From fadushin@ecs.syr.edu Sun Apr 29 05:32:24 2001 Return-Path: Received: from mailroom.ecs.syr.edu (ecs.syr.edu [128.230.208.14]) by minbar.fourfold.org (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id f3T9WON27844 for ; Sun, 29 Apr 2001 05:32:24 -0400 Received: (from fadushin@localhost) by mailroom.ecs.syr.edu (8.10.2/8.10.2) id f3T8SrE05478 for fadushin@www.ovlr.org; Sun, 29 Apr 2001 04:28:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: from syr.edu (syr.edu [128.230.1.49]) by mailroom.ecs.syr.edu (8.10.2/8.10.2) with ESMTP id f3T8SqW05475 for ; Sun, 29 Apr 2001 04:28:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: from works.team.net (IDENT:root@works.team.net [216.35.192.56]) by syr.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id EAA02959 for ; Sun, 29 Apr 2001 04:28:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by works.team.net (8.10.1/8.10.1) id f3T7rOZ03858 for lro-digest-gone; Sun, 29 Apr 2001 03:53:24 -0400 Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001 03:53:24 -0400 Message-Id: <200104290753.f3T7rOZ03858@works.team.net> From: owner-lro-digest@works.team.net (LRO Mailing List DIGEST * * * *) To: lro-digest@works.team.net Subject: LRO Mailing List DIGEST * * * * V1 #360 Reply-To: lro-digest@works.team.net Sender: owner-lro-digest@works.team.net Errors-To: owner-lro-digest@works.team.net Precedence: bulk X-Subscriptions: http://land-rover.team.net/majorcool/cgi-bin/majorcool.cgi LRO Mailing List DIGEST * * * * Sunday, April 29 2001 Volume 01 : Number 360 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 14:26:25 -0600 From: "William J. Rice" Subject: Re: LRO: Brake Shoes I've heard of a dousing in gasoline, a brief conflagration, then a sanding w/ fine paper as a semi-cure for contaminated brake shoes. I think I may even have done this, but can't quite remember. Maybe it's the burning gas fumes affecting my memory. bill On Fri, 27 Apr 2001 15:14:41 -0500 (CDT) Ray Harder writes: > > i wiped off a set of oily shoes with acetone > once -- the appeared as new, and i reused > them. it all worked out fine. the oil leak > wasn't that bad, though and perhaps a longer, > worse leak would cause oil to soak in more. > if there was a good bit of lining left, i would > wipe and use... ray harder > > On Fri, 27 Apr 2001, Brian F. Waltman wrote: > > > Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 15:05:49 -0500 > > From: Brian F. Waltman > > Reply-To: lro@works.team.net > > To: lro@works.team.net > > Subject: LRO: Brake Shoes > > > > Hello all, > > > > I finally figured out why my brakes seem to be a bit slow in > stopping me. > > The hub seal on one of the back wheels is going bad and the > differential oil > > is leaking out into my drum. Makes it abit hard to stop in a real > crunch! > > Anyway, I got a new seal in the mail the other day and will > replace it this > > weekend. The question is, once I get the oil leak stopped, do I > need to > > replace the brake shoes? I am assuming they are covered with oil. > If so, > > will I need to get new ones? > > > > Yes, that's right, I'm still learning. The hard way in most > cases. > > > > Thanks in advance, > > > > Brian Waltman > > '69 Series IIa 88" > > > > > > Sincerely, > > Ray Harder > > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 17:08:52 -0400 From: "Alan Richer/CAM/Lotus" Subject: Re: LRO: Brake Shoes Safest and best is to replace the shoes, most definitely. There are those of us who have been known to clean a pair of brand-new shoes (cough...) by burning off the old oil but this is neither desirable nor recommended (even though it works well on riveted shoes....). Swap 'em - it's a better idea. ajr ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 14:13:28 -0700 From: "Faure, Marin" Subject: LRO: Re: Series II motor Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2001 15:51:13 -0700 From: "Rich Williams II" Subject: LRO: Series II motor >I found the Robin's Egg Blue (or similar) to be on later blocks. Robin's Egg Blue was definitely used on the Series III in 1973, as that's what my engine was painted. I also have some color brochures from that era, and the photos of the engine bay of the Series III shows the Robin's Egg Blue engine very clearly (the rocker covers were aluminum colored, by the way). But I have seen in the UK engines from earlier years (original paint) that were gray, black, blue (Lister blue for those of you in the UK who know something about marine engines), green (similar to the green used on Volvo Penta diesels), and in one case that the owner swore was original, red. The red block was in an SII, and given the condition of the paint, I had no trouble believing it was original. Based on what I've seen over the years, I suspect Land Rover used whatever engine paint they happened to get a good deal on at the time. There seemed to be no rhyme or reason for their color selections. _________________________________________ C. Marin Faure Producer/Director, Boeing Video Services telephone (425)393-7721 mobile (206)650-5622 fax: (425)393-7741 e-mail: marin.faure@boeing.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 14:30:06 -0700 From: "Faure, Marin" Subject: LRO: Re: Sagging springs, why. Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 09:23:33 -1000 From: "Peter Ogilvie" Subject: LRO: Re: Sagging springs, why. >How come series rovers always sag, usually to the right side?? Don't give me any of the handed spring crap as it hasn't been a factor for ages. If jeep suppliers can provide springs that sit level, why can't the Rover crowd make stock multi leaf springs do the same. Why should they? There seems to be an obsession among a lot of Series owners about the fact their vehicles don't sit level. The fact is they never did and never will, at least not with the stock springs and bushings. I think this is largely due to the nature of the bushings, which can resist a spring's tendency to return to its "normal" arch. Also, as you may have gathered if you have worked on or changed a Land Rover's springs, the things are about as crudely and inconsistently made as it's possible to be without resorting to using wood as a component. Rover Parts uses a lot of different suppliers for things like springs, and I suspect the specs are REALLY sloppy in terms of defining the metal and other characteristics. So I'm willing to bet that the actual spring rates among even a brand new set of springs are all over the map. Any consistency will be totally by accident. The company seemed to know this, as the tolerances for body corner height off the floor given in the shop manual are pretty wide. My own SIII leans with no consistency whatsoever, and his has done so from the day it left the factory, or at least the day I took delivery in 1973. It all depends on who or what was in it last, the direction of the last corner it went around, and so on. Sometimes it leans a bit to the left. Sometimes it leans a bit to the right. Sometimes it doesn't lean at all. If you don't like the way it's sitting, reach up after you get out and push up or pull down on the rain gutter on your side of the vehicle until it's sitting the way you like it. It will stay that way until you get back in it again. It's the nature of the beast, and short of going to completely different springs and bushings, the thing's gonna lean one way or the other most of the time. But who's to say your Land Rover's leaning? Maybe it's your part of the planet that's off kilter. Don't overlook that possibility.... _________________________________________ C. Marin Faure Producer/Director, Boeing Video Services telephone (425)393-7721 mobile (206)650-5622 fax: (425)393-7741 e-mail: marin.faure@boeing.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 14:33:32 -0700 From: Paul Quin Subject: LRO: RE: Re: Series II motor Marin writes: . "and in one case that the owner swore was original, red. The red block was in an SII, and given the condition of the paint, I had no trouble believing it was original." Interesting. I'll have to do some core samples of the paint on my red SII engine and see if I can tell whether it's original or not. Paul in Victoria. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 14:41:08 -0700 From: "Faure, Marin" Subject: LRO: Re: Brake Shoes > Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 15:05:49 -0500 > From: Brian F. Waltman > Reply-To: lro@works.team.net > To: lro@works.team.net > Subject: LRO: Brake Shoes > >The question is, once I get the oil leak stopped, do I need to > replace the brake shoes? I am assuming they are covered with oil. If so, > will I need to get new ones? You should, but you may be able to get away with not having to. I had a hub seal go out once on my SIII and so much oil got into the drum they were grabbing on application and skidding the wheel, which is what alerted me to the fact there was a problem. I replaced the hub seal, but since the shoes were pretty new, I simply wiped them down and cleaned them with solvent or detergent (can't remember which). I did not seem to suffer any loss of braking power after this. However, this occurred on a rear wheel, so a loss of braking power wouldn't really have been noticed as there would be no veering right or left, and since most of the braking is done by the front brakes, I wouldn't have know if there was a reduction in stopping power on the rear wheel. Given the metallic nature of today's brake shoes (big mistake, taking asbestos out of brake lining, in my opinion- lots of downsides and no upside to doing it), I suspect the oil will have less effect and less penetration than with the older, softer lining that was used in the past. _________________________________________ C. Marin Faure Producer/Director, Boeing Video Services telephone (425)393-7721 mobile (206)650-5622 fax: (425)393-7741 e-mail: marin.faure@boeing.