ?

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 16:44:14 -0500
From: Kevin Girling <lroshop@idirect.com>
Subject: LROI

what kind of AMerican coverage does it have in LROI?      thanks  -tre

Getting better each month.  We are keeping the pressure on LROI to keep it
up.  I shall be with the publisher and editor next week to press home the
message and pass on the many comments, good and bad, from web users.

Regards

Kevin

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 16:59:31 -0500
From: Jeffrey A Berg <jeff@purpleshark.com>
Subject: Re: FWH's

Peter Hirsch writes (regarding rear FWH for flat towing):

>Disengaging rear fwh's while you are driving does not increase fuel
>efficiency any further, btw.

I would agree. Though there is a reduction in friction (See my post:
"Yankin' the hubs again"), weight remains constant.  All things considered,
it's probably not enough of a difference to have much effect on gas mileage.

The reduction of unecessary wear & tear on the towed vehicles drivetrain is
something else entirely...

Rgds. RoverOn!

JAB

==
 Jeffrey A. Berg     Purple Shark Media        Rowayton, CT
                    jeff@purpleshark.com
                     ==================
	My garden is full of papayas and mangos.
	My dance card is filled with merengues and tangos.
	Taste for the good life,
	I can see it no other way.
		--Jimmy Buffett, Lone Palm (live version)

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 17:27:16 -0500
From: Tre McCroskey <tmccroskey@CENTER.COLGATE.EDU>
Subject: Re: LROI

how do i go about subscribing to LRO?     -tre

isn't there a  800 #?

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 14:21:43 -0700
From: faurecm@halcyon.com (C. Marin Faure)
Subject: Re: Engaging 4wd on the move

> Paul said-
>To eliminate possible damage ... DON'T FIT FREE-WHEEL HUBS! If you
>forget whether the hubs are engaged or not and have to engage 4X4 on the
>move (and the hubs aren't locked) you're gonna swear at yourself.

While the caution against trying to shift into 4wd on the move with
feewheel hubs disengaged cannot be repeated too many times, I don't think
this is a reason not to fit freewheel hubs at all.  I installed Warn hubs
on my Series III 88 within a year after purchasing the vehicle new in 1973,
and I've never regretted having them.  I've never accidentally engaged the
4wd lever, although I have, on occasion, become uncertain of which position
the hubs were in during a drive.  In those cases, I simply stopped and
checked.

It's always been pretty obvious to me prior to a drive whether or not I
might need 4wd due to road or weather conditions.  If it looks like I might
need it I engage the hubs before leaving the house.  But having the ability
to disengage the front wheels on good roads and nice days has saved me
countless gallons of fuel over the 23 years I've owned the vehicle, reduced
the noise (a little, not much), and added a small but noticeable amout of
performance when the hubs are unlocked.

If one is particularly concerned about the possibility of trying to engage
4wd with the hubs unlocked, it would be a simple matter to fabricate a  bar
mounted to the floor in some way which could be pivoted into position under
the yellow knob to physically prevent you from pushing the lever down.
Whenever you unlock your hubs, you put the lever lock into position.  I
have considered doing this from time to time, more for want of something to
do than for the fact that I thought I really needed it, but have never
gotten around to it.  Over 23 years of double-checking the position of the
hubs before a drive has simply made it an unbreakable habit, and a lock
would be redundant.  But it certainly would be easy to fabricate, and there
may be owners out there who have done just that.

C. Marin Faure
(original owner)
  1973 LR Series III 88
  1991 RR Vogue SE

------------------------------
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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 18:26:55 -0500
From: Mike Johnson <johnsonm@borg.com>
Subject: Re: LROI

At 05:27 PM 10/30/96 -0500, you wrote:
>how do i go about subscribing to LRO?     -tre

	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 7 lines)]

>how do i go about subscribing to LRO?     -tre
>isn't there a  800 #?
No, there is an 888 #.  :)
the number is 1-888-lro-shop or 1-888-576-7467

beats the heck $8.64 I was paying!
Mike Johnson N7WBO
http://www.borg.com/~johnsonm

------------------------------
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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 18:39:25 -0500 (EST)
From: "William L. Leacock" <wleacock@pipeline.com>
Subject: LRO Magazine.

I am a British Land rover enthusiast and have lived here in NY for the past
two years. In todays LRO Digest you ask the question "is everybody happy
with :LRO, is no news good news ?
 Until earlier this year I was a subscriber to LRO since the very beginning,
i.e. the days when it was privately owned. I allowed my subscription to
lapse because of the high cost. Particularly when compared to other
magazines in the marketplace. When one compares the subscription price of
any other magazine to the newsstand price there is a significant difference.
 My brother in law is the Production Director of a large UK magazine
printing company and so I have some idea of the costs involved in producing
a magazine. To be told that printing costs lead to cost increases which are
equal to the printing price is stretching my gullibility too much. When one
compares the amount of advertising in the magazine to the editorial then i
believe the advertisers are really paying the production costs.
 When one considers that at the newsstand price there are potentially
several others sharing the profit margin on the magazine, it means that the
publisher makes several times more profit on a subscription magazine than on
a newsstand sale.Adding to this the fact that the subscription mony is paid
up front, it can be used to either earn interest or reduce borrowing etc. I
still believe that subscription purchasers of the magazine get a raw deal.
 I therefore wish to add my name allongside that of Dixon's in the big black
list in the sky.

 Regards  Bill Leacock   Limey in exile.

------------------------------
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From: "Tom Rowe" <trowe@aae.wisc.edu>
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 18:01:20 +0000
Subject: Re: LRO Magazine.

 Bill Leacock writes:
> I am a British Land rover enthusiast and have lived here in NY for the past
snip
> still believe that subscription purchasers of the magazine get a raw deal.
snip

Well said Bill! I took another look at the subscription cost (after 
the recent post by LROShop) and even a two year sub at the old price 
would save me about $0.50 per issue. That's a long time to have my 
money tied up for such a measly savings. I can't believe postage is 
*that* much.

Tom Rowe
UW-Madison Center for Dairy Research    
Madison,WI, USA
608-265-6194, Fax:608-262-1578        
trowe@aae.wisc.edu                

 Four wheel drive allows you to get
 stuck in places even more inaccessible.

