From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 3 05:54:50 1992
Return-Path: <sgm@hplb.hpl.hp.com>
From: Steve Methley <sgm@hplb.hpl.hp.com>
Subject: V8 (HC) in Airportable - cooling behaviour
To: lro@transfer.stratus.com
Date: Mon, 3 Aug 92 11:53:53 BST
Mailer: Elm [revision: 64.9.hplb.1]
Status: RO
Hi folks,
as this is my first posting I'll introduce the beast:
It's an ex British Forces Airportable/Lightweight which some time in its life
has been converted to use the 3.5l V8 in road car tune. Diffs are Range Rover,
but the gearbox remains the SIII LR synchro unit. I've had the vehicle a
little over a month now and am still sorting out the various bodge jobs
inflicted upon my unsuspecting pride-and-joy by previous owners.
One problem I'd welcome comments on is the behaviour of the cooling system.
The thermostat is 82'C and the Landy will settle down to do this all day on the
open road, but the warm up is wierd: Before I put antifreeze in the LR, it
would overshoot the thermostat temp by say 10-15'C for a few minutes, before
settling back. Now with about 40% antifreeze it overshoots by 20-30'C before
settling back after a longer period. I find this worrying.
What I did first was to have the radiator repaired (leak in top) (BTW it's a
Range Rover radiator with two electric fans on a manual switch, no mechanical
fan on the V8 any more), replace the thermostat, flush with clean water, and
make all hoses pressure tight. However the problem persists, and is certainly
worse now the system is pressure tight and I've upped the boiling point.
Before I take my next course of action which is flushing with a descaler, I'd
like to hear any views out there in net.land. Could I be running lean or
retarded and cause this problem - any experience? I think the descaler could
cause more leaks so I'm hesitant to do it!
Anyway, please let me have any good ideas. I'm really enjoying the beast off
road and did my first night-time trek last week.
Cheers,
Steve.
--
//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
Best Regards,
Steve.
Dr Steve Methley ***** *****
HP Labs, Filton Road, *** /_ __ *** email: sgm@hplb.hpl.hp.com
Bristol, BS12 6QZ, UK ** / / /_/ ** or sgm@hpl.hp.co.uk
direct line: +44 272 228751 *** / *** fax: +44 272 312164
switchboard: +44 272 799910 ***** ***** or 790554
//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 18 00:09:42 1992 Return-Path: <@mail.uunet.ca:aficom!fourfold!dixon@micor> To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Subject: Replacement for 90wt. From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner) Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1992 22:11:53 -0400 Organization: FourFold Symmetry, Breckenridge, Quebec A quick question... A friend, who has four LR's (109, 2x88, military light weight) has suggested that I do ot put 90wt into the diffs and gearbox, but rather put a synthetic oil in. What is the opinion on this? His rational is simple. 90wt doesn't do nice things to the shifter when it is -30f up here. In fact you can easily break the gear shifter. He has been through two so far. He also advised me to leave the vehicle in third gear, but not to engage the transfer case. Thus you can warm up the gearbox and not damage it to much. As for the LR in the garage, not much has changed. The parts that I have been waiting for (5 months for some) have arrived so some further progress may be realised. As my friend with the Blazer has returned from vacation I now have a vehicle, and assistant <grin> to help remove a replacement engine from a forelone 109 rotting away some 70 miles from here. Happily, the engine runs smoothly and is in pretty good shape. If all goes well, it might actually be on the road before the snow flies... :-) Rgds, -- dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca FourFold Symmetry, Breckenridge, Quebec, Canada
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 18 08:15:32 1992 Return-Path: <barbeau@io.eecs.umich.edu> Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1992 09:12:02 -0400 From: barbeau@io.eecs.umich.edu (Chris Barbeau) To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Subject: Newbie gets in deep quick... Cc: barbeau@io.eecs.umich.edu Well, not really, but more problems cropped up than I expected once I really tore into the bad beast. I followed everyone's advice about flushing the brake system with Castrol and examining the fluid, I didn't see any evidence of disolving rubber. I don't know if this means he was using Castrol and just happened to have a bottle of some other stuff in the vehicle or what, but in any case, it seems fine. Generator turned out to be bad, taking the battery with it. Not a big deal, though I think that I will replace it with an alternator. I want to run a few extra lights and perhaps at some point, a winch, and I understand that I will be further ahead with the alternator. One of the front springs was fairly settled, so I ordered two new ones from Rovers North, but they're backordered... Sigh... I wondered if anyone has had experience with rechromed swivel balls. The price on them is attractive compared to new, but I wondered how good a job they do. If the prep on the surface is well done before the chroming, and if the chrome layer is thick enough to last... I got a reccommendation to carefully get all the rust off of the existing balls and use an epoxy resin to fill the pits (sanding to smooth) then just reinstall... Seems like this would work for awhile, but I don't know how worn the existing balls are. (btw: Whoever suggested that I check the levels in the swivel balls was absolutely right. None, none, none... So no telling how long they were empty) I might be repairing a surface that is just to worn to seal properly. I don't really want to do the job again, since there are other things to get on to, so I would rather get new or rechromed balls and be done with it. Taking apart the front end, I got to the hub nuts (big deal, right?) and with a standered 1/2" driver, I can't budge the nut (everything so far has been "heat it up and bang it a few times" to loosen) Is it OK to use a breaker bar? The points on the nut are already a little round, and the driver is only sheet metal. Should this nut be on this tightly? It's obviously not rusted in place since this area is bathed in oil. Ahh, the mechanicals... I can hardly wait until I get to the cosmetics! Those are the fun repairs/upgrades... -chris barbeau
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 18 10:40:40 1992 Return-Path: <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> From: Mike Rooth <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> Subject: Replacement for 90wt To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Date: Tue, 18 Aug 92 16:31:04 BST Dixon I have looked in my (geniune) "Repair Operation Manual" and it says that the recommended lubricants are for temperate climates only.Yours isnt.A letter to Land Rover might have some result since the manual also says to get in touch with them if operating in very hot or cold climates.The current issue of LRO has an article about British Army Training Unit Suffield who run S111's in Canada (in winter,too).Dont know whether its a stupid suggestion,but if you could locate their phone number? Regards Mike Rooth
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 18 10:43:13 1992 Return-Path: <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> From: Mike Rooth <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> Subject: Newbie gets in deep... To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Date: Tue, 18 Aug 92 16:39:12 BST Chris I have a suggestion,based on the advice a friend was given when replacing swivel balls on his S111.If you fit a gaiter kit when doing the job,then when finished,fill the gaiters with grease, no water can get near the chrome surface and in theory the chrome should last indefinitely. Any help? Mike Rooth
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 18 10:53:06 1992
Return-Path: <scrl@hplb.hpl.hp.com>
To: lro@transfer.stratus.com
Subject: Re: Newbie gets in deep...
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 18 Aug 92 16:39:12 BST."
<9208181539.AA02331@hpc.lut.ac.uk>
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 92 16:47:16 BST
From: Simon Lewis <scrl@hplb.hpl.hp.com>
Talking about swivel-pin housings, it is considered quite acceptable in
the LR community in the UK not to replace housings which aren't too
knackered, but just to replace the oil with grease, which doesn't leak out.
I ran my SIIA that way for years, with no ill effects. I did have
freewheel hubs, so the UJ wasn't doing too much turning of course -- just
an occasional bit of exercise in `fixed'.
Simon.
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 18 11:12:28 1992 Return-Path: <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> From: Mike Rooth <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> Subject: Replacement for 90wt To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Date: Tue, 18 Aug 92 16:31:04 BST Dixon I have looked in my (geniune) "Repair Operation Manual" and it says that the recommended lubricants are for temperate climates only.Yours isnt.A letter to Land Rover might have some result since the manual also says to get in touch with them if operating in very hot or cold climates.The current issue of LRO has an article about British Army Training Unit Suffield who run S111's in Canada (in winter,too).Dont know whether its a stupid suggestion,but if you could locate their phone number? Regards Mike Rooth
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 18 11:20:41 1992 Return-Path: <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> From: Mike Rooth <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> Subject: Newbie gets in deep... To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Date: Tue, 18 Aug 92 16:39:12 BST Chris I have a suggestion,based on the advice a friend was given when replacing swivel balls on his S111.If you fit a gaiter kit when doing the job,then when finished,fill the gaiters with grease, no water can get near the chrome surface and in theory the chrome should last indefinitely. Any help? Mike Rooth
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 18 11:32:39 1992
Return-Path: <moore@fslg8.fsl.noaa.gov>
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 92 16:21:08 GMT
From: moore@profsc.fsl.noaa.gov (Mark Moore MOORE@FSL.NOAA.GOV)
To: lro@transfer.stratus.com
Subject: RE: 90wt oil
>> Subj: Replacement for 90wt
>>
>> Dixon
>> I have looked in my (geniune) "Repair Operation Manual" and it
>> says that the recommended lubricants are for temperate climates
>> only.Yours isnt.A letter to Land Rover might have some result
>> since the manual also says to get in touch with them if operating
>> in very hot or cold climates.The current issue of LRO has an article
>> about British Army Training Unit Suffield who run S111's in Canada
>> (in winter,too).Dont know whether its a stupid suggestion,but if
>> you could locate their phone number?
>> Regards
>> Mike Rooth
This may get a few flames, but here goes anyway. The protection
of a 90wt oil is the same (in theory) regardless of whether it's
natural or synthetic based. The advantage of having synthetic oil
is that the viscosity is affected less by temperature extremes.
