From fadushin@ecs.syr.edu Fri Apr 27 18:45:48 2001 Return-Path: Received: from mailroom.ecs.syr.edu (ecs.syr.edu [128.230.208.14]) by minbar.fourfold.org (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id f3RMjlN22358 for ; Fri, 27 Apr 2001 18:45:48 -0400 Received: (from fadushin@localhost) by mailroom.ecs.syr.edu (8.10.2/8.10.2) id f3RLgDJ20425 for fadushin@www.ovlr.org; Fri, 27 Apr 2001 17:42:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: from syr.edu (syr.edu [128.230.1.49]) by mailroom.ecs.syr.edu (8.10.2/8.10.2) with ESMTP id f3RLgDW20422 for ; Fri, 27 Apr 2001 17:42:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: from works.team.net (IDENT:root@works.team.net [216.35.192.56]) by syr.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA10470 for ; Fri, 27 Apr 2001 17:42:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by works.team.net (8.10.1/8.10.1) id f3RKNpS25526 for lro-digest-gone; Fri, 27 Apr 2001 16:23:51 -0400 Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 16:23:51 -0400 Message-Id: <200104272023.f3RKNpS25526@works.team.net> From: owner-lro-digest@works.team.net (LRO Mailing List DIGEST * * * *) To: lro-digest@works.team.net Subject: LRO Mailing List DIGEST * * * * V1 #359 Reply-To: lro-digest@works.team.net Sender: owner-lro-digest@works.team.net Errors-To: owner-lro-digest@works.team.net Precedence: bulk X-Subscriptions: http://land-rover.team.net/majorcool/cgi-bin/majorcool.cgi LRO Mailing List DIGEST * * * * Friday, April 27 2001 Volume 01 : Number 359 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2001 15:51:13 -0700 From: "Rich Williams II" Subject: LRO: Series II motor Paul, After having just finished the full Monty on my SII motor I dug around and researched the engine color before painting it again. I am not trying to Concours this truck but I at least want to know what was exactly original then make my decisions from there. What I found was that there was every indication that my block had never been completely disassembled and inside there was a light camel colored paint used to basically seal up the iron block. On the outside of this block I found very light gray paint. Further inspection found a crack between no's 3 and 4 so I had to go after another SII block. Tore that one down and cleaned it thoroughly and there was the same paint, at least on the inside. The outer surfaces had the gray paint but there was less of it. BTW, this wasn't faded blue/green, tested for that. Then talking to some folks who knew the engines back when these were contemporary automobiles, they all independently said that for these early motors, none were painted this Robin's Egg Blue. So where did this color come from? Apparently, all parts from the UK that were originally this color were from military sources. What has happened in the last few decades is that for some reason everyone thought it was an appropriate color and started using it. Most commonly, the variant of Detroit Diesel Green and some other version known as Alpine Green were used - they all basically look the same anyway. I even called some of the larger suppliers in the US and asked them what they used on their rebuilds and all said they used this particular Detroit Diesel Green. After the rebuild they spray the whole darn block, manifolds, ancillaries, everything! Then I found some old color pictures of early SII trucks and I found the same gray again. Okay, I was convinced that gray was the way to go. So here's what I did and I can tell you that it looks fantastic. All were out of the spray can from the local hardware store and I spent less than $10 to respray the whole thing oil pan - Gloss black high temp paint by Rustoleum front cover - Gloss black high temp paint by Rustoleum block - Ford gray high temp paint by Rustoleum intake manifold - bead blasted to metal color valve cover - bead blasted to metal color exhaust manifold - flat black high temp coating by Performance Coatings (actually this cost $100) I have to say that this is the best darn looking tractor motor I have ever seen - looks as utility as it really is - nothing fancy - super basic. Now the only thing that really matters when we paint this stuff is that we LROs are satisfied with the net results. Well, I couldn't be happier. The engine is not back in the truck yet so everything is completely visible. I am more than happy to email anyone images of this finished product for you to compare with the green that most seem to want. I believe Pete Hope has some images of a new SIIa motor that is all green. Oh, that's another point. What I said about the motors not being green save for military units only holds for original SII motors. I found the Robin's Egg Blue (or similar) to be on later blocks. Hope this helps, Rich Williams '60 SII 109 SW ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Apr 13001 17:30:18 -0700 From: "Lonn Howard" Subject: LRO: Re: Axles Hey J-L, I have stomped and romped pretty hard on my stock front axle, both on grabby hard-pack and on sand. I figured that if I was going to grenade something it would be best to try do it close to home. Since most of the time I am off-roading in the middle of nowhere I am very conservative with the power, but around home I'll push it to the limits. So far, no problems with the stock front axles. I spoke with Timm recently and he has moved on to a bigger and badder front axle. He is now running a Salisbury front axle with bigger brake disks than he was running on the stock front axle. Given the wildman-behind-the-wheel driving style I have seen Timm exhibit with no ensuing axle failures, I figure my stock front axle should be OK. The turning radius was decreased with the wider offset wheels, and it looks like I could even screw in the wheel stops a bit more to further improve things. All of that said, I would still like to beef up the front diff just to be safer. Lonn - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jean-Leon Morin" To: Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2001 12:56 PM Subject: LRO: Axles > As some of you may know, I have been looking into the possibility of > changing over to late model Dana axles, modified to fit the series rover's > width. I just got a bit of bad news as narrowing the axleshafts costs a lot > when you are dealing with such an imposing axleshaft. > > I am reconsidering the whole idea in a big way. This e mail is primarily > addressed to Lonn, and TeriAnn, but others always seem to have interesting > insights and ideas, so that's why I am mass-mailing it. > > Most conversions I have heard of are running a salisbury differential in the > rear. This appears to be a very tough diff, perfectly capable of handling a > stout V8 or, in my case, a large 6 cylinder. This is common knowledge. If I > do stick with rover axles, I'll be going to a salisbury at the rear, and a > rover at the front. > > What I'm worried about is the front diff. How is this end of the equation > holding up? Lonn and TeriAnn are using bone stock front axles,and I haven't > heard of any breakages... yet. > > TeriAnn, you even have a Quaife (sp?) diff lock in the front, and, the > stocker axleshafts are holding up nicely, considering that you have quite a > bit of weight in the Green Rover, and power to boot. Lonn has a lot of > power, and a whole lot of tire to spin, but yet seems to have evaded > breakages. > > Well, here goes. Is it safe to assume that the front axleshafts are capable > of handling a fair amount of abuse? I realise the rear ones are put to the > test in daily driving, and the front see limited strain IE only off-road, > but it seems that they are OK for pretty hard off-road use. As far as I can > tell, Timm Cooper's rock crawling rig has a stock rover axle (except for > brakes) up front, and I can pretty much bet that Mr 5+ howler monkey would > have a front salisbury under there if it was needed. > > I've heard of broken half shafts up front, but they seem to be a little less > common than rear axleshaft breakage. Maybe the front carnage can be > attributed to ? years of hard use, and simply failed. Opinions on this? > > Lonn, how is the turning radius with your new wheels and tires? Better or > worse than the old tire/wheel combination? > > > Lots of questions, sorry everyone. > > ______________________________________________________ > Jean-Leon Morin > AKA "Dr. Detroit" > > Valdez - 1966 IIA 109 freak > Slagmobile - 195? II parts bin > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2001 20:34:33 -0400 From: "Jean-Leon Morin" Subject: Re: LRO: Axles Adam, I know this but I am dealing with chevy 1 ton axles which have axles of almost 2" in diameter, and I have to narrow the front as well. There's U joints up there, so I can't get some shafts made, therefore I have to cut and respline the old shafts. J-L - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2001 4:45 PM Subject: Re: LRO: Axles > why do you say that? custom alloy axles really arent all that expensive! moser engineering makes custom super high quality in 1.5" dia. and 35 spline in any length for like $300 a pair! > > adam > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2001 20:31:46 EDT From: WhatsUp129@aol.com Subject: Re: LRO: Axles trust me you may just want to go to their site (www.moserengineering.com) and see what they have, chevy 1 ton is D60 front and Corp 14 bolt or D70 rear, and those are 1.5" diameter 35 spline. adam ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2001 17:34:11 -0700 From: "Faure, Marin" Subject: LRO: Re: Steering wheel centering Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2001 09:05:37 -0400 From: "Robert A. Virzi" Subject: LRO: Steering wheel centering >While driving back, I noticed my steering wheel is just slightly off center. I seem to recall