------------------------------
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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 16:03:15 -0800 (PST)
From: Andrew Howton <andrew_howton@bc.sympatico.ca>
Subject: Rover outing in Alberta

It looks like the Rover outing this weekend (Nov 2) is a go.  We have 6
SerII and SerIIIs lined up so far and everyone is welcome.  We'd like to see
a few coil sprung units to so if your in the Calgary area call.  We expect
to meet at about 8am in southwest Calgary (MacDounalds at Sarcee and
Richmond Road) but phone either Brain at (403) 243-5415 or myself at (604)
425-0598 to confirm the location.  With the weather as it is now we sould be
seeing lots of mud,ice,& snow, bring chains and recovery gear if you have
it.  Myself and Brian both have winchs and other gear so don't be affraid if
you lack it.  The destination is the Maclane Creek off road vehical area
just southwest off Bragg Creek Alberta (about 45min to 1hour from Calgary
(Rover speed Scotty)).  We're going to have a GREAT time so don't miss it,
I'll post the aftermath here next week.

And remember, becarefull out there and kept em oily side down.

(PS sorry but I will double post this message to make sure it gets out.)

Andrew Howton
Sparwood, B.C.
(604) 425-0598

------------------------------
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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 20:30:12 -0500
From: Kevin Girling <lroshop@idirect.com>
Subject: Re: LROI

In North America you can call toll free 1-888-LRO-SHOP.  You can also
subscribe via our web site using an online order facility or download the
order form and fax it to us.

Regards.
>how do i go about subscribing to LRO?     -tre

	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 7 lines)]

>how do i go about subscribing to LRO?     -tre
>isn't there a  800 #?

------------------------------
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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 20:39:09 -0500
From: Kevin Girling <lroshop@idirect.com>
Subject: Subscription Prices

Well it seems we can't please everyone, only most of them.

A new subcription for North America costs GBP57 for 13 issues.  This price
includes air mail which, being of British origin is very expensive.  This is
about US$86 or US$6.62 delivered to your door.

You can of course wait three or four weeks for it to hit the news stands and
pay  a higher price.  Isn't that what consumer choice is all about.

When we started LRO SHOP in North America the price was GBP77, about US$116.27

Whichever way you decide to buy it we hope you enjoy the magazine and
please,  keep the comments coming.  We will pass them on to EMAP.

------------------------------
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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 21:08:04 -0500
From: rover@pinn.net (Alexander P. Grice)
Subject: Hotter coils, welded points

Greg Moore writes with problems with a newly-installed Accel supercoil.

Well, you could do away with the points altogether...especially if you goal 
is more reliability in the wet.  Fit a Luminition electronic ignition system 
and you're set.  

The purpose of a ballast resistor on the coil is to provide a hotter spark 
for easier starts.  Typically, there is a separate wire directly to the coil 
from the ignition switch/start position whereby 12 volts are fed to the 
coil.  Once the engine fires, the ballast resistor drops the voltage to 7 or 
8 bolts or so...which supposedly prolongs the life of the various ignition 
components.  Cheers

      *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"----*
      |               A. P. (Sandy) Grice                   |
      |     Rover Owners' Association of Virginia, Ltd.     |
      |    1633 Melrose Parkway, Norfolk, VA 23508-1730     |
      |  E-mail: rover@pinn.net  Phone: 757-622-7054 (Day)  |
      |    757-423-4898 (Evenings)    FAX: 757-622-7056     |
      |                                                     |
      *---1972 Series III 88"------1996 Discovery SE-7(m)---*

------------------------------
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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 18:01:05 -0800 (PST)
From: Uncle Roger <sinasohn@crl.com>
Subject: Re: Hand Throttle

At 10:51 AM 10/30/96 GMT, you wrote:
>This begged a question, how should I use the hand-throttle? Most of the
>time, I have it set on say the 3rd or 4th notch from the slow end?

I use it as sort of a cruise control.  For long drives like on I-5 it works
well, but you have to remember to set it back to 0 when you exit...
Normally, I have it set at 0 (all the way off.)  'Course, mine is in serious
need of cleaning and adjustment.

--------------------------------------------------------------------- O-

Uncle Roger                       "There is pleasure pure in being mad
sinasohn@crl.com                             that none but madmen know."
Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates
San Francisco, California                  http://www.crl.com/~sinasohn/

------------------------------
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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 18:01:15 -0800 (PST)
From: Uncle Roger <sinasohn@crl.com>
Subject: Re: @Highway Speed?

At 12:20 PM 10/30/96 -500, you wrote:
>you really use a 11A everyday and drive faster than 60 mph?  I saw a 
>HMN ad for 100 mph LRs?  Has one ever gone that fast?  I also saw a 

I was working 35 miles south of San Francisco for a while last year (I live
in SF) and drove everyday.  Other than the lack of a radio, it was great.
Averaged 70mph. 

I know of an 88" that has done 100mph (not on the highway, of course) but it
had a Chevy V-8 in it.

--------------------------------------------------------------------- O-

Uncle Roger                       "There is pleasure pure in being mad
sinasohn@crl.com                             that none but madmen know."
Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates
San Francisco, California                  http://www.crl.com/~sinasohn/

------------------------------
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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 21:07:59 -0500
From: rover@pinn.net (Alexander P. Grice)
Subject: LRO

>I can now relax a bit although if anyone has any comments for the editor I
>will be in the UK next week visiting with him.

Ummm...you could ask him to pay me for the *copyrighted* article they used a 
while back.  Didn't get so much as a farthing from 'em.

      *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"----*
      |               A. P. (Sandy) Grice                   |
      |     Rover Owners' Association of Virginia, Ltd.     |
      |    1633 Melrose Parkway, Norfolk, VA 23508-1730     |
      |  E-mail: rover@pinn.net  Phone: 757-622-7054 (Day)  |
      |    757-423-4898 (Evenings)    FAX: 757-622-7056     |
      |                                                     |
      *---1972 Series III 88"------1996 Discovery SE-7(m)---*

------------------------------
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From: "Beckett, Ron" <rbeckett@nibupad.telstra.com.au>
Subject: RE: Purchase of 1990 Defender 90 (NZ)/Diesel Engine Life
Date: Thu, 31 Oct 96 13:39:00 EST

Richard,

My next door neighbour got over 300,000km out of his Holden Gemini 4-cyl 
diesel but then he was doing about 100km per day to and from work.  I guess 
a Defender would match that.  However, it really does depend upon how many 
km you do per year.  For example, Aussie taxis are, in the main, Ford Falcon 
4.1 litre 6-cylinder petrol engines running LPG (dual fuel).  A friend's 
taxi has over 500,000 km with no major work on the engine.  Not to be 
sneezed at.  BUT it is on the road nearly 24 hours a day.

