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Subject: Re: 
Date: Fri, 07 Jul 95 18:56:12 +0930
From: "Peter Hand" <phand@arch.adelaide.edu.au>

On Thur, 6 Jul, mtalbot@InterServ.Com (Mark Talbot) wrote:
[much about oily bits deleted]

>seal around diff. Anyone offer some help ?? 

Hi,
	I just had this happen on a SIIA. Most likely it's the last seal in the
gearbox (speedo-cable housing on mine). Mine was probably due to go, the one I
took out was the original leather seal (1964). Check the transmission brake
shoes, as they're likely to be oil soaked. 

		Pete
--
 Peter Hand    Rm 461,            | ph# +61 8 3034588                ,-_|\ 
 Department of Architecture,      | fx# +61 8 3034377               /     \ 
 University of Adelaide, SA 5005. |                                 \_,-^./ 
 email phand@arch.adelaide.edu.au | Bugs crawl in under Windows ... 

------------------------------

From: Andrew Grafton <A.J.Grafton@lut.ac.uk>
Subject: Questions for the 4th month of LR ownership
Date: Fri, 7 Jul 95 10:41:27 BST

> I still, after more than three months of ownership, get a big grin on
> my face ever time I get behind the wheel of my 88.  I have spent about

I know the feeling!

> I don't know how the PO lived with this Series III for 23 years in
> Phoenix, Arizona without a tropical roof.  It was his daily transport
[snip]
> than sheet aluminum rivited to the ribs on the roof.

I'll take a much closer look at ours for you if you want...
As far as memory serves;  The thing is an Aluminuim plate riveted
onto some (5?) U shaped longitudinals (mounted looking like a C...) 
which space it from the roof.  I don't know if the outer skin is 
riveted to the three roof stiffening ribs that are already there.
The Al plate is in 3 sections riveted together (this is for a 109"
- it looks like an 88" version would just have 2 plates)
The edges are supported by bolts which run through cylindrical
nylon spacers.

I have just fitted a full length roofrack to one of our 109"s
(no tropical roof) and was getting too hot driving round in the sun
so I put a couple of big pallets on the top.  The internal temperature
dropped by a huge amount.  This could be an alternative if you
need a roofrack as well...

The biggest advantage of the (official) tropical roof is the 
air-vents in the inner skin.  They are four small hatches that
open up into the space between the two skins and direct air
into the cabin.  Diagram(s) below.  The vents are really effective
at 'speed' (ha,ha).  Please excuse crap ASCII art. 

On the cooling note - our forward-facing air vents in the
bulkhead work much, much better with the spare tyre removed
from the bonnet.  
One of the machines has a very silly looking
sun-visor attached above the windscreen which sticks out
about 6 inches over the bonnet.  It may look silly, but it
really does help if the sun is overhead by keeping it off the
dashboard (which usually gets pretty hot).  It bolts onto the
windscreen edges and central divider.

Diagrams of tropical roof vents

                      no rain gets in (here, anyway...) 
Open                       V                     
            ------------------------------------- outer skin
air flow         @@@@@@
between --->           @@@@@@        pivot
skins            \           @@@@@@ /
            ---   \                +---------------inner skin 
                   \ 
                    air directed into cab 

Closed
            ------------------------------------- 
 

            ---@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@+--------------

Let me know if you want more info.

Anyone else out there with tips on LR cooling?  Minds soon
to be overheated crossing African deserts want to know!
Please, no air-conditioning recommendations  :-)

Sorry, can't help re:tyres or finances!  

All the best,

Andy
A.J.Grafton@lut.ac.uk

------------------------------

Date: 07 Jul 95 06:05:15 EDT
From: "Stefan R. Jacob" <100043.2400@compuserve.com>
Subject: Re: BLOW-BY BLUES

> ...<snip>... wonder: what causes the gasket
> to blow like this? I don't want it to happen again.

a) overheating (which in turn can have an assortment of causes)
b) cylinder head fastened with uneven/wrong torque
c) inferior quality gasket or gasket w/ material flaw
d) *old age*  -  it seems many LR owners are most of the time unaware of the
time and mileage their beasts have put behind them. After 100,00 miles or so
and at times punishing treatment, any head gasket can be expected to throw
away the spoon...

Stefan
<Stefan R. Jacob, 100043.2400@CompuServe.com>

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 Jul 1995 11:45:03 +0059 (BST)
From: Charlie Wright <cw117@mole.bio.cam.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Re[2]: Fuel tank leaks (from Oxygena

> Hank asks...
> > Maybe this is why the fuel tank in my very old 109 is suddenly dripping 
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 7 lines)]
> You can try the gas tank repair kit from the Eastwood Catalog ($39.95 -
> 800-557-3277). It's a three part kit - the first part is a phosphoric acid

I don't know about the North American price, but an underseat tank in the 
U.K. is only about 30 pounds new... $45-$50.  I'd think this was better 
spent money than $40 on a three-part filler?  Perhaps not.

Surely you could modify a newer, U.S. made plastic tank to fit under the 
seat?

Charlie

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 7 Jul 1994 12:33:38 +0000
From: svf@novabase.pt (Sergio Valentim)
Subject: Help in LR Def 90 TDi

Hello!

=46irst of all i'm new here. Is there anyone that could help me in the
shop of a Land Rover? (no, i don't want money...)
I want a LR Defender 90 TDi and i=B4ve already one in mind.
The vehicle is from the year 1988 and he made 56.000 Km.
My question is what things in the car i have to lookup to conclude
that the car is in conditions or not.
Any information on LR Def 90 TDi or places where i can find it (www,
ftp, gopher, etc...) is welcome.

Thanks for attention.