While it doesn't usually get to -300F here in Colorado, there have
been days when my Stanza tranny froze in gear until the blasted
thing warmed up. I've replaced the fluids in my Rover tranny with
90wt AMSOIL. I haven't run it long enough to see the results.
However, the Stanza shifts noticeably smoother all year round.
The Audi will get the same replacement this winter.
Hope this helps.
Cheers.
Mark
--0-
moore@fsl.noaa.gov
NOAA - Boulder, CO USA
1961 109" Landrover Pickup "Adamson"
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 18 12:11:14 1992 Return-Path: <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> From: Mike Rooth <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> Subject: Replacement for 90wt To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Date: Tue, 18 Aug 92 16:31:04 BST Dixon I have looked in my (geniune) "Repair Operation Manual" and it says that the recommended lubricants are for temperate climates only.Yours isnt.A letter to Land Rover might have some result since the manual also says to get in touch with them if operating in very hot or cold climates.The current issue of LRO has an article about British Army Training Unit Suffield who run S111's in Canada (in winter,too).Dont know whether its a stupid suggestion,but if you could locate their phone number? Regards Mike Rooth
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 19 04:35:35 1992 Return-Path: <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> From: Mike Rooth <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> Subject: Free Wheel Hubs To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Date: Wed, 19 Aug 92 10:29:57 BST Does anyone have any opinions on the effectiveness (or otherwise) of Free Wheel Hubs? Steve mentioned having had them on his 11A,and I was wondering what people's experiences with them were(i.e are they worth fitting from a fuel consumption/speed viewpoint).The reason I ask is that I have been running my 88" 11A diesel without the front propshaft for the last two or three weeks.One of the U.J's went down,and the row was indescribable.The old lady seems to run much more freely without it.Now I'm due to put it back,I am seriously considering a pair of FWH.A 4 by 4 mag I used to take gave the opinion that they made no difference at all,which personally I find difficult to believe.Dont take the mag anymore,it seemed deicated to slagging Land Rover off at every opportunity.Anyone got any opinions? Mike Rooth
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 19 10:08:11 1992
Return-Path: <caloccia@aperture.cac.stratus.com>
To: Mike Rooth <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk>
Cc: lro@transfer.stratus.com
Subject: Re: Free Wheel Hubs
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 19 Aug 92 10:29:57 BST."
<9208190929.AA28357@hpc.lut.ac.uk>
Date: Wed, 19 Aug 92 11:04:41 -0400
From: Bill Caloccia <caloccia@aperture.cac.stratus.com>
> Does anyone have any opinions on the effectiveness (or otherwise)
> of Free Wheel Hubs?
I may be wrong, but it seems that more often than not,
LR's in the states have free wheeling hubs. My mechanic advised running
with them disengaged while on the freeway -- Certainly you get better
fuel economy if you're just pushing the vehicle with two wheels, and not
dragging the front drive train also.
Just be sure to engage them often (once a week for a romp about
field or town) so that the front swivel pins spin and get their share of
lubrication.
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 20 06:17:29 1992 Return-Path: <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> From: Mike Rooth <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> Subject: Free Wheel Hubs To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Date: Thu, 20 Aug 92 12:15:10 BST Thanks,chaps,I think I'm convinced that a set of FWH would be an overall *good* thing. Actually,Rob,FWH's have always been an optoinal extra over here, and there are many Rovers running around without them.When I bought my Rover about four years ago,it had a sticker on the dash stating "Warning This vehcle has Free Wheeling Front Hubs".It hadnt. Somebody obviously had removed them,perhaps because they had bought another LR without them and wanted to transfer. The reason I asked the question was because the correspondence column in the aforementioned mag contained a letter from a LR Ltd employee stating they had done a test to see how much (or little) FWH's made. This consisted of pulling a (new?) Rover along by hand,once with the hubs engaged,and once without.He stated that the spring balance showed (if I remember rightly) only about 2lbs difference,and they concluded that the hubs werent worth the money.I never *really* went for this because I reckon;and this is just a "gut" reaction;that the resistance of the moving parts would increase a the speed went up. Maybe not.If anyone knows different,feel free! Once again thanks Regards, Mike
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 20 09:03:20 1992
Return-Path: <caloccia@aperture.cac.stratus.com>
To: Mike Rooth <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk>
Cc: lro@transfer.stratus.com, caloccia@aperture.cac.stratus.com
Subject: Re: Free Wheel Hubs
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 20 Aug 92 12:15:10 BST."
<9208201115.AA12536@hpc.lut.ac.uk>
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 92 09:57:23 -0400
From: Bill Caloccia <caloccia@aperture.cac.stratus.com>
> hubs engaged,and once without.He stated that the spring balance showed
> (if I remember rightly) only about 2lbs difference,and they concluded
Well, if you think about it, that 2# difference is mechanical
resistance (drag) added to your rolling friction. Every time you
you go to change speed, you end up having use more power to change
the momentum of all those extra spinning parts.
If you look at racing, they don't use heavy wheels, they use
light ones. Having the hubs engaged effectively adds to
the spinning mass connected to the wheels.
- Bill
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 20 11:10:15 1992 Return-Path: <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> From: Mike Rooth <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> Subject: FWH To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Date: Thu, 20 Aug 92 16:53:05 BST Yup,thanks Bill,I hadnt thought of that.One more thing,and then I'll shut up.In the current issue of LRO a firm is advertising a brand of hubs I havent seen before.The brand name is ORA,and the accompanying photo shows "U.S.PAT" on them.I take it from this they are American made.Price about $76 inc tax.Anyone know anything about them?They seem quite reasonably priced. Thanks Mike
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 20 12:08:48 1992 Return-Path: <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> From: Mike Rooth <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> Subject: FWH To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Date: Thu, 20 Aug 92 16:53:05 BST Yup,thanks Bill,I hadnt thought of that.One more thing,and then I'll shut up.In the current issue of LRO a firm is advertising a brand of hubs I havent seen before.The brand name is ORA,and the accompanying photo shows "U.S.PAT" on them.I take it from this they are American made.Price about $76 inc tax.Anyone know anything about them?They seem quite reasonably priced. Thanks Mike
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 21 06:44:59 1992 Return-Path: <stauffer@cc.swarthmore.edu> Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1992 07:42:51 -0500 To: lro@transfer.stratus.com From: Glenn Stauffer <stauffer@cc.swarthmore.edu> Subject: New Land Rovers for sale in the US! Did anyone catch the Land Rover ads, lately. I saw one this morning - caught the tail end actually - that advertised a Land Rover model that will be available for a limited time at select Range Rover dealers. Anybody know any details - like cost? --------------------------------------------------------------- | R. Glenn Stauffer <stauffer@cc.swarthmore.edu | | Swarthmore College Computing Center, Swarthmore PA 19081-1390 | | Tel: 215.328.8654 Fax: 215.328.8673 | | | ---------------------------------------------------------------
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 21 06:50:38 1992 Return-Path: <scrl@hplb.hpl.hp.com> To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Subject: Re: New Land Rovers... Date: Fri, 21 Aug 92 12:46:41 BST From: Simon Lewis <scrl@hplb.hpl.hp.com> Reports in the UK a few months ago indicated a cost of $40,000. Seems a bit high to me. Hell, that's nearly as much as they cost here for God's sake! (I'm only slightly joking. They're 19,000 pounds new, which at today's excahnge rate is $36,900). The model is a 3.5 litre V8 petrol 110 12 seater, fully macho-ised with external roll-cage, bull-bar, and all the trimmings. Simon.
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 21 09:27:15 1992
Return-Path: <caloccia@aperture.cac.stratus.com>
To: lro@transfer.stratus.com
Subject: Re: New Land Rovers...
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Fri, 21 Aug 92 12:46:41 BST."
<17739.714397601@slewis.hpl.hp.com>
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 92 10:24:46 -0400
From: Bill Caloccia <caloccia@aperture.cac.stratus.com>
_AutoWeek_ (two weeks ago ?) indicated that they would be unable to bring the
110's (etc.) as we know them in to the country after 1994, due to federal
safety regulations for sport/utility (?) vehicles which go into effect then.
Initial reports said that 500 were to be imported for '92-'93.