By comparison, a RR buyers guide in 4WD Overlander magazine  a year or so 
ago noted that the pre-leaded RR v8 engine  would readily do 300,000 km 
before needing a rebuild but the post-1986 leaded engines apparently need 
rebuilding by 200,000km.  Later leaded V8s were better.  My '87 was 
re-engined at about 150,000 (it now has a 4.6L engine and 265,000km).

For equivalent usage patterns of long runs, the diesel will outlast the 
petrol engine but I don't know about short haul use.

Regards,

Ron  Beckett
'87 RR (265,000km)
'83 RR (125,000 km)
plus 3 Hillmans (the 1971 Hunter engine rebuilt at about 100,000 miles - the 
car was bought new by me)

 ----------
From: Pyramid
Subject: Purchase of 1990 Defender 90 (NZ)/Diesel Engine Life
Date: Thursday, 31 October 1996 7:22AM

I am looking at a 1990 Defender 90 currently.  The vehicle has been AA 
checked and seems OK.  However I would be interested in any opinions on the 
price.  They are asking $30k.  This seems comparable with the cost of 
importing a similar aged vehicle from the UK, plus duty etc. but is it a 
fair price?  What I know is that the vehicle was imported from the UK, it's 
a 1991 model, has 72000km on the clock, was owned by a LR enthusiast in 
Nelson and then a pharmacist in CHCH.  Any comments would be appreciated.
Also I known that diesel engines are supposed to have a longer life than 
petrol, but how much.  Another 1990 110 I have looked at had 130000km on the 
clock, how many more km's should it be good for?

Thanks
Richard Bloor
1982 SIII "Clyde"

------------------------------
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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 18:57:58 -0800 (PST)
From: Andrew Howton <andrew_howton@bc.sympatico.ca>
Subject: Rover outing in Alberta

Sorry if to anyone that has already seen this but it kepts coming back at me
and I don't think anyone is getting it:

It looks like the Rover outing this weekend (Nov 2) is a go.  We have 6
SerII and SerIIIs lined up so far and everyone is welcome.  We'd like to see
a few coil sprung units to so if your in the Calgary area call.  We expect
to meet at about 8am in southwest Calgary (MacDounalds at Sarcee and
Richmond Road) but phone either Brain at (403) 243-5415 or myself at (604)
425-0598 to confirm the location.  With the weather as it is now we sould be
seeing lots of mud,ice,& snow, bring chains and recovery gear if you have
it.  Myself and Brian both have winchs and other gear so don't be affraid if
you lack it.  The destination is the Maclane Creek off road vehical area
just southwest off Bragg Creek Alberta (about 45min to 1hour from Calgary
(Rover speed Scotty)).  We're going to have a GREAT time so don't miss it,
I'll post the aftermath here next week.

And remember, becarefull out there and kept em oily side down.

(PS sorry but I will double post this message to make sure it gets out.)

Andrew Howton
Sparwood, B.C.
(604) 425-0598

------------------------------
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From: Wdcockey@aol.com
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 22:01:28 -0500
Subject: Re: Engaging 4X4 on the move (mystery)

C. Marin Faure correctly observes that:
>To disengage
>4wd, however, you will have to come to a complete stop, pull the High-Low
>Lever (red knob) all the way back into LOW, which releases the yellow knob
>lever, and then shift the High-Low lever back to HIGH.

Why the necessity to shift to 4wd low from 4wd high before 2wd was designed
in is a a complete mystery to me. It is purely a result of the complex
transfer case shift mechanism, not the transfer case itself. In older Jeeps
and the like with a much simplier shift mechanism you can shift out of 4wd
high on the fly as easily as into 4wd high. There was a posting a year or so
ago about how to modify the shift mechanism so you can shift directly out of
4wd high to 2wd, but it seemed rather involved.

Maybe James Taylor will find an "old boy" who can explain the rationale.

Regards,
David Cockey

------------------------------
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From: Wdcockey@aol.com
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 22:10:12 -0500
Subject: Prefab Social Circle (AutoWeek Nov 4, 1996)

"Land Rover has made ownership of its vehicles a hobby, complete with a
prefab social circle of the like minded"
>From Autoweek (November 4, 1996, pp24-26) three page article on the Land
Rover Centre strategy. Only mention of Series LR is the "the indelible image
is that of Malin Perkins and the dogged Jim Fowler bouncing across the veld
in a Series II, on their way to an adventure with lions and snakes."

In the same issue is one page about a 1958 Toyota Land Cruiser, including
mention that the Land Cruiser was a foot in the door in international
markets.

Regards,
David Cockey

------------------------------
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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 22:15:17 -0500
From: landrvr@blacdisc.com (Mike Loiodice)
Subject: Re: Free wheel hubs

>As an aside, a French outfit has developed a free-wheeling hub, 
>centre diff locking, front prop shaft disconnect system for the 
>classic Range Rover, supposed to fit Disco's & Defenders to....
-
Now *that* has got to be something to avoid... like the plague! A snooty
French free wheeler.. Run away! Run away!

Cheers
Mike

------------------------------
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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 20:23:17 -0800
From: rogers@batnet.com (Jeffrey A. Rogers)
Subject: NAS Defender 90 Information

Hello! I'm new to the list and was wondering if there are any lists, or
other internet resources, dedicated to NAS D90's.

------------------------------
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From: Wdcockey@aol.com
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 22:35:27 -0500
Subject: Replacing brake lines (Re: Dual or Single Brake Sys.)

As an aid in bending brake lines I've used heavy aluminium wire to form a
template first. With pre-made lines cut the wire to the length of the line,
then use it to figure out how to bend the line to fit. When flaring the ends
yourself use the wire to determine the length needed.

My practice is to replace any metal lines I don't know the history of which
show rust, and any hoses which have deep cracks. On our pickup one of the
rear axle lines broke where it passed through the grommet as I was removing
it. Scary. The SW blew a front line during pre-purchase inspection with a
haeavy foot on the brake. Also scary.  In both cases the brakes had been
okay. Brakes and steering are the most critical systems. Don't rely on dual
master cylinder as an excuse to neglect the brakes.