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 01 14:44:06 -0700 From: TeriAnn Wakeman Subject: Re: LRO: Axles >As some of you may know, I have been looking into the possibility of >changing over to late model Dana axles, modified to fit the series rover's >width. Which I thought was strange because Salisbury axle assemblies are Dana 60s. Salisbury became the Dana division. And of course the Salisbury assemblies already fit Land Rovers. >Most conversions I have heard of are running a salisbury differential in the >rear. This appears to be a very tough diff, perfectly capable of handling a >stout V8 or, in my case, a large 6 cylinder. Yes the Dana 60 (AKA Salisbury) is well regarded. > This is common knowledge. If I >do stick with rover axles, I'll be going to a salisbury at the rear, and a >rover at the front. Your basic options are: - - Salisbury (AKA Dana 60) front and rear - - Rover axle front & Dana 60 rear - - Rover axles front & rear but with 4 or more pin carrier, beefier ring & pinion & larger axles inside the LR housing. The rear handles all the stress in 2WD and more than 50% in 4WD. SO it HAS to be stronger than the standard Rover axle. The fronts? I think it depends upon what your power plant is, the terrain you are on and how you drive. > >What I'm worried about is the front diff. How is this end of the equation >holding up? Lonn and TeriAnn are using bone stock front axles,and I haven't >heard of any breakages... yet. I'm running stock Rover in the front except for a six pin automatic torque biasing diff. With the four cylinder engine I broke the front right axle at the inside splines in foot plus foot snow. I broke a ring & pinion up front. But the vehicle was bouncing up a steep hill and the body got high enough that a 'U' joint on the front prop shaft binded and the yolk yanked the pinion nut right off the pinion shaft. Before things were said and done the front yolk of the diff was separated from the diff and hanging on the loose front end of the front prop shaft and the pinion gear got pushed through the ring gears. My immediate cure was to tilt the front of the front diff upwards 2 degrees. We'll see if it helps. While everything was apart it was noticed that there was a slight twist on the inner spline of the front left axle. I probably should have replaced both front axles while I was at it. I consider 40 years to be an acceptable axle life. Other than that I've had no problems with my Rover front axle assembly. I think that since I'm running a detuned 302 I'm probably easier on my drive train than these gonzo guys and their hot rod 350s. So I'll be leaving the front axles alone unless I break something or I trip over a real cheap Salisbury front axle assembly. The other option is a beefier ring & pinion and hitting GB Rovers up for a set of beefy front axles. For the rears, I figure even though the stock Salisbury axles are pretty strong, mine are probably around 28 years old. I may swap them out just for the fun of it on the grounds that they may be getting fatigued after all those years of use. I haven't decided between big custom axles & bigger Dana spider gears or strengthened axles from Great Basin Rovers. But then I haven't looked into either yet. >Well, here goes. Is it safe to assume that the front axleshafts are capable >of handling a fair amount of abuse? They seem to. The Fonts usually receive a little less than 50 % of the power in 4WD and they seem to be quite a bit stonger or more resiliant than the stock rear axles. >Timm Cooper's rock crawling rig has a stock rover axle He just went to a Salisbury up front. But he might have bent the weaker LR axle housing from doing flaps up landings off the runway. Timm makes almost every gonzo LR pilot I have seen seem tame. So yes the front Salisbury is beefier than the front LR axle assembly. The question is do you really need it? I can't tell you. >I've heard of broken half shafts up front, but they seem to be a little less >common than rear axleshaft breakage. I've broken one front & put a slight twist in the other front. I broke six rear axles. > Maybe the front carnage can be >attributed to ? years of hard use, and simply failed. Opinions on this? Well, there was 38 years of use for the front axle I broke. But I just putter around from place to place and take the easiest track through any obsticals I might find. So golly, it could be just fatigue over time, or that powerful 2-1/4L engine. TeriAnn Wakeman Marigold Ltd. Santa Cruz, California Web design, site updating, testing webmaster@overlander.net search engine optimization, graphics and more http://www.overlander.net/Marigold/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 22:05:11 -0400 From: Stephen West-Fisher Subject: Re: LRO: Series II motor Rich Williams II wrote: > > Now the only thing that really matters when we paint this stuff is that we > LROs are satisfied with the net results. Well, I couldn't be happier. The > engine is not back in the truck yet so everything is completely visible. I > am more than happy to email anyone images of this finished product for you > to compare with the green that most seem to want. I believe Pete Hope has > some images of a new SIIa motor that is all green. Oh, that's another > point. What I said about the motors not being green save for military units > only holds for original SII motors. I found the Robin's Egg Blue (or > similar) to be on later blocks. > > Hope this helps, > > Rich Williams > '60 SII 109 SW I'd be interested in the pictures, I'm about ready to major my SII engine. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 18:27:59 -0400 From: "Lee Jones" Subject: LRO: RE: Re: Sagging springs, why. Hmmm - My 109 is down by the LEFT side - it is RHD though..... Lee - -----Original Message----- From: owner-lro@works.team.net [mailto:owner-lro@works.team.net]On Behalf Of Peter Ogilvie Sent: Friday, April 27, 2001 3:24 PM To: lro@works.team.net Subject: LRO: Re: Sagging springs, why. Things have been too quiet on the list, thought I'd generate some controversy. How come series rovers always sag, usually to the right side?? Don't give me any of the handed spring crap as it hasn't been a factor for ages. If jeep suppliers can provide springs that sit level, why can't the Rover crowd make stock multi leaf springs do the same. I just did an RM parabolic switch and the truck sits level for the first time since I've owned it. Before, the truck had the typical right side down lean. Did the rears first and, after removal, found the stock springs to have an 1" difference in arch. With the parabolics on the rear, truck appeared to set level though I didn't drive it much and park on known level ground and measure it to verify. Thought the sag must have been caused by the stock rear springs, alone. Switched the fronts and truck still sits level, but discovered the front springs also have a 1" arch differential. The front springs were stock, new in 1991 and have only 5,000 miles on them. They weren't the different arched springs as fitted to early right hand drive vehicles as I understand these springs were never imported. The rears were original with with 35,000 miles on them. Unfortunately, I didn't mark the springs before I took them off but must assume the tall springs were on the right side. I've got two Rovers that I have driven regularly and both had sag problems. Solved the problem on my 88 by putting a nasty looking, rust pitted POS spring from the right side of my parts truck on the left side of the 88. Spring was so bad that it broke completely as soon as I lubed it and was able to flex. At least the truck sat level for a while. If every other car manufacturer and aftermarket supplier can make springs that sit level, why can't the makers of stock Rover springs do the same??? My back loves the parabolics, by the way. Truck rides so much smoother over my test section. In second gear at idle, truck used to bounce me off the seat. Now the truck glides over the loose rubble and bare lava. Feels almost like someone went out and rounded the corners off all the bumps and lumps. Have the usual Rocky Mountain 2 leaf front springs and fixed 3 leaf rears on my 109 regular pickup. Was going to do a comparison with the TI Console parabolics but don't want to take the time to switch everything out. Like the idea of the helper springs on the TI's for comfort but can't swear it has an effect in real life. Yes I know the hang up argument with the helpers, but had no problems in a years use on the 88. Oh!! and the sway argument is horse puckey. Truck corners just as level as it did with the stock springs. Axle doesn't tramp to the outside of turns with bumps like it did with stock springs, so handling in side loading is actually much improved. Shocks are OME installed months before the spring switch so they aren't a factor. Aloha Peter Ogilvie Kona Coffee Rover 1970 88 soft top, 'huli' Mine since '84 but recovering from exposure of the dark side. 1966 109 pickup 'slime' In my garage since '90, finally up and running 12/00. 1965 88 parts car, slowly sinking into the lava. 196? 88 hard top, possibly 'phoenix' if it rises, it will certainly be from ashes or at least a pile of rust _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 22:29:06 -0400 From: Stephen West-Fisher Subject: Re: LRO: Series II motor Stephen West-Fisher wrote: > > I'd be interested in the pictures, I'm about ready to major my SII > engine. Silly operator, didn't mean for that to go to the whole list, sorry. However, I just went out and had a close look at my engine, made rather simple since it's sitting in the engine stand awaiting teardown, and the only paint I could find was just to the rear of the left motor mount. Grey. This is a 1960 SII 88. Under the flywheel cover it looks like the case is painted white, but this is up against the wall right now so I cannot be sure. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 18:29:12 -0400 From: Keith Tanner Subject: Re: LRO: IIa single system brake reservoir Yes, you can change over to dual reservoirs without having to change the rest of the system. My IIa now has a separate clutch reservoir and the original brake fluid reservoir with the bottom feed plugged. Keith Tanner and Basil, who's legal! - ------------ Keith's page de home: http://keith.miata.net - ------------ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 18:32:10 -0400 From: Keith Tanner Subject: LRO: A thank you. My goal was to get my Rover on the road, licensed and legal, by my birthday. Well, that was yesterday. And early in the morning, Basil passed his safety inspection! (much excitement ensued). It came down to the wire, but it happened. I'd like to thank you all for putting up with all the questions. I'm a happy camper. If anyone's interested, the whole process is documented and photographed on my webpage - http://keith.miata.net/landy . Keith Tanner and Basil, free to roam. PS: right after the new plates went on, we swapped in the GM alternator and bypassed the hybrid system that was in the truck. - ------------ Keith's page de home: http://keith.miata.net - ------------ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 17:09:38 -0600 From: Rick Grant Subject: Re: LRO: RE: Re: Sagging springs, why. > >How come series rovers always sag, usually to the right side?? As mentioned by Marin it's because of the huge tolerances allowed in the spring/frame/bushing assembly. The manual states that a 1" difference side to side is acceptable. A one inch drop across the width of a Land Rover gives a perceptible lean. And for what it is worth, my LHD leans to the left unless I have just completed a hard left hand turn and stopped, then it is level. Rick Grant 1959 Series II "88" VORIZO Rick Grant Communications Media and Crisis Management Calgary Ottawa www.rickgrant.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 01:13:07 -1000 From: "Hope Peter" Subject: LRO: Re: Re: Axles Just to add something else to the equestion. If your problem is the front axle, you could get a Dana 44 from a scout. Width is an inch or two wider, so you would need to get a new wheel offset, but its a standard size bolt pattern and pretty easy to source. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 01:16:11 -1000 From: "Hope Peter" Subject: LRO: Re: Re: Sagging springs, why. Don't have the answer to your question, but am very interested in seeing them for my self. Whats the driving time from Hilo to your place? Gonna be on island 12&13 May with some friends. Figured maybe meet for lunch on Saturday? Arrive in Hilo at 8, Staying at KMC. Pete ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 20:43:21 EDT From: BSharp4601@aol.com Subject: LRO: Re:Sagging springs, why. > Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 16:13:12 -0400 > From: Bill Adams > Subject: Re: LRO: Re: Sagging springs, why. > > I recommend that you stay away from TI Console springs. My 4 leaf rears > have sagged to the left almost from day one ( installed mid 1997). > Attempts at remediation through the company's owner have been fruitless > and I fear that I'm stuck with a for-shit suspension. > - -- > Bill Adams > 3D & Motion Graphics Design Director > International Broadcasting Bureau > Washington, D.C. > 202-205-9638 > badams@ibb.gov BTDT. I bought some parabolics from Bill at Great Basin a couple of years ago and had a similar problem with sag to the left side. Bill was very accommodating and helped with replacement springs (twice). It still sagged (a lot) to the driver's side, and, no, it wasn't me. I only weigh in at 188 lbs. After he suggested having the low side re-arched at a spring shop I continued to have problems with sagging springs. It seams that not all spring shops are equally as proficient as others. The shop I first patronized (in business for 20+ years and "had lots of experience with Land Rovers") put more arch in the low side springs, but after about three days, the sag was back! After several attempts at this mess I tried another spring shop. They charged twice as much as the first, but the re-arch held. (Both shops do cold vs. hot re-arching.) The first place must not have disassembled the spring pack before reworking the springs, so, after several days they returned to their original shape / sag. The second place stripped them down, reworked the leaves, and then rebuilt them. They worked out great. I know that it seams unfair to have to rework "new" springs, but it was the only way to get it to sit level. I'm talking about between one to two inches difference from side to side, not just a little lean. Not all Rovers are created equal, some favor the left, some favor the right, go figure. Even with the stock springs, my 88 leaned to the left (DS). If you're trying to get it to sit level, start with the rear springs first, you may not have to mess with the front springs. My sincere apologies to Bill Davis at Great basin Rovers for my being a PITA. If I'd known the problem was with the "experienced" spring shop in the first place, it would have saved a lot of grief for both of us. Bill went the extra distance to help me try to solve the problem. Now to go through the same mess with my 109. The parabolics are worth it, both handling and comfort are greatly improved over the stock springs. YMMV, Bob Sharp Tucson, AZ The slumbering herd on the Rover Ranch: 52 Series I 80" 53 Series I 80" 60 Series II 88" 63 Series IIa 88" 71 Series IIa 109" 96 Discovery Series I "Why is it that every project you complete on a Land Rover results in knowledge and skills you hope you never need to use again?" PS. Has ANYONE else NOTICED that IT is FASHIONABLE to SHOUT every OTHER word NOW? Or is it just the curmudgeon in me coming out? ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 18:52:02 -0600 From: "Jim Hall" Subject: LRO: flywheel pins How does one remove the 3 pins in the flywheel? On a side note, to go along with the rotor in hand stories... I noticed the teeth on the ring gear were worn, so I decided to turn it around. After slowly and carefully working it off, I proceeded to pound it back on in the same direction. Doh!! So off again and on again.. - -- Jim Hall 1966 88" Elephant Chaser http://www.users.qwest.net/~jimfoo "You know, I never really damaged my Rover 'till I started wheeling with Jim." Mitch Stockdale ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 23:46:25 -0400 From: "Peter Thomson" Subject: LRO: Re: flywheel pins You do not pound ring gears- they are heated and they expand so as to just fall into position. - ----- Original Message ----- From: Jim Hall To: lro Sent: Friday, April 27, 2001 8:52 PM Subject: LRO: flywheel pins > How does one remove the 3 pins in the flywheel? On a side note, to go > along with the rotor in hand stories... I noticed the teeth on the ring > gear were worn, so I decided to turn it around. After slowly and > carefully working it off, I proceeded to pound it back on in the same > direction. Doh!! So off again and on again.. > -- > Jim Hall > 1966 88" Elephant Chaser > http://www.users.qwest.net/~jimfoo > "You know, I never really damaged my Rover 'till I started wheeling > with Jim." Mitch Stockdale ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 00:00:25 -0400 From: "Bill Fishel" Subject: LRO: Re: Re: Brake Shoes Check the surface on the distance piece that the hub seal rides on. If this isn't any good, you will be replacing the seals and degreasing the brakes again in the near future. The hub seal race or distance piece ( take your pick at what you want to call it) is easy to replace but I've always had to split it with a chisel. I have had good luck using a light smear of grease on the new seal and distance piece for the initial installation. After a few miles on the seal it should get a light amount of lube to keep it from burning from the diff lube but shouldn't leak. I personally won't replace the seal without replacing the distance piece. They dont cost much and the hub is already stripped far enough to do it. Bill Fishel ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 22:14:03 -0700 From: "Paul Quin" Subject: LRO: Hylomar SQ 32 M Hi all, It's 10 PM and I'm reading through the Green Bible operation A1-32 in preparation for the job of replaceing the rear main bearing oil seal tomorrow. One step calls for using Hylomar sealing compound SQ 32 M on the seal retainers. Is Hylomar available in Canada? I have various Permatex sealers and gasket compounts, would one of these work? Tx. Paul Quin 1961 SII 88 Victoria, BC Canada ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 10:52:54 +0200 From: "S. Vels" Subject: LRO: Re: Re: Brake Shoes Bill Fishel wrote: > The hub seal race or distance piece ( take your pick at what you want to call it) is easy to replace but I've always had to split it with a chisel. On should not try to remove it without splitting it. Once it starts to rotate it can be removed. Do not damage the flange. > I have had good luck using a light smear of grease on the new seal and distance piece for the initial installation. Mandatory! > > I personally won't replace the seal without replacing the distance piece. They dont cost much and the hub is already stripped far enough to do it. Be shure to have a tube to bang on the new race. It takes ages to ping it on with a pin hammer. A bit of heat (not much) will also ease the fit. rgds sv/aurens - just adding my 0.02c ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 12:30:08 +0100 From: Subject: LRO: Re: flywheel pins Drill a small hole in the rear of the flywheel and knock the pin out with a punch. The easy way to get the hole in the correct place is to clamp a piece of wood/metal to the drill table, drill a pin sized hole in it, change to the smaller drill, put flywheel face down with the pin in the hole and drill your wee hole for the punch. Chaz http://freespace.virgin.net/chaz.mackenzie/home.htm - -----Original Message----- From: Jim Hall To: lro Date: Saturday 28 April 2:08 Subject: LRO: flywheel pins >How does one remove the 3 pins in the flywheel? On a side note, to go >along with the rotor in hand stories... I noticed the teeth on the ring >gear were worn, so I decided to turn it around. After slowly and >carefully working it off, I proceeded to pound it back on in the same >direction. Doh!! So off again and on again.. >-- >Jim Hall >1966 88" Elephant Chaser >http://www.users.qwest.net/~jimfoo >"You know, I never really damaged my Rover 'till I started wheeling >with Jim." Mitch Stockdale > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 07:38:22 -0600 From: "Jim Hall" Subject: Re: LRO: Re: flywheel pins Too late now..... I actually have done this on another vehicle also and had no problems. Peter Thomson wrote: > > You do not pound ring gears- they are heated and they expand so as to just > fall into position. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Jim Hall > To: lro > Sent: Friday, April 27, 2001 8:52 PM > Subject: LRO: flywheel pins > > > How does one remove the 3 pins in the flywheel? On a side note, to go > > along with the rotor in hand stories... I noticed the teeth on the ring > > gear were worn, so I decided to turn it around. After slowly and > > carefully working it off, I proceeded to pound it back on in the same > > direction. Doh!! So off again and on again.. > > -- > > Jim Hall > > 1966 88" Elephant Chaser > > http://www.users.qwest.net/~jimfoo > > "You know, I never really damaged my Rover 'till I started wheeling > > with Jim." Mitch Stockdale - -- Jim Hall 1966 88" Elephant Chaser http://www.users.qwest.net/~jimfoo "You know, I never really damaged my Rover 'till I started wheeling with Jim." Mitch Stockdale ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 07:38:54 -0600 From: "Jim Hall" Subject: Re: LRO: Re: flywheel pins Thanks, a very good idea!! chaz.mackenzie@virgin.net wrote: > > Drill a small hole in the rear of the flywheel and knock the pin out with a > punch. The easy way to get the hole in the correct place is to clamp a piece > of wood/metal to the drill table, drill a pin sized hole in it, change to > the smaller drill, put flywheel face down with the pin in the hole and drill > your wee hole for the punch. > > Chaz > http://freespace.virgin.net/chaz.mackenzie/home.htm > -----Original Message----- > From: Jim Hall > To: lro > Date: Saturday 28 April 2:08 > Subject: LRO: flywheel pins > > >How does one remove the 3 pins in the flywheel? On a side note, to go > >along with the rotor in hand stories... I noticed the teeth on the ring > >gear were worn, so I decided to turn it around. After slowly and > >carefully working it off, I proceeded to pound it back on in the same > >direction. Doh!! So off again and on again.. > >-- > >Jim Hall > >1966 88" Elephant Chaser > >http://www.users.qwest.net/~jimfoo > >"You know, I never really damaged my Rover 'till I started wheeling > >with Jim." Mitch Stockdale > > - -- Jim Hall 1966 88" Elephant Chaser http://www.users.qwest.net/~jimfoo "You know, I never really damaged my Rover 'till I started wheeling with Jim." Mitch Stockdale ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Apr 01 07:01:55 -0700 From: TeriAnn Wakeman Subject: Re: LRO: Re: Re: Axles >Just to add something else to the equestion. If your problem is the front >axle, you could get a Dana 44 from a scout. Width is an inch or two wider, >so you would need to get a new wheel offset, but its a standard size bolt >pattern and pretty easy to source. Or you could: A. beef up the insides, or B. put a Salisbury (Dana 60) in the front And only carry one spare tyre. TeriAnn Wakeman Marigold Ltd. Santa Cruz, California Web design, site updating, testing webmaster@overlander.net search engine optimization, graphics and more http://www.overlander.net/Marigold/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 16:29:18 -0000 From: "N Forbes" Subject: Re: LRO: Re: flywheel pins I think that with a torch and some vise grips you can just pull them out. Red Zit had his flywheel resurfaced last month and the whole thing only took about 30 minutes so I don't think they spent much time with the pins. Niall Forbes 66 IIa 88SW - The Red Zit Dartmouth, Nova Scotia The Nova Scotian Rover - http://www3.ns.sympatico.ca/forbes/intro.htm "See the happy moron, He doesn't give a damn. I wish I were a moron. My God! Perhaps I am!" - --author unknown _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 08:36:02 -0400 From: "Alex Maiolo" Subject: LRO: Re: Hylomar SQ 32 M I assume they are talking about something like Permatex Blue Hylomar. It's a good choice to use when there is a posibility of the excess sealant getting into the sump. Unlike Black ATV or the like, which will not disolve and possibly clog stuff up a little, Blue Hylomar will disolve or get chewed up very easily. Good stuff! If Permatex isn't available, there are other brands. I think "777" is another. The tech manual calls for it around water jackets too. You should be able to find it at any medocre or better parts store. Cheers, Alex Maiolo Chapel Hill NC - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul Quin" To: Sent: Saturday, April 28, 2001 1:14 AM Subject: LRO: Hylomar SQ 32 M > > Hi all, > > It's 10 PM and I'm reading through the Green Bible operation A1-32 in > preparation for the job of replaceing the rear main bearing oil seal > tomorrow. One step calls for using Hylomar sealing compound SQ 32 M on the > seal retainers. Is Hylomar available in Canada? I have various Permatex > sealers and gasket compounts, would one of these work? > > Tx. > > Paul Quin > 1961 SII 88 > Victoria, BC Canada > > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 13:04:45 -0600 From: "Jim Hall" Subject: Re: LRO: Re: flywheel pins I had already tried that with 0% success. I couldn't even get them to turn. N Forbes wrote: > > I think that with a torch and some vise grips you can just pull them out. > Red Zit had his flywheel resurfaced last month and the whole thing only took > about 30 minutes so I don't think they spent much time with the pins. > > Niall Forbes > 66 IIa 88SW - The Red Zit > Dartmouth, Nova Scotia > The Nova Scotian Rover - http://www3.ns.sympatico.ca/forbes/intro.htm > > "See the happy moron, > He doesn't give a damn. > I wish I were a moron. > My God! Perhaps I am!" > --author unknown > > _________________________________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. - -- Jim Hall 1966 88" Elephant Chaser http://www.users.qwest.net/~jimfoo "You know, I never really damaged my Rover 'till I started wheeling with Jim." Mitch Stockdale ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 12:16:32 -1000 From: "Peter Ogilvie" Subject: Re: LRO: Hylomar SQ 32 M Hylomar is Hylomar though I believe it is either now owned or distributed by Permatex. Its fame goes back to British Motorcycles as a no leak gasket sealant. I'd try and find it if you really want a no leak seal. I've seen it here in Kona so it can't be all that rare. Aloha Peter Ogilvie Kona Coffee Rover 1970 88 soft top, 'huli' Mine since '84 but recovering from exposure of the dark side. 1966 109 pickup 'slime' In my garage since '90, finally up and running 12/00. 1965 88 parts car, slowly sinking into the lava. 196? 88 hard top, possibly 'phoenix' if it rises, it will certainly be from ashes or at least a pile of rust >From: "Paul Quin" >It's 10 PM and I'm reading through the Green Bible operation A1-32 in >preparation for the job of replaceing the rear main bearing oil seal >tomorrow. One step calls for using Hylomar sealing compound SQ 32 M on the >seal retainers. Is Hylomar available in Canada? I have various Permatex >sealers and gasket compounts, would one of these work? >Paul Quin _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 22:26:42 +0100 From: "Frank Elson" Subject: LRO: Re: Re: Sagging springs, why. totally correct Marin. Extract from Land Rover 'secret' build book: 'Tolerances in the vehicle will be plus or minus one inch(ish)' Best Cheers Frank +--+--+--+ I !__| [_]|_\___ I ____|"_|"__|_ | / B791 PKV "(o)======(o)" Bronze Green 110 CSW - ----- Original Message ----- From: Faure, Marin To: 'Land Rover Mail Group' Cc: Sent: Friday, April 27, 2001 10:30 PM Subject: LRO: Re: Sagging springs, why. > Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 09:23:33 -1000 > From: "Peter Ogilvie" > Subject: LRO: Re: Sagging springs, why. > > >How come series rovers always sag, usually to the right side?? Don't give me > any of the handed spring crap as it hasn't been a factor for ages. If jeep > suppliers can provide springs that sit level, why can't the Rover crowd make > stock multi leaf springs do the same. > > Why should they? There seems to be an obsession among a lot of Series owners about the > fact their vehicles don't sit level. The fact is they never did and never will, at least > not with the stock springs and bushings. I think this is largely due to the nature of the > bushings, which can resist a spring's tendency to return to its "normal" > arch. Also, as you may have gathered if you have worked on or changed a Land > Rover's springs, the things are about as crudely and inconsistently made as it's > possible to be without resorting to using wood as a component. Rover Parts uses > a lot of different suppliers for things like springs, and I suspect the specs are REALLY > sloppy in terms of defining the metal and other characteristics. So I'm willing to bet that > the actual spring rates among even a brand new set of springs are all over the map. Any > consistency will be totally by accident. The company seemed to know this, as the > tolerances for body corner height off the floor given in the shop manual are pretty wide. > > My own SIII leans with > no consistency whatsoever, and his has done so from the day it left the factory, or at > least the day I took delivery in 1973. It all depends on who or what was in it last, the direction of > the last corner it went around, and so on. Sometimes it leans a bit to the left. Sometimes > it leans