Subject: LRO digest, Vol 1 #39 - 45 msgs

From: [email-masked]
Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 03:11:11 -0400 (EDT)

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Today's Topics:

   1. Virus (Peter =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Thor=E9n?=)
   2. Re: Hand Cranking (Luca Ingianni)
   3. Re: Timing question (My running problem -update) ([email-masked])
   4. Re: On the road tool kits (Rob MacCormick)
   5. beginner - lesson learned (Rob MacCormick)
   6. Oil Pressure and Knocking (Sergi, Michael)
   7. Re: Oil Pressure and Knocking (John Cranfield)
   8. RE: Oil Pressure and Knocking (Sergi, Michael)
   9. Re: On the road tool kits (Bill Adams)
  10. RE: Hand Cranking (Matt Peckham)
  11. Re: Perrone's recommendation (Kirk Hillman)
  12. VIRUS, NOTHand Cranking (Matt Peckham)
  13. Re: Timing question (My running problem -update) (Kirk Hillman)
  14. Re: Timing question (My running problem -update) (Kirk Hillman)
  15. Re: Timing question (My running problem -update) (Kirk Hillman)
  16. Re: beginner - lesson learned (Alan Richer/CAM/Lotus)
  17. Re: Timing question (My running problem -update) (Kirk Hillman)
  18. Re: beginner - lesson learned (Kirk Hillman)
  19. Re: beginner - lesson learned (Rob MacCormick)
  20. Re: beginner - lesson learned (Rob MacCormick)
  21. BIG nuts (Rob MacCormick)
  22. Re: BIG nuts (Rob MacCormick)
  23. Re: BIG nuts (Perrone Ford)
  24. erratic idle and e ignition (Simon J. Harding)
  25. Re: Perrone's recommendation (Hope Peter)
  26. Re: Perrone's recommendation (Kirk Hillman)
  27. Re: On the road tool kits (TeriAnn Wakeman)
  28. Re: On the road tool kits (Ivan Van Laningham)
  29. repainting camo? (george kase)
  30. Re: repainting camo? (Larry Smith)
  31. RE: repainting camo? (Lee Jones)
  32. Joke (Carl Kinkade)
  33. Re: repainting camo? (Rich Williams II)
  34. Re: Joke (Andy Pease)
  35. engine tuning and Vacume question. (Hope Peter)
  36. Re: repainting camo? (Hope Peter)
  37. RE: engine tuning and Vacume question. (Perrone Ford)
  38. Re: Timing question (My running problem -update) ([email-masked])
  39. Re: engine tuning and Vacume question. ([email-masked])
  40. Re: engine tuning and Vacume question. ([email-masked])
  41. RE: engine tuning and Vacume question. (Perrone Ford)
  42. Re: engine tuning and Vacume question. ([email-masked])
  43. Re: engine tuning and Vacume question. (Hope Peter)
  44. RE: engine tuning - More stuff for Peter (Perrone Ford)
  45. Re: More stuff for Peter (Hope Peter)

--__--__--

Message: 1
Date: Mon, 06 Aug 2001 10:35:38 +0200
To: [email-masked]
From: Peter =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Thor=E9n?= <[email-masked]>
Subject: [lro] Virus
Reply-To: [email-masked]

Dear list,

I got a mail this morning from [email-masked] with an 
attached file named AP.EXE. My antivirussoftware found a virus in this file 
(named W32/Magistr@MM) which is now deleted and gone. Anyone else got it? 
Anyone who nows what it is?

Peter
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dr. Peter Thorin
PhD, Senior Research Scientist
Head of R&D section
National Veterinary Institute (SVA)
Dept. of Virology, Research and Development
P.O. Box 585; SE-751 23 Uppsala
Sweden
Phone: +46 18 67 43 73
Fax: +46 18 471 45 20
[email-masked]
http://w3.sva.se
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

--__--__--

Message: 2
From: Luca Ingianni <[email-masked]>
To: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: [lro] Hand Cranking
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 11:32:02 +0200
Reply-To: [email-masked]

Am Monday 06 August 2001 02:47 schrieb Paul Quin:
> Did the diesel model Series come with a hand crank too?  I imagine that
> a diesel would be a bit more of a challenge to turn over by hand...

I have a hole in the bumper for the crank but I didn't get the actual 
crank when I bought the Rover. The guy I bought it from told me not to 
bother looking for one as I'd easier throw it over a fence than hand-start 
it.

have fun,
	Luca

- -- 
There are very few personal problems that cannot be solved through a
suitable application of high explosives.

--__--__--

Message: 3
To: [email-masked]
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 06:38:23 -0700
Subject: Re: [lro] Timing question (My running problem -update)
From: [email-masked]
Reply-To: [email-masked]

The idle circuit should be more correctly called the idle and transition
circuit.  The fuel jet controls all fuel in circuit but if you look at
the idle fuel holes in the throttle bore you will see a number of holes.
the bottom hole is idle fuel feed, the upper holes are transition fuel
feed, but they also work as air correction jets for the idle hole,  the
mixture screw is between the transition holes and the idle hole.  So the
Idle jet should be selected for transition and the screw used to lean out
the idle.  since the idle circuit air correction jets are the transition
holes they can't be changed.  I'm not sure what " Did you know that the
Weber idle jet is responsible for 80% of throttle on the 32/36? " is
suppose to mean. In "Weber Carburettors" Passini suggests to set float
level so main fuel feed starts feeding at 1900 RPM no load. It is
possible that the idle circuit feeds fuel for quite a bit of throttle
after main feed starts but the amount of fuel is insignificant compared
to main feed. 

 Idle jet should be selected for transition which is that strange place
between idle and main feed.  Then idle screw can be adjusted.  That is
the easy part.  Main jet air correction jet and emulsion tube work with
and against each other at the same time.  It is possible to get correct
A/F mixture with 2 wrong and compensating with the third, but only at one
load point.  It is a sad fact that most carbs are tuned only to "good
enough".  That is what I do with the Rover.  good luck.
Chris
> Yes very interesting.  And no I didn't know that.  If the idle 
> screw
> controls the amount of fuel that is going through the idle circuit 
> then why
> do they have different size jets?
> And if you change out the fuel jets should you also change the air 
> jets?
> Pete
> _______________________________________________
> LRO mailing list
> [email-masked]
> http://land-rover.team.net/mailman/listinfo/lro

--__--__--

Message: 4
Date: Mon, 06 Aug 2001 08:21:44 -0400
From: Rob MacCormick <[email-masked]>
Organization: Boston College
To: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: [lro] On the road tool kits
Reply-To: [email-masked]

There you have it.......All you need to bring is TAW and the green rover.....