Use steel lines, no concerns about fatigue as with copper alloys nor galvanic
corrosion worries as with copper alloys. I doubt there is a savings with
resleeving LR wheel cylinders. My biggest problem when replacing lines are
frozen bleeder valves. Keep the tophats on to keep water out of the valve.

Regards,
David Cockey
'60 SII 88" PU
'60 SII 88" SW 

------------------------------
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From: "Beckett, Ron" <rbeckett@nibupad.telstra.com.au>
Subject: RE: Rover FWH
Date: Thu, 31 Oct 96 14:48:00 EST

Hi Alistair,

I am not an expert, I only go on what I read.  Like you, I would have 
expected an improvement in fule economy with the hibs free-wheeling.

Re changing to 4WD on the move:
 I recently did a 4WD driver training course with the NSW Land Cruiser Club 
( I had an FJ55 Land Cruiser at the time - since sold to my son).
On that course, they taught that one can change from High 2WD to Hig 4WD on 
the move with no problem.

I quote from the training notes (I know the LR has a more complicated excess 
of levers)

"To shift from H2 to H4, you simply back off and pull the lever to the H4 
position"
"To shift from H4 to H2 back off the accelerator and push the lever to H2"
"To shift from H4 to L4 you must STOP, de-clutch and shift the lever to L4"
"To shift from L4 to H4 you must STOP, declutch and shift the lever to H4 
position"

Regards,
Ron Beckett
'87 Rangie 4.6L
 ----------
From: Alastair
Subject: Rover FWH
Date: Monday, 30 October 1995 11:41PM

I've got a LWB 6 cyl ex Army LR, that I got in Victoria (I'm at uni in QLD
most of the time, and Rovers are very expensive up here! ;-))

My mechanic told me down south that FWH do little for fuel economy, can
damge your driveline if 4wd is selected on the move if they're in 4x4, but
can possibly save wear.

I don't know...I have FWH in my car; (I have serious probs with 'em at the
moment though), so I can't tell you if I get a more economic highway run
with them in 4x2.

Scientifically, I'd have to say there would be a *slight* fuel saving
running along the highway with 4x2 on the hubs; just jack a corner of the
car up, and try spinning the front wheel (that's jacked up of course!)
first in 4x4, then in 4x2 - there's a noticable differennce when I move the
wheel by hand, so I imagine my engine feels it too!

The 6 is  a real gas guzzler, and I get something like 25-28L/100kms...not
a student car I know! But Lawerence, in Singapore has a vehicle pretty
close to mine, and he has good fwh, and an overdrive and reports
15l/100kms, so there's got to be something in that!

Regards,
Alastair

*****************************************
*Alastair Lyon                                               *
** 1979 ex-Military Police Series III two door  *
*2.6L Rover 6 cyl.                    *
*Townsville, Australia                                    *
*****************************************

------------------------------
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From: "Johnny Halverson" <halvers@empnet.com>
Subject: subscribe
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 21:48:53 -0800

Subscribe lro halvers@empnet.com

------------------------------
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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 13:31:20 -0500
From: CompuServe_Mail <postmaster@compuserve.com>
Subject: Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]

	id MAA06128; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 12:14:32 -0500
	id JAA21098; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 09:03:55 -0800
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 18:07:25 +0200
From: pwakefie@isd3.esrin.esa.it (Paul Wakefield - System Manager (SERCO) X492)
X-To: lro@playground.sun.com
Subject: Lancastrians on tour
X-edited-by: LRO-Lite
Message-ID: <bulk.21072.19961030090321@Land-Rover.Team.Net>

Hi people

Subject: Re: LRO International
>>> More UK content!  :-)
>> More Scottish content!! :-}
More Euro content for the Euro-boys
oh, sorry, I don't get it anymore here :-(

Subject: Re: Free wheel hubs

I've got 'em and I love 'em but it's damn hard making the gasket that fits 
between the ally bit and the hub, the ones I got from my local LR bits shop were 
wrong. Ball pein hammer for 20 Mins was preferable to the 20 mile drive.

For my next trick, a head gasket fashioned from a sheet of annealed copper.....

Re: Yorkshiremen

I'm a Lancashire man myself, that's even further from Scotland on my map
(Cumbria gets in the way)
Re: MOT's
Mike rants:

> The tests are run by *private* licensed garages, with no guarantee that the 
> so-called mechanic that is giving you the benefit of his expert opinion can
> even *read*.
Come on Mike, there are _some_ duff testers out there, but they have all had to 
pass the DOT course to say they can test vehicles. This privilege can be revoked 
if they let a death trap back on the road. (Even though the test certificate 
only certifies the condition of the vehicle at the precise moment of the test)

Personally, I'm quite happy about the MOT, I'm not happy about the licence to 
print money it gives some (unscrupulous) garages.

Subject: Steering Relay

Franz says: 
> I'm pretty sure, that this won't get the 90w were it should (at least if you
> don't wait a long time)
There is no other easy option on the later type, so it's best to crank out the 
bolts (2) & syringe it in through one hole. I didn't have a syringe, hence 
having to drip in EP90 for about 1/2 hour.

Cheers, Paul.

------------------------------
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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 13:31:20 -0500
From: CompuServe_Mail <postmaster@compuserve.com>
Subject: Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]

Message "Lancastrians on tour", sent at 13:26 EST on 30-Oct-96, could not
be delivered to [106344,3302] at 13:31 EST on 30-Oct-96 because the
recipient mailbox is full.

------------------------------
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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 13:54:50 -0500
From: CompuServe_Mail <postmaster@compuserve.com>
Subject: Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]

Message "Check Engine light", sent at 13:45 EST on 30-Oct-96, could not be
delivered to [106344,3302] at 13:54 EST on 30-Oct-96 because the recipient
mailbox is full.