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 21 11:43:45 1992 Return-Path: <u10122%y1.sdsc.edu@Sdsc.Edu> Date: Fri, 21 Aug 92 16:40:21 GMT From: u10122%y1.sdsc.edu@Sdsc.Edu (dushin russell) To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Subject: another resto Since it's been quite awhile since I last posted a message on this net I think I will reintroduce myself and my hord of beasts. Born in the early years of LR imports as a son of two MG TC owners (mom's was an imported white one with a black interior, dad's as right hand drive black one with a red interior) I like to think I came to be with Girling Crimson in me blood and a lug wrench in me mouth. As the third in an expansive family that eventually topped out at seven, I undoubtedly prompted the 'rents to rethink their wheeling needs......the MG's were sold, a five-seater VW bug replaced them, and the family was off and growing. Their itch for the brit rigs continued, however, and the need for a solid utility vehicle to pull horse trailers and tow a manure spreader led them to consider the new imported from the motherland. At the Yorktown Grange Fair of '61 (held about an hour north of New York) they fell in love with a blue ser.II '88 soft top that had just made the trek that very morning from the floor of Grand Central Station where it had made its US debut. We still have some of the early ads/literature that was used for promos.....the slogan "At forty miles per hour all you will hear is the roar of the engine" was the line that rang true to their hearts.......they bought it on site, drove it home that night, and hence began the family affliction that continues today. That blue-II took a roll while towing a flatbed of wood and was sold as a wreck to a friend for real cheap. A green '67 IIA '88 replaced it and continues in operation-doing the same 'ol shit-towing, horse moving, hay-raking thing. It is the family workhorse and has provided years and years of fond memories for us all (perhaps I will write of some of them in the future....). Another '67 '88 was bought about a decade ago-it is a complete though frame-rotted resto project for the future (not the subject of this letter). A third LR-the subject of this letter-was purchased for a decent price just two months ago. It is a "semi-road-worthy" '60 series IIA '88 complete with fairey OD and warn hubs. She's puke green with a hardtop that lacks side windows, and still has that grotesque exhaust system that winds its way through the driver's side wheel well and thence to the rear. She also has a tailgate and lifting rear window, and she might just get herself a "haircut" and become a softtop someday soon. So far I've dont the following: Fixed the charging problem (brushes and reg- ulator), replaced all leaf springs (shocks are aftermarket, unfortunately, but seem ok), replaced the hub seals all around (brakes were recently done, but need either a good bleed or a master cylinder rebuild), and replaced the swivelpin housing seals. Now in the process of replacing the door trim and am about to tackle the stiff steering problem(s). The door trim job has turned out to be a bit more of a pain in the ass than expected.....mainly due to the fact that few of the holes in the new trim align well withe those drilled in Ike's day. Rover's North suggested drilling the body, but I am drilling the trim instead since I feel that the new holes may be too close to the old holes (some are only about 1/8" off) and I don't want to permanantly damage the body. Also, I now have this fear (now that one side is almost done) that my doors will no longer shut easily, if at all. I may have to do some adjusting of the door hinges, shim the out or something (any suggestions??). As for the steering, I suspect the relay unit and/or tie rod ends are at fault, and have secured all the necessary bits to do a disassembly-cleaning-seal replacement-lube-and reassembly job on the relay and spankin' new tie rod ends so's I can keep myself busy over the coming weekend.....or perhaps the coming month. Forgot to mention (and am unable to edit) that this '60 '88 came from the san diego area (don't be fooled by this email address-it is coming via ucsd but is accessed from work here on the east coast in the metro ny area). The frame is in decent shape-has traces of surface rust in a few spots but has about 95% of the original enamel still on it! I've looked and looked for rovers in these parts for years, but never found one at this price with such a good frame. this was, needless to say, one of the big selling points for me. This baby did many an hour on some guy's farm, changed hands twice, then ended up owned by a young guy who was navy-bound and absolutely had to get rid of it. He had crossed the country in it earlier this year so it has only seen a month or so of east coast salt......naturally one of the next things I intend to do is to clean up the questionable spots and spray her down with protectant (any suggestions??- I am leaning towards used 90 wt in kerosene 'cause I got lots of it and no placce else to put it!). I'd best be on my way since the clock still ticks and I've probably lost most of you by now, anyway. cheers all, rd
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 24 05:29:51 1992 Return-Path: <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> From: Mike Rooth <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> Subject: another resto To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Date: Mon, 24 Aug 92 11:27:40 BST Dushin, Sounds like you have a good one there!What I dont understand is how the door trim stops the door closing.Or do you mean door seals? Mind you,having said that,I must admit that I dont *have* any door trim,(makes hosing out the interior*much* easier:-).Mebbe the striker plate can be adjusted?Sounds like your chassis is worth cleaning up and painting with chassis black,and perhaps blowing some proprietory preservative into the box sections.Or maybe you dont suffer in the U.S like we do in the U.K,from idiots that spread salted grit on the roads at every opportunity:-) Regards Mike Rooth
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 25 01:26:51 1992 Return-Path: <@mail.uunet.ca:aficom!fourfold!dixon@micor> To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Subject: Replacement for 90wt From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner) Date: Mon, 24 Aug 1992 23:10:03 -0400 Organization: FourFold Symmetry, Breckenridge, Quebec Mike Rooth <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> writes: > I have looked in my (geniune) "Repair Operation Manual" and it > says that the recommended lubricants are for temperate climates > only.Yours isnt.
From what I have seen, I really can't lose trying out the AMSOIL type lubricant in the diffs and gearbox. Oh well, something else to change, though I had intended to anyway. > The current issue of LRO has an article about British Army Training > Unit Suffield who run S111's in Canada (in winter,too).Dont know > whether its a stupid suggestion,but if you could locate their > phone number? I understand that they just renewed their lease for another ten years... :-) If we are lucky that may mean abnother bunch of military light weights to go on the block. They did get in a lot of trouble for last years sale, as the vehicles are *NOT* supposed to be driven on the road. (Lovely Ministry of Transport eh? Spoil sports) Of course, from what I understand, the LBC Timemachines <tm> are in operation, so don't be surprised if some Series IIA looks a little funny... <g> As for my little beastie, I spent a lovely Sunday digging out a trailer from fifteen years of growth and getting it ready to support a particular 2.25L engine south of here. On a more annoying note, after several months of waiting my reservoir to clutch master cylinder pipe finally arrived, apparently straight from the factory. The damn thing is straight as an arrow and about a foot long! I went and ordered the real thing because I didn't even have an original in the first place. Now I have this nice piece of pipe, at least four inches too long, nothing to bend it with, and not a clue to what shape it should be. <grrr...> Rgds, from Ottawa (It snowed in Edmonton a couple of days ago, love the weather this summer... :-)) Dixon -- dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca FourFold Symmetry, Breckenridge, Quebec, Canada
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 25 06:03:58 1992 Return-Path: <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> From: Mike Rooth <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> Subject: Replacement for 90wt To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Date: Tue, 25 Aug 92 11:59:11 BST Dixon, Hey,youve lost me:-) What;or who;is LBC Timemachine <tm>? Mike (IN the UK where its raining...so whats new?)
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 25 09:31:47 1992
Return-Path: <moore@fslg8.fsl.noaa.gov>
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 92 14:24:56 GMT
From: moore@profsc.fsl.noaa.gov (Mark Moore MOORE@FSL.NOAA.GOV)
To: lro@transfer.stratus.com
Subject: Valve seats
>> a particular 2.25L engine south of here. On a more annoying note,
>> after several months of waiting my reservoir to clutch master cylinder
>> pipe finally arrived, apparently straight from the factory. The damn
>> thing is straight as an arrow and about a foot long! I went and ordered
>> the real thing because I didn't even have an original in the first place.
>> Now I have this nice piece of pipe, at least four inches too long,
>> nothing to bend it with, and not a clue to what shape it should be.
>> <grrr...>
I managed to refit all of the lines on my truck with a hacksaw and
flaring tool courtesy of Sears, Roebuck, and CO. Bending was
accomplished by wrapping around various radius tool handels (including
hammers, a shovel, and the canopy frame on the bed of the truck :-).
As for my own question...
The head for the truck went into the machine shop yesterday. I chose to
go with the hard valve seats so that I could run unleaded fuel. Any
thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Cheers.
Mark
--0-
moore@fsl.noaa.gov
NOAA - Boulder, CO USA
1961 109" Landrover Pickup
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 25 11:03:40 1992 Return-Path: <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> From: Mike Rooth <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> Subject: Valve Seats To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Date: Tue, 25 Aug 92 17:02:24 BST Mark, Sounds like a good idea.A good many people over here are having their heads (as in cylinder) modified with hardened seat inserts for the same reason.Mind you,with leaded at the equivalent of $5.20 a gallon a saving of about $1.20 per gallon is worth having.I suspect the environmental considerations come a long way second.:-) I must admit that I havent got that problem,being a 2.25 diesel owner but I *am* paying $4.00 a gallon:-( I havent heard of any problems arising from the coversion. Cheers Mike Rooth (1971 2.25 88" Diesel Hardtop)
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 25 13:21:49 1992 Return-Path: <twakeman@apple.com> Date: Tue, 25 Aug 92 10:20:31 -0700 From: Teriann J. Wakeman <twakeman@apple.com> To: M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk, lro@transfer.stratus.com Subject: Re: Replacement for 90wt Mike, Dixon is also on the British car mail list. On that list, LBC normally means Little British Car, But those of us with such things as Land Rovers look at it as being Large British Cars. I suspect Dixon was suggesting that some individuals might concevibly place IIA commision plates on the EX-military machines to make them older Land Rovers for registration purposes. Dixon, What is the condition of the rest of the 109 doner Rover? Any good parts at a reasionable price?? Any unusual parts?? TeriAnn
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 26 00:47:59 1992 Return-Path: <@mail.uunet.ca:aficom!fourfold!dixon@micor> To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Subject: Re: Replacement for 90wt From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner) Date: Tue, 25 Aug 1992 23:37:05 -0400 Organization: FourFold Symmetry, Breckenridge, Quebec <car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com> writes: > Mike, > I suspect Dixon was suggesting that some individuals might concevibly place > IIA commision plates on the EX-military machines to make them older > Land Rovers for registration purposes. :-) > Dixon, What is the condition of the rest of the 109 doner Rover? Any good > parts at a reasionable price?? Any unusual parts?? It is just a standard 109" station waggon. The frame is finished. Completely rotten. There were 2x4's stuck in the front part of the frame to help hold the bumper on. (Since gone). The wheels have been exchanged for the smaller 88" wheels recently. The bulkhead was not in very good condition, and is in worse since I took a torch to parts of it to remove the two front wings in one piece. The bolts holding it on were completely frozen/rusted. (The wings are slightly dented) The front roof is gone, given its life to become a trailer top from what I understand. The body seems to be complete. The brakes are going to a 109" pick-up parked nearby which is to be sold to whomever wishes it. Considering that the engine is in good condition (I'm taking the engine and related bits), the gearbox should be in good shape, as well as the rest of the drive train. As for prices on other bits, I'd have to ask. Anything you are interested in? Some of his prices are reasonable. I can get a 1275cc engine for my Mini from him for C$100, though condition is unknown. The contents of the engine compartment with working engine is going to set me back C$500 (approx US$400). Slightly cheaper than rebuilding my engine at this point, and I'll now have a spare. Rgds, Dixon -- dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca FourFold Symmetry, Breckenridge, Quebec, Canada
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 26 00:52:47 1992
Return-Path: <@mail.uunet.ca:aficom!fourfold!dixon@micor>
To: lro@transfer.stratus.com
Subject: Replacement for 90wt
From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner)
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 1992 23:21:37 -0400
Organization: FourFold Symmetry, Breckenridge, Quebec
Mike Rooth <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> writes:
> Dixon,
> Hey,youve lost me:-)
> What;or who;is LBC Timemachine <tm>?
