Subject: LRO Mailing List DIGEST * * * * V1 #405

From: [email-masked] (LRO Mailing List DIGEST * * * *)
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 16:58:04 -0400

LRO Mailing List DIGEST * * * * Tuesday, June 12 2001 Volume 01 : Number 405

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 18:18:39 -1000
From: "Hope Peter" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: LRO: Re: Engine/Trans Swap

> Is there such as thing??  I thought racing harness started at 4 points
> and usually were five point to keep you from submarining on front impact.

3 point has a Y for shoulder straps.
4 point has an H for the shoulder straps
5 point add in the anti submarine strap, also refered to as a vasectomy
strap ;-)

>  I think LR had a good idea by making the
> cage external.  The hard part is anchoring it.
>

Only the window hoop needs to be external.  Hoop behind the driver and a
third at the rear are pretty easy to fab.  I recommend changing the
outriggers that the front of the tub mounts to for the strongest set up.
I also recomend strengthening, replacing or adding a second bulkhead
outrigger for the front hoop.
I am working on a full external cage for an 88 currently.  This is for a
factory stock framed vehicle.  Includes rock sliders and a front bushbar.
Representation of the design is on my webpage.

Pete

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 12:27:39 -0400
From: "Alan Richer/CAM/Lotus" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: LRO: Missing Front Drive Shaft

Re: Missing driveshaft:

OK - I assume the diff lock is locked on, then to keep the damn thing
driveable? This could be a whole bag of worms...like a bad transfer
case/diff, bad driveshafts in the front axle.  There's a lot of stuff in
there to go wrong...

One thing to check right off is jacking up one front wheel and spinning it
- - does the drive flange turn? If notm, there's likely pieces broken/missing
in there....

               ajr

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 09:41:03 -0700
From: Mark Pilkington <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: LRO: Missing Front Drive Shaft

John,
    There are a number of reasons the front drive shaft would be missing.
1) There was something wrong with it.
2) There is something wrong with the transfer case
3) Feeble attempt at getting more MPG out of a Rangie by making it 2WD
(it is still having to push it's front driveline with the front wheels and
causing friction and drag because there are no Free Wheeling Hubs)
It must be an older RR. That cannot be good for the transfer case, can it?
Just thinking out loud, you'll get more technical answers from some of the
other more mechanically minded LR Owners.
Kind regards,
Mark Pilkington
Owner of two Dormobiles!

John Wang wrote:

> Being a range rover neophyte I bought a 88 range rover over the weekend
> only to find that the car is missing it's front drive shaft.  I called a
> local range rover salvage yard and was given a quote of $150 for the drive
> shaft.   I know, I know, shouldn't be so trusting of other people. . but he
> seems like a nice guy. . lol. . oh well, a lesson in life.   Anyway, why
> would people take out the front drive shaft?  Other than the drive shaft
> could there be other potential problems?
>
> Thanks,
>
> John

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 12:54:15 -0400
From: "Alan Richer/CAM/Lotus" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: LRO: Missing Front Drive Shaft

It must be an older RR. That cannot be good for the transfer case, can it?

Speaking as the owner of the same year, this is one of the few NA models
you could do this with. Try this trick with a viscous-coupled Tcase and
you'll fry it in short order...

                    ajr

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 13:08:51 -0400
From: "Jean-Leon Morin" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: LRO: Re: Engine/Trans Swap

Yes, you do in fact have a great point - I suspect you have an 88" wheelbase
truck.

I would also stay the heck away from a 6 cyl if I had an 88, a putting such
a large amount of weight on the front axle of a SWB would be asking for
trouble. Personally, I am not at all knocking using a 4 cylinder in stock
form, 120 hp is exactly what the doctor ordered for a light 88, but Adam was
discussing boosting the power output - before spending three grand building
a high strung racing motor, why not go for a real loafer six? The money and
time required is about the same, yes, a six is more of a tight fit, but it
works - the Ford is massive, but it fits pretty nicely, with some breakfast
massaging.

If you can live with a relatively stock motor, an Iron Duke is a good
choice. If you are looking for horses before even swapping it out, why not
spend all that time and energy putting in a motor that will give you the
power you want?