------------------------------
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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 13:54:50 -0500
From: CompuServe_Mail <postmaster@compuserve.com>
Subject: Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]

	id LAA24841; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 11:45:06 -0500
	id IAA20491; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 08:24:46 -0800
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 08:28:27 -0800
From: cascardo@ix.netcom.com (Lucas Andres Cascardo)
Subject: Check Engine light
X-To: Land-Rover-Owner@playground.sun.com
X-edited-by: LRO-Lite
Message-ID: <bulk.20479.19961030082431@Land-Rover.Team.Net>

What does the Check Engine light exactly indicate on a D90 '95.  In the 
manual it says it could either be a problem with the electronic fuel 
injection or the exhaust system?  How does it monitor both?  Reason 
asking is that mine lit up and after about 10 min the car started 
billowing white smoke from the exhaust and I could not accelerate, 
driving slow I made it to the dealer.  Surprisingly, the car did not 
stop.

God I hope this isn't going to cost me.......

Lucas C. 

------------------------------
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Date: Thu, 31 Oct 1996 01:06:11 -0300
From: rover1@sky.net (Steve Paustian)
Subject: Happy B-Day

>Regards
>Peter Hirsch
>SI 107in S/W
>Vienna, Austria (officially 1,000 years old this November 1)

Happy Birthday to a beautiful and fondly remembered city.

Steven Paustian
AKA Generalissimo Chaos  (Al U. Minium)
President, Flatland Rover Society
04/500 D90SW

------------------------------
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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 15:06:43 -0500
From: CompuServe_Mail <postmaster@compuserve.com>
Subject: Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]

	id IAA05508; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 08:49:57 -0500
	id FAA17789; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 05:42:26 -0800
From: RoverNut@aol.com
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 08:46:11 -0500
X-To: lro@playground.sun.com
X-cc: RoverNut@aol.com
Subject: Dissention in the Yanks
X-edited-by: LRO-Lite
Message-ID: <bulk.17778.19961030054213@Land-Rover.Team.Net>

I have a 69 IIa without free-hubs. My truck can do over 75 mph (with OD) and
cruises comfortably at 62mph (without OD). I have two friends with Series
LRs. Both have free-wheeling hubs. My car is faster, gets better gas milage
and is just as quiet, if not quieter. I don't think this has anything to do
with the fact that I don't have FWH, I think it's because, although we all
take really good care of our vehicles, mine was better maintained from the
get-go.
My experience is: you have nothing to lose or gain by installing FWH. Spend
the money elsewhere. Modifications are nice, but don't screw around with
something that seems to work fine.
Yours,
Alex Maiolo
69 IIa
89 Range Rover

------------------------------
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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 15:01:46 -0500
From: CompuServe_Mail <postmaster@compuserve.com>
Subject: Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]

	id IAA04800; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 08:48:12 -0500
	id FAA17738; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 05:40:40 -0800
From: "Mark Gehlhausen" <Gehl@sphinx.nwscc.sea06.navy.mil>
X-To: Land-Rover-Owner@Land-Rover.Team.Net
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 08:38:18 -500
Subject: Re: Thermo fit...
X-edited-by: LRO-Lite
Message-ID: <bulk.17710.19961030054029@Land-Rover.Team.Net>

I read of a one barrel Weber in use.  Tell me more?  Was this a 
factory option?  Might someone know the throat size?  
Mark

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 15:01:46 -0500
From: CompuServe_Mail <postmaster@compuserve.com>
Subject: Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]

Message "Re: Thermo fit...", sent at 14:49 EST on 30-Oct-96, could not be
delivered to [106344,3302] at 15:01 EST on 30-Oct-96 because the recipient
mailbox is full.

------------------------------
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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 15:06:43 -0500
From: CompuServe_Mail <postmaster@compuserve.com>
Subject: Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]

Message "Dissention in the Yanks", sent at 14:53 EST on 30-Oct-96, could
not be delivered to [106344,3302] at 15:06 EST on 30-Oct-96 because the
recipient mailbox is full.

------------------------------
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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 15:48:22 -0500
From: CompuServe_Mail <postmaster@compuserve.com>
Subject: Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]

	id FAA26528; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 05:51:47 -0500
	id CAA15664; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 02:47:28 -0800
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 05:47:28 -0500
X-To: Land-Rover-Owner@playground.sun.com
From: landrvr@blacdisc.com (Mike Loiodice)
Subject: Re: Generator vs. alternator
X-edited-by: LRO-Lite
Message-ID: <bulk.15650.19961030024620@Land-Rover.Team.Net>

John Cooper sez..

>When driving with all appliances going (wipers, heater, lights) I have no
 juice left after stopping and trying to restart the beast.  When driving
 with no appliances going I have enough juice to start the rover.  Should I
 have the original generator rebuilt or purchase an alternator.  If the
 alternator is the way to go, can you recomend a brand, size, and installing
 tips?                                                   Thanks, John Cooper

-
Before you go that route, check the battery and the condition of the battery
terminals, battery cables, and connections on the generator and regulator.
You could have a weak battery or a poor connection preventing the battery
from being fully charged.

Cheers
Mike Loiodice
166 W. Fulton St.                  1965 SerIIa 88 Petrol - Faded Green     
Gloversville                       1972 SerIII 88 Petrol - Fern Camo
NY  12078  (USA)        7          1971 SerIIa 88 Petrol - Red and Blue
                     #:-}>         1964 Triumph Spitfire - BRG

------------------------------
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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 15:48:22 -0500
From: CompuServe_Mail <postmaster@compuserve.com>
Subject: Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]

Message "Re: Generator vs. alternator", sent at 15:22 EST on 30-Oct-96,
could not be delivered to [106344,3302] at 15:48 EST on 30-Oct-96 because
the recipient mailbox is full.

------------------------------
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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 19:14:26 -0500
From: CompuServe_Mail <postmaster@compuserve.com>
Subject: Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]

Message "Re: electrical rebuilds", sent at 17:46 EST on 30-Oct-96, could
not be delivered to [106344,3302] at 19:14 EST on 30-Oct-96 because the
recipient mailbox is full.