some folks here having a simple way to re-center without a trip back to the shop. IF (and it's a big if) the steering mechanism is at all similar in philosophy to what's on a Series, you should be able to loosen the ends of the steering rod, aka drag link (NOT the tie rod), and rotate the rod until the steering wheel is where you want it. Then retighen the rod ends. On a Series, the drag link is in front of the tie rod and axle. As the Discovery is built on the Range Rover chassis, I'm going to assume the steering layout is similar to the Range Rover's. On that vehicle, the drag link is actually BEHIND the front axle, I believe. But the adjustment process should be basically the same. _________________________________________ C. Marin Faure Producer/Director, Boeing Video Services telephone (425)393-7721 mobile (206)650-5622 fax: (425)393-7741 e-mail: marin.faure@boeing.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2001 15:58:08 -0700 From: Paul Quin Subject: LRO: RE: Series II motor Thank Rich, Under all the oil and dirt, mine seems to be a combination of rust and poppy red right now so I think that ANYTHING will be an improvement! See http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Garage/4954/lroilfltr.jpg Gray / black sounds good to me. Paul in Victoria. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2001 18:58:32 -0600 From: "Jim Hall" Subject: Re: LRO: Re: Axles I broke my front axle in Moab trying to go up a very steep, rough rock. I'm sure it broke because the front end was bouncing and I was at full throttle. Bill from Great Basin has some stronger ones, but you need to upgrade to 24 spline. I think most normal folks would be fine with the stock setup however. Lonn Howard wrote: > > Hey J-L, > > I have stomped and romped pretty hard on my stock front axle, both on grabby > hard-pack and on sand. I figured that if I was going to grenade something > it would be best to try do it close to home. > All of that said, I would still like to beef up the front diff just to be > safer. - -- Jim Hall 1966 88" Elephant Chaser http://www.users.qwest.net/~jimfoo "You know, I never really damaged my Rover 'till I started wheeling with Jim." Mitch Stockdale ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2001 19:17:06 -0600 From: "Jim Hall" Subject: Re: LRO: another engine GRRRRR!!! Oops, I was looking at the stroke of the 2.6, not the bore. The bore is way smaller. Well my ring gap is .074. I didn't look in the bible to see what it should be as I'm pretty sure that mine is a bit on the wide side. The cylinders don't seem very worn, just a few thousandths, so all I need are rings. Luckily the bearings are .010, so no problems there. I just wonder what my compression ratio will be after milling .080 off the head with .060 pistons. Erik Barr wrote: > > You might want to try > http://www.deves.com/ > > I bought a set of 2.6 rings last summer from them. They had them in > stock and they may have .060 rings anyway- or may make them. > Erik > > Jim Hall wrote: > > > > Anyone have 2.6l rings? They are the right size. > > > > Jim Hall wrote: > > > > > > Now I know why my rover ran so good. My block, which was bought from > > > Rovers North in 1989, I would assume as reconditioned, has .060 over > > > pistons!!! Assholes!! How is somebody supposed to rebuild such an > > > engine. > > > I don't imagine they can be bored to .080. At least it doesn't have much > > > of a ridge, but I currently can't find .060 over rings. Guess it's time > > > to think about what conversion I want to do next time. I'm afraid to > > > check the bearings and see what size they are. > > > -- > > > Jim Hall > > > 1966 88" Elephant Chaser > > > http://www.users.qwest.net/~jimfoo > > > "You know, I never really damaged my Rover 'till I started wheeling > > > with Jim." Mitch Stockdale > > > > -- > > Jim Hall > > 1966 88" Elephant Chaser > > http://www.users.qwest.net/~jimfoo > > "You know, I never really damaged my Rover 'till I started wheeling > > with Jim." Mitch Stockdale - -- Jim Hall 1966 88" Elephant Chaser http://www.users.qwest.net/~jimfoo "You know, I never really damaged my Rover 'till I started wheeling with Jim." Mitch Stockdale ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2001 20:21:27 -0500 (CDT) From: David Scheidt Subject: Re: LRO: Steering wheel centering On Thu, 26 Apr 2001, Robert A. Virzi wrote: :My Disco was in for an alignment yesterday (tough winter, lots o' :potholes). Took the mechanic quite a while (and lots of heat) to get :everything sorted. Finally got it done and I left. While driving :back, I noticed my steering wheel is just slightly off center. I :seem to recall some folks here having a simple way to re-center :without a trip back to the shop. Could someone refresh my memory? :Did it have to do with drag links or something? Thanks. You can fiddle with the drag link to get the wheel centered. Given that you've just paid someone to do this, I'd take it back and make them fix it. They did shoddy work, and should fix it. - -- dscheidt@tumbolia.com Bipedalism is only a fad. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2001 20:21:27 -0500 (CDT) From: David Scheidt Subject: Re: LRO: Steering wheel centering On Thu, 26 Apr 2001, Robert A. Virzi wrote: :My Disco was in for an alignment yesterday (tough winter, lots o' :potholes). Took the mechanic quite a while (and lots of heat) to get :everything sorted. Finally got it done and I left. While driving :back, I noticed my steering wheel is just slightly off center. I :seem to recall some folks here having a simple way to re-center :without a trip back to the shop. Could someone refresh my memory? :Did it have to do with drag links or something? Thanks. You can fiddle with the drag link to get the wheel centered. Given that you've just paid someone to do this, I'd take it back and make them fix it. They did shoddy work, and should fix it. - -- dscheidt@tumbolia.com Bipedalism is only a fad. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2001 19:44:02 +0100 From: "Frank Elson" Subject: Re: LRO: RE: slugs anyone read 'Earth' by Emile Zola? Wonderful, won-der-ful, description of a drunken donkey. Best Cheers Frank +--+--+--+ I !__| [_]|_\___ I ____|"_|"__|_ | / B791 PKV "(o)======(o)" Bronze Green 110 CSW - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Wednesday, April 25, 2001 5:21 PM Subject: Re: LRO: RE: slugs > In a message dated 4/25/01 12:16:06 PM Eastern Daylight Time, > Alan_Richer@Lotus.com writes: > > > > > > > Oh, the visual on that one! (Particularly if the dogs are allowed on the > couch) > > Nate > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2001 22:23:58 -0500 From: "A. P. \"Sandy\" Grice" Subject: LRO: Another.... "Jim Hall" >Now I know why my rover ran so good. My block, which was bought from >Rovers North in 1989, I would assume as reconditioned, has .060 over >pistons!!! Assholes!! How is somebody supposed to rebuild such an >engine. What about sleeves? A good machine shop should be able to fit cylinder liners so you can't tell. The old guy that runs the shop I've used on occasion - a true artisan with engines, BTW - has a rule of thumb. Measure the wear on the cylinder (or crank or whatever), double it and go with the next larger piston or bearing size. Methinks your engine was pretty well worn before the rebuild.... Cheers Cheers *----jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is legendary-----* | | | A. P. "Sandy" Grice | | Rover Owners' Association of Virginia, Ltd. | | 1633 Melrose Parkway, Norfolk, VA 23508-1730 | | (757)423-4898 (757)622-7054 FAX (757)622-7056 | | | *----1972 Series III 88"----1996 Discovery SE-7(m)---* ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2001 03:30:48 -1000 From: "Hope Peter" Subject: LRO: Re: Axles Jean-Leon, why not get a front Salisbury also? Pete ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 14:51:52 +0200 From: Luca Ingianni Subject: LRO: OT:off-road tech links - -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Well, not really off topic, but anyway. I am supposed to give a short talk at the English class at unversity next week. I don't have a fixed topic as long as it's somehow connected to engineering (because that's what I study) and I was thinking of doing something on off-road cars, probably highlighting desing differences to ordinary cars (Rover content: I'm sure I won't be able to resist bragging with my LR). I don't want you to do my homework, but if any of you knew a website that gave a decent overview over that topic I'd be extremely glad because all of the books at the uni library seem way too much in-depth for my purposes. TIA & have fun, Luca - - -- There are very few personal problems that cannot be solved through a suitable application of high explosives. - -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.4 (GNU/Linux) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iEYEARECAAYFAjrpa20ACgkQ7uxRR5vRvyuVJQCgjea2p2Ov4ETyhxXO3mvTllYr pFEAoJwVYyJr/u0Ouh/xO0IT3ERQmIdg =Vxn1 - -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 09:27:21 -0400 From: "Lee Jones" Subject: LRO: RE: OT:off-road tech links Luca, At least here in the US the dealers have a pretty neat comparison booklet between all the most popular SUV's out there with approach angle, departure angle, articulation, ground clearance, etc. It may be a starting point for you. Lee - -----Original Message----- From: owner-lro@works.team.net [mailto:owner-lro@works.team.net]On Behalf Of Luca Ingianni Sent: Friday, April 27, 2001 8:52 AM To: lro@works.team.net Subject: LRO: OT:off-road tech links - -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Well, not really off topic, but anyway. I am supposed to give a short talk at the English class at unversity next week. I don't have a fixed