J-L

- ----- Original Message -----
From: Kirk Hillman <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2001 12:27 AM
Subject: Re: LRO: Re: Engine/Trans Swap

> J-L,
>     I don't know why someone else would want the 2.5 (Iron Duke), but I
know
> why I would choose it.  Simplicity.  The motor is small and fits in the
> engine bay terrifically.  Weight, it's hard to compete with a small lump
> like that.  Minimal modifications... to anything.  Sure, it won't compete
in
> torque with the 250 or 300 inch monsters, but it isn't intended to.  The
> Duke can reliably put out 120-125 Hp using production parts.  Personally I
> would love to have an engine like that at the moment.  I like the idea of
> keeping the weight down.  The reason is simple to illustrate if you know
> what a Suzuki Samurai is.  I could be wrong but I believe the 2.5 is
lighter
> than the 2.25.  Parts are extremely cheap too.  The bores are the same as
> the 350 as well as some other parts which vastly increases one's options.
>     The other opinion (yours) would likely be to simply fit the 250 or 300
> as you did.  Great!  I would love that as well, but it involves much more
> work which I don't have time or money for.  My fear is the destruction of
> other parts of the truck under the torque these engines put out.  A few
> others on the list that might remember my incremental plan to modify my LR
> may also remember my thoughts on overcoming this problem.  But again,
meant
> more time and money.  Maybe someday, maybe never.  :-)
>     I say 'Good on Ya' J-L.  Same goes for those planning on using the
2.5.
> Have fun.
> Kirk

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 13:18:43 -0400
From: "Jean-Leon Morin" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: LRO: Re: Engine/Trans Swap

Granted, it will happen, but let's say you HAD to always hit a boulder at
that RPM to get torque and horsepower from your turbo. TeriAnn, I was just
saying that low end torque is really nice to have, and there is simply no
replacement for displacement in this case.

Of course, you can use the gas pedal, I just don' t like the idea of having
to use it all the time. I think some folks have forgotten why I said what I
did - Adam, who was discussing an SM420/iron duke swap with a turbo kit, was
asking for opinions. I basically said that he'd be better off for off-road
with a torquier motor, normally aspirated.

Not knocking the Duke swap, it works well, cheap. But if you are planning on
running 33" tires, and you want the power that you'd find in a Jeep with a
six, why turbo a 4 cyl? All you really want is a 6.

J-L

From: TeriAnn Wakeman <[email-masked]>
To: LRO list <[email-masked]>
Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2001 10:32 AM
Subject: Re: LRO: Re: Engine/Trans Swap

> > When is the last time
> >anyone held a constant 3000 rpms while crawling over a boulder?
>
> Oh a couple months ago just to get up a steep ramping bolder.  First gear
> low range 3000 RPM put me at about 4 MPH with gobs of power & torque.  My
> first gear low range final drive ratio is 70.4 and I have 32 inch dia
> tyres.  1000 RPM puts me at about 1.5 MPH with way more torque than the
> LR 2.25 produces at peak torque.
>
> One thing about having power + a very low ratio is I just about have to
> drive low range first with the hand throttle.  Any bump puts enough
> movment in my foot to cause the Rover to jump forward.  It takes very
> little throttle change to make very quick changes in velocity.
>
> TeriAnn Wakeman               Marigold Ltd.
> Santa Cruz, California        Web design, site updating, testing
> [email-masked]      search engine optimization, graphics
>                               and more
>
> http://www.overlander.net/Marigold/index.html
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 11:15:29 -0600
From: "Coates, Clinton" <[email-masked]>
Subject: LRO: True Brits (was Guiness)

Somebody wrote that the Scots, English and Welsh were British, but not the
Irish?  I have a cousin in law from Wales (a Jones...) who has informed me
that "...the Welsh are the only true Britons...".  The term English is an
evolved form of Angleisch (or some version of this spelling) which comes
from the Angles, one of the Teutonic mob that came over to Briton in the
400s and onwards.  Hence, Anglo-Saxon...  It seems there was a Welsh king
named Arthur or Artur or Artursus or somesuch who took umbrage with this and
tried to kick them out, to no avail...

I am sure someone with a better grasp of history and archaeo-linguistics
could pin me down on some of the dates and details, but in broad strokes, I
think that comes close.

Funny, all those good Anglo Saxon Britons from Robin Hood's time were being
put upon by Normans, who were nothing more than a bunch of hopped up
Vikings, another Germanic crowd.

Gotta love history!

Clinton

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 13:17:36 -0400
From: Matt Peckham <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: LRO: Re: Engine/Trans Swap

what kind of a nightmare would it be trying to fit a newer engine like say a
'98 Jeep 4cyl or a 2000 Jeep V6?  I figure the electronics would kill you,
but I just thought I'd ask...  I've seen a couple motors for amazingly low
prices lately.

Matt

- -----Original Message-----
From: Jean-Leon Morin [mailto:[email-masked]]
Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2001 1:19 PM
To: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: LRO: Re: Engine/Trans Swap

Granted, it will happen, but let's say you HAD to always hit a boulder at
that RPM to get torque and horsepower from your turbo. TeriAnn, I was just
saying that low end torque is really nice to have, and there is simply no
replacement for displacement in this case.