------------------------------
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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 19:14:26 -0500
From: CompuServe_Mail <postmaster@compuserve.com>
Subject: Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]

	id JAA03105; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 09:47:41 -0500
	id GAA18369; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 06:36:32 -0800
Date: Wed, 30 Oct 96 09:39:34 EST
From: "Bobeck, David R." <dbobeck@inetgate.ushmm.org>
X-To: Land-Rover-Owner@playground.sun.com
Subject: Re: electrical rebuilds
X-edited-by: LRO-Lite
Message-ID: <bulk.18350.19961030063557@Land-Rover.Team.Net>

My two pence concerning the question about the alternator (and the loss of
juice):
If you have the slightest suspicion that one of your electrical components is
failing, my opinion is: rebuild the sucker ~

Ummm...I think if I did that I'd end up rebuilding ALL of them...:)

Cheers

Dave B. "Mr. Suspicious"

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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 22:12:45 -0800
From: Michael Carradine <cs@crl.com>
Subject: Re: Happy B-Day

At 01:06 AM 10/31/96 -0300, you wrote:
:>>Regards
:>>Peter Hirsch
:>>SI 107in S/W
:>>Vienna, Austria (officially 1,000 years old this November 1)
:>Happy Birthday to a beautiful and fondly remembered city.
:>
:>Steven Paustian
:>AKA Generalissimo Chaos  (Al U. Minium)
:>President, Flatland Rover Society
:>04/500 D90SW

 CONGRADULATIONS!!  May Vienna enjoy thousands of years more
 in peace and harmony as a jewel on the European continent.

 Michael Carradine
 VP, Land Rover Owners' Assoc.
 72-88, 89-RR

------------------------------
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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 18:25:07 -0500
From: CompuServe_Mail <postmaster@CompuServe.COM>
Subject: Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]

Message "Re: ighway Speed?", sent at 17:10 EST on 30-Oct-96, could not be
delivered to [106344,3302] at 18:25 EST on 30-Oct-96 because the recipient
mailbox is full.

------------------------------
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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 22:25:27 -0800
From: twakeman@scruznet.com (TeriAnn Wakeman)
Subject: Re: High Parts Cost?

At  8:45 AM 10/30/96 -0500, Mark Gehlhausen wrote:

>I was looking over a RoverLog catalogue and floored by the costs of
>Series swivel ball and brake rebuild kits.  Are all parts this
;expensive?  Holy Cow, these are not Range Rovers!!  Please
>reveal your Series parts source stashes?  Mark

If you're in the US, British Pacific is generally your best price high
quality parts source.

TeriAnn

twakeman@scruznet.com

------------------------------
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Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 18:25:07 -0500
From: CompuServe_Mail <postmaster@compuserve.com>
Subject: Delivery report for message to [106344,3302]

	id NAA03793; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 13:11:27 -0500
	id KAA22176; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 10:03:29 -0800
X-To: "Mark Gehlhausen" <Gehl@sphinx.nwscc.sea06.navy.mil>
X-Cc: lro <lro@land-rover.team.net>
From: Alan Richer/CAM/Lotus <Alan_Richer/CAM/Lotus.LOTUS@crd.lotus.com>
Date: 30 Oct 96 13:03:47 EST
Subject: Re: @Highway Speed?
X-edited-by: LRO-Lite
Message-ID: <bulk.22165.19961030100254@Land-Rover.Team.Net>

Sure, it can be done - I do it every day. My typical commute is a 60-mile round 
trip from the New Hampshire border to Boston, usually done at 65-70.

This is in a 109 with 16-inch tires and an overdrive, and the stock 2.25.

Works fine - there's no reason not to.

     ajr

------------------------------
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Date: Thu, 31 Oct 1996 18:08:11 +1100
From: Paul Nash <paul@frcs.alt.za>
Subject: Parts Books

>From: Pieter  Erasmus
>Subject: PARTS CATALOGUE
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 9 lines)]
>can obtain a parts catalogue for RANGE ROVER CLASSIC and the SERIES LAND
>ROVER.

Try Autobooks in Randburg: I don't have their phonenumber or address
off-hand (it's in the Joburg directory though).  I got sIII and 110 factory
manuals from them, plus Haynes manuals _and_ a sIII factory parts
catalogue.  They also have lots of Range Rover books and manuals (lots of
Rangies in that area).

	paul

------------------------------
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From: Franz Parzefall <franz@max.physiol.med.tu-muenchen.de>
Subject: Re: Chained again
Date: Thu, 31 Oct 1996 08:19:34 +0100 (MET)

Tim said:
| Someone once told me that winter driving success (or lack thereof) can be   
| attributed as follows: 50% tire, 25% vehicle and 25% driver skill.

I'd put it to 40% driver skill. Last winter I easily pulled a guy with 
a 7.5 ton truck up the icy ramp to the parking lot behind our house. 
He wasn't even able to get the back axle onto the ramp and had better 
tires than I. At this time I was running on light truck tires with 
allmost no profile. 

An other thing about winter driving: It's not sure that you can easily
drive down were you drove up just before. Breaking seems to be much more
prone to loosing traction than driving.

cu.
Franz
---------------------------------------------------------------
Franz Parzefall                franz@physiol.med.tu-muenchen.de
       _______
      [____|\_\==
      [_-__|__|_-]      Brumml, exmil. 1989 Land Rover 110 2.5D
 ___.._(0)..._.(0)__..-
                                  

------------------------------
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Date: Thu, 31 Oct 1996 02:20:49 -0600
From: Nathaniel Council <council@gcnet.com>
Subject: [Fwd: [Fwd: FWD: Re: AIDS (fwd), it's a school project, send it on. (fwd)]]
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

THIS I A STUDENTS EXPERIMENT. THE REASON FOR ALL THE FORWARD MESSAGES IS
EXPLAINED AT THE BOTTOM, PLEASE FORWARD AND DON'T ERASE THE FWD'S

--------------671C1AF23857
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

You may have already gotten this from Tim or not but check this out, It's 
kinda freaky if ya think about it...but I guess that's the whole point

--------------27BB12744159
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Tue, 22 Oct 1996 22:07:46 -0500 (CDT)
From: johns natasha <johnsnat@acc.wuacc.edu>
Subject: Re: AIDS (fwd), it's a school project, send it on. (fwd)

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Tue, 22 Oct 1996 21:31:40 -0500 (CDT)
From: Brown Sam M <brownmel@acc.wuacc.edu>
    palmeri adriana <palmeria@acc.wuacc.edu>,
    holthaus katrina <holth994@acc.wuacc.edu>, sarab@hesston.edu,
    jenn@hesston.edu, lmshear@mtholyoke.edu, HParrish@lonestar.UTSA.edu,
    ritch@juno.com, suthi@unm.edu,
    brice ramon arthur <briceram@acc.wuacc.edu>,
    brown kevin james <brown980@acc.wuacc.edu>,
    trujillo mario <truji999@acc.wuacc.edu>,
    johns natasha <johnsnat@acc.wuacc.edu>,
    ruggero melissa <ruggerom@acc.wuacc.edu>,
    schroller buffy l <schrolle@acc.wuacc.edu>,
    langhofer shelly <langhofe@acc.wuacc.edu>,
    hill amber <hillambe@acc.wuacc.edu>
Subject: Re: AIDS (fwd), it's a school project, send it on. (fwd)

This is long, guys, but be patient, it has a good point.