topic as long as it's somehow connected to engineering (because that's what I study) and I was thinking of doing something on off-road cars, probably highlighting desing differences to ordinary cars (Rover content: I'm sure I won't be able to resist bragging with my LR). I don't want you to do my homework, but if any of you knew a website that gave a decent overview over that topic I'd be extremely glad because all of the books at the uni library seem way too much in-depth for my purposes. TIA & have fun, Luca - - -- There are very few personal problems that cannot be solved through a suitable application of high explosives. - -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.4 (GNU/Linux) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iEYEARECAAYFAjrpa20ACgkQ7uxRR5vRvyuVJQCgjea2p2Ov4ETyhxXO3mvTllYr pFEAoJwVYyJr/u0Ouh/xO0IT3ERQmIdg =Vxn1 - -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 07:00:16 -0700 From: "Lonn & Rhonda" Subject: Re: LRO: Re: Axles Jim, Are you running the 2.25? Any modifications to your rig that may have contributed? Lonn - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Hall" To: Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2001 5:58 PM Subject: Re: LRO: Re: Axles > I broke my front axle in Moab trying to go up a very steep, rough rock. > I'm sure it broke because the front end was bouncing and I was at full > throttle. Bill from Great Basin has some stronger ones, but you need to > upgrade to 24 spline. I think most normal folks would be fine with the > stock setup however. > > Lonn Howard wrote: > > > > Hey J-L, > > > > I have stomped and romped pretty hard on my stock front axle, both on grabby > > hard-pack and on sand. I figured that if I was going to grenade something > > it would be best to try do it close to home. > > All of that said, I would still like to beef up the front diff just to be > > safer. > > -- > Jim Hall > 1966 88" Elephant Chaser > http://www.users.qwest.net/~jimfoo > "You know, I never really damaged my Rover 'till I started wheeling > with Jim." Mitch Stockdale > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 07:02:57 -0700 From: "Lonn & Rhonda" Subject: Re: LRO: Re: Axles The second after I hit the send key it hit me that you have the 60 over 2.25... Lonn - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lonn & Rhonda" To: Sent: Friday, April 27, 2001 7:00 AM Subject: Re: LRO: Re: Axles > Jim, > Are you running the 2.25? Any modifications to your rig that may have > contributed? > Lonn > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 10:20:30 -0400 From: "RON WARD" Subject: LRO: IIa single system brake reservoir Morning all, Can the single system "tropicana orange juice concentrate" brake and clutch reservoir found on early IIa's be replaced with plastic dual system reservoirs without having to convert to dual brakes? How 'bout a replacement for the can reservoir? Anyone have an alternate NAPA or other US parts store equivalent? TIA Ron Ward ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 10:21:59 -0400 From: "RON WARD" Subject: LRO: Jack-all mounting Ordered the mounting brackets. Does anyone have a photo of their hi-lift or jack-all mounted on the rear of a series truck? Either to the right or left of the door or tailgate? Ron Ward ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 10:31:20 -0400 From: "Tackley, John" Subject: LRO: RE: Steering wheel centering Position the truck on flat ground with the wheels pointed straight ahead. Loosen the clamps on both track rod ends, then take a pipe wrench (using a rag to protect the track rod), and turn the track rod in the direction that moves the steering wheel in the direction you want to go. Once centered, tighten the track rod end clamps. Since the ends have opposing threads, they move in proportion to one-another, preserving your alignment adjustment. JT/ric previously... My Disco was in for an alignment yesterday (tough winter, lots o' potholes). Took the mechanic quite a while (and lots of heat) to get everything sorted. Finally got it done and I left. While driving back, I noticed my steering wheel is just slightly off center. I seem to recall some folks here having a simple way to re-center without a trip back to the shop. Could someone refresh my memory? Did it have to do with drag links or something? Thanks. -Bob - ----------------- S1 Disco, Fuggles, visible at http://people.ne.mediaone.net/raver ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 11:53:51 -0300 From: john.cranfield@ns.sympatico.ca (John Cranfield) Subject: Re: LRO: RE: Steering wheel centering No No... not the track rod. This will alter the toe in. Change the length of the drag link. This is the rod coming off the steering box. John and Muddy "Tackley, John" wrote: > > Position the truck on flat ground with the wheels pointed straight ahead. > Loosen the clamps on both track rod ends, then take