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From: sreddock@VNET.IBM.COM
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 95 09:42:10 GMT
Subject: Camel trophy tyres

AFAIK the camel trophy uses 700x16 XCLs as the 750s fouled the arches.
This info came from the totally typo free Land Rover Owner International,
so it is guaranteed totally correct, and shame on you for doubting it, probably
well quite likely correct anyway.

Has anybody out there tried 750 XCLs?  It could be that 750s of a different
brand squeeze in.

Happy Land Rovering, Steve

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 10:57:51 +0100
From: Peter Kutschera <peter@zditr1.arcs.ac.at>
Subject: Need help with 2.25 Diesel: smoking when idle

Hello!

Whe I got  my SIIa 109 (1968) about 3 years ago the engine was the
only part working fine. 

This changed last fall. 

It is now nearly impossible tho start when the temperature goes below
5 Deg Celsius, the engine smokes REALY MUCH when idle or going
downhill. 

First I was thinking that the problem could be the injectors, but why
should the be so bad? Maybe the injector pump is misadjusted? I didn't
change anythink but had a look to the mounting of the pump and found
that it would NOT be possible to turn the pump clockwise !!!

So what should I try next?
 Timing chain (cheap, I have to weld the radiator anyway) ? 
 Injectores (new ones are expensive) ? 
 Adjustment of the pump (how? I fear I can destroy the engine) ?

Any answers wellcome!

Thanks, Peter

Signature: http://zditr1.arcs.ac.at/~peter
Landrover: http://zditr1.arcs.ac.at/~peter/LR

------------------------------

From: Stephen Thomas <THOMSE-U@m4-arts.bham.ac.uk>
Date:         30 Oct 95 10:13:37 GMT
Subject:      Curses.....Old Joe strikes again...

Yes it just had to happen....

Not two days after there was talk of problems with heater plugs on
diesels I too suffered the problem of the series connections. Can't
you just tell that Land Rover was closely linked to Longbridge? I
mean, the heater plugs obviously got the "one out, all out" mentality
from their Austin cousins.

After a brief spell of blind panic ('Fire you b*****d, fire!'), I got
my head around the issue and put a circuit tester onto each of the
plugs and the feed - no earth on any of them. I pulled the first
heater plug in the line, replaced it with a spare, and after just a
few seconds the engine caught.

The actual operation took just a few minutes, what took the most
amount of time was waiting for my Pa to arrive with his tools,
nothing I had would fit - why can't they make heater plug heads the
same size as spark plugs? A spark plug puller would have done a fine
job!

Finally, Steve, is this how your 88" was meant to look?
    _________________________________
    |_______|_______|_______|_______|   "Moose"
    |   ____________    |      |    \\  '73 III 88"
    |  /      | \   |      |     \\      ________
       |  |      | |   |      |      \\    |        |
    |  \______|_____/   |______|_______\\___|________|__
    |___________________|_______________|---------------\
    |  []    []    []   |           | 0         |)
    |                   |--]        |               |
       _|    /   OOOOO      |           |      OOOOO    |__
      |_|____I OO o o OO ___|_______________|___ OO o o OO ____|
       0  OO o 0 o OO           OO o 0 o OO
           OO  o  OO     "Tread Lightly"     OO  o  OO
                 OOOOO                 OOOOO
                       Florida Rover Canvas
    Steve Swiger
    swiger@luna.cas.usf.edu

Or is it just another RTA on the Information Superhighway?
Steve

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Stephen Thomas                          Phone:0121-452 1405
                1964 Ser IIa Diesel 'Andy'
'Land Rovers let out all that gear oil to compensate for all the
rain water they let in'
----------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

From: Mike Rooth <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Need help with 2.25 Diesel: smoking when idle
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 95 11:05:32 GMT

Peter,
Wecome to the club!!
I suspect that your starting problems may be separate from
your running problem.My engine started OK even when it was
totally worn out,and smoked all the time like a factory chimney.
You dont say whether the engine will turn in cold weather,and
just wont catch,or whether it just wont turn over.If the latter
pound to a penny it needs a new battery.If the former,what sort
of state are the heater plugs in?Dont forget that the heater plugs
are series wired and failure of one will render them all inoperative.
Also,a good lorry drivers tip,given to me by innumerable truckers
when I first got my Oily Wadder was "Keep the fuel tank WELL full
in cold weather,to prevent fuel waxing".If the fuel waxes up it
*wont* start.
Check the condition of the air cleaner.Diesels need *loads* of
air,and a clogged air cleaner doesnt help.Just take the large
pipe off the air cleaner and run the engine,see if the smoke
is any less.If not,its not that.
When did you last change the fuel filter?
Chances are the injectors *are* dirty/maladjusted.The best way is
to get the ones you have cleaned and set up,by a competant diesel
place.All the specs are in the Genuine Parts manual.
Like you,ny distributor pump has no adjustment left clockwise.I'm
very much afraid that this is a result of the skew gear being worn.
Although you *could* try a new timing chain,it cant hurt.

Unfortunately, a new skew gear is getting on for fifty quid(where
*do* they get these prices from?),so as yet I havent done anything
about it.
I've had encouraging results from RedLine Fuel Additive(An American
product I beleive).
Also,setting up the tappets can help,and is cheap to do.
Cheers
Mike Rooth

------------------------------

From: Easton Trevor <TEASTON@DQC2.DOFASCO.CA>
Subject: Is a pattern emerging?
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 95 10:04:00 EST

The company (Land Rover/BMW) attitude to the use of the name seems to be 
hardening. Aftermarket suppliers ( I presume all, but know for certain of 
one) have been advised by solicitors letter to remove all reference to Land 
Rover from their literatureand advertising. This means in North America that 
unless one has previous knowledge where to get them then parts for earlier 
Rovers will be difficult to find.