> Mike (IN the UK where its raining...so whats new?)
AN LBC Timemachine is a marvelous device for those living in areas that have
slightly oppressive motor vehicle safety laws. <1> It consists of a black box
whereupon a nice newly restored vehicle is placed into the machine, a few
magic incantations said with the holy screwdriver, riveter etc. and your
old, rusty, *licensed* vehicle is suddenly all better. It also works wonders
on those LBC that are missing their papers, while the numbers and registration
for a another happen to be conviently available. The general usage that I
am familiar with is to "put your LBC through the timemachine"
The types in the MoT don't like this habit and they generally term it moving
the serial numbers from one vehicle to another.
Rgds,
Dixon
(where it is now 30c with thunder storms...)
1. A good case in point was the "fight" I had with Quebec's Ministry of
Transport when I went to get my Mini licensed. An example should
suffice, and it got worse from here. The Mini has some drain
openings at the bottom of the sills to allow moisture/water to escape
so they do not rot out as fast as they are wont to do. The sills
were new & from the factory. I even had photo's and factory manuals
to prove that they were supposed to be there. Would they pass it with
these holes there? No way. They made me fill them in with tar (which
later fell out rather quickly).
--
dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca
FourFold Symmetry, Breckenridge, Quebec, Canada
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 26 00:57:11 1992 Return-Path: <@mail.uunet.ca:aficom!fourfold!dixon@micor> To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Subject: Valve seats From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner) Date: Tue, 25 Aug 1992 23:25:06 -0400 Organization: FourFold Symmetry, Breckenridge, Quebec moore@profsc.fsl.noaa.gov (Mark Moore MOORE@FSL.NOAA.GOV) writes: > As for my own question... > > The head for the truck went into the machine shop yesterday. I chose to > go with the hard valve seats so that I could run unleaded fuel. Any > thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated. Anytime you are going to have an old head off for some work you might as well have this done. It doesn't cost that much, and some cheap unleaded gas will cause the valves to receed into the head over time. When I get the transplant done, the head off of the dead engine is going to get this treatment. Rgds, -- dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca FourFold Symmetry, Breckenridge, Quebec, Canada
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 26 10:39:32 1992 Return-Path: <twakeman@apple.com> Date: Wed, 26 Aug 92 08:36:33 -0700 From: Teriann J. Wakeman <twakeman@apple.com> To: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca, lro@transfer.stratus.com Subject: Re: Replacement for 90wt If the differentials are in good shape I may be interested in purchasing one or both. What condition are the front seats in? What colour are they? I do not remember if you mentioned the year of the donor car. I could also be interested in windscreen wiper motors. The sheet metal ducting on the part of my heater that fits inside the LR has seen much better days. The ductwork on mine is essentually a rectangular duct that comes out from the bulkhead and curves around so that the opening faces the driver. There are two round sleaves on top to fit the demisters, a small door on the side to provide heat to the passanger. If the donor LR is fitted with that kind of duct (would have the big heater of course) and it is in good shape, I would be extreamly interested. You might consider fitting the rear petrol tank to your 109 sometime in the future. Also, I am looking for a complete good condition Solex carburetor. And since I will need to rebuld the engine before too many more miles, I could be interested in a head and rocker arm assembly so I can start the process without taking the LR off the road. TeriAnn '60 Series II 109 Pickup originally from Eastern Canada
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 26 11:08:11 1992 Return-Path: <twakeman@apple.com> Date: Wed, 26 Aug 92 08:36:33 -0700 From: Teriann J. Wakeman <twakeman@apple.com> To: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca, lro@transfer.stratus.com Subject: Re: Replacement for 90wt If the differentials are in good shape I may be interested in purchasing one or both. What condition are the front seats in? What colour are they? I do not remember if you mentioned the year of the donor car. I could also be interested in windscreen wiper motors. The sheet metal ducting on the part of my heater that fits inside the LR has seen much better days. The ductwork on mine is essentually a rectangular duct that comes out from the bulkhead and curves around so that the opening faces the driver. There are two round sleaves on top to fit the demisters, a small door on the side to provide heat to the passanger. If the donor LR is fitted with that kind of duct (would have the big heater of course) and it is in good shape, I would be extreamly interested. You might consider fitting the rear petrol tank to your 109 sometime in the future. Also, I am looking for a complete good condition Solex carburetor. And since I will need to rebuld the engine before too many more miles, I could be interested in a head and rocker arm assembly so I can start the process without taking the LR off the road. TeriAnn '60 Series II 109 Pickup originally from Eastern Canada
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 26 17:01:41 1992 Return-Path: <u10122%y1.sdsc.edu@Sdsc.Edu> Date: Wed, 26 Aug 92 21:59:07 GMT From: u10122%y1.sdsc.edu@Sdsc.Edu (dushin russell) To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Subject: follow-up. Mike, I meant door seals (not trim). Upon completion of the job the doors did not, alas, do the close-thing smoothly. I did eventually find that the striker plate was adjustable (oh yeah.....gee, I remember adjusting these once before in order to get a bent door on the farm-rig to close once again....then I was able to hold a beer in one hand while raking the hayfield instead of having to wait until the job was done to satisfy my thirst...)-but even with the adjustmetn they are both tough to close. They are, however, improving with time (as the rubber gets used to being scrunched) and I do feel that eventually they will operate normally. Yes we do suffer the wrath of the salt tossers here in the northeastern US. I will soon drench my members (frame members, that is) in proprietary oils. But hey, now I have a new problem. This past weekend I began to work on my stiff steering problem. Jacked her up, threw her on blocks, disco'd the steer- ing relay from below-at the bottom steering relay arm, verified that the wheels could be steered freely and that the stiffness was due to either the relay or the steering box, disco'd the top relay arm, and am now convinced that the majority of the stiffness occurs in the box. Certainly, some of the stiffness is a result of an old encrusted relay.....it shows signs of leakage and didn't turn too freely (a relative term), but I think my box is the source of my real problem. Additional evidence of this was found upon removal of the filler plug.......a small stick was inserted into the gook within and in sunlight (the sun does shine here on most days) took-on the appearance of US army green metalflake paint......ie lotsa little bits in there. I do believe I am in need of a good cleaning, inspection, possibly some new bits, and reass'y. Since I have some other things to attend to in that general area (eg exhaust manifold leaks, got a frozen bolt that should be holding my generator in, still want to replace the seals in my relay, etc) that will require removal of my radiator and maybe my left wing I am considering attacking it all at once so as to make my life easier (esp the removal of the drop arm for the steering link- age). Any suggestions for the least-masochistic method for a steering box removal???..........perhaps not, since you've beeen blessed with a steering box that does not rub-up against your exhaust manifold (I knew there was some reason why driving on the r/h side of the road has its advantages!). thanks, russell a fleet of 88's
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 27 01:01:21 1992
Return-Path: <@mail.uunet.ca:aficom!fourfold!dixon@micor>
To: lro@transfer.stratus.com
Subject: Re: Replacement for 90wt
From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner)
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 1992 22:21:56 -0400
Organization: FourFold Symmetry, Breckenridge, Quebec
<car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com> writes:
> If the differentials are in good shape I may be interested in purchasing
> one or both.
<Ack!> I'll ask about them. When I made the original deal on the engine
I asked about taking other pieces off of it. The indication I got was
if the 109" pick-up didn't nead it, I could probably take it, though I
have to ask. Getting them off and shipping them is another problem.
When he has the pick-up ready to sell I'll post a message here. He has
offered me a 1970? Range Rover (serial number 113), but I don't have the
$$$ to afford it currently. When I do... :-) I understand that the first
55 Range Rovers were destroyed in testing, so this one should be pretty
near to being the oldest around. It was apparently the first one ever
brought into North America before they were banned for various reasons.
> What condition are the front seats in? What colour are they?
The seats look to be in fairly good shape. As for the colour, they are grey.
he LR is beige in colour.
> I do not remember if you mentioned the year of the donor car.
Late '70s I believe. It is a Series IIA.