Sergio Valentim
Lisboa - Portugal

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 Jul 1995 12:33:36 +0100
From: cw117@mole.bio.cam.ac.uk (Charlie Wright)
Subject: Re: Tre's and ammeters.

Thanks Bill,

>It is not really necessary to take the front off to fit an alternator,
>although it is sometimes difficult to extract the rear dynamo stud. But from
>your experiences it was probably a good job you did.

We tried it on my old IIa without. Big mistake. We ended up breaking down
and taking out the panel...

> A word of caution, the ammeter for the dynamo will not take the output from an
>alternator, dynamoes typically charge at around 20 amp whereas alternators can
>charge at between 40 and 100 amps dependant on model and on battery condition.

I can see it's off scale, but the ammeter looks tougher than the wires
running to it.The Lucas 16ACR only puts out 35 Amps.  I'd like a bigger
ammeter, but does anyone know the source for a 40-50 amp unit that fits in
the original dash?

Cheers,
Charlie

C. R. Wright                                    Dept. of Genetics
+44 (0)1223 333970 telephone                    Univ. of Cambridge
+44 (0)1223 333992 telefax                      Downing Street, Cambs.
cw117@mole.bio.cam.ac.uk                        CB2 3EH, England

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 Jul 1995 12:35:19 +0100
From: cw117@mole.bio.cam.ac.uk (Charlie Wright)
Subject: Re: Dynamo->Alternator swap

Michael,

Thanks for the note:

>The Ammeter connections need to be reversed but the fuel guage does not.

But why not? Tell us Uncle Joe!

>With the Delco, the ammeter deflects full for just a second and then slowly
>comes down to zero. I would expect the same with the Lucas alternator..

I expect this to improve after my 650Ah battery finally recovers from a
month of irregular charging. It's still drawing about 10 amps at 13.9-14.2
volts after initial settling. I'll keep an eye on it.

>The only change I made was to add a #10 guage wire to the engine harness for
>the the alternator output. That wire also connects to the buss-bar on the
>terminal strip. I also added a ground connection between the alternator and
>the engine block.

Didn't think the earthing strip was required. I have a good connection
metal to metal.

I bought 37amp wire for the job, but I realised that the wire from the
terminal block/splice (formerly the box) to the ammeter was even smaller
than the old dynamo wire.  I'd need to do everything from
alternator->ammeter->battery with the new wire to make it 'smoke-proof', I
think. There are bottlenecks in the current (no pun intended) system.

Anyone know a source of 50amp ammeters that fit? A nice looking (stock
looking) voltmeter for my dash?

Cheers,
Charlie

C. R. Wright                                    Dept. of Genetics
+44 (0)1223 333970 telephone                    Univ. of Cambridge
+44 (0)1223 333992 telefax                      Downing Street, Cambs.
cw117@mole.bio.cam.ac.uk                        CB2 3EH, England

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 Jul 1995 08:11:13 -0400
From: chrisste@clark.net (Chris Stevens)
Subject: Re: BLOW-BY BLUES

>a) overheating (which in turn can have an assortment of causes)
>b) cylinder head fastened with uneven/wrong torque
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 7 lines)]
>and at times punishing treatment, any head gasket can be expected to throw
>away the spoon...

I'm expecting the new gasket today for installation this weekend and have a
few questions. Pistons 2 and 3 have carbon build-up on them...can I, or
should I, use a wire cup brush on an electric drill to clean them up? Same
goes for the valves. What else should I look for with the head off?

Chris Stevens                           1969 SRIIA 88" SW

BCG Corporate Communications
Towson, Maryland, USA
(410) 583-1722
(410) 583-1935 (FAX)
chrisste@Clark.net

------------------------------

From: hlapa@Zeus.signalcorp.com
Date: Fri, 07 Jul 95 08:34:09 EST
Subject: 1-Man Nudge Bar Install

All,

Just put the Genuine Parts Nudge Bar on the Disco last night.  Not 
complicated, but here's some tips:

First, you are told to replace the molded plastic center part on the 
front bumper with the one supplied with the bar.  To put the metal 
license plate mount on the new piece, you'd have to carve out two 
largish holes to slip the tabs through.  Just leave it off and drill 2 
or 4 small holes for self-tapping SS screws, or install rivnuts.  Much 
nicer looking should the vehicle move to a rear-plate-only state.

Also, before undoing the four bumper mounting bolts, take out just 
one, and find four short bolts of the same diameter, short enough to 
not protrude through the entire frame member.  Then, one by one, 
withdraw the long bolts and replace with the short bolts, heads 
outboard, to maintain bumper/frame hole alignment.  Then when the bar 
is offered up to the frame, insert the original long bolts, heads to 
inboard side, through the holes, pushing out the short bolts as it 
goes through.  The bumper will shift easily if hole alignment is not 
mechanically held, and simultaneous bar/bumper/frame alignment is 
difficult to regain once lost if you're doing this alone like I was.  

All in all, an hour or two is all it takes, and the built-in slop in 
the hole tolerances allow you to shift the bar around to make sure 
it's level with the body.  The bar arrived well packaged by L-R, no 
worries about scuffs and scratches in shipment.  But if you order from 
Rovers North, be sure to proactively ask for Regular Ground shipment, 
or the shipping charge will sting!

Rightside up and Forward,
Hank

------------------------------

From: "Tom Rowe" <TROWE@AE.AGECON.WISC.EDU>
Date:          Fri, 7 Jul 1995 07:57:55 GMT -0600
Subject:       diff locks, wipers, TRE

Andy Woodward:
>When on my own, I tend to keep the diff unlocked. That way I can get myself 
>unstuck easily (usually) by just locking teh diff and reversing out. Sort of 
>traction fuse to save lots of annoying winching.