Of course, you can use the gas pedal, I just don' t like the idea of having
to use it all the time. I think some folks have forgotten why I said what I
did - Adam, who was discussing an SM420/iron duke swap with a turbo kit, was
asking for opinions. I basically said that he'd be better off for off-road
with a torquier motor, normally aspirated.

Not knocking the Duke swap, it works well, cheap. But if you are planning on
running 33" tires, and you want the power that you'd find in a Jeep with a
six, why turbo a 4 cyl? All you really want is a 6.

J-L

From: TeriAnn Wakeman <[email-masked]>
To: LRO list <[email-masked]>
Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2001 10:32 AM
Subject: Re: LRO: Re: Engine/Trans Swap

> > When is the last time
> >anyone held a constant 3000 rpms while crawling over a boulder?
>
> Oh a couple months ago just to get up a steep ramping bolder.  First gear
> low range 3000 RPM put me at about 4 MPH with gobs of power & torque.  My
> first gear low range final drive ratio is 70.4 and I have 32 inch dia
> tyres.  1000 RPM puts me at about 1.5 MPH with way more torque than the
> LR 2.25 produces at peak torque.
>
> One thing about having power + a very low ratio is I just about have to
> drive low range first with the hand throttle.  Any bump puts enough
> movment in my foot to cause the Rover to jump forward.  It takes very
> little throttle change to make very quick changes in velocity.
>
> TeriAnn Wakeman               Marigold Ltd.
> Santa Cruz, California        Web design, site updating, testing
> [email-masked]      search engine optimization, graphics
>                               and more
>
> http://www.overlander.net/Marigold/index.html
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 13:06:14 -0500
From: "KEITH ARMSTRONG" <[email-masked]>
Subject: LRO: Re: "Lay" opinion of Guinness :-)

Hi All,

I received the following from my father-in-law today...

> Yesterday after spending all day in the pasture spraying
> thistles I had to try one of your Guinness beers.  I came to
> one conclusion.  The only appropriate use of the extra stout
> would be to pour on your feet to cure ingrown toenails.
> Keith, how to you drink such stuff?  Giving Noah a drink of
> that stuff would certainly cure him of beer.

Hmmm, think it's an acquired taste :-)

LR content.....do I have to unbolt both ends of my driveshafts to remove the
trans?  I thought there would be enough travel in the slip joint to get them
out of the way....maybe there's just too much crap in the slip joints?

Keith Armstrong
Des Moines, IA

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 11:08:56 -0700
From: Mark Pilkington <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: LRO: Re: Engine/Trans Swap

In a current British Land Rover Mag, there is a guy who had a 4.2 Liter Straight
Six
Jaguar E-Type (XKE) put in a 1995 110 Pickup.  It looks the same, but is very
fast. Interesting but totally irrellevant to the question being asked.
Mark Pilkington

Matt Peckham wrote:

> what kind of a nightmare would it be trying to fit a newer engine like say a
> '98 Jeep 4cyl or a 2000 Jeep V6?  I figure the electronics would kill you,
> but I just thought I'd ask...  I've seen a couple motors for amazingly low
> prices lately.
>
> Matt
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jean-Leon Morin [mailto:[email-masked]]
> Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2001 1:19 PM
> To: [email-masked]
> Subject: Re: LRO: Re: Engine/Trans Swap
>
> Granted, it will happen, but let's say you HAD to always hit a boulder at
> that RPM to get torque and horsepower from your turbo. TeriAnn, I was just
> saying that low end torque is really nice to have, and there is simply no
> replacement for displacement in this case.
>
> Of course, you can use the gas pedal, I just don' t like the idea of having
> to use it all the time. I think some folks have forgotten why I said what I
> did - Adam, who was discussing an SM420/iron duke swap with a turbo kit, was
> asking for opinions. I basically said that he'd be better off for off-road
> with a torquier motor, normally aspirated.
>
> Not knocking the Duke swap, it works well, cheap. But if you are planning on
> running 33" tires, and you want the power that you'd find in a Jeep with a
> six, why turbo a 4 cyl? All you really want is a 6.
>
> J-L
>
> From: TeriAnn Wakeman <[email-masked]>
> To: LRO list <[email-masked]>
> Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2001 10:32 AM
> Subject: Re: LRO: Re: Engine/Trans Swap
>
> > > When is the last time
> > >anyone held a constant 3000 rpms while crawling over a boulder?
> >
> > Oh a couple months ago just to get up a steep ramping bolder.  First gear
> > low range 3000 RPM put me at about 4 MPH with gobs of power & torque.  My
> > first gear low range final drive ratio is 70.4 and I have 32 inch dia
> > tyres.  1000 RPM puts me at about 1.5 MPH with way more torque than the
> > LR 2.25 produces at peak torque.
> >
> > One thing about having power + a very low ratio is I just about have to
> > drive low range first with the hand throttle.  Any bump puts enough
> > movment in my foot to cause the Rover to jump forward.  It takes very
> > little throttle change to make very quick changes in velocity.
> >
> > TeriAnn Wakeman               Marigold Ltd.
> > Santa Cruz, California        Web design, site updating, testing
> > [email-masked]      search engine optimization, graphics
> >                               and more
> >
> > http://www.overlander.net/Marigold/index.html
> >
> >