a pipe wrench (using a > rag to protect the track rod), and turn the track rod in the direction that > moves the steering wheel in the direction you want to go. Once centered, > tighten the track rod end clamps. Since the ends have opposing threads, > they move in proportion to one-another, preserving your alignment > adjustment. > > JT/ric > > previously... > > My Disco was in for an alignment yesterday (tough winter, lots o' > potholes). Took the mechanic quite a while (and lots of heat) to get > everything sorted. Finally got it done and I left. While driving > back, I noticed my steering wheel is just slightly off center. I > seem to recall some folks here having a simple way to re-center > without a trip back to the shop. Could someone refresh my memory? > Did it have to do with drag links or something? Thanks. > -Bob > ----------------- > > S1 Disco, Fuggles, visible at http://people.ne.mediaone.net/raver ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 11:19:40 EDT From: Gbrovers@aol.com Subject: Re: LRO: Axles Jean Front axle shafts are not subjected to the stress of the rears primarily due to the fact that when you have them engaged you are in 4 wheel drive and splitting the torque front and rear. Weight transfer issues are also involved but I won't go into that. I also suspect that the front shafts are manufactured from a better material and have a higher heat treat level. I haven't actually had any tested so its a gut feel at this point. We have tested several sets of stock rear axles and they have a very low heat level. Rockwell C of 35 to 45 - and frequently thats on the same shaft! As a result upgrading front shafts is optional in my opinion, unlike the rears. I do sell a 24 spline axle conversion kit for the front. The vast majority of them have gone to folks in the south east U.S. Those southern boys are hard on equipment! From what I understand Tellico is like Moab except everything is covered with wet slimey moss! You can source Salisbury diffs for the front but the only real advantage is a stronger ring and pinion gear. Install a 4 pinion carrier (or a 4 pin style) in the Rover diff and you will eliminate the most of the difference with the Salisbury without the disadvantages of the Salisbury - weight, loss of ground clearance, modified driveshaft etc. Will end up costing a lot less too. Bill Great Basin Rovers P.S. I don't think anything of Timms is stock ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 11:38:58 EDT From: DONOHUEPE@aol.com Subject: Re: LRO: Stupid LR Owner (Me) Trick - --part1_f6.9876672.281aec92_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 04/26/2001 4:40:31 PM Mountain Daylight Time, Rick Grant wrote: << Forgetting wouldn't be so bad except I can't understand how I could have the cap off for a good five minutes without seeing that the rotor was not there. Where was my mind >> It can be hard to see what is not there. How human of you. On the positive side, however, you did get home. Paul Donohue 1965 Land Rover 109 Denver - --part1_f6.9876672.281aec92_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 04/26/2001 4:40:31 PM Mountain Daylight Time, Rick Grant
wrote:

<< Forgetting wouldn't be so bad except I can't understand how I could have
the cap off for a good five minutes without seeing that the rotor was not
there.  Where was my mind >>

It can be hard to see what is not there.  How human of you.
On the positive side, however, you did get home.

Paul Donohue
1965 Land Rover 109
Denver - --part1_f6.9876672.281aec92_boundary-- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 11:55:07 -0400 From: "Tackley, John" Subject: RE: LRO: RE: Steering wheel centering Thanks, John...that's what I meant to say...Honest ;->) - - No No... not the track rod. This will alter the toe in. Change the length of the drag link. This is the rod coming off the steering box. John and Muddy "Tackley, John" wrote: > > Position the truck on flat ground with the wheels pointed straight ahead. > Loosen the clamps on both track rod ends, then take a pipe wrench (using a > rag to protect the track rod), and turn the track rod in the direction that > moves the steering wheel in the direction you want to go. Once centered, > tighten the track rod end clamps. Since the ends have opposing threads, > they move in proportion to one-another, preserving your alignment > adjustment. > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 11:12:35 -0600 From: "Tim Czajka" Subject: LRO: Re: Axles Jean-Leon Morin wrote: >I just got a bit of bad news as narrowing the axleshafts costs a lot when >you are dealing with such an imposing axleshaft. > Depending on your location and availability, there are some other 4x4s that used offset rear axles. One is the Jeep CJ-5 up through 1971. They used the Dana 44 rear axle. Best bet would be the 1969-71 Dana 44 rear ends that used flanged 30 spline shafts. You would not have to cut this axle except for moving the spring pads slightly. Just use the proper offset wheels and it would match the Series axle width. Also the FJ-40 vehicles used an offset rear axle and they are said to be very strong in some ways. Not sure how the width compares to the Series. There are also some offset Dana 20 axles that Jeep used on vehicles equipped with the original quadratrack tcases. 