Good method. If you use your maximum traction to get yourself stuck, 
it's certainly going to take a lot of work, or a winch, to get out. 
When I lived in VT a guy from the electric company that drove the 
back roads as his job said he *never* used four wheel drive to get to 
a site. That way he had the most traction for getting out.
  My signature notwithstanding.

TeriAnn,
>Lucas makes a spindle adaptor that allows the owners of duel wiper motors use 
>the later splined arms.  It screws onto your smooth wiper motor shaft.

Anco also makes those adaptors and ajustable length arms. I've been 
buying them at NAPA stores for some time. Actually the last one I
bought was about six years ago, but I assume they are still 
available. Often they aren't "stocking" items and must be special 
ordered. As I recall the arms come with the little bonnet so they fit 
both types. What I like best is that if you get them adjusted right 
you can use 11" blades instead of the standard 10".

William L. Grouell,
>The major disadvantage of free-running types (cotter pin-bg) is that when
>the break-loose resistance is overcome, either through loss of fastener
>pre-load or ineffectiveness of the accessory device (cotter pin-bg), further
>resistance to fastener loosening becomes essentially zero and eventual
>disengagement of the mating parts is a distinct possibility. In contrast,

With respect to the  experts, I've used castelated nuts on all kinds 
of equipment, farm equip to big trucks and I've never had one fail 
when used in a *suitable* location. I always use a new cotter pin and 
put Never-Seeze (TM) on it. I *have* seen them fail, or rather come 
off by spanner, when they are very old and rusty and weren't 
originally  installed by the method I described. 

That said, it seems as if this thread (no pun intended) may become 
another "Which is better, an 88 or 109?" discussion.
Tom

Tom Rowe
UW-Madison Center for Dairy Research    
608-265-6194, Fax:608-262-1578        
trowe@ae.agecon.wisc.edu                

 Four wheel drive allows you to get
 stuck in places even more inaccessible.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 Jul 1995 14:38:21 +0100
From: cw117@mole.bio.cam.ac.uk (Charlie Wright)
Subject: Re: BLOW-BY BLUES

Chris,

There is good discussion in your Haynes manual (you do have one, don't
you?) about de-carbonising cylinders and piston crowns.  I wouldn't even
think about a rotary wire brush on a drill myself.  Think gentle and keep
the crud out of the bores with grease.

I know that BMW's official fix (for engine/head in situ) is to blast
high-pressure _pecan shells_ into the pistons, past the valves... I kid you
not.

Charlie

C. R. Wright                                    Dept. of Genetics
+44 (0)1223 333970 telephone                    Univ. of Cambridge
+44 (0)1223 333992 telefax                      Downing Street, Cambs.
cw117@mole.bio.cam.ac.uk                        CB2 3EH, England

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Jul 1995 07:39:32 -0600
From: Scott Johansen <SCOTTJ@wpmail.code3.com>
Subject:  

unsubscribe lro-digest

------------------------------

From: Richard Jones <rich@apricot.co.uk>
Subject: British Computers
Date: Fri, 7 Jul 1995 15:03:01 +0100 (BST)

>>>p.s.    Q: Why don't the British make computers?
>>>        A:  because they cannot figure out how to make them leak oil.... 

>>Well ya got it wrong I'm afraid Peter.  They do build what passes for a 
>>computer.  Amstrad builds an assortment of such devices...they were even 
>>sold in the US by Sears about ten to twelve years ago.  And they don't need 
>>to leak oil...they can lose data.  Only problem is that when you move the 
>>machine you can't find the missing data underneath. 8-D.

>Gerry, sorry to misstate the case of British built computers!  I do 
>have an entire bucket of '1's here, if you need some for your Amstrad...
>However, I just moved, and cannot find the corrosponding bucket of '0's :-)

Can't see any oil or data in a puddle under my British designed and built 
Apricot computer (maybe I have the one that proves the rule)? :-)
__ 
  _ __              Apricot Computer Limited
 ' )  )      /      3500 Parkside                 Tel:   (+44) 121 717 7171
  /--' o _. /_      Birmingham Business Park      Fax:   (+44) 121 717 0123
 /  <_<_(__/ <_     BIRMINGHAM  B37 7YS
 Richard Jones      United Kingdom                Email: richardj@apricot.co.uk 

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 Jul 1995 07:15:53 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jim Russell <jrussell@netcom.com>
Subject: Nylock fasteners...

As I recall, the reuse of nylock fasteners is approved for aircraft
applications as long as the locking device is not damaged.  Could be
wrong, though.  Where are my A&P manuals anyway? 

                  Jim Russell   ====   jrussell@netcom.com
                         (Seattle -- San Francisco)            

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 Jul 1995 16:17:57 +0200
From: dbeers@eu.wang.com (David Beers)
Subject: Mail Order Stockists

>I want a LR Defender 90 TDi and i=B4ve already one in mind.
>The vehicle is from the year 1988 and he made 56.000 Km.
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 8 lines)]
>Sergio Valentim
>Lisboa - Portugal

Hello Sergio,

I have a 1989 Land Rover 90 Turbodiesel, and there are a few things you need 
to be aware of.  First, the 1988 model you are interested is not a Defender 
TDi model.  These were introduced in 1991.  The engine you are looking at is 
in fact a different engine from the TDi model, as I found out later.  They 
both are 2.5 L turbo, but the old Turbodiesel has 85 horsepower, while the 
later TDi has 107 horsepower.  The TDi engine is a newer design that 
incorporates an intercooler, which the older one doesn't have.  There is now 
an even newer TDi engine with 117 horsepower as well.  The "Defender" name 
was added at the same time as the TDi engine was introduced (1991).  