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 14:54:07 EDT
From: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: LRO: Re: Engine/Trans Swap

I want a sort of hybrid, but I dont want to have to do a lot of chassis 
welding, aside from motor mounts.  eventually i will have a land rover on a 
different chassis, but not currently.  i have the time for this sort of 
project, as i have a different vehicle for daily uses (1988 range rover).

adam

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 14:59:24 -0400
From: Matt Peckham <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: LRO: Re: Engine/Trans Swap

no, you have a different vehicle for daily uses, (mountain bike, scooter or
skateboard, which one is it?)  :)

Matt

- -----Original Message-----
From: [email-masked] [mailto:[email-masked]]
Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2001 2:54 PM
To: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: LRO: Re: Engine/Trans Swap

I want a sort of hybrid, but I dont want to have to do a lot of chassis 
welding, aside from motor mounts.  eventually i will have a land rover on a 
different chassis, but not currently.  i have the time for this sort of 
project, as i have a different vehicle for daily uses (1988 range rover).

adam

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 22:12:58 +0100
From: "Frank Elson" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: LRO: Guinness (was Acetone and Rain-X)

Ajr writes: <<<Newcastle Brown Ale <<<

OK guys, what's the 'odd' thing about serving Newkie Brown?

(there is no prize btw)
Best Cheers

Frank
    +--+--+--+            
     I !__|  [_]|_\___   
     I ____|"_|"__|_ | /     B791 PKV 
     "(o)======(o)"    Bronze Green 110 CSW

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 22:25:51 +0100
From: "Frank Elson" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: LRO: Replacing footwells

Peter writes: >>>Haven't any first hand experience but a number of people
have riveted in the
> replacement footwells.  Use some kind of permanent marine sealant where
the
> parts overlap, drill and pop.  Riveting will be nearly as strong as
welding. <<<

I've done this (twice) using galvanised sheet used for making up air
conditioning ducts. Couple of coats of red lead, plenty of sealant around
the edges, plenty of rivets and at least one looks as good as new 12 years
later (I just went out and checked) the other is still on the road 15 years
later and I don't remember the guy who had it off me (and who I see
regularly) saying he'd had to 'do' the area again. Remember to still cut out
the rusty bits and redlead (or your favourite rust protection paint, POR 15
you lot are always going on about?) first.

Best Cheers

Frank
    +--+--+--+
     I !__|  [_]|_\___
     I ____|"_|"__|_ | /     B791 PKV
     "(o)======(o)"    Bronze Green 110 CSW

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 22:32:26 +0100
From: "Frank Elson" <[email-masked]>
Subject: LRO: Re: British Beer, The Right Temparature

Mark writes: >>>visited a
> terrific museum dedicated to the US Army Air Corp fliers. It is located
just
> east of Diss <<<

as a Brit I am ashamed to say I'd never heard of that. I hearby promise to
go and visit soon.
 Some of us here do appreciate what your lot did for us.
Best Cheers

Frank
    +--+--+--+
     I !__|  [_]|_\___
     I ____|"_|"__|_ | /     B791 PKV
     "(o)======(o)"    Bronze Green 110 CSW

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 22:39:16 +0100
From: "Frank Elson" <[email-masked]>
Subject: LRO: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Guinness (was Acetone and Rain-X)

Alex writes: >>>Perhaps it's what's left over after a run of Budweiser is
complete<<<

Did you know that 'Bud' drunk from the bottle is a trendy drink in the UK?
Whenever I see 'em I have a chuckle knowing what my 'Murrican friends
actually think of it :-)>

Of course the young things drinking it are looking at me and thinking 'he's
an old fart drinking Mild'
like I care...
Best Cheers