> You might consider fitting the rear petrol tank to your 109 sometime in the
> future.
I am going to try and get as much off of the LR, whether I need the parts
or not. Step one is to get them off and into safety in my garage before
someone else decides that they want them.
> Also, I am looking for a complete good condition Solex carburetor. And since
> I will need to rebuld the engine before too many more miles, I could be
> interested in a head and rocker arm assembly so I can start the process witho
> taking the LR off the road.
The Solex seems to be a general problem. The original one that I have is in
need of a rebuild and the rebuild kits are non-existent. The one on the donor
LR works so I'll be using that one. I am hoping, as the donor engine runs,
to be able to do a straight transplant and get mine finally on the road. It
has been a long time coming...
I will have to get ahold of the local LR club. There are some 72 of them
in the Ottawa area in all shapes and forms, so there must be a ton of
parts kicking about. I have tried to interest them in this forum, but
InterNet access is very difficult up here and my system is long distance to
most members.
Rgds,
Dixon
1964 109" Station Waggon
BTW, An article in my latest OVLR newletter quotes Rover as saying that all
500 Defenders coming over are spoken for, 25 of them are coming to
Canada and they are trying to keep the price *under* C$56,000! If
this nonsense keeps up, it will drive up the price of the old wrecks
that we rely on for spare parts and drive up the value of ours making
it difficult to have more than one... :-( Let the yuppies have
Suzuki's and Jeeps.
--
dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca
FourFold Symmetry, Breckenridge, Quebec, Canada
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 27 04:53:52 1992 Return-Path: <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> From: Mike Rooth <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> Subject: follow up. To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Date: Thu, 27 Aug 92 10:53:00 BST Dushin, You could always try a little Vaseline (petroleum jelly)on the door seals where the latch crunches the rubber.Dont think it hurts rubber.Might get a bit greasy though.... Dont you mean *left* hand side of the road?It has other advantages, such as being able to mount your horse without getting run over,or your sword getting in the way.....:-)Now *everbody*really needs to do that! Frankly,just to make you feel better,I'm dreading having to do anything with the steering box.If it was me,Iwould try and get the grunge out via the oil hole,and replace with fresh oil and molybdenum disulphide, or some such,or wash the thig out with paraffin (kerosene),and put new oil in.Anything to avoid taking it off! Cheers Mike (88" that lets wet in...they *all* do that!)
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 27 05:01:59 1992 Return-Path: <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> From: Mike Rooth <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> Subject: 90wt To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Date: Thu, 27 Aug 92 11:01:12 BST Dixon Just a point to clarify,11A's were not made after Oct '71 (mine is Mar 71),so the donor vehicle cant be any younger than that. Cheers, Mike
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 27 09:07:40 1992
Return-Path: <caloccia@aperture.cac.stratus.com>
To: lro@transfer.stratus.com
Subject: Re: follow up.
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 27 Aug 92 10:53:00 BST."
<9208270953.AA10583@hpc.lut.ac.uk>
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 92 10:03:54 -0400
From: Bill Caloccia <caloccia@aperture.cac.stratus.com>
> You could always try a little Vaseline (petroleum jelly)on the
> door seals where the latch crunches the rubber.Dont think it
> hurts rubber.Might get a bit greasy though....
Most spec's I have seen recommend silicone based grease, for door
seals and you can usually get away with silicone spray lubricant, just be sure
to miss your paint work.
- Bill
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 27 12:05:35 1992
Return-Path: <mvgrie@mtcamm.monsanto.com>
From: Mark V Grieshaber <mvgrie@mtcamm.monsanto.com>
Subject: Help for a neophyte...
To: land-rover-owner@transfer.stratus.com
Date: Thu, 27 Aug 92 12:00:26 CDT
Hello All:
I inspected a 1960 88" last weekend for possible purchase, and realized
pretty quickly that I don't know beans about Land Rovers. I need some
pointers to information and suggestions on a couple of things before I
make some significant mistake.
I have Teriann Wakeman's lovely article on Land Rovers (thanks Teriann!),
but I still have some questions. I have admired Land Rovers for a long
time, and would like to remedy the Land Rover-less situation here.
Here are some pretty basic questions (don't laugh) (quotes are from Teriann's
article):
> Land Rovers have an aluminum body with a
> steel frame, firewall and front (holds radiator).
Are there steel members inside the doors? How about in the walls
of the body? Or is *everything* other than frame, firewall and
front all aluminum?
> There were three series of both models imported, series I (pre '58 hard to get
> parts for (short wheelbase series I seen in "The Gods Must be crazy)), Series
> II ('58-60), Series IIA ('61-'69 or '70 (earlier ones have headlights inside
> wings, later ones have headlamps on wings)), and Series III. Most people
> prefer the IIA to the series III
Ok, I must have looked at a series II (1960, right? - the owner
said it was a series IIA - could he be right?) It had headlights
inside the wings (fenders), not on them. Did the headlight placement
change between series II and IIA, or between earlier and later models
of the IIA series? Why do most people prefer IIA to III? What
advantages do they have?
> Since Land Rovers are still in production, you can still get genuine factory
> parts :*) I get mine mail-order from New hampshire. If I am willing to pay
> overnight, I can get any part for the Land Rover new or used, next day.
This refers to original factory parts, correct? Are parts for all
series essentially interchangeable, or is the factory still making
replacement parts for all models, or what? Are factory parts the
only ones available? Are they distinctly better than aftermarket
parts, or are there no aftermarket parts available? Or is the thought
of an aftermarket part heresy? :) That said, where do you go to
get parts? The local Range Rover dealer? Phone numbers, addresses,
etc, would be very helpful. Who puts out catalogs? Are there any
newsletters available from parts houses? I've seen some mentions of
a LRO magazine - can anybody supply me with full name and address and
phone number - is it any good? Are there other magazines that
might be helpful to me in my quest for understanding?
> Land Rovers have more charisma in its lug nuts than most cars have in their
> whole body.
Amen!
> There are 3 engines available for these cars:
> - 4 cylinder petrol. This engine is seriously overbuilt. ...
> Compression is low so it runs on just about any type of petrol. It has
> a single downdraft carb, circular intake ports, roller cam, 20 Amp
> generator. The engine gets about 15 to 18 MPG and runs smoothly under
> load below 1000RPM.
> - A disel version of the 4 banger.
> - An 'L'head 6 that came in a few LRs (mainly 109s). This is a heavy low HP
> antique. Parts are relatively hard to get.
Sounds like the 4 cylinder petrol is the best bet. How does the
diesel version rate? Any idea of relative populations of these engines?
Did I hear that original carb rebuild kits are not available? How
does this fit with the availability of other parts mentioned above?
What is the situation with replacement carburettors? Alternator
conversions? Any other common conversions/modifications?
> There are basically 2 versions of transmissions. The series II and Series III.
> - The series II transmission does not have syncro in first (granny) or second
> gears.
> - The series III transmission is considered not to be quite as strong as the
> series II box but has syncro in all forward gears.
Is the II and III here refering to the transmissions that were fitted
to the series II and III Land Rover, or only to the transmission model?
In other words, do all Series III Land Rovers have Series III
transmissions, or might you find a Series III transmission originally
installed in a Series II Land Rover? The owner of the 1960 I looked
at insisted that it had synchro in all forward gears, but the second
gear synchro was not working; would this have meant that it had a
series III transmission on a series II (or IIA) vehicle?
> - When you test drive the car use all gears as well as high and low range. It
> should be quitest in fourth gear. In pre- series III, DO NOT downshift
> below third gear while moving. There is no syncro there & the owner may be
> very unhappy if you were to take off a tooth or two. Be sure to try all 8
> gear ratios forward and both reverse ratios. If you have a overdrive thats
> 16 forward & 4 reverse! The transfer case should smoothly go into & out of
> 4 wheel drive.
Ok, time for a dumb question. I have absolutely no experience driving
a fourwheel drive anything. All of my vehicles are manual transmission,
so that has never been a problem. That said, I've never found that my
ignorance has prevented me from *learning*. Help me figure out what
goes on here! Anybody willing to give me a basic primer on how to
drive a four wheel drive vehicle? Including how overdrive fits in?
Basic questions would include: How do the front and rear coordinate?
Do you shift front and back independently, or simultaneously? How do
you shift if you do it independently? Can you list the gear
combinations that yield all mentioned ratios? Are there any
combinations you don't use? What combinations are used when? Hey,
I can figure out a two wheel drive four speed with no problem - let's
extrapolate from that. "Transfer case" - definition? I think I know
what it does, but please tell me anyhow. How do I detect whether the
optional overdrive is present? (Is it a button, a switch, a plunger,
what? And where is it located?) Pretty basic questions, hmm? Nobody
I know has a four wheel drive vehicle, so I don't have anyway to figure
this out easily locally.
> - When trying out the 4 wheel drive, make sure the front wheels are locked.
> If you turn the wheel while in 4WD and on dry pavement, expect to feel the
> steering wheel wobble a bit. This is normal under these conditions & does
> not happen on icy roads or off road. If you do not feel a wobble in the
> steering wheel while making a tight turn on dry pavement in 4WD, there is
> something wrong or you are not really in 4WD with the front hubs locked.
Do all Land Rovers have lockable front hubs? I was under the impression
that some were full time four wheel drive, no option about it. How
does one distinguish? How do you lock the front wheels? What makes
it wobble a bit on dry pavement?