a bit to the right. Sometimes it doesn't lean at all. If you don't like the way it's sitting, > reach up after you get out and push up or pull down on the rain gutter on your side of the vehicle > until it's sitting the way you like it. It will stay that way until you get back in it again. It's the > nature of the beast, and short of going to completely different springs and bushings, the thing's > gonna lean one way or the other most of the time. > > But who's to say your Land Rover's leaning? > Maybe it's your part of the planet that's off kilter. Don't overlook that possibility.... > > _________________________________________ > C. Marin Faure > Producer/Director, Boeing Video Services > telephone (425)393-7721 > mobile (206)650-5622 > fax: (425)393-7741 > e-mail: marin.faure@boeing.com > ------------------------------ End of LRO Mailing List DIGEST * * * * V1 #360 ********************************************** From fadushin@ecs.syr.edu Sun Apr 29 19:15:14 2001 Return-Path: Received: from mailroom.ecs.syr.edu (ecs.syr.edu [128.230.208.14]) by minbar.fourfold.org (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id f3TNFDN29713 for ; Sun, 29 Apr 2001 19:15:13 -0400 Received: (from fadushin@localhost) by mailroom.ecs.syr.edu (8.10.2/8.10.2) id f3TMBil19836 for fadushin@www.ovlr.org; Sun, 29 Apr 2001 18:11:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: from syr.edu (syr.edu [128.230.1.49]) by mailroom.ecs.syr.edu (8.10.2/8.10.2) with ESMTP id f3TMBhW19833 for ; Sun, 29 Apr 2001 18:11:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: from works.team.net (IDENT:root@works.team.net [216.35.192.56]) by syr.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA28286 for ; Sun, 29 Apr 2001 18:11:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by works.team.net (8.10.1/8.10.1) id f3TLTAo11511 for lro-digest-gone; Sun, 29 Apr 2001 17:29:10 -0400 Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001 17:29:10 -0400 Message-Id: <200104292129.f3TLTAo11511@works.team.net> From: owner-lro-digest@works.team.net (LRO Mailing List DIGEST * * * *) To: lro-digest@works.team.net Subject: LRO Mailing List DIGEST * * * * V1 #361 Reply-To: lro-digest@works.team.net Sender: owner-lro-digest@works.team.net Errors-To: owner-lro-digest@works.team.net Precedence: bulk X-Subscriptions: http://land-rover.team.net/majorcool/cgi-bin/majorcool.cgi LRO Mailing List DIGEST * * * * Sunday, April 29 2001 Volume 01 : Number 361 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 22:23:19 +0100 From: "Frank Elson" Subject: Re: LRO: Brake Shoes I've done this... more than once I'm afraid... it works fine Best Cheers Frank +--+--+--+ I !__| [_]|_\___ I ____|"_|"__|_ | / B791 PKV "(o)======(o)" Bronze Green 110 CSW - ----- Original Message ----- From: William J. Rice To: Sent: Friday, April 27, 2001 9:26 PM Subject: Re: LRO: Brake Shoes > I've heard of a dousing in gasoline, a brief conflagration, then a > sanding w/ fine paper as a semi-cure for contaminated brake shoes. I > think I may even have done this, but can't quite remember. Maybe it's > the burning gas fumes affecting my memory. > > bill > > On Fri, 27 Apr 2001 15:14:41 -0500 (CDT) Ray Harder > writes: > > > > i wiped off a set of oily shoes with acetone > > once -- the appeared as new, and i reused > > them. it all worked out fine. the oil leak > > wasn't that bad, though and perhaps a longer, > > worse leak would cause oil to soak in more. > > if there was a good bit of lining left, i would > > wipe and use... ray harder > > > > On Fri, 27 Apr 2001, Brian F. Waltman wrote: > > > > > Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 15:05:49 -0500 > > > From: Brian F. Waltman > > > Reply-To: lro@works.team.net > > > To: lro@works.team.net > > > Subject: LRO: Brake Shoes > > > > > > Hello all, > > > > > > I finally figured out why my brakes seem to be a bit slow in > > stopping me. > > > The hub seal on one of the back wheels is going bad and the > > differential oil > > > is leaking out into my drum. Makes it abit hard to stop in a real > > crunch! > > > Anyway, I got a new seal in the mail the other day and will > > replace it this > > > weekend. The question is, once I get the oil leak stopped, do I > > need to > > > replace the brake shoes? I am assuming they are covered with oil. > > If so, > > > will I need to get new ones? > > > > > > Yes, that's right, I'm still learning. The hard way in most > > cases. > > > > > > Thanks in advance, > > > > > > Brian Waltman > > > '69 Series IIa 88" > > > > > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > Ray Harder > > > > > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 22:30:26 +0100 From: "Frank Elson" Subject: Re: LRO: Series II motor but surely pink is the only correct colour for a L/R engine? Best Cheers Frank +--+--+--+ I !__| [_]|_\___ I ____|"_|"__|_ | / B791 PKV "(o)======(o)" Bronze Green 110 CSW - ----- Original Message ----- From: Stephen West-Fisher To: Sent: Saturday, April 28, 2001 3:05 AM Subject: Re: LRO: Series II motor > Rich Williams II wrote: > > > > > Now the only thing that really matters when we paint this stuff is that we > > LROs are satisfied with the net results. Well, I couldn't be happier. The > > engine is not back in the truck yet so everything is completely visible. I > > am more than happy to email anyone images of this finished product for you > > to compare with the green that most seem to want. I believe Pete Hope has > > some images of a new SIIa motor that is all green. Oh, that's another > > point. What I said about the motors not being green save for military units > > only holds for original SII motors. I found the Robin's Egg Blue (or > > similar) to be on later blocks. > > > > Hope this helps, > > > > Rich Williams > > '60 SII 109 SW > I'd be interested in the pictures, I'm about ready to major my SII > engine. > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001 09:31:53 +0100 From: "Phil Norris" Subject: Re: LRO: Series II motor I will follow where you lead, oh great one.... Qui-chang Norris, The L-R grasshoppah....... (off getting me hi-lift today 4 me birfday !!) - -----Original Message----- From: Frank Elson To: lro@Works.Team.Net Date: 29 April 2001 09:04 Subject: Re: LRO: Series II motor >but surely pink is the only correct colour for a L/R engine? >Best Cheers > >Frank > +--+--+--+ > I !__| [_]|_\___ > I ____|"_|"__|_ | / B791 PKV > "(o)======(o)" Bronze Green 110 CSW > >----- Original Message ----- >From: Stephen West-Fisher >To: >Sent: Saturday, April 28, 2001 3:05 AM >Subject: Re: LRO: Series II motor > > >> Rich Williams II wrote: >> >> > >> > Now the only thing that really matters when we paint this stuff is that >we >> > LROs are satisfied with the net results. Well, I couldn't be happier. >The >> > engine is not back in the truck yet so everything is completely visible. >I >> > am more than happy to email anyone images of this finished product for >you >> > to compare with the green that most seem to want. I believe Pete Hope >has >> > some images of a new SIIa motor that is all green. Oh, that's another >> > point. What I said about the motors not being green save for military >units >> > only holds for original SII motors. I found the Robin's Egg Blue (or >> > similar) to be on later blocks. >> > >> > Hope this helps, >> > >> > Rich Williams >> > '60 SII 109 SW >> I'd be interested in the pictures, I'm about ready to major my SII >> engine. >> > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001 20:18:52 +0800 From: SEAN Subject: LRO: Defender 110 'pick-up' Gearbox There was a 'clonking' sound when i drive in 1st and reverse gear so I changed the rear axle ball joint, gear mainshaft, syncro assy, mainshaft gear for my LT77 gearbox. I also changed the clutch, clutch plate and clutch release bearing. Now the 'clonking' sound has gone but there is a 'grinding' sound on my 5th gear now. It didn't come when I'm cruising but when I release the gas pedal to a 'quarter' to slow down the vehicle speed...it CAME!. ..mostly on 5th gear. If the vehicle is cruising, I free all gearing then there's an 'uneven' moving sound from the gear box. There's also a 'whining' sound from it. It's difficult to get a rebuilt gearbox at this part of the world. Please help. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001 13:17:08 +0100 From: "Frank Elson" Subject: Re: LRO: Series II motor Phil writes: >>>off getting me hi-lift today 4 me birfday !!)<<< don't forget the adaptor for the 110 lifting 'oles probably get one at Gaydon at the weekend if your birthday money didn't stretch... Best Cheers Frank +--+--+--+ I !