Frank
    +--+--+--+
     I !__|  [_]|_\___
     I ____|"_|"__|_ | /     B791 PKV
     "(o)======(o)"    Bronze Green 110 CSW

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 22:28:47 +0100
From: "Frank Elson" <[email-masked]>
Subject: LRO: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Guinness (was Acetone and Rain-X)

you spotted the extra 'e' Alex. As I prefer Irish whiskey and always have
some around, mine shouldn't be a 'Scots' Mac.

mix? to taste mate, to taste - and have a lot of fun experimentin'...
 (I do half'n'half myself)
Best Cheers

Frank
    +--+--+--+
     I !__|  [_]|_\___
     I ____|"_|"__|_ | /     B791 PKV
     "(o)======(o)"    Bronze Green 110 CSW

- ----- Original Message -----
From: Alex Maiolo <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>
Sent: Monday, June 11, 2001 2:15 AM
Subject: LRO: Re: Re: Re: Re: Guinness (was Acetone and Rain-X)

>
> > Ginger Wine is great...
>  > Ever mix it with whiskey for a genuine 'Scot's Mac' ?
>
> No, what are the proportions? Any other godd Stone's drinks?
>
> > (ok, anyone notice my deliberate mistake?)
>
> It looks like you had an extra "e" floating around that you had to use...
>
>
> > Not sure where Stones' bitter comes from... well, probably a toilet
> > somewhere...
>
> Perhaps it's what's left over after a run of Budweiser is complete.
>
> Alex Maiolo
> Chapel Hill NC
>
>
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 20:59:40 -1000
From: "Hope Peter" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: LRO: Re: Engine/Trans Swap

> what kind of a nightmare would it be trying to fit a newer engine like say
a
> '98 Jeep 4cyl or a 2000 Jeep V6?  I figure the electronics would kill you,

The electrics for a FI are a real pain unless you have pulled the old
harness or order a new one, and make sure to get the computer and all the
sensors.
The Jeep 4cyl may have more HP on the books, but trust me, it still can't
get out of it's own way.  It will do 80mph on the flats, but has a hard time
keeping 55 on inclines.  It definately doesn't have any lowend oomph.
I won't get to do any testing until this weekend, but so far a cam, head,
intake, exhaust switch on the IIa 88 2.25l is going well.  Engine started
right up :-)
Doing some unrelated things in the engine compartment and finishing up my
front hoop, all easier with the wings removed.
Anyway, very interested to find out what if any improvements I will have.
Just doing the intake and exhaust saw a 5mph gain on my test hill (40mph
before 45mph after in 4th...wont pull OD at all)  Cam made a very noticable
differen ce in the sound.  The intake has a different note to it.

Pete

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 20:28:32 +0100 (BST)
From: Robert Ries <[email-masked]>
Subject: LRO: Re: British Beer

Date: Sat, 9 Jun 2001 21:38:20 +0100
From: "Frank Elson" <[email-masked]>
Subject: LRO: Re: British Beer

Mark Pilkington writes: >>>Ding Ding. Right you lot, out, I'll 
not be
telling you again!!
> Bloody hell, time for a curry already!<<<

Mike Harding says brewers put something in beer that makes you 
want a curry
afterwards. He's right.

BTW Mark, 24 hour opening hours are on the way. Sob, no more 
'last orders'
sob...

Best Cheers

Frank
    +--+--+--+
     I !__|  [_]|_\___
     I ____|"_|"__|_ | /     B791 PKV
     "(o)======(o)"    Bronze Green 110 CSW

And not a moment to soon, 11 pm is way to early for the thirst I
work up reading all these bloody digests!!  HA!
See you at the pub sum day Frank...

=====
Robert D. Ries
SSgt, USAF
Burwell, England
"With friends like these..."

____________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @yahoo.co.uk address at http://mail.yahoo.co.uk
or your free @yahoo.ie address at http://mail.yahoo.ie

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 20:31:36 +0100 (BST)
From: Robert Ries <[email-masked]>
Subject: LRO: Re: Guinness 

We were once on our way to Dublin where I told my son he'd get 
a 'real'
pint of Guinness. He, a 'seasoned' drinker who'd seen and tasted

it all went
'Oh, yeah, sure' humouring the old man.
 Sat down in McDonnels and got ourselves a pint. He took a taste

and
enlightenment dawned...
You have NOT tasted Guinness until you've tasted it in Dublin. 
Trust me...
Best Cheers

Frank
    +--+--+--+
     I !__|  [_]|_\___
     I ____|"_|"__|_ | /     B791 PKV
     "(o)======(o)"    Bronze Green 110 CSW

I think that sometink aboot te' tax mon seeps thru the
barrels...