This seems a very short sighted attitude, after all how many companies 
advertise parts for Jeeps, Broncos, Blazers etc without being harassed by 
Chrysler, Ford or GM. I suggest that  we series owners start a campaign to 
protect our suppliers. A good start would be to visit the local franchised 
dealer when looking for spares ensuring that our most well used and classic 
Land Rover is parked prominently and leaking its best while attempting to 
locate the parts that we know they no longer supply then complain to the 
dealer manager about lack of availability . Write to Land Rover and let them 
know you care, though they probably don't.

 These suppliers have been providing a valuable service keeping Land Rovers 
alive, especially during the years when Rover had no interest in North 
America.  A campaign to eliminate the supply of inferior aftermarket parts 
would be one thing, but perhaps a futile idea it just being a case of 
'caveat emptor' just like for all other vehicles. The elimation of all 
reference to Land Rover under pain of legal action seems just ridiculous. 
Maybe they just want to kill off all the Series vehicles and have us buy 
Range Rover 4.6 HSE at $91,000 Can.

 Let's see 1962 Series II trade in at $40,000, Charima compensation at 
$40,000 net price $11,000. Still seems a bit steep for an ordinary looking 
SUV.

Even Land Rover Owner Magazine and Land Rover World may soon have to become 
"The world famous 4x4 vehicle that is renowned for its exploits but whose 
name we are not allowed to mention magazine" and there won't be room for a 
picture on the cover. I guess the'll even have to airbrush the naughty bits 
(Grille badges from Full Frontals)

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 09:29:39 -0500 (EST)
From: Dixon Kenner <dkenner@emr1.emr.ca>
Subject: Re: new 110 or old 109?

On 29 Oct 1995, Stefan R. Jacob wrote:

> 110 suspension/comfort is sedan-like (almost). In a 109, if you drive
> over a cigarette butt you can feel with your ass whether it was with
> or without filter. Get the picture?

	Hmmm, you must balance you tires...  :-)

	BTW, this with radials or bias ply?  Must be radials.  With SAT's
	you ass should be too numb from the drone to notice a wee butt...
	:-)

------------------------------

From: Danny Phillips <danny@tlpgate.lonpar.co.uk>
Subject: Power Steering Pump.
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 95 14:06:03 GMT

My 90 disco (uk) has a leaky pump, but the chaps who sort my car have said that
at this point it is nothing to worry about, just keep an eye on the fluid, and
they have said they will keep an eye on it. they have Dept of Trans info as to
when it would become an mot failure (the dot have clarified about leaks etc).

they have just fitted a recon unit for 250quid all in (inc fitting) so they are
not telling me what they want to hear <G> and other people have said that the
recon units are okay, its bearings wearing that give the probs apparently.

The mechs themselves drive landies off-road so they (i hope) are not pulling
my strings.

p.s. i have just had to have a new rear lock fitted to my disco (same time i 
asked about the pump) and the moral of the story is if you don't want to have 
it break, don't let the wind blow it shut. It blew the door so hard that the 
whole car rocked (like when you put the handbrake on, on a slope) not as normal

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 07:15:23 -0800 (PST)
From: "John C. White III" <jcwhite3@well.com>
Subject: Re: Is a pattern emerging?

Solicitors can write all the letters they want.  It's what they do to 
scare people.  As you correctly pointed out, Jeep, Chevy, Ford parts are 
advertized by aftermarket suppliers all over the place.  I'm sure 
Chrysler, GM and Ford protect their brands to the fullest extent 
allowable.  If you check out the other auto magazines, you'll see parts 
for BMWs, too.  I haven't checked the mastheads, but there are magazines 
out that are targeted at BMW owners and probably aren't published by BMW.
The one thing aftermarket suppliers can't do is advertize that they carry 
"genuine" parts, unless they are genuine.

Cheers!
John

On Mon, 30 Oct 1995, Easton Trevor wrote:

> To change subscription write to: Majordomo@Land-Rover.Team.Net

	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 41 lines)]
> name we are not allowed to mention magazine" and there won't be room for a 
> picture on the cover. I guess the'll even have to airbrush the naughty bits 
> (Grille badges from Full Frontals)

------------------------------

From: setus1@dei.unipd.it
Subject: one curiosity ?
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 16:25:16 +0100 (MET)

Hi,
I have a Land Rover 88" of the 1985. This is my first and only one car.
She has some particulars : the front is of the 88" but the back is of the 90".
The stop lamp on the top and the indicators light bottom. She has a blue soft
top, 7.50R16 from the factory and the 90" seat from the factory too.
The engine is different from another of mine friend 88" (1979??)
If you know something about this model write to me thank you !!!

P.S.I forget that the front brake are of the 109" (biggest of the 88" brake
	and with two srews for the regulation)

		Thank you.
		Ciao,Francesco.

------------------------------

From: Grahame.Harden@BRI.NRC.CA
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 10:42:18 -0500
Subject: Speedo erratic...

In answer to:

The speedo is still erratic...sometimes working perfectly, other times 
flailing about, *but* the whole time, the odometer works perfectly.  I don't 
think its the cable/sheath.  It's but 2 yr. old and I took the cable out and 
lubed it with this miracle PTFE speedo grease before reinserting it.  It's 
gotta be in the head...(or mine)  Cheers

.....