__| [_]|_\___ I ____|"_|"__|_ | / B791 PKV "(o)======(o)" Bronze Green 110 CSW ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001 12:46:32 From: "Chris Oles" Subject: LRO: Blue Hylomar and frame over progress... I picked my tube up from Autozone. Permatex is the manufacturer and from what I can tell, it seals up nicely and holds the gasket in place when offering it up to the engine. On the frame over: My 70 SIIa 88 will be roaring to life today! Yesterday I finsihed re-installing the wings and bought new plugs and oil and installed both. Today is double-checking the timing, installing some gauges and turning the key. All that there is left is the bonnet, doors and floors. It's been a long 8 months but the resto should be completed in the next 2 - 3 weekends. How has anyone that has performed the frameover successfully transitioned from the "I've gotta get out there and finish this project or my wife will kill me" to after it's done, waking up on a Saturday and having nothing but regular maintenance to do? Anyone want to suggest a new restoration project for me to work on? Maybe a boat -- something that can be tinkered with and finished in time for my retirement in 30 or so years :) Chris 70 SIIa 88 From: "Paul Quin" To: Sent: Saturday, April 28, 2001 1:14 AM Subject: LRO: Hylomar SQ 32 M > >Hi all, > >It's 10 PM and I'm reading through the Green Bible operation A1-32 in >preparation for the job of replaceing the rear main bearing oil seal >tomorrow. One step calls for using Hylomar sealing compound SQ 32 M on the >seal retainers. Is Hylomar available in Canada? I have various Permatex >sealers and gasket compounts, would one of these work? > >Tx. > >Paul Quin >1961 SII 88 >Victoria, BC Canada > > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001 14:10:22 +0100 From: "Neil Brownlee" Subject: LRO: Another Impossible Thing? And Malta! According to LRE, my tyres don't fit? That's a shame, cos it LOOKS LIKE THEY DO to me!!!! Strange, I think that stating point blank that 235/85's won;t fit is a bit contoversial is it not? Or is it just me suffering from Jet Lag? Which reminds me, just got back from Malta, and have never seen so many Land Rovers in the wild in one place! Can any listers from Malta makes themselves known to me offlist, as I'm opening up an office over there (hopefully on the Valley Road (and YES! It's high up!)) and would like to meet up with some like minded people for beers and eats! - ------------------------------------------------------------- Neil 1978 Land Rover Series III 109" Ex-MOD - 'Harriet' 1997 Land Rover Discovery V8i ES - 'Piglet' - XD9000i, Terrain Master Winch Bumper & Hi-Lift carrier, Bearmach steering/sump guard, Mantec Side Protection Sills, Scorpion Racing +2" suspension lift, De-Carbon Shocks, Southdown Fuel Tank Guard, 235/85 General Grabber MT's, WH Wheelcarriers Diff Guards 1998 Land Rover Freelander - 'Misty' ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001 07:19:24 -0600 From: "Jim Hall" Subject: Re: LRO: Defender 110 'pick-up' Gearbox How are your u-joints and slip joint on the driveshaft? SEAN wrote: > > There was a 'clonking' sound when i drive in 1st and reverse gear so I > changed the rear axle ball joint, gear mainshaft, syncro assy, mainshaft > gear for my LT77 > gearbox. I also changed the clutch, clutch plate and clutch release > bearing. Now the 'clonking' sound has gone but there is a 'grinding' sound > on my 5th gear now. It didn't come when I'm cruising but when I release the > gas pedal to a 'quarter' to slow down the vehicle speed...it CAME!. > ..mostly on 5th gear. If the vehicle is cruising, I free all gearing then > there's an 'uneven' moving sound from the gear box. There's also a > 'whining' sound from it. It's difficult to get a rebuilt gearbox at this > part of the world. Please help. - -- Jim Hall 1966 88" Elephant Chaser http://www.users.qwest.net/~jimfoo "You know, I never really damaged my Rover 'till I started wheeling with Jim." Mitch Stockdale ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001 15:28:27 +0200 From: Paul Oxley Subject: Re: LRO: Another Impossible Thing? And Malta! Neil Brownlee wrote: > According to LRE, my tyres don't fit? That's a shame, cos it LOOKS LIKE THEY > DO to me!!!! Strange, I think that stating point blank that 235/85's won;t > fit is a bit contoversial is it not? Hmm, 235/85/16's are the recognised replacement tyre for 750X16's (outside wheel diameter is closest to standard). Wonder who's in charge of facts checking at LRE... Frank!? Regards Paul Oxley AfricanAdrenalin.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Apr 01 07:42:50 -0700 From: TeriAnn Wakeman Subject: Re: LRO: Another Impossible Thing? And Malta! >According to LRE, my tyres don't fit? That's a shame, cos it LOOKS LIKE THEY >DO to me!!!! Strange, I think that stating point blank that 235/85's won;t >fit is a bit contoversial is it not? Could be you are thinking different driving conditions. A tyre may indeed fit with plenty of room for pavment driving and rub against something under extreme articulation. I don't know about them funny coiler suspensions but when leafrts articulate the top of the tyre swings outwards on downward articulation and inwords during upper articulation. You need plenty of side top side space inside the wings. Also series rear suspensions dance around a lot. The tyres go forwards and rearwards as well as tipping innwards and outwards and sometimes one side will get a little ahead of the other. On the other hand a SUV fully outfitted for Mall Terrain can afford larger flashier tyres because they do not undergo extream articulation. What fits depends upon where and how you drive. TeriAnn Wakeman Marigold Ltd. Santa Cruz, California Web design, site updating, testing webmaster@overlander.net search engine optimization, graphics and more http://www.overlander.net/Marigold/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001 08:52:13 -0600 From: "Jim Hall" Subject: LRO: ring gap q Shouldn't the first and second rings wear at the same rate? The gap of the second ring on one piston is about 1/3 the gap on the first. Did some idiot also put a standard top ring on instead of a .060 over? - -- Jim Hall 1966 88" Elephant Chaser http://www.users.qwest.net/~jimfoo "You know, I never really damaged my Rover 'till I started wheeling with Jim." Mitch Stockdale ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001 16:54:01 +0100 From: "Neil Brownlee" Subject: Re: LRO: Another Impossible Thing? And Malta! "Mall Terrain"!!!! I'll have you know that my "funny coiler suspension"ed vehicle has seen plenty of offroad action (hence the decimated paint work) and the axle articulation has been tested as fully as possible bearing in mind that the last 4 months in the UK have been a period of inactivity for us offroaders. I would also like to point out that the 3 Land Rovers I own all have different suspension systems, from the leaf springs of the 109" to the independant suspension on the Freelander. All these types of suspension have a place and ALL can be made to whatever you, as the owner, require. It justs takes time, and usually money, to get the end result. There is *NOTHING* that you cannot do to a Land Rover within reason, and I, for this is MY opinion, thought that as a magazine, LRE should not have stated POINT BLANK that 235/85's would not fit!!!! - ------------------------------------------------------------- Neil 1978 Land Rover Series III 109" Ex-MOD - 'Harriet' 1997 Land Rover Discovery V8i ES - 'Piglet' - XD9000i, Terrain Master Winch Bumper & Hi-Lift carrier, Bearmach steering/sump guard, Mantec Side Protection Sills, Scorpion Racing +2" suspension lift, De-Carbon Shocks, Southdown Fuel Tank Guard, 235/85 General Grabber MT's, WH Wheelcarriers Diff Guards 1998 Land Rover Freelander - 'Misty' ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001 11:58:00 EDT From: NADdMD@aol.com Subject: Re: LRO: Another Impossible Thing? And Malta! In a message dated 4/29/2001 10:45:16 AM Eastern Daylight Time, twakeman@cruzers.com writes: << On the other hand a SUV fully outfitted for Mall Terrain can afford larger flashier tyres because they do not undergo extream articulation. >> Teriann, There you go stirring the pot again! When I take the Badger to the mall, I guarantee you I get some significant articulation. Some of those curbs are 8" high. Not to mention that some of the grassy little dividers are really quite steep. Did I mention my wife doesn't like going with me to the mall in the Badger? Nate ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001 10:24:06 -0600 From: "Jim Hall" Subject: Re: LRO: Another Impossible Thing? And Malta! However you state that you have a 2" lift. Is the magazine talking about a stock vehicle? Neil Brownlee wrote: > There is *NOTHING* that you cannot do to a Land Rover within reason, and I, > for this is MY opinion, thought that as a magazine, LRE should not have > stated POINT BLANK that 235/85's would not fit!!!! > > ------------------------------------------------------------- > > Neil > > 1978 Land Rover Series III 109" Ex-MOD - 'Harriet' > 1997 Land Rover Discovery V8i ES - 'Piglet' - XD9000i, Terrain Master Winch > Bumper & Hi-Lift carrier, Bearmach steering/sump guard, Mantec Side > Protection Sills, Scorpion Racing +2" suspension lift, De-Carbon Shocks, > Southdown Fuel Tank Guard, 235/85 General Grabber MT's, WH Wheelcarriers > Diff > Guards > 1998 Land Rover Freelander - 'Misty' - -- Jim Hall 1966 88" Elephant Chaser http://www.users.qwest.net/~jimfoo "You know, I never really damaged my Rover 'till I started wheeling with Jim." Mitch Stockdale ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001 10:31:59 -0600 From: "Jim Hall" Subject: LRO: front seal retainer I know there was some discussion recently about putting screws or something in place of the rivets to allow removal from the front. I am wondering why even put the retainer on at all. It's only purpose as I can see it is to trap dirt between it and the seal. I'm sure the seal is going nowhere without it. Any insights into this? - -- Jim Hall 1966 88" Elephant Chaser http://www.users.qwest.net/~jimfoo "You know, I never really damaged my Rover 'till I started wheeling with Jim." Mitch Stockdale ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001 13:22:13 EDT From: Zaxcoinc@aol.com Subject: Re: LRO: front seal retainer - --part1_49.aa091c8.281da7c5_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 4/29/01 9:35:50 AM Pacific Daylight Time, jimfoo@qwest.net writes: > . I'm sure the seal > is going nowhere without it. Any insights into this? > Well, I'm not so sure it's going nowhere. I've seen a lot of seals spin, or migrate away from where I'd like them to be on farm equipment. I haven't changed to the fix mentioned yet, but when the front cover has to come off, I will. Zack - --part1_49.aa091c8.281da7c5_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 4/29/01 9:35:50 AM Pacific Daylight Time, jimfoo@qwest.net
writes:


. I'm sure the seal
is going nowhere without it. Any insights into this?


Well, I'm not so sure it's going nowhere.
I've seen a lot of seals spin, or migrate away from where I'd like them to be
on farm equipment.

I haven't changed to the fix mentioned yet, but when the front cover has to
come off, I will.