=====
Robert D. Ries
SSgt, USAF
Burwell, England
"With friends like these..."

____________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @yahoo.co.uk address at http://mail.yahoo.co.uk
or your free @yahoo.ie address at http://mail.yahoo.ie

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 09:35:00 -1000
From: "Peter Ogilvie" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: LRO: Re: Engine/Trans Swap

I was talking stock gearing as many people love to crow about running 75mph 
in their stock trucks.  Just wanted to be sure that people know that, 
'HAPPILY cruising at 75mph with stock gearing' is an oxymoron.

Aloha
Peter Ogilvie
Kona Coffee Rover
1970 88 soft top, 'huli' Mine since '84 but recovering
     from exposure of the dark side.
1966 109 pickup 'slime'  In my garage since '90, finally running.
1965 88 parts car, slowly sinking into the lava.
196? 88 hard top, possibly 'phoenix' if it rises, it will
     certainly be from ashes or at least a pile of rust

>From: TeriAnn Wakeman <[email-masked]>
>
> >Cruise and happily are not synonomous with 70mph in a series.  If my 
>figures
> >are correct, your turning 4,147rpm at 70mph.
>
>That sounds about right for 100% stock series gearing but if I remember,
>he mentioned swapping out the 4.7 diffs for 4.1 and adding an Ashcroft
>high ratio Xfer case kit.
>
>
>TeriAnn Wakeman               Marigold Ltd.
>Santa Cruz, California        Web design, site updating, testing
>[email-masked]      search engine optimization, graphics
>                               and more
>
>http://www.overlander.net/Marigold/index.html
>

_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 19:51:03 GMT
From: [email-masked]
Subject: LRO: Clutch slave etc.

Jim, Allan, Bill and Garrick;

This lengthening of the pushrod trick causes me great confusion.  

First off Garrick and Travis have differant set-ups, Garrick is a SII and 
Travis has a SIIA in his SIII.  These are very similar, hovever the difference 
may be part of the problem.  I personally have a SII and have pondered this 
very same lack of clutch actuation often.  
First lets all look and make sure that the Master cylinder is providing full 
stroke thereby putting the most fluid to the slave cylinder.  Secondly lets 
look at the amount of play at the throw out mechanism.  The rotational play of 
the shaft prior to making the forks push the bearing/sleeve into contact with 
the pressure plate.  Thirdly I would sugesst that we start with the piston 
pushed back as far as possible into the slave cylinder.  Now rotate the 
throwout shaft until contact is made with the pressure plate.  Adjust the slave 
cylinder rod to make contact with the outer face of the piston.  If the rod is 
to short at it longest then allow the piston to move down in the slave cylinder 
until it contacts the shaft.  Bleed the system now.  

So here we have the master cylinder set to move the most fluid, the throw out 
ready to press on the pressure plate and hydraulics ready to fill the slave as 
a result of the displacement in the master cylinder.  

Are there any faults to this practice?  please reply.

Hurricane Mitch and the Red Dinosaur
(Bill, are you studying
French?)

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Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 16:03:09 -0400
From: Matt Peckham <[email-masked]>
Subject: LRO: Spotting

ok, I don't know who this was, but they just drove away, even though it was
pretty obvious I was following them.  I was driving down winter street in
Lincoln, and as it merged with the one way section near the reservoir, I
spot a Series 3 eggshell hardtop with some really skinny little tires pull
out in front of me.  2 people in it.  Since I could only go the same way, I
was following them.  They didn't slow down, wave, beep, or anything!  We
pulled back onto Trapelo Rd, and they just sped away.  Not the courtesy I am
used to seeing from Series owners, and how often do you encounter another
one on a deserted road, replete with monster speed bumps to make you go
really slow.  Guess I am a bit OVER friendly...

I was taking a colleague out for a spin as he was bored, again, over
friendly...