TeriAnn Wakeman wrote:

> For an on the road tool kit you probably don't need more than a AAA card
> and a phone.  But a spare fan belt, tune up kit, and some hoses  along
> with the tools to replace them might not hurt.
>
> An off road expedition type trip looks like what David was addressing in
> his reply and what I would like to build upon.
>
> >My spares kit is more or less like this:
> <<SNIP>>
>
> >wheel bearings (just because I have them,
> <<SNIP>>
> >spare cylinder head (only on trips to Ottawa...)
> >random collection of nuts, bolts and washers
>
> >My tools are something like this
> <<SNIP>>
> >This is excessive.  I admit that.
>
> Gee and I'm going to advise more stuff.
>
> For the head you didn't mention a head gasket set nor a torque wrench
> (Stay close to me on the trail, a torque wrench is part of my on board
> tool kit).
>
> For the wheel bearings you didn't mention a wheel bearing retaining nut
> socket, spare locking washers and the felt seals (something that also
> lives in my LR).
>
> Something you didn't mention was a pair of new rear 'U' bolts & fixings.
> They can and do break on the trail.  Though I have not broken one since I
> read the part in the factory manual that said they should be retorqued
> every 12 thousand miles.  Well that and since I switched from stock 1/2
> inch 'U' bolts to 9/16ths harder steel 'U' bolts.  But in the previous 20
> years of driving the Green Rover on the trail I broke rear 'U' bolts
> twice and have seen it happen to others.
>
> You didn't mention spare engine mounts.  They can be very handy things to
> have out in the field.  I was once by myself up a lonely Death Valley
> side canyon when I lost both front engine mounts.  My engine was
> basically sitting loose inside the compartment.  It took me 2 days to
> drive out of that canyon building a smooth trail in front of me and
> levering the engine back into sorta alignment frequently.  And I'd spend
> less that two hours going in.
>
> Ever since then I've carried 2 new spare engine mounts with fixings plus
> a short jack capable of lifting the engine to install mounts.
>
> Also I didn't see mention of a spare fan belt.  You can not get very far
> without the water pump turning.
>
> A can to two of radiator stop leak can come in handy after a puncture.
> And bailing wire makes a good field repair for broken exhaust hangers.
>
> A set of jewelers files can repair threads, resurface points in an
> emergency and do any number of small modifications.
>
> If you have an overdrive you need to carry the original transfer case
> back plate, rear main output gear, special washers and the socket for the
> the main shaft output nut.
>
> Also an assortment of punches & chisels might come in handy.
>
> I consider both oil and grease guns to be essential.  You should regrease
> all your fittings as soon as practical after deep water crossings.  Even
> prop shaft 'U' joints can retain a lot of water inside.
>
> >random collection of nuts, bolts and washers
>
> I used to do this and found that the size I didn't have with me is the
> one that broke or fell off.  After getting home from a desert run only by
> the grace of the bolts someone else had in a custom bumper extension I
> changed my random collection into a systematic collection of fixings.
>
> I now carry this brief case sized plastic box with lots of little divider
> compartments.  My collection now includes: 4 each of grade 8 fine thread
> bolts in different lengths from 1/4 inch through 9/16ths inch dia; 4 ea,
> grade 8 fine thread and course thread nuts and lock nuts for each bolt
> dia; four each flat and lock washers for each dia plus an assortment of
> fender washers.  The collection includes an assortment of non-SAE bolts
> and nuts that fit on a series rig.  Also in the box is a spare new rubber
> brake hose, lock washers for the hub nuts, felt washers for the hubs,
> assorted LR lock tabs, spare castallated axle nut, an assortment of
> cotter pins, assortment of crimp on electrical connectors, enough new
> shock bushings to do one shock, special bolts that pin a leaf spring pack
> together (I had to rebuild a set in the field once after a rear 'U' bolt
> let go), spare diff pinion nut & washer (don't ask), a spare wheel
> cylinder bleed screw, spare tyre air nipple, plus a couple of assorted
> hardware odds & ends.
>
> I've basically become a good person for a series rig to be with if they
> break.  But a coiler with metric fixings is SOL.
>
> TeriAnn Wakeman               Marigold Ltd.
> Santa Cruz, California        Web design, site updating, testing
> [email-masked]      search engine optimization, graphics
>                               and more
>
> http://www.overlander.net/Marigold/index.html
> _______________________________________________
> LRO mailing list
> [email-masked]
> http://land-rover.team.net/mailman/listinfo/lro

--__--__--

Message: 5
Date: Mon, 06 Aug 2001 08:46:01 -0400
From: Rob MacCormick <[email-masked]>
Organization: Boston College
To: [email-masked]
Subject: [lro] beginner - lesson learned
Reply-To: [email-masked]

greetings....Reminder to those preparing to remove half-shaft. Park the car
far enough from the side of any obstructions (garage wall for example) so that
the half shaft can be extracted. By dumb luck I have enough room (I think) if
I remove a small cabinet....I hope I have enough room as the car is currently
on jack stands and the road wheels and drums are already off...

--__--__--

Message: 6
From: "Sergi, Michael" <[email-masked]>
To: "[email-masked]'" <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 09:02:16 -0400 
Subject: [lro] Oil Pressure and Knocking
Reply-To: [email-masked]

Here is my current situation;

All readings from a newly installed Smiths dual oil pressure/cooling temp
gauge(I finally splurged).

New filter and 10W-40 oil.  Start engine cold, oil pressure 50-55 psi at
idle.  Engine sounds great.  As coolant temperature comes up, a faint
knocking begins and the oil pressure start to drop off.   Finally at running
temps the oil pressure drops off to 20 psi at idle and the knock is
noticeable.  Revving the engine slightly brings the oil pressure up to 40
psi and the knocking stops.  Racing the engine will give 50 psi.  

So,

Is 20 psi oil press when hot at idle normal?  The manual only quotes hot at
2000 RPM numbers(45-60 psi).
Is it an oil pump problem?  Worn gears maybe?   I would think if the intake
screen is plugged I would see low pressures across the board.
Since the knock goes away with normal oil pressures, is the normal oil
pressure masking another problem?

Mike

--__--__--

Message: 7
Date: Mon, 06 Aug 2001 10:08:35 -0300
From: [email-masked] (John Cranfield)
To: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: [lro] Oil Pressure and Knocking
Reply-To: [email-masked]

Try switching to 20/50 Oil  (castrol preferably).
It doesn't sound like your engine is in any imediate danger.
John and Muddy

"Sergi, Michael" wrote:
> 
> Here is my current situation;
> 
> All readings from a newly installed Smiths dual oil pressure/cooling temp
> gauge(I finally splurged).
> 
> New filter and 10W-40 oil.  Start engine cold, oil pressure 50-55 psi at
> idle.  Engine sounds great.  As coolant temperature comes up, a faint
> knocking begins and the oil pressure start to drop off.   Finally at running
> temps the oil pressure drops off to 20 psi at idle and the knock is
> noticeable.  Revving the engine slightly brings the oil pressure up to 40
> psi and the knocking stops.  Racing the engine will give 50 psi.
> 
> So,
> 
> Is 20 psi oil press when hot at idle normal?  The manual only quotes hot at
> 2000 RPM numbers(45-60 psi).
> Is it an oil pump problem?  Worn gears maybe?   I would think if the intake
> screen is plugged I would see low pressures across the board.
> Since the knock goes away with normal oil pressures, is the normal oil
> pressure masking another problem?
> 
> Mike
> _______________________________________________
> LRO mailing list
> [email-masked]
> http://land-rover.team.net/mailman/listinfo/lro

--__--__--

Message: 8
From: "Sergi, Michael" <[email-masked]>
To: "[email-masked]'" <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: [lro] Oil Pressure and Knocking
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 09:38:45 -0400 
Reply-To: [email-masked]

That is what I use in the RR and should have went with the same stuff.
Maybe I'll try a quart of ATF in the engine for flushing before draining.