In summary:

What you are looking at (in official Land Rover terms) is a Land Rover 90 
Diesel Turbo.  This model has 85 HP and is capable of a top speed of 125 
km/hr.  "Comfortable" cruising speed is 100-110 km/hr.  Anything more is too 
noisy for me.  I have been told that the newer TDi's go up to 140 km/h with 
less noise.

Things to watch:

- It is VERY, VERY, important that you confirm with the previous  owner that 
he/she changed the oil at the specified intervals.  Otherwise, it is likely 
that the turbo mechanism will not live a full life, as it's bearings are 
lubricated by the engine oil, and is very sensitive to dirty oil.  
Otherwise, budget some money for a turbo rebuild for later (mine has already 
been rebuilt once by the previous owner).  Other than this, they say that 
this engine is as reliable as the non-turbo engine.  We shall see...

- Look under the chassis to check for rust and impact damage.  As long as 
the chassis is in good shape, everything else is affordable to repair, 
especially with an engine with low km's.

- Check the engine and suspension bushes (silent-blocks).  If these are worn 
out after only 56,000 km, then that implies that the vehicle was used 
heavily off-road.

- When you start the engine cold, you will notice a cloud of white smoke 
that will go away as soon as you press on the accelerator.  This is normal.

- When you press hard on the accelerator to pass or to go up a steep hill, 
you will notice black smoke blowing out.  This is normal.

- Any other kind of smoke activity/color is not normal.

Satisfaction report:

I am very happy with my 90, as I consider it the first Land Rover that you 
can use for everyday transportation and travel that consumes a reasonable 
amount of fuel.  I average 10-11 L / 100 km., which is pretty good.  I would 
be very happy to give you more detailed information if you want, either here 
or through E-mail.

Good luck,

David

E-mail >  dbeers@eu.wang.com

------------------------------

From: Russell Burns <burns@cisco.com>
Subject: Re: Tre's and ammeters.
Date: Fri, 7 Jul 95 7:51:12 PDT

>   Terri Ann.... TRE fitting, ensure that the taper section on the TRE and the
> hole is free of grease, if necessary apply chalk.  Push the tre home and either
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 12 lines)]
> designed for repeated usage.
>   Regards   Bill Leacock   Limey in exile.
I thought the nylon was only used until the rust could take over....

Russ

------------------------------

From: Mike Rooth <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: BLOW-BY BLUES
Date: Fri, 7 Jul 95 15:48:55 BST

> To change subscription write to: Majordomo@Land-Rover.Team.Net

	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 25 lines)]
> +44 (0)1223 333992 telefax                      Downing Street, Cambs.
> cw117@mole.bio.cam.ac.uk                        CB2 3EH, England
Just goes to show what I've always thought.They're nuts.

Mike Rooth

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 Jul 1995 09:04:51 -0700
From: gpool@pacific.pacific.net (Granville B. Pool)
Subject: Unsafe Jeeps

Michael Carradine wrote:

> but certainly not because of 24 volt electrics.  My understanding
> is that military Hummers are deemed unsafe by DOT for civilian use
> much like the Jeeps are (the last also having been destroyed) with
> roll-over accidents having killed 500 or so persons to date.

I haven't heard this about Hummers and don't know why it would be any
different for the military ones than for the civilian ones.  With as low a
profile as the Hummer has, its nearly 7'2" overall width, and its wide-based
A-arm independent suspension, I can see no reason to expect roll-over problems.

The "Jeep" you mention, however, is quite another story.  Actually, it's not
a Jeep but a Ford Mutt M-151, which replaced the Jeep M-38A1.  The Mutt had
swing-axle independent suspension (like an Austin Gipsy) and was very narrow
(about the same as the WWII Jeep MB).  The only modern 4x4 that I know of
with swing axles is the Steyr-Daimler-Puch Pinzgauer (unless there's been a
change in its suspension design that I haven't heard about).  It not only
has swing axles but portal axles as well.  And it's a tall one, too.  I
think the Pinzgauer is really neat but would sure be careful on the curves (8*0

Cheers,

Granville B. Pool, Redwood Valley, North California, USA
Several old Land-Rovers and other dubiously collectible vehicles
<gpool@pacific.pacific.net> (707)485-7220 Home; (707)463-4265 Work

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Jul 1995 09:12:06 +0100
From: cs@crl.com (Michael Carradine)
Subject: More LR Web links

      ______
      [__[  \==
      [________]                 /^^
 ___.._(o)__.(o)_______..._/^^^^^

 Just ran across three Web pages (RR, Def, and Disco) on the
 Popular Mechanics Magazine WWW page.  They compare 200 '95
 vehicles in general descripion, specification, price, and
 a photo.  The LR's are under: '95 New Car and Truck Profiles,
 Vehicle Type, Compact SUV's, Land Rover.  The URL is:
 http://popularmechanics.com/popmech/auto/1HOMEAUTO.html

 Michael Carradine   Carradine Studios                          cs@crl.com
 Architect           Architecture Development Planning    Pgr 510-945-5000
 NCARB RIBA          PO Box 99, Orinda, CA 94563 USA   Ph/Fax 510-988-0900

 Mercedes-Benz Unimog 4x4 WWW page at:  http://www.crl.com/~cs/unimog.html

------------------------------

From: hlapa@Zeus.signalcorp.com
Date: Fri, 07 Jul 95 11:52:59 EST
Subject: Re[4]: Fuel tank leaks (from Oxygena

Charlie,

Agree with your cost/benefit analysis.  My car, however only has one tank, under
the station wagon bed.  I'll likely look for the best price on a "new" like 
tank.  

Some years ago, a friend got the gas tank of his American sedan torn open on 
some jagged old PSP at a military proving ground.  Our hosts in green dragged 
him out and epoxied the huge tear.  He continued to drive with that emergency 
repair, and no leak, for quite some time.  I'm looking into some similar things 
for a temporary job, pending the new tank.

Hank

------------------------------

From: "Tom Rowe" <TROWE@AE.AGECON.WISC.EDU>
Date:          Fri, 7 Jul 1995 11:40:34 GMT -0600
Subject:       increasing turbo longevity

Hello all,
I've been meaning to post some info on turbos for those who care.
I used to rebuild them and picked up a few things along the way 
(sorry, I didn't pick up any turbos).
First, I don't know what make turbo LR uses, but most of this will 
apply to all turbos.

Starting the engine. Don't rev it up until your oil pressure is built 
up as turbo clearances are less than most engine parts and it will be 
the first damaged. Idealy you shouldget a T fitting and mount your 
oil pressure sender at the oil inlet to the turbo. It's usually the 
last thing the pressure gets too. Some designs though either have a 
check valve to prevent oil leaving the line, or a direct line to the 
turbo from the pump.

Shutting down. Don't park your Rover and then immediately shut down. 
The turbo gets HOT and a cool down of a minute or two (longer 
if you've been using a lot of boost) will be appreciated. When you 
shut down with a hot turbo the oil cokes up on the shaft and will 
eventually foul the bearings and lead to premature failure. There are 
available resevoir kits that are charged with oil on startup then release 
it to drain through the turbo on shut down. The best I've seen is a 
kit that comes with it's own pump and allows you to prelub the turbo 
and a heat activated switch that will post lube it until the temp 
drops to an acceptable level. It draws the oil from the sump through 
a fine filter that contains a magnet.

If you are working around your turbo make sure you don't foul the 
drain tube if it's a flex tube. Turbos must have the drain port within 
a specific range of angle and a clear drain. If either is out of spec 
the oil will back up and blow by the seals and into the engine. On 
it's way it will foul the impeller and if it goes on long enough you 
can get enough of a build up to get the turbo out of balance. Once 
out of balance, it gets progressively worse until it contacts the 
housing and will take about one second to completly destroy the turbo 
and possibly wipe out your engine.

If you must run the engine with the air cleaner removed, be *very* 
careful that nonthing gets sucked in. Very small things will wreck it 
in short order, most intake side impellers are aluminum and fragile. 
This seems obvious, but you'd be supprised how many wrecked turbos we 
saw because something got sucked into the air intake.

Depending on the make of turbo, you may be able to get a water cooled 
housing (like the ones used on Saabs) that will help keep it cool.

If you need to get your tubo rebuilt, ask if they balance the shaft 
and impellers. Some shops don't but it's important. Best, if it's a 
shop you are familar with, is to ask them "How do you balance the 
shaft and impellers?"

Hmm, that's all I can think of at the moment, if more comes to mind, 
I'll post it.
Tom

Tom Rowe
UW-Madison Center for Dairy Research    
608-265-6194, Fax:608-262-1578        
trowe@ae.agecon.wisc.edu                

 Four wheel drive allows you to get
 stuck in places even more inaccessible.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 Jul 1995 18:57:20 +0200
From: vortex@worldaccess.nl (Bert Palte)
Subject: Smiths aftermarket instruments.

On July 7th, Charlie Wright wrote:
* 
>I'd like a bigger
>ammeter, but does anyone know the source for a 40-50 amp unit that fits in
>the original dash?
*
This brings me to the following question.
Perhaps one of you UK readers can respond:
*
Does anyone know if the  'original' Smiths  52 mm round accessory
(aftermarket) instruments are still available?
They were once, but last time I've seen them was about 15 years ago
(and then I was a student, couldn't afford to buy them...)
The only thing comparable are digital-type 52mm instruments from Equus
(sold here by Halfords), but I don't like them.. they don't look British...  
*
Any comments?
*
Bert Palte, Soest, Holland
vortex@worldaccess.nl
1964 ex-BFG  88 LR
*

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 Jul 1995 10:06:59 -0700
From: growl@hsmpk14a-101.Eng.Sun.COM (William L. Grouell)
Subject: Re: diff locks, wipers, TRE

> That said, it seems as if this thread (no pun intended) may become 
> another "Which is better, an 88 or 109?" discussion.
> Tom

 It was not my intent to start a cotter pin vs Nyloc discussion. I quoted
that paragraph because it strongly implies that Nylocs are reusable. Castle
nuts are clearly superior in thermal applications.

R, bg

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 Jul 95 10:12:52 -0700
From: "TeriAnn Wakeman"  <twakeman@apple.com>
Subject: Re: Re[4]: Fuel tank leaks (from Oxygena

Hank,
The Land rover tank has a second skin on the underside which tends to trap 
water.  Most leaks tend to happen under the second skin where you can not get at
them without major torch work.  

You are much better off getting a new tank.

Inexpensive aftermarket tanks of very good quality are readilly available in the
UK for considerably less money than a tank would cost in the US (I once 
purchased a new rear and a new front tank, new front and rear drive shafts, a 
front wing skin, and a full set of genuine weather stripping in the UK for about
the same price as a rear petrol tank and one drive shaft in the US).

TeriAnn Wakeman              .sig closed for remodeling
twakeman@apple.com         
              
                         
                       

------------------------------

From: "Tom Rowe" <TROWE@AE.AGECON.WISC.EDU>
Date:          Fri, 7 Jul 1995 12:18:11 GMT -0600
Subject:       Re: diff locks, wipers, TRE

 
> > That said, it seems as if this thread (no pun intended) may become 
> > another "Which is better, an 88 or 109?" discussion.
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 8 lines)]
> that paragraph because it strongly implies that Nylocs are reusable. Castle
> nuts are clearly superior in thermal applications.
Mine either, I do reuse them on occasion.
Tom

Tom Rowe
UW-Madison Center for Dairy Research    
608-265-6194, Fax:608-262-1578        
trowe@ae.agecon.wisc.edu                

 Four wheel drive allows you to get
 stuck in places even more inaccessible.

------------------------------

From: Russell Burns <burns@cisco.com>
Subject: Nyloc nuts.
Date: Fri, 7 Jul 95 10:42:54 PDT

When I rebushed my panhard rod with bearcans, I reused the origional
nyloc nut. I rechecked it after a few hundred miles, and found
it was loose. I then applied loctite to the nut every time I
had to rebush the panhard rod with beercans. When I did finaly
break down and rebush the panhard rod I used new nuts.
I would not want to be driving a rover with out a 
panhard rod.
All I can recommend is that if you reuse them, apply loctite,
or assume they may fall off.

Russ

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 Jul 1995 11:31:53 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Brabyn <brabyn@skivs.ski.org>
Subject: Re: Nyloc nuts.

On Fri, 7 Jul 1995, Russell Burns wrote:

> When I rebushed my panhard rod with bearcans, I reused the origional
> nyloc nut. I rechecked it after a few hundred miles, and found
> it was loose. I then applied loctite to the nut every time I
....
> All I can recommend is that if you reuse them, apply loctite,
> or assume they may fall off.

I'll second that, and add that in my experience the torque values given 
in the manual are much on the conservative side; I found I needed to 
tighten them quite a bit more to eliminate the clanking.

Cheers

John Brabyn

------------------------------

From: jory@figment.mit.edu (Jory Bell (prichard))
Subject: Re: Nyloc nuts.
Date: Fri, 7 Jul 1995 14:56:41 -0400 (EDT)

Maybe this was mentioned in an earlier message I
missed, but if you are going to reuse nylock nuts, you
shouldshash the face with a hammer, which "redeforms" the nylon, making it good as new...

-jory

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Jul 1995 12:22:21 +0100
From: cs@crl.com (Michael Carradine)
Subject: Re: Unsafe Jeeps

 Granville,

>> but certainly not because of 24 volt electrics.  My understanding
>> is that military Hummers are deemed unsafe by DOT for civilian use
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 8 lines)]
>profile as the Hummer has, its nearly 7'2" overall width, and its wide-based
>A-arm independent suspension, I can see no reason to expect roll-over problems.

 I wasn't writing too clearly there...  what I meant to say is
 1.  Hummers are being destroyed rather than sold to the public
     because they do not meet DOT requirements, and
 2.  Jeeps have roll-over accidents, and have killed 500 or so
     persons in military accidents (There was a big uproar about
     them being destroyed and the reasons given in Army Motors).

>The "Jeep" you mention, however, is quite another story.  Actually, it's not
>a Jeep but a Ford Mutt M-151, which replaced the Jeep M-38A1.

 What do I know (or care to know) about Jeeps? --zip!   :)

 Cheers!

 Michael Carradine   Carradine Studios                          cs@crl.com
 Architect           Architecture Development Planning    Pgr 510-945-5000
 NCARB RIBA          PO Box 99, Orinda, CA 94563 USA   Ph/Fax 510-988-0900

 Mercedes-Benz Unimog 4x4 WWW page at:  http://www.crl.com/~cs/unimog.html

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 Jul 1995 13:01:27 -0700
From: matts@caciasl.com (Matt Snyder)
Subject: contemplated '88 RR purchase

I bought an '88 RR about a year and a half ago, from a dealer, and paid 
$18,000.  Mine had no apparent problems, although in that year and a 
half I've had to replace the tires (tyres), power steering pump, alternator, 
and repair a number of electrical problems, including power seat controls, 
turn signal stem, and diff-lock warning sensor.  The odo fails to roll over
on the 1,000 mile mark until I nudge it with a paper clip.  Assuming that 
problem started AFTER I bought the car, the car had about 50,000 miles, 
probably the same as yours.

Advantages of my car over yours:
  - drive train warranty from the dealer
  - a year and a half younger than yours

Advantages of your car over mine:
  - you'll probably have fewer immediate mechanical difficulties if your 
mechanics are correct.
  - $4,000 less

One question: how do you know your tires are original?  Are they Michelan 205's?

Compared to my deal, I'd say yours sounds good.

One word of warning about the '88 year Range Rover:  the engine is 
underpowered, i.e. you'll labor going up inclines on the road.  I understand 
the '89 and subsequent engines are increasingly more capable.

-Matt

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 Jul 1995 13:02:40 -0700
From: matts@caciasl.com (Matt Snyder)
Subject: contemplated '88 RR purchase

I bought an '88 RR about a year and a half ago, from a dealer, and paid 
$18,000.  Mine had no apparent problems, although in that year and a 
half I've had to replace the tires (tyres), power steering pump, alternator, 
and repair a number of electrical problems, including power seat controls, 
turn signal stem, and diff-lock warning sensor.  The odo fails to roll over
on the 1,000 mile mark until I nudge it with a paper clip.  Assuming that 
problem started AFTER I bought the car, the car had about 50,000 miles, 
probably the same as yours.

Advantages of my car over yours:
  - drive train warranty from the dealer
  - a year and a half younger than yours

Advantages of your car over mine:
  - you'll probably have fewer immediate mechanical difficulties if your 
mechanics are correct.
  - $4,000 less

One question: how do you know your tires are original?  Are they Michelan 205's?

Compared to my deal, I'd say yours sounds good.

One word of warning about the '88 year Range Rover:  the engine is 
underpowered, i.e. you'll labor going up inclines on the road.  I understand 
the '89 and subsequent engines are increasingly more capable.

-Matt

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 Jul 1995 13:27:24 -0700
From: matts@caciasl.com (Matt Snyder)
Subject: Re:  contemplated '88 RR purchase

>don't know the brand but they look big, nice, and totally new.

The stock tire, Michelan 205, is a strange size, so it tends to be rare and 
slightly expensive, but it's an excellent tire.  If the current owner 
replaced them with the same, that's a good sign that he cared.

I, on the other hand, replaced mine with more readily available 225's, which 
are very slightly larger.  If the same was done on yours, and you end up 
having odometer work done anyway, I would recommend having the 
speedometer/odometer calibrated for the differently size tires at the same time.

-Matt

------------------------------

From: LANDROVER@delphi.com
Date: Fri, 07 Jul 1995 18:22:14 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: Starter rebuild

Spenny raises his eyebrows and asks...

> I am having an old starter rebuilt, and the guy qoted me 80-100 USD.
>  I had expected @ 40 USD given that is lucas, and not american. other
> people have told me they had starters rebuilt for @20 USD
> my question is: am i being f****d without the decency of at least a kiss
> on the lips? or is this what a lucas startes costs to rebuild?

Try another auto-electric shop. If you had gone to one that specializes in
foriegn cars, try your basic auto-electric shop (You know the kind..
Been there 100 years with some 60 year-old geezer named Irv there for the
last 50..) A Lucas starter is just another starter after all. 

For $80 to $100 US you can probably get one from England! Maybe two!!

Cheers
Mike

  

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Jul 1995 18:18:15 -0500
From: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney)
Subject: More Fun With Merseyside

After waiting 2.5 weeks for Merseyside (LR Supermarket) to replace the out of 
spec pistons they sent I received a letter saying "With reference to your 
problem the acceptable tolerance on these pistons is 3.5767-3.5776 measured 
from the grudgeon pin.  We hope this meets with your satisfaction."

After having spent over $30 in phone calls to the UK to correct the problem I 
decided to send the following letter (trying a little Dale Carnegie technique 
to get the dickheads to solve the f-ing problem).  I'll keep you posted as to 
how they respond.  

This sucks.

Bill

maloney@wings.attmail.com

July 7, 1995

Michael Divine
LR Supermarket
Bridge Industrial Estate,
Speke Hall Rd., Speke
Liverpool, L24 9HE

Dear Michael,

First of all I want to say how pleased I was at how promptly my order was 
filled (at my door in 7 days).  On initial examination all of the parts 
appeared to be satisfactory, although I would have liked 4 wrist pin bushes 
instead of 1, but since I was billed for one I decided to let it slide and 
purchased them locally.  Also you and the other customer representatives at 
Merseyside have been very courteous.

I just received your response to my problem with the mis-matched piston set.  
You refer to the acceptable tolerance for the pistons to be 3.5767 to 3.5776, 
but didn't not refer to the clearances I provided you over the phone on June 
21.  I assumed the measurements had been mislaid, so I left work early today 
to stop at my machine shop to take the measurements myself, verify the 
machinist's meaurements, and respond in writing.

The top measurement is taken at the top of the skirt.
The middle is taken at the same level as the grudgeon.
The bottom is taken at the bottom of the skirt.

They are (all taken 90 degrees from the grudgeon pin):

Position        Size    Clearance
Top             3.573   .009
Middle          3.579   .003
Bottom          3.579   .003

Top             3.576   .006
Middle          3.583   NEGATIVE .001****
Bottom          3.581   .001

Top             3.578   .004
Middle          3.582   .000****
Bottom          3.580   .002

Top             3.576   .006
Middle          3.581   .001
Bottom          3.580   .002

Haynes listed piston clearances:  .003 to .004

I included the top and bottom measurements so that you would be able discuss 
and verify a potential problem with the vendor supplying your pistons.  Having
had a position in the past as a Quality Representative for AT&T, I know the 
negative impact that poor quality parts from a vendor can have on your sales. 
 We also appreciate constructive feedback from our customers.  Spending time 
and money on returned equipment is money lost.

According to your acceptable tolerances, none of these pistons is within 
specification going by the middle measurement (90 degrees from the grudgeon 
pin).  Also, given a standard bore of 3.582 for .020 oversize, the second and 
third pistons would have been an extraordinarily tight fit in the bores, if 
one were to attempt to fit them.

I was referred to you by members of the Ottawa Valley Land Rover club and the 
LRO Internet list, who spoke quite highly of your firm.  I have been dealing 
with Craddock up until now, but as they can be slow to respond I decided to 
give you a try.

I look forward to your prompt resolution of this problem and to placing 
further orders with you in the future.

Sincerely,

Bill Maloney
614 Pines Lake Dr. W.
Wayne, NJ 07470
USA
W-201-564-2073
H-201-835-1796

cc. Nigel Fryatt, LRW
cc. Ottawa Valley Land Rovers Association
cc. Land Rover Owners Association of Virginia
cc. Land Rover Owners Association of America
CC. Solihul Society
cc. LRO@team.net - Land Rover Internet List

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 Jul 1995 19:37:49 -0500 (CDT)
From: David John Place <umplace@cc.UManitoba.CA>
Subject: RE: misc digest questions

I was the one saying how to fit new valve stem seals without taking off 
the head.  Unfortunately you can not do the stem guides this way.  You 
need a press to put the stem guides in although I have seen a tool for 
hammering the guides in.  It looks like a punch with a projection that 
goes down the guide to hold it straight but Unless there is a tool to 
pull the old guide with the valve still in I can't see how you would do 
it.  If you have to get the valve guides re done you can save a little 
bit by having them nurled by an automotive shop but that is a stop gap 
measure at best.  You may as well take the head off and get the valves 
laped if you are going to the trouble of doing the stems.  By the way you 
can lap your own valves if you really are had put for cash.  Take a 
suction cup the size of the valve to grind.  Attach it to a dowel of wood 
and put it in you electric drill.  Put some valve grinding paste on the 
valve and rotate it till the shiny area on the valve area is even.  One 
problem however is you really have to get the old paste off the head 
before you reassemble our you are asking for trouble.  By the way, if you 
have the old "0" ring type valve guide seals, replace the guides with the 
type that takes umbrella type seals they are far superior. Dave VE4PN

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 Jul 1995 19:41:06 -0500 (CDT)
From: David John Place <umplace@cc.UManitoba.CA>
Subject: Re: Re[2]: Fuel tank leaks (from Oxygena

For those trying to fix their gas tanks.  Most radiator shops will do 
tanks for you and it is a lot safer and lasts longer than the epoxy 
route.  By the way up here in Norther Canada, the Indians often use a 
paste of Sun Light Soap to seal tanks on thier beeters and it holds like 
flint.  Just rub the soap in the gas where the leak is and it goes like 
rock.  It might just get you home some day.  Dave VE4PN

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 Jul 1995 19:47:40 -0500 (CDT)
From: David John Place <umplace@cc.UManitoba.CA>
Subject: Re: Questions for the 4th month of LR ownership

For helping the heat problem, put some reflective "r" factor film on the 
windows.  It does help a bit.  A good fan from a semi trailer or bus with 
the wire mesh, pointing at you, will help a lot there are evaporative 
units sold by Coleman products a few years ago that are actually very 
good.  They don't use engine power of any kind.  They fit on the roof and 
the evaporation plus a small 12 Volt fan cools the interior.  The roof 
unit looks like a platic mushroom.  Dave VE4PN

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 Jul 1995 19:53:06 -0500 (CDT)
From: David John Place <umplace@cc.UManitoba.CA>
Subject: Re: BLOW-BY BLUES

The best way to remove the carbon is the old diesl fuel in the air intake 
or cheaper use water from a spray bottle or just a coke bottle of warm 
water very slowly at high RPM will do a better job than all the scaping 
and brushing you will ever do.  Dave VE4PN

------------------------------

From: UncleBrad@aol.com
Date: Sat, 8 Jul 1995 00:19:36 -0400
Subject: Re: High-speed Transfer Cases

I don't know much about them, but Dan Anderson, in California brought a
couple of them abck from England last year. He was going to sell them, but
they turned out to be just the cases with the special gears in another box.
The idea, I guess, was that you would take the other gears from your own or
another transfer case and put the high-speed transfer together yourself. Sort
of a kit.

I'll bet he still has them.  I think his price was around $700. His phone
number is 1-916-257-6869. 

Brad Blevins

------------------------------

From: LANDROVER@delphi.com
Date: Sat, 08 Jul 1995 02:03:58 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: Questions for the 4th month of LR ow

Andy asks....

> Anyone else out there with tips on LR cooling?  Minds soon
> to be overheated crossing African deserts want to know!
> Please, no air-conditioning recommendations  :-)

A popular modification for LHD vehicles has been to install a roof vent in
the drivers door. The footwells get very toasty with the exhaust so close
by. You install the vent so that when open, it catches some air ("at speed").

Cheers
  Michael Loiodice       E-MAIL   landrover@delphi.com              
  166 W.Fulton St.       VOICE    (518) 773-2697                    
  Gloversville                                                      
  NY, 12078              1965 Ser IIa 88 Petrol (On the Road!)      
              7          1972 Ser III 88 Petrol ("Fern")
           #:-}>         1971 Ser IIa 88 Petrol (Parts is Parts)

------------------------------

From: LANDROVER@delphi.com
Date: Sat, 08 Jul 1995 02:04:20 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: Dynamo->Alternator swap

Charlie asks...

> >The Ammeter connections need to be reversed but the fuel guage does not.
> But why not? Tell us Uncle Joe!

There are some things that are better left as mysteries... but here goes
anyway...
The ammeter measures current flow to and from the battery and as such is
polarity sensitive.
The fuel guage measures resistance in the tank sender unit. Resistance to
ground (earth), I might add. I haven't actually taken a guage apart, so I
can't tell you exactly why or how this all works. Let's just say it works by
FM (F***ing Magic)...
 
> >the the alternator output. That wire also connects to the buss-bar on the
> >terminal strip. I also added a ground connection between the alternator
	 [ truncated by lro-digester (was 6 lines)]
> Didn't think the earthing strip was required. I have a good connection
> metal to metal.

The good metal to metal connection will eventually build up corrosion and
resistance. So will the earthing strip for that matter. But using
star-type lock washers, it is mechanically a better connection. The Delco
has a threaded hole for the earthing strip so I figured why not...

Cheers
  Michael Loiodice       E-MAIL   landrover@delphi.com              
  166 W.Fulton St.       VOICE    (518) 773-2697                    
  Gloversville                                                      
  NY, 12078              1965 Ser IIa 88 Petrol (On the Road!)      
              7          1972 Ser III 88 Petrol ("Fern")
           #:-}>         1971 Ser IIa 88 Petrol (Parts is Parts)

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 8 Jul 1993 01:32:26 -0500
From: kgb@uic.edu (Ken Berliner)
Subject: Re: Oxygenated fuels and Gas tanks

At 11:53 AM 7/6/95, John Brabyn wrote:

>I read in an Atlantic British ad that all RR fuel tanks up to 1990
>(which are all the same design) are prone to failure between the
>tank and the skid plate.

Yup, that's the spot!

kgb
89 RR

*********************************************************
Reachable at
E-mail: kgb@uic.edu
WWW: http://www.uic.edu/~kgb/     <- Whoa! I'm on the web
*********************************************************

------------------------------

  END OF LAND ROVER OWNER DIGEST 
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