Zack - --part1_49.aa091c8.281da7c5_boundary-- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001 18:30:11 +0100 From: "Neil Brownlee" Subject: Re: LRO: Another Impossible Thing? And Malta! Jim, That's the problem.....nothing's really stated, the guy was asking general questions, and obviously there is an answer, as I have these fitted, along with many others over here! - ------------------------------------------------------------- Neil 1978 Land Rover Series III 109" Ex-MOD - 'Harriet' 1997 Land Rover Discovery V8i ES - 'Piglet' - XD9000i, Terrain Master Winch Bumper & Hi-Lift carrier, Bearmach steering/sump guard, Mantec Side Protection Sills, Scorpion Racing +2" suspension lift, De-Carbon Shocks, Southdown Fuel Tank Guard, 235/85 General Grabber MT's, WH Wheelcarriers Diff Guards 1998 Land Rover Freelander - 'Misty' - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Hall" To: Sent: Sunday, April 29, 2001 5:24 PM Subject: Re: LRO: Another Impossible Thing? And Malta! > However you state that you have a 2" lift. Is the magazine talking about > a stock vehicle? > > Neil Brownlee wrote: > > > There is *NOTHING* that you cannot do to a Land Rover within reason, and I, > > for this is MY opinion, thought that as a magazine, LRE should not have > > stated POINT BLANK that 235/85's would not fit!!!! > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > Neil > > > > 1978 Land Rover Series III 109" Ex-MOD - 'Harriet' > > 1997 Land Rover Discovery V8i ES - 'Piglet' - XD9000i, Terrain Master Winch > > Bumper & Hi-Lift carrier, Bearmach steering/sump guard, Mantec Side > > Protection Sills, Scorpion Racing +2" suspension lift, De-Carbon Shocks, > > Southdown Fuel Tank Guard, 235/85 General Grabber MT's, WH Wheelcarriers > > Diff > > Guards > > 1998 Land Rover Freelander - 'Misty' > > -- > Jim Hall > 1966 88" Elephant Chaser > http://www.users.qwest.net/~jimfoo > "You know, I never really damaged my Rover 'till I started wheeling > with Jim." Mitch Stockdale > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001 18:22:06 +0100 From: "Colin Clegg" Subject: LRO: Brake Drum Removal Hi I have a SWB Series 3 and I am trying to remove the brake drums on the rear wheels to replace the wheel cylinders. The only problem is that they will not shift. Does anyone have any tips, before I go completely mad ? Cheers Colin Clegg colin.clegg@bigfoot.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Apr 01 11:11:07 -0700 From: TeriAnn Wakeman Subject: Re: LRO: Another Impossible Thing? And Malta! >"Mall Terrain"!!!! I'll have you know that my "funny coiler suspension"ed >vehicle has seen plenty of offroad action Did you see anyplace in my reply where I said I thought you owned a Mall Terrain Vehicle? Did you see a place where it was implied that YOU owned a MTV?? What was there was a mention that Mall Terrain vehicles can fit larger tyres than a rig that uses the articulation capabilities of the vehicle. There was NOTHING said about YOUR particular vehicle. You're a little over sensitive about vehicle designation aren't you? TeriAnn Wakeman If you send me direct mail, please Santa Cruz, California start the subject line with TW - twakeman@cruzers.com I will be sure to read the message http://www.shadow-catcher.net <- Photography for sale http://www.overlander.net <- Web directory for Land Rover http://www.cruzers.com/~twakeman <- My personal web site "How can life grant us the boon of living..unless we dare" Amelia Earhart 1898-1937 ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001 19:21:10 +0100 From: "br" Subject: LRO: Re: Brake Drum Removal loosen brake adjusters at back of drum and tap the rim of the drum with a rubber mallet - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Colin Clegg" To: Sent: Sunday, April 29, 2001 6:22 PM Subject: LRO: Brake Drum Removal > Hi > > I have a SWB Series 3 and I am trying to remove the brake drums on the rear > wheels to replace the wheel cylinders. The only problem is that they will > not shift. > > Does anyone have any tips, before I go completely mad ? > > Cheers > > Colin Clegg > colin.clegg@bigfoot.com > > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Apr 01 11:17:46 -0700 From: TeriAnn Wakeman Subject: Re: LRO: Another Impossible Thing? And Malta! ><< On the other hand a SUV fully outfitted for Mall Terrain can afford > larger flashier tyres because they do not undergo extream articulation. >> > >Teriann, > >There you go stirring the pot again! When I take the Badger to the mall, I >guarantee you I get some significant articulation. Some of those curbs are >8" high. Not to mention that some of the grassy little dividers are really >quite steep. Did I mention my wife doesn't like going with me to the mall >in >the Badger? > >Nate > Yah I particularly like those malls that have retaining walls between the levels. It provides me with an oppertunity to use my bridging ladders. THen there are those nasty speedbumps. Low range first gear & hit the ARB locker switch. I love to do mall terrain crawling, exp if the mall has a good book store or a decent antique store. Convoying with John Hess through a mall is exciting. He can spot a microbrewpub from miles away. TeriAnn Wakeman Marigold Ltd. Santa Cruz, California Web design, site updating, testing webmaster@overlander.net search engine optimization, graphics and more http://www.overlander.net/Marigold/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001 19:42:37 +0100 From: "Neil Brownlee" Subject: Re: LRO: Another Impossible Thing? And Malta! TeriAnn, It's just the withdrawal symptoms....we're all edgy (sp?) over here...can't go offroad, we're being labled by UK newspapers etc etc. Oh, and over here, "MTV"'s as you call them, are the stock vehicles, or the leisure market vehicles, modified Land Rovers (i.e. with winches etc) are not usually created just for the Tesco run here!! If you have have the bandwidth I could mail you a few pictures of my Landies....they are my pride and joy (or you could have a look at my extremely pathetic attempt at a web page .. it's not finished and never will be, but it's at www.offroading.freeserve.co.uk - ------------------------------------------------------------- Neil 1978 Land Rover Series III 109" Ex-MOD - 'Harriet' 1997 Land Rover Discovery V8i ES - 'Piglet' - XD9000i, Terrain Master Winch Bumper & Hi-Lift carrier, Bearmach steering/sump guard, Mantec Side Protection Sills, Scorpion Racing +2" suspension lift, De-Carbon Shocks, Southdown Fuel Tank Guard, 235/85 General Grabber MT's, WH Wheelcarriers Diff Guards 1998 Land Rover Freelander - 'Misty' - ----- Original Message ----- From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: "LRO list" Sent: Sunday, April 29, 2001 7:11 PM Subject: Re: LRO: Another Impossible Thing? And Malta! > >"Mall Terrain"!!!! I'll have you know that my "funny coiler suspension"ed > >vehicle has seen plenty of offroad action > > Did you see anyplace in my reply where I said I thought you owned a Mall > Terrain Vehicle? > > Did you see a place where it was implied that YOU owned a MTV?? > > What was there was a mention that Mall Terrain vehicles can fit larger > tyres than a rig that uses the articulation capabilities of the vehicle. > There was NOTHING said about YOUR particular vehicle. > > You're a little over sensitive about vehicle designation aren't you? > > TeriAnn Wakeman If you send me direct mail, please > Santa Cruz, California start the subject line with TW - > twakeman@cruzers.com I will be sure to read the message > > http://www.shadow-catcher.net <- Photography for sale > http://www.overlander.net <- Web directory for Land Rover > http://www.cruzers.com/~twakeman <- My personal web site > > "How can life grant us the boon of living..unless we dare" > Amelia Earhart 1898-1937 > > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001 08:46:53 -1000 From: "Peter Ogilvie" Subject: Re: LRO: Brake Drum Removal There is a tapped hole on the face of the drum that takes the same thread screw as the Flat Head Fixing screws. Run a bolt, with suitable thread, in that hole and it will force the drum off. forceful tapping with a hammer will aid in removal. If you use a steel hammer, do it judiciously as you could possibly damage the drum, though I haven't had a problem. Be sure that the shoes are adjusted all the way off. Counter Clockwise to back off adjustment when turning the adjusting nuts. Aloha Peter Ogilvie Kona Coffee Rover 1970 88 soft top, 'huli' Mine since '84 but recovering from exposure of the dark side. 1966 109 pickup 'slime' In my garage since '90, finally running. 1965 88 parts car, slowly sinking into the lava. 196? 88 hard top, possibly 'phoenix' if it rises, it will certainly be from ashes or at least a pile of rust >From: "Colin Clegg" >Reply-To: lro@works.team.net >To: >Subject: LRO: Brake Drum Removal >Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001 18:22:06 +0100 > >Hi > >I have a SWB Series 3 and I am trying to remove the brake drums on the rear >wheels to replace the wheel cylinders. The only problem is that they will >not shift. > >Does anyone have any tips, before I go completely mad ? > >Cheers > >Colin Clegg >colin.clegg@bigfoot.com > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001 13:50:46 -0500 (CDT) From: David Scheidt Subject: Re: LRO: Brake Drum Removal On Sun, 29 Apr 2001, Colin Clegg wrote: :Hi : :I have a SWB Series 3 and I am trying to remove the brake drums on the rear :wheels to replace the wheel cylinders. The only problem is that they will :not shift. Make sure you've got all the screws off. loosen the brakes, and beat on it with a rubber mallet. On genuine drums, there's a fourth threaded hole in the drum. Insaead of having a hole in the hub behind it, it's got the hub. YHou can thread a bolt (same thread as the screws, but you want something with a hex head and force it off that way. : - -- dscheidt@tumbolia.com Bipedalism is only a fad. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 21:48:51 -1000 From: "Hope Peter" Subject: LRO: Re: frame over progress... > How > has anyone that has performed the frameover successfully transitioned from > the "I've gotta get out there and finish this project or my wife will kill > me" to after it's done, waking up on a Saturday and having nothing but > regular maintenance to do? Uhm, drive it? Pete ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001 20:41:00 +0100 From: "Colin Clegg" Subject: Re: LRO: Brake Drum Removal There is only 1 screw on mine (The fronts have three). There is a second hole, I'll try a bolt and see if that helps. Colin - ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Scheidt" To: Sent: Sunday, April 29, 2001 7:50 PM Subject: Re: LRO: Brake Drum Removal > On Sun, 29 Apr 2001, Colin Clegg wrote: > > :Hi > : > :I have a SWB Series 3 and I am trying to remove the brake drums on the rear > :wheels to replace the wheel cylinders. The only problem is that they will > :not shift. > > Make sure you've got all the screws off. loosen the brakes, and beat on it > with a rubber mallet. On genuine drums, there's a fourth threaded hole in > the drum. Insaead of having a hole in the hub behind it, it's got the hub. > YHou can thread a bolt (same thread as the screws, but you want something > with a hex head and force it off that way. > : > > -- > dscheidt@tumbolia.com > Bipedalism is only a fad. > > > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001 10:25:17 -1000 From: "Peter Ogilvie" Subject: Re: LRO: Brake Drum Removal Aloha Colin: Unless you have some ersatz aftermarket drums, there ARE three flat head machine screws holding the drums to the hub. Look very closely, they may be hiding under rust and crud. If you don't see three chamfered holes for the machine screws, something is terribly amiss. The hole for the push off bolt is not chamfered, just a flush hole that's threaded and should be the fourth hole in the face of the drum. Aloha Peter Ogilvie Kona Coffee Rover 1970 88 soft top, 'huli' Mine since '84 but recovering from exposure of the dark side. 1966 109 pickup 'slime' In my garage since '90, finally running. 1965 88 parts car, slowly sinking into the lava. 196? 88 hard top, possibly 'phoenix' if it rises, it will certainly be from ashes or at least a pile of rust >From: "Colin Clegg" > >There is only 1 screw on mine (The fronts have three). There is a second >hole, I'll try a bolt and see if that helps. > >Colin _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001 10:58:31 -1000 From: "Peter Ogilvie" Subject: Re: LRO: Re: frame over progress... Many years ago I got the bug cruise the world but building a boat was the only way I thought I could afford the boat I THOUGHT we needed. In my searches I found the boat of my dreams but it had just been sold. In talking with the guy that built it, he had some very sage advice that is somewhat apropo to your question. He said: "if you want to build a boat, build a boat. If you want to go sailing, buy a completed boat and go sailing. Don't try and mix the two." It was only after 6 months, with no end in sight, into converting the huge fiberglass bath tub into a livable, sailable boat, that I understood the wisdom of his words. The time invested in building the boat, would have been much better spent in sailing a less grandiose but servicable completed boat. Learned a lot in the construction of the boat, got in really good physical condition, lost a few fingers, and ended up with a boat that was a perfect fit for my wife, our dog and me. Even with all that, we should have bought a finished boat and left. Might have gotten farther than Moorea if we'd gone two years sooner. We didn't really want to build a boat, we wanted to go sailing The Rovers are another story, I really want a simple, fix it myself 'erector' truck. Don't want anyone else mucking about with my Rovers. >From the success, but mostly abandoned dreams of all the backyard boatbuilders in Costa Mesa in the early 70's, you need to seriously look at why your doing what your doing. Most of the boat projects weren't finished by their original creators. Almost all the ones that were finished were sold almost immediately after completion because the reality wasn't the same as the dream. If you like working on vehicles and bringing some abandoned derelict back to life, sell it as soon as the project is finished. Then go out and get yourself another new project. If you want to go four wheeling you could do something as heretical as Peter H. says and actually go out and use the truck for its intended purpost. If trackless exploring and camping is your raison d'etre, might think about buying someone else's finished project or (heaven forbid) a J**p and getting out there on a weekend. Maybe we need a twelve step program for frame over withdrawal!!! Actually, I keep a number of Series trucks about as continuing projects. Seems like I get one up and running and something goes wrong with another so I never really have to worry what to do when I'm finished working on one truck. So between the trucks and the coffee farm, my time is never at a loss. Aloha Peter Ogilvie Kona Coffee Rover 1970 88 soft top, 'huli' Mine since '84 but recovering from exposure of the dark side. 1966 109 pickup 'slime' In my garage since '90, finally running. 1965 88 parts car, slowly sinking into the lava. 196? 88 hard top, possibly 'phoenix' if it rises, it will certainly be from ashes or at least a pile of rust > > How > > has anyone that has performed the frameover successfully transitioned >from > > the "I've gotta get out there and finish this project or my wife will >kill > > me" to after it's done, waking up on a Saturday and having nothing but > > regular maintenance to do? _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001 18:28:01 -0300 From: john.cranfield@ns.sympatico.ca (John Cranfield) Subject: Re: LRO: front seal retainer Without the retainer it possible for a stick to push the seal back into the front cover. How do I know this? The usual way :( John and Muddy Jim Hall wrote: > > I know there was some discussion recently about putting screws or > something in place of the rivets to allow removal from the front. I am > wondering why even put the retainer on at all. It's only purpose as I > can see it is to trap dirt between it and the seal. I'm sure the seal > is going nowhere without it. Any insights into this? > -- > Jim Hall > 1966 88" Elephant Chaser > http://www.users.qwest.net/~jimfoo > "You know, I never really damaged my Rover 'till I started wheeling > with Jim." Mitch Stockdale ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001 22:06:57 +0100 From: "Colin Clegg" Subject: Re: LRO: Brake Drum Removal Definately only 1 screw. I have just been and double checked. It has a chamfered edge as you say. The only other whole is flush, I take it that this is the push off bolt. The front hubs have three screws and a fourth flush hole. Guess I must have some weird hubs on the back then. I'll let you know how I get on. Colin - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Peter Ogilvie" To: Sent: Sunday, April 29, 2001 9:25 PM Subject: Re: LRO: Brake Drum Removal > Aloha Colin: > > Unless you have some ersatz aftermarket drums, there ARE three flat head > machine screws holding the drums to the hub. Look very closely, they may be > hiding under rust and crud. If you don't see three chamfered holes for the > machine screws, something is terribly amiss. The hole for the push off bolt > is not chamfered, just a flush hole that's threaded and should be the fourth > hole in the face of the drum. > > Aloha > Peter Ogilvie > Kona Coffee Rover > 1970 88 soft top, 'huli' Mine since '84 but recovering > from exposure of the dark side. > 1966 109 pickup 'slime' In my garage since '90, finally running. > 1965 88 parts car, slowly sinking into the lava. > 196? 88 hard top, possibly 'phoenix' if it rises, it will > certainly be from ashes or at least a pile of rust > > > > >From: "Colin Clegg" > > > >There is only 1 screw on mine (The fronts have three). There is a second > >hole, I'll try a bolt and see if that helps. > > > >Colin > > _________________________________________________________________ > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001 22:06:47 +0100 From: "Colin Clegg" Subject: Re: LRO: Brake Drum Removal Definately only 1 screw. I have just been and double checked. It has a chamfered edge as you say. The only other whole is flush, I take it that this is the push off bolt. The front hubs have three screws and a fourth flush hole. Guess I must have some weird hubs on the back then. I'll let you know how I get on. Colin - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Peter Ogilvie" To: Sent: Sunday, April 29, 2001 9:25 PM Subject: Re: LRO: Brake Drum Removal > Aloha Colin: > > Unless you have some ersatz aftermarket drums, there ARE three flat head > machine screws holding the drums to the hub. Look very closely, they may be > hiding under rust and crud. If you don't see three chamfered holes for the > machine screws, something is terribly amiss. The hole for the push off bolt > is not chamfered, just a flush hole that's threaded and should be the fourth > hole in the face of the drum. > > Aloha > Peter Ogilvie > Kona Coffee Rover > 1970 88 soft top, 'huli' Mine since '84 but recovering > from exposure of the dark side. > 1966 109 pickup 'slime' In my garage since '90, finally running. > 1965 88 parts car, slowly sinking into the lava. > 196? 88 hard top, possibly 'phoenix' if it rises, it will > certainly be from ashes or at least a pile of rust > > > > >From: "Colin Clegg" > > > >There is only 1 screw on mine (The fronts have three). There is a second > >hole, I'll try a bolt and see if that helps. > > > >Colin > > _________________________________________________________________ > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > ------------------------------ End of LRO Mailing List DIGEST * * * * V1 #361 **********************************************