> LAND ROVER EXTRAS:
> - A tropical roof with air vents and upper windows is highly desirable.
> Add 2-3 hundred dollars to value.
> - Add $500 for good condition overdrive.
> - Add $700 to $1000 for Positraction differentials.
> - Subtract $500 if car has LR six engine
> - Factory manuals are desirable.
How common are the tropical roofs? How common is overdrive?
Positraction differentials were a factory option? How common were
they? How can I tell when inspecting a Land Rover if it has them?
Wow! The LR six is that bad? Like *really* worse than the four?
Factory manuals sound great - how do I get them? If LR is still
cranking out parts, can I get brand new factory manuals? If not,
does anyone have a spare set they would like to sell to me?
> VALUE:
> - Since Land Rovers are not common and have not been imported for a long time,
> many people have no idea what they are worth. Just as a guess, I would say:
> Doormobile $10K, 109 2 door $6K, 88 $4K, 109 four door $3K
> - These are for good condition runners that are essentially stock. If you
> look about you may find a fixer up in a field for considerably less.
> Bargains can be had from people who have no idea what they are worth.
> Excellent condition cars may command up to twice the above values.
> Ex-military Land Rovers command a higher price.
Is this still reasonably accurate information? Anybody have any
additional data to add here about prices? I can certainly second the
notion that they are uncommon in the St. Louis Missouri area. I've
only *seen* three in the past ten years. Does it sound like I might
have to buy one from much further away? The 88" I looked at on
Sunday had a totally rusted away frame - it was no longer safe to
drive since the suspension attach points for the springs, etc were
90% gone... Overall condition was really bad, and very nonoriginal.
One front swivel was badly pitted (other was good), heater was gone
and a handbuilt replacement cobbled in, radiator was shot, firewall
was rusted through, much bondo, bad seats - a thoroughly abused
vehicle. The owner wanted $2500USD for it, which I thought ridiculous.
Confirmation?
As may be obvious :) I know almost nothing about Land Rovers, other than that
I want one. If anyone could help me with some of these really basic questions,
I would be very appreciative. If these are too basic for everyone on the
list, feel free to email me rather than post on the list if you want, though
there might be others like me that could benefit from some of these...
Thanks much!
Mark Grieshaber
mvgrie@mtcamm.monsanto.com
From mtcamm!gridley@snow.water.ca.gov Thu Aug 27 12:31:48 1992 To: mvgrie@mtcamm.monsanto.com Cc: land-rover-owner@transfer.stratus.com In-Reply-To: Mark V Grieshaber's message of Thu, 27 Aug 92 12:00:26 CDT <9208271700.AA03275@mtcamm.monsanto.com> Subject: Help for a neophyte... Date: Thu, 27 Aug 92 10:22:16 PDT From: gridley@snow.water.ca.gov Sender: gridley@snow.water.ca.gov
Source-Info: From (or Sender) name not authenticated. In your post you mentioned an article by Teriann Wakeman. Might you have a copy you could e-mail to me or pointers on where I could get a copy. Thanks Frank Gehrke California Cooperative Snow Surveys Program P.O. Box 942836 Sacramento, CA 94236-0001 916-653-8255
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 27 12:34:51 1992 Return-Path: <gridley@snow.water.ca.gov> To: mvgrie@mtcamm.monsanto.com Cc: land-rover-owner@transfer.stratus.com In-Reply-To: Mark V Grieshaber's message of Thu, 27 Aug 92 12:00:26 CDT <9208271700.AA03275@mtcamm.monsanto.com> Subject: Help for a neophyte... Date: Thu, 27 Aug 92 10:22:16 PDT From: gridley@snow.water.ca.gov Sender: gridley@snow.water.ca.gov
Source-Info: From (or Sender) name not authenticated. In your post you mentioned an article by Teriann Wakeman. Might you have a copy you could e-mail to me or pointers on where I could get a copy. Thanks Frank Gehrke California Cooperative Snow Surveys Program P.O. Box 942836 Sacramento, CA 94236-0001 916-653-8255
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 27 17:50:55 1992 Return-Path: <u10122%y1.sdsc.edu@Sdsc.Edu> Date: Thu, 27 Aug 92 22:48:24 GMT From: u10122%y1.sdsc.edu@Sdsc.Edu (dushin russell) To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Subject: meetoo Please be so kind as to place me on this newsgroup. As it stands right now I have to log into my brother's machine from afar to read all the good stuff that comes and goes through your diskspace. Thanks much, Russell Dushin eightyeightenit.
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 28 05:20:04 1992 Return-Path: <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> From: Mike Rooth <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> Subject: Help for a neophyte To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Date: Fri, 28 Aug 92 11:18:18 BST Mark, Phew!Pretty tall order!Still,here goes with my two pennorth. First of all,I had better point out I,m English and Solihull is only about forty miles from here,so spares availability in the US I'm not able to comment on. The doors have an alloy skin and steel frames.They are in two halves top and bottom.Replacement door tops over here are alloy,but originals are steel(I have one of each).The bonnet(hood) is likewise,alloy with steel frame.The rest of the body is alloy held together by external galvanised steel "brackets". Headlight placement changed without reference to model,first for the American dollar area,then for the home market.About mid/late sixties I *think* but am not certain.11A or 111,you pays your money and takes your choice! The S111 came out in Oct '71,as a "civilised" LR.It featured several changes.Front to back,plastic rad grille instead of steel mesh, (loud moans from the Aussies who used the mesh grille as a BBQ),separate hydraulic master cyls for brake and clutch,revised clutch for lighter pedal pressure,fresh air heater(round air intake on left wing in UK,dont know about US) all synchro gearbox,revised dashboard with instuments in front of driver,better seats.Oh,and a stronger back axle,also wheel studs and nuts the same on 88" and 109",the nuts are 1 and1/8 or 27mm,but you will find this on late 11A's (such as mine).The 11A gearbox is held to be stronger than the 111,but it is possible that the real reason is that you can abuse the later box without it complaing audibly.Try that on the old box and it makes"get your hand OFF that lever" noises. Leaving out the S1,many parts are interchangeable.Engines,gearboxes,axles 9(but be careful there).Every LR should have a plate inside the cab telling you the chassis(frame)number,the wheebase and model number11,11A,111,etc. LRO magazine,yep,I take it myself adrress;- LRO Publications Ltd, The Hollies, Botesdale,Diss, Norfolk IP22 1BZ England. Annual subscription US and Canada(air) 35 pounds (abt $70) Tel 0379 890056 Fax 0379 898244 Teriann is not *quite* right about the engines(sorry teriann it is a bit of a nitpick I know,but explains why the 2.25 petrol is so strong) The 2.25 diesel was developed from the 2.00 diesel which was introduced to satisfy a demand for a diesel LR from fleet owner that ran diesel vehicles.Up till then the only engine was a 2.00 petrol.the 2.25 petrol was then developed from the diesel,since the 2.00 petrol was a bit long in the tooth by then.It also allowed some prts commonality. Since the diesel compression ratio is 23:1,you can see why the petrol version is so strong. Right,I've got an 88"S11A diesel2.25.Built Mar '71.Now ,I like it,but I wouldnt recommend it for long trips.It is noisy and not as powerful as the petrol.Its fuel consumption is better 23mpg,but bear in mind that we pay around $5 per gellon for fuel.The 2.6 is a DOG,Flame if you like people,but I reckon it has nothing going for it. The LR you looked at probably *did* have the S11 box,but the seller didnt know about the lack of syncro.With this box to change from bottom to second,or third to second you have to double de-clutch.Gets simple after a bit of practice!:-) Only the "modern"coil sprung LR's are full time 4WD(and the Range Rover) The others have the option.On the road,use 2WD as a normal car.To engage 4WD in high range,push the yellow knob down.To get back into 2WD,pull the Red lever fully back,and then push fully forward.To engage low range (low box),pull the Red lever back.You are then in low box 4WD. Note there is no low box 2WD.To return to high box 2WD push the Red lever forward.To use 4WD on the road will cause spring wind up and rapidly wear the tyres.2WD is on the back axle,4WD engages the front axle. Permanent 4WD vehicles have a differential in the driveline to enable the two axles to rotate at slightly different speeds. Hope this helps a bit.I've a couple of books at home on the history of the Land Rover,I'll make a note of their ISBN's and let you have them later. Best of luck, Mike Rooth
From mtcamm!M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk Fri Aug 28 08:39:41 1992 From: Mike Rooth <M.J.Rooth@lut.ac.uk> Subject: neophyte To: mvgrie@mtcamm.monsanto.com Date: Fri, 28 Aug 92 14:40:02 BST Status: RO Mark, Here are the book titles I promised. Land Rover The Unbeatable 4by4 Authors:- K&j Slavin and G.N.Mackie Pub Haynes Pub Inc 861 Lawrence Drive Cal 91320 USA ISBN 0-85429-721-9 --------------------- The Range Rover/Land Rover Author Graham Robson Publisher David&Charles Inc North Pomfret Vermont 05053 ISBN 0-7153-8786-3 he Range Igore that little glitch above Workshop Manual S11 and S11A Part One (covers engines clutches and gearboxes) Part no 606407 Part Two (the rest) Part no 606408 This has no ISBN since it was published by Rovers,the part no being a spares no.The two volumes are expensive,currently about $80 for the pair,but they are GOOD! They are available from the LRO Bookshop (you have that address)and having just looked it up they are now about $94 the pair.They cover the period 1958-1970. There is also a new book out by Lindsay Porter called "Land Rover:Guide to Purchase and DIY Restoration" published by Haynes,price $34 ISBN I dont know.(I cant afford one at present:-().As soon as I can,I will though. Actually,this one may be your best bet,thinking about it,the first two books listed are very good reading,Ken Slavin's particularly because the co-author Gordon Mackie worked for Land Rover and was in charge of Special Vehicle Operations.LRO is a good mag,and Porters book should give you some idea of what to look for when buying. The Workshop manual is an essential tool,IMO,but can come later if necessary. Best of Luck Mike Rooth