1976 - 1979 CJ-7 and some of the other Jeep trucks. Some of these may fit without cutting axles although keyed shaft strength is an issue on certain models. Just some ideas to avoid major axle surgery. You would of course have to deal with wheel bolt pattern issues. Getting axles as a set would avoid this and it could also be a cheap way to get a different ring and pinion ratio if you find the right set. Tim Czajka 1972 Series III 88 _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 14:44:25 -0400 From: Bill Adams Subject: Re: LRO: Jack-all mounting Ron inquires: Does anyone have a photo of their hi-lift or jack-all mounted on the rear of a series truck? wierd one dood. - -- Bill Adams 3D & Motion Graphics Design Director International Broadcasting Bureau Washington, D.C. 202-205-9638 badams@ibb.gov '66 Land Rover 109 SW Diesel '81 GoldWing '69 Le Sabre Convertible '63 Pearson Vanguard "Practicing the ancient art of ren-ching" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 09:23:33 -1000 From: "Peter Ogilvie" Subject: LRO: Re: Sagging springs, why. Things have been too quiet on the list, thought I'd generate some controversy. How come series rovers always sag, usually to the right side?? Don't give me any of the handed spring crap as it hasn't been a factor for ages. If jeep suppliers can provide springs that sit level, why can't the Rover crowd make stock multi leaf springs do the same. I just did an RM parabolic switch and the truck sits level for the first time since I've owned it. Before, the truck had the typical right side down lean. Did the rears first and, after removal, found the stock springs to have an 1" difference in arch. With the parabolics on the rear, truck appeared to set level though I didn't drive it much and park on known level ground and measure it to verify. Thought the sag must have been caused by the stock rear springs, alone. Switched the fronts and truck still sits level, but discovered the front springs also have a 1" arch differential. The front springs were stock, new in 1991 and have only 5,000 miles on them. They weren't the different arched springs as fitted to early right hand drive vehicles as I understand these springs were never imported. The rears were original with with 35,000 miles on them. Unfortunately, I didn't mark the springs before I took them off but must assume the tall springs were on the right side. I've got two Rovers that I have driven regularly and both had sag problems. Solved the problem on my 88 by putting a nasty looking, rust pitted POS spring from the right side of my parts truck on the left side of the 88. Spring was so bad that it broke completely as soon as I lubed it and was able to flex. At least the truck sat level for a while. If every other car manufacturer and aftermarket supplier can make springs that sit level, why can't the makers of stock Rover springs do the same??? My back loves the parabolics, by the way. Truck rides so much smoother over my test section. In second gear at idle, truck used to bounce me off the seat. Now the truck glides over the loose rubble and bare lava. Feels almost like someone went out and rounded the corners off all the bumps and lumps. Have the usual Rocky Mountain 2 leaf front springs and fixed 3 leaf rears on my 109 regular pickup. Was going to do a comparison with the TI Console parabolics but don't want to take the time to switch everything out. Like the idea of the helper springs on the TI's for comfort but can't swear it has an effect in real life. Yes I know the hang up argument with the helpers, but had no problems in a years use on the 88. Oh!! and the sway argument is horse puckey. Truck corners just as level as it did with the stock springs. Axle doesn't tramp to the outside of turns with bumps like it did with stock springs, so handling in side loading is actually much improved. Shocks are OME installed months before the spring switch so they aren't a factor. Aloha Peter Ogilvie Kona Coffee Rover 1970 88 soft top, 'huli' Mine since '84 but recovering from exposure of the dark side. 1966 109 pickup 'slime' In my garage since '90, finally up and running 12/00. 1965 88 parts car, slowly sinking into the lava. 196? 