One simple question, I assume you've been under the heap and checked
that the nut on the rear 'box bearing is tight. Obvious, I know,
but there you go. Failing that, yep, you've got a speedo unit
problem.
It shouldn't matter on a 'real' landrover, you simply travel as
fast as the discomfort allows!

Grahame

------------------------------

From: GElam30092@aol.com
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 10:43:16 -0500
Subject: Thoughts and prayers for fellow injured LRO..........

(I've never seen a posting like this so I hope that I don't offend anyone.)

There were three of us that went out on a short trip this weekend.  All three
of us have posted to the LRO and are active in Land Rover activities.  The
group consisted on myself, Dave Brown of Phoenix and James Howard of
Flagstaff.

We met in Camp Verde which is north of Phoenix.  We made our way over to the
Verde Hot Springs and crossed the river to continue our journey.  At this
point, Dave Brown and his son parted company to return to Phoenix.

James and I continued the trip making our way to a plateau over looking the
Verde River and the canyon.  It was a beautiful spot, a cool and partly clear
night.  As we went about the night's activities, we discussed the LRO and the
Mendo Reece list and the enjoyment that we received from the lists.  James
and I agreed that both lists and their  members help expand the LR
experience.  We enjoy the camaraderie, the advice and the humor that appears
here on a daily basis.

We made our way back to the interstate on Sunday with the typical activities
associated with driving older LR's.  James had to make several stops to
adjust his carb. and we even made one stop to remove a live 4-foot
rattlesnake from the middle of the road.  (Hey... he's one of God's little
*deadly* creature's too... but aren't we all?!)

We parted company at the interstate and I made my way back to Phoenix.  Late
last night, I got a phone call.  It seems that James was involved in a fire
at his home in Flagstaff last night.  He sustained 3rd degree burns across
his chest and his residence was heavily damaged but not destroyed.  I spoke
to his mother last night for the first time ever.  She had spoken to him
while he was still in the ER and she said he sounded strong.  This was after
the morphine of course!  She is flying from VA this morning.

I spoke to James this morning.  He is in the MICU at Flagstaff Medical
Center.  He said that he was going to be there for several weeks while they
go through the skin grafts.  He was watching TV ... watching the report of
his own accident!  I could tell he was in a lot of pain but he wouldn't admit
it.  

On our trip, James has mentioned that he met several of you in Portland.  I
believe that it was last year.  If you haven't met James, let me assure you
that he is a modest young man, educated in astronomy and employed by the
Naval Observatory.   He's the kind of person that you want on an trip:
friendly, steady, dependable and knowledgeable.

James will have a long road to recovery.  Undergoing skin grafts will be
painful.  He will appreciate our prayers and thoughts.  I don't think he'll
have a computer to communicate with the list while in the hospital so postal
mail seems to be the only alternative.

I know that James would love to hear from everyone and would appreciate your
support.  If you have a few minutes, stop and drop him a short note at the
address below.  I'll include the phone number too.  

Thanks for your assistance and thank you for indulging this request.

Gerry Elam
Phoenix AZ

James Howard
c/o Flagstaff Medical Center
1200 N Beaver
Flagstaff   AZ  86001
USA

Phone number:  520-779-3366

------------------------------

From: K Schmidt <s20845@hp.rmc.ca>
Subject: Weber carb
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 95 11:21:41 EST

I am looking at buying a Weber in the next couple months and I don't want to pay
for the adapter plate (I now have a Solex) Does someone have a carb that is off
the manifold that they could measure the _precise_ diameter of the intake, as
well as the diameter and depth of the ridge in the base of the carb.  I need
these dimentions to make the part but would like to avoid pulling my carb off.
Thank you in advance!

Kurt

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 30 Oct 95 11:34:10 EST
From: "Bobeck, David R." <dbobeck@ushmm.org>
Subject: power steering leak

Being a Seires LRO, I don't know that much about power steering, but I do
know that my Honda's powers teering rack has been leaking for almost two
years, since a hack/mechanic filled it with Non-Honda fluid. Unfortunately
it took me too long to make the connection and the warranty on his work was
long over. I now top off the fluid about once a year and everything is fine.
The leak is slight, i.e, no puddles, just wet boots on the rack. But it
works and as long as I check it I'm fine.

          Dave
          89 Honda Civic
          72 Series III SWB

BTW, since owning the LR, the Honda is trying to win me over by taking on
Rover/Lucas-like features. For example:
1. Dome light comes on while cornering
2. Stereo stops while horn is depressed
3. Left speaker operation only after hitting bumps
4. Mysteriously consumes oil
5. Defroster makes window foggier
There's others, but I can't remember them. If only it had four-wheel drive
and was shaped like a D90...

------------------------------

From: Alan Richer/CAM/Lotus <Alan_Richer/CAM/Lotus.LOTUS@crd.lotus.com>
Date: 30 Oct 95 11:54:17 EST
Subject: Re: Weber carb

>I am looking at buying a Weber in the next couple months and I don't want to 
pay
>for the adapter plate (I now have a Solex) Does someone have a carb that is off
>the manifold that they could measure the _precise_ diameter of the intake, as
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 7 lines)]
>Thank you in advance!
>Kurt

Ask around - one of these should be easily and cheaply available used. it's not 
as if they wear out.....

If no luck there, let me know and I'll take a machinist's rule to the bottom of 
mine.