From mtcamm!twakeman@apple.com Fri Aug 28 12:44:18 1992 Date: Fri, 28 Aug 92 10:44:28 -0700 From: Teriann J. Wakeman <twakeman@apple.com> To: land-rover-owner@transfer.stratus.com, mvgrie@mtcamm.monsanto.com Subject: Re: Help for a neophyte... Mark, First of all, asking 2.5K for a pile of used landrover parts is a tad bit expensive. You can purchase a new galvanized frame for about 2.4K. You can purchase the lower parts of the firewall for a little over $100. I think I have recently seen new complete firewalls in a catalogue for about $1K. Swivil Balls are in the $250-300ish catagory. Sounds like what you would have to do is purchase a new frame & firewall (approx $3.5K) then move the parts over to the new frame. Of course if you go to that trouble, you will want to replace everything that is worn out. By the time you were finished, you would probably put $7-8K into new parts plus the price of painting the LR. You would have a LR that would be close to new & a whole lot cheaper than the 110 Defender they are importing for $50K or so. The project would take most of your weekends for probably more than a year (I'm going through something similar on my TR3 right now). Unless you pay a Land Rover mechanic $$$$ to build a new Land Rover for you, it is a HUGE job. A Land Rover in poor condition is no fun and a constant source of agravation. There is no way you are going to get a LR with a rusted away frame & bulkhead sorry, firewall, into condition where it would be enjoyable without replacing them. On the other hand there is nothing like one. My 109 is my second LR and I have had it for 14 years now, and have no plans for surplusing it. I would suggest that if you are going to purchase a Land Rover, ether purchase the best on you could afford, or look for a donnor car with body parts in good condition and expect to spend the time & $$$$$ to build a new Land Rover (still much cheaper than purchasing a new one). Now lets see If I remember your questions: WWhy do people generally prefer series IIA to III? The III has a number of plastic parts, including a plastic grill that detract from the look & feel of a Land Rover. The II has this huge padded instrument pannel that looks (to my eye) ugly and it lowers the amount of air that you get from the cowel vents. The Transfer case: physically it sits to the right of the transmission and slightly lower. It has two jobs. One it is a two gear transmission that fits on the output of the transmission. In hi range, it doesn't do anything. It just allows the output of your transmission to go to the drive shaft(s). In low range, you pass the output from the transmission through a big reduction gear before it goes to the drive shaft(s). The purpose of Low Range is to allow you to have a range of gears (high reving of Hp & torque) at very low speeds (off road drivingover rocks up & down hills etc). The Transfer case also has a second job (thats why there are two levers). It can either transmitt the output from the transmission to the rear drive shaft only or to both the front and rear drive shaft (4 WD). Now, if you have the transfer case in 2WD high range, it acts like a regular big car. Put it in 2WD low range, it acts like a regular big car with a 4 speed transmission and a top speed of about 25MPH. Put the transfer case in high range 4WD and it acts like a regular big car with a couple of exceptions: 1. the front steering tends to kick very slightly while making turns in dry pavement (I think this has to do with the front swivils but I am not shure), and 2. The LR is a lot more stable on lose ground or ice & snow. With the transfer case in 4WD low range you have this added traction and a top speed of about 25 MPH. Overdrives: Overdrives for the Landrovers are mechanicl beasties bolted to the back of the transmission. They are really yet another 2 gear transmission that fits between the transmission and the transfer case (4 gears in transmission to 2 gears in the overdrive to 2 gears in the transfer case to one or both drive shafts.. whew). There is a shift lever that comes from the OD unit through the front of the seat box. If a LR had an overdrive attached, there would be a gear shift lever sticking out the front of the seat box (not to be confused with the mechanical brake lever that sticks out of the front of the seat box). Transmission: The all syncro transmission was fitted from the factory starting with the series II Land Rovers (why they are called series III transmissions) A series IIA was not factory fitted with a full syncro transmission. The earlier transmission (no syncro in first or second) are very stong transmissions and are sometimes placed into series III Land Rovers by owners who regularly break their stock transmissions. Owners of series II(A) Land Rovers who want to be able to shift into first or second without stopping forst often have a transmissin from a series III (all syncro) installed into their earlier LR. There are rotating dogs, gears, syncros or some such that need to come to a complete stop when shifting between gears in an all syncro LR transmission. If this does not happen, the transmission self destructs. So the way to kill a LR all syncro transmission is to speed shift. If you always come to a stop at the center of the 'H' briefly, an all syncro transmission will last forever or until it runs out of oil. Back to your owner who says the transmission has syncro in second but the syncro is bad. Have him shift into first while the LR is moving. If it is a series III transmission, and you are going slowly, it will go into first. If it is an earlier no syncro in first & second transmission, it will tell you in terms only a deaf person would miss. Locking Hubs: By the name, you can guess that one of these things would sit on each front hub if they are fitted. If locking hubs are not fitted, you will see hub dust covers just like what is fitted to the rear hubs. Locking hubs come in a couple of different types but generally are generally like a beefy cast tin can coming out of the hub. This will have a twisting hadle of sorts at the end (mine has two small ones). You twist the handle to ether lock the hubs or to unlock the hubs. Unlocked hubs, means the wheels turn, but the axles, differiential, and front drive shaft does not. Result is better gas milage, less wear, slightly more power, no 4WD possible while the wheels are unlocked. With locked hubs, when the wheels turn they drive the front axles, the front diff, front drive shaft and front part of the transfer case. When the transfer case is in 4WD, the transmission drives all this stuff & applies power to the front wheels. Locking hubs were a dealer installed option very popular in north America. I do not belive that Rover sold a locking diff but I may be wrong. They are available in the aftermarket though. About half the Land Rovers I see have tropical roofs. AAfter market parts may be good or they may not, you take your chances. Factory parts are usually quite good. Yes you can still get new factory manuals. Rovers North Rt 128 Box 61, Westford VT (not new Hamshire, I lied). 802-879-0032. Thay carry factroy parts, have a parts catalogue, a newsletter and lists of Land Rovers for sale. Atlantic British in NY has same except they specilize in aftermarket parts. I think they are the ones with complete new firewalls. Yes there is a steel inner frame in the Land Rover doors. There is an exterior galvanized steel trim that goes around the outside of the body where the top bolts down. I'm running out of steam so I hope i answered most of your questions. The way you described the LR I would pay no more than $500 & only then if I was going to use the good parts to build a new land Rover. TeriAnn
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 30 00:17:44 1992 Return-Path: <@mail.uunet.ca:aficom!fourfold!dixon@micor> To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Subject: Land Rover for sale From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner) Date: Sat, 29 Aug 1992 22:40:20 -0400 Organization: FourFold Symmetry, Breckenridge, Quebec For those interested there is a Series II Land Rover pick-up for sale some 50 miles to the south of me. (I live near Ottawa, Ontario, Canada) It is a 109" pick-up. What is good? The body is in very good shape, no corrosion holes that I could see. The engine is also in good shape. It runs smoothly. The bulkhead is likewise in very good shape, the floors are either original, or have been replaced with factory parts. (If so, who ever did it, did a good job) No rust there. It hase been used for the past winter as a plough in behind a British car restoration shop. It has not been used to plough every driveway in sight. It is originally from Manitoba. It is red in colour. (I do not know if this is the original colour or not.) What is not so good. The interior of the back "pick-up" area is a bit dented from having objects inside it. This is not very surprising. The one part that everyone asks about, the frame? Well, the front part of the frame is in good shape. Nothing wrong with it that I could see when I was under it. The frame does need word starting from just forward of the rear wheels. There are rust holes there. The owner wants $1,500 Canadian for it. (approx $1,200 US) The serial number is 1504000150 for those who are interested. I figured that it was a Series II because the exhaust does not go down from the manifold, but comes across through the left wing and then down under the vehicle. Anyone interested? It is a far better deal that the one for US$2,500 that I have just seen mentioned here... Rgds, Dixon -- dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca FourFold Symmetry, Breckenridge, Quebec, Canada
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 30 00:20:45 1992 Return-Path: <@mail.uunet.ca:aficom!fourfold!dixon@micor> To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Subject: Half way there... From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner) Date: Sat, 29 Aug 1992 22:58:26 -0400 Organization: FourFold Symmetry, Breckenridge, Quebec What a lovely day. Intermittent rain, overcast, windy, and cool. Now why would I and a friend go and spend five hours exposed to the elements? Well, as of now I have a nice working 2.25 litre Land Rover engine sitting on the floor of my garage. The engine was in the dead 109" station waggon that I described the other day. Since the vehicle was very difficult to move, as it looked as if it had been torpeoded amidships ie ""o\/o" we had to get the engine out where it sat. An oxy-acetelene torch made quick work of the the bulkhead and other mounting brackets and bolts and with a bit of a struggle, we got the engine seperated from the gearbox, loaded on a trailer and off home for a transplant to occur in the near future... :-) :-) :-) Rgds, Dixon BTW, with such nice toys as torches, before you ask why it took so long, to start it was up against a tree in the front. Having a tree in the way made it very difficult to get the engine crane in and under the front. There isn't a tree there anymore... <grin> -- dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca FourFold Symmetry, Breckenridge, Quebec, Canada