88 hard top, possibly 'phoenix' if it rises, it will certainly be from ashes or at least a pile of rust _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 13:37:09 -0600 From: "Jim Hall" Subject: Re: LRO: IIa single system brake reservoir Look for an '89? Mitsubishi Galant at the junk yard. Res will fit in the Rover bracket. Just plug one of the outlet tubes. RON WARD wrote: > > Morning all, > > Can the single system "tropicana orange juice concentrate" brake and clutch reservoir found on early IIa's be replaced with plastic dual system reservoirs without having to convert to dual brakes? How 'bout a replacement for the can reservoir? Anyone have an alternate NAPA or other US parts store equivalent? > > TIA > > Ron Ward - -- Jim Hall 1966 88" Elephant Chaser http://www.users.qwest.net/~jimfoo "You know, I never really damaged my Rover 'till I started wheeling with Jim." Mitch Stockdale ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 13:45:14 -0600 From: "Jim Hall" Subject: LRO: another engine problem Took a piston out yesterday and found that one of the piston pin clips hadn't been seated in the groove. Good thing it never came out. .060 over and poor QC, I would have never expected that from RN. - -- Jim Hall 1966 88" Elephant Chaser http://www.users.qwest.net/~jimfoo "You know, I never really damaged my Rover 'till I started wheeling with Jim." Mitch Stockdale ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 15:05:49 -0500 From: "Brian F. Waltman" Subject: LRO: Brake Shoes Hello all, I finally figured out why my brakes seem to be a bit slow in stopping me. The hub seal on one of the back wheels is going bad and the differential oil is leaking out into my drum. Makes it abit hard to stop in a real crunch! Anyway, I got a new seal in the mail the other day and will replace it this weekend. The question is, once I get the oil leak stopped, do I need to replace the brake shoes? I am assuming they are covered with oil. If so, will I need to get new ones? Yes, that's right, I'm still learning. The hard way in most cases. Thanks in advance, Brian Waltman '69 Series IIa 88" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 16:13:12 -0400 From: Bill Adams Subject: Re: LRO: Re: Sagging springs, why. I recommend that you stay away from TI Console springs. My 4 leaf rears have sagged to the left almost from day one ( installed mid 1997). Attempts at remediation through the company's owner have been fruitless and I fear that I'm stuck with a for-shit suspension. - -- Bill Adams 3D & Motion Graphics Design Director International Broadcasting Bureau Washington, D.C. 202-205-9638 badams@ibb.gov '66 Land Rover 109 SW Diesel '81 GoldWing '69 Le Sabre Convertible '63 Pearson Vanguard "Practicing the ancient art of ren-ching" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 15:14:41 -0500 (CDT) From: Ray Harder Subject: Re: LRO: Brake Shoes i wiped off a set of oily shoes with acetone once -- the appeared as new, and i reused them. it all worked out fine. the oil leak wasn't that bad, though and perhaps a longer, worse leak would cause oil to soak in more. if there was a good bit of lining left, i would wipe and use... ray harder On Fri, 27 Apr 2001, Brian F. Waltman wrote: > Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 15:05:49 -0500 > From: Brian F. Waltman > Reply-To: lro@works.team.net > To: lro@works.team.net > Subject: LRO: Brake Shoes > > Hello all, > > I finally figured out why my brakes seem to be a bit slow in stopping me. > The hub seal on one of the back wheels is going bad and the differential oil > is leaking out into my drum. Makes it abit hard to stop in a real crunch! > Anyway, I got a new seal in the mail the other day and will replace it this > weekend. The question is, once I get the oil leak stopped, do I need to > replace the brake shoes? I am assuming they are covered with oil. If so, > will I need to get new ones? > > Yes, that's right, I'm still learning. The hard way in most cases. > > Thanks in advance, > > Brian Waltman > '69 Series IIa 88" > > Sincerely, Ray Harder ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 16:16:22 -0400 From: Bill Adams Subject: Re: LRO: IIa single system brake reservoir These are not difficult to find if you need a new one. - -- Bill Adams 3D & Motion Graphics Design Director International Broadcasting Bureau Washington, D.C. 202-205-9638 badams@ibb.gov '66 Land Rover 109 SW Diesel '81 GoldWing '69 Le Sabre Convertible '63 Pearson Vanguard "Practicing the ancient art of ren-ching" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 20:23:31 -0000 From: "N Forbes" Subject: Re: LRO: Axles So the hot ticket then is to mount a front axle on the rear and lock out the rear steer. Or hook it up like on a monster truck. Cool!! Niall Forbes 66 IIa 88SW - The Red Zit Dartmouth, Nova Scotia The Nova Scotian Rover - http://www3.ns.sympatico.ca/forbes/intro.htm "See the happy moron, He doesn't give a damn. I wish I were a moron. My God! Perhaps I am!" - --author unknown _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. ------------------------------ End of LRO Mailing List DIGEST * * * * V1 #359 **********************************************