Anybody got a spare adapter for outr friend here? -Alan 

------------------------------

From: ScottFugate_Group8@ctdvns1.ctd.ornl.gov
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 95 12:29:35 EST
Subject: U.S. Army Land Rovers

Gang, 

My brother, the tread-head Army Captain, reports to me a sighting of the 
Ranger Battalion's Land Rovers at Fort Benning, GA.  He conveys that they are 
being run topless and without windshields, the driver and passengers wearing 
helmet and goggles.  They are equipped with a roll cage that also serves as a 
weapons mount for a .50 caliber machine gun or the Mk 19 fully automatic 40 mm 
grenade launcher.  He also thinks there is a version that sports some type of 
"tank killer" weaponry such as the TOW or DRAGON, or recoilless rifle or 
something.  That's the cool part, but get this -  The Rangers call these 
vehicles "gun Jeeps".  Ughhhh!

He's trying to get me a picture.  I'm going to be tracking surplus sales real 
closely in 8 or 10 years!

Scott Fugate
1970 IIA 88
1989 RR

BT

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 30 Oct 95 10:00:06 -0800
From: "TeriAnn Wakeman"  <twakeman@apple.com>
Subject: Throttle shaft bushing?

Does any one know a U.S. company that can put bushings in the throttle shaft 
holes for a Solex to bring the holes back into spec?

I'm ready to trade the rochester for the original stock carb, but the throttle 
holes are worn on both Solex carbs that I have. 

TeriAnn

------------------------------

Date: 30 Oct 95 13:30:20 EST
From: <Chris_Browne@us014-boston-minet.ccmail.compuserve.com>
Subject: disco wheels etc

---------------------------- Forwarded with Changes ---------------------------
From: Chris Browne at US014-BOSTON-MINET
Date: 10/30/95 8:27AM
Receipt Requested
Subject: disco wheels etc
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

============== Begin part 2 ==========================

     correcting your address see message below

______________________________ Forward Header __________________________________
Subject: disco wheels etc
Author:  Chris Browne at US014-BOSTON-MINET
Date:    10/30/95 8:27 AM

     Jim,
     
     tire sizes are really tough to figure out sometime, as a 95 dosco 
     owner i have spent time looking at alternatives but have not dived in 
     yet.
     I am pretty sure that LR fits 7.50 x 16 onto the Camel vehicles but 
     check with Rovers North first about doing that on a regular disco as 
     the Camels have 130 springs which is heavier duty but not much 
     different. have seen 7.00 x 16 on Discos- LR uses Michelin XCL tire
     
     7.00 x 16 is the imperial equivalent of 215/85 x 16 that BFG has in 
     mud terrain. 225/75 x 16 is the most popular alternate size for the 
     disco in the uk what you lose in width you gain in height your call. 
     
     7.50 x 16 metric equivalent is 235/85 x 16. the latter looks a bit 
     fatter to my eyes but may be worth trying as it is available in BFG MT
     
     you could always fit old man emu springs with a 1 or 2 inch suspension 
     rise Once again RN is a source on that. good luck let us know what you 
     do 

============== End part 2 ============================

------------------------------

From: "Tom Rowe" <TROWE@AE.AGECON.WISC.EDU>
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 12:36:08 GMT -0600
Subject: Re: Throttle shaft bushing?

TeriAnn asks:
 
> Does any one know a U.S. company that can put bushings in the throttle shaft 
> holes for a Solex to bring the holes back into spec?

I'd think any carb shop worth it's weight should be able to do that.  
Have you checked with any?
Tht's a fairly common problem in carbs.

Tom Rowe
UW-Madison Center for Dairy Research    
608-265-6194, Fax:608-262-1578        
trowe@ae.agecon.wisc.edu                

 Four wheel drive allows you to get
 stuck in places even more inaccessible.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 11:02:03 -0800
From: matts@cacilj.caciasl.com (Matt Snyder)
Subject: Range Rover Trailer Wiring Harness

Your wiring harness will plug easily into the provided socket behind the 
starboard tail light.  However, the other other end of the wiring harness is 
nothing more than 8 wires, which you'll need to connect to your trailer via 
some plug/socket combination of your own doing.

-Matt

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 12:33:33 -0800 (PST)
From: John Brabyn <brabyn@skivs.ski.org>
Subject: Re: Heater vents/controls '90 RR

On Sun, 29 Oct 1995, Steve Willey-pc wrote:

> In my 'new to me' '90 RR I seem to only get heated airflow from the round 
> vents directed at the windshield and not from the fascia louvers facing the 
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 9 lines)]
> flow form the round vents is reduced and cold or at least not-heated air 
> flow from the fascia vents is increased.

Steve -- you have discovered one of the wonderful features of Range 
Rovers -- being British, they assume you will want hot air blowing into 
the vehicle at all times to combat the icy outdoors.

The heating and ventilation system defies all logic and common sense, and 
the symptoms you describe fall more into the category of features. I had 
the same dilemma when I got mine -- I took it in to the dealer to have it 
"fixed" but was told that's how it's supposed to work!!!

Hopefully the new model has improved slightly on the earlier arrangement.

Cheers

JOhn Brabyn
89 RR

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 12:37:30 -0800 (PST)
From: John Brabyn <brabyn@skivs.ski.org>
Subject: Re: Range Rover Power Steering

On Mon, 30 Oct 1995 KKelly6788@aol.com wrote:

> I have a slow leak in the power steering box on my '89 RR.  Some sources tell
> me that the box can be rebuilt and others have said that it must be replaced.

Kelly -- you are one of the lucky ones whose leak is only "slow".
I've talked to mechanics and DAP about this, and all agree it's a bad 
design and you either buy a new one every couple of years or put up with 
it. The reconditioning process doesn't fully solve the problem apparently 
and DAPhas given up trying.