Matt Peckham
74 Lightweight.
        _____
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 | /    \       /    \|)
[||( () )\_____|( () )[ ]
~~~~\~~/~~~~~~~~~\~~/~~~~~~~~~

www.crossmember.com

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Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 13:25:50 -0700
From: "G. Mugele" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: LRO: True Brits (was Guiness)

At 11:15 AM -0600 6/12/01, Coates, Clinton wrote:
>Somebody wrote that the Scots, English and Welsh were British, but not the
>Irish?  I have a cousin in law from Wales (a Jones...) who has informed me
>that "...the Welsh are the only true Britons...".  The term English is an
>evolved form of Angleisch (or some version of this spelling) which comes
>from the Angles, one of the Teutonic mob that came over to Briton in the
>400s and onwards.  Hence, Anglo-Saxon...  It seems there was a Welsh king
>named Arthur or Artur or Artursus or somesuch who took umbrage with this and
>tried to kick them out, to no avail...
>
>I am sure someone with a better grasp of history and archaeo-linguistics
>could pin me down on some of the dates and details, but in broad strokes, I
>think that comes close.

Well Clinton, here's a fun site where you can learn more about the 
Angles (and Sax) in Northern England and how it was they came to be 
there after the Romans departed (by invitation actually) and their 
migration to the South East.
http://www.britishempire.co.uk/bbs/messages/10230.html

>Funny, all those good Anglo Saxon Britons from Robin Hood's time were being
>put upon by Normans, who were nothing more than a bunch of hopped up
>Vikings, another Germanic crowd.
>
>Gotta love history!

You'll have to look elsewhere for Anglo-Saxon dominance in the the 
Southeast prior to the invasion of the Normans .... BTW they were 
from Normandy (France) not Germany nor Scandinavia.  I think that 
little conflict started by Bill the Conqueror may be the basis for 
the current and ongoing love/hate relationship between the peoples on 
opposite sides of the channel.  Of course that other more recent 
French guy, Mr. Bonaparte may have contributed.

http://britishhistory.about.com/aboutuk/britishhistory/gi/dynamic/offs 
ite.htm?site=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ibiscom.com%2Fbayeux.htm

LAND ROVER Content..... it should be noted that Series Land Rover 
technology was derived directly from 1900 years of continuous 
development of the Ox Cart with influence and techno,input from the 
Romans, Vikings, Danes, Germans, French and even the US WWII 
contribution, the J**p.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 13:39:40 -0700
From: "Faure, Marin" <[email-masked]>
Subject: LRO: Re: gear and transfer teach please

Behalf Of Camilo Osejo
Sent: Friday, June 08, 2001 2:32 AM
To: [email-masked]
Subject: LRO: gear and transfer teach please

>Could please anyone explain how do the gear and transfer box levers work in
a series vehicle (to be used in a sIII santana)?

Pretty simple, and you've probably got lots of answers already.

Long shift lever, black knob.  Main transmission,  four speeds plus 
neutral plus reverse.  Basic "H" pattern.

Red knob lever.  Three positions, "I" pattern.  When the lever is 
forward, the transfer case is in high.  In the middle is neutral, and when 
the lever is back, the transfer case is in low.  When lever is pulled back 
into low, it also automatically engages four wheel drive.

Yellow knob lever.  Two positions, up and down.  It is spring-loaded to 
the up position.  When the knob is up, the vehicle is in two-wheel drive.  
Pushing the knob down engages four wheel drive, high range when the 
red knob lever is forward in high range.  The yellow knob lever can be 
pushed down anytime at any speed to engage four wheel drive AS LONG 
AS the vehicle is not equipped with locking front hubs that are disengaged.

To get out of four wheel drive high, the vehicle must be stopped and the red 
knob lever pulled all the way back into low range, which will release the yellow 
knob lever which will pop back up into two wheel drive.  The red knob lever 
should then be pushed back forward into the high range position.  You will then 
be back in two-wheel drive.

So the only possible drive combinations are:

Two wheel drive, high range.  Red knob lever forward, yellow knob lever up.
Four wheel drive, high range.  Red knob lever forward, yellow knob lever down.
Four wheel drive, low range.  Red knob lever back, yellow knob lever up.

You must use the clutch when shifting the main transmission lever and the red knob 
lever.

The Series Land Rover's gearbox arrangement is similar to the original Jeep's, only 
the Jeep has a more logical setup as I recall.  There is a lever to control high and 
low range and a lever to control two wheel drive and four wheel drive.
___________________________
C. Marin Faure
  (original owner)
  1973 Land Rover Series III-88
  1991 Range Rover Vogue SE
  Seattle

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Date: Tue, 12 Jun 01 13:32:35 -0700
From: TeriAnn Wakeman <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: LRO: Clutch 

>I've tried the extra bleeding and the max lengthening of the slave piston 
>bolt.  I still need three pumps of the clutch to get the new clutch plate 
>disengaged from the flywheel!!!

>1960 Ser II (ie single chanel everything) SWB SW.

OK.

First thing is to check your mechanical linkage for wear.  Lots of little 