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 30 00:23:27 1992 Return-Path: <@mail.uunet.ca:aficom!fourfold!dixon@micor> To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Subject: manuals etc... From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner) Date: Sat, 29 Aug 1992 23:22:51 -0400 Organization: FourFold Symmetry, Breckenridge, Quebec From: Mark V Grieshaber <mvgrie@mtcamm.monsanto.com> > Do all Land Rovers have lockable front hubs? I was under the impression > that some were full time four wheel drive, no option about it. How > does one distinguish? How do you lock the front wheels? What makes > it wobble a bit on dry pavement? No. Rover does not believe that it is possible to have a reliable locking mechanism fro the front wheels. Thus all of the Series I - III were originally full-time four wheel drive. All of the locking mechanisms are after market. I have only seen two variations of them, and with the second, I have only seen that type once. > Factory manuals sound great - how do I get them? If LR is still > cranking out parts, can I get brand new factory manuals? If not, > does anyone have a spare set they would like to sell to me? New, the manuals will set you back about US$115. They are available from Rovers North in Vermont. Used manuals can usually be found at British car shows and generally sell for about US$40. I have seen them at this price for the past two years at the Import Car show in Carlisle PA. You best bet would be to get them at one of these shows. I doubt if anyone is going to give up a spare set. One set you always need. The second goes in the house (the first usually resides in the garage). A third generally ends up at the office with a second parts book (another manual to get. They are very useful too. About US$25 at Carlisle this spring.) when it comes time to do a bit of routine maintenance on your aluminium friend. > - Since Land Rovers are not common and have not been imported for a long time, > many people have no idea what they are worth. Just as a guess, I would say: > Doormobile $10K, 109 2 door $6K, 88 $4K, 109 four door $3K Watch the price jump when the new Land Rover Defenders arrive over here... Some trivia. Only 16,000 Land Rovers were ever sold in North America. Who knows how many are still alive... > Does it sound like I might have to buy one from much further away? > The 88" I looked at on Sunday had a totally rusted away frame - it > was no longer safe to drive since the suspension attach points for > the springs, etc were 90% gone... Overall condition was really bad, > and very nonoriginal. One front swivel was badly pitted (other was > good), heater was gone and a handbuilt replacement cobbled in, > radiator was shot, firewall was rusted through, much bondo, bad > seats - a thoroughly abused vehicle. The owner wanted $2500USD > for it, which I thought ridiculous. This price is riduculous. Assuming the engine runs, it might not be bad for a parts vehicle for, say, $500. Time to go farther afield for one if you really want one. People in Ottawa have gone as far as Alberta to get them. I was lucky and found one across the street of a friend some 35 miles away that had been in dry storage for 15 years. It is rare that you will find them locally here, despite the fact that there are some 72 in the area. In ten years, I have only see one advertised in the Montreal area and one in the Ottawa area in the past five years. In a previous message I described one some 50 miles to the south of me for approx. US$1,200. Even with travel, it is in far better shape than the one you describe at half the price. The question is whether or not you want a 109" wheel base Land Rover rather than the 88". The fact that it is the pick-up version does not matter. You can convert it to the Station Waggon type if you wish. It isn't difficult as all you need is a rotten donor and a box of spanners. Rgds, Dixon -- dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca FourFold Symmetry, Breckenridge, Quebec, Canada
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 30 12:47:07 1992 Return-Path: <@mail.uunet.ca:aficom!fourfold!dixon@micor> To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Subject: 109" pick-up From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner) Date: Sun, 30 Aug 1992 11:50:47 -0400 Organization: FourFold Symmetry, Breckenridge, Quebec > Unless you pay a Land Rover mechanic $$$$ to build a new Land Rover > for you, it is a HUGE job. That could be an understatement considering how massive some of the parts are. Despite the fact that the whole thing comes apart fairly simply, you will encounter rusted bolts etc. The only obstacle is really having the space to put two Land Rovers and all of the parts as you take one apart and build the new one. You will also need the assistance of a friend for some of the tasks, like maneouvering the roof off, getting the gearbox, then engine out. A torch would be a requirement, that or several gallons of penetrating oils and a heat source. Ahhh, my frame is in good shape, but has a layer of steel flaking off from sitting. It should either be replaced, or coated. Either job will be quite the adventure. I think I'll wait until I have a garage with a concrete floor. Rebuilding mine on gravel has not been fun... > Why do people generally prefer series IIA to III? The III has a number > of plastic parts, including a plastic grill that detract from the look > & feel of a Land Rover. The III has this huge padded instrument pannel > that looks (to my eye) ugly and it lowers the amount of air that you get > from the cowel vents. It is just not the plastic grill and padded instrument panel. I find that one of the distinguishing features of our aluminium friends is the inboard headlamps. Placing them on the wings seriously detracted from their apperance. BYW, I picked up a spare front grill for my Series IIA. Time to be a real Land Rover owner and cook steak on the front grill... :-) > Overdrives: Overdrives for the Landrovers are mechanicl beasties bolted > to the back of the transmission. The Fairey overdrive transmission now enjoys Rover approval. It will set you back approx. US$1,000 if you wish to add it. There is a cost however. If you add the overdrive transmission you lose your PTO to the front of the vehicle. In you have a PTO winch, you will have to replace it with either an electric winch, or one like mine that is driven off of the crankshaft on the front of the engine. I would say, that if a potential purchase has a winch on the front, add some $500 to the value. > Locking Hubs: By the name, you can guess that one of these things would > sit on each front hub if they are fitted. If locking hubs are not fitted, > you will see hub dust covers just like what is fitted to the rear hubs. Ahhh, the purpose of this post. The 109" pick-up is full time four wheel drive. It does not have locking hubs on the front. > I do not belive that Rover sold a locking diff but I may be wrong. > They are available in the aftermarket though. Rover itself never did. > About half the Land Rovers I see have tropical roofs. I have yet to see a 109" Station Waggon that didn't have the safari roof. Rgds, Dixon -- dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca FourFold Symmetry, Breckenridge, Quebec, Canada
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 31 00:09:32 1992 Return-Path: <@mail.uunet.ca:aficom!fourfold!dixon@micor> To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Subject: yet more on the 109" pick-up From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner) Date: Sun, 30 Aug 1992 23:08:05 -0400 Organization: FourFold Symmetry, Breckenridge, Quebec Yet more information on the 109" pick-up to the south of me. The brakes don't work very well. Whether or not it is just bleeding or seals is unknown. It has not been checked by the present owner. Fr those interested, it is at The Sports Car Factory, PO Box 27, Hallville, Ontario. The phone number is 613 989-2171. The person to ask for is John Prichard. When I was by there today he said that for $3,500 Canadian he would fix the frame, brakes and everything else so it could pass a safety inspection. This price includes the $1,500 Cdn, so for another $2,000 Cdn you get one that you can drive home. I guess working brakes can be a benefit to keep the damage to other vehicles down, not that the LR would ever get damaged. BTW, This guys place just has to be seen. The amount of old parts and vehicles is amazing. He is primarily into restoring Jag's, but does all types of British cars. He does not buy the body panels, buy makes them there on an English wheel. The heavy machinery there is incredible. The results just as impressive. He doesn't consider any car past saving, but manages to restore just about anything. Well, I was impressed. I was by to get the complete pedal boxes for clutch and brake masters as well as the windscreen assembly. I discovered yesterday when I went to rebuild the clutch master that someone had broken the end where the pipe comes in from the reservoir and had welded it back together and used a tap to try and put the threads back in order. Not knowing how well it would seal, I figured a newer one was in order. The price was right. In the next couple of days, I am going to get the rest of the glass that is there. Having spares is always useful, but the weight of these parts... If I was married, I'd be dead by now. I already have several hundred pounds of Mini parts, but with a Mini, that is a lot of parts. BTW2, I'm going to sandblast and paint the pedal boxes. What colour should they be, or were they in general? If all else fails, Im just going to make them black or dark green, but I am curious. The next afterhours project? They are getting a page scanner at work. Time to start turning a number of pages in the parts manual into GIFs... Anyone know of a pc (DOS-based) database programme that would handle these? Writing a programme to tie them together would be easy. Rgds, Dixon 109" Series IIA Station Waggon (still not working...) -- dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca FourFold Symmetry, Breckenridge, Quebec, Canada
From mtcamm!car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 31 12:13:50 1992 Return-Path: <twakeman@apple.com> Date: Mon, 31 Aug 92 10:10:52 -0700 From: Teriann J. Wakeman <twakeman@apple.com> To: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca, lro@transfer.stratus.com Subject: Re: Half way there... Dixon, you'vebeen reserecting that Land Rover for what a year now? I have enjoyed corresponding with you about it, but I would like to send a congrats for a working LR. Hope this engine works out for you!!!!!! TeriAnn
Posted text Copyright 1990-2011 the original author or Bill Caloccia, All rights reserved.
Photos & text Copyright 1990-2011Bill Caloccia, All rights reserved.
Page Created: 13 Jan 1997
All trademarks are undoubtedly owned by somebody else.