> Has anyone had any luck with any of the "conditioners" that are added to the
> power steering reservoir to stop slow leaks.

Since the box uses ATF, I tried a transmission fluid conditioner, but to 
no effect.

Cheers

John Brabyn
89 RR

------------------------------

Date: 30 Oct 95 16:02:43 EST
From: "Stefan R. Jacob" <100043.2400@compuserve.com>
Subject: Re: Heater vents/controls '90 RR

> ...  When I move the same slider to the up position hot air 
> flow form the round vents is reduced and cold or at least not-heated air 
> flow from the fascia vents is increased.
...
> Is this truly a 'bug' not a 'feature?'  i.e. should I really be getting 
> heated air from the fascia vents?

Gotta have something to remind you that you're sitting in a Rover, after
all ;-)
This is in fact a feature and *not* a bug. If you want warm air from the vents
you must switch from fresh air intake to recirculation (aka "the fog machine").

> ...    Is the shop manual valuable and/or worth the money?

If you're able and willing to work on the car yourself it will pay off
with the very first substantial service or repair job you perform on it.
Just for late night reading they're a) to boring, b) to costly.

Stefan
<Stefan R. Jacob, 100043.2400@CompuServe.com>

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 16:33:36 -0500 (EST)
From: "Francis J. Twarog" <ftwarog@moose.uvm.edu>
Subject: Trivia

I thought it might be fun to start doing a daily trivia contest (of 
sorts) on the digest - the answers to the questions need not be 100% 
correct - indeed, humorous ones would be preferred - since some of the 
ones I've thought up may not be verifiable... anyway, I'll give it a try 
and see what people have to say... oh, yeah, what do you win?  Fame and 
applause from fellow owners, of course!  O.K. - In what year and why did 
LR change the door handles on 90s and 110s from the standard style to the 
plastic push-button type.  (Remember, there were a few years where 
roll-down windows in full doors still shared the original latch.).  For 
those who think this one's easy, think of this round as just the beginning!

Frank Twarog
Burlington, VT

BTW - send your answers to the digest, 'cause I'm not the judge!

------------------------------

From: ASFCO@aol.com
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 17:24:53 -0500
Subject: E-Mail address wanted 

Any body have an E-Mail address for the following persons ???  Mike Bross or
Steve O'Neill  both from Hendersonville, NC  or Harold Gollberg from
Asheville, NC.... I  would also be interested in hearing from any other rover
owners  in that area   who would like to get together, as I will be down
there for a week or so around Thanksgiving. (Just cant get enough of this
Rover Stuff) Thanks and regards to all                        Steve
      WA2GMC

                                                                           72
Sreies lll    

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 18:21:41 -0600 (CST)
From: wilsonhb@ctrvax.Vanderbilt.Edu (Henry B. Wilson)
Subject: 7500 mile service

Land Rover subsidizes these services to keep overall prices in line with
competitors like JGC or Explelunker (always in the dark, you know).  My 7500
mile service cost $42--yours should have, too.

Henry B. Wilson             http://vumclib.mc.vanderbilt.edu/~wilsonhb
henben@aol.com (currently most reliable) or wilsonhb@ctrvax.vanderbilt.edu

           '59 AHY 100-6                    '94 Disco
                              
      "The Healey's clean; the Rover's filthy.  Life is perfect."

------------------------------

Date: 30 Oct 95 19:22:42 EST
From: compuserve <72647.2641@compuserve.com>
Subject: Re: Re: Is a pattern emerging?

Yes I know of at least one magazine that is definately targeting BMW owners (BMW
car)  Not published by BMW:

Printed on contents pages

INDEPENDANCE
This publication is neither associated with nor approved by BMW (GB) Limited or
its dealers, or any club or associaation.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 31 Oct 1995 11:32:38 +1100 (EST)
From: haystack@netspace.net.au (Doug McPherson)
Subject: High mileage. Is it a problem ?

Hi all.

In the continuing saga of wanting to buy a 110 here in Oz.....

1.) One of the 110s I'm looking at has a pretty high mileage. 240000kms
(150,000 miles).
       Its a 1985 model.
       Thats pretty high in 10 years. I'm wondering if the whole truck is
about to expire in a fury of nasty                 noises !    Its does seem
in good condition, just lots of miles.
        A friend has a 30 year old IIa 109 thats only done 116000 miles, and
they've used it pretty heavily.
        Whats the expected lifetime of such things as diffs, gearbox and
engine (V8) if we assume they've         been adequately maintained ?

2). I'm seriously considering getting a Range Rover instead. Nobody wants to
sell me a 110 at what I       consider to be a reasonable price. They all
want nearly AUS$20k. I'd prefer to spend closer to $15k.
      Especially considering most of them aren't in particularly good
condition. Very clean, low mileage             84/85   RRs seem
significantly cheaper than 110s.
      Spleen Venting mode off.....  

3)  I've been warned off the 5 speed 110s (those with the LT85 gearbox).
According to this guy at a           Melbourne Land Rover
parts/service/second hand sales place (4x4 motors in Blackburn) the 5 speeds
need significant maintenance at about 100000kms. New bearings etc. Then the
overdrive gears go....
     According to him the 4 speeds (LT95) are bullet proof . Just another
data point.

Thanks

Doug.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 21:02:12 -0500
From: Matt Neibaur <matt@jax.gttw.com>
Subject: Discovery Woes

Discovery Fans,

I bought a '95 Discovery in Jacksonville, FL about 5 months ago.  Since
then, I've put on about 8,000 miles (changing the oil first 1,000 and every
3,000 thereafter).  On my first trip the motor in the rear sun roof went
out the first time I used it.  Easy to fix, but it made me wonder about
quality control at the factory.  Now I've got something more serious going
on.