elongated holes add up to a lot of movement in th pedal.    Check every 
connection and replace anything that is elongated.  Chances are the 
bronze ball has seen better days.  Also check where the pedal connects to 
the master cylinder.  The nuts sometimes back off.

Also the vertical slave cylinder can be a real pain to bleed properly.  I 
pressure bleed does it quickly.  I once poured a qt of LMA fluid through 
a clutch system in an unsucessful attempt at a good pump bleed.

TeriAnn Wakeman               Marigold Ltd.
Santa Cruz, California        Web design, site updating, testing
[email-masked]      search engine optimization, graphics
                              and more

http://www.overlander.net/Marigold/index.html

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Jun 01 13:24:44 -0700
From: TeriAnn Wakeman <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: LRO: Missing Front Drive Shaft

>  Anyway, why
>would people take out the front drive shaft?

Because the front diff, axle or CV joint is broken.

Hope you got the RR cheap.  I'd start it off with a full checkup.

TeriAnn Wakeman               Marigold Ltd.
Santa Cruz, California        Web design, site updating, testing
[email-masked]      search engine optimization, graphics
                              and more

http://www.overlander.net/Marigold/index.html

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Jun 01 13:56:16 -0700
From: TeriAnn Wakeman <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: LRO: Re: Engine/Trans Swap

>what kind of a nightmare would it be trying to fit a newer engine like say a
>'98 Jeep 4cyl or a 2000 Jeep V6?  I figure the electronics would kill you,
>but I just thought I'd ask...  I've seen a couple motors for amazingly low
>prices lately.

Why would he want a series rig that needed SMOG testing?  Otherwise they 
could be made to fit.  Personaly I'm a fan of simplicity.

TeriAnn Wakeman               Marigold Ltd.
Santa Cruz, California        Web design, site updating, testing
[email-masked]      search engine optimization, graphics
                              and more

http://www.overlander.net/Marigold/index.html

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 13:57:24 -0700
From: "Faure, Marin" <[email-masked]>
Subject: LRO: Locking hubs (was gear and transfer.....)

Date: Thu, 7 Jun 2001 22:37:37 -0700
From: "Rich & Lori Williams" <[email-masked]>
Subject: LRO: Re: RE: gear and transfer teach please AND ANOTHER Q

>Okay so add to all this the use of Free Wheeling Hubs.  My 109 came with
Fairey FWH but never got the opportunity to engage them so 2 questions:
1) when the truck is put back into service do I want to keep them

Some people think freewheel hubs are a waste of time, others think they 
have some value.  I put Warns on my SIII shortly after taking delivery of 
the vehicle new in 1973, and am very happy with them.  I consistently 
measured a 1-3 mpg fuel savings when driving on the highway with the 
hubs disengaged.  Around town, the mileage improvement is negligible.  
Over the last 28 years, I've saved a fair amount of fuel, particularly since 
for the first ten years, my Land Rover was my only vehicle and was driven 
every day.

There is also a slight, but noticeable improvement in acceleration with 
the hubs disengaged, and it takes a bit less power (as measured by my 
manifold pressure gauge) to climb grades with the hubs disengaged.  This 
makes sense as there are a fair number of revolving parts that aren't being 
driven by the engine when the hubs are disengaged. So again, there's a bit 
of a fuel savings which, over almost three decades, has added up to something.

>2) how do they get used?

I leave the hubs engaged most of the time when driving around town.  I disengage 
them when I'm going to be driving primarily on highways.  It's important to engage 
them relatively frequently, as the upper swivel bushings get their lubrication from the 
U-joints slinging oil around inside the swivel ball.  If the hubs are disengaged, the front 
driveline isn't moving, or isn't moving very fast, and so the oil in the swivel balls isn't 
getting thrown up onto the upper swivel bushing.  If this condition persists, the upper 
bushing will dry out and wear quickly, and you'll have a relatively major repair job on your 
hands.  Warn says to engage the front hubs at least once a month for at least a mile.  In 
my opinion, that's way too little for the Land Rover's swivel system.  So I use the 
"engaged in town-disengaged on the highway" guideline, and so far have not ever had to 
repair or replace any front swivel components in 28 years.  In town, you're turning corners, 
parking, etc., and the swivel bushings are getting a workout.  On the highway, most directional 
changes are fairly small, so the swivel bushings are not being moved much.

Some people on this list have described all the problems they've had with locking hubs, 
and they find them a waste of time.  All I can say is that the manual Warn hubs I installed 
back in 1973 have given perfect service without EVER having had to be overhauled, and I 
have realized a significant-over-time savings in fuel and a slight but appreciated improvement 
in road performance when they are disengaged.

So if it was my vehicle, I'd keep them and use them intelligently.
___________________________
C. Marin Faure
  (original owner)
  1973 Land Rover Series III-88
  1991 Range Rover Vogue SE
  Seattle

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