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Tue, 22 Oct 1996 15:29:11 -0500 (CDT)
From: sharp tabitha <sharptab@acc.wuacc.edu>
Cc: brown melissa <brownmel@acc.wuacc.edu>
Subject: (Fwd) (Fwd) Re: AIDS (fwd), it's a school project, send it on. (fwd)

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 17:08:23 CST
From: "Anne, 96 Spires, Amy" <SPIRESA@BETHANY.BETHANYLB.EDU>
Subject: (Fwd) (Fwd) Re: AIDS (fwd), it's a school project, send it on.

------- Forwarded Message Follows -------
From:          Self <BETHANY/SPIRESA>
Subject:       (Fwd) Re: AIDS (fwd), it's a school project, send it on..but d
Date:          Mon, 14 Oct 1996 13:22:37

This e-mail has a powerful message.  Keep all the forwards and forward to 
all of your friends.  Enjoy and take it seriously.
Wendy
Just get through all the forwardings(with out erasing them!) and yo 
will see what this is all about
---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996 22:46:00 -0500 (EST)
From: Alison Beth Mayer <amayer@indiana.edu>
    crhaines@ophelia.ucs.indiana.edu, Sarah Fordyce <sfordyce@indiana.edu>,
    mbina@falstaff.ucs.indiana.edu, wrubin@othello.ucs.indiana.edu,
    ralevy@othello.ucs.indiana.edu, jgriess@ophelia.ucs.indiana.edu,
    ldepa@ophelia.ucs.indiana.edu,
    Shawn Steiman <sss2912@alpha.cc.OBERLIN.EDU>,
    Marissa Mohr <trustno1@falcon.cc.ukans.edu>, My Family <LJAJM@aol.com>,
    Todd Blackman <toddles@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu>,
    Jayna Doshi <ShrideviD7@aol.com>, Josh Frost <cnvz85a@prodigy.com>,
    Caroline Collins <ST963619@PIP.CC.BRANDEIS.EDU>,
    Beth Eagle <beagle@music.cc.uga.edu>, Hal Bowers <hbowers@umr.edu>,
    Sabra Goffin <turbos69@aol.com>, Wendy Asner <wca6668@ksu.edu>,
    Lexie Applebaum <Baum7@aol.com>, mjjaffe@ophelia.ucs.indiana.edu,
    rklein@falstaff.ucs.indiana.edu, dfroemke@hamlet.ucs.indiana.edu,
    lzakiela@ophelia.ucs.indiana.edu, jkstroup@juliet.ucs.indiana.edu,
    Sara Magariel <lnmagrl@primenet.com>,
    Danny Osman <dsosman@students.wisc.edu>,
    Brian Fife <bfife@slate.Mines.EDU>, Brian Cooper <Smstuco95@aol.com>,
    fremon@uakron.edu, mhuff@nike.heidelberg.edu, GDrosemary@aol.com
Subject: Re: AIDS (fwd), it's a school project, send it on..but dont erase the , fwd's you'll see why at the end... (fwd)sorry, just had to do it.. , , , , (fwd)Think that you will find this interes
ing... (fwd)

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996 22:52:53 -0400 (EDT)
From: BRADLEY MICHEAL ALBUS <bma200z@barbados.cc.odu.edu>
    Marisa Louise Moen <mmoen@students.uiuc.edu>
Subject: Re: AIDS (fwd), it's a school project, send it on..but dont erase the , fwd's you'll see why at the end... (fwd)sorry, just had to do it.. , , , , (fwd)Think that you will find this interes
ing... (fwd)

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996 20:10:39 -0400 (EDT)
From: Mark Reinhardt Apelt <mra5m@server1.mail.virginia.edu>
    colleen blue <cblue8vk@mwcgw.mwc.edu>, jenny goode <goodejn@jmu.edu>,
    jenny larkin <cjlark@maila.wm.edu>, Katina <kapelt@vt.edu>,
    maria maratos <mgm9b@virginia.edu>,
    sarah mccall <smcca6ag@mwcgw.mwc.edu>,
    vaughn bell <Vaughn_Bell@brown.edu>
Subject: Re: AIDS (fwd), it's a school project, send it on..but dont erase the , fwd's you'll see why at the end... (fwd)sorry, just had to do it.. , , , , (fwd)Think that you will find this interes
ing... (fwd)

Hola,
Please pass it on ist been going long enough to keep it passing.
look at the whole thing it is interesting (but long and old)
Try sending it to another country.

On Tue, 24 Sep 1996 20:04:59 -0400 (EDT) "John D. Koch" 
<jkoch@liberty.uc.wlu.edu> wrote:

> Hope you like this...shitface
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 13 lines)]
>     Stephanie Cauble <cauble@cleo.bc.edu>,
>     Matt Holliday <mhollid@tiger.lsuiss.ocs.lsu.edu>
> Subject: AIDS (fwd), it's a school project, send it on..but dont erase the , fwd's you'll see why at the end... (fwd)sorry, just had to do it.. , , , (fwd)Think that you will find this interesting
..
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> Date: Sun, 22 Sep 1996 18:54:38 -0400 (EDT)
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 486 lines)]
> >>>>>>>>>>>        hussain@husc.harvard.edu, kopelson@husc.harvard.edu,
> >>>>>>>>>>>        laskey@husc..harvard.edu, obst@husc.harvard.edu,
I tried to send this to others but the message at the end got cut off 
because of the enormous size that it had grown to so I deleted some 
of the forwards so the project could continue any way this was supposed to be an expirement to see if 
the e- mail system could be infected with the HIV virus. Please 
pretend you have been infected and pass this on to someone else.   
This is an AIDS awareness project it is not meant to offend anyone

PS. please don't erase the forwards 

--------------27BB12744159--

--------------671C1AF23857--

------------------------------
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From: marsden@digicon-egr.co.uk (Richard Marsden)
Subject: Re: LROI
Date: Thu, 31 Oct 96 10:04:46 GMT

> what kind of AMerican coverage does it have in LROI?      thanks  -tre
> Getting better each month.  We are keeping the pressure on LROI to keep it
> up.  I shall be with the publisher and editor next week to press home the
> message and pass on the many comments, good and bad, from web users.