I took my son and friends to a cross country running meet today.  While
there, it began to rain, so I started the car and drove about 3 miles.  It
was quite humid (not unusual for Florida) and I noticed that the car began
to sputter.  The more I stepped on the gas, the more it stalled out.  I
coasted to a parking lot, started it and it made an electrical whining
noise, but the starter didn't turn over.  So I called the 800 number for LR
towing.  While waiting, I tried starting the car, and it started right up.
I drove for another thirty minutes and the same thing happened again, only
this time I noticed that the speedometer and tachometer were on zero while
the engine was going.  I also noticed that the radio didn't work - no
light.  Its sitting in my garage now.  Any ideas?

I've been reading in Land Rover magazine that there is a problem with
quality control with the Discoveries.  It seems they are having to spend
over $2,000 dollars per car on warranties.  Although I love this car, what
happened to the legendary dependability, or was that just a legend?

The legend lives on?

Matt Neibaur

matt@jax.gttw.com

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 22:02:43 +0000
From: RMILLER@Middlebury.edu (Raoul Miller)
Subject: Re: Alaskan 110s

>Anyhow, this ad appears which made me wonder if others have heard of or
>inquired about them.
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 11 lines)]
>he's crazy or it was a typo.  I'm going to call on Monday unless someone
>out there has heard of them and shares the info.
I haven't heard about these but there was the guy selling 110s from Montana
(Big Sky Rovers).  When he sent me photos, the 110 he was asking $26,000
was badly rolled, radiator stoved in, top destroyed, needed cab roof,etc,
etc, you get the picture.  The 90s and 110s he had were scrap from the
Canadian bases in Alberta.  Wonder if these are the same thing or if this
is another source.
        Let us know what you find out as I for one would be willing to ride
my bike to Alaska to get a decent diesel engined 110 that I could register
in the US.
        There are a number of legally registered 110s here in the
northeast.  Rovers North had one for sale this spring - $25K for a 110
county SW with V8 and a bunch of nice add-ons.  Some other guy in New
Hampshire was also selling a 110 county and wanted $30K.  Then last week I
saw a light blue 110 SW on route 7 in Vermont between Burlington and
Middlebury.  Couldn't see where it was registered but it had "E" reg.
English plate on the rear.  Anyone know who this belongs to?
        While we are on the subject, could anyone fill me in with some more
details on what Vermont being a "non-DOT" state means?  And can you legally
import a 110 into Canada?
        Thanks
        Raoul

------------------------------

From: CpaulP@aol.com
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 22:23:02 -0500
Subject: Re: Lashing Down Gear

I am considering installing LASHING CLEATS on the inside of my Defender 90
along the wheel well just above the floor.  This was standard on military
rovers. Concern is electrolysis problems.  Has anyone used this method? How
would you prevent electrolysis problems?  Any other better methods of setting
up a versatile method of lashing down gear?  

------------------------------

From: Inkornoink@aol.com
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 23:01:43 -0500
Subject: Re: 110's

jim - i spoke with one of the guys in Alaska today re: the 110's ....he has
them alright...lots of em.....however they cannot get them registerd for the
US...they have tried for over a year.     Aaarrghhh!

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 23:02:28 -0500
From: rover@pinn.net (Alexander P. Grice)
Subject: 109 for sale

Several folks have asked me if I know of any Rovers for sale in the 
area...well, one has just turned up.  There's an absolutely box-stock, RHD, 
1968 109" 5-door diesel for sale in southeastern Pennsylvania.  Sounds like 
a nice truck...tropical roof, bronze green paint, very good *original* 
condition.  The chap's name is Gabor Antalics and he's relocating to the UK 
(by way of Turkey), so he's looking to sell his vehicle here.  The vehicle 
come with a rebuilt military 2.25 petrol as a spare.  Give him a call at 
215-925-1804.
      *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"----*
      |               A. P. (Sandy) Grice                   |
      |       Rover Owners' Association of Virginia         |
      |    1633 Melrose Parkway, Norfolk, VA 23508-1730     |
      |  E-mail: rover@pinn.net  Phone: 804-622-7054 (Day)  |
      |    804-423-4898 (Evenings)    FAX: 804-622-7056     |
      *-----------------------------------------------------*

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 20:13:30 -0800
From: Roger Sinasohn <sinasohn@crl.com>
Subject: Re: 12-speed?

> By my count, 4 gears, doubled by OD = 8 doubled by lo range = 16 forward & 
> 4 reverse

That's it!  16 fwd - 4 reverse = net 12 fwd!

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Uncle Roger                         "There is pleasure pure in being mad
sinasohn@crl.com                                that none but madmen know."
Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates
San Francisco, California

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 20:11:55 -0800
From: Roger Sinasohn <sinasohn@crl.com>
Subject: Re: Soccer practice [in a landy?]

>           You wrote "if you want something to to drive
>           around in or haul the kids to soccer practice, get
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 6 lines)]
>           What's wrong with taking kids to soccer practice
>           in a Landie?! That's what mine used to do...

You're absolutely right, of course.  LR's are *very* versatile.  However, if 
*all* you're going to do is haul the kids to the mall and such, you can save 
yourself $10-15K by buying a 4-runner, or rodeo, or whatever.  And if you've 
got kids to feed, that may very well be a major consideration!