Mike

--__--__--

Message: 9
Date: Mon, 06 Aug 2001 09:53:22 -0400
From: Bill Adams <[email-masked]>
Organization: U.S. International Broadcasting Bureau
To: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: [lro] On the road tool kits
Reply-To: [email-masked]

Just as an informative bit of anecdotal cheez-whiz, I drove about 22
miles yesterday with no fan belt. Had to stop once to fill the radiator,
but made it home with no problems.
-- 
Bill Adams
3D & Motion Graphics Design Director
International Broadcasting Bureau
Washington, D.C.
202-205-9638
[email-masked]

'66 Land Rover 109 SW Diesel
'81 GoldWing
'69 Le Sabre Convertible
'63 Pearson Vanguard
"Practicing the ancient art of ren-ching"

--__--__--

Message: 10
From: Matt Peckham <[email-masked]>
To: [email-masked]
Subject: RE: [lro] Hand Cranking
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 09:54:31 -0400 
Reply-To: [email-masked]

it's Sircam, the most trickiest virus out there.  I own a Nissan Xterra, and
I got an email with Nissan Independence Parts List.  I got another one with
road bike trails, I get a majority of them from Katherine Waluk.  Norton has
a good anti Sircam recovery tool.  www.nortonantivirus.com

Matt

-----Original Message-----
From: Luca Ingianni [mailto:[email-masked]]
Sent: Monday, August 06, 2001 5:32 AM
To: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: [lro] Hand Cranking

Am Monday 06 August 2001 02:47 schrieb Paul Quin:
> Did the diesel model Series come with a hand crank too?  I imagine that
> a diesel would be a bit more of a challenge to turn over by hand...

I have a hole in the bumper for the crank but I didn't get the actual 
crank when I bought the Rover. The guy I bought it from told me not to 
bother looking for one as I'd easier throw it over a fence than hand-start 
it.

have fun,
	Luca

- -- 
There are very few personal problems that cannot be solved through a
suitable application of high explosives.

_______________________________________________
LRO mailing list
[email-masked]
http://land-rover.team.net/mailman/listinfo/lro

--__--__--

Message: 11
From: "Kirk Hillman" <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [lro] Perrone's recommendation
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 07:58:47 -0600
Reply-To: [email-masked]

Peter,
    Just a couple more questions.  What is the elevation (I am assuming
pretty close to sea level).  Also what are your idle jets?

Kirk

--__--__--

Message: 12
From: Matt Peckham <[email-masked]>
To: [email-masked]
Subject: [lro] VIRUS, NOTHand Cranking
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 10:13:52 -0400 
Reply-To: [email-masked]

it's Sircam, the most trickiest virus out there.  I own a Nissan Xterra, and
I got an email with Nissan Independence Parts List.  I got another one with
road bike trails, I get a majority of them from Katherine Waluk.  Norton has
a good anti Sircam recovery tool.  www.nortonantivirus.com

Matt

--__--__--

Message: 13
From: "Kirk Hillman" <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [lro] Timing question (My running problem -update)
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 08:12:36 -0600
Reply-To: [email-masked]

Pete,
    As I understand it this is how it goes.  The idle jets contribute to
over 80% of the throttle range.  That doesn't mean that it is COMPLETELY
responsible.  The point is that a typical carb has the idle circuit shut off
soon after you leave idle.  Secondly, the air correction jets meter air on
the upper end when the carb is flowing more.  The idle mixture screw affects
the mixture only at the very bottom of the scale.
    If you have see charts depicting the actual time different components of
a carb influence mixture and flow rate you will find it is more of a
progressive thing than segmented as it sounds.
    In your message you asked if when changing main jets the air jets should
be changed.  That depends.  If your carb was mixing proportionately perfect
and you changed your mains, then yes you probably would need to change the
air jets as well.  This is only an assumption based on logic.  I have never
had a carb tuned perfectly prior to a modification to judge for myself.

Kirk

--__--__--

Message: 14
From: "Kirk Hillman" <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [lro] Timing question (My running problem -update)
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 08:32:37 -0600
Reply-To: [email-masked]

Peter,
    It would appear that Chris has a far greater grasp on the function of
these Weber's than I do.  The 80% reference is based on tech I read here and
there on the web while doing a little research.  If I remember correctly
that was from Redline Weber.  If I was mistaken please forgive the error.

Kirk

--__--__--

Message: 15
From: "Kirk Hillman" <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [lro] Timing question (My running problem -update)
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 08:35:18 -0600
Reply-To: [email-masked]

Chris,
    How does one adjust the float to start feeding mains at 1900 RPM no
load?

Kirk

--__--__--

Message: 16
Subject: Re: [lro] beginner - lesson learned
To: [email-masked]
From: "Alan Richer/CAM/Lotus" <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 10:31:10 -0400
Reply-To: [email-masked]

Heeeheeeeheeee......

Why am I picturing a tidy, suburban garage in a quiet neighborhood with an
axle-shaft-sized hole in the wall?

               ajr

--__--__--

Message: 17
From: "Kirk Hillman" <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [lro] Timing question (My running problem -update)
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 08:44:18 -0600
Reply-To: [email-masked]

Pete,
    If I am soooo far off in my understanding of how the Weber carb works,
it is a really good thing I have no opportunity to teach such things to
others.  :-)
    What Chris describes is the typical western/Japanese carb.  That is what
I learned working on motorbikes when I was younger.  Perhaps unfortunately,
I have been reading a fair bit on the web lately to try and learn more.  It
was this reading that helped me draw the conclusion that the Weber was
different and operated in the manor I described.  I think I will just be
quiet about it until I learn more (if it helps).
    Apologies to all for the misinformation.

Kirk

--__--__--

Message: 18
From: "Kirk Hillman" <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [lro] beginner - lesson learned
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 08:45:02 -0600
Reply-To: [email-masked]

Drywall patch isn't THAT expensive... 

Kirk

--__--__--

Message: 19
Date: Mon, 06 Aug 2001 11:08:28 -0400
From: Rob MacCormick <[email-masked]>
Organization: Boston College
To: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: [lro] beginner - lesson learned
Reply-To: [email-masked]

swami Richer is right on except  for the tidy part.....I think I can pull out
the shaft w/o the hole saw....

Alan Richer/CAM/Lotus wrote:

> Heeeheeeeheeee......
>
> Why am I picturing a tidy, suburban garage in a quiet neighborhood with an
> axle-shaft-sized hole in the wall?
>
>                ajr
> _______________________________________________
> LRO mailing list
> [email-masked]
> http://land-rover.team.net/mailman/listinfo/lro

--__--__--

Message: 20
Date: Mon, 06 Aug 2001 11:09:41 -0400
From: Rob MacCormick <[email-masked]>
Organization: Boston College
To: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: [lro] beginner - lesson learned
Reply-To: [email-masked]

no dry wall needed....My garage has no power let alone
drywall......Hmmmm perhaps a cat door startegically placed.....

Kirk Hillman wrote:

> Drywall patch isn't THAT expensive...
>
> Kirk
> _______________________________________________
> LRO mailing list
> [email-masked]
> http://land-rover.team.net/mailman/listinfo/lro

--__--__--

Message: 21
Date: Mon, 06 Aug 2001 11:17:40 -0400
From: Rob MacCormick <[email-masked]>
Organization: Boston College
To: [email-masked]
Subject: [lro] BIG nuts
Reply-To: [email-masked]

What size are the wheel bearing nut(s) on a rear axle (mines a salisbury
if it matters)?......So far I know its bigger than my biggest socket
(11/4") and smaller than my biggest plumbers pipe wrench....est. 5"
between the jaws.

--__--__--

Message: 22
Date: Mon, 06 Aug 2001 11:24:49 -0400
From: Rob MacCormick <[email-masked]>
Organization: Boston College
To: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: [lro] BIG nuts
Reply-To: [email-masked]

11/4"??? oops should be 1 and 1/4".....

Rob MacCormick wrote:

> What size are the wheel bearing nut(s) on a rear axle (mines a salisbury
> if it matters)?......So far I know its bigger than my biggest socket
> (11/4") and smaller than my biggest plumbers pipe wrench....est. 5"
> between the jaws.
> _______________________________________________
> LRO mailing list
> [email-masked]
> http://land-rover.team.net/mailman/listinfo/lro

--__--__--

Message: 23
Date: Mon, 06 Aug 2001 11:38:46 -0400
From: Perrone Ford <[email-masked]>
To: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: [lro] BIG nuts
Reply-To: [email-masked]

I believe they are 2 1/8"  At least that's what they are on the 
coilers.  A quick call to Rovers North or British Pacific should remove 
all doubt.

-P

Rob MacCormick wrote:

> 11/4"??? oops should be 1 and 1/4".....
> 
> Rob MacCormick wrote:
> 
>> What size are the wheel bearing nut(s) on a rear axle (mines a salisbury
>> if it matters)?......So far I know its bigger than my biggest socket
>> (11/4") and smaller than my biggest plumbers pipe wrench....est. 5"
>> between the jaws.

--__--__--

Message: 24
From: "Simon J. Harding" <[email-masked]>
To: "[email-masked]'" <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 09:11:07 -0700
Subject: [lro] erratic idle and e ignition
Reply-To: [email-masked]

Last week I replaced my carburetor with a good used one.  Before that the idle speed was erratic, due to the linkage.  When I bought my rover the linkage was so gummed up it was almost like having a hand throttle.  From time to time had to lower the idle at stops by pulling the pedal up with my toe! My first rover maintenance task was to de-gunk the throttle linkage with WD 40. 

On another note, installed a good used zenith and electronic ignition and my rover is running great, just in time for my SE Oregon trip.  To anyone considering electronic ignition, I'd recommend it highly.  Put the e ignition in a good used Lucas distributor.  If anyone out there needs a ducellier distributor with new rotor, points and like new cap, as well as spares of all of the above, let me know and make me an offer(directly as I'm going to unsub in a few hours).
simon

--__--__--

Message: 25
From: "Hope Peter" <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [lro] Perrone's recommendation
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 06:37:02 -1000
Reply-To: [email-masked]

My house is at 650', my work place is about the same.  I drive from Sea
Level to around 1500' max.   I realise that I may need to rejet after
getting to washington, but not by much.  I didn't pull the idle jets yet.  I
have two different Webber books I have been reading up on.  I understand how
the idle and transition ciructs work with the webers.
My plan is to go leaner on the idle jets.  My idle screw can go all the way
in, back out 1/4 turn and the vehicle idles.
The local race shop sells all the different parts for the weber, but the
jets are $4 each.  Not that much money, but if I get a bunch of different
sizes of each jet it's going to run some money.  I wish I had access to a
gas analyser (tail pipe sniffer).  The auto-hobby shop here at pearl
doesn't.  Will check a few more.  If I could get a handheld sniffer that I
could have in the cab as I drive it would be best.
Opening the gap in the plugs to .04 made a difference in everything but the
hills.  It stills looses power the second it hits a hill.
All of this may be acedemic anyway.  With my tires I have dropped my rear
ratio from 4.77 to 3.45.  Since I can hit 75 on the flats, I think that if I
drop back down to a 31x10.50 tire I will loose around 5-7 mph on the flats,
but should be able pick up just as many on the hills.  The idea I have is to
use the 31 ATs as my daily driving/commute tires and switch back to the 33's
for offroad.
I have not noticed any problems with the weber on hill climbs.  We only have
a couple of really steeps ones, and I am able to chug up those in 2nd low
and around 2000 rpms.
Pete
Kirk, what size idle jets did you have and what are the new ones?
What size are your mains and air jets?

----- Original Message -----
From: "Kirk Hillman" <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Sent: Monday, August 06, 2001 03:58
Subject: Re: [lro] Perrone's recommendation

>
> Peter,
>     Just a couple more questions.  What is the elevation (I am assuming
> pretty close to sea level).  Also what are your idle jets?
>
> Kirk
> _______________________________________________
> LRO mailing list
> [email-masked]
> http://land-rover.team.net/mailman/listinfo/lro

--__--__--

Message: 26
From: "Kirk Hillman" <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [lro] Perrone's recommendation
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 11:34:02 -0600
Reply-To: [email-masked]

Peter,
    I wouldn't worry about such a small change in altitude.  You are only
covering hundreds of feet difference.  The problems come when those hundreds
turn into thousands like it is for me in the rocky mountains.  That's
another great thing about one of the Bosch systems, automatic altitude
compensation.  I admit it is one more electrical component to go bad, but
maybe worth the chance.
    Another question.  Are the speeds you quote actual (compensated) speeds,
or are they what shows on your speedo?  Effectively you could be doing more
like 80-85 mph on the flats!  If we were to analyze this from a different
perspective I would say your overall Hp is good with torque to be desired.
The ACR cam doesn't have overlap does it?  I am just speculating, don't mind
me.

Kirk

--__--__--

Message: 27
Subject: Re: [lro] On the road tool kits
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 01 11:19:11 -0700
From: TeriAnn Wakeman <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Reply-To: [email-masked]

>There you have it.......All you need to bring is TAW and the green rover.....

I've been home so long I could well be convinced to go along on trips as 
maintenance mechanic and maybe even general guide in return for trip 
costs.

TeriAnn Wakeman               If you send me direct mail, please
Santa Cruz, California        start the subject line with TW - 
[email-masked]           I will be sure to read the message

http://www.shadow-catcher.net      <- Photography for sale
http://www.overlander.net          <- Web directory for Land Rover 
http://www.cruzers.com/~twakeman   <- My personal web site

"In the world of type A & type B drivers consider me a type C gypsy  
traveler.  Destinations are optional and not necessarily desirable."

--__--__--

Message: 28
Date: Mon, 06 Aug 2001 12:29:56 -0600
From: Ivan Van Laningham <[email-masked]>
Organization: Symantec
To: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: [lro] On the road tool kits
Reply-To: [email-masked]

Hi All--

TeriAnn Wakeman wrote:
> 
> ?There you have it.......All you need to bring is TAW and the green rover.....
> 
> I've been home so long I could well be convinced to go along on trips as
> maintenance mechanic and maybe even general guide in return for trip
> costs.
> 

<g> Gee, sounds like fodder for a book to me.

Metta,
Ivan
----------------------------------------------
Ivan Van Laningham
Symantec
http://www.pauahtun.org 
http://www.foretec.com/python/workshops/1998-11/proceedings.html
Army Signal Corps:  Cu Chi, Class of '70
Author:  Teach Yourself Python in 24 Hours

--__--__--

Message: 29
Date: 06 Aug 2001 16:45:55 -0500
From: george kase <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Subject: [lro] repainting camo?
Reply-To: [email-masked]

Does anyone know what that brushed on MOD camo paint is made of
and how to repaint a vehicle that has been painted that way?
Do you remove the camo, just sand it or what? I want to spray
a typical auto enamel onto the vehicle.

--__--__--

Message: 30
From: "Larry Smith" <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [lro] repainting camo?
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 17:54:03 -0400
Reply-To: [email-masked]

George,

Two (actually probably more, but...) choices.  Use plastic beads or baking
soda to "sand blast" the truck.  Messy and the stuff gets in to all the
cracks, crevices, etc.  Second is to use an aircraft paint stripper
available from NAPA.  Messy, etc. but probably cheaper and more effective.
Someone earlier this year did something similar.  However, after they put
the stripper on to work, they covered it with saran wrap.  Supposedly it
keeps the volatiles from evaporating off as fast, making the stripper work
more efficiently.

Larry Smith
Chester, VA
----- Original Message -----
From: "george kase" <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Sent: 06 August, 2001 05:45 PM
Subject: [lro] repainting camo?

>
> Does anyone know what that brushed on MOD camo paint is made of
> and how to repaint a vehicle that has been painted that way?
> Do you remove the camo, just sand it or what? I want to spray
> a typical auto enamel onto the vehicle.
> _______________________________________________
> LRO mailing list
> [email-masked]
> http://land-rover.team.net/mailman/listinfo/lro

--__--__--

Message: 31
From: "Lee Jones" <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: [lro] repainting camo?
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 18:03:26 -0400
Reply-To: [email-masked]

I don't know but at the rate it is flaking off in my garage, it may be down
to the original green in a year or so! :-)

Lee

"There are two kinds of fool. One says, 'This is old, and therefore good.'
And one says, 'This is new, and therefore better.'"

-----Original Message-----
From: [email-masked] [mailto:[email-masked]]On Behalf
Of george kase
Sent: Monday, August 06, 2001 5:46 PM
To: [email-masked]
Subject: [lro] repainting camo?

Does anyone know what that brushed on MOD camo paint is made of
and how to repaint a vehicle that has been painted that way?
Do you remove the camo, just sand it or what? I want to spray
a typical auto enamel onto the vehicle.
_______________________________________________
LRO mailing list
[email-masked]
http://land-rover.team.net/mailman/listinfo/lro

--__--__--

Message: 32
From: "Carl Kinkade" <[email-masked]>
To: "RRO" <[email-masked]>, "LRO" <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 17:04:10 -0500
Subject: [lro] Joke
Reply-To: [email-masked]

I hope you guys don't mind a joke.  I thought it was funny and you would get
a kick out of it.

Carl

I was riding to work yesterday when I
observed a female driver cut right
in front of a pickup truck causing him to have
to drive on to the shoulder to avoid hitting her.

This evidently angered the driver enough
that he hung his arm out his window
and flipped the woman off.

"Man, that guy is stupid" I thought to myself.

I ALWAYS smile nicely and wave in a
sheepish manner whenever a female
does anything to me in traffic and here's why:

I drive 48 miles each way every day to
work, that's 96 miles each day.
Of these, 16 miles each way is
bumper-to-bumper. Most of the bumper-
to-bumper is on an 8 lane highway so if you
just look at the 7 lanes I am not in,
that means I pass something like a
new car every 40 feet per lane.

That's 7 cars every 40 feet for 32 miles.
That works out to be 982 cars
every mile, or 31,424 cars.

Even though the rest of the 32 miles is not
bumper to bumper, I figure I
pass at least another 4000 cars.

That brings the number to something like
36,000 cars I pass every day.

Statistically, half of these are driven by
females, that's 18,000.

In any given group of females 1 in 28 are
having the worst day of their period. That's 642.

According to Cosmopolitan, 70% describe
their love life as dissatisfying or
unrewarding. That's 449.

According to the National Institute of
Health, 22% of all females have
seriously considered suicide or homicide.
That's 98.

And 34% describe men as their biggest
problem. That's 33.

According to the National Rifle Association
5% of all females carry weapons
and this number is increasing.

That means that EVERY SINGLE DAY, I drive
past at least one female that has
a lousy love life, thinks men are her
biggest problem, has seriously
considered suicide or homicide, is having
the worst day of her period, and
is armed.

Flip one off?...............I think not.

--__--__--

Message: 33
From: "Rich Williams II" <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [lro] repainting camo?
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 15:13:05 -0700
Reply-To: [email-masked]

George,

The "aircraft stripper" found at Napa, etc... is not as effective as the
strippers found at auto body and paint supply shops.  I went through lots of
the aircraft stuff from the local parts store before being turned onto the
industrial grade stuff.  I buy it in 1 gal. cans.  Just to confuse matters,
the stuff I buy at the auto body supply store also has an aircraft on the
can.  But IT IS from a different company - I already checked.  Anyway, the
industrial grade stuff does go farther - faster, than the stuff from Napa.
When comparing the cost of the two, I came out ahead with the heavy duty
stuff even though it was more expensive up front due to the large cans.

As far as the Saran Wrap goes, do use it where practical.  It does help
contain the volatiles a bit and slows the drying out of the goop.  As long
as that stuff is wet, it's working.  And the AL body parts usually clean
right up.  I even took a large tub filled with the goop and soaked tiny
painted bits in it over night.  Cleaned up the parts like I've never seen
before.  I also re-use the stripper.  If the stripper isn't too gunked up
with paint I can plop the scrapings off and move them over to another area
to strip.  You lose a little potency but it still works and makes it a
little more economical.  The extra 21" between an 88 and a 109 make for a
bit of extra body work ;-)

Regarding the media blasting, I have done some things with plastic beads and
that worked very well.  The beauty is that the beads are inert and will not
react with future finishes.  Some have suggested using ground-up walnut
shells or baking soda.  The trouble is that regardless of what media you are
blasting with, you will never remove 100% of the stuff from the tiny nooks
and crannies.  Both baking soda and walnut shells have contamination and
leaching drawbacks that could be a problem later on.  There's the potential
to screw up an otherwise beautiful paint job.  So on AL, stick with plastic
and on steel, use the garnet.

Good luck,

Rich Williams
1960 SII 109SW

----- Original Message -----
From: Larry Smith <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Sent: Monday, August 06, 2001 2:54 PM
Subject: Re: [lro] repainting camo?

George,

Two (actually probably more, but...) choices.  Use plastic beads or baking
soda to "sand blast" the truck.  Messy and the stuff gets in to all the
cracks, crevices, etc.  Second is to use an aircraft paint stripper
available from NAPA.  Messy, etc. but probably cheaper and more effective.
Someone earlier this year did something similar.  However, after they put
the stripper on to work, they covered it with saran wrap.  Supposedly it
keeps the volatiles from evaporating off as fast, making the stripper work
more efficiently.

Larry Smith
Chester, VA
----- Original Message -----
From: "george kase" <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Sent: 06 August, 2001 05:45 PM
Subject: [lro] repainting camo?

>
> Does anyone know what that brushed on MOD camo paint is made of
> and how to repaint a vehicle that has been painted that way?
> Do you remove the camo, just sand it or what? I want to spray
> a typical auto enamel onto the vehicle.
> _______________________________________________
> LRO mailing list
> [email-masked]
> http://land-rover.team.net/mailman/listinfo/lro
_______________________________________________
LRO mailing list
[email-masked]
http://land-rover.team.net/mailman/listinfo/lro

--__--__--

Message: 34
From: "Andy Pease" <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [lro] Joke
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 20:17:57 -0500
Reply-To: [email-masked]

Now I remember why I'm single... :-)

Andy

----- Original Message -----
From: "Carl Kinkade" <[email-masked]>
To: "RRO" <[email-masked]>; "LRO" <[email-masked]>
Sent: Monday, August 06, 2001 5:04 PM
Subject: [lro] Joke

>
> I hope you guys don't mind a joke.  I thought it was funny and you would
get
> a kick out of it.
> Carl

<snip>

--__--__--

Message: 35
From: "Hope Peter" <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 16:03:38 -1000
Subject: [lro] engine tuning and Vacume question.
Reply-To: [email-masked]

>     Another question.  Are the speeds you quote actual (compensated)
speeds,
> or are they what shows on your speedo?  Effectively you could be doing
more
> like 80-85 mph on the flats!  If we were to analyze this from a different
> perspective I would say your overall Hp is good with torque to be desired.

Speeds are from the GPS.  I can hit 75mph on the flats at 3500 RPMs with an
overdrive and 33" tires.
Yes good HP but loss of torgue.  I have been advised to close down my
exhaust some.  I bought a 20$ muffler and I don't think it anything more
then a empty tube with an opening at each end.
I am going to get a more restrictive muffler after the move.

To the vacume.
After the recent discussions on vacume I decided to install one on my
vehicle.  In the base of the weber, right were it bolts to the intake, is a
vacume port.  The pierce manifold has a large threaded port that goes to my
brake booster.  So I run the vacume tube for the dizzy from the base of the
carb.  I got a T fitting and a couple feet of tubing and ran a gauge into
the cab.  I have a vacume pump with a dial gauge as well, so have tested my
standalong gauge with the pump and they are reading the same.
All readings for vacume are in inches of mercury.
At idle (750-800 rpms) it is reading zero.
Driving down the freeway, 2100rpms, 50mph, foot just barely on the gas, and
it's reading 10".
If  I step on the gas to speed up, it drops right to zero.
If I slowly step on the pedal I can get  the gauge to slowly rise to 25".
But beyond a certain point it drops to zero.
If I am driving 50mph and just remove my foot from the pedal it drops to
zero.  Hit a hill and give it gas to maintain speed up hill, drops to zero.

Now if I have no power up hills, runs rich, seems to me to be related to the
fact that I don't have any vacume advance working for me.
Should I find a T that will fit the power brake vacume line (5/16") and the
smaller vacume line to the dizzy?

I did see some improvement with the larger spark gap, but it still tears up
your eyes it's so rich.  Going to bump the gap another .05 and see how she
drives tomorrow.

Pete

--__--__--

Message: 36
From: "Hope Peter" <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [lro] repainting camo?
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 16:07:18 -1000
Reply-To: [email-masked]

> Does anyone know what that brushed on MOD camo paint is made of
> and how to repaint a vehicle that has been painted that way?
> Do you remove the camo, just sand it or what? I want to spray
> a typical auto enamel onto the vehicle.

Just want to point out that if the Brits use the same type of chemical
resistant paint (CARC???) that the US Army does, I wouldn't sand, scrape, or
sand blast with out wearing a heavy duty respirator, and then I would still
be weary.
Pete

--__--__--

Message: 37
From: "Perrone Ford" <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: [lro] engine tuning and Vacume question.
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 22:14:54 -0400
Reply-To: [email-masked]

Ok,

	I've heard this wives tale one too many times to times to not ask.  Why on
ANY engine would anyone suggest INCREASING exhaust backpressure?  I've heard
everything from it helping increase torque to it's a replacement for
Viagra... ok maybe not, but what is the theory behind this?

	I've never read it in ANYTHING, or heard it from any authority so I am
curious what the thinking is.

-P

> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email-masked] [mailto:[email-masked]]On Behalf
> Of Hope Peter
> Sent: Monday, August 06, 2001 10:04 PM
> To: [email-masked]
> Subject: [lro] engine tuning and Vacume question.

> Yes good HP but loss of torgue.  I have been advised to close down my
> exhaust some.  I bought a 20$ muffler and I don't think it anything more
> then a empty tube with an opening at each end.
> I am going to get a more restrictive muffler after the move.

--__--__--

Message: 38
To: [email-masked]
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 23:16:16 -0700
Subject: Re: [lro] Timing question (My running problem -update)
From: [email-masked]
Reply-To: [email-masked]

Kirk,
You just bend the arm on the float till you get it right.  Now for the
fine print.  With safety glasses or better yet goggles on look down the
carb throat with the engine running.  Now open the throttle till you see
fuel running out of   the main nozzle.  Some judgment is needed here
because it will start to drip before it needs smoothly.  If you are
1800-2000 RPM I would leave well enough alone.  If you are too low then
lower the float level so more vacuum is needed to lift fuel to the
nozzle.  If you are too high then raise the float so less vacuum is
needed to lift fuel to the nozzle.  I try to work in 1/2 mm steps.  I
can't get my 34ICH above 1600. this is the fact that behind my belief
that the 34 is too small for the 2.25L.

 I have to admit I have very little experience with  the 32/36 ,only used
one on a Honda of my ex-girl friend and the jobber jetted it for my set
up.  Most of my hands on time was spent with a 34ICH and lots of DCO and
DCOE which may be very different then the 32/36.

I now see what you meant with the idle circuit covering 80% of the
throttle statement and I can except that as real.  but it would be a
constant amount once the throttle was above the transition holes so you
wouldn't need to consider it if you tune like I do.  I start with
transition then idle  once those are set I can work my way up the load
range and not have to look back.

It doesn't seem to me like you had much wrong.

Chris

 Mon, 6 Aug 2001 08:35:18 -0600 "Kirk Hillman" <[email-masked]>
writes:
> 
> Chris,
>     How does one adjust the float to start feeding mains at 1900 RPM 
> no
> load?

--__--__--

Message: 39
To: [email-masked]
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 23:43:50 -0700
Subject: Re: [lro] engine tuning and Vacume question.
From: [email-masked]
Reply-To: [email-masked]

Perrone,  I can't speak for many engines, but when I use my wave
simulator I model a muffler by reducing the diameter of the collector. 
The difference is almost always a smoother torque curve with the dips
brought up more then the pikes are brought down.  This is with a
reduction of say 2.5 down to 1.75".  I believe this is due to a change in
density of the exhaust gases so the wave speed is changed.  I'm only
talking 5 ft. lb at the most but the results were most surprising.  Also
I'm talking below 3500,  above that I just see the same curve but lower. 

chris 

On Mon, 6 Aug 2001 22:14:54 -0400 "Perrone Ford" <[email-masked]>
writes:
> 
> Ok,
> 
>         I've heard this wives tale one too many times to times to 
> not ask.  Why on
> ANY engine would anyone suggest INCREASING exhaust backpressure?  
> I've heard
> everything from it helping increase torque to it's a replacement 
> for
> Viagra... ok maybe not, but what is the theory behind this?
> 
>         I've never read it in ANYTHING, or heard it from any 
> authority so I am
> curious what the thinking is.
> 
> -P
> 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [email-masked] [mailto:[email-masked]]On 
> Behalf
> > Of Hope Peter
> > Sent: Monday, August 06, 2001 10:04 PM
> > To: [email-masked]
> > Subject: [lro] engine tuning and Vacume question.
> 
> > Yes good HP but loss of torgue.  I have been advised to close down 
> my
> > exhaust some.  I bought a 20$ muffler and I don't think it 
> anything more
> > then a empty tube with an opening at each end.
> > I am going to get a more restrictive muffler after the move.
> _______________________________________________
> LRO mailing list
> [email-masked]
> http://land-rover.team.net/mailman/listinfo/lro

--__--__--

Message: 40
To: [email-masked]
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 23:33:22 -0700
Subject: Re: [lro] engine tuning and Vacume question.
From: [email-masked]
Reply-To: [email-masked]

Your readings sound just about right to me only thing is you are reading
ported vacuum not manifold.  This is where you want the vac advance.  The
vac advance boost timing when cylinder pressure is low because the engine
is throttled down.  The fuel can take this much advance because the
cylinder pressure is low due to the throttling down.  

Chris
> 
> To the vacume.
> After the recent discussions on vacume I decided to install one on 
> my
> vehicle.  In the base of the weber, right were it bolts to the 
> intake, is a
> vacume port.  The pierce manifold has a large threaded port that 
> goes to my
> brake booster.  So I run the vacume tube for the dizzy from the base 
> of the
> carb.  I got a T fitting and a couple feet of tubing and ran a gauge 
> into
> the cab.  I have a vacume pump with a dial gauge as well, so have 
> tested my
> standalong gauge with the pump and they are reading the same.
> All readings for vacume are in inches of mercury.
> At idle (750-800 rpms) it is reading zero.
> Driving down the freeway, 2100rpms, 50mph, foot just barely on the 
> gas, and
> it's reading 10".
> If  I step on the gas to speed up, it drops right to zero.
> If I slowly step on the pedal I can get  the gauge to slowly rise to 
> 25".
> But beyond a certain point it drops to zero.
> If I am driving 50mph and just remove my foot from the pedal it 
> drops to
> zero.  Hit a hill and give it gas to maintain speed up hill, drops 
> to zero.
> 
> Now if I have no power up hills, runs rich, seems to me to be 
> related to the
> fact that I don't have any vacume advance working for me.
> Should I find a T that will fit the power brake vacume line (5/16") 
> and the
> smaller vacume line to the dizzy?
> 
> I did see some improvement with the larger spark gap, but it still 
> tears up
> your eyes it's so rich.  Going to bump the gap another .05 and see 
> how she
> drives tomorrow.
> 
> Pete
> _______________________________________________
> LRO mailing list
> [email-masked]
> http://land-rover.team.net/mailman/listinfo/lro

--__--__--

Message: 41
From: "Perrone Ford" <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: [lro] engine tuning and Vacume question.
Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 00:01:49 -0400
Reply-To: [email-masked]

	I would have thought the gains would come from superior scavenging, but
exhaust tuning is a VERY dicey game without computer modeling.  It's one
area I truly am thankful I have software to use...  The other thing is that
I tend to understand exhaust changes made at the primaries or the collector,
but I have no IDEA what guys are talking about changing mufflers some 8 feet
down the line.  The velocity is so slow, and the gas has cooled so much by
that point, I can't imagine you'd see much in the way of gains down there
ESPECIALLY by choking it down.

	Can your wave simulator model exhaust flows through previously designed
pieces?  Meaning can you input specs for well known headers and see the
results?  Do you also model engines?

-Perrone

> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email-masked] [mailto:[email-masked]]On Behalf
> Of [email-masked]
> Sent: Tuesday, August 07, 2001 2:44 AM
> To: [email-masked]
> Subject: Re: [lro] engine tuning and Vacume question.
>
>
>
> Perrone,  I can't speak for many engines, but when I use my wave
> simulator I model a muffler by reducing the diameter of the collector.
> The difference is almost always a smoother torque curve with the dips
> brought up more then the pikes are brought down.  This is with a
> reduction of say 2.5 down to 1.75".  I believe this is due to a change in
> density of the exhaust gases so the wave speed is changed.  I'm only
> talking 5 ft. lb at the most but the results were most surprising.  Also
> I'm talking below 3500,  above that I just see the same curve but lower.
>
>
> chris

--__--__--

Message: 42
To: [email-masked]
Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 00:11:15 -0700
Subject: Re: [lro] engine tuning and Vacume question.
From: [email-masked]
Reply-To: [email-masked]

Your points are well taken.  but I'm talking about the velocity of the
waves in the gas not the gas. As to your questions yes.  its too late for
me to think clearly now so good night

chris

On Tue, 7 Aug 2001 00:01:49 -0400 "Perrone Ford" <[email-masked]>
writes:
> 
>         I would have thought the gains would come from superior 
> scavenging, but
> exhaust tuning is a VERY dicey game without computer modeling.  It's 
> one
> area I truly am thankful I have software to use...  The other thing 
> is that
> I tend to understand exhaust changes made at the primaries or the 
> collector,
> but I have no IDEA what guys are talking about changing mufflers 
> some 8 feet
> down the line.  The velocity is so slow, and the gas has cooled so 
> much by
> that point, I can't imagine you'd see much in the way of gains down 
> there
> ESPECIALLY by choking it down.
> 
>         Can your wave simulator model exhaust flows through 
> previously designed
> pieces?  Meaning can you input specs for well known headers and see 
> the
> results?  Do you also model engines?
> 
> -Perrone
> 
> 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [email-masked] [mailto:[email-masked]]On 
> Behalf
> > Of [email-masked]
> > Sent: Tuesday, August 07, 2001 2:44 AM
> > To: [email-masked]
> > Subject: Re: [lro] engine tuning and Vacume question.
> >
> >
> >
> > Perrone,  I can't speak for many engines, but when I use my wave
> > simulator I model a muffler by reducing the diameter of the 
> collector.
> > The difference is almost always a smoother torque curve with the 
> dips
> > brought up more then the pikes are brought down.  This is with a
> > reduction of say 2.5 down to 1.75".  I believe this is due to a 
> change in
> > density of the exhaust gases so the wave speed is changed.  I'm 
> only
> > talking 5 ft. lb at the most but the results were most surprising. 
>  Also
> > I'm talking below 3500,  above that I just see the same curve but 
> lower.
> >
> >
> > chris
> _______________________________________________
> LRO mailing list
> [email-masked]
> http://land-rover.team.net/mailman/listinfo/lro

--__--__--

Message: 43
From: "Hope Peter" <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [lro] engine tuning and Vacume question.
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 19:07:00 -1000
Reply-To: [email-masked]

> but I have no IDEA what guys are talking about changing mufflers some 8
feet
> down the line.  The velocity is so slow, and the gas has cooled so much by
> that point,

This may be true...but my muffler is 40 inches from the end of the header.

All I am trying to do is drive up a hill.  I am willing to sacrifice some of
my flat speed 5-10mph even, if I can pick that back up on the hills.
If building some restriction helps this I am gain.
The muffler I have is a POS so I am going to change that for sure.  Can't
hear myself think right now at standard speeds.

But if the muffler doesn't have anything to do with my problems, then I am
needing to look at something else.

I am going to continue with the regapping.  Works so far.
Thanks
Pete

--__--__--

Message: 44
From: "Perrone Ford" <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: [lro] engine tuning - More stuff for Peter
Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 01:30:40 -0400
Reply-To: [email-masked]

Peter,

	Torque in an engine comes from only a few things:

1.  Piston ring sealing (good vacuum and pressure holding)
2.  Good transfer of heat from combustion to work produced (thermodynamic
transfer)
3.  Reduction of friction (RPM related more than anything)
4.  Cylinder pressure.

	So lets examine the problem from a mechanical perspective.  If you have
GOOD sealing at the rings and valve seats, then you will maximize 1 and 4.
Any leaks and you are tossing torque and horsepower out the window.  The
leakdown test will tell you everything you need to know in these two
critical areas.

	Heat transfer is a function of the block and heads holding in heat.  Cast
iron does this pretty well, but things like keeping an eye on the thermostat
(not running too cool) can have an effect.  Also you want to bring the
engine as lean as you dare, then richen it up enough to feel confident.
This will do a few things.  First, it will improve fuel economy.  Second, it
will let the engine burn hotter in the chamber which produces more work on
the piston increasing power, and third, when combined with good spark, it
allows the engine to burn very cleanly so you pollute less.  Be DAMN careful
not to get too lean (pinging) as that will tear up a motor in a hurry.

	Now reduction of friction is a big thing in motors.  The faster you spin
the engine the more you lose to friction, but in engines with tolerances as
loose as a Land Rover, I wouldn't be surprised if the you are getting
frictional problems all over the place.  Try running a GOOD synthetic for
1000 miles once you have your engine running well.  You'll be shocked at how
much smoother, quieter, and easier it will run.  On top of that, you'll run
much cooler (particularly in the gearbox).  Mind your thermostat as you
probably want your motor running near 210-220 for best power.  Any cooler
than that, and your tossing power away keeping the engine cooler than
necessary.

	In all of this there is no place where restricting exhaust flow comes into
play.  In fact, you want the exhaust gases moving away from the motor as
quickly as possible as long as you don't COOL them too much.  Hot gases move
faster and help torque, which is why racers wrap their headers and coat
their headers.  I'd LOVE to know what the cam specs on a 2.25 look like.
That would tell me volumes about what is going on with the motor and how to
make more power with it.   Restricting flow in the exhaust means that the
exhaust gases are moving slower down the pipe, and it means that all the
burnt gases aren't getting out of the chambers.  This causes two problems.
First, since the exhaust isn't getting out well, less intake mixture is
getting in to be burned which cuts down power.  Second, since the exhaust
gases are leaving the chamber slowly, it means the piston is working to push
out a lot of those gases instead of them being sucked out by the vacuum of
the other gases moving down the headers at high speed.  I'd love to hear
different from anyone who knows different.

	These are just some quick tips.  What are you gapped at now? How are the
plugs looking?  If you are still running plugs from when you were running
way rich, toss them out, gap the new ones at whatever you are gapped at now,
and continue opening up until you start misfiring.  What kind of plug wires
are you using?  You'd be AMAZED at how much difference that makes.  I am
going to start marketing good wires for series trucks and coilers in a few
months.  I should be able to do premium wires for you guys for $40-50.

Best of luck again!

-P

> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email-masked] [mailto:[email-masked]]On Behalf
> Of Hope Peter
> Sent: Tuesday, August 07, 2001 1:07 AM
> To: [email-masked]
> Subject: Re: [lro] engine tuning and Vacume question.

> This may be true...but my muffler is 40 inches from the end of the header.
>
> All I am trying to do is drive up a hill.  I am willing to
> sacrifice some of
> my flat speed 5-10mph even, if I can pick that back up on the hills.
> If building some restriction helps this I am gain.
> The muffler I have is a POS so I am going to change that for sure.  Can't
> hear myself think right now at standard speeds.
>
> But if the muffler doesn't have anything to do with my problems, then I am
> needing to look at something else.
>
> I am going to continue with the regapping.  Works so far.
> Thanks
> Pete
> _______________________________________________
> LRO mailing list
> [email-masked]
> http://land-rover.team.net/mailman/listinfo/lro

--__--__--

Message: 45
From: "Hope Peter" <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [lro] More stuff for Peter
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 20:45:12 -1000
Reply-To: [email-masked]

----- Original Message -----
From: "Perrone Ford" <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Sent: Monday, August 06, 2001 19:30
Subject: RE: [lro] engine tuning - More stuff for Peter

>
> Peter,
>
> Torque in an engine comes from only a few things:
>
> 1.  Piston ring sealing (good vacuum and pressure holding)
> 2.  Good transfer of heat from combustion to work produced (thermodynamic
> transfer)
> 3.  Reduction of friction (RPM related more than anything)
> 4.  Cylinder pressure.

Plugs were brand new yesterday...set at .04 going to open em up to 045
Wires, cap and rotor are brand new rover parts from BP

Compression is even across em, but low (144,141,143,139) with a 8:1 head

plan is to get a 2.5 liter short block when I get to Washington and have it
balanced.  This will fix 1,3,4

I will check on the cam settings.
Thanks again
Pete

--__--__--

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