An idea: Some large international magazines have different editions. Perhaps
LROi should consider this?
Its good to have international and US articles, but not loads every month.
Obviously, the Yanks will disagree here, so two editions might be an idea?
Advertising could also be split accordingly?

Just an idea

Richard (ex-Gurkha SIII 109 FFR)

------------------------------
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From: bb@olivetti.dk (Bent Bohlers)
Subject: RE: Purchase of 1990 Defender 90 (NZ)/Diesel Engine Life
Date: Thu, 31 Oct 1996 12:09:28 +-100
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Beckett, Ron[SMTP:rbeckett@nibupad.telstra.com.au] wrote:

By comparison, a RR buyers guide in 4WD Overlander magazine  a year or so 
ago noted that the pre-leaded RR v8 engine  would readily do 300,000 km 
before needing a rebuild but the post-1986 leaded engines apparently need 
rebuilding by 200,000km.  Later leaded V8s were better.  My '87 was 
re-engined at about 150,000 (it now has a 4.6L engine and 265,000km).

My Land-Rover 110" 83 with a V8 have now run 247,000km without rebuild.
it is a low compression 8.13 : 1, I have run it the last 180,000 km myself, on 
unleaded 92 octane only. 
At 168,000 km the heads was off, to do the exhaust valve on cylinder 7, and 
at that time, it was still possible to see marks from the hone-ing.
I expect to open again when I reach 300,000 km, and do all the valves.
NB: It is my daily driver, but I never come over 3000 rpm, and mostly go with 2000.

Happy Rovering

Bent Boehlers

------ =_NextPart_000_01BBC724.615C2740

------------------------------
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From: Andy Woodward <azw@aber.ac.uk>
Date: Thu, 31 Oct 1996 11:15:07 +0000
Subject: Re: Engaging 4X4 on the move

>>I can engage 4x4 on the move.  Is this correct.  Any special
>>procedures to follow so to eliminate any damage that can be done?

>Engaging LOW range will require you to come to a complete stop at
>which point you can shift the High-Low lever (red knob) back to Low. 
>You can shift from Low to High on the move, but you shouldn't be
>moving very fast when you do.  The Series III owners manual spells
>all this out in more detail.

I can change from high to low on the 90 at any speed the low box is capable of 
handling - say up to 25-30mph in 5th - by doing a sort of 
double-double-declutch with the relevant engine speed matching 
(since oyou have two boxes to shift). Try it 
gently from high 2nd to low 4th or 3rd. 

I havent actually done it for years, since I dont need to, but I was 
intereste to se if it was possible. It is and is not even that hard 
for someone used to a non-synchro crash box.

------------------------------
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Date: Thu, 31 Oct 1996 11:01:12 +0000
From: M.J.Rooth@lboro.ac.uk (Mike Rooth)
Subject: Re: Lancastrians on tour

>Come on Mike, there are _some_ duff testers out there, but they have all
>had to
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 9 lines)]
>Personally, I'm quite happy about the MOT, I'm not happy about the licence to
>print money it gives some (unscrupulous) garages.

Not a rant at all.Merely a statement of what I've found.And the first
year I had a car was the first year that the MOT came in.Which was fine
at the time,brakes,lights,steering,structural soundness.But its gone far
too far IMO.It has little to do with safety,apart from the basics mentioned,
and is so complicated that few if any of your average mechanics can
understand most of what they are doing.And if some of the ones *I've* come
across have passed the MOT course,it doesnt say much for the course.
Not only is it a licence to print money for unscrupulous garages,it is
being used as a similar licence for Motor Factors and the trade.
As for death traps,the main problem seems to be to convince some of these
idiots that the car isnt,and shouldnt be,new!I would hazard a guess that
if the MOT was abolished tommorrow,it would take at least ten years for
vehicle soundness related accidents to increase by any significant amount.
And if the test was cut back to cover what it originally set out to
cover,and no more,They probably wouldnt increase at all.My view,and
I'm sticking with it:-)
Cheers
Mike Rooth

------------------------------
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Date: Thu, 31 Oct 1996 11:47:04 +0000
From: M.J.Rooth@lboro.ac.uk (Mike Rooth)
Subject: Re[2]: Dissention in the Yanks

Dave(The Hulk) roars:

>Oooh, you're making me angry...you wont like me when I'm
>angry!!!!ARRRRGGGGHHHH!!!....(clothes start to split under the strain of
>grotesquely engorged neck muscles....)

I wonder if,out of deference to the well being of Dave's shirts,it is
worth re-iterating what the Land Rover *was*,and still is,designed for.
An agricultural vehicle,with all that implies.It is to the credit of
its designers that it fulfills so many much different roles today,nearly
fifty years later.Land Rover also found that people were buying it for
reasons they never envisaged at the design stage.I've seen a good many,
owned by farmers etc *with* FWH.And farmers dont spend money lightly.
Just depended what their usage patterns were with the vehicle.Taking
stock to market is an on-road task,taking fodder to beast in the
fields in winter,an off-road one.Wife taking it shopping,daughter
taking a horse to a show,popping down to the pub,tree-stump pulling,
fence mending,the list is endless.And the County Set bought them,they
became fashionable.I can remember many years ago,a colleague of my
father's turning up at work in a 109 Safari.This bloke was particularly
keen on socialising,and not,at first sight,a Land Rover type at all.
His excuse was"Well,if you turn up at a dance in it,people think you've
left the Bentley at home."And a fashion accessory it *wasnt* designed as.
I looked out of the window this morning,and there,on a building site,
(*more* green field gone!)is a 110 Tdi hardtop.Basic bog standard,blind
side H/T with the firm's name on the sides.Sitting inna field.Nearly new.
As for the "hobby types" Tony,can I point out that but for the hobbyists
there wouldnt *be* many of the old girls left.And you wouldnt *beleive*
the mental contortions you have to go through to justify buying one.
If you really want a useless accessory,try one of those dashboard mounted
"roll and pitch" gauges.Ensures you are looking at the dashboard while
you go inverted.....
Cheers
Mike Rooth

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