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Uncle Roger                         "There is pleasure pure in being mad
sinasohn@crl.com                                that none but madmen know."
Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates
San Francisco, California

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 20:12:08 -0800
From: Roger Sinasohn <sinasohn@crl.com>
Subject: Re: Petrol versus Batteries

I actually thought this was part of the EV mail list...  When I saw the 
mention of LR's, I had to check the headers!

> Also understand the "total" polution argument against electric vehicles.  

EV's are considerably cleaner overall than ICE's (Int. Combustion Engine 
[vehicles]).  The "'total' polution argument" comes from the petrol companies 
and the auto makers (who don't want to have to convert.)

> Am under no delusions that I will be able to buy a pratical electric LR

Actually, you can.  Bob Rickard (wilde_evolutions@olympus.net) of Wilde 
EVolutions has done one up.  Works great, from what I hear.  This might be a 
costly conversion, but it's doable.  

If you don't have your heart set on an electric *land rover*, check out some 
of the other EV makers, especially Renaissance cars.  On my web page 
(http://www.crl.com/~sinasohn) I've got a link to a list of EV resources.  

> in '97? must meet a zero emissions standard.  Anyone know of LR's plans?)

Land Rover isn't affected, yet.  Only the biggest 7 or so have to meet it.  
(mfrs selling over x number of vehicles have to sell 2% as electrics.)

There's actually quite a link between LR's and EV's.  There are at least 3 or 
4 folks (me, Jory Bell, Brian Foster, ?) from the LRO list who are on the EV 
list, and one of the dealers for Renaissance Cars is Mission Viejo Land 
Rover; the owner is on the board of directors.  But even more so, I think 
LRO's share a desire to preserve the lands that our LR's let us enjoy.  

Anyway, don't want to babel too much.  Lemme know if you want more info on 
EV's.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Uncle Roger                         "There is pleasure pure in being mad
sinasohn@crl.com                                that none but madmen know."
Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates
San Francisco, California

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 20:12:31 -0800
From: Roger Sinasohn <sinasohn@crl.com>
Subject: Re: re:Consumer Reports on Discovery

> > town.  So I'm looking for either an Electric Vehicle or a DeLorean.
> What was that about a "pleasure in being mad"?? OK.. Considering your in
> the great western bozo land of automotive regulations, an Electric vehicle
> might be OK.. But a DeLorean? Come on, Roger. Practical??

Well, for daily commuting, and around town (try parking a 109" in downtown 
San Francisco!), why not?  Besides, it's the coolest car there is, plain and 
simple.

You wouldn't want me to get a <gasp> *normal* car, would you?   8^)

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Uncle Roger                         "There is pleasure pure in being mad
sinasohn@crl.com                                that none but madmen know."
Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates
San Francisco, California

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 23:44:35 -0500 (EST)
From: Dixon Kenner <dkenner@emr1.emr.ca>
Subject: Re: Trivia

On Mon, 30 Oct 1995, Francis J. Twarog wrote:

> applause from fellow owners, of course!  O.K. - In what year and why did 
> LR change the door handles on 90s and 110s from the standard style to the 
> plastic push-button type.  (Remember, there were a few years where 
> roll-down windows in full doors still shared the original latch.).  For 

	You're joking...  LR's died in 1974 over here.  Let's talk anti
	burst door handles before we talk the plastic nonesense.  

	(good grief... the plastic stuff would last a winter at -40c)

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 23:51:02 -0500 (EST)
From: Dixon Kenner <dkenner@emr1.emr.ca>
Subject: For those asking...

	Quebec referendum:

	Yes:	49.5%
	No:	50.5%

	At the Prescott for the OVLR pub bash

	Winner of the betting pool was the club at 50-50

	Closest to this were myself at 51-49 No and Dave Meadows
	at 49-51 Yes.

	No 105mm tomorrow across the river...

------------------------------

From: rmodica@east.pima.edu
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 21:54:17 MST
Subject: AZLRO (Arizona Land Rover Owners)

I sent this on 10/16 but it apparently didn't get out to anyone.

10/16/95 to LRO@team.net
On Sunday 10/15 the fledgling Arizona Land Rover Owners had its first Rover    
Ride organized by Paul Mathis.  In attendance were two D-90s ( one only 4 days 
old owned by Dan Grambihler ), two Discos, 4 Range Rovers including a 4.0 SE,  
one Hummer and one "gulp" Toyonissan pickemup (sorry Paul).  We drove around in 
the Arizona desert west and north of Lake Pleasant just outside of Phoenix for 
about five hours and 25 miles.  Nice rugged country with a few little fords    
across the Agua Fria river and lots of rocky old mining roads.  A fun time by  
all.  We will try for a larger attendance in the future, but the AZLRO seems to 
be on the way to reality.  BTW "Thanks" to Tom Mills for the mention in the     
latest Solihull Society newsletter.

For more information about AZLRO please e-mail me directly at:

rmodica@east.pima.edu 

Rob Modica      '51 SI 80"      '60 SII 109"
Tucson AZ       '94 Disco 5-spd  "Casper"  

------------------------------

From: "Robert Watson (CNA)" <a-robw@microsoft.com>
Subject: RE: Discovery Woes
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 21:04:34 -0800

[snip]
 While waiting, I tried starting the car, and it started right up.
I drove for another thirty minutes and the same thing happened again, only
this time I noticed that the speedometer and tachometer were on zero while
the engine was going.  I also noticed that the radio didn't work - no
light.  Its sitting in my garage now.  Any ideas?

Did you look at the:
	Diagnostic display under the front passenger seat?
		(possible ECU problem)
	The fuse box behind the panel under the steering wheel?
		(loose/blown fuse)

After installing my ham radio and rooting around under the dash, I wasn't too 
impressed with LR's idea of wiring practices (i.e. it's a rat's nest under 
there) OTOH, they have plenty of fused circuits (for a reason?) so it should 
still be safe, if not trustworthy.

I've been reading in Land Rover magazine that there is a problem with
quality control with the Discoveries.  It seems they are having to spend
over $2,000 dollars per car on warranties.  Although I love this car, what
happened to the legendary dependability, or was that just a legend?

That does seem awfully high.

    _____
   /___|_\___     Bob Watson <a-robw@microsoft.com>
  |   |   |  \                  6405 235th Place SW
  |---|___|___\____     Mountlake Terrace, WA 98043
  |  _|   |   | _  }\
 [|_/_ \__|___|/_\_}|    '95 Beluga Black Discovery
    \_/        \_/

 \_/

------------------------------

From: RICKCRIDER@aol.com
Date: Tue, 31 Oct 1995 01:15:35 -0500
Subject: Re: Thoughts and prayers for fellow injured LRO..........

In a message dated 95-10-30 11:18:02 EST, GElam30092@aol.com writes:

>I know that James would love to hear from everyone and would appreciate your
>support.  If you have a few minutes, stop and drop him a short note at the
>address below.  I'll include the phone number too.  

Well,  James is certainly wished the best from this keyboard.    Thanks for
the posting  Gerry.    I've sent him a card with a photo of a nice Poppy Red
73 Slll 88" to generate nice thoughts while in the hospital.

Gerry didn't mention the cause or the source of the fire.........wonder if it
was Rover related.......perhaps a garage fire?    Please keep us posted
Gerry.

Rick Crider
Monroe  NC
<rickcrider@aol.com>  
66  Slla  109"
73  Slll    88"
88  Range  Rover

------------------------------

From: RICKCRIDER@aol.com
Date: Tue, 31 Oct 1995 01:15:17 -0500
Subject: Re: Discovery Woes

In a message dated 95-10-31 00:26:47 EST, a-robw@microsoft.com (Robert Watson
(CNA)) writes:

>After installing my ham radio and rooting around under the dash, 

Well........another amateur radio operator on the list.    Seems that there
are several of us.    Would say that the list has a relatively high ratio of
hams.    Must be something about the smell of hot smoking wiring and
circuits.
Regards.........and 73.....
Rick Crider  KD4FXA
Monroe  NC
<rickcrider@aol.com>
66  Slla   109"        Hugo        .........and,  still,  for sale..........
73  Slll     88"        Jesse      
88  Range  Rover    ...my daily sloth.....and needs a water pump
.........To prove I'm a glut for punishment......My '61 Alfa Giulietta Spider
has Lucas wiring.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 22:16:17 -0800
From: justfred@netcom.com (Fred Heald)
Subject: Baja Trip

All,

I just wanted to brag a bit.  I just finished a week-long trip from San
Diego, CA to Cabo San Lucas, in my 1965 109" soft-top RHD beater.  I built
a box for the back (with some help from previous posts) that holds/secures
my stuff and has space for a futon on top.  2,000 miles (by the
questionable but semi-functional odometer) at about 50mph the whole way;
only 100 or so of it off-road (unfortunately).  No big problems - one small
one, on a bumpy dirt road, the battery jumped out of its rack and mashed
into the fan shroud, and I had to figure out (as dusk continued) how my
electrical system worked (I forgot that it was 'positive earth').  Between
La Paz and San Jose del Cabo, was stopped at a gas station and another tan,
soft-top rhd 109 pulled in - they were from British Columbia (I forgot to
ask, "Where is that, somewhere near Bolivia?").  Camped on beaches, ate
fish tacos stared at the stars.

BTW, I'm reading a book called _The Coming Plague_ about viruses, LRs are
mentioned frequently.  As a developing-world epedemiologist, "It does
sometimes matter whether you know how many logs it takes to float a
Land-Rover"

Email me if you want more info about the trip.  I reccommend it!

Fred Heald                                      justfred@netcom.com
WWW Home page: ftp://ftp.netcom.com/pub/ju/justfred/fred.html
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"THERE MAY BE A RISK ASSOCIATED WITH CONSUMING RAW SHELLFISH AS IS THE CASE
WITH OTHER RAW PROTEIN PRODUCTS" - sign in New Orleans oyster bar
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

From: wassili@AMC.UVA.NL
Date: Tue, 31 Oct 1995 08:35:35 +0001
Subject: Re: Discovery Woes

>To change subscription write to: Majordomo@Land-Rover.Team.Net

>In a message dated 95-10-31 00:26:47 EST, a-robw@microsoft.com (Robert Watson
>(CNA)) writes:
>>After installing my ham radio and rooting around under the dash, 

Sorry for interrupting, but as a non-native English-speaking uhh typing
member of the list, could any one explain to me what a ham radio is? I
assume its not the kind of ham one gets from the local butcher though? Or
did I miss a thread about new technologies were they import ham from
Tjernobyl and convert them to transistors in implement them in new car hifi?

LR*LR*LR*LR*LR*LR*LR*LR*LR*LR*LR*LR*LR*LR*LR*LR*LR*LR*LR
                ____
      |   _____/|__||   Roy Wassili,<wassili@amc.uva.nl>
      |  /(-8|  \   |   Avalon Green '95 Dicovery,
  ____|_/[]__|__\___|#  scarved for live
 |] __=|     |  __  |#
[|_/  \|_____|_/  \_|]
  ( o )        ( o )

------------------------------

  END OF LAND ROVER